Nathaniel Crosby

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logo right on the pocket. Today's episode is with Walker Cup Captain Nathaniel Crosby, Nathaniel was the captain in twenty nineteen when the US won the Walker Cup, and he will be the captain in twenty twenty one at Seminole where he's a member. So we quickly talk about the match that was there, the Rory McElroy, Dustin Johnson, Ricky Fowler, Matthew Wolf match, and then we dive into some of his playing career on the European Tours, and then we

talk about the twenty twenty one Walker Cup. So, without further ado, here's Nathaniel Crosby.

a mere percentage of the market share. So when Ping started to dominate on the PGA Tour and they had sixty percent of the players or forty five percent of the players or whatever it was and used Ping putters, the market share was exactly the same titleist golf ball since the fifties. Right, it's the count the market share. And you know this is the same as the counts. You know, seventy percent of the touring pros. It's the same deal all the way through, all the way to

Fairway Woods. And we had the we outsold Callaway of

my storekeeping unit. We didn't out sell them by brand, but we have sold Calaway by you know they if you're talking about the Trimetal versus Callaway, you know, any one storekeeping unit of Callaway that was a fairy would we have sold them because they in nineteen ninety eight and nine, So you know, I think the big thing what we did as a category is Adams really came out first, but they didn't commit to the PGA tour and they had a few guys on the Senior tour

playing it, but they created that shallow wood. And my whole feeling about you know, any product is if it's different and it's a better and it's a better product for a significant part of the market, doesn't have to be all the market. Could be thirty percent of the market, could be forty percent of the market. But if it's a better product for part of the market that's significant enough,

then you can really capture some market share. And the shallow faced woods were you know, people were hitting them further because you could have lower loft and get them in the air. So instead of a fifteen degree three wood, you were in a thirteen degree three wood, or you know, instead of a four wood at seven at nineteen degrees, you're in a seventeen degree four wood, So you're just hitting it further. But it did have some negatives and people topped them if they tried to swing up on them.

They had to kind of hit them like an iron. And uh, you know I always used to present it by saying there was a vertical margin of air that wasn't as great as a deeper you know, the vertical margin air wasn't as good. So if you if you chop down on it in the rough, you'd you know, you'd fluff it. You'd hit right under it. But you could hit it out of kind of nest, you know, if in the short rough you could you could bomb it out of the short run. Yeah, uh, you just

had to keep it. I mean I was a different player. I was thirty five or thirty eight years old then I could still have a reasonable back. But I remember hitting that, you know, that eleven degree. I could hit that two hundred and fifty five or sixty yards and off the ground and that was just a game changer for me. And you know, the thirteen degree was you know, maybe ten yards less, but you know, you could get an eleven degree fairlywood up in the air and you

could have it. You know, you could hold par fives with it and for the average play. And I was like playing with my partner at the Cravens, my uh, the Botuto, my Orlamar co chairman at the Leonard the Cravens, and I was looking at him trying to use a pretty average player about a ten or twelve handicap, and I was like, man, am I glad he's using that at orland Mark tri Medal as opposed to a traditional because just an awkward lie or of a thin lie,

you could still nail those of Mars. And you know, it's just a The golf manufacturing business is a hard business. And I just felt like, you know, I grew two

companies and missed the ring on both of them. So I'm still kissed, you know, because I succeeded in a really hard category and really didn't get the windfall because you know, I think Lamar we went from one hundred and fifteen million in ninety nine and lost control of the company, and I was stayed on the board for another year and a half and just couldn't handle the direction they were trying to underpromise and over deliver.

get along great. It's a great chemistry that really very Van Gerviig the you know, I think there had been a little bit of that before, but Barry van Gervig really ushered in the old retired champions to mix in. Billy Joe Patton I think was a member here, and you know, former Walker Cupper, but in Captain and I think and and we had so many but it was just a little bit in Mick and uh, Barry Van Gervig really allowed me to be a part of the club.

And you know, uh ushered In down In Gray and Benny Giles and uh Spider Miller, Mike McCoy, Uh, you know, Buddy Marucci just goes on and on. I know I'm going to leave out some but you know, Gene Elliott now is you know, great amateur golfer, and we all have a we all have a blast together. We all love playing. Dick citter Off one of my best buddies I have. I love to hand pick old crotchety guy. So I love Dick citter Off's death, who won the British Amateur a couple of times, and I think he

played in ten or twelve Masters. So we have a blast together there. And uh, you know, Dick would be playing with Ken Ling Gome or you know, you go out there and you know get paired with you know, Tom Ryan or Ed Hurley or Jimmy Donner. All these guys that are absolute champions of industry.

