His name is Charles Williamson, but for almost a decade, his name was replaced by a series of numbers assigned to him by the Federal Bureau of Corrections. Those numbers served as a daily reminder that he was doing time for credit card fraud. When I say fraud, I'm not talking to typical minor league lick for Pared Jordan's. I'm talking major fraud to the tune of twenty million dollars.
But we'll elaborate in that little later, because every story has the beginning, and this story starts with another Elias that Williamson went by, and that was Gorilla Black. One day, you know, I was in a real dark space, and at that time I was financially inept, so a lot of money that I had previously made and with being an industry, with touring, with publishing, all of that had pretty much been exhausted of me living and you know, trying to create a business, which was my barbershop. A
lot of y'all that's been throughout the city. A lot of people know me from on and you know, hair salons and barbershops, you know, being in the hair business over the last almost twenty years, whether it's creating products, whether it's shops and so forth. So um an associate introduced me. And when an associate introduced me to it, I've seen the power of it and I was in a dark space at that time. I'll be the first
to admit that. And I realized that it was a potential way to change things up for me in the immediate future on my finances. But I really didn't understand the mechanics behind it. And so once you know, I've always been an inquisitive individual by nature soul, me sitting down and really getting an understanding of exactly how it worked.
Once I did, I ended up connecting with somebody. And when I did connect with this person through you know, the dark web, he had sent me a batch of you know cards, and I think it was like November of that year, and I think the first month I made about fifty dollars. And from that point out, I realized that, you know, he had codependency problems. He was you know, pretty much a heroin at it. And from that point out our conversation became a little bit deeper,
and so he understood it. I had the financial ability to be able to take these cards and actually make a profit, and he was having financial issues of his own because of his codependency problem. So I took it upon myself to ingratiate myself to the point of where I would pay for all of the other means that came to get in the card is, whether it be you know, the servers, or whether it be you know, all of the different technology that was needed and mare
were and so forth for that nature. And I pretty much funded it. And so once I got to that level, I realized that I got really really really deep and um to where you know it was it was nothing to harvest, you know, in a week's time to the three thousand cards, and um, I had to understanding in a sophisticated means to be able to tap into thousands of pots pretty much worldwide. And um, I would take those cards as I would get them and let them
sit in different batches and so forth. So my level of understanding of how the complexity of it it was. It was complex at first, but uh that that complexity just pretty much grew into child's play after a while because he explained to me on so many different levels. And as that happened, I pretty much graduated into you know, other circumstances with other individuals who was doing the same thing. So that just expounded itself into a whole another you
know situation, and where it just continued to you know growing. Um, yeah, you're mixing the dark web. And that's always been like a mythical thing to me, like how did you learn that technology? Did they teach you all the technology and how to get access the dark web and everything like that. Well, it was pretty much a lot of different sites in which me doing my homework Delvon and Delvon and Delvon
and Delvon. And in that era, there was websites that actually sole and marketed you know, um day capabilities of you know, selling dumps, which is quote unquote credit card numbers. UM. I went on in site and you know, there was a messaging um technology that was pretty much a Russian technology and in which way you could message the you know, all of the different hackers and so forth. And so
when I messaged him, how I met the individual? When I messaged him, he hit me back and so he was like, I said, well, I need fifty cards, and so he sent them to me and I hadn't even sent him the money, and I must said have made maybe about six seven thousand dollars off of them, and um he said, yeah, brother, who you owe me? Um this? And I was like, okay, cool, So I sent him the money and from there he would just send him, just send him, send him, send him, send him, send him.
And so when he got to the point to where he couldn't actually pay for you know, to serve for space, to be able to run the equipment and all of the gear, to be able to you know, playing all of them, all ware throughout all of the posits that you know, was pretty much worldwide. I just pretty much took over all of that aspect of it, on the billion of it. And then from there he was able to pretty much access you know, my computer, you know, remotely, and then step by step I was able to learn
everything exactly what he was doing. And it was crazy because when you look at it, it's like if me and you're standing on a block, but imagine having a big, huge ring full of keys, and each one, well not a huge ring. Let's just say we got at least five keys, but we go to each back door and we try each key, and then every time it would crack on my screen would say vulnerable, and then it's like us going to all of them and so imagine doing that times a hundred thousand and then times a million.
