Headliner & Better Call Daddy: Crafting Legacy Through Podcasting

>> Elissa: Hi, podcasters. Welcome back to another episode of the Headliner Discovery Marketing podcast. If you're new to the podcast, firstly, hi. Second, a little about us and the show to kick things off. Headliner, simply put, helps podcasters find and grow their audience. On the podcast, we like to talk about how to better grow and market podcasts. On this episode, we're joined by two very special guests. The hosts of the Better Call Daddy Show, Rena and her dad, Wayne, use Headliner

to help market and grow their show. Today, we'll be talking to them about their podcast journey and, of course, learn how they market and grow their awesome show. Before getting started, though, Reena and Wayne, do you want to introduce yourselves and maybe talk about the Better Call Daddy Show a little? >> Reena: Yes. Thank you, Elissa. Great job.

Well, we started our podcast about four years ago after I had worked for a couple of other podcasters, and I was like, you know, I feel like I have all of the skills to do this, and a lot of it is just jumping in and learning along

the way. So some of the skills you need for podcasting are guts, like the ability to reach out to people and say, hey, I would love to know more about your story, or, hey, I loved working with you, and I would love to talk about that journey and, you know, figuring out what you want your podcast to be about. For me, my dad has always been my right hand. He was an entrepreneur for 40 plus years, and I have been an entrepreneur for about five years, five,

six years. And I was always calling him for advice, not just on how to take customers, how to price customers, but also life advice. And. And so I felt like we had a unique relationship and bond and something that couldn't be replicated. And I think that that too is something that you need for a show, is have a unique niche, have a unique idea. And all throughout my career, actually, I've always kind of

wanted a sidekick. Even when I would sing as a kid or perform in front of others, I would, like, grab one of my sisters to kind of hold my hand. When I was singing the Star Spangled Banner at college or if I was giving a speech to people in the community, I would want to bring a friend to, like, look at in the audience to make me feel more comfortable. And so my dad's my number one supporter and biggest fan. And I knew that he wouldn't back out on me and he'd probably make a good addition to the

show. So he always wanted me to be on stage. He always wanted me to be a performer. He kind of pushed me in front of the camera, so I grabbed him right along and was like, hey, let's do this thing together. And it's been amazing because I'm the one that, like, reaches out to the guests and finds the guests and

markets it, which are totally my strengths. And then my dad is really good at, like, synthesizing my thoughts and kind of summarizing things and, like, bringing an intergenerational perspective at the end of every episode. So he's kind of like the final thought, which, when I first started, you know, my very first job out of college was the Jerry Springer show. And I used to book like, these wild and crazy stories and. And then at the end of that, Jerry would come in with, like,

his final thought. And I always thought that that was so smart. You know, he comes in with like, this newscaster ish, kind of like, here's what you can take from that and here's how we can change the world together. And I was like, hm, I feel like my dad could be that. So I interview a wide range of people and perspectives and, you know, people with different traditions and all kinds of

backgrounds and then share the stories with him. He listens to it separately, he comes back on and then he gives me his take. And it's turned into this whole thing where people want my dad's approval or, you know, people have a question for my dad. There's people that don't have dads in their lives. There's people that also look up to their fathers. there's. Turns out there's all kinds of daddy stories. And so we've kind of weaved that into the angle of our podcast. What do you think about that,

dad? He's just listening to me go off. >> Wanye: Yeah, sounds pretty good. when in doubt, better call Daddy. That's right. Yeah, I, I think, what we've been able to do also is we've been able to learn. And it's really a form of communication where everyone can participate and we all can pick up wisdom points from each other. So the more experiences that we're able to hear, and live, we. We, can even change our own perspective on certain issues that have been come up on the show.

