I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset. And when I find my.
Ball in a brid egg Friday egg, the dreaded Friday Friday, Frida fridagg bride.
Egg Lie, I'm about ready to run off of the.
Welcome back to another edition of the Friday Golf Podcast. Today's episode, I'm very excited. I am joined by Steve Williams, longtime caddie for Tiger Woods, and Evan Priest Uh. They together put uh put together a book that is on sale on April first, called Together We Roared. You can
pre order this book. Really they they went into painstaking detail to recount and sit down and rehash Steve Williams' career catting for Tiger Woods, which was quite the run, one of the best runs we've ever seen in pro golf, probably the best run that we've ever seen in pro golf. So today I'm joined by Steve Williams and Evan Priest UH to talk about some of the stories, tales and UH and just talk about catting for Tiger Woods in
in really his heyday. This was really a fun episode UH to speak with with Steve and Evan obviously worlds of insight, and I mean I think you could, as Evan got to do, Uh, you could probably talk to Steve for days about about his time catting.
For Tiger Woods. So we will we will get into that.
Uh.
We are barreling down on the Master So the next couple episodes will probably be Masters themed. I think we're going to do an Augusta National Course podcast next week and then we will have our our Master's pod coming up. But this was a This was an awesome episode. I was it was really pumped after we finished this interview, and it was fun reading the book. Check out the book. You can pre order it on Amazon. Together we roared. Before we get to Steve and Evan, let's talk about
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save twenty percent on your entire order. Thanks, and let's get to Steve Williams and Evan Priest. All right, Steve, I got to ask, how did you get Tiger to play in the New Zealand Open.
It was quite simple. When I made the arrangement to start working with him, I said, he's only I only asked for one thing, and he said, what's that? I said, when you win a major championship, I'd like you to come down and play in the New Zealand Open. It was as simple as that, and I have to you know, I took great pride, and then he took that he was seriously and he came down and played. So yeah, that's pretty exciting.
What was it like getting that on his schedule, because obviously, you know, I think like probably one of the things that with a global superstar liked Tiger time and figuring out when someone can do something is one of the trickiest things.
Yeah, it was very fortunate when he agreed that he was going to plan it and he inquired about how soon, what year could we plan it. The organizers of the event, you know, were willing to make the event the date that suited him basically, so, and it was it's normally played back then was played in February, so we played it in January after the toramented Capelous. So it worked
very convenient. Capella is, you know, halfway to New Zealand as it is, so you know, instead of being a thirteen hour flight Mala, it's only an eight our flight from Honolulu, so that worked out really good.
You know, I saw that I didn't know before this as a you know, a Tiger fan, really someone that got into golf because of Tiger. So obviously you know, Steve Williams fan. I didn't really you were from Paraparauma Beach and that's a golf course that I've dreamed of going to see for years. I didn't realize that that New Zealand Open was played at the course that you
grew up on. What was it like seeing and and you know, seeing Tiger Woods come play the golf course that you grew up on in the New Zealand Open.
Yeah, it was kind of surreal. And on the Tuesday afternoon when we went and played nine holes practice, we stood on the tenth tee and these you know, I don't know how many thousands of people there were. I've never seen that many people at UMU, So I had to get my head around it for a little bit, you know, because as a golf course so I started cutting out when I'm five years old, and every day after school I looked for golf balls and all the
water hazards and so forth. Though, you know, to be then walking the fairways with at the time the best player in the world, it was. It was remarkable. It was actually was It was a dream come true. And actually as a child, when I used to watch all these taunts on TV from America, I had this idea that, you know, maybe one day I might be getting one of those guys and maybe one day he might play
my course. I mean, it was ar fit extreme, but it was one of those dreams that came to reality, and you know, it was exciting times.
So Evan, you and Steve put together this book together, we wrote and it's it's really Steve's recounting of his career with Tiger Woods, which arguably the greatest run of a player in a caddy together in the history of golf. What was your favorite part of putting this book together with Steve.