Imagine going to a million back doors trying those keys. And so, yeah, I knew the vulnerabilities inside the Microsoft system. And so once I understood that, and then from there he would sit there and explain to me how to actually use you know, all of the different technology and them allware, they'll be added to it, and pretty much
it was. It was a game changer for me because I was it was it was lights out because every time you would go inside of a store, a lot of you don't even realize it, but you take your card and imagine you're going in there and you're just paying for some milk and some cookies or whatever it mayby. Well, when you slide that magnetic strip, that magnetic strip sends out a series of codes, which is a track one
at tracked two, and that information goes to a processor. Well, I would get inside of that line and when that information would go to the processor, it would also go to me and go to the processor and go to me. And imagine all of the people that walk in the store in the day so you pretty much said, um said, access to the terminals that were in the stores. Yeah, it's surpas the point of sales. Wow. So look, let me ask you this. You mentioned that you made money
off of these cards. How would a person make money of a credit card? Pretty much? You know, we use a machine, and then I would take that machine and you could actually encode any magnetic strip with the code of numbers, which is a series of numbers which identifies
every individual. So let's just say the first track would have your name on it, your last name, your first name, with a series of numbers, and then there would be another one and that would be the being and the beginning numbers is the bank identification number, and then a series of numbers that would actually lead to that account. So I would just use track two track two on everything.
I made it a lot easier. I didn't need all of that, And I would just go into a store seven eleven and I would take thirty gift cards that was on the shelf that had never been open and never been touched, and I just put them in the grocery bag and walk out the store with him or
anywhere I would see them. And then when I would get back to my lab, I would just open them up and with a program placed on the laptop, it would be plugged into a box and whenever I would swap into and all of that information Track one, track two, well, I would using the only using track two. It would be on that card, and from there I would give that card to my crew of individuals and they would
pretty much go on shopping spreeze all day. So you guys would go on shopping sprees and pretty much real the items that you curate to on those visits, not really the item so much. It would just be on a shopping spreef for gift cards. So you know, I would never sent her brought up in there with some
booty shorts into you know, Bloomingdale. Actually you had to dress the part, so I would make sure that she had her hair nice and that she looked like she was someone who had five thousand dollar credit card or had access to five or ten thousand dollar credit card and so much. Pretty much essentially, once she would just slide that card, it would ring up the sail and then she would buy items to disguise the bigger play.
The bigger play was the actual gift card. So being able to get a five hundred dollar Bloomingdale card, which would pretty much retail on the streets for about three hundred dollars or to fifty or whatever or a half of it. So imagine she got three five hundred dollar home depot cards, UM, a few hundred dollar Bloomingdale and Norstradale North uh Norstrooms cards, UM walking side of all marked and pretty much you could buy these cards when you buy another product. So at that time I would
let them keep all of the merchandise. All I wanted was a third or third or third or third for me and third for you, a third for the actual game pretty much the cost of everything. So it was the third or third or third split and so you exactly pretty much essentially they would keep two thirds and I would keep two thirds. How much money would you say this operation was grossing for you a month? Yeah? It varies. I mean, because I was sending cards with females,
you know, the federal government. All of this is documented. And also I was selling cards to other individuals. You know, I was selling fifty four thousand, so probably about a hundred thousand, maybe a hunting if shorter, maybe any anywhere around eighty nine somewhere around there. Oh wow, man, so you really have a celebrity, you really have an elaboraty system going yeah, yeah, okay, so you know you have this going on. What was your run? Like, how many
years was you doing it? Successful? It wasn't a very very long run, man, I mean it was probably about a good to three year run. And you know, it wasn't a real real long run because you know, I guess the element of surprise is the surprise itself. So the individual what brought the run pretty much to an
end is the individual. I never forget there was a There was two locations in the Seattle area, and one of the locations, you know, I never forget this because it's so eerie, and I never forget getting the phone call from me said I got two more spots, and so he had access to it. And when I went inside every and I looked, I said, where did these cards come from? And when I'm you know, taking the numbers,
and I'm looking. By this time, I'm able to look at the first three digits of it, and so I know what the bank, what banks they are, and I'm like, these not regular cards, these are business and corporate cards pretty much essentially, and so I'm running them boom, I'm running.