I was more hardlined on certain issues. And then when you understand what some people have gone through, you, have some more compassion and consideration of, of their travels and can even change your mind. And then Other guests, of course, prove, that, my initial reaction is true, because they come on there and they're trying to sell something that is just not true or beyond the scope of, rationale or reasoning or where they're blowing their own horn to justify their behavior even though

it's really wrong. So we try to keep it candid. We try to be respectful, but we also try to keep it in perspective of, where we can share our thoughts and. where it's candid, and comes from the heart and not where we have to live within certain rules, and regulations and be told, tell our guests what to say or. Or tell ourselves what

we have to say. But we can do it in a manner that is, like I said, that's respectful and try to understand each other and where we have a true forum where, we can share our thoughts, and not necessarily, make it a dramatic, stage show or sideshow. >> Elissa: That's so awesome. Well, definitely appreciate, the candid thoughts. it. love listening to the story. your guys's relationship is so cool. It, definitely reminds me of myself and my dad. So I always love listening to the

show. just, you know, a humble m. Little plug and shout out there. but anyway, so thinking about kind, of what you guys have said, it sounds like you guys have learned a lot of new skills from podcasting. So could you kind of elaborate on some of that and maybe even, just kind of how the show has evolved over time as you've either honed in kind of more on your niche, your formatting, or really, really anything. Just all. Anything skill related.

>> Reena: Well, man, lots of new skills. >> Wanye: But still a common theme to the show is that we try very hard to, give credit and review the legacy of where you came from and where you're going and the value of, of human life through multi generations and where we're not just, hopefully we're not just living for ourselves, but that we are trying to, improve our communication and. And our level of maturity, where human

beings have a chance to. To grow and not be, sometimes the uncivil animals that we tend to be. >> Reena: At times, I think that my dad's reactions to the guests have gotten a lot deeper. And like I said, sometimes guests come prepared like they know the format of the show and they ask my dad a question and he remembers them now and, and tries to really respond in a thoughtful way. I think in the beginning we were still figuring out

what my dad's part was going to be like. In the very beginning I'm like, should he sit on and listen to the story as it's unfolding? But that I feel like wasn't a good idea because, he doesn't really have the time for that. It's better for him for me to be able to conduct the interviews and then cut it down to what the segment's gonna be, and then for him to listen on his own and then for us to have a conversation most of the time undiscussed, unless he needs a pointer. Like sometimes

I'll be like, I don't know how to respond to that. And I'll be like, okay, let's sidebar. Cause I've already had the conversation, but for the most part it's really my dad coming up with his own thoughts. It's like reading two separate book and then having a conversation about the book. But instead I have a conversation with someone like an interview, and then he listens to it privately and then he has his own thoughts on it and we kind of create a

segment out of that. And then from his reaction to the story, I then formulate the intro. So that's really evolved over time. In the beginning I was like, you know, reading somebody's bio or you know, having some questions in mind of what I wanted to ask. Now after 350 plus episodes, I'm able to kind of do my research and, and know what people talk about and it's a lot less scripted. >> Elissa: That's got to be nice too, like setting it up. it definitely

is stressful. Like when you're first starting out and you're trying to figure out that formatting and all the little things, Just there's so many things that podcasters learn over time. And so that's really cool that you guys have been able to kind of take the show, learn from your own formatting. And definitely over 300 plus episodes hone in on how to really kind of structure it, that works for you and your audience.

>> Reena: But we do still mix it up. Like just a week ago I went to an event, I volunteered to be a part of a media booth and I interviewed people on the fly that I knew

nothing about. And that's Kind of fun, just, you know, whoever is looking to be interviewed that has never been on on a podcast before and you know, normally I'll know enough about a person where I can kind of know what they like to talk about, but if you know nothing about them other than the fact that, you know they're in the travel industry, you gotta be like, hey, well how'd you get into the travel industry? How long have you been in

the travel industry? What do you love about travel? So you kind of have to let them talk and give you clues of where to go in the conversation or, you know. I threw a podcasting event And one of the questions that I asked the people that came was, do you have a podcast? Do you want a podcast or have you guessed it on a podcast? And there was a lady who came, her name was Dr. Sandra Montgomery. And she ended up saying she wanted to guest on a podcast. And I was well, hey,

I'm working at this media booth this week. If you show up, I have access to the cameras and the mics and we can do it live. She drove an hour. Excuse me, she drove an hour to be interviewed. And it was her first podcast. And we had just met, you know, the day before. And so that's like a really good way to mix things up and be able to use body language and have an intimate conversation in person. It feels different. So I encourage actually podcasters to meet people in real life, go to

different events, throw an event of your own. I mean, all of these things kind of, they can still be inserted into your format. I still had my dad respond to it at the end. I still asked her about her dad, but also about her business. >> Elissa: That's really cool that you guys are able to kind of mix it. So whenever you're recording, like, do you prefer to try and do it a certain way or however the guest is wanting to be interviewed. do you do in person? primarily over the Internet?

