Today's podcast is brought to you by B dratty our friends over at B dratty. It's cold well Knights is here. Well, what's your favorite B dratty item you got?
I mean, how can you go wrong with the crew neck sweater. It's the best thing that they've gotten the shop.
The sweatshirt. You like the sweatshirt?
Oh yeah, front pocket. I mean, you're lounging around watching coffee golf in the morning. You got Hawaii coming up, You're gonna be sitting around. You need something comfy, something warm looking out of the snow. It's good for all situations.
Yeah.
People a lot of times look at me.
I'm wearing that sweat They're like that is that kangaroo pouch on a crew neck sweatshirt?
And I'm like, oh yeah. And it's like people get like jealous if you've got a kangaroo pouch and they don't have one.
Well, I mean, especially you got Violet here, she's running around. You could throw her right in there, carry around the golf course.
Who knows, you know, the kangaroo pocket has no limits as to where where I'll go. There's snow on the ground here, so I don't think I've gone be going golf course anytime soon. You can get the crew neck on our website, the Fridagg dot com. We've got a few and some random sizes left, but otherwise you can go get that sweatshirt on bdradty dot com. Welcome back to another edition of the Fridagg Podcast. Today I am joined by Nick Hardy. Nick is a former All American
from the University of Illinois. He was actually up on the podcast a couple of years ago, I think is episode nineteen or thereabouts. He was on with his teammate Dylan Meyer. So Nick is just got through the second stage of Q school. He's obviously a pretty high profile young player who will be playing on the Corn Ferry Tour next year, and a local from the Chicago area. So I've gotten to watch Nick play so many times
grown up from when he was thirteen. It's been pretty cool to see a local kid really develop into one of the best young players UH in the game.
So here's our podcast with Nick Hardy. I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. And when I find my ball in.
A frid Egg Frida egg, the dreaded Frida egg, Friday, Frida Egg, Brian Egg, Frida Egg, Bride egg.
Lie.
I'm about ready to run off the gump. What do you do in your downtime when you're not playing golf?
Oh, man, I mean not much, Honestly. I like to I like to work out, you know, I just like to chill. Quite honestly. I like to chill because I spend spend a lot of time, you know, at golf, and just because I love it. I'm always practicing, I'm always playing. But you know, I like to work out and I like to chill. I like to I love fantasy football. I love the Bears, you know, I mean, I love tough season. I set aside all my Sunday
afternoons to watch football. But besides that, I mean, you know, I'm pretty pretty, you know, blanned.
Besides that, going from college to professional golf where college you have a lot of built in distractions to golf. You know, professional golf golf all the time. What's been the toughest thing about that? Have you had troubles?
Right, No, there's no doubt. I mean my senior year of college, I remember thinking like, okay, I'm going to be making this transition next year, and I'm going to have a lot more downtime than I do right now, you know, just based on having you know, teammates at hand and being able to you know, be competitive them with them. Day to day practice schedule, workout schedule, everything's
planned for you, from class to studying. You know, everything's you have your own planned everything out for you, and you know the next year, I would have to really just make my own plan and be cautious that I'm not trying to overdo it too because knowing me, I'll probably want to overdo working on the game and just being there too much. But it's important to build you know, outside hobbies and have a routine day to day that you're comfortable with. You're making sure you're not kind of
overdoing it. And I think I've found the happy medium. I mean, I kind of really, honestly, it's been It's been nice because I just really have slowed myself down on a day to day basis. College you're kind of running from class to practice, to lunch to you know, you name it. You got something to do, and now I just kind of take my time. I notice that I'm moving a lot slower day to day, which is better for me. I notice I drive slower, I eat slower. I you know, I do everything a lot slower than
I did in college. And I think that's a great That's honestly a much better way to live. But uh, I think that's really what I've noticed.
Did it take time to figure out that you need to slow down?
No, I guess it just sort of happened, you know, it just kind of it just kind of just went to float that way because I just had more time and I was able to fill gaps by just getting breakfast slowly every morning, or taking more time practicing over you know, still being you know, effective with practice, but having more time to do what I feel like I need to do.
You go down to Scottsdale in the winter, do you do you stay with other guys playing or roommates or do you.
Yeah, I stay with family friends. Actually, my caddie, Eric Marcus, his parents live live out there and they have a house in the DC Ranch Community. So I stayed with them last winter, and I plan on doing so a little bit this winter too. But I also have my grandpa in Tucson, who I stayed with for a couple of times. And then my my buddy's Charlie Dalllson's out there, so I will stay with him a couple of times too.
But yeah, having family friends out there for now is great for me because it's you know, I like to be in Chicago and when it's nice and so it's doesn't really make sense. I'm on the road in the winter time when I want to be in Scots, so it doesn't really make sense for me to have my own place yet out there.
Hopefully you're on the road all the time.
Yes, hopefully I'm on the road all the time.
But you want to be and that's true.
That's true.
The uh so you talked to when we talked last time when you were still in school you were a junior then and Illinois. You talked about how you work really well with structure. How have you gone about building structure now that you get to decide your structure?
Right, It's nice, you know when you're When I was in college, especially having coach Small develop our own structure in terms of practice, that was really nice, and having you know, six or seven other guys being able to
compete against every single day was really nice. And now now I start to realize how lucky I was to have that just fit out and plan for me, because you know, obviously I trusted Coach Small first and foremost with with my practice, but with structure in my whole life, because he really cared about us and we were doing I knew I was doing the right things, and I believed one hundred percent that I was doing the right things in practice that would make myself successful on the course.