Yeah, it's I mean, it's hard. It's a hard question
and an easy question at the same time. But I think I've told a few people now and I've decided that when Steve and I were researching, and I was researching and writing, and we were doing twice weekly interviews, my favorite moment is when Steve would interrupt himself because he would recall it question I'd asked in the previous interview, and he'd be like, Evan, I just had a thought, and I'd scrambled for the notepad and be like, go ahead, because they were the most raw, like organic kind of
like they've they've laid dormant in Steve's memory for decades
and he's just remembered it until now. So I knew those were and those ended up being like basically the best anecdotes in the book where Steve just accidentally his memory just that you know, machine was rolling and all of a sudden he recalled something and that was to me the most organic memories that he had, because some of the best anecdotes in the book, like the fact that Tiger and Steve hand wrote letters to each other, that was that answer came from a totally unrelated question
and he just remembered on that in that moment that he and Tiger hand wrote letters to each other. And I thought, well, that's no, no one knows that. That's a totally new, you know, revealing sort of tale about him and Tiger.
And I suppose that was my favorite moments.
Yeah, when when Steve would interrupt himself and just bring up absolute gold from the bowels of his memory.
That was the great beauty of the book and not been in a rush to do it when we had the time, and then we did it twice a week, and that was actually amazing some of the things that you know, it's been a number of years since I've actually worked with Tiger, and that was the beauty of
the book. That actually rekindled some of my own memories, and that was a lot of fun to beout it not only rekindle them, but actually write them down and remember those memories so that you know, like the book will be a great read for me as well, you know, to keep myself up to date with what happened a number of years ago.
And and the one for the gearheads out there, I'll only tease this, you know, so that it's not ruined when you go to read the book, but so it's quite famous amongst gearheads that Tiger eschewed the Nike driver for about a week back in two thousand and three. And yes, if you are some of the great golf journalists like equipment journalist John Wall and Mike Johnson, those sorts of guys, they know about that period, but they
don't know why. And there's actually a really just kind of silly reason that Tiger got rid the Nike driver for a week tried a tailor made driver and the story behind that was one of my favorite memories that
Steve came up with. And again that was that was a memory where we were just talking about some event in two thousand and three and then all of a sudden, Steve goes, you know what, I remember there was this one moment and it was this one golf with a triggered Tiger to want more distance, and that was one of my favorite moments in the book. And I just thought, I don't think anyone in the world knows that. I'm
pretty sure that's brand new. And that was I think that was my favorite moment in the book.
Yeah, I was. I was amazing.
There are so many little nitty gritty things I grew up caddying and I always have enjoy, like, just love the psychology of player and caddy. Steve you in the book, there are multiple references to these detailed stats that you would keep in a notebook about taker's rounds, and then you would go and analyze them, you know, like I think now the tour is so far, you know, they've been such leaps and strides in terms of stat keeping.
At the time, you know, in the early two thousands, was keeping stats like was this a common thing that caddies did, and what type of advantage did you feel that these stats get brought you?
Yeah, I mean it certainly wasn't a common thing about caddes because everyone used to when you're standing with a bunch of other caddes on a path three T and they look at your had you know, I would write down the pin platements on a piece of a four paper from one to eighteen and I have a lot of notes on every hole and what those notes were, you know, I would write the distance down that Tiger had, what club would he hit, and did he hit it
right or left? And so at the end of the week, I could look at all these stats and you know, say he hit you know, he hit a driver, you know, twenty five times this week, he hit nine left and X amount of shots to write, and I would be able to compound not only stats of obviously the ones that are like hitting a fairway, noting in a fairway, but I would do my own way of doing that.
So you know, there was a lot of holes that say, for instance, you had a hole that like, let's just stay for instance, the eighteenth pole at the TPC at Sawgrass, there's trouble on the left. You just can't go left. It's a penalty. So if you hit it into the first cutter right rough on the right, essentially that for me was a fairway hit because you were trying to hit it down the right side and you've only missed it by a couple of yards. So I put that down as a fairway hit to give me more accuracy
for what I needed to know. But at the end of the week. I was about to go and tell Tiger, hey, look, Tiger, last week, you know you hit this many seven nines and it was a glaring fact that you hit this many of them to the right, or you missed the green with this many seven nines, but you didn't do it with an apel nine on them, and that would possibly mean there was this chance of maybe the lye or the loft angle was off in that club. And also it enabled me to give Tiger something to work
on all the time. You know, last week, this part of your game was no good. So in between that tournament and the next moment, if there was a break, that gave them something to work on it. At the end of the year, when I compiled a year statistics, there would be something that would be below par for what he would expect, and I would give him that and that's something you could work on it. It was very advantageous to be able to keep all those statistics
and then you know, compile them year after year. When he made swing changes. You know, you know, there's always a great debate between or not between us, but in the media as the you know, did Tiger play better under this swing?
