Kiota.
I'm Chelsea Daniels and This is the Front Page, a daily podcast presented by.
The New Zealand Herald.
New details have emerged about what could be happening behind the scenes at Gloria Vale. Authorities have been quietly involved in yet another investigation there, with the Children's Minister and Uraga Tamariki both involved.
This time a mass allegation.
Investigation relates to concerns that parents were taught to cover the mouths of children and babies to stop them from crying.
Ends At Herald's senior.
Investigative reporter, Michael Morra has been digging into this and he joins us now on the Front Page. First off, Michael, I know in this day and age, you'd be pretty hard pressed to find someone who doesn't know what Glory is Val is. But how would you explain it to someone who just didn't know anything about it?
I guess it's a secretive sect on the west coast of the South Island. It's a fundamentalist Christian community. They have a very male dominated leadership structure. Women don't really have the same rights or leadership roles as the men who there's the overseeing shepherd and then the Shepherds do. They have a very shared sense of belonging and they promote large families. They have struck protocols on what you
can dress. They also do not like influence from the outside world, which is seen as evil, and their world is seen as following Jesus Christ and what he would do.
How many people are there?
Do? We know?
About six hundred members at Gloria Vale currently.
Wow.
And a lot of kids.
Yes, mostly children, So the population of Gloria Vale is mainly made up of young people.
Tell me about how you first learned that there might be another investigation happening behind the scenes at Gloriavale and what are those allegations.
So I've just started doing some investigative work into Gloria Vale, and part of that involved filing some Official Information Act requests with the Children's Minister, Karen Shaw. As part of that request, I sought updates and ministerial briefings. I essentially, as a journalist, wanted to know what precisely was going on at Gloria Vale right now in twenty twenty five, and what had the minister advised been advised was going on.
What I learned is that police and udoing a Tamaiki have quietly been conducting what they term a mass allegation investigation at Gloria Vale. This has involved more than one hundred interviews with parents children who are current residents of Glorivale, as well as some former residents or leavers of Gloriavale. This started this investigation in November last year and it's
now been complete. And what I've learned from the documents is that this investigation was carried out as a result of concerns that came out in the Royal Abuse and Care Inquiry. Now that Abuse and Care Inquiry obviously heard from lawyers and former residents of Gloriavale about the abuse and harm they say occurred during their time within this community, and it was that information which prompted this mass allegation investigation.
Now what exactly was it all about, Well, one aspect and it hasn't really been covered much at all in the media in terms of what the Commission heard was that there was a practice at Gloria Vail that Founder Hopeful Christian essentially taught and encouraged, and that was if a child is crying or upset or making noise, there is a method to stop that and it should be encouraged because it's disciplining a child, and parents who discipline their children and who have well behaved children at Gloria
Vale are given the big tick that they're doing well. And that method to quiet and children was to put your hand over the baby or child's mouth and knows so that they would not cry anymore. Now, obviously that is incredibly dangerous. However, I have spoken to former Gloria Vail residents who told me parents were never told of the risks of this to a child. It was all about discipline and they were taught these techniques, which is hand over mouth to prevent a child from crying.
Yeah, I mean you've spoken to at least one former Glory of Our resident, Virginia Courage. I saw what she said about her experiences there as a parent.
Well.
Her comments in my story out on enzid hero dot co dot nz this morning verifies what the Royal Commission into Abuse and Care heard, And what the Commission heard was that quote. Several former residents reported seeing children and infants turning blue after they had been essentially suffocated by their pearents when they were crying. Virginia Courage told me that about two thousand and fourteen, she was in a meeting.
This was a married couple's meeting, and during that meeting, Hopeful Christian and another person who she says was some sort of medical authority within Gloria Vale, even though he had no medical training whatsoever, spoke about this technique and said not to worry about asphyxiation and that the child who would go quiet would still be able to breathe because they would just then relax. But it was about teaching them discipline, and so her comments was that she
saw children turning blue in her time. She also said to me that she had to on one occasion, and this was in two thousand and six. Between the two thousand and six and two thousand and eight, she was brought a baby who was limp and in the arms of her father, and she was asked to resuscitate the baby, which she did. Of course, Virginia, as a woman in Gloria Vale, did not make a fuss about this, did not say to the father, what are you doing, because women and saying something like that too a man in
Gloriavale is frowned upon. She told me she was horrified and terrified by the practice and the fact that it was being taught and she said to her husband, they would never do that to their children. But she recalls growing up in Gloria Vale, she saw it happen regularly to other children and she saw children kids plural go blue when this occurred.