So you really have to bank your ball against the wind. You got a right to left wind, you better fade it. You have a left right wind, you better draw it. And you better have that ball coming down hitting the green when at lands straight. You know, it can't it can't be coming in on an angle or it just rolls out. And I think that that was missing a little bit yesterday because the greens were so soft, and you know, the course was the fairways were soft, so

they weren't running. There's just nothing that could be done about that. You can't get out there with the blow dryer, you know. So, but I think I think the targets are so hard to hit, and I think the course held up pretty darn well considering I think it would have been perhaps more intriguing if if the wind was blowing and the frank greens were firm.

and it was a pitch and put course. You know, and Craig Garvin used to or Claude Harmon used to say, yeah, yeah, they talk about my sixty all the time, but they don't tell that I shot sixty three the next day. He shot one twenty three in two days. And I know because I used to spend countless hours with Tony Penna, who was playing with him. But I think, you know, when Barry van Gervik took over, he made a strategic, you know, a philosophical difference with the course. I think

the ball was going further. This was in the early nineties, you know, it really wasn't didn't take the big jump until the PROVX in the well whenever. That was two thousand and four or five when the prov X came out. But the guys are getting bigger, everybody's getting stronger, so it's impossible to link in the course more than they really have on a whole. Like fourteen is really a part four for those guys. Fifteen is really a part

four for those guys. Although they can move the tea's back a little bit, it's still a part four for the most part, a hard one. But still, you know, fourteen and fifteen are pretty easy Part five for those guys, you know, the seventh hole, which is a long hole for the members is you know, those guys were hitting it right to the lake and there were you know, they were flipping into the lake because there's nowhere that

they can move the tee back. So when Barry van Gervik came in, he you know, the greens were always soft, and I enjoyed the greens being soft because you could you could shoot at a corner pin placement and you know, you could get results. But the course now, especially with the bunkering, the fairway bunkering. When Core and Crenshaw came in, they put lifts on those bunkers. The bunkers were very benign.

The fairway bunkers were benign. The green side bunkers have always been monsters, but the fairy the fairway bunkers were very benign. You hit it in a fairway bunker wasn't a big deal and the ball would roll through the fairway bunker. If you hit it at the fairway bunker with enough strength. Now the ball just hits the lift of the bunker and stays. Not only stays in it,

chances are all half berry under the lift. So h you know, I think that the greens being firm and fast as opposed to you know, a couple of points slower and soft, which was what it was during the Pullman era and the Alan Ryan era, you know, have made the actual green sizes about half of what they used to be. The green sizes are the same, but because they're firm and fast, you know, they're rolling at

twelve or whatever during tournaments and they're firm. So the targets are literally half of what they used to be. And you better hit the ball against the wind, curve it. You have to curve it against the wind, and you really can't. You really can't shoot at too many pins.

I believe on the Golf Channel for the European Tour. But at any rate, you know, I had plentiful stories. But the overview is that I was eighty seventh on the money list my first year, you know, one hundred and fifteenth I think the second year, and one hundred and fifty fifth the third. So as they say on Wall Street, I was negative trending. But you know I

got I got some great friends. All the guys that are on the TV who are all my big buddies, Robert Lee, you know, Mark Rowe, Tony Johnston, Richard baxall these guys are all on the European TV for the Golf Channel, and I just had a blast making European trends. And you know, christ the O'Connor junior. All the Irish guys were great friends of mine. And you know, I think Heimi Gonzalez, the Brazilian, was one of my very good friends. And he he's he's buying a bottle of perfume.

He was a lifelong I believe, bachelor, and he was then about twenty nine years old and I'm twenty four and I see him buying a bottle of perfume in the in the duty free in Paris, and I was like, who are you buying that bottle of fume for? And himI says to me, He says, Nathaniel, you know, I buy this bottle of perfume for a girl I have yet to meet. And the other funny story is John Bland, the Old Krusty, one of my favorite people in the world. He's crusty old dude who was really a talented player.

I mean he could really play South African and I played practice rounds with him once in a while. He was probably about thirty nine or forty and I was twenty four or five, and I showed up one day to the practice screen before our practice round and he's putting and he looks up and sees me and greets me, and he says Nathaniel, he says, good to see you, my boy. I'm looking forward to today. He says. I wondered.

