Welcome back to another edition of the Frida Egg Podcast. Today's episode is brought to you by Athletic Brewing. I recently completed a dry January and many thanks to the help of Athletic Brewing. They are the pioneer in the non alcoholic craft beer industry, quite a growing industry, and
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first order to go along with the health kick. I've been in the gym recently and I like to interview people that with interesting stuff going on and stuff that I'm interested in, and it got me thinking about the health and fitness side of golf. So today our guest is Barrett Stover, who is the owner of Revolution sp He trains a ton of professional athletes, from baseball players of golfers. He has trained the likes of Brooks Kopka among many other professional golfers. And I hope you enjoy
and learn some new stuff from this chat. One other announcement, be sure to check out our recent Frida Egg Stories podcast about the nineteen ninety six GMO Greater Milwaukee Open. This is hosted by our managing editor, Garrett Morrison and it's a documentary style podcast. Takes a ton of time in production. There's a lot of production that goes into it, and Garrett's, you know, put together a really compelling story
around Tiger's first start as a professional. So he talks to the likes of Curtis Strange, II, May Diaz, the then Milwaukee Journal Sentinel golf writer Gary Tomatto, Nike's ad writer Jim Riswold who wrote that famous Hello World ad. For now, this podcast is on our Frida Egg feed. It's just a couple episodes back, but check it out and let us know what you think of the format. And we're looking forward to rolling out at least one
of these a month going forward. So, now, without further ado, here's our conversation with Barrett Stover.
I missed a green, for example, I'm already upset when I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. And when I find my ball in a bright egg Frida egg, the dreaded Frida egg Frida egg Frida egg egg Frida egg brid egg, Lie, I'm about ready to run off the golf course. You do.
You do a lot of baseball training, right correct?
What uh what types of stuff are you trying to unlock with the body with baseball?
Yeah, so I grew up playing baseball and that's where my passion was and got me into training. The whole rotational sports thing. And I'm sure we'll get to the golf part of this a little bit later, but you know, with rotational athletes, it's it's a lot of similar movements as far as we're concerned with training athletes where you need hit mobility, you need uh strong shoulders, especially the
smaller muscles in the orders. You need to obviously be able to rotate well, separate hip and shoulder separation, you know, everything from the toes. The head needs to be strong and move and move well. So when we're looking at that, we're also specifically with baseball, concentrating obviously on the shoulder and the elbow, making sure that those are safe as possible.
So a lot of it has to do with thoracic movement as well, upper back, shoulder blades and making sure that the athlete can actually like reach overhead without a lot of other compensations going on. And then depending usually the lead leg hip, we want to make sure that that you can land and rotate into that hip really well, and off the backside load and rotate off that backside really well as well.
So as kind of golf, what are some other rotational sports.
Softball, tennis, cricket you could throw in there. You know, all sports have a rotational aspect. You know, even if you think of alignment pulling around the corner for running back, then he's going to rotate out of his stance and start and start moving that way before he starts moving, you know, sprinting literally, and he's gonna have lateral movement as well. So there are aspects of all sports. But really anything where you're swinging an object or throwing an
object is gonna be more rotational. Volleyball can kind of fall into that as well, where it's a lot of jumping and diving a lot of forward and backward movement, but you're also swinging your arm, you're rotating after you jump. So all sports have some rotational components on it. They're the ones that we think about like golf, baseball, softball, tennis, you know, those those specific rotating sports.
Yeah, you mentioned the shoulder and the elbow with with baseball is particular like kind of safety points of emphas may make sure they you know, obviously those are.
High risk injury areas.
Like in golf, what what are the muscle groups that you're that you are are areas that buy you folk us most sign so.
The biggest one with golf and specifically well it gets into professionals as they get a little bit older. But in the average golfer that's a desk jockey has a nine to five job, it's low back, right, So you know, when we look at low backs, there's a lot of things that feed into low back issues. Hip position is a big one. What can the usually the side of the injury is not the actual problem, It just takes
the blunt of the issue at the compensation. So when we're looking at someone that has a low back problem, it's usually the hips or the upper back, depending on what they can or cannot do with either one. And when we're looking at golf, it's usually a lack of rotation through the hips and the upper back, and so they rotate a lot through their lower back, and the lower back can rotate some, but it's more made to
flexni extend. So that's when people start grinding on those discs, and uh, you know, usually like L four, L five is a big one that a lot of people have hurt and that they end up just just grind the two vertebrate literally grind on the disc until it pops and compress the disc. And that's where you hear people say like, oh, I blew out a disk or have a bulging disc, and that's usually from lack of rotating through the hips or the upper back, and that's a simplified version.
It's it's interesting that you say, I've this last year, I had like my first back issues and all I've been doing all winter is stretching like hips and everything, and and like you can feel the pain start to go away, but it takes a lot of time. What I guess for that regular guy, what are the best things they can do that are light lifts in terms of you know, I go say, I go work in an office every day. What are and I don't I got kids, I don't necessarily have like all the time in the world.
What are the easiest things you can do to kind of.
Like a thirty minute type deal or something to kind.
Of yah, maybe maybe even less.