>> Reena: for the most part. It's over the Internet, unless people are local. I've done local interviews in Chicago and I lived there for a decade. For a decade. I knew a guy that owned a studio and so I sometimes rented it. I know a couple people in Houston now, one that has a place where I can just record audio. I know a guy that can do audio and video, but sometimes if you rent people's studios and there's a M fee, so, you know, if the business wants to sponsor that,

amazing. I think it's better to have the video footage, but otherwise, you know, you can do an audio recording remotely. And that sounds just as good if you have a mic. And that's another thing that we've learned. In the beginning, you know, my dad was just using his Apple earbuds, but it was important that he had some sort of mic. Then he upgraded to the Yeti. I've now upgraded to the MV7 sure mic. There's always

upgrades. You can get a light, you can get a. A stand, you can get a HD, you know, 1080p camera, or you can shoot in person. I think, you know, people wanting to start a podcast first, see if you like it, guest on other people's podcasts first. Get solid at, like, telling your story before you're like, okay, I want to host this thing. Right? Like, there's steps. >> Elissa: Yes. Hosting and being on are definitely very, very different. There's for sure.

I heard you mention brands. I, know that you are the queen of collaboration. So kind of, how do you go about reaching out to brands, for either sponsorships or just even if you're thinking like, oh, I want this person to be on my podcast, how do you go about facilitating those conversations? >> Reena: So even at this oil and gas event that I was just at, what's it called?

I'm like, blanking. Oh, the OTC event, the Offshore Technology Conference, There was a guy, and he was a podcaster, and he was also part of the podcast row, Matt Bertram. And he was like, hey, I know a guy that is getting ready to launch a podcast, and he's discovered the fountain of youth pill. And I was like, ooh, introduce me to that guy. And so I reached out to him and I found out kind of who he's

interviewed and what brands that he's going to feature. And he's like, I'll send you my fountain of youth pill. So it's just. It's the same thing as, like, finding people to interview. It's the people that are in your path. I. I interviewed Shawna Arnott. She and I worked together on a GaryVee event, and she had hired me to help

her with sponsorships. And so I thought she would be. She would be a great person to have on because we've worked together, she's seen me in the field, she's booked a Lot of sponsors. She kind of showed me what the script to that looked like. But when I, when I worked for her, she was like, hey, I've got an Excel spreadsheet of, like, all these brands I'd love to work with. When you get one that's interested in being a part of the event, if you need help closing,

get me back on the phone. Otherwise, you're free to reach out and however way you want to do it. And once you get one, then it's like, okay, what did I say? That worked. How can I rinse, recycle, repeat? And so it's like, do my kids like a protein snack? Reach out to that brand, tag them, see if they even look at your story, if you're

using their product. Like, a lot of times, you know, if my kids like a product, I'll take a picture of them eating the protein snack or using the shoelaces or playing the game, and I'll tag the brand and see if they're even responsive. One of the ways that I booked Spirit Airlines for the Gary V event was reaching out on Twitter to Spirit, airlines help. And I was like, hey, who's the brand manager? You know, and

then they put me in touch with the brand manager. It's, it's partly like, knowing who to ask for, seeing where the brands are receptive, and also, like, letting them know that, like, you like their product. And, like, how can you partner? Do you ever partner with creators? I think, I mean, you work at a brand. What do you think about that? >> Elissa: Yeah, I mean, that's definitely something that I've seen work in the

past. We, are on social media everywhere, so I obviously see the same people pop up on our feed or tagging us, engaging with our stuff. I personally, I've reached out to people, you know, better call Daddy show, for instance. that I've seen being kind of super users of the products and saying like, hey, like, thank you so much. would you like to be featured in, like, our newsletter or something? And then

relationships can evolve from there. So, you know, that's might be more unique to our brand is like, we're actively seeking, but I've definitely gotten DMs on LinkedIn. People have found me personally and have been like, hey, like, I love Headliner. I would love to talk to you. So we've had, some kind of partnership spawned from that too. So, yeah, as a brand manager, definitely reach out to people on social media.

not everybody that monitors the Twitter is going to be the person that you need to talk to, but they will probably know the person that you need to talk to. So I would always encourage people to kind of reach out and like Reena said, try and engage with brands as much as possible on social. >> Wanye: Great. >> Elissa: way to grow. >> Wanye: Well I, I agree that it's relationship building, network, building your network.