I wondered what you both sat to tickets for you for Saturday and Sunday because I know you won't be making these guys. Oh, those guys would definitely take the piss out of you. They were so much fun. But you know, Seve was I got to know Seve played with him in the British Open at Troon in eighty two, and uh, you know, we had the stars if you remember we had when I played over there, I got paired, sorry about the background there. The Uh we had Seve

as number one player in the world. We had Langer one year as number one player in the world, and uh Faldo lyle wusnomu okay uh. And I played with elive belt after his rookie year was my second and because I played well my first year or I was probably second or third out of the tour school in the highest you know, as far as the money list, and they paired me with a life belt five times,

I think. So I played ten rounds of golf with them in eighty six, you know, so I paired with him a bunch of Colin Montgomery I played with him in his first round as a pro at the Hoggs Castle in Scotland at the Scottish Open. We had a bunch of guys and the guys that people didn't know that could really play. I mean all those Spaniards could really I mean kind of Czaris and you know Tennaro, he's trying to think of the Rivero could really play.

In the Irish guys with Damon Darcy and Das Smith almost won the British Open at forty nine years old. People don't know that Mark McNulty and these guys could really play, and nobody really knew them. But we really had the stars. And then they were only giving three spots on the European Tour to the Masters, and that was a big flying because then they opened it up

at the expense of the amateurs. The Masters really opened it up in about nineteen eighty eight, I think, and right away, I mean, look at all the Europeans that have won the Masters. It's just amazing.

ten players. So I was number three and in eighty one and number three in eighty two. And then I didn't end on a high note. You know, I didn't play great. I didn't really play any tournaments before I turned pro. Tried to play the ammeter one last time but in eighty four, but didn't really end on a high note. And then I think, looking back, I don't have any misgivings about retiring too soon or quitting at

twenty six or seven years old, whatever I was. I think it was twenty just turned twenty seven, but twenty six. I think it just turned twenty six. And you know, the thing about it is is I recognized it was just going to be a hard career. It was going to be I could have maybe stayed out there and got in my tour card and played well. But you know, I think when you look at these guys, they're just

some guys are better athletes than others. And I had I was lucky enough to have dinner with Tom Weiskoff in December and I told him this. I said, you know, you're a point zero zero one percent athlete, right and I'm probably a top three or four percent athlete. You know, I'm a good athlete, but you know, to be a top you know, you're not having fun unless you're in the top thirty or fifty. And back then you had to be in the top thirty or fifty be making

any kind of a living. And I just think that there's so many good athletes then and now, and these guys that you know, we're absolutely I mean, you know, the athleticism is underrated. I think I think these guys are just such good athletes because you see so many different types of swings. Even my walker Cup players, My Walker Cup players, I'm going through. I'm building a picture book for the guys right now and a lot of Actually I hired Brian Morgan, the Scottish photographer, and he

took two thousand images. So this biggest a marathon to put together. But you know, the guys swing so differently. Cole Hammer swings so differently than Stephen Fisk and Isaiah Selinda and Brandon Woo and they all swing so differently. They're all low through the ball, you know, and the same thing on the you know, look at the leading guys on the beach. Look at yesterday, I mean Matt wolf and when they dissected, you know, Ricky Fowler's flat.

You know, he's got a flat swing that's slightly laid off. And you know, then you got Rory that's got a picture perfect form. And you know it's they're all so different of you know, Dustin Johnson so shut and you know, how can it be? But it's just like I'll bet you Dustin Johnson could have played baseball. I bet Rory could have played baseball. I bet they could have. You know, Dustin Johnson could have played basketball, sure, you know, and Matt Wolfe the guys are total athletes, and.

hole in the US Open in nineteen seventy two. You know, he felt like he was a little shut and you know, at the top of the swing and he made an adjustment. You gotta, I mean, are you kidding me? Make an adjustment on a two hundred and thirty five yard shot. You know, when you're leading the US Open and you hit the pin with with a one iron, you know, that's incredible instinct, incredible athleticism to be able to do that,

whether you you know, whatever you do, archer. You know, whatever his adjustment was, whether he arched his back more, he you know, stayed down the line more, or whatever

his adjustment was, you know, was his secret. But you know, and then you look at you know, Hogan did it with technique because Tony Kinney used to tell me that he really wasn't that great a player until he changed his He used to swing along and have a he used to fight a bad hook, and then he changed his grip to where he knew he could never hook the ball. So he did it with technique. But under underneath it all, he was a good you know, he's

a beautiful athlete, you know. So you know, I think obviously chipping and putting a nerve has a lot to do with it as well, and that has a lot to do confidence. But boy, sure looks like a lot of golf holes are easier for Dustin Johnson than a lot of other people, you know, And he can bombit that way. And this guy, Matt Wolfe is the same. He was lucky enough to have him in my practice squad last year or a year and a half ago

where he played seminole. We played Seminole twice and then played macart Or twice or Medalist mccarts are, and then bear Slub twice. So I had him for six rounds. And you know, this guy is totally the real deal. He has at three point thirty and as you saw yesterday, he's a bomber and he knows his golf swing. He's great, He's gonna win a lot.