I walked into a Walmart and I think mont Claire Claire Mount, California, and I walked in and I must have the boat light four or five PlayStations, and then I must have bought about another three or four five gift cards myself literally and I'm like, damn, So the cards was they was going going going, and um to come to find out that the company that they came from had went and got a computer forensic expert that was able to trace back where the cards where we
planted the line and trace it all the way back to the actual server and trace it all the way back to his I P and pretty much once that happened, Yeah, it was. It was pretty much everything was on a on a on a time clock pretty much. And once they gathered they gathered enough information and they grabbed him. He you know, pretty much relinquished you know, everything and pretty much essentially told on me. So yeah, so so so he um involved, you went to his mess he
got caught and pretty much ruled over on you. When did you get an ideal? Because I think people normally get an ideal they could feel the heat on them. Did you feel the heat in the instance, I didn't really know. I never forget at the time. UM, you know me and you know my son's mother. We was in Puerto Rico, and I never forget. I went out there for my birthday and I stayed at the Continental Hotel.
And you know, during my birthday is this elaborate thing that they do there where people jump in the ocean backwards and they make all of these new resolutions of how the rest of the year is gonna be, and you know, all of these different epiphanies they begin to have. And it's a holiday almost essentially there. And so we came back and whenever we came back, I owned a motorcycle shop at the present time, and I went to
the motorcycle shop. And when I went to the motorcycle shop, my partner, who was my partner inside of my motorcycle shop, he was like, YO, get the funk out of here. Federal agents been all over the place. Hearth Thorn, the sheriff Department, Towrence, Police Department, UH, the Marshals, the Secret Service. They had toward the shop, two smith Rens and um they was looking for me, and yeah, I had a and then so I had a friend, you know, my
friend Geo. He called, you know, an officer that he knew, and he said, man, they got a twenty two count indictment um for guerrilla black out of Seattle. And that's how I found out I had a twenty count indictment. Yeah. Did you ever think about running? Man? I wanted to run. You know, I stayed here and I had to throw my phones away. I threw everything away and try to get off of the grid. But pretty much it's the FEDS man. So everyone that was associated with me, that
was inter linked with me, they had under surveillance. So you know, imagine I had this motorcycle shop, another motorcycle shop too, uh, barbershops, and also office that you know at the time my wife and I was running. So I had all of these. I have five different businesses going on, plus my elicit business, my my real cash cow, my credit card hustle. So um, yeah, I mean I thought about running. That was a thought in my mind
for a long time. But I was like, damn, where I'm gonna run to, Like, this is the federal government that's I'm going to lead the country, And you know, leave my kids, leave everything that I pretty much know. So the thought came across my mind. So the thought came brout your mind. So when how did the police finally how the law enforcement officials finally kick up? Which I had got an attorney, and I was talking to the attorney, but I didn't understand that they pretty much
essentially already knew where I was at. So the attorney was pretty much keeping them at bay. Um. Eventually I would end up getting a paid attorney and working with a whole another individual. Um. But I never forget it. I Um. I was sitting in there in the living room and I was reading the Bible. It's so coincidental. And we hear a knock on the door, and my
wife she got asked for the door. And at this time I was living in Palace Verdes, and so here the door pump, blah blah boom, and so she like black black, black black, And I'm like, what the hell, what's going on? And so I walk up and then you know, the federal agents, they was all in plain clothes. They was all, you know, I'm swing, so from the Secret Service. I'm sewing, so from the Secret Service. I'm
from the Secret Service. I'm from the Secret Service. Charles Williamson can used to please step forward, said yeah, are you Charles Williamson. And in their hand they had the indictment and the Warren as well, and they didn't even put no cuffs on me. I looked in front of my yard and I've seen six hundred bins is and I've seen rain drovers, and all of them was filled with federal agents, all of them with Secret Service. They literally walked me to the back of a six hundred,