Coach?
For this swing coach. I mean, I had all my information that would tell me exactly that, you know, whether which one was better or if in fact one coach was better than the other statistically wise.
Yeah, and sorry, I was going to add Steve.
Steve worked out a glaring weakness from a specific club, specific distance, and specific shot shape that you could Steve. You probably agree it had a big impact on the Tiger Slam before the two thousand season, and he kind of went from you know, a below average to elite at that distance to the point where you know, there was a of a myth on too with the Tiger wasn't good from this particular distance?
And was it?
Someone came up to Ameror and Tiger and yourself, Steve during a practice round a people beach at the US Open. It's Johnny Miller. And Miller said, yeah, but he can't really hit wedges, can he can't? And he said no, you watch like he's been working on it in the off season with Steve. And that was all based on Steve's starts from ninety ninety nine.
Yeah. No, Look, statistics. For some unknown reason, no one told me to start taking statistics when I first started catting it wasn't just Tiger that the statistics was doing it with Ray Floyd, and it just was a great way of being able to sit down and analyze.
You know.
Of course nowadays they have all the shot linked data and everything, but you know what that doesn't records, like I said, is the clubs that were hit and where and where those shots had. If there was a tendency, what was that tendancy and you know what was the reason for that tendancy.
Yeah.
I like the way you talked about like giving a fairway hit if you hit it up the right side and it ends up in say the short rough instead of the fairway.
You know, like you achieved the shot you wanted to hit.
I've always thought it was silly, like if I'm like four inches on the fringe that it doesn't count as a green. In my head, I counted as a green and I counted as a putt, you know, one hundred percent.
You know, you think about sometimes playing Let's just say you're playing in the Open Championship and it's horrendously windy and you're going into a par four from well over two hundred yards with a you know, three or four in or something like that and you miss the green by a foot, but it might be twelve. The flag might be located four off the right of the green, and you're five off the right of the green. Well, it's a great shot, that was, it's in the proximity
of where the flag's located. I count that as a green hit, so it gave us a little bit more accuracy. And you know, the one stat that I love the most is that I worked out that if Tiger hit sixty five percent of the fairways or greater and didn't three part in an event, you couldn't beat him. And it was you know, so it was all you know, he worked ferociously on never having a three pup and because you know, that was a stat with that he
knew as well. So that was one that was a very very good stat and you know, a decent driving week those three puts, he was going to be standing on the podium.
So you worked for Greg Norman and then also Ray Floyd, two great all time great players. When you got the call from Tiger, you know what you're working for? Raef Floyd? What excited you so much about Tiger Woods at that time?
Well, it actually it wasn't it was. It was an odd situation. It was a nineteen ninety nine and in fact, yesterday I was just reminded yesterday it was twenty six years to the day to the first time I put his bag on my shoulder Tuesday, the March the seventeenth, was in nineteen ninety nine. So anyway, in two thousand I had in ninety ninety nine, I thought, I thought to myself, in two thousands might be my last year counting.
I was interested in going back to New Zealand and maybe starting some kind of junior academy and taking all the information I've learned from all the years on tour canting for Greg and Raymond Floyd, that perhaps I could use that information to really help junior golf in New Zealand. I've done an extensive amount of travel, and it was satisfied with the career that I had. And then I, you know, I got the call from Tiger. I didn't
take the job immediately. I talked to a few friends about it because I knew it was going to be demanding. And then I even you know, when I went up and met Tiger at his place in Orlando and discussed the job, and he explained pretty clearly what his mode, what his goals were, and what he was striving to do. I knew it was going to be an intense job, but you know it was something I took on and I relished the challenge, and yeah, the rest is history. I guess you could say what.