And of course if you put out a quality show hopefully more and more people will want to connect with it. And and that might be a simple answer but if you're doing something hands on and you're building relationships and it's down to earth, I think it has a chance to be successful. >> Elissa: Exactly. And then I think podcasting too, it's such

a collaborative community. So like we'll even see at conferences, a lot of podcasters will come up to us and talk because we're normally in very discernible headliner gear that you can see from a mile away. So people will be able to kind of talk to us as humans. So that's of course if you have the opportunity to go to a conference or anything, talking to people in person is going to be a great way to kind of get those relationships started and formed.

>> Wanye: It sounds old school. That's what a lot of these trade shows or when my dad and I used to go to a few of these lighting shows. It's not necessarily just talking business. It's getting to know the needs of other people and seeing that and showing that you have capability to answer any of their questions and that you can be there for them in the clutch. And that seems to be accomplished. but you've got to be able to get in the door and a good way of doing that is being able

to express yourself in person. And in today's technology it's so easy to not have that personal touch because you got emails and and cell phones and, and automatic answering of phones and going to voicemails where you're lucky if somebody even will take your call. And it goes around press 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and then you hope that you even get

a, a call back. It's it's a lot more difficult I believe today even with the better communication because you're able to block out everybody, if you can't or don't want to get a connection. There's a way to avoid everybody. And in the old days you could even stop by somebody's place and if they don't see you, they don't see you. But sometimes you're able to hand out a card or, or or say

hello to someone in the office there. even sometimes even without an appointment other than to say, hey, try to fit me in. I just traveled from out of town to visit someone and you know you're right around the corner. Love to try to do business with you or help you, your needs in any way. But Podcasting and having an opportunity to voice your opinions, is a great opportunity for further freedom, in my opinion. >> Elissa: Exactly.

>> Reena: I wanted to give Headliner a little shout out because in yourall's newsletter at the end you encourage people to reach out. And that is actually I think why I initially reached out because I had tried a campaign with you guys and then it says we want to hear from you. And I feel like in all of URLs communication you put that in there that we want to hear from you. I don't think most brands, honestly I haven't seen other brands do that as much and

that is inviting. That makes me feel like you guys are approachable. And like you said, you're on all social. Like if I tag you guys, I see that you engage and so that makes creators want to engage back. >> Elissa: Well, thank you for the kind words. we just kind of following up on that, we definitely. So headliner, we were created purely from feedback, so we are always actively looking for feedback. And then that's kind of something that we like to echo back to podcasters

too. It's why we started this podcast specifically is from Feedback. So that's even something, that kind of podcasters can take into their own marketing strategy and think, okay, I want to improve. How can I improve? Getting feedback is going to be such an easy way to know that you are improving, especially for your listeners and your most loyal kind of followers. So.

>> Reena: And along with Feedback, one of the things that I rate my success on is honestly, like how many people are messaging me m in my DMs, on a daily basis. And honestly, like I know who my people are on Pretty much every channel. And I give that love back too. >> Elissa: You do? >> Reena: Like, I know the people that send me memes. I know the people that send me TED talks. I know the people that recommend books, and

I love all of those people. And then if I'm reading a good book that I feel like one of those people might like, or if I see a funny meme, you know, it's like, know your people, know what they like, know what they send you, and kind of give them some love back. And it. It's so much fun. And I have a Facebook group, too. I feel like this is a really big benefit if you have a podcast, to have a place, whether it's discord, whether it's a Facebook group, whether it's a WhatsApp group.