Okay, Okay, yeah, I know there's tons of stuff that you can do at home, and maybe we can work on maybe like a little bit of video series or something so I can walk through these tags and videos for this sort of thing. So so everyone, I'm a very visual person. So when someone talks me through something, I'm like, great, now show me, because I have nothing really comprehended of what you just said. So the main thing with that is that the ham strings and abs
become long and weak. So that and that leads to the low back being short and tight. So we're constantly compressing on the disc because we're stuck in low back extension. So again Sparkano's version would be to strengthen the ham strings and the abdominals. That would be the quickest way to do it. And while if you're going to stretch anything, stretch the quads and the hip flexers. So we also
don't just douce any type of static stretching. We have some specific ways that we stretch where we're always activating either the same muscle group or the antagonists the opposite muscle group. So we'll usually if we do some type of hip flexer or quad stretch, we'll go right into a hip extension exercise where we're working glutes, your butt or your hamstrings.
When you're talking about stretching the one while you're activating the other, you're antagonists.
What's the purpose of that. I'm just.
So if we just lengthen the muscle that's short and tight. It's the main thing is it's going to be a short term fix. So you get up from stretching, you feel great, right, You're like, oh wow, I'm so loose in limber. Everything feels you know, it feels feel like a million bucks again. You know, the tightness has gone. Research has shown status stretching results usually last around twenty minutes and then you're right back to the position you're
in before. So in order to hold the position, if something short and tight, we want to loosen it up so that our body can move like it's supposed to. But then we want to do something to hold that position. So then we'll look at the hips like we go from I'm using atomical terms here, but well, for hip flex are short and tight, will be an anterior public tilt,
which is like sticking your butt up and out. And then if we so if we open that up, we want to take the hips in the post to your public tilt, which is like rolling your hips under, so you're rounding your low back and teach the body how to hold that position. So now we're bringing it more into a neutral position and holding it there and strengthening the other side, pulling the muscles, using the muscles to pull the hips into the right position. Does that make sense?
So we're actually like holding the position instead of just being like, oh, I found this new position, but I don't know what to do with it.
I'm a visual person also, but what you're describing kind of reminds me a little bit of more of a yoga style pose than a you know, like a yoga style stretch. Then just say, hey, I'm just gonna bend down and touch my toes.
Correct, Yeah, so yeah, And then if you've been down touching your toes, you're just stretching out your post, your chain, your hamstrings and little back and that sort of thing, which again could be appropriate for some people, but the majority people benefit more from stretching the front side and strengthening the back side.
It's it's really interesting that you say when you're when you're having back problems and everybody talks about you, think of like, Okay, I'm as stretch my hamstrings, but your hamstrings are actually like long and weak, So you're correct, like, so you're strengthening them when you're doing that.
Yeah, So I'll try to find some pictures and put them on Twitter and maybe you can tweet them out so we can I can show you this because I know, like I can picture in my head obviously this is what I do for a living. For the average guy, I imagine that you don't have too many people and
your majority listeners aren't majors and extra science. So so the idea is that your hamstering attaches to the bottom of your pelvis to think like bottom of your butt cheek, and so if the bottom of the butt is rotated up, it's going to lengthen it's going to pull the hamstring into a longer position. Can you visualize that a little bit. Yeah, So from that from pulling it, it's going to pull and make it longer because the distance between the attachment
point and the insertion point becomes greater. And so if that happens, they're gonna feel tight because they're pulled tight.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah. So if we're already, if we're already like if you already stretch, you're already in a stretching position, and then you try to go deeper in the position, it's like, wow, this, I feel this a lot more. So, Yeah,
you're already stretched stretching some. So if we can then take that and strengthen it and make that a little bit shorter and stronger, it should pull the pelvist back into position and get it in the in the proper in a neutral position, so that we have the hip flexer and quad and button hamstrings working together and and equally as supposed, that one being one being super strong in the lm being very weak.
So static stretching versus you know, like active active stretching is one myth. Like sports sciences has come a long way in the last say decade, really.
Even finally starting to catch up in golf.
Yeah, well golf's always ten years behind everything. So that's what What would you say are some of the other myths out there with it, maybe specifically for golf or just general fitness.