open the back door and put me in it. And along the way back to the Federal building you can see those cars swarming around. And we got there. Then they took me up there and I never forget. They was like, you want to sit down and talk. I was like, man, it's been a rough day. Man. I just need two things. Man, I need a soft bunk man and a pubby meat sandwich. And we ain't got nothing else to really say. Okay. So from there processed
me out, went to the raiment. Following day, they sent me up to m d C. And then the Ninth Circuit, which is from Seattle. Up there they sent down the request to have me uh extradited back up to Seattle was so crazy and ironic. Like I said previously, the places in which where we got the information from out of these two spots in Seattle, and the forensic scientists, all of the information that they got, they pretty much
sent it over to the federal government. And the moment that cards was moved over international wire or over over you know, these internet communications, it became a federal crime. So I couldn't be prosecuted on the state level. It became all federal at that time. So it became of fear. And if I'm not mistaken in the fits you that time, No, it's not a dent. You do eighty seven point five percent of it. So, um, yeah, it's eighty seven point five percent, you know, even on a non violence such
as mine. Um. Crazy part about it is is for me to get the time that I got, I pretty much, you know, to keep a lot of other people that was involved with me out of the way, I had to give away my appeal rights as long as they allowed my family members, you know, to not be caught up in you know, my present charges on a conspiracy. So pretty much I gave away my appeal rights. So yeah, yeah, that was an honorable thing to do. Um. You know, now, when did your sentence you come about? Um? I was
sentenced actually once they took me into custody. What was so crazy is what is the day eighteen two days ago? Yeah, would be the anniversary of that day is January sixteenth. They took me into federal custody, and I probably I got sentenced later that year of two thousand and thirteen October. I got sentenced October ten. Um, I was extradited from m DC to C Tax C Tax which is Seattle Tacoma, Washington, to have a federal holding that's there. So once that happened, Um,
I never forget. I think his name was Judge Gonzalez, and um they pretty much that whole day. Man, I was hearing dudes getting sixty months, seventy months, eighty months. I was like, Oh, I'm gonna get love. I'm gonna get love. And UM, I never forget. I wasn't pleaning. I didn't want to plead to the twenty million dollars in fraug. That was you know, us being slick on some on some some nickel slicks. Ship. We're not gonna
plead to the twenty million. It sounds a lot better pleading to thirty thousand credit cards instead of pleading to twenty million dollars a fraud. So my attorney got up there with the Nickel slicks. Shit. It was like, you know, repleating the you know, these thirty thousand credit cards. The judge was like, man, I ain't trying to hear that. Man, this is a twenty million dollar fraud case, and just
swatted my attorney like bow. And you know, during this, with me signing for open plea, my life is literally in the judge's hand. It's not like a regular where I'm locked into a set amount of time. I have my guidelines, which is a hundred and eight to a hundred and thirty five months, so the judge can give me within that range, or he could go above it. During you know, behind the mitigating circumstances. Under one bank fraud charge, which I played till over five of them,
bank frog carries a maximum penalty of thirty years. I played the aggravvated identity death Aggravated identity theft carries the twenty four mandatory sentence. I played it also to access device for aud which is essentially any device that you're able to use as a communication vehicle for bank information as well, so I never forget it. Man. He was like, um,
you know what Mr Williams said to do. I can give you twenty years and uh man, I mean I just felt like my whole life flashed and I'm literally sitting here in a black box cuffed, he said. But I'm not gonna do that to you. He said, I'm gonna give you for these charges right here, there's gonna be eighty seven months. And on top of that, I'm going to give you another twenty four months for the aggravated identity theft, so that's gonna be a hundred and ten months. But he said, you ever come back up
in this courtroom again, I will give you twenty years. Yeh. And so where did you do your time that I did most of my time and but Loon Park Federal Correctional um Institution up there in Long Park, California. So yeah, that's Ceclon Pard that's the Santa Maria, California actually, and you were locked there with interesting people, Yeah, definitely, man um. The first place where they housed me at was in