Like, have a place where you can gather your people and have, like, a core space where you bounce ideas and get back to your feedback, where you get feedback. I have a Facebook group with about 800 people in there, and these are my people that, like, literally show up for me. And so if I am thinking about interviewing a bachelor from a reality show, I will gauge the interest of that and say, hey, have you watched the Bachelor? Or,

you know, did you. Were you not into getting the rose? Or whatever, you know, but I will gauge different topics in my Facebook group. Like, I just posted something in there recently that went crazy, and I was like, how come only 50% of marriages work out? And there were so many responses to that. So obviously that would be an interesting topic to cover because a lot of people in our audience are, you know,

mid-40s. They've either been married once before or, you know, they've, you know, definitely gone past that seven year itch, or they've started again and they all had opinions on that. So it might be interesting to cover that topic in. In more than one way even. I mean, it was so crazily engaged. So

that's. That's a good idea, is like, have a place where you can gauge interest of different subjects and where you can point people who have been on your show to where the other people are that have been on your show or where your community lies. >> Elissa: Awesome. And then you obviously just mentioned, Facebook groups, but have you seen kind of any other platforms for your podcast that have worked for helping kind of like, more grow or engage your audience as well?

>> Reena: Twitter. Twitter and podcasting go together. I'm part of two private chats on Twitter with tons of podcasters, and a lot of it is kind of just sharing each other's Stuff, but like, you get to be friends with the people in there from actually checking out their content, you know, I had a podcaster message me today and he was like, hey, better call daddy. Just wanted to let you know you're like one of my top four that I listen to on good

pods. And I'm like, that's cool. And then when I shared that another podcaster was like, me too, you know, and then you want to see what else they're listening to. I want to see who else is in their top four. I want to check out the other podcasts that they like because they like me. Like maybe I should be checking out those shows or connecting with those people. You could just. So Twitter.

Definitely. I feel like threads, I've gotten more action there than I have Tick Tock threads, you know, has been. I, I've got past a thousand a lot quicker than I did on Tick Tock. I feel like, There's definitely a podcasting community if you do hasht podcast threads. My feed is filled with different podcasters and I'm finding my people there too. >> Wanye: Are you using YouTube also?

>> Reena: Oh yes. Thank you for reminding me. So I feel like with YouTube, I, I definitely could spend more time there and I've had some big wins, but I've also

like had some duds where you're like, d***, this is a lot more effort for not enough payoff. But then if, if you interview somebody that has a big following on YouTube, then it's worth it. >> Elissa: Yeah. >> Reena: but the searchability is really good there. And then also another thing that I know I need to be doing more and this is probably a tip for other people. And I've talked to other podcasters who swear by this is. I know I need to be blogging about each episode. I

do. So kind of repurposing the show notes. Not only are you doing that on every social media platform, but SEO is a big thing. When you do blogs and you add the keywords and then your back episodes are really discovered. And I have a backlog of episodes that I need to do that for. >> Elissa: Yeah, I, I'm always a big fan of doing

blogs. I don't necessarily do it for our podcast, but I definitely see like you can get over time and see like in Google Analytics, like whenever you post a blog, normally you kind of see like a quick spike in traffic. it'll teeter off. But then especially if you've got very intentional kind of about some of your keywords or if you're just kind of trying to more establish your authority and you're kind of using like similar themes.

You can really kind of watch your traffic steadily grow over time. So blogs are definitely something that I've seen have grown our podcast mostly, not necessarily because of, the searchability of it, but we actually embed all of our podcast episodes into our blog with our disco widget player. So we see a lot of people, are finding our podcast by reading our blog directly so we can even track

that traffic. so that's just also something that's really cool about blogs is just being able to kind of have an additional touch point to not only plug your content in like either your brand or your authority, but also directly have your podcast link there as well. >> Reena: are there any tools through Headliner that can help with that?

