Superintendent Series: Jordan Caplan on Belvedere and Michigan Golf

Welcome back to another edition of the Fried Egg Podcasts and our Superintendent series, which is brought to you by our friends over at Toro. Among the countless reasons why we go to the course, communing with Mother Nature, sits near the top of most lists, and the company most trusted to responsibly maintain our golf environments, Toro continues to

I miss the green, for example, I'm already upset. When I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. And when I find my ball in a fried Egg Friday.

Egg the dread and Frida Egg Friday fridagg Brian egg.

Lie, I'm about ready to run off of the course.

Yeah, but when you were in you were in Philly. You're at the Cricket Club when this job came up, Like when you came out to interview where you just had you been here before? You know what what was?

Uh? Yeah, So.

You know I grew up in Michigan, so definitely coming up uh up north. I was familiar with Charlavoy. My my wife and I actually were married in in Charlavoya. There's a cool little castle. It's called Castle Farms. So you know, I wanted to get married in a castle. My wife wanted to get married at a farm. So it worked out perfectly. Did you google Castle Farm? You know, we just we just wanted something more of a of a destination and it was, uh, it was a beautiful spot.

What yeah, what talk about quite a transition going from Philadelphia in an agronomy job in Philadelphia to northern Michigan. What's that? What's that been?

Like?

It's you know, Northern Michigan's a it's a great place to grow grass. You can afford a mistake or two. Philly East Coast is just just ruthless. It's it's so hot and humid, a thousand things can go wrong, uh during the summer, you know, on the on the flip side, Well, while the summer up here might be a little better,

Yeah, you like walk outside of lather like, yeah, you just walk outside and it's you know, here here we go.

So yeah, I love it, you know, definitely loved working working in Philly, you know, despite despite the uh, the summers and and the grind.

But yeah, it's it's just great.

Up here that had to be a big transition besides just the the pace of life from Philadelphia to northern Michigan. But like the the club, like a giant club, like the Cricket Club, three courses, you know, with probably almost a thousand members, maybe more than a thousand.

Yeah, No, you're you're you're correcting that. Yeah, the the Cricket Club was just a big, a big machine golf, but was also fortunate enough to be at the Philadelphia campus, the Saint Martin's campus where that that kind of was your country club feel where there was the pool, there was tennis. Uh, we had grass tennis courts there and then the the nine hole Saint Martin's golf course.

Did you maintain the tennis course too.

Yeah, yeah, which is you know that was that was really cool. It was something different. You know, I'm still I'm still kind of geeked out by by grass tennis and uh, you know, there's a there's a number of facilities in in in the States that you know, I still follow.

And was there basically one crossover between golf and tennis maintenance or did you do different things for tennis or were there things that are standard practice and tennis that you could bring to golf.

I would say, if you can.

If you can manage turf, you could you could manage a grass tennis court. The only difference being some of the intricacies with the line painting, but but a lot of moving parts. I mean, to mow, to mow an approach on a golf course, you just start going, you know, to mow a tennis court, you got to move tennis nets.

You've got to.

You know, then paint the lines after. Uh, there's divide or nettings between between the courts. So that the grass part pretty much if you can do it on a golf course, you can do it on a tennis court. It's it's just there's some additional moving parts and and you know, additional running and twisting and uh traffic that that that surface would would experience.

So in terms of difficulty of maintenance, is baseball field the easiest? Tennis court? Second? Golf course?

Third?

How how would you what's the hierarchy?

You know, I don't.

I think each each presents its challenges and we need and.

We can't have their off top.

Yeah, you know the thing about the thing about a baseball field or or even you know, the little uh, you know, not little, but it was four acres of of manicure. I'd say that the difference between a golf courses you're spread out and you've got you know, numerous different areas of the course. On a baseball field, you just you could stand on home plate and see, you know, see the whole thing. So uh, you know, I think that the vastness of the golf course is what makes

Yeah yeah.

And then you know, so the kicker is in in Philly, it's hot. These courts were predominantly poa and you know, definitely need water.

So you know, the kicker is you on a golf course if.

You needed a cut in between a group and you know, spray down the green, you can, I mean you could still pot on that. You can't really have a wet surface for for tennis players. So uh, you know, another facet of that was just having a good rotation, you know, tating the tennis players knowing, okay, I need a water here, they'll play on this court. That that was watered in the morning and.