An outsider might look in and say, well, these children are being exploited.
They talk nonsense, They talk nonsense. These children are growing up learning now to take responsibility. They're not going to go on the doll We will find work for people, and if they can't work for some reason, we will look after them. I believe that God's given me a job to do and that's why we start the community and whatever that meant to do that or done it.
So what else have the documents revealed? What does the Children's minister know about this?
So I've spoken to Karen Chaw. She was quite reluctant to go into specifics about this investigation. But what we do know from police or maybe I'll just mentioned the police action first on this, because that's quite important here. The police have carried out this investigation that's now complete and they have issued two formal warnings to to residents at Gloria Vale and they are also doing what they're calling techniques. They're giving parents techniques on how to deal
with various childhood behaviors and scenarios. So that's the official action that police and udong A Tamadiki have taken. Two formal warnings and then education and advice. Now the minister says that's a good positive step because her team, who she says she has recently increased resources for in Graymouth, are going in there regularly and are advising parents about what you should and shouldn't do when you have a child or baby. So she says that's a good start,
you know, will it Lee? I said to her, well, you know, will this actually result in change? And she said, well, look, it may not change the entire world, but it's a start,
is what she said. I also asked her, in light of these this evidence and these investigations and what the Royal Commission has already found, should Gloria Vale still be functioning in twenty twenty And she said to me that she would not offer her personal opinion on the state of Gloriavale, but that under her watch, her job was to ensure that children were safe and that's what she would do and she said that if police or audoing A Tamadeki learned that children were being harmed in Gloria Vale,
it's her expectation that they would be removed from that community. And she's quite adamant that her team in there regularly doing the best job that they can. They've been properly resourced to do that job, and she's keeping a very close eye on this situation. What does regular mean, I think regular means weekly, So audong A Tamadiki are going in there weekly to check on things that are happening there.
Just in terms of a little bit of a background as well to this mass allegation investigation to give you a bit of a stare on just how significant this was. Ordering a Tamadiki between October twenty twenty four and August this year received so that's eleven months, they received eighty one reports of concern from within the glory of our community. So this really gives you, Chelsea, a pretty strong indication
of just how problematic things have been. So these reports of concern, the eighty one sixty of those reports have concerned related to this mass allegation investigation, which of course, was this practice or technique or method of covering up a child or babies airways when they are upset or crying. So that is the result of the investigation so far, these formal warnings from police and the education and advice being offered.
Who else have you spoken to about this?
Spoken to lawyer Brian Henry. You may remember Brian Henry's name.
He is, Yeah, he's been in court before.
Run yep, yep. He has. In fact, he led to landmark cases which were successful in the Employment Court which determined that his clients, former Gloriavale residents were in fact employees at Gloria Vale, not volunteers. During that those court cases he effectively we didn't effectively, he did state that essentially Gloria Vale was operating off the back of slave labor and child labor in some instances. So that is what the Employment Court heard and they agreed with him.
And there has been various reparations that Gloriavale has had to pay out as a result of that. So Brian Henry has essentially been spearheading action against Gloria Vale. He was scathing of the action taken by police and of the comments of the Children's Minister Karen Chaw in this instance. In his words, he says, this practice of handover mouth amounts to suffocating a child and it is, in his words, a very very serious crime. In his words, it's also
very very violent. And he's highly critical of the minister, telling me that how can she sit back in Wellington and say that she's reassured that everything is okay in Gloria Vail when we know that it's still operating, and when we know that this sort of thing has been
going on. He also points out that doing things like issuing warnings or offering education and advice to leaders at Gloria Vail, in his mind, will not lead to change because don't forget, Gloria Vail is community whereby they all listen to the shepherds, and the overseeing shepherd they call the shots. It's not police or auditing a tamadiki who
they necessarily listen to. That's what he says. That's what Brian Henry says anyway, So he is deeply skeptical about whether these formal warnings and education are being dished out by police and ordering a tamadeki is going to lead to lasting change because of the extent of control and manipulation that has been visited on the people of Gloriaval for many, many decades.
It sounds like he would rather Gloriaval ended.
Well, I mean exactly, and he's said that to me, you know, during our interview that how can the Minister say that we're doing all we can to ensure these children are safe when Gloria Vale is still operating. That's the fundamental problem here is that Gloria Vale is still in the existence in twenty twenty five. He says, this government and consecutive governments have failed to do anything about Gloria.