>> Elissa: Yeah, so we have it's the disco widget embed. So it's disco free by Headliner, but it's just a very simple widget that you can if you have WordPress, excuse me, if you have WordPress, there's a plugin for it. So you can do it. And it'll just kind of pull in contextually relevant episodes based off of that blog. So if you are writing about that specific podcast episode, it will of course recommend

that. But if you also have kind of two similar episodes, then it'll try and recommend those as well to listeners so they can see it. It'll be like a quick little clip. They can play it, listen to the clip and be like, oh, I really like that. Click through and listen to the entire episode. So that is something that Headliner offers. >> Reena: Oh my gosh, I am glad that I now know

about that. It's funny because I watched your all's YouTube video of how to use Eddy and I wasn't even use using Eddy at that time. So that has really helped me. And I tell everyone I literally scream it from the rooftops like Eddy by Headliner is amazing for title suggestions and AI picks if you know, sometimes I've had people that want to do anonymous episodes so they don't want their face, they don't want me making any clips. They don't maybe have. They maybe didn't send me a graphic

of their brand. So creating AI images like 3 or 4 is so helpful. And I've now done that, just to mix things up. Even, you know, instead of doing a video clip or a branded graphic, you could do an AI image. And those are, those are really great and fun. And I have found, you know, people engaged them. And so yeah, I'm always looking for ways to do things differently or to work with brands that are also having a similar audience. Another tool, that

I've discovered is the braid. It applies and instead of like having a camera person at your event where you're like using these prompts, like, hey, do you have a podcast, want a podcast or want a guest on one? I could have done that on the braided app and created that prompt which creates a QR code and then they can respond like in app and then it strings all of the responses together. So that's just fun. And you could even like do this on LinkedIn.

You could do this on social, like create a QR code with a prompt and people can respond on their phone via video or text. so I think that that's fun. There's all kinds of AI tools now. there really are. >> Elissa: And there are AI tools coming up every day. So it's definitely, an exciting time for creators to kind of have those tools to help them especially offload the things that they don't necessarily love doing, like blog writing.

I wouldn't say that that's my passion, but having tools, like Eddy, that help you kind of either distill content or whatever just to kind of speed up those tasks, so you can get back to the things that you really like about podcasting are definitely, that's been so awesome for, and we've just seen a lot of podcasters kind of being like, oh, I don't like want AI to take away from the creative side of podcasting, but I

like how it helps me do the things that I don't want to do. So that's kind of something that's been really cool to see especially as like our products and being able to see that, but also just seeing it kind of out in the community and stuff like that, is always really awesome, 100%. >> Reena: It has definitely helped with productivity for me so much. >> Elissa: But, I do have one final question. just kind of before wrapping it up here, we've talked a lot about your

marketing and everything. but just kind of thinking about your podcast. What helps define success for Better Call Daddy? >> Reena: What do you think about that, dad? >> Wanye: Well, I, I think if people can that watch the show, can relate to it and, and can get, like I said, one, or two sense of wisdom out of it, I think we've been successful is getting a message out in a down to earth honest way. And,

we're trying to build a legacy of, in. In the format of making it, important to tell your story and to tell the story of where you came from and hopefully to your children and children's children, of where you're going, where you're giving them an exciting perspective that it's not, just about me, it's about all of us. >> Reena: I love that answer. Yeah. I mean, it's funny because I now feel like we have a project where we are gaining new skills and we're getting special

time together. And it's not too often that somebody in their 40s gets to do that with their parent. And I hope that we encourage other parents to, like, interview their kids or the kids interview the parents and, you know, have a project together where you can learn and build a community. I think that that is success to me. I, like, look forward to my special daddy time and then

also partnering with brands and learning new tools and bringing all of these cool people into my life. It has just presented so many amazing opportunities. >> Elissa: Well, that's awesome. And I always love, I said it once, I'll say it again. I love listening to you guys podcast, kind of hearing your relationship and how it's able to kind of connect you guys and then, you know, obviously tell the world about either other people's stories and just kind of give your two cents.

it's always so great to listen to the show. but I do think that about does it today. So I would like to thank our amazing guests for being on the show today. Thank you. Thank you. Reena, Wayne, it was a pleasure. And to the podcasters out there and to the listeners out there, if you'd like to learn more about Headliner, please visit us anywhere at the web at Headliner App.

>> Reena: App. >> Elissa: for more on Rena and her dad, listen to the Better Call Daddy show wherever you get your podcast. And as always, thank you so much, and happy podcasting.