And now that you know I've spent four years at school and learning from coach and learning from my teammates, I kind of know how to practice to get things done and not just be there and just going through the motions. So I try to do things that we did at school in my structure practice and try to complete things in practice and try to feel like I'm getting things done in order to get that confidence, that self belief instead of just kind of being there hitting balls,
going through the motions and whatnot. So having learned from Coach Mall and being structured in practice at school, I've been able to do things on my own, But not having those teammates from day to day is the biggest difference.
Yeah, talk about the teammates. I think one of the interesting things with college golf is that it's this team environment, and I mean your guys's teams at Illinois, great players, I mean Charlie Danielson who we were talking about earlier, Thomas Deetree, Brian Campbell, Dylan Meyer, you know, guys that are playing on PGA Tour, European Tour, having a lot of success. What was it the practice environment?
Like right, yeah, No, coach made the practice environment extremely competitive, Like every single day we were doing something to get our competitive juice is flowing, you know like that, And that's a great thing about our team though. Those guys you named, every single one of them was super super competitive and everyone hated losing in practice as much as they did you know, on the course and in real competition. So that having that every day was such a good environment.
And you know, now it's for me, I have different guys that I do that with, but having those guys at that those types of players at your disposal every day, whether it be on the course or in that indoorpse or outdoor facility, we're doing something to keep keep competitive.
So you've kind of like as you've moved into professional golf. You've got a group of guys now that you have similar competitiveness with when you're doing, when you're practicing, and when you're playing.
Yeah. So at the Merrick Club where I practice, you know, and I've been you know, lucky to practice for eight years now. I practice with Patrick Flavin, a bunch Brian Orr, my old high school teammate. They're both you know, up and coming players who've just turned pro recently, and Patrick's had success this year in Latin America Tour. So I mean, we make each other better. We feed off each other, for sure. There's no doubt that over the years we've
made each other better. And it's not we're not probably doing similar things you know that we're doing at school with Coach Small in terms of practicing competitively, but we're on the golf course just as competitive. We could play for a dollar and it'd be it'd be quiet out there. Sometimes we would not be talking to each other, just really competitive on the golf course. We don't want to lose to each other. So that's what makes you better.
Though, What are your guys favorite games to play on the course.
If we got a foursome, we're always playing Scotch games just too. On two. I'm sure many people were familiar with Scotch games, but we would we would mix up the teams randomly. We always played with Jim billd or two. They have pro Kepper Lakes And it's great playing at Kepper Lakes too, because that course is very hard. It can beat you up, especially the back nine. Uh yeah, and so I mean it playing that course too has made me better. So it's uh, it's quite a treat to be able to play there too.
Last year, you you missed out on on getting through Q School stage two just by what the two shots one? Yeah, two shots two shots. And then you you didn't go to play either Canada or Latin America. You kind of did a lot of Mondays, some smaller events in Arizona. You got some exemptions. What was the decision did you think about doing Latin America or Canada? Is there a reason that you didn't do it?
Yeah, of course I did. I mean it was a very tough decision. And I don't regret anything of what I did the past year, and looking back on it, I mean, the year couldn't have gone better. I failed so many times. I mean I have three part of the last two holes at Q School second stage last year to miss by two. I missed the Cup. I wanted Tory Pines and the sponsor exception I had. I missed the Cup. I wanted Dominican Republic. I lost in a four for three playoff to get in the waste management.
I missed a Cup. I wanted the US Open. I mean, just making the cut is not my standard I set for myself. But in order to have any success that you want to have, you got to play the weekend. And I mean, I couldn't be more thankful for those experiences now. I mean, I've learned so much from those experiences and I'll never forget the feelings I had after those tournaments. But it's just made me better. I know,
I know it for a fact. And not deciding, you know, deciding not to go to Canada or Latin was a hard decision for me because I knew I probably should
be playing events and getting those reps in. I didn't know at the time though, I would have maybe three three exemptions left, and I knew I was I would be a great Monday qualifier and I ended up qualifying for three webs and I had a sponsor exception in one of them, and I knew that that was probably a tough decision, and I knew many people wouldn't agree with me for it, and I didn't care. I mean,
I didn't care what others thought about my decision. I knew that I would I would kind of make my own experiences and I would make my own opportunities as I went. And I ended up having some success. I mean I played in the US Open again, which is another great experience. I won an APT event All Pro Tour. I mean I finished third in another one. I mean I had some small moments of okay, I know, I know I'm on the right track, which gave me good feelings.
But.
Not playing. I probably didn't play in enough tournaments this year, even though I probably still played in eighteen to twenty. At least, you know that decision was really hard, But I don't regret any of it.
Talk about golf, and I guess what you said. I agree with a certain extent with the UH. When you have near missus versus when everything's going good, like what you're learning right from near misses.
You learn way more when you go don't get the things that you kind of desire for I feel like if I had actually made the cut in all those or barely squeaked in and played the weekend and whatever I did, whatever I did, I mean, I wouldn't have learned nearly as much as I did from just just getting cut in the throat for those like five or six heartbreaks. I mean, the standard I said for myself is not just to make the cut. Let me get this clear, but not playing the weekend, will you know,
it's enough to not make you successful at all. So I just feel like, I mean, over and over again, I definitely felt, you know, some sort of heartbreak this year. But I mean it's it's probably why I had success last week at second stage, you know, and why it's why I decided to go back to the same site and try to do it all over again, you know. I mean those experiences I'll always look back to the rest of my career, you know.
Yeah, I don't know. I think with life in general and golf in general, and when you miss, when you get it, it's like a teaching moment because then you get back, and especially with golf, like you're never in the same situation twice ever in golf I think that's probably why it's the coolest game in the world, right because you'll never hit the same shot ever again.