Made Tiger just different from from other great players like that?
Well, I mean, you know a lot of players are just happy some weeks just to make the cup, finish in the top ten, wherever it might be. You know, Tiger's a successful week is only a win, So if it wasn't a win, it wasn't a successful week. And his his drive and determination to reach such lofty goals whether he got there or not, but he set himself some incredibly lofty goals and the way that he worked to get to those goals and the way that he's able to peak for major championships, and I think that
was the catalyst to Tiger's successes. He worked out a way and had a schedule, and you know, when he sat down and did a schedule, he never deviated off a schedule. That's one thing I loved with him a post any player that I've worked for, he would sit down at the end of a season and he would work out a schedule that he thought were best enabled
him to peak for those four major championships. And he wouldn't deviate from that schedule, which made it very easy for myself living in New Zealand traveling back and forth. But he just the way he went about things, he just you know, he he didn't get caught up. And all the money he got made, he didn't get caught up and all the fame that he had. He just had some goals and and he just works his tail off to achieve those goals. And you know, it's very
easy to get comfortable in life. There's a lot of great players on the tour that should have major championships and multiple championships behind their names, and Evan, you've seen that year in year out. You know, you wonder how some of these guys don't win majors, But when you make the sort of money some of these guys do, some of them get comfortable and they lead a very
luxurious life if you like. But you know, Tiger was just he had a goal and that was obviously the clip Jacks record of eighteen majors, and he was never going to start working hard. Even to this day, even as we speak right now, you know, you know that he believes in himself that at some point he can stand on the first tee of a major championship and feel that he is fully fit, fit to compete seventy
two holes, and that he's done the practice to do that. So, you know, I guess last week's announcement a lot of people were thinking, oh, that might be the end of them, but online there is no way that's the end of them.
I you know, as you know, as someone who covered the twenty nineteen Masters, and Evan you were there also. I mean it kind of like we had, you know, in the mid two thousands, this period of time where you were like, well, it may never happen again, and then it happens and you're like, this is astonishing.
You know.
Now at this point, I'm I'm it's unbelievable.
He's not even playing and going you know it, he'll play just the Masters and make the cut, and he has this made cut streak that's still going at Augusta National.
It's it's just astonishing.
He is.
I think, like the hyper competitiveness is something that you know, we've you know, the greatest athletes ever and I you know, I grew up a fan of Michael Jordan. It's something you see that, like where that drive to be the best was just out of this world. Evan, do you have a favorite story from the book that maybe didn't make it.
In Oh, it's a great question. Wow, there wasn't much in the cutting room floor, to be honest, but oh god, you've absolutely got me a beauty there. Favorite story that didn't make the book, I think, to be honest with you, there were a few moments from two thousand and five, like actually non major tournaments during that season, like he was really at the height of his powers and Steve
and Tiger witnessed such incredible things. But two thousand and five, there are a few regular tournaments, I suppose moments like Steve told me off camera about the chip in I think it was a birdie at Tahyo Club in Japan where they played the Asia Pacific Amateur last year, and just the moments surrounding that, and how Tiger told Steve like this is absolutely going in. This is the way it's going to break once it hits the green. It was completely identical to the two thousand and five Masters
chip in. It just gets less airtime because I believe it was a WGC World Cup and just moments like that where there's such geeky goal stories, but you know, when you're working to ninety thousand words, ninety five thousand words, it's just like something has to give and that unfortunately it was one of them, but I think, yeah that two thousand and when was that stew thousand and one, Well.
Yeah, yeah, it was something like that. Was it was the World Cup? And it was I wrong that Tiger tipped them to beat New Zealand.
Was that Craig Perks and Craig Perry on that.
Tim No, it was.
Michael Campbell and Campbell.
Yeah, and I don't actually recall the other player, but he chipped them to beat us on. Yeah, so it was it was like a bit of sweet chipping. I guess.
Yeah, it was moments like that.