Is dry now.

So top dress a tennis court.

We we didn't, you know, but you know certainly when we when we a rated, we we dragged the.

Corps around you A.

Yeah, yeah, is that like just like do tennis players react the same way.

As golfers the cricket Club, it was. It was nice at the Cricket Club because the tennis courts were used, you know, between Memorial Day and Labor Day in the shoulder season, everything nets was stripped off off the area and it was used for to actually play cricket.

Uh.

Still, so we we focused our aerration in the in the shoulder season of tennis. But but yeah, you you couldn't. You wouldn't want.

To play tennis on a grass court right after it was aerrated.

Did were tennis players pick here about their playing surface or golfers?

I think it's uh, you know, I'll put it this way. No, no tennis at at the Belvidere golf course. And I'm I'm fine with that.

I guess like tennis players can't complain about whole location.

So that's that's true.

Yeah, yeah, And the net's where it is every day, so you can't complain about the net.

The net location.

So I getting to Belvidere there, this place is a very historic place. There are not been many golf pros. There haven't been many superintendents. What's it like, you know, taking over for somebody that's been here for you know, decades.

Yeah, I mean, you know, the cool part is since the club was was built in nineteen twenty five, I'm the fourth superintendent in it's in its history and my my predecessor, Rick Rick Runch was here for thirty years, you know, and and and did did numerous things from he started to take the course to where.

It is now.

And it's kind of like a passing of the torch and I'm going to put put my spin on it and take it the direction it needs to go for you know, hopefully the next twenty five thirty years as well. So yeah, I mean it always helps, uh, you know, to have new eyes on something. You know, Rick Rick was Rick was a superintendent and a different generation than I am. So you know, I don't know, if you know,

With anything you look at different generations, like you look at like building architecture, which I think like mirrors golf architecture in a lot of ways, Like you see the trends of building architecture today versus you know, what they

Yeah, I mean, ultimately, you know, if you know, wherever you are, you want to maintain the course, uh to the membership's expectations, and you know it's it's it was a great golf course when I showed up on on day one. You know, if you did nothing, it would it would be great. We're we're ultimately just trying to refine, refine some details, you know, to to ultimately the keep keep it in that William Watson UH vision and and

It was so firm.

It just played perfectly into what Hickory golf is all about. And and get in some cool bounces and you know, if you're lucky, it bounced towards the cup. If if you're not, it bounced bounced the other way. So yeah, just trying to refine some details out out on the course. But you know, like like I said, if if we didn't do anything, this is a great, great property and you know, the greens out here, the green surrounds just just you know.

Blow people away.

Yeah, I've imagine having Hickory like a Hickory golf culture like this place has, like your pro Marty very into Hickory golf like and I think you imagine that helps because when people come out and play Hickory's and it's firm, it's such a different experience than when you play Hickory's and it's soft because the ball just doesn't you know, react and move the way it needs to with Hickory equipment if it's soft.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely, And you know, it's just it's just really cool that you know, members you know and invest the time in the in their equipment. I mean, you might find a golf club and you don't if it's an original club, you don't know who used it before you you know, they definitely you know, where the outfits and and and dress the part, and it just it fits in great for the culture here that you know, belvidere, play, belvitere,

Yeah, that's one of my favorite things about the place is, like, you know, you go in like the golf house or I don't know what they call it, the pro shop, probably pro shop.

Yeah, I don't know.

It's like you go into there and it's like they just there's such an embrace with the history of the place. And I think obviously I played here maybe a decade and a half ago, and you know, it wasn't backed. And obviously they did the restoration with Bruce Happner where they got a lot of the green surrounds back, but like you know, getting that playing surface where it is browned out where like you know, you look at old ariols and golf courses weren't heavily watered and everything like

Yeah, yeah, And I would I would also describe uh, Marty's Little Pro Shop as a you know, museum of sorts. He's got he's got pictures of all the great golfers who have who have played here. Uh, Sarah's in and you know, could could go on and on. Uh He's always got you know, this kind of old school jazz music playing in there. So I mean really that that's the experience at Elevet Here. You know, forget, forget everything else going on in the outside world, come come play

Have as has survived to this day.