It'll be completely new another time. But but the thing is, the things that you're feeling down this stretch are always the same everything. Like that's a great thing about golf is it's individual. So I mean, you may not have the same physical things over and over again, but your your mind and and your body and what you're feeling will always be the same. And that's that's like the tangible thing that you can always get better at is
how you control yourself out there. And I feel like I am, in some ways am a slow learner and I've always been that way. Every single level I've I've kind of played at. It's taken me a little bit of time to feel like I okay, I'm I'm ready to really go now, you know, And I've i feel like I've always been that way, And that's a great thing about golf is like you just got to keep getting better at learning how to handle yourself in those moments.
What particular aspect do you think has been the toughest for you to to learn, Like in the moment.
Honestly, it's just being able to control myself. Like I am definitely more of a high strung competitive guy. And you know, Coach Small right when I got to school, he always talked about being able to like know what level you play at your best at and everyone's different. Everyone, like say you go a one to tenth scale on like emotion and just anxiety. I'm definitely a higher anxiety person,
Like I am always probably riding at at eight. And you got guys maybe like Brian Campbell, for example, He's probably riding at a two. Like there are guys that are just different in terms of like being able to have to get themselves up for something or get themselves down for something. And if you're if you're always at a five, then then you're always probably lucky to be that way. But for me, I always need to calm myself down and and you know, find the right level for myself, you know.
Yeah, I it's interesting. I think that golf is so unique in this fact that like, if you're playing in the NBA finals, everybody's amped, right, But in golf, you have to play to your like personality, right, and it's you can't try and be somebody you aren't right. You can't look at you can't look at Brian Campbell and be like, well, I just need to be like him, No, because it would would not work for you.
No, No, it wouldn't. And and that's the that's the crazy thing about it is you gotta be, you gotta you gotta know yourself, you gotta know and that's your trial and error, you know, just like anything.
But and that's that's probably where when you have things not go your way, is when you learn more about yourself than when things go You're.
Away for sure, for sure. I mean, when things are going well, anyone can go out there and find the right whatever. Because things are just going well, you're not really like thinking about those things. But when you're driving home from with a seven hour drive thinking about infestering in your mind about how you just misplayed two shots to miss the cup I want or one shot, you know, then that's when you're really learning, Like you got plenty of time to think about things when you fail, you know.
It's those drives. A few years ago, I've I was playing a US mid am a qualifier and I was playing well, and I finished double double and I was in the middle fair way of both the whole and I miss missed qualifying by one or two and I was played in Indianapolis. I'm driving home and it was just it was a four hour drive and I don't remember anything from it because you know, you're just replaying and it's just amazing when you have moment tournament golf.
The drive home from a tournament, it is like the craziest thing in the world because like you've left the world, yeah, essentially.
And it's crazy because I mean, you you're just festering inside, but you're you know, you're kind of driving and you're just kind of in the zone. Your body, your your mind's just like like driving for you. But you're just festering about the things that you know maybe have gone wrong. But on the other side of things, like when things go well, like I've driven home three times making the US Open for six hour drive and that's the best,
you know, best time in my life. One of those drives was with Charlie Danielson and we were the one of like two of the only four to qualify at Springfield out of eighty guys, and we were driving home and that was the best drive of our lives. I mean, like like it's just it can it can be. That's a great thing about golf, though, you know it can be. It's so high and low and I mean it's not like you know, like you said, it's not like football or basketball where you can just make things better by
trying harder. You know, it's just you gotta it's the right temperament.
Yeah, a lot of times if you try try less, things turn exactly.
That's totally with golf and especially with putting. You know, it's like like it's just like you gotta just let things happens. You know. You just gotta control what you can control only you know.
That's it's so true because you get especially if you're playing like a scramble, people are like, oh, you gotta make this, don't and it's like you never make that pot. No, you can't try and make it. No, it's talk about it. Say you say you're over a big putt. You say it's a match play match and you need to make something like your mentality is the same for that pie as any other putt, right.
For sure, I mean, And it just goes back to like relying on your your routine, you know, and totally just only controlling on on. You know what you can control, and then that's not what's in front of you. Realistically, everyone reads the putt, okay, I got the read, and everyone just obsesses with the read. But what I control, can control, is right in front of my eyes, right here, and this is me making a good stroke and hitting
the golf ball as well as I can. And that's that's all I'm worried about when I hit a big putt is just I know, Okay, all I can control is what my eyes are looking at right at, you know, right a dimple on the golf b or whatever I'm looking at, and I can't control whatever else happens in front of me. I can predict what happens in front of me, but I can't control it.
Once you have your read, it's you shut off that right.
Yeah. Yeah, I mean a lot of people just you know, it's it's totally goes back to thinking too far in the future or too far in the past. I mean, it's it's what's what's in front of you. That read is the future. You know, what what is in the now is making the best stroke you can and whatever happens out in front of you is happens.
So you played the your third US Open, you qualify, You made the cut at Chambers Bay, you played at Oakmont, and then you played this year in pebble the first two as an am. Did you feel any different playing in the US Open as a pro.
Yeah, I mean, my feelings that week were so different because I honestly felt like I was like, that was the week where I felt like, Okay, I'm I can compete against these guys, like I really believed it.
And he got off to great starry.