Yeah, it was just like it's honestly, there were hundreds of them, and you just like felt like you were maybe choosing one of your children over the other when you when you made the call delete that story from the manuscript, But you just thought, man, ninety five thousand words to work with There's so much more I could go into, but yeah, that was one of them. Those cool off the beaten path, non major stories were my favorite.
Steve, you brought up the swing change a little bit, and I think I reading reading the book, I think you have some opinions probably around this. It seemed like you were a big fan of the way Hank Haney taught. When you look back, do you ever question whether he should have reset the swing kind of after that slump with Bush Harmon. I think this is something that all golf nerds think about a lot.
Yeah, look, it's a great question, and you know there's so many people got an opinion on it, but no, no, I can give an accurate answer because you know, he actually made the swing change. But Tiger's a very very that he's a big student of the game, has a great understanding of the fundamentals and the technique and what's required to be able to swing the best for your sort of physical limitations of you like, And he wouldn't make a swing change of that magnitude unless he thought
he could get better. And that's the great thing about strife that Tiger is the continuation to strive to get better. He never got comfortable. He always believed there was a way to get better. And I describe that quite clearly in the book about his you know, his process around that. But you know, he just believed that he could get better. And you know, it's not something that was a rash decision.
He put a lot of thought into it. And he you know, he had he had one sort of floor in a swing that you know, he found difficult to get to remove that floor in a swing when he was working with Botch, and he felt that going on another route with Hank would possibly end that floor that he had. Tiger could continuously say, you know, when someone
asked him about a particture, I got stuck. And he hated that feeling of what he would call get stuck basically in Layman's terms of getting the club behind your bodies ahead of the club and so forth, and you know, you either get stuck or you flip it with the hands. But he believed, you know, that he could find a way that he could swing the best that he could
and he was striving to find that. And you know he made that change from Butsch to Hank, and my statistics will tell you that he played equally as well under both of those coaches.
And just to add to that, Steve analyzed that particular sort of phenomenon in a way that I've never thought about, and it's actually one of my favorite sort of parts of the book. There's not really an anecdote, it's more analysis in that Tiger actually needed that challenge, as like he needed to give himself an obstacle to be able
to move forward. It was almost like, you know, be where the injured golfer be, where the golfer going through a swing change, and he needed to constantly take one step backwards to be able to go two steps forward because.
He enjoyed the media.
You know, Steve told me this, and I don't mean to put words in Tiger's mouth, but Tiger really enjoyed media criticizing him and for why he would make a swing change when it had just won the ninety ninety seven Masters or it had just completed the Tiger Slam, and he enjoyed that having that chip on the shoulder to wear around as like, well, not only do I have an excuse for playing poorly, but I actually had something that's driving me to succeed because everyone thinks that
I can't win, you know, more majors with a swing change, But I'm going to go out there and prove them that even with a B plus swing, while I'm perfecting it to A plus, I'm still going to go out there and beat everyone with my B and C game. And it actually gave him this kind of challenge that it was almost like he had reached a level of perfection after the Tiger Slam. I would never accuse him of being bored of golf given the level that he achieved, but he kind of needed something else to take his
mind off the pursuit of majors. And Steve describes it beautifully in the book and that it gave him like a second and a third win. You know that the change under boardsch after ninety seven, the change under Haype after sort of during the slum, it gave him extra motivation, almost like Mike wod Jordan taking you know, perceived slides in the NBA and using them as fuel. It was a lot like that with the swing changes. Wouldn't you agree with Steve.
One hundred percent? I mean, there's no person I know that's played golf that likes the challenge like he does. And that was. You know, when you present yourself with a challenge of making a major swing game, what that does is keep you one hundred percent focused on working as hard as you can to be the best player you can. And it's very easy to get comfortable in golf.
We see it all the time with players, and you wonder they get to a certain level and then they just, you know, they don't they don't continue that trajectory upwards. They just stay flat for a long period of time. And that and he one of his ways for him to continue that unbelievable upward trajectory was by making a swing change and then working ultimately as hard as he possibly could to get that swing change into position where he could win major championships. It wasn't you know. I mean,
it's amazing. His mind is so different to anybody else.