Well, for golf, the big one is that like lifting weights is going to make you immobile or tighten you up, or you know, leave you unable to swing a golf club. And that's something that I've tried to probably put more stuff out there, but really dispel that myth. The great thing is we have guys like Brooks and a few other guys that are taking their weight training very seriously and they're also really good at golf, right, And for some reason Tiger didn't. Tiger was that guy, and then
Tiger got hurt and everyone blamed weight he trained too hard. Well, Tiger did a lot of things in his life that probably led to that outside of what a certified strength conditioning coach who had the proper credentials and knew what they're talking about told him to do, Like the training correct. Yeah,
so that's one thing. You know. You read that article where he's running miles upon miles and boots and doing seal training, You're like, and then he's purposely trying to get more extension in his left knee and his swing to create more power. Well, something's got to give, and athletes are the best compensators. Tiger's one of the best
athletes we've ever seen. So he's going to compensate better than anyone, and therefore he's gonna get the movement from the knee or the back, whether it's whether it wants to or not. So just this whole idea that lifting makes you tight and makes you bulky, Uh, it's completely false. If you go and you lift with like Arnold, then he might get tight and muscle bound. If you get on some type of steroid package, then yes, you might
get a little tight and muscle as well. But if you're doing if you're seeing someone that knows what they're talking about, and you're getting stronger, then you should be able to move better as well. So the way we describe mobility as its strength and flexibility together mobility, if you could move really well and you're really weak, it's just as dangerous as being strong and not being able
to move. So I guess that's another myth too where guys just worry so much about mobility is oh, you know, my ta spine isn't mobile, And it's like, yeah, dude, well you can't. You can't squat one hundred and thirty five pounds for free reps either, you can't deadlift two twenty five like fix fix the low hanging fruit first and then worry about your tea spy mobility. And just a little little proof of that is we had a
kid that played golf at a Division one school. He works at the Golf Channel now actually produces my produces my podcast Ashton Nix, And he came in here and I said, I'd like to do an experiment on you, and he's like, all right, whatever, man. So I put him on a bodybuilding program for three months and we measured his We measured him his club at speed, you know distance everything on a flight scope before he started working out. And then after three months and he was
up five miles an hour on clubhet speed. And it was like, like I would not if someone, if a golfer came in is like this is the workout you're doing, I'd I'd tear it up, be like we need to start over. It was zero rotation, it was no frontal play, movement side to side. It was straight like beach body, get big workout, and there wasn't I have to look back. I think there was like one or two hip mobility things in there and that was it. But it was just straight lifting.
Yeah, so would a better way to describe I guess golf training. Everybody I like getting stronger, but is getting more explosive?
Yeah no, that's a great way. I mean, yeah, that's for sure one way to do it. The huge terms functional fitness these days, you know functional strength, which way overplayed because then if you just put anything into a golf movement, it's functional which is also a little bit of a pet peeve of mine. But yeah, if you become more explosive than strength, is the power of that
explosion equation, right? You know, I want to move mass as fast as possible, so moving a lot of mass a little bit slower should help with explosiveness, just like moving a little mass really fast should help with exposiveness. So yeah, that would be a good way to say. So.
Something we've touched on this a little bit with you know, the beach body workout versus you know, getting a little
rotation in it. Something I was I wanted to talk about was the idea of specialization versus like kind of generic training where where maybe you play a lot of sports, you know, may your kid or like I remember that the best golf I've played, like as an amateur, you know, was when I was playing a ton of basketball, and I felt like it really helped because there was a lot of quick twitch and my legs were stronger than ever.
But that was a completely different sport, right, But with today's day and age, with the specialization, is there value in doing you know, playing you know, doing other activities that might have kind of residual impacts or is it just best to just specialize?
For sure at early age it's better. This is a tough question because it really depends on the person. If you have a twelve some people just wire different. If you have a twelve year old just loves golf, loves baseball, loves basketball, whatever the sport is, and they have no desire to do anything else, then I don't really have a problem. You know, to let the kid play back a lot of basketball, but you should be doing something
to offset that. And that's where the strength and conditioning field is kind of filled in over the last couple of years, is that it's become the extra sport. So you know, if you're a golfer and you just love golf and you can't get away from it, and you don't like basketball, you don't like baseball, whatever it is, you know, okay, that's fine, but let's also supplement some things in to where you know, the parents should know
better than the kid. Where he doesn't need to hit, you know, spend an hour on the range three hundred and sixty five days a year. Maybe it's a month or two where he doesn't touch a club and he just looks really heavy. It works out really hard, and then that's also supplemented into this workout, into his training regiment the rest of the year as well. But for the most part, yes, it is better to play sports at a younger age. It gives you a better movement library.
Is one phrase that we use in our company to say, you know, like if you're in basketball, you're putting in a lot of different positions where you have to control your body. You have to explode out of those sort of things where if you just swing a golf club all the time, the only time you're in a different position is if you have like an uphill lie or
if you're in a bunker or something like that. So it just expands your movement library and allows you to your body to be able to understand it and move better in certain positions.
The what you said about strength training becoming the additional sport. You know, when I grew up, I played every sport under the sun. And now now I see kids and I'm like, oh, they don't do anything. But that's a great way to kind of explain, Oh, yeah, like strength training, because now I go to the gym and there's like high schoolers, there's like thirteen year olds everywhere, and I think to myself, it is like, God, when I was like twelve, I was never in a gym.
Yeah, right, exactly. And that's that's also where I get if you're training for sports like you can't. We can't replicate as functional and doing air quotes there as people try to be. You can't replicate like going up for a rebound the ball being over your head. You have to reach your armback, grab the ball of land and go back up in like a sports performance ship unless you literally throw the ball and have someone catch it there.
So the variability that you get from playing sports, and that the reactive you know, you have to there's a lot of reaction involved in something like basketball too, or tennis or something if you want to cross train that way that you're not gonna get from just lifting in
a gym. But if you are going to see someone that does with they're doing and they're throwing meds and balls and they're jumping and they're doing sprints, and they're building an athlete first in the golfer second, then they should fill in some of those gaps.