Yeah, I mean I looking back at that week and yeah, I was really frustrated again and missing the cup I won, and it was another just kind of a heartbreaker looking back at that week though, that was huge because it was honestly the first week where I felt like I
could beat every single one of these guys. Like I came in really confident, I was hitting the ball as good as I've ever hit the ball, and I just had two doubles on the first round that killed me, Like, and there were mistakes that I don't normally make either. It was like it was just normally I take my own medicine and play patiently and all that, but I made I made a bad mistake on number nine out
of the fairway bunker. I hit a five iron trying to go for the green when I probably should have just hit a layup in that fairway and just took it. Took a five, but even the layup into the nine fairway is not easy because you got the ocean on your right and just horrible rough on the left. So I took all of everything into account and I went for the green and I hit it in the hazard to the right, just barely in the in the prairie grass in front of the ocean, and ended up hacking
out and making a double. And then I hit a great iron shot into ten that came up short and didn't get up and down. So I was backed even through ten holes after being three under through seven, and I just made another double bogie coming in, and I, you know, I'm looking at I think I was. I shot three over in the first round, I think, or two over, I can't remember, but uh yeah, I shot two over in the first round. And then I come back, you know, and I played in the morning on the
first round, in the afternoon in the second round. Now I'm going to like the last tea time, and I'm finishing almost at dark and it was not easy. Like I played really solid in the second round and I had I was on the cut line with six holes ago, and I missed a short put on number four and I finished on nine, and I had a bunch of opportunities coming in for Birdie the last five holes, and
I didn't get one to go. And I remember, I remember though, like after all the heartbreaks I had prior to that US Open and you know, everything I had three or four before that, I knew I was handing on myself really well. And I came away with that US Open thinking, well, I know I handled myself so well coming down the stretch in this one. It wasn't that I kind of hurt myself or cost myself by
not handling myself the right way. And that was the most frustrating part of it, was I finally handled myself the right way I felt like, and it didn't it just didn't happen my way. And you know, walking away, you know, walking away from that week was just just grueling because I knew I handled myself the right way finally, instead of the ways before where I didn't maybe didn't control myself down the stretch the way I should have, or.
You might have pushed too much when.
Right right, or I tried too harder, or yeah, exactly this time, I knew I hindled myself the right way. It just didn't go my way. I didn't get in for the weekend, and that was so frustrating because I played so well that week and I remember probably could have I probably could have scored. I mean, the way I hit the ball and the way I played it, it could have been a really special first two days. It could I mean, it could have been, and everyone could say that, but I really believe I knew it.
That's what's you know, stunk was deep down. I knew I could be like in the top ten after these first two rounds away I've hit the ball and the way I've played, and I remember, you know, I was just so so motivated right after that, and I got on a plane to Tulsa, Oklahoma to play in an All Pro Tour event, and it's like, Wow, You're going from the US Open to an All Pro Tour event. This is kind of crazy, this is reality, you know. I'm like, this is a professional goal. I haven't done
anything yet. I have not proven myself one bit, I've gone from the US Open to an all pro tour event. It's you know, this is this is reality. And I I actually went into that week and I I shot six under the first round and ten under the second round, and I that was just all semming from what I told you. That was the one I won the week after the US Open. I just I remember that that I was just telling myself the right things after the US Open, like okay, like you can't feel bad for
yourself after that. I was telling myself like I knew I handled myself the right way, and I knew, I know I'm close, and I I remember that that was just all from self talk, and I knew I was really confident even after missing a cut.
That's the thing with Gofflet Your score is not always doesn't always show right.
It doesn't indicate what you're how you're playing sometimes, because that's the frustrating part. And that's what happened to me at the US Open, for sure. It just it just doesn't indicate. Like they always say there's no pictures on the scorecard, but really, in your mind, there's always pictures on the scorecard.
Yeah, Like you could go out and shoot seventy five and be like, god, I played really really good.
Yeah it.
And then you could play the next day and shoot seventy two and be like, I didn't play very good.
Oh exactly. There's no doubt about it. And everyone go around telling everyone how they played after the round or whatever, and there's people who were Everyone's saying the same thing, usually like oh, I played so good, but I just couldn't get the putts to drop. And it's the same story for a lot of people, but yet no one cares. You just got to go out and get it done. And that's a great thing about professional golf is you
got to keep proving it. You got you can't just This isn't the NBA where you can sign a four year, one hundred and twenty million dollar contract and you're set for four years. You got to keep proving it every single weekend, every single day, and that's that's a great thing about it. And it's just a total result oriented business.
To talk a little bit, you mentioned about the late tea time at Pebble. Obviously as a sectional coalth you get kind of the dumpy tea times as a sponsor.
And that's you get and that's another day. That's another thing about it. The number one most popular question I've been asked when I say I played three years opens, Oh, who you've been paired with? Like it must be I'm like, you, you have no idea that.
I followed you for a little event and you're you're playing partners weren't having their best days out there.
They're like, oh, you must be played with some of the coolest like playing. I'm like, you have no idea who they are, Like, like, you know, I need to be I need to prove myself before I can get those nice seat times that everyone has.
You know, how much tougher is it playing in those tea times. Then it's say even college where you are amateur stuff where you were, you know, nobody's ever going to say you get put in. They have like preferred pairings. But in amateur events you totally get preferred pairings. If you're a big, bigger player.
Well, there are different experiences for me, Like at Oakmont, I had the best tea times I thought I had like the third time the first the first round and the perfect morning you know, like perfect greens everything, and then like the third time in the afternoon wave so it was perfect like that. I would I wouldn't want better two times in that and then in the chambers and uh oakma or in Chambers and pebble a the
same tea times. I had the last tea time of the morning wave in the in the first round, and then the last tea time in the afternoon wave of the second round, the totem pole, the worst tea time Chambers.
You're this you're what were you a freshman, right or so I was going to be a sophomore, gonna be so they didn't really know who you were, right, No, And then and then you made the cut, and then the next year you get a prime amateur t time and then you're at the bottom of the rung of pros.
Oh yeah, no, it's hilarious. But it's fair. It's I mean, it's fair. But I mean I knew what I was gonna get it, you know good. I knew the times I was gonna going into it. But that's the thing, like those those tea times suck. But I mean it's
just way it is. Like you you go into the first round, Okay, I got a morning tea time, but I'm like nine o'clock or nine thirty and and then I got so much time, you know, because I'm like three o'clock the next day or two o'clock or whatever, and you're just like the waiting.