Jay Dorm. And Jay Dorm we call that Loon Park Hills, because when you come into the actual yard, there's two big buildings that's next door to each other and they've been there forever in a day and back then in the gap and used to be like they said, a military you know site or whatever. But we called it the projects because it was the first floor, second floor, third floor, and on the other side it was medical. Then it was two more floors, and so we called
it the Projects. And inside was where they had the phone booth setting. So this first dorm right here when you passed the gym was cater and then when you passed the other gate past the barbershop all the way to the back, that was Ja Dorman and back there, you know, I was in there with you know, a lot of interesting characters, but more than you know, the one that was the most essential and important man, and I got a lot of understanding and a lot of
mentoring from was Harry oh Man. Uh. I think he was a key point for me because I had never ran into an individual who was as intelligent and a person that had this bevy of knowledge on so many different topics and situations and who was well read and could communicate itself in a way that was well articulated
and intelligent. That was something that was unseen in there because everybody else was on Niggorish ship, so you know, everybody was just playing the phone trying to get a bus to send some bread, or do this, a girl do that. And I never forget. He was the first individual to introduced me to Aggy Mandino. That book Man is by African author, and introduced me to everything story story book about Jeff Bezo. Just he had were lockers
full the Levenber books. The man would just have books after books after books after books, and he would order books and then he would bring him over there and say, baby, before read this, and then come back and be like, man, let me know what's up with that book, and I'll be giving him a summation of pretty much how the book broke down. And he already knew that I was a fast reader. But you know, the most protective books was these books that he had from this African author
named Agi Mandino. So oh, you already know what I'm talking about, and I do research it and I haven't got two of his books. But Agi Mandino was a dope, dope, dope dope writer and he wrote things in these parables. So that's what made it so dope with this African author. And he was really real protective and I never forget UNC pulled up on me, was like, baby boy, you
finished with that book. And and all of the years, almost seven years, I've never seen him that protective about books and the book ain't never about this then, But those were books I think that he had begun in reading at the beginning of his bid. And you know, he walked down life in the state that's twenty five.
He was in the fast serving another nineteen years, so you know, um that was those books was definitely incredible, and he just introduced me to so many different authors, man, just authors that I have never heard of, never you know, begin you know, to even think that was super duper dope, Like a lot of people don't even you know, read a lot of the different books that Robert Kiyosaki wrote, but one of the dopest books that he wrote was
Retired Young Retired Rich. I mean, just so many different authors that I was able to read, um, you know, how to win people, win people and influence people by Dale Carnegie. Just all kind of different authors that I read up on and just read their books, and he introduced me to a lot of them books. You know, a lot of our people, a lot of the viewers out there, have never been to prison before. Give us a brief summary of prison life in general. I mean
prisoners a place based on respect. Everything is dealt from a place of respect. Everything is dealt on the place of being on man time, and you being a man first before any and all things. You know, I don't care what kind of squabbles you got, I don't care
what kind of killer you is. If you go in there looking for something, they're gonna give you what you're looking for, whatever it is, whatever level you think when you go in there on a respectable level, on some man time, you know, and whatever adversity come your way, you handle it immediately. And a lot of times that's you know through you know, whether it's we get down going run one or if it needs even be to go to another level where we gotta go get that knife.
You know, however it needs to be dealt with, it's gonna get debt with, and it's gonna get dealt with quickly and fast. Another thing with prison, especially being around a lot of the individuals. Is you gotta go, You gotta get a homies, that paperwork, because these are the people that you're gonna be living with essentially sometimes a decade,
sometimes multiple decades. And a dude just want to know that you solid you know here on you know, you're sitting here eating soups and snacks and fun packs and you fucked up. That's that's the ultimate disrespect. If you fucked up, you fucked up. Understand that. Understand that this ain't the place for you to be. And and when you're moving in there, everything is gonna be on respect time.