they had the hot hand. You know, Cole Hammers number one ring player in the world, and Steven Fisk had won nine college tournaments I think, including six that year and finished second in the NC two as is. So I paired those guys together and made sure that they played in both the singles matches. You know, I think ox shave Tea probably has the best raw talent of

any player I've ever seen. I mean, the guy's got a wingstand that's just amazing, and he being seventeen, and Stuart Hagastad being the only mid amateur I kind of thought that that was a good fit. And you know, I think the other guys, John Pawk and Celinda were getting along grave But I think Brandon Wu and Smalley and Isaiah and they're all I think they're all destined to do very well. And I think, you know, Stuart

Hagastad by the way, choose an amateur path. I think this guy, because he's going to have fifteen or more shots of winning a US Amateur. I think he's got a very good chance of winning multiple US Amateurs. And I'll bet you I'll be surprised if he doesn't win four or five minameters because he is that good. And you know, it's uh, it's he's really impressive. He got to the quarters. I think of the US amitter last year, and you know.

bad week for me his pest. You know, he wants to do he wants to restart the week when he gets to the semifinals, where basically anybody else who's the midameter would take, you know, being a mid you know, getting to the semifinals at the beginning of the week. So he's he is heads and shoulders to me. Uh, you know, there's Scott Harvey and Matt Paris Ali and

Parsi Ali and the others. To be sure, and I haven't followed or studied the midams quite as well, but I'll tell you one thing Stuart hagisat is not a oh boy, we have to take a midamter. H he doesn't, you know, There's there's no he is. He's a great presence and he really was a great chafferone as well for for you know, the Wild the Wild Child, which there were some on our team and it was a great chaperone for Aacsha and uh you know, but but I love I loved each and every one of them.

It was just a blast, and you know it would be hard for me to pick one. I was really impressed with Andy ogle Tree and of course Jean Augustine. I mean, these guys are they're all top notch, but uh, just looking at the images there, their form and their technique, it's just amazing. And uh and I think they're all

going to go a long ways. I think it's hard to get on tour that you know, you've got so many wrinkles now and you've got a bottleneck with this Corona virus, you know, and uh, you know, to get on the PGA Tour because you got you know, the guys. They've got to be fair to the guys that got through the corn Ferry last year, and you know it's going to be a bottleneck trying to get on the

PGA Tour. So it'll be interesting to see what the PGA Tour does and how they adjust their you know, the eligibility factor on how you you know, how many guys can be on the tour and the tournaments and you know what's going to happen with the corn Ferry and the upcoming qualifying for the following year.

So it was kind of like a time more for me. But you know, this year a lot of the tournament's been canceled of the Walker Cup is in May, so I'll only have this summer to really scout the players. N C two as has been canceled, and next year's n C two A is after is after the the Walker Cup the two weeks after, so it'll be a much more abbreviated scouting deal. But I that was one of the funnest parts about it for me, with scouting

the players and getting another families. I think I got to see like Ricky Castillo play, and yeah, a few of the other a few of the other players that would be considered because of their you know, junior careers. So Ricky Castillo to me is, you know, his last summer, his successes last summer. I believe we're going to count

and you know, he was freshman of the year. You know, it'll be interesting to see if some of the guys that were on my team the last time choose to, you know, another year of college golf, because if they choose to play another year of college golf because of the bottleneck, you know, it keeps you know, that doesn't allow him to have cash, they won't have cash, but they play another year of college golf and then they can.

You know, that would be John Pack who's a senior in Florida State, and Andy at Georgia Tech and Vocal Tree, and of course John Augustin at Vanderbilt. So you know, I was, if anything, I was a little disappointed that Akshay but Tia turned pro. I just I think that he is an incredible, incredible talent. A lot of the European guys have done that. They turned pro at seventeen. I don't think it was a financial it might have been a financial decision, but I don't think it was

a financial necessity. But I don't know that enough. I don't know enough, But you know, I kind of wish that he had won fifteen to twenty college tournaments, which was inevitable for this guy, and had gotten the college life experience and enjoyed, you know, the maturity that that brings in that part of your life. So I was, you know, he kind of got thrown it through himself in the deep end right away. And you know, things are different when you don't when you're not the center

of attention. Right when he when he showed up a junior tournament, he was definitely the center of attention. And I watched him when the Taylor made Rolex Junior at PGA by about seven or eight shots, and you know, I've never seen anybody make so many pots. It was amazing. But he's a great, great kid.

back with three birdies. When you are in the Masters and you make a double bogie, you're like, holy shit, I hope I don't make another one. It's just a different metal deal. When you're looking down the range and you see guys that you're not sure you can be day in and day out, it's just a different It's harder to play your own game. I guess that's the easiest way of saying it.