Yeah, what what is that day?
Like, I mean, it's just okay, let's go work out, let's eat breakfast, let's go work out again. Let's I mean, it's just like I mean, I got tons of food waiting for me at the tent. I'm like, I don't know, I just it is eating and working out and stretching. That's what it is. And it's just like you trying to.
Stay offes off On TV.
I watch a little bit. I like to see how the courses reacting, but it's not going to react the same at five or six pm when I'm playing. So it doesn't mean it doesn't do me any good anyway, But like, uh, I mean, both Chambers and Pebble, I'm getting off the course and it's pitch black, you know, like I it's it's cold. At Pebble, it's it's I mean, the ball's not going anywhere at six pm at you know,
on the ocean, it's it's completely different. But the greens are you know, Pebble's greens were amazing at and and you know, everyone says like they're not usually this good, ever, and I'm like, well, I mean, they can't get any better than this, And then you know, when you get to six pm, seven pm at night, they're they're totally beat up.
And did you play or do any practice round stuff that late? Did you think about trying to do that?
That would have been a smart idea, but I did. I didn't know. I mean, like honestly, having been my third US Open, I wanted to really just make sure I was fresh. And I remember my Chambers one. I'm like, oh, like first US Open, I'm gonna play all the practice runs I can. And I played with some cool players. I played with brooks Keopka. There, I played with Zach Johnson, I think Web Simpson. I played with some really cool players in the practice ns. But that was because I
spent seventy two holes preparing for the tournament. And then I bade the cut and I remember after that Sunday, I couldn't move. I mean I even as a freshman or sophore when I was young, but I was so beat up, like and then I I you know, I learned the hard way with that. But like I just kind of at the at Pebble, I'm playing nine every day and I played with Charlie Danielson every day for four days straight, and I'm like, I'm just I don't I'm just totally focused on having the most energy I can.
I think that's something that has changed, and especially professional golf in the last five years, is how much less practice round play happens that especially at major championships. And I think that's something that's the common golf fan doesn't understand, is how much seventy two holes right of competitive especially national championship level golf, takes out of you.
No. It It really like people don't see, like, you know, the physical toll any tournament will take on you, even if you have a caddy, but still it is a physical toll. It really meant the mental the mental wears on the physical, sure, but but it's still I mean, it's it's totally a factor and people don't see that. But it really is.
Going from the US Open, the feeling of playing US Open versus.
Q School, I mean, I would I mean, Q School's more stressful, for sure, but the first tea nerves it's that doesn't compare. I mean, I had never been more nervous in my life the first US Open first tuh, but just on the every shot told. I mean, the Q School like the grind of it. It's just it's it's more so the grind from you know, whole one to hold seventy two than it is for the US Open.
You know, the the US Opens like exhilarating because you got tons of people watching, even my group, you know what, I'm playing with Joe Shmo's next to me. It just made the US Open too. Uh, it's exhilarating because you got so many people out there and I, you know, I get all these IL chants and I and I chants, and it's just it fires you up, like you have that you have that extra support and it feels great out there. Like it's just exhilarating. But you know, the
the Q School rind is different. There's nobody out there, you know, it's just you. Really, I mean I I carried my bag at both stages this year. I'm like, it's just me out there with a bunch of guys who are trying to try to do it.
It just doesn't compare, would you say that you've got like the heightened nerves of the US Open, but then you get into it and you're just.
Yeah, yeah, Once you get into it, it's like it's just, you know, some of the most fun times in your life on the course, just because there's so many people watching and it's the ultimate stage, you know, on the ultimate venues, and it's just it's it's really just it's it's fun. It's that's what it is. And after the first t or a first hole, it's like, Okay, the nerves start to go away and it's just fun.
And then with Q School it's more of like just a looming it's.
Anxiety, the anxiety like being able to having to control the anxiety the whole time. Is is from one to seventy two. That's the part of it that's different because at the US Open, even as a pro, like you look, it's a good paycheck if you you know, do well, but it's it's it's just exhilarating, exhilarating, like even in my third one, honestly, it's still it's just the most fun times in your life. And it will be that way and you know into my fifteenth one hopefully.
Yeah, yeah, that'd be good up hopefully more than that. Yeah, what was the biggest shock turning pro? Like, what was one thing that surprised you when you turned pro that you didn't expect.
It's hard to say, because I mean, honestly, I was lucky because I was so well prepared for it being in Illinois and you know, being around all those guys that went pro at Illinois before me and having those relationships with those guys. I mean, I wouldn't say I was, like, you know, surprised with one thing. Honestly, I just nothing, nothing equals to the like the excitement you get when you walk on the range with all those guys that you've been watching for your whole life. And I mean
you can't. You can't mimic that. You you can, you can always drop in your mind how how things will go, and like be ready for that just because you you've been wanting it your whole life. But nothing mimics when you walk up on the range and there's tiger woods, you know, or nothing, even even other guys. It's just it's cool.
I feel that way, and I'm just a medium member Tigers on the Range.
Yeah, it's it, you know, it's just that's that's not something that you can be ready for.
Honestly, you played tons of match play as an am, whether it be through USGA stuff, the Western other am events. College. Is there is there a match that you think about the most?