You're not gonna What's so crazy is once you see that violence jump off, everybody's super respectful because they understand that that violence could take place in the in the inkling of a second, and that violence come in your life. It could mean your asswhoops severely, just in an inkling, and in there is just every day it's the monotony of doing the same thing over and over all and over and over and it's repetitive, and it's you become programmable,
and you're on a program. So at this time, you wake up at four thirty in the morning, at six o'clock, you hear the yard call, you do the same thing day in day out, you become desensitized to you know, you guys, it's a big hoorade for the holidays, but when you're away from loved one's family members and you in a place whereas Graham and it's dark, you become
desensitized to it. And the only way you're able to get any information or understand what's going on in the real world is through need literature that comes through, whether it be a newspaper, whether it be magazines, or what you see through the bubble, and you're living through a bubble pretty much and watching the television. That's the only way you know what's going on in the real world out there and through phone calls and emails. So that's
how prison is. It's just on a respect level. Like if someone's going to the shower and it's a line of closed, you can't just walk and just go in to the shower and just take a shower at leisure. No, it's people before you, and that I get you caught up in wreck immediately. You can't put your hands on somebody outside of your race. That will get your ass disciplined immediately. You can't eat from somebody else. You can't.
I don't care how bamba tacos. They look like they're over there making you ben I take your ass over there and getting none. And that's just how prison is. You know where you watch TV, you watch TV, where our TVs is at. You know a lot of dudes like, oh man, I'm gonna do what. No, no, no, no no no. Ain't no man bigger than the program. Ain't nobody bigger than the car. No matter how big you is, you become this small when you walk into prison because
all you got is your people and that's it. And you're gonna do what they say when they're saying and how it's done, and you pretty much you know you won't. You you ain't on your time. You you're on the cars time. And how it's gonna move, it's how you're gonna move. Now, when did you get the news? I want to go back to the exact day and the time, and how you feel the rare emotions that were running through your body when you found out she was getting
out of prison. Oh wow, I mean I had waited for so long and they finally gave me a date, And I want to say, it was like April eleven, And what it is is is you're waiting for the Halfway House to give you a date. So that was an emotional thing in itself. And so imagine that rush of emotion. And then when COVID came, it pushed that date again to May eighteenth. May eighteenth is when of
is when I walked out of a federal facility. And I never forget that morning between my bunk because at that time we didn't have access to the yard because of the COVID situation and how rampant it was, and I had just did a thousand push us right there between the bunks, and I jumped in the shower as I usually do around that time, and I never forget.
I heard the officer come up outside of the booth, Williams six three one seven four one one too, Williamson roll that ship up, and I said, roll it up. And so homies just converged on me, and everything was pretty much dispensed out. You know, all your belongings pretty much is you know, spoken fold, all your comrades and friends. You know, the homie get these shoes, he get these books, these headphones, go over there to him, all of these soups go to homie over there, everything pretty much has
already spoken for before you go. So everything was spoken fold and everybody converged and you know, hugs and you know smiles, you know, and that moment your stomach just bubbling and rumbling, like damn, I'm gonna go home, my nigga finally, Like I never forget that feeling, like just the excitement, the rush, just like damn at you'd be scared at the same time though too, like you know, like damn, what the funk like because you've become I don't like to saying like this, but it's like a
low key home. So you used to this environment, you used to doing things this way. You used to I know, the showers, I got the showers, I got this bunk. It's it's kind of it's a taboo to people who have never been there, but for somebody who've been there, you know, you've become accustomed to and so that fear comes in. And even though the excitement is the first rush, but then it's like an excitement slash fiery emotion like oh ship, oh ship, damn damn, but the excitement is
still They're like damn, what I'm gonna eat. What I'm gonna dude, I'm gonna get some pussy. I wanted to drinks, have me a drink, you know. So it was just a whole ball of emotions, man, a whole ball of them. Like like, man, it's like getting a brand new car, you know. Prison. Actually I didn't get picked up from prison. Um. What happens is is that, uh, I ended up catching They gave me a bus. They give you a two dollar They gave me a two hundred dollar card, and