Yeah, I mean, it's it's such a neat property because obviously you have the you have the ridge that the clubhouse sits on, and you know some of the you know, the road runs through, dividing the front and the back nine for those that haven't been to Velvet Yere, and you've got a ridge that this road sits on the ninth hole, the first tee and then the tenth tee and the eighteenth hole sits on that's like the prominent ridge.

Yeah, huge, huge ridge, you know.

To finish, you finish the front nine on it, you finish eighteen on it, and then you're kind of winding your way through these ups and downs, you know. I Uh, one of my favorite things to do, uh in Charlavoy is just drive around on some of these country back roads. Oh my god, and I just go, oh, golf course there. You can put a golf course there, and it's just you gotta wonder what, you know, what if they decided to go a mile down the road, would it have

It's a so Wasson lived in the winters in San Francisco and he came here every summer.

Yeah. So he he came here for you know, twenty twenty five years after after he built it, and you know, was was the golf pro here, you know, so that that gave him all that time too to kind of see his product and protect it from being from being tweaked.

I wonder how much like fine tuning he did over the years, like how many little tweaks And he probably never like you know, he had he kept decent notes, like you have some hole by hole things from him, But like you know, I wonder because like Ross, you always hear about Ross lived on you know, Pinehurst on like the third hole there, right, and then he lived at Essex County, I believe, up in Boston for a period of time. And you see the holes by his

Got yeah you know you got a one er two. I mean, how willing were those guys, you know to admit, oh yeah, I did make a mistake there. I mean they were probably pretty attached to their work. And you know, take take the Cricket Club for example, the Tiling House course. I believe there were some alterations by someone other than tilling Hass not too long after they did it. You know, Tilly probably wouldn't have you know, condoned any of that.

That's an interesting thing with today, Like an architect builds a golf course and sometimes like they don't even play the golf course for years like versus then like a lot of times an architect might work at the club or live at the club, or you know, build the golf course and was a member, you know, prominent member like Stevie McDonald obviously had houses at every golf course he built, like you know these you think about how

Yeah, yeah, so you know, a labor of love for mister William Watson for sure.

Yeah.

I mean the one thing, obviously, I think, like the one glaring thing the golf course is the bunker style, Like that's the one thing that is a little bit missing from like just pure throwback as you come out. And the bunkers were renovated in the nineties and obviously they probably were like a you know, needed renovation of some sort, needed work. But now you have not really a intricately shaped they're kind of a you know, imagine if I built a bunker might look like that, you know.

Yeah, yeah, So.

We have old aerols and the nineteen thirty six, but then some stuff in the fifties.

So even in the fifties, the.

Bunkers, you know, mimic the you know what we saw in the nineteen thirty six areas, So a Watson bunker you know around the sixties, uh, definitely kind of you know, joined joined some bunkers together, made them a little rounder. I think a lot of that goes into play too with Hey, those were easy to maintain.

Well, this is the whole architecture thing too, is like that just became like you look at building architecture, like subdivisions came in vogue in the fifties and sixties and like the cookie cutter like you know, right, right, So that's that's culture perfectly how I would describe the the bunkers now, you know, kind of a cookie cutter look to it. You know, that's what happened to every golf

The greens absolutely. And you know, so so we we you know, we know what what needs to be done. You know, obviously there's there's a lot of stuff that goes into a into a bunker restoration. There's money, there's a lot of things with with sand and and bunker liners.

Greens out here, you know. So so we'll keep on it.

We'll be I think that's a cool way to do it too, is like you get the short game area. It gives like members a chance to see you know, like I think it's really hard for a lot of times people to envision what something might look like unless somebody does like a very intricate photoshop rendering.

Right.

But like you know, for somebody to be able to go out play in it and like hit shots out of it and also look at it, it just does wonders for the you know, them being able to see, oh, we're going to do bunkers like this out on the golf course, right.

And I truly believe you know, shapers like Bruce and others, while they can put something on a plan, I think they do their best work when they just roll up to the bunker and and and I don't want to I don't want to describe it as winging it. They certainly know what they're doing, but you know, let the let the juices flow out in the field and and then be really hard to to kind of unless you're an excellent artist to to draw what that bunker looks like.

You. So, I I think we're on the right track.