How do you work, I guess when you when you're working with a high level athlete, say, you know, professional golfer, how do you work with the Is there any conversation with say the swing coach about where what they're trying to work on, say they're trying to get a deeper hip turn or something. Are you then also complimenting that with exercises that are working on their movement efficiencies that are restricting that you know, personal swing issue.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, great question. Definitely should be a combination of the conversation there with the higher level athletes. Usually they can communicate a lot of what they're trying to do and what they want to do, and again, the higher level of the athlete goes I usually give them a little bit more leeway into having a say what we do. If you're thirty years old and you're on the PGA tour, you're in the MLB, you should have some type of feel for your body about what works
and what doesn't. So you know that doing A B and C, you've tried it before, it didn't feel good, Okay, we'll try to supplement something else. And so some of it should come from the athlete as well. But yeah, absolutely talk to the coach and say, hey, I really like him to get it, you know, rotate into his hip on the load more in the backswing. But he
no matter what I try, he can't do it. Okay, Well, then we find that he has limited interrotation on the back hip, and so yeah, he actually physically can't do it. So if I can get his improved his internal hip rotation on the right hip, on the or backhip, depending on which side you're playing with, then he should then be allowed to physically get in that position. And then maybe it's just a motor patterning thing or something where it's like, oh, I've never been able to do.
That before, and that makes sense.
One of the things in golf that is pretty big right now is overspeed training. And I think that it's been it's been something with your baseball background, it's been something that has been used in baseball for a really long time.
What are your thoughts on it?
And and and for the layman, what what is over speed training?
Overspeed training is just using an object to help you move faster than you naturally would in that sport. So it's funny you say this about baseball because there's actually a lot of similarities in baseball and golf about how far behind they are and like baseball, like people still hate technology and so like the use of trackmen, like people are like, I think it's like satanic arts or something, and it's.
Like, go ahead, how do you use TrackMan in baseball?
It picks up spin rates on baseball's and it's a different machine, but it's the same idea like spin rates and velocities, release points, stuff like that. So you can then look at depending on how the ball rotates will affect the pitch. So you can say, oh, I needed to rotate this way to get this effect, or I throw this pitch all the time and it has bad rotation, so maybe I shouldn't throw it anymore because it's a bad pitch's.
So basically like it can teach it, you know, Like I do a podcast with Jeff Ogilvie. He always says, like people were always searching at you know, Monday at a tournament. Was always like, oh, like I'm trying to figure it out. I think I figured it out, and then TrackMan came along and everybody figured it out. And with baseball, it's kind of the same way. With like a pitcher, like I don't know why my curveball is hanging and it's oh, yes, is why correct?
And then you look at like, oh, your hand positions off, and then you change the hand position, you see the spins bake up, and it's like, okay, that was the issue along, and it gives you the immediate feedback, just like in golf if you're like, hey, I'm why is my driver when I swing the driver? Why i'd have five thousand rpm you know, spin rate on the on the when I hit the ball, and then say, oh,
well you're slicing it. You know. Every time, it's like, okay, now I fix my club path and I'm down to two fifty twenty five hundred or three thousand RPMs, which is about right for a driver, right.
I think. So I think that it's like, yeah, twenty five hundred is good.
Yeah, so we'll say that that's good. I have someone correct us. Yeah, I think I think it's eighteen hundred to twenty five hundred from what I remember. Yeah, And then so that's how I use track Man. And then for overspeed training. I mean, the main thing with baseballs is throwing the lighter baseballs. So a regular baseball is five ounces. And then what's been pretty much agreed upon would be the safest way to do that would be to use a four ounce and a three ounce ball.
So we use those baseballs and then try to, obviously after a proper warm up, throw the lighter baseballs as fast as you can. And then the idea is that it's teaching your body how to move faster. And part of moving fast as you're creating greater force, so you
have to learn how to accelerate that greater force. So you're teaching your body and causing stress in your body that way, so that then when you put a five ounce baseball back in your hand, it's like, oh, I can move faster and I didn't blow up, and you know, like everything is intact, so therefore I allowed, I can allow myself to and organize my movements to move faster with the normal weighted ball or club in my hand.
So it's essentially tricking your subconscious that has.
Some of it, yes, to move some of it's physical, Yeah, some of it is physical. There is definitely a so the mental part would just be intent. Like I think that's where the golf thing. I don't mean to take
anything away from super speed. They do a great job, but the idea of I think a lot of times, specially golf or with some baseball pitchers, is they just never they're so worried about like hitting the fairway or throwing the ball in the right place that they just kind of guide the ball or guide the club instead
of being really explosive and athletic with it. And so like with super speed, when you don't have a club or a ball in play, it allows them mentally to free up and have greater intent with swinging, and then they see the speeds they're like, oh, I can actually do this, and then so that part is the mental part would be the subconscious like you're speaking of, along with the body being able to like, oh I found a six or seventh gear. I don't have to say
it forty five miles an hour. I can hit sixty miles an hour and I'm not gonna crash in a ditch and burn. Yeah.
And that's one of the things I think that gets misconstrued and is that and this is something that Jeff Ogilvie always says too, is that the best swingers on tour are the longest hitters because it you know, it seems like with our conversation there, they're the ones whose bodies allow them to swing the best.
Yeah. Yeah, or they can use what they have the best because they make sense.