Yeah, I mean my sophomore year, we should have won it at Oregon. I know it's like, oh, anyone can say we should have won, but we really should have won that year. It was like I I I think of I don't. I don't. I'm not a dweller of the past at all. Like I move on things fine, and you know I'm better for it, but I'm really Yeah, it stings that we never won a national championship when I was there and our team my sophomore year, I mean, I've got a poster of my room behind me, and
it's like how many times we won. It's we won like ten of our thirteen events that year, nine of our thirteen events that year, and and then going in nothing will beat the vibe of that team that we had, like we we were so close knit. You know, it was me, Charlie Thomas, Dylan, and Eduardo Aprelli and then Alex Burge played a lot too, and nothing will beat. The vibe of our team that year. I mean, we we were so close knit, we were so good. I mean we had Coach small too. You know, that's that's
pretty fun. But I mean going into Oregon, we were we were we no doubt in our minds, we were the best team. And we finished second in match play after not having our best stroke play. And I remember we were like eighth going into the final round of stroke play, but that that never felt like like oh crap to us. We never felt like, oh, we were
gonna miss match play. We just kind of played a really solid final round and we ended up being one stroke out of Texas for winning stroke play, and we were the two seed and we played South Carolina and I remember the great thing about the South Carolina match was that, uh, they put up Matt ne Eesmith against or uh, coach put up Eduardo against Matt ne Eesmith and or one of the other way around or something, and Coach it was perfect because Coach was able to,
like Edwardo was a freshman at the time, and Coach was able to like get Eduardo ready for this match because he's like, like they're talking about how you're the sacrificial lamb at Wardo like like, you're they they've already
marked off a win for your match. And and it was great, no better feeling when Eduardo beat him on the eighteenth hole and we uh we ended up you know, we ended up taking care of business against them, But that that was that was such a fun feeling because Eduardo like felt, you know, so great and you should have and he beat their best player and Matt's now gone on to the PGA Tour. But uh, that was such a great feeling. And then it's just one drawback that I have about the NCAA match play is that
you have to play two matches in one day. And that always bid us in the butt, honestly, Like we we we made final, the you know, final four three years in a row, and we end up losing in the final four three years in a row. And I mean, you can't make excuses looking back. I mean, I don't make excuses. But that's that's one thing that I wish was different, is that you spread out the matches one each day.
You know, they'd make more money that way too.
Yeah, And and I mean it just makes complete more sense that way too, because I mean we talk about the physical and mental grind of the US Open. Nothing compares to the NCAA Championship Week.
You know, is it the added Is it added because you've got your team?
Yeah, you got your team and it's emotional. But you got on the Thursday where the week starts. Practice round. You've got a seven and a half hour practice round.
Yeah.
So you show up to the NCAS and you got on Wednesday or Tuesday, and you got a practice round. You get one practice round on Thursday, and it is the slowest round of golf on your in your whole life. It is seven and a half hours, and you gotta study each hole. You gotta be you know, coach is just going crazy. It's a you know, a huge day. You got to learn every hole. You got a super Bowl Yeah, yeah, it's it's just a hectic day. And then you know, you you eat breakfast obviously, like nine,
go out the course of ten. You're you're on the course till five for sure at least, and then you know, you get you got to get a quick dinner and you got you know, the first round the next day, and you got four rounds of stroke play. You have a cut after the third round, that's you know, no, no joke, top fifteen out of thirty, and then you got another cut, and then you got match play, and you got that first day of match play is two matches.
So think about already the toll you've taken. You know, you already played four rounds, you already played a slow practice. You got a team that's obviously emotional wanting to win. Obviously everyone wants to win. But that that you get, you get to play your match, you win, and you have to go right back out, and that's just it's just a grind. It doesn't doesn't make sense to me.
And we never we never accomplished anything that day, which I mean obviously it's an excuse, but that just doesn't make sense to me.
I mean, I mean, you get to there. And it's the other thing about match play is it's just you see it every year with it. I mean last year they were talking about how Lucas Beureguard beating Tiger Woods was like the upset. It's like, I mean, we're talking about the fortieth rank player. It's like it's like Eduardo beating Matt and he said, like that that's gonna happen four times out of ten.
I hate it too, my own horn. But when he lost to Lucas Beureguard, I'm like, he's gonna win the Masters like that, that's I mean Tiger. You know that festered with Tiger for that whole week and a half more than master, you know that. And and I'm like, like, he just missed a four footer, like that's not what
he is. That put yeah me too like that. I mean, I'm like, I mean this guy, you saw how good he looked and in Austin that that week he hit the ball amazing, like, and he played really well against beer Guard too. He just made a couple of dumb mistakes and Tiger doesn't make normally, and that was that was quite something. And then yeah, when everyone's talking about, oh, like someone some random beat the beat Tiger, I'm like he,
first of all, he's not random. He's probably won before many times in.
The wgcsh right right.
Yeah, It's like it's it's golf. It's just it drives me nuts.
Every year. It's like, yeah, every year one of the big players goes down to some guy that's like fiftieth to sixty and it's like this is not enough. Set like this issically going to happen.
It's probably that guy will probably beat the top seed forty six percent of the time.
Exactly like the part. And that's a That's another great thing of what we talked about is the margin in golf so right, and.
And that's that's crazy when you just compare it to it's like sister sport in tennis. It never happens in tennis. You never see you rarely see a fifty seed beat a three seed. Even it just doesn't happen.
Yeah, it's it's really true. I think there's something because tennis has played a match in tennis in a weird way. Is more it's like a it's like a five game series in NBA versus like a set is like a game, right, you know, versus a round in golf.
Is it's a sprint.
Yeah, it talk about US Open local versus u US Open sectional. I always think about this with qualifiers like eighteen hole versus thirty six hole qualifiers mindset or it's bit or Monday Monday, it's massive.
I mean obviously I would much rather prefer a thirty six hole match, you know, thirty six hole qualifier, Like I mean, you you can play not as like aggressive you can it definitely will get a better player ten times out of ten. Then in just an eighteen home match, but I understand the logists of an eighteen hold match or eighteen old round already takes five and a half hours, you know, so you don't have the time usually, but
it is it is definitely a big difference. Like in a Monday qualifier, you gotta, you know, get out and get off the good start no matter what, or you're going home. And then in a thirty six hole US Open qualifier you can play more patiently, you can can serve more energy, you can just play to your strengths more and it just will get the better player for sure.