Vale for decades.
For fifty years, Chelsea, Yeah, this is how long it's been going on for. And we know leaders like Hopeful Christian was a convicted sex offender. We know there's been multiple cases brook before the courts where sexual assault on young people has been proven and police have been involved in that. So he is deeply skeptical of the minister's reassurances and invites her to go and talk to some of the leaders of Gloria Vale to understand the gravity and the seriousness of the current situation.
And so what would you say to them and Glory about it.
Genuinely skiered and don't know what's out there in the outside world.
I would say to them that the world is so bigger than so much bigger than Glorovale, and like it's okay to ask questions, and life is more than just survivant, like God put us on this earth to have imaginations and to have hobbies and to live and enjoy it, not just survive. And life can be fun. It doesn't just have to be work work, work, and you can ask questions, you can be you, and being you's okay.
Has Gloria Vail responded to any of this, Yes.
So they have come back to me, and in an email attributed to a community spokesperson, they tell me that the members of Gloria Vail uphold the national expectations of safety for children in New Zealand. They also point out that since twenty sixteen there have been education programs within Gloria Vail on safe parenting and child safety awareness, and that since twenty sixteen these education processes have quote progressively
been embedded. They also talk about the mass allegation investigation in the community spokesperson told me that there was a significant percentage of internal reporting that had taken place by parents self reporting, which is how Adongo Tamadiki may have become aware of this issue. They say that there were two formal warnings issued by police. One was the result of a parent self reporting and the other allegation was denied.
The spokesburses says neither allegation involved a member while in a professional role and that neither allegation led to further action. But just to confirm, they have said that it was in twenty twenty four that police and OT held a meeting with parents and leaders and were quote very clearly told of the emotional and physical dangers of restricting the
airway in young people. Essentially, what Gloria Vale is telling me is that they have taken on board this meeting when police turned up and OT turned up and said, hey, look you can't restrict a child's airways. They've taken that on board and they have been implementing these changes over many years now. Of course, when you get a statement like this as a journalist and it says that education programs have been progressively embedded, I then went back to
Gloriavale and said, well, what does that mean? Does that mean that this is still possibly happening, And the response I got was, to my knowledge, no parents are practic this. So I guess that's the reassurance from Gloria Vale is that this is not happening anymore. It was hardly what I would say a compelling green light that all is well. But I think what is important here, Chelsea, is that it was the Royal Commission who unearthed this information about
children having their airways restricted. Was it the leaders at Gloria Vale who volunteered and said, hey, guys, we just realized we've been doing this and it might not be the best way to treat kids. Was it Gloria of our leaders who who offered up this information to police or authorities?
No, it was not.
It was leavers. It was former residents who told police in OT and the Commission about what happened. And it is on that basis that police and OT have begun this investigation.
How confident are you that this practice has ended?
Well, look, I'm not in Gloria Vale. I haven't been down there for some time. I have spoken to people at Gloria Vale because I would like to go down and catch up with the new overseeing shepherd who's been put in charge of the place. But I don't know is the answer. You know, it depends on who you asked.
You know, I suspect that some would believe it. Of course, is still going on because as I've said, these sorts of practices and techniques, just like you have to dress like this, and just like we have this structure of men in charge and women are not. You listen to the leadership. The leadership are in total control and you have to abide by what they say. And this form of discipline for children while brought in recommended and endorsed
by Hopeful Christian, the founder of Gloria Vale. But look, we have to also listen to what the minister is saying here, listen to what police and ot have done. This is not a small investigation. This is a huge, months long investigation. More than one hundred interviews have taken place, and they say that they have they're now and there making sure parents are aware of parenting techniques and how
to treat their children. And of course we have Gloria Vale saying that you know, they have been implementing these child safety programs since about twenty sixteen, and they have also told me that to their knowledge, no parents are practicing this anymore, so look, it depends on who you ask. We've been told that it's not happening anymore, so I think, you know, we have to I don't have any evidence that it is still going on at Gloriavale at the.
Thanks for joining us, Michael Pleasure.
That's it for this episode of the Front Page. You can read more about today's stories and extensive news coverage at enzidherld dot co dot nz. The Front Page is produced by Jane Ye and Richard Martin, who is also our editor.
I'm Chelsea Daniels.
Subscribe to the Front Page on iHeartRadio or wherever you get your podcasts, and tune in tomorrow for another look behind the headlines.