Yeah, because they're yeah exactly, because they they aren't. They aren't constricted. They're the longest hitters they like. And this is what I always say to like my wo are like, I want to hit it further that are like, you know, just regular golfers, like average golfers play on the weekend, is like, well, you need to like technically get into the right spot. And you know, it drives them crazy because they're you know, good athletes and other sports and they can't.
It's like, well, like you need the technique.
First off, but then yeah, you know your body needs to move in certain ways that are different than your body's used to moving for sure.
Yeah. So, and then again, the other thing with the either overspeed or underspeed training is if you have a bigger engine, you'll be able to move faster. So the super speed and I believe they are on the same page with me here. They are helpful and they're great, but your ceiling's only so high unless you also do strang training with it. So if you're just one hundred
and thirty five pounds soaking wet, and you're a college golfer. Like, it's great if you can swing those clubs very fast, but one you're yourself at risk for injury, or two you're lowering your ceiling by not doing the strength condition along with that. Like it's a piece of the equation, it's not the entire equation. Yeah, that's a good golf golf myth bust right there.
That makes sense.
Yeah, You've got to do all the work and nothing's really easy.
Right, So I have a Hondo cord, you know, and I don't think I think there's under two hundred horse power in that thing. Great carb, but nothing special. If I go and get like the transmission tune perfectly and you know, do all this work to help the little things and the gears change better and all those things, Like I'm still my zero to sixty is still not
going to be like five seconds, surrounder. If I go and put you know, a four hundred and fifty power horsepower engine in that thing, then I have a chance to have a you know, zero sixteen hundred five seconds.
Yeah, that makes sense.
So something unique with golf is the duration when you're playing petitively, the duration of around. What do you do from a training aspect that tackles like kind of the endurance aspect. I you know, I hate to say, but just the length of time that you're out there.
It's not a forty eight minute basketball game or you know.
Yeah, no, for sure, this is good. This is another myth that I wanted to get to. So another one of my friends is the golf coach at North Alabama shout out to the Lions, and we had this conversation. He's like, Dude, my guys fade at the end of rounds all the time, and he's like, do we need to run more? What's the deal? Like, I feel pretty
good about our strength condition program. And the analogy I always use with that is if I can bench press four hundred pounds and you can bench press two hundred pounds, who's going to bench press one hundred pounds more? It would be me, right, Like I can, I'm stronger, Therefore I can do one hundred pounds more for more reps.
So it's the same thing with golf. If someone is only you know, is weak, and someone else is strong, the guy with the strength will also have better endurance throughout the round because they have a higher capacity.
That makes sense because if you're starting high, everybody kind of loses at a pretty similar rate, right.
In theory, Yeah, yeah, so if if someone's if you're everyone's if you start it, if someone's starting at two hundred percent compared to someone sort at one hundred percent and you both drop fifty percent, someone's at fifty, if someone's at a hundred. And the other thing with that is with golf, I mean, yeah, there's walking involved and there's endurance in that, but the actual swing is a
very fast, switch explosive movement and you're doing that. I don't know what the play cal or what the swing clock is on now, but I would think it's like once every forty five minutes, you're taking a full swing and then you you know, when you get to the green, it's gonna you're gonna have a fifteen minute break between before you take another one. So you still need to be able to take an explosive doing movement on the
eighteenth tea box and then have control over that. So that's where I really believe that the strength aspect comes into play, where if you're not if you're not strong, and you're tired and not explosive and you get to the eighteen te box, it's gonna be bad. It's gonna be a disaster. Where if you're used to playing and you're stronger than everybody else, then you should be able to produce a better result on the eighteenth hole.
Yeah, So if you play a lot and you're fading at the end of the round, it's not an endurance thing, necess'.
It's probably just a starting strength thing.
I would say. I would say the majority of people are like that, especially with the guys. I mean, if it's the guys you're playing with for fun or in you know, like club championships, like I would say almost one hundred percent. There's probably some general condition that comes into that because it's guys that may or may not just be working at a desk all day and have like
zero cardio endurance at all. But as far as like, it's not someone like a you know, someone that's a cross country runner would need, you know, to have the same endurance as a offer like obviously the need for cross country and nurse is much greater because it's an aerobic movement in sport. So I would say that majority of the time, speaking in generalizations, that it would be a strength issue.
What what are some of the other myths that you want to hit on you alluded.
To, Uh, it might be better just to keep talking and let me let them come out when we go this. Yeah, I mean it's mainly revolved around the golfers a week and they need to get stronger. That's the main thing I want to get out there.
Range of motion and strength are kind of intertwined, right.
Very good, Yeah, that's great. Yeah. So one thing we measure in our evaluation is active first passive range of motion. So think passive range of motions, like I'm moving a joint for you and taking you as far as you can stretch, Okay, So then active would be how far can you move that joint and control it. So obviously there's a a big disparity between the two where the active is really big or sorry, the passive is really big and the active is really small. You have this
large range of motion you can't control. So the only way that helps it only helps you if your body forces you to get in that position through something, through some movement, and then that's not actually beneficial because then you're moving through this large range of motion that you can't actually control you have no strength in that range of motion.
That's I watched something with Adam Scott where he talked about how he was actually too flexible.