I mean, we're gonna have a bunker that you can get your get your feet in and play around, and we'll try some different bunker sands and you know, go from there. But yeah, it was just really cool to watch him, watch him go. He actually he dug the bunkers out and then he shaped a couple of green pads and he actually said, I've never I've never built a green.

With a mini excavator before. This is this is kind of cool.

I'm not saying he would switch to just doing it that way in the future, but yeah, he was definitely kind of in the zone and and making it happen.

One of my favorite things was you're you're very like I'm a big self deprecator of myself, and I love that we pulled up to your your chip here. So this is this I built this bucker is terrible. Yeah, I mean just uh, just being honest. But you know, the difference between you know, the professionals and myself is, yeah,

Right right?

Yeah, i mean tree tree work for example. You know, we we do a lot of that in house, you know, but but we know too want to wave the white flag and hey, this is a little it's a little crazy.

Let's bring in the professionals.

How big is it that a tree? It's not necessarily the size. It's kind of like what's going on up top? What's you know, where it's uh.

Where it's leaning.

You know, I'm I'm scared to death of willow trees. That's got to be done by a professional from from the top down.

So that's that like when there's more going on up top, that's when you have to start up top. You can't just cut.

It and yeah, yeah, yep, yep.

So yeah, it's it's it's awesome to be able to to do things yourself out here and and be self you know, self sufficient. You know you also you got to know when to call him in. You know at the Cricket Club, we uh we laid like a mile of brick paths walk pass around the around the club and we did it all ourselves in house. You know, the savings on that to have a contractor do it.

Just just everybody can relate to that. That's ever done like a house project. And they turned out, you know, they turned out great. Now for a quick word from our sponsor, Toro. For more than a century with cutting edge turf equipment and irrigation solutions, Toro has had your front nine covered and your back nine two. In fact, Toro's always had your back period. Toro is committed to your long term success as tour pros are committed to

Yeah, I mean one hundred percent. You know, skiing, snowboarding. There's a cool little little just slope in town with toe ropes for kids to use. The boying resorts which aren't too far away. I mean that's probably classified as the best skiing up in you know, this part of the in the Midwest, in the Midwest.

Which is like below average. Yeah, yeah, before any ski snobs.

So there's I mean, it's it's what you make of it, you know. I guess my biggest thing is it can snow as much as it wants up here. Snow living in you know, in inner city like Chicago or Philadelphia is just miserable.

So just after like two days, it turns stuff brown.

Yeah.

Ice.

Yeah, So I'll take the snow as long as you're in the right in the right setting and and you have some good, good outlets to you know, enjoy it.

What do you what do you what are you doing in the winter? Like, what's that look like? You said, that's that when you have to be really careful with ice and such and damage on the greens. How do you monitor that? Like, what's a recipe for something that you really need to be worried about?

Yeah, I mean the best is you know, when you just have kind of a light, fluffy snow on there, even if it's a foot deep, you know that snow's got you know, poor spaces in it. And and I'll get the the nightmare scenario is if you get a melt down and then you get an ice layer that forms, you don't want your grass to.

Be uh essentially creates like an impermeable surface. Yeah, the grass can't breathe.

Yeah, the snow, the snow itself is nice, you know, protection from from wind and and and everything else. In fact, you know this this spring, our snow melted pretty early and uh it got it got pretty hot and uh you know for that time of year and windy and and things were drying out before the irrigation system was turned on. So you know, to to have had that snow cover for an extra two weeks would actually been you know favorable, uh, to to just protect the protect

I know, which harder is it.

To walk with snow shoes?

It's I think it beats it beats going in.

Is it like one point five times walking or you know, like.

I think it?

Uh, if anything, it's a good it's a good workout. It beats you know, sinking down a well.

Obviously it's better. You know, they exist for a reason. But like, you know, are we talking like what's the strain level versus walking on just grass? You feel the burn? Yeah, feel the burn? Yeah, yeah, you might be in better shape in the winter.

And yeah that's a good that's a good point. You know.

You you almost need to get yourself in pre winter, pre winter shape for that.

You gotta start walking snow shoes on the grass.

Yeah.

Now, if I if I wanted to get fancy, maybe someday I'll buy myself a snowmobile and drive that around. But I also don't want I wouldn't want anybody driving by to see me on that because you know, they might think, oh, it's the new new.