You know, that constant us to continue to improve. Would you say that's you know, in all your years on tour, is that one of the big separators with Tiger to everybody else besides just the sublime talent?
Look, yeah, I mean there are an enormous amount of players that have talent just like Tiger's got a lot of natural talent. And a lot of talent that these derived from incredibly hard work. But you know, you're absolutely right. I mean, it's just that that's just the way the man is, and that's Harry. You know, that's Harry went on to be such a great player, you know, that drive to get better and work and put a new swing on the table and make it work.
Has there been a player that's come along since Tiger that most reminds you of Tiger Woods?
Well, I mean I think when I look at Rory, I find him to be a very very gifted athlete, a guy that works extremely hard on his game, and he strives to get better all the time as well. And he works very, very hard, and he's physically very you know, he's like Tiger from when he came on the tour to now. His body formation, in his physical
you know, presence is right up there. And yeah, you know, I just admire him as a player, and you know, like everybody, we just hope that he can get over the line at augusta join that exclusive Grand Slam club and then perhaps he can make a significant run to add to his major tally. But you know, when you take the time to write a book like this with Evan, and you see how successful Tiger was in the record that he had in the major champ So, you know, and you see someone like Rory who hasn't won a
major since twenty fourteen, he's an unbelievable player. It just shows you how difficult it is to win major championships. And I think during that time, you know, Evan's a journalist, and you know, and all the people that me and or even that they got to the point where they just expected it to be him to be in contention and major championships with a chance to win. But it
certainly wasn't as easy as that. You know, it's not as easy as he made a look, and you know, you've got guys, like I said, like Rory has in one month since twenty fourteen, and that proves how difficult it is to win those major championships.
I thought. I mean, it was just kind of fascinating. When you're reading the book.
You know, you guys got off to a little bit of a slow start by Tiger standards, and you know, you you expressed some level of worry about, you know, how getting out of the blocks, and then next thing, you know, it's like you're reading the book and it's like, oh, they've won seven of the last eleven Mabors. Do you is there a particular part of the run that you go back and think of? And Evan was, They're a particular part of the run that you most enjoyed hearing about.
Yeah, I've got to say, Sonandrews, like it's just a special place in all of our hearts really, but like I was just blown away by what Steve remembered twenty five years later, the fact that you know, a little bit of a swallower, but he, like Steve, Steve cadded for maybe the greatest golf it's ever been played, complete the career Grand Slam, using a yardage book that he drew by hand, because he didn't like that, you know, like the kind of stock you know, mass distributed, which
was probably a very good yardage book, but that all the caddies he's onto it.
He didn't like that.
A lot of the foreign caddies didn't like the way that was mapped out because they had their own preference. The fact that Steve went there a week early while Tiger was off playing the most incredible golf courses in remote parts of Ireland just their history and you know the fact that sonandrew is and the way that Tiger dissected that it was truly I don't know if anyone's played a golf course the way it was designed to
be played then Tiger Woods the Sandrew's in two thousand. Yeah, So I think that's the favorite part of the Slam for me. I don't know about you, Steve, but and Andrews is always different. And also for the fact that you finally were a major championship winning caddy at Saint Andrews, and it was something you had dreamed about since you walked up that eighteenth that s Andrew's with Fanny Simison as she carded Faldo and so for you that was a personal goal.
So I enjoyed hearing.
That that side of the career Grand Slam as well.