And where that would be the same idea.
Yeah, that that'd be a good problem to have, you know.
Yeah, right, And again if you're you know, depending on your podcast demographic. But most people that play golf at an amateur level, that's not the case, right, because they sit at a desk all day and and they're just you know, they they don't use is they lose the range of motion because they don't use it the you know, if you don't don't use it, you lose it principle. And so they feel tight and they feel restricted. But again,
just moving moving will help them. They should move a lot, like the more you move the better, but you should also not just stretch like lifting should help you feel even better than you should move in lift.
Yeah, yeah, that that makes sense. I feel like that they're the lifting bugaboo with golf. Is is so like people are you know, like when Rory got big, everybody, oh, it's too big? Is there is there any credence to getting too big? Like you know, like where it restricts movement. Is that when need's a problem. Yeah, I mean you know we've talked.
About for sure. Yeah, like we talked about and again, like professional athletes are pretty type A and like addictive personality people right like to be great. I'm sure you've talked to some of these guys like they're kind of out there, and you know, you look at someone like Elon Musk, that guy's pretty extreme. He's not your normal
human being. So to be like truly great, there's usually some type of addictive or you know, just some some part of your brain that just pushes everything to the edge. And so that definitely happened with weightlifting, where they just start like, oh I feel better, I look better, and then they take it too far and then get too tight and they get too and they focus on the wrong things as far as they don't do the movement
stuff that they need to to compliment the lifting. They just like to talk about do a beach body workout, and you know, constantly training on that, playing less golf. If you're not swinging constantly, then your mobility is gonna decrease just because you're swinging golf cup like you're rotating. However, many times a day when you practice. That's going to hold or increase your mobility by doing that. So yeah, I mean it can absolutely bound you up and tighten
you up. Like we talked about getting everything short and tight instead of being able to be neutral and strong.
So just like you just alluded to with with swinging a golf club, but I noticed this because I'm in Chicago and I'll go weeks without touching a club and then I'll go play golf for five days and I'll notice, like, by the end of this golf trip my my swing, I can feel my swing that's longer, and I'm playing better golf because it's like, yeah, it's getting back out
there like that. If you don't use those muscles, they just that's where they kind of not contract, but they actually get longer and weaker and then they don't move as well.
Yeah, depending on what it is, if it gets longer, weaker, shorter, tighter, I mean shorter and tighter can also be weaker. Not to get too deep into muscle anatomy right now, but so yeah, I mean the idea is that if you if you don't ever raise your arm above your head and it doesn't help you survive, your body isn't going to keep that movement, okay, you know, like a survival principle, like it's not going to exert the energy to maintain
that movement. Where it's basically telling yourself it's like a you know, like a short term evolution type thing where if you reach your if I never reached my hand over my head to grab something off a shelf, it's only this high, and you do this for ten years, it's gonna be and you never move your hand above your head, it's gonna be really hard to lift your
hand above your head. Like that makes sense, right, Like your body has no need to do that movement anymore, so it's not going to keep that movement around it doesn't. It correlates that with something that doesn't have to do with surviving. So if you're eating every day and you're comfortable without moving anything overhead, then it's you're not gonna be able to do it. And then you do something like swing a golf club where you try to get back here and you're not gonna be able to do it.
What uh?
What are some exercises that let's just say are very popular. If you went to you went to your local gym that people are doing that. When you think about golf and the functional training of golf, that you're that, you're like god, that that's not doing anything.
Oh a lot of it. A lot of it. Yeah, No, a lot of it's dictated by form. So a lot of people have trouble with like your normal back squad. I have no issues with the actual back squat the exercise, but if you don't have the hit mobility, if it's pushing you into a ton of back extension, which would be compressing that disk, and you don't have the movement qualities necessary to do a proper back squad, then it's
really bad for you to do. I love deadlifting. If you don't have the prerequisites physically to deadlift, then it's
really bad for you to do. So that's a little bit more of the take I look at if you're trying to be an athlete, I think the leg extension machine is probably the worst thing for people to do, because you're in a seat of position and strengthening your quads more and reinforcing that pattern that you're in all day and doing an isomate, isolated exercise that really has no effect on any athletic well in movement that you do. So that might not an answer, but it's.
Not like what you talked about earlier. It's not activating any part of your other body when you're just sitting.
There right, correct, correct.
It's like that idea when you're stretching too and you're activating the opposite muscle, like if you're doing so that like extension, if you're doing like a one leg of squat, you have to use your whole body, right.
Yeah. I wish everyone was easiest to talk to and understood it as well, because a lot of people just totally missed the point on these things.
I don't know.
I'm a I'm very remedial. I have a lot of but it's.
Awesome to do.
Yeah, but it's I mean, you're spot on with what you're saying there.
Well, So it's it's just like when I think about it from my personal side of things that I think like a lot of it is I sit in this chair like all day and it's like getting and I think this is where a lot of golfers struggle, is like getting just even to a point where you can do a squat because of like hip tightness, hamstring you know, weak hamstrings, and that is a long process to get there, and I think that's where people fall off so much with fitness for sure.