they give you two hundred dollars. And then on top of the two hundred dollars, I had got all the money that was on my books from you know, my activities in there, but all of it is put on a card and so pretty much they give you a bus um ticket. So the van puts you in the van and then they drive you to the bus station. So when I got to the bus station, I'll never forget. I must have walked damn near fifteen Literally, I walked
like fifteen blocks, and I never forget. I walked right into a CVS and I bought you know, at that time, I had never you know, it's different now I've been out for a while, but I've seen the phone and it was in the pack and I'm like, it's twenty dollars. But I got bought the phone. Boom boop. Walked all the way back to the bus station because my bus didn't come until later, and that bus take you to the downtown Greyhound station. So you know, I'm so out
of the loop. You just imagine being gone for nine years. I don't know how to operate none of this ship when I when I left, it was still buttons on phones and ship. It wasn't no Facebook, was no Instagram. Really, Facebook had just really started pretty much. So um, the
dude took my phone. He was from the camp and he just threw the program to put the card on there and I was able to make a phone call the hot and uh, how had me this extra bomb uber to come pick me up like a limo uber and all that ship food and all kind of stuff up in there for me. So my brother was the first one to in gratiate. Make sure you know I was straight this best bomb man. Let me ask you this, what did you eat when you first good out? What did I eat? Damn? It seemed like what did I eat?
What was the first thing that I ate? I wait a minute, what did I eat? He sent me some food? I had some food he sent in the uber. It was like a breakfast or something like that, a bomb ass breakfast, and so I ate that on the way to the half house because I only had twenty four hours to get to the halfway house. So that night I was just so in thralled with the phone. I
just stayed at the bus station. And so when he sent the Uber Deluxe or whatever it was it suv do with the little like a little limb or whatever not. So I think it was like a breakfast in there, and I ate all of that ship. And that was the first, uh street food I had ate because I didn't eat anything at the bus station or at the other bus station, So it was like a like a breakfast thing or whatever. Not. Now, before we end, man,
I'm gonna ask you a very important question. I want you to think about a little bit with the prison cost you. Wow, you know, my crime was worth twenty million dollars twenty million, twenty million, that's what the government charged me. My actual loss was far less, but the price that was even greater than the twenty million when you take a look at it on a deeper level
and scale. So I took thirty thousand credit cards. So these thirty thousand credit cards belonged to thirty thousand people at one point or another that went somewhere and probably tried to swipe that card, whether it was a soccer mom pulling up to McDonald's with her kids, just trying to get something to eat for our kids going after school, and trying to swipe that card, and it declined, that's one of the thirty thousand people. My children we're left
without leadership, without father, without guidance. My mother was left without her son. My brothers were left without counsel, My wife was left without a spouse and a provider and a love. And me I was inside of a federal correctional facility. I once read a thing said that rich people measure riches and materialism, but the wealthy measure wealth and time. So when you understand time is the most valuable commodity that one could have, that every fortune five
company is trying to commoditize. Then information, then leverage, and then part of leverage would be money. M I gave away. I traded nine years, two months for twenty million dollars in fraud. The people, the places, the connections, the relationships that I could have created and made, the time with my children, all of that was lost. My grandmother used to say that when we die, we die with our memories. We don't take nothing else from this earth. We take
with us our memories. Imagine there was no winner. Everybody lost. My children lost, my wife lost, the thirty thousand people who owned those cards lost, my brother's loss, and most of all I was lost. It was much much. The time I gave away was the most valuable things that one could have. I can't go back and get back a nine years two months of my life. You gotta realize, even though our life seemed like it's long, man, this
ship short. I'd have lost so many people to natural causes or violent deaths while I was in and all the way to now. You can't get back time. You could always get money, like we were just previously saying ship poor is temporary, but I mean being broke is temporary, but poor is eternal forever. I can easily go get some money, but I can't go get back that time. I can't