Yeah, the Open Championship is, you know, I view it as the greatest championship with the greatest golfing event there is. And to be able to walk up that eightyenth hole twice with Tiger, you know, and both times, you know, he's not like he's not needing to make a power or Bertie to win the tournament. He's got the tournament under control. It's a pretty special walk and the way that he played around there in two thousand was, you know,
was incredible. But you know, if you go back to the US Open and the you know, the first discussion we have following his signing a scorecard at the US before the presentation, that is, you know, obviously the little bit of banter about what happened with the golf war situation. And then the next thing he said to me, Steve, I want you to get your ass over to St. Andrews. I want you to know that golf course like the back of the hand, because I'm going to play even
better than I did here at Pebble. And if you were to asked me, Andy, which tournament was the greatest taunt Tiger played? Was at St. Andrews in two thousand. You know, at Pebble Beach there was a triple bogie on the third hole there, and there was a couple of shots that you know weren't as good. But at San Andrews, just as Evans said, he just dissected that course and played unbelievable. And another fond memory of the Open Championship was actually at Hoylake Tiger not played the
course before, and we arrived there on Saturday afternoon. We hadn't got to the house for two minutes and Tiger's pushed me out the door. Get down the road, get to the golf course, Steve, go and have a walk around before I'm going to play about you know, four o'clock. It's like, man, you get to go and have a sleep. How come I don't? So, you know, I go to the golf course and I walk around, you know, pretty pretty at a pretty quick pace, and then have a
get a good feel for it. Come back to the house. We have lunch, and I sit down and I said, you know what, Tiger, I reckon. If you don't hit the drive around there, you're going to have a very good chance. The bunker's a penal. Your iron play, my statistics will tell me at the moment that your mid to long iron play is better than it's ever been,
which it was, but by my statistics. And for him to take that on board and play a major championship without hitting a driver and win the tournament, that was a pretty special week. And you know, I think other players were just like, Wow, this guy's not hitting a driver, and look where he's hitting it and he's still beating us.
I feel like when you look back at one of the biggest things that Tiger and the way he played golf has left an imprint on the game was the way the way he strategized and the way you guys strategize getting around a golf course. And I think so thing that's been popularized in golf has been the idea of avoiding hazards at all costs. And at the Open, you guys went out of your way to avoid bunkers at all costs. There it's the most penal bunker. It's
effectively a shot penalty. The idea of aiming down sides of fairways as opposed to right down the middle. Steve, what was the was that a team kind of building into that or did Tiger have some of that before you got on the bag?
What was the strategy?
And kind of take us behind dissecting a golf course with you guys.
Yeah, Look, I mean when I first out killing the Tiger, you know, right at the beginning of ninety ninety nine, he certainly wasn't in love with his driver. He was he was not driving the ball good enough to win major Championships right at the start of ninety nine to nine. So you know, there was a lot of thought when I'd go out and measure a golf course and I'd just start looking, you know, on a hole in that okay, so you know, you can't hit it on this side
and that, and you've got to favor the side. And so when when we play courses, I always would say to Tiger, you know, you know, when you got on the tea, you just favor a little right here, or just favor a little left here. And he would know exactly why I was saying that, because obviously there's trouble on the left and that. And you know, when you go around these Open Championship courses, if you take the bunkers out of play, you eliminate the double bogie generally.
You know, there's so many double bogies made during the Open Championship because you drive it in one of these fairway bunkers and sometimes you've got to come out backwards or you can't even advance the ball sometimes, and you know,
it brings that double bogie factor on the play. And you know, the less double bogies you have on your card, and a major better chance you got a winning But it was just the thing that we you know, the strategy thing to developed very quickly because I was very aware that, you know, whilst he was you know, obviously very long off the tee, he could be very wild
off the tea as well. You know, as as a swinging proven its confidence improven, and also as the equipment improved and so forth, he got better and better at driving the ball. But you know, when you hit the ball, you know when he was playing, and you know through that Tiger Slam, and that he was the longest, not the longest player tour, but he was the longest of the best players on tour, and he had a distinct advantage and one of the biggest attributes that gets overlooked
a Tiger's game. He's the best player out of rough ever, there's just no question in my mind. No player has had the skill and the strength and the ability to control the ball out of the rough like Tiger did,
and that's something that gets overlooked. He's got many, many great attributes of the way he's played the game better than others, but that's the one that stands out to me is just his ability, you know, and the iconic shots that everybody will remember is obviously a pebble beats and you know on the path up and over the cliff on of the green, and the famous statement that was heard around the world which became renowned was, you know, Roger Malby said, you know, it's just not a fair game.
You know, like that was I think it was one of the all time great statements by a commentator. But you know, when you look at that shot there, there's no other player can dig that ball out of that ruff, get it up.
You know.