We're both from Illinois. We're not a professional golf hot bed. Yeah, per se, we got a lot. There are a lot of guys in your age group that are doing stuff. But I don't know if a lot of people know this. So State junior match flights called the chick Evans here. Yeah, you're thirteen, and you and Doug gam playing all high
schoolers make the finals as eighth grader. Yeah, do you ever think back to how crazy, I mean, you guys played your first match against each other since then, and the at the East Like Cup a few years ago, but like talk about that, we I mean, and did you know Doug well before that?
Yeah, So, Doug, I started playing IJG events when I was nine and nine and ten years old. I honestly want a lot of them. I didn't have like much competition at all, like honestly, I mean, I'm not trying to be cocky, but that's what that's what it was.
And then and then eleven years old comes around, and you know, you got this new kid who's paired with me in the first term of the year and his name's Doug gimm And I'm like, oh, okay, like this is like this is a new player obviously, And I was, you know, a little surprised that he was paired with me, because honestly, the ijjus always paired with me with the same guys that were like supposed to be pretty good. And he was really good, Like he was really good.
I don't think he played too well in the first event because, like I know, he and his dad say that his dad didn't let him play an event until I don't know, I don't know if he was able to hit range balls really well or I don't know, but I know Doug said he wasn't allowed to play in events until his dad led him, and finally he did. And I think I squeaked it out in the first event that we played with each other, and I think
it was like glen View Park. But after that, I mean, Doug and I played a lot against each other eleven, twelve, and thirteen, and then when we were thirteen, we did the Chick Evans, obviously, and I remember I think Doug one won the stroke play and I was like third in this or fourth in the stroke play, and I think I was like the sixth seed and he was a one seed and we ended up both seeing each other in the finals, which was pretty cool, and that
was really cool. And I still remember the match and I'm still kind of beat up about it because I was one up through fourteen, and on fifteen, I think I three putted to lose a hole, and then we tied sixteen, and then on seventeen Doug made a birdie to go one up, and then on eighteen I hit this drive. I don't know if anyone knows the eighteenth old steeplechase, but it's like a it's like a dog leg left par five. Then the second shot if you
go for it's over water. But of course I was like four foot six at the time and Doug was, you know, probably taller than me. But I hit my drive right on like the side hill, and I had this baseball swing lie and I just completely missed it. I tried to lay up with like a six iron, I towed the crap out of it, and I ended up under these trees with the small trees on the
left side. Like I remember, I had like one hundred and ninety yards out of the rough and Doug had laid up to like one hundred one hundred yards and I needed to make a birdie. And I mean, to this day this was probably one of my best shots I've ever hit my life. But I was under a tree one hundred ninety yards out out of the rough, and I was thirteen years old, and I had a five wood in hand, and I hit the best five wood of my life. I mean, I I had to like shorten my swing to make sure I don't hit
these tree brand and I just hit this punch. I had hit it right in the side of the face. It was one of those knucklers that came out hot, no spin. But I landed this thing just over the water, probably in the rough, maybe in the fringe, and it lands really soft and kicks up to like three feet, and I was just like, that's the best shot I've ever hit. I remember my dad walking up to the left just like screaming, like like my dad was crazy, probably just going nuts. And Doug's dad was either cadding
for him or standing there. And Doug ended up hitting this good wedge like twelve feet. He's got like a curl or like a like a three foot slider down the hill and he makes it like a twelve foot three foot break slider. And I was just like damn, Like that was quite a match, Like I mean, and then I was I ended up, you know, losing one down and they put up two down on the board. I'm like I lost one down, but I mean it was just I was like, yeah, this kid's this kid's
for real. You know, you were a little but like when I saw let me say this, let me say this. When I saw Doug make that but last, you know, a couple of months ago to make his card, I'm like I've seen that like eight times already like like that. I mean, I that's not it doesn't. It didn't surprise me one bit when I went in.
That was honestly one of the coolest moments of the hold off here.
Yeah, for sure, for sure, I mean it was. It was the heck of it. Up and down. I mean we played two big tens at Victoria, and that's no easy up and down. You got you got water right behind you. And it was like a twenty yard bugger shot and he had like a ball below his feet, and you know, he played a great like side spinner you know, coming in from the left that you know, chucked up to about what it was seven feet and drilled it. You know.
It kind of like encapsulates prog golf, like right there, like this great player, he was way inside the line, a bad shot here and a bad shot there, and all of a sudden he's on the line and then he's got crazy. He's got to get really not an easy up and down to get his card, and it's like, are you gonna do it? Are you not going to do it?
Yeah? No, that's that's that's the great beauty of professional golf. Honestly, it's just there's no better way of being competitive, I guess, and the feelings you get being able to control it, learn how to control it. Just it's the best you were.
You were a smaller kid growing up and then you hit this gross burt and yeah, I imagine your game change completely totally.
I mean I was. I was not. I didn't probably break six feet until senior year of high school. Like I was. In my freshman year of high school, I remember I weighed one hundred and twenty pounds and I was like five foot three. And then by my junior year, I finally was growing and I was probably five ten. But I mean, I, I uh, I was so such a different player my I mean, I was like I was like Dylan Meyer. I was basically like Dylan Meyer.
I had a hell of a short game and I hit these hybrids and woods to you know, three feet all the time. And then my game change obviously a lot. And once I grew, I kinda honestly, I started hitting it further and and my short game got kind of messed up, Like I didn't have the same like technique. My technique changed because I grew, I think, And.