Yeah, it's everyday thing, and it's it's chipping away. It's just like anything golf. It's the same type of deal. Like you know, I'm sure everyone that you play with complains about their short game being great, But how many guys go out and practice the short game for a couple of hours a week?
Yeah?
Yeah, like that sucks. It's not fun, you know, but if you chip away, no pun intended, if you chip away at it and you work at it, then it'll eventually get better. If you spend ten minutes a day doing it, It's so different with the body and moving. If you if you stood up there and you did some type of even yoga type stuff in your you know, right beside your desk there for ten minutes a day in a month, I'm sure you would feel like you moved better.
Yeah.
I got one of those rollers, yep, and I just have it out in my living room and I like, when I'm watching a basketball game at night, I'm just I roll on it and it's it's made an unbelievable difference, like how I feel even just waking up in the.
Morning, for sure.
How do you how do you make it fun?
You know you just talked about how it's it's not you know a lot of this stuff's not fun. How do you in Like when I practice golf, I go out and I try and gamify it to make it really fun, Like I do different different drills where I can, you know, have a little pressure and make it feel like more than just practice.
Well, we do almost all small group training, so you know, if you get a group of high school guys working out together, then it's doesn't take much to get them to start competing with each other in whatever they're doing. So that would be the one thing is get a workout partner. I work out with the same guy every single day, so even on days where he doesn't want to do anything, I can, he kind of has to keep up with me, and vice versa. When I don't want to do anything, I have to keep up with him.
It works out well or about the about the same strength levels on all lifts, so we pretty much can just if I'm a little bit stronger in something, he was motivated to catch up with me, and vice versa. If he's stronger in something, I want to catch up with him. So having someone to do it with, I think is the biggest thing, just like anything else. Setting goals and saying hey, I want to get to A, B and C by the state would be a good
way to do it. And then I mean there's I think there's different types of even communities or Facebook groups you could join or something like that too, where you're tracking your progress or doing something like my fitness power tracking calories with diet and tracking what you eat and see how that's changing. So I think any type of accountability that you can create is the biggest thing with
working out. That's why people pay personal trains, right because they have to show up and they have to do something. So accountability with someone and then also having some type of peer pressure along with that accountability to push you to do it would be the two biggest things. And find something you like, Like I hate running, I'm not gonna go I'm not going to create a program for myself where I'm running every day. I hate it, Like that's miserable. I enjoy lifting, Yeah, I'm gonna so I'm
gonna lift more than anything else, Like should do. I try to do some cardio. Yeah, I don't do as much as I should. But you know, if you hate yoga, don't go to yoga class. Like, go find something that you like. If you like orange theory, great, go do that. You know, there are some things that people should not like. Some people should not to cross it. They're not able
or possible to do it. But find some other type of high intents the interval training class that you can go to that is better suited for you if you like that type of workout. So that's the other big thing is find something that you really enjoy doing, or that you could do with your friends, or that some of your friends enjoy doing and think you might like it eventually, because at all, I mean, no one likes doing stuff they suck at, right, Like that's why I
don't play a lot of golf. I'm terrible. I don't enjoy it. It just makes me mad, So I don't do it that much. If I had a group of I kind of played with here and there, I'm sure I would do it more and I would enjoy it more and I'd get better and that sort of thing. But starting off, it's if you don't do anything. Getting back into it is gonna be rough.
Yeah, that's I mean the first I feel like this last year I didn't work out much and I've been renewed because I've actually been home, not traveling. But like once you get there's a moment when you that you cross where like all of a sudden you're at the
gym and you're just hoping for to end. And then there's like a day that it flips where you like, you keep doing more, you do more, and you want to go do more and that's like the best it's like the best feeling of accomplishment you can get, you know.
Yeah, for sure. I mean again, like I do this for a living, and I still have those days where it's like what do I have left to do? Like can this thing be over now? And it's just a matter of kind of getting through those days. And there's other days where you're talking like you're talking about where I get done with my workout, I'm like what else
can I do? Is there something like I do two more sets of something real quick because you're feeling it so and that'll be you know, that's a good lesson too in the gym, if you if you have a day where you're a it's a I'm going to make myself do something to day, make it a little bit shorter, and then know that if you're going to have a day where you feel really good, you're going to do
a little bit more. But don't you know, it shouldn't be something where it's like someone's holding a gun to your head and making you do it and you're miserable. It should be something that there is some enjoyment and maybe if just the fact that you're done with it and you feel accomplished, but some type of enjoyment associated with it.
Okay, So say say I'm a parent of a burgeoning golfer, you know, young golfer. What what age should I really start thinking about, you know, functional and strength training for a kid.
I know this is always a question that comes up.
Depending on the maturity of the kid. We would say around twelve. So we also we've played around had some stuff like youth athletic development classes where it is geared more towards a nine and ten year old. So if it's something like that where it's a it's a again in a group setting that's more designed around kind of like playing and races and those sort of things. That type of physical activity, then that's great, or I mean
gymnastics would be great for that as well. But as far as like a training aspect, something where it's a forty five minutes to an hour of playing and body weight movements is a great thing for a kid that's signed or ten years old, and then once twelve comes around, get them into more of like a weight training setting. One myth overall about weight training is that stunts growth. That's not true.