Snowmobile park at the Belvitere So.

And then you wouldn't get all the exercise right right right, So so with the you know, with the I wonder if global warming obviously, like everywhere it's getting hotter, So like do you think like that early spring might become more and more of a thing?

Yeah, I mean it.

It's have you talked to Rick at all about like how it changed over his career. I think the bottom line is living on Lake Michigan is you never know what you're gonna get with with the amount of snowfall. And it's for me, it's just really hard to keep track of what is normal now, you know, even even in Philly.

Uh to say, hey this.

This is the hottest year ever and you're like, well last year was pretty hot or so It's it's tough. The big issue around here is, uh, when when the lake levels start to rise, and you know, there's a lot of beautiful homes on Lake Charlavoie and Lake Michigan and and maybe not quite equipped to handle it, you know, rise in water level, you know, so so the lakes

I always think snow on a golf course like kind of accentuates sometimes contour like and then obviously the trees don't have any leaves, do you Are there things that you've noticed in the winter, like any examples of stuff that you've noticed on the golf course in the winter that you wouldn't have seen if you weren't walking around.

And yeah, I mean that that I love looking at that. You know, snow cover the other really nice way to see uh, contours on the golf course. It's it's hard to video, but if you if you drive around the course at night with your lif on you you see the funkiest stuff going on that you would never see in daylight. So so with the snow you can also kind of Okay, so there's a big snow bank over here, that means that area the golf course gets gets wind swept.

That means it gets probably a lot of sun right right right, and.

You know the the when you're coming out of snow melt. I mean, I'd still consider that winter time, that winter sun is just as important too to the grass as you know, sunlight would be during the growing season. You know, so even even though a tree might not have its leaves on it, it very well could be you know, hindering some of that that winter sunshine and that you know, ultimately you need to get the get the place green and growing again.

Come come the season.

We had a uh, I've been a little spoiled. I mean we've had to two pretty good starts of the season in my in my two years here. That that that I will take.

What you took over for long time superintendent, retain the staff like was there, you know, what were the things that you know, obviously you wanted to impart your your practices, but you have a staff that's been used to, you know, doing things one way. How is the process of kind of of of working and things that you wanted to do. I imagine you can't just be a heavy handed approach like.

Yeah, I mean I have to I have to commend them because I mean it probably was a little scary. Hey, I've I've worked here for.

Rick for for X.

Number of years, a new guy coming in. I mean, and in some situations that probably is what happens. New guy comes in and just clean cleans house. They they were all very uh, you know, willing and and helpful and in my transition. And and I think they're kind of seeing the method to the madness. You know, if if if they're noticing the courses looking good and and they're getting some high fives when they're out there, you know,

You know, obviously Philly people versus Upper Midwest people. It's you know, coming back, leaving and coming back. You know what what are the different is it? Just working with people in the midwect. I don't want to get you in trouble with anybody in Philadelphia. I think all the Philadelphians are pretty aware of their you know, of their personas is there is it, you know, managing people in the two different places, Is it distinctly different?

Yeah, I mean as as far as you know, we're working side by side, hard working folks who work on the golf course. I mean, that's that's the same, you know. And then membership too, it's got I think I just feel like people are a little more relaxed up here. You just come, you come, and you throw it all away. It's a vacation club too, versus an everyday CLUBB true, true, So I think there's just a little more you know,

Members choose to spend summers up in Charlavoie.

You know, obviously Belvidere is a well known vacation club, right because and it's well known because it's public. But then there's all these other ones up here that are just like kind of like these little places that have some neat stuff going on, and what's the dynamic with like the superintendent's up here, did everybody everybody kind of do you guys get together every once in a while or how does that work because you're all at these little lake town clubs.

Yeah.

So so one thing about so Belvidere, I think this is a misconception, but Belvidere is a private golf club that that allows you know, outside play. I think the term semi private's kind of kind of weird. But but as far as the area, there's there's so many great golf courses. There's the golf course. Uh, Superintendent Association Michigan is is top notch. It's all, uh, it's all under

I feel like Central Michigan superintendent in southeast probably you know, have just you know, some anngst about you guys and your growing conditions. Yeah, gosh, I like to poke fund or something.