Do you think it's also because you were hitting you needed it.
Last probably, And I was just always such a talented ball striker. I always knew kind of how to hit greens. I didn't I always I haven't always had like, honestly, the best swing. I've always had, you know, I've always been a little steep. I've always had, you know, not you know, not the best fundamentals, but I've always been able to know how to feel it around. And that's you know, that's the credit obviously I had. I've had the same swing coach Brett Paki since I was ten
years old, and we've been together ever since. And that's a great thing about it is Brett and I have such a great dialogue and even through my Grossburt, you know, through everything we've we've been able to, you know, have you know, do really good job, I think, and he's done a great job with me. But yeah, my golf swing changed so much. My short game change and obviously not having to rely on it much probably changed it.
But by the time I got to school freshman year, coach wanted to change all this stuff about Coach Mall wanted to change a lot of stuff about my short game. And you know, I played well my senior year of high school. I going into the freshman year of college, I made the final four of the Western m I I you know, made another USAM. I've been playing really well and my freshman year at college, I had a good year. But I was just totally overwhelmed with my
short game. I mean I was just you know, having you know, obviously not having the best short game my senior year of high school. But I still like didn't overthink it. I just kind of went around there and just got the job done. And then, you know, I needed a better fundamental short game, but I needed to change things, obviously, but I was just totally overwhelmed. When I started working with coach Mall on it, I ended up getting pretty damn good at it, and right now,
short game has never been better. And it's why I played really well last week and I leaned on it a lot last week.
But I feel like when you're a kid, it's not fun to practice short game, but then like all of a sudden, it becomes the most fun thing.
To practice, exactly, no doubt about it. I Mean you kind of just don't care. When you're a kid. You kind of just do it and find a way to be good at it, you don't really think about the technique of it. But in order to have all the shots, you need to have good technique. And that's kind of what I learned for a couple of years there at Illinois. I mean, Coach Small did a great job teaching me how to do it like like, but like I I was pretty overwhelmed for a few years there.
I actually think that the best feeling in golf is when you have an incredibly difficult the shot where you know you have to hit it right into a certain spot for it to just kind of trundle over a.
Hill like on a pitch, and when you hit nip it definitely on tight lines like no better feeling. And I you know, I was never good at those, but like now I feel like I could go anywhere. And honestly, I I was never good at the tight lie like square face, but got to keep it up a little bit shots and that's what I've been proven on a lot.
I mean, I've always been pretty good at just you know, the awkward ones, flop ones, bomps, the flops, all those, but the square face off, tight lies off a downhill lie, you know, those are those are when you get it good of those. It's a powerful feeling, you know, it's like.
The most most fun. Yeah, when you hit those right, because then the ball dis reacts. It's just like you know how it's going to react, no doubt. Yeah, it's it's cool. I short game is something that I used to hate and wasn't very good at right, and then like now like I don't play or play that much and try, I don't practice at all, but like short games where I have the most fun.
Yeah, it is fun. It's fun to practice. I mean I learned that at school too. Coach small short game is amazing and a lot of my teammates is were too, like d Trie and Charlie's their short games are unreal.
Yeah. So what's the thing you miss most about college amateur golf?
College? For sure, miss my teammates and practicing with them day to day. Amateur golf, I mean the summer events. The slate of the summer events are so good, you know, like you can name every one of them. Every one of them is run amazingly by great people. And I played in most of them, and you know, those were a lot of fun, for sure.
What's the thing you least miss about it.
You know, I almost said slow golf, but it just gets slower.
But I.
Honestly I like the flexibility of having creating my own schedule now, like with like how I want to do things every day to day. So I wouldn't say I missed. I least missed the structure part of it. But I definitely like being able to be flexible.
Yeah, I think the structure.
Oh, definitely class though not having class in there is huge.
I mean not having those walks across the quad in December and champagne.
Yeah, it's like that's that's that I don't miss for sure.
I remember one hear I had this U. I had like the last final and I've I lived in the six pack as a fresh last final and the buses weren't running. It was like the last day. It was so late and it was like the coldest day of the year, and I was walking back and I just had a horrible final. I knew I bombed it. Yeah, And I was walking and it was windy and I almost just gave up. I almost laid down.
I know, I know that feeling.
So the last two questions here, we'll get out on two fun ones and So what's the best shot you've ever hit? The one the best shot that you think about.
Oh, that's hard. I don't really have one that I think about from time to time. I probably should, Honestly, I don't have one, but the one I just mentioned against Doug I obviously remember. Well, so I'll leave it on that one.
Okay. What's the worst shot you've ever had?
Oh? Well, I hit a pretty bad one a couple of weeks ago at uh at Illinois fundraiser. I coach had me get up in front of about two hundred people with who were there, and uh, it was cold morning.
I hadn't quite warmed up yet, and he told me to get out the driver because he you know, and I'm like, okay, at least yeah, so at least I could tee it up too, right, And then, uh, you know, I tee this thing up and I just hit like a thirty yard duck hook, like straight in the ground, and I'm just like, let me just I just went straight and teed up another one, and this one went like ninety yard duck hook, and then I teed up another one and finally I hit it one way down there.
I was like, all right, I warmed up, you know, but man, I mean I wasn't embarrassed, but I'm just like, like, this is pretty dumb to hit a shot when you're not even warmed up yet.
It's it's funny the worst shots that like they're almost so shocking that like you're not like you're just like, wow, that was really weird.
Yeah, you just got to laugh them off, you know.
It's a short memory. So well, good luck in final final stage. Hopefully you've got a bunch more fans to go with all the line. I faithful here, thank you, and and uh we'll be we'll be looking for you, and uh and next year on the corn Ferry Tour.
Yes, sir,