If you're if you're like, I heard of that one again, right, No, for.
Sure, I did too, Like I started lifting when I was fifteen because my dad thoughts stunting growth. If you're loading up a back squad on like a nine year old and you're like compressing the disc and the spine in a very heavy manner at a very young age, then you probably won't grow as much than if you let the person naturally develop. But just like doing your reverse lunch with five pounds in your hand is not going to stunt growth or doing push ups like we
do push up. We don't like kids bench bress dumbbells. You know, it's like, well, the dumbbells are actually lighter compared to your body weight, So what's just because this body weight you're okay with it? Like it makes no sense. And then the other part of your your question would be the how much do they specialize? So if you're if you're nine and you're playing golf, baseball, basketball, and you're you know, play each four months a year, then you don't really need to work out, like go go
play basketball in the backyard for your workout. But if you're just doing golf and you are specializing, then you need to do something else to increase that movement library and help you become an overall better athlete.
What if you're you know, and I know this is impossible, where you just start diagrazing one thing because everybody's different, everybody moves different. But if I if I said, hey, I really want to increase my speed, what would be the like the best simple thing I could do on a on a regular basis to increase speed?
My first answer would be, let's get you stronger. Very first thing I'll tell you is we need to get you stronger. And again with that strength, excuse me, I am going to assume that within that strength training program you are getting quality movement in the strength training. So if you get quality movement in the strength training, then it should fix again the low hanging fruit that that is the mobility issue that someone that sits at the
desk most of the day has. So that would be the first thing, and then the second thing would be like actually working on hit mobility and strength through the movement. So you asked for one thing or one.
Yeah, I was just gonna say one exercise, one exercise.
If I gotta go, I've bet go for it. Broke with one exercise.
Okay, Yeah, sorry, I knew I was gonna get off on tangent.
It's okay.
Question started cut, And that's an impossible question because everybody's got to be a little bit different probably for sure.
If you can deadlift with really good form, if you can do like a trap bar deadlift with really good form, I would say that would be the one that would that I would.
Start with because it's going to work so many aspects of your body, right correct.
Yeah, that's it's as much of a full body exercise lift as you can have. It makes create stiffness and strength, especially through the middle of your body.
Yeah, that's why it makes so much sense given what you said right off the beginning about the idea of doing exercises where lots of parts of your body are active during it as opposed to just you know, static.
Yeah, a lot of people will say that with that type of question, if you could do three things for any athlete, it would be some type of deadlifariation, a sprint, and some type of mess and ball throw.
That makes sense.
So how can people can find you? You're on Twitter and Instagram? Do you have a podcast? How do how do people find you for you know, if they're interested in learning more?
Yeah? Uh, first and foremost, my company is called Revolution Sports Performance. We're in Orlando, Farta. Our website is pretty basic, but it's Revolution sp dot com. And then for my personal social media is Barrett Underscore Stover so b A R R E T T Underscore Stover last names like the chocolates. And then the podcast is a whole lot of b s. Get a little there, appreciate it, appreciate it. I get lucky every once in a while. So then
that's on all of the podcast channels of iTunes, Spotify. Yeah, it's it's uploaded. I upload their anchor, So it's on all of them and then uh yeah, that's pretty much it for for me.
Awesome, awesome, Well thanks for coming on and you know, giving us some dropping some knowledge on the fitness aspect.
I think everybody can do just a little bit, you know. That's the thing.
It's just doing a little bit more that you're doing and you're going to see improvement for sure.
For sure. Yeah, I mean that's do something like we talked about, like like move and find some type of movement that you like doing. And a shameless plug here at the end. We also do online training. So if there are any people out there that live in the middle of Wyoming or somewhere like that where they're pretty restricted and don't have anyone to work with, we'd be
happy to help. Again, we work with ages. I think we have ages twelve to forty nine right now, so we see a wide variety of clients and we're happy to help anyone who's dedicated to becoming a healthier human. So just because you're not a professional golfer a professional baseball player doesn't mean that we wouldn't be happy to work with you.
That's it's funny.
My wife and I like kicked around that idea of moving somewhere that it's not like we live in Chicago area, so it's like we have everything we need. But one of the things that restricted us we were in because we were looking at a small town in Michigan and it was like, God, there's like.
Not like a real gym here, you know, And yeah, that's tough.
That's a lot of the country doesn't have like a really nice gym to go work out at.
Yeah. Well, I'm so snotty now that i hate going to like La Fitness because I'm used to working out like in my gym where it's myself and one other person with the whole gym to ourselves, and you know, I don't have to deal with other people. I don't have to worry about the equipment they have, like all this sort of things. So yeah, I definitely feel you there.
Yeah, so no, no shameless plug.
That's I think online online training is U is a great way to go, and I think you're seeing it with golf too. The ability with video, how much you can do yeah, is just extraordinary. I mean sure, whenever I have something that's ailing me, I like Google and I find like YouTube and a there's like it's unbelievable, the wealth of knowledge out there.
Yeah, so no, it's it's going in the right direction, all right.
So thanks so much for coming on Barrett, and everybody go go follow Barrett his company, Revolution.
And sp On on Twitter and Instagram.
Thanks so much.
Andy, Thanks