I've talked to.

You know, this year in particular, I've talked to some folks in the Detroit area and they've had a lot of a lot of rain. So I mean I feel for them, uh for sure. But yeah, it's it's a good it's a good community.

You know.

Obviously up north we're a little a little farther away from everybody else, so maybe we are a little a little tighter of a group. But you know, you can't if I mean talk about a golf trip. You know, if if you wanted to spend some time in northern Michigan, you you couldn't go wrong.

I mean I would.

I would hit up Arcadia Bluffs, you know, spend some time at Forest Dunes. You know, certainly stop by and see us at at Belvetere. But you know, if you also just get off the beaten path, I mean, you're bound to discover kind of a sleeper.

That's the thing. There's so many courses up here. Just stop, Like this is why I find myself. I just get off the road and go look. Even if you just go pull into the parking lot and get out and walk a couple of hundred yards, you'd probably see something cool because, like you said about driving around, like the land's just so good that like it's almost hard to

It's I mean, it's it's it's right up there with any other you know, popular golf destination trip. Now granted you can't do it in the winter, so yeah, go to go to Pinehurst then, but yeah, it's uh, it's it's awesome.

You know.

Our courses. Uh that there are some sandy spots. You know, some of it was cut through an old seed or swamp. So that's a little more of a you know, mucky kind of soil. But it's not it's not really it's not a heavy clay soil.

So yeah, I mean.

It's it's uh, you almost you could have a golf course every every square mile up here.

You know what you did a little bit of a green expansion on the back of eight. How did you go about that that? Like what process did you do to expand the green in the back of.

The Yeah, so there was a maple tree that grew behind eight, you know through some old pictures. I mean, you know, maybe it was considered the iconic tree, but in reality, that tree wasn't there when when William Watson built that green. He built that green to kind of be uh you know infinity green that sits up on the horizon, right up.

On that prominent ridge. We talked about early early, and so.

Once once the tree, once we removed the tree, where we we basically just took the old approach and started moaning, moan it lower. And we've got some uh, you know, top dressing to catch it up on and so you mowed it like scalped it. Yeah, yeah, pretty much scalped it. But it wasn't too it wasn't too dramatic.

And then what do you do? Then you will, we'll, we'll.

We'll definitely you know, included in our zeration top dressing. Get some get some seed in there.

I mean.

Another another thing is anytime there's a void, just just put a plug in it, you know. So we're we're getting it to where it will be, you know, look uniform with the rest of the green. It will obviously grow better because it doesn't have the the canopy of the tree above it. And there's some pinnable spots back there that that we'll be excited to use, you know. We uh twenty twenty five will be our one hundred year anniversary and we'll be hosting the Michigan Amateur again.

They this course was the every year host for long.

This course.

Yeah, it was known as the home of of the Michigan Amateur. I think forty forty times. It will be forty forty one and twenty five. We wanted to uh do it then to coincide with our our anniversary.

So you're just gearing up for that.

Yeah.

Yeah, and it's you know, it's it's coming up and you know, to see kind of what we've accomplished in just a short amount of time. We're gonna be we're gonna be looking awesome for that, and uh, you know, can't wait. It's uh, it's not the longest courset. You know, those guys probably play, but again, I think the greens will keep them honest. If it's windy, you know, good luck guys.

And I, you know, having played a few state ams like I would hate to have to play the sixteenth hole and in a very high pressure situent, a wedge into that green. Yep, it's just terrifying, could make or break you. Yeah, and if you bail, it's just the ultimate delayed penalty. Depending on where the pin is, like you might be laying up to just hope to get out of with five from just off the green. Yeah, it is.

Well.

The good news is I will gladly let the Golf Association of Michigan select the pin locations for for events like that, although I will say you would you would be qualified yourself to to do that as well. When you were out changing changing cups with me this morning.

Oh no, yes, well I think that's like the most fun thing to do is that pens.

I love you. That's like what you have all that power in your hand every every morning.

You know. The reason we have all of our events is just so I get to set up set up a golf course. I think that's like one of the most fun things to do is And I always wish like in I don't know, you know, I don't know any membership or any course that's ready for this, but I always want to have back tea's in front of middle tea's, maybe front tee behind a middle tea. You know, change it up. Have people played different places. I think, for like a your back tea, moving sixteen up to

Drive the hole right right. Yeah.