Western last year. So I've gotten to see these guys. I've got Tha Gallia who's going to be highly highly ranked. And Tha Gallia had a great year at Pepperdine and I saw him play at the Western last year and also at the US Amateur at Pebble. So I've seen a lot of these guys. Pearson Coody, I've seen a bunch. William Mout I've seen a little bit. So you know, I'm not unfamiliar with Craig Cummins. I saw at the Western and he looks fantastic as well. I miss seeing

him win the Pacific Coast. But in any rate, so most of the guys that are highly ranked, Trent Phillips is down there to have seen him, I haven't seen a few of the others. Thorpe's and I saw It's at the Peddle Beach last year at the at the Open, So you know, I've gotten I've gotten familiar with a bunch of these guys that are currently being considered. Cannon Klake have I watched. I think he finished second to

Akshay and at that Rolex Junior. But at any rate, I'll I'll hopefully get to see, you know, four or five tournaments this summer. I'm hoping to go to the Transmits, hoping to go to definitely be going to the US Hammer at Bandon Dunes and hopefully the Porter Cuff if they don't cancel these events. So I know they've canceled the Pacific Coast already, so it'll it'll be interesting to see if these guys scrub out. Sonny Hand. I will go to as well. I believe they've postponed it but

haven't canceled it. So North North Yeah, Northeastern unfortunately got canceled. I was looking forward to going up there.

at college golf. He was a brigging young for a little bit and uh, you know, he went to Robert Lewis Stevenson High School before he went to Brigham Young. But he was definitely the player I was playing in that British Open at True Truon that he could have won.

But you know, he he uh, he really had it going on, and he had that golf machine thing down perfectly and was working with Ben Doyle for a long time and something happened, there is my understanding, something happened with him and Ben Doyle and and uh he kind of lost his teacher and then he tried to change his swing. But boy, I gotta say, everybody thought he was the next you know, Jack Nicholas, Tom Watson, whomever, you know, he was going to be the next great player.

I don't know that it. Shoot, Scott Verplank won everything twice. Yeah, he won the you know, I mean, if you look at Scott for Plank's record, I don't have I don't have it in front of me. But he won the quarter Cup, he won the Western, he won the Western I mean, won the Western Amateur and Opening. He won, He won them all, and you know that's I kind of overlapped. He was a little bit younger than me. But you know, I got a lot of time with

Hal Sutton, got a lot of time with Marcomearra. You know, Corey Pavin was my age, so we had a pretty good crop. I mean, I was Scott Hope. You know, Hal and Scott Hope were a little bit ahead of me. But I got invited to all these tournaments when I was seventeen and eighteen, so I got you know, John Cook, and I got the class ahead of me because I

was getting invited to these tournaments that were really young. Yeah, I played well in the junior I was medalist in the junior so I got kind of justified the invice to these tournaments. So I was getting a lot of exposure from my dad's things, so I didn't I was kind of cluttering up the field, finishing in the middle

of the pack. And then and then I started to I played well in college my freshman year and one, and you know, but and then you know, quarterfinals this transmiss and North and South same thing, and semi finals and the Broadmoor, so I was kind of hanging around. Yeah, but I was, you know, I hadn't won anything big before the US Amateur but but anyway, it was it was great too, you know, to get around all of those guys, and and we had a great crop of players for sure.

of an environment, you know what I mean. But boy to that kid certainly has a wingspan. It's a fine line, for sure. But the guys that are a little bit better than everybody else, you know, they understand it and they know it, and that's why they go in week in and week out and perform. And it's easier for the guys that know it to play their own games.

And the guys that are you know, you know, I mean Tom Lehman didn't really start breaking through until he was thirty thirty one, right, yeah, yeah, And Hogan was on this. Pogan could have given up. I mean, if he doesn't, you know, make the paycheck in Oakland, he quit and you know, his whole career wouldn't have unfolded if he doesn't make that paycheck in Oakland, right, So it's it's amazing. But Hogan didn't win a major until he was thirty five. So it's amazing how the success

happens and when it happens and for what reason. But stable lifestyle is a big part of it, as well as the athleticism and the nerves being the third.