I mean I know you've you've made this point before, but you know, switch it up. Don't play the same golf course every day. One thing my daughters are five and three. My five year old just got her first set of golf clubs. But as she gets better, I mean, in my mind, I'm just gonna play the you know, the forward teas that she plays with, you know, with hickory clubs or something. You could take the driver out of your bag.

Or well that's like, if you're a good player, one of the best activities.

Well I'm not saying I'm a good player.

I know, but like any player, this is one of the best activities you can do. Like, if you're trying to break eighty, if you're trying to break ninety, go play the forward tees and you like probably will get to feel the pressure of like, and it's the same thing for like a good player who's trying to shoot more and more under par. Is like the best thing you can do is put yourself into a position where you get under par quickly and have to keep going

Into the feeling like oh.

I'm gonna break, like your expectation changes, and that's a good.

Thing to me. It's it's still golf. You know, it's all golf.

It's it's fun. How have you gone about getting your daughter into the game. Has she been really interested? Because that's what you do. Like, I'm Matt, I have a one year old and this is something I'm I'm very interested in now is how people get there.

Yeah, I don't.

I don't want to be you know, pushy on them. But you know, she sees that it's something dad does or you know, dad's got it on on TV. You know, I think for her, I hope she loves the sport. But if we spend time on the golf course, it'll be more about you know, us us spending time together.

But yeah, I'm I'm excited. You know.

We we started with the uh with the plastic clubs. Hit those in the backyard and she she just got her own little bag with the with the four clubs in it and she'll just she'll just walk around the backyard with it on.

I mean, I think she loves it. She asked.

She asked me to get my golf bag the other day and walk with her and no, I don't I just need this this sixty degree wedge.

I don't. I don't need to carry my whole bag, but.

Just walking around the back, it might be about all the accessories for you know.

That's that I think that's the hands off approach is probably the best way. Yeah, yep, yeah, I'm excited. We have this one hickory club. A friend of mine got like a it was like a birth gift with her name out, and she just sits and hammers it into the under the ground, Like I don't know what to do with the club, Like is it she hang it up somewhere, But I just give it to her.

She'll if she knows golf is something that you do, she'll she'll she'll do it, you know, just the.

Humor of me. Yeah, yep.

All right, Well, what's what's in the plans for this fall and uh in the winter here?

What?

What are what are your big projects?

Yeah, we're just gonna we've got to wrap up our little short game project.

You gotta get seed down soon, right yeah? Yeah, oh yeah, this is like peak growing time. Yeah, we're we're in it, so for for sure, you know, uh, definitely want to want to see some green before before winter out there and then just uh, you know this this uh, there'll be a gradual drop off of you know, membership leaving and things, things slowing down on the golf course. Marty holds a fun uh he calls it the Blitz tournament at the end of the year, and it's it's crazy

See where it takes us. I'm I'm looking forward to.

Uh, you know, just just a little bit of peace and quiet on the golf course. It's been it's been busy this year. I I love seeing golfers enjoy the place, but you know sometimes I love being out there by myself in the winter too.

So peace and quiet. And I assume you're Alliance football fan.

No, no, it's good for you.

I'm not doing that, No, no thanks.

I decided that I grew up in Michigan, I moved around a lot, so I never truly had a professional team. But I decided when I left Philly, lived there for seven years, that I would stay allegiant to uh to the Philly teams.

Yeah yeah, transplant Philly Philly.

Yeah.

Well, I've got too many people, took too many hats and shirts to uh to go the other way.

Man, that's I didn't see that color. You know, you know, Midwestern turned into a Philly sports fan is quite the.

I would have thought.

Yeah, all right, Jordan, thank Hooper, coming on. I'm excited to see you know the next next dozens of years that you're here and where Belvedere goes.

Thanks so much for having me appreciate it.

Thanks for listening to another edition of the Friday Podcast. Today's episode was edited by Meg Atkins. As a reminder, we have some great stuff in the pro Shop. One of my favorites with fall approaching is our hoodie. We get lots of comments about this hoodie. I would size up if you're in between sizes, if you're kind of medium large, go large. They're a little they run a little small. But a lot of people say this is like the softest hoodie they own, this is the most