The strength and ability to play out of the rough was extraordinary, you know, whether it be from two hundred yards out of eighty yards out there. I mean he could hit short shots out of the rough around the greens, pitch shots, you know, from forty sixty eighty yards around the greens, and the control on them was just you know, he was amazing how he could He had the strength
and ability to hold that club face square. You know, we all know when you're playing the long ruff, I twists very quickly the hands that the ruff just wrapped around the club face and't it. But his ability to play out of the roff is something that was hugely to ranges.
All right, let's take a quick break.
We have a new podcast on the Frida Egg Golf podcast network. It's called The mix Bag. It is our own Meg Atkins and Matthew Galloway and they talk about women's golf. This is a I think, a great new addition to our network. If you're into l the LPGA, you're into women's golf, check this out. It's on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts from. They do a great job so far of covering the sport. They've had some great interviews and it is on you know,
second episode, so you can go check that out. If you are into LPGA golf, this is going to be the podcast to listen to.
We were really excited.
It will be a weekly podcast and we are really excited to see where it goes. So Meg covers women's game for us and Matthew Gallaway is a former LPGA caddy, most notably caddy for Michelle Wee so very connected to the game. He's I feel like he's just got enough distance from from caddying where he you know, he can He's still connected but can provide takes and insights. So check that out on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your your podcast, it's called the Mixed Bag. All right,
let's get back to Steve Williams and Evan Priest. When you talk about I'm always fascinated about like golf IQ and I think Tiger has you know, I don't know him personally, but from all you know reports like this extraordinary golf IQ. And you've been on the bag for a number of great players, whether it was like reading the lie, understand understanding the wind, understanding like what little nuanced aspect of Tiger Wood's golf brain do you think about the most.
Yeah, the one thing that I thought was amazing that he did so when he's playing with other players and you'd get onto the green or you get around the green, he would play out in his head that that player is going to make that part, so that when that player made the part, it's not like, oh wow, I'm two shots behind, now no I'm one shot behind, all wow,
how did he make that? Or you lucky mother? He played this out in his head so there was never any surprises, you know, Like you know, you often watch a player and that two guys going head to head down the streets and that and one guy makes a bomb from fifty feet and you see the other players reaction. You know, it's just it's that slight moment of well, wow,
how did that just happen? But you never ever saw any change in emotion when Tiger was playing with an opponent and he chipped in holder shot that because he played that out in his mind and that's the way he thought. A great way to analyze that was when Tiger was playing in the Canadian Opening, and I believe
that was in two thousand as well. During that street he faced that bunker shot from the eighteenth hole out of the fairway bunker over the water in that and Grant Waite was on the green, so in his mind, he Grant's on the green for two, cutting for three. In his mind, he's played out that he's making three, so I have to hit this ball on the green and make no worse than four. So it was his thinking was absolutely incredible, or not incredible, but different to other players.
Avid, was there anything that like from like the little things that stood out to you as somebody who's covered the game for so long.
Yeah, I think, first of all, from a personal standpoint kind of like we all have built up Tiger in our minds to be this winning robot, and you know, he just achieved things that we don't think are humanly possible, mentally possible. And he was actually a really caring, kind
of thoughtful guy behind the scenes. And probably of all the players that Steve caddy for, he can recall no other player really shaking his hand and saying thank you after a round like repetitively four times a week, fifteen twenty times a year, and never faulted, you know, just by how bad or good he was playing. And the second thing was I loved learning about that kind of like body language and the dynamics between Steve and Tiger, which really.
Comes through in this book.
Apart from revealing new anecdotes have never been heard before, it's more analyzing Steve twenty years later, like why did you guys work? And Steve referenced the famous seven nine out of the rough at the six hole Peple Beach. But what Steve told me that kind of blew in my mind was after about a year together, he realized that Tiger was a quick player.
Which would go a long way today's game.
And so Steve, that's actually why Steve marched thirty yards ahead of I always wanted that as a kid. Go was a big fantasy is at Ozzie Key where, you know, kind of like an idol, And I was like, why why does he walk so far ahead of Tiger? What
is the reason behind that? And in the book, Steve reveals that he was like just trying to get It was quite stressful cutting to Tiger, as you can imagine, and he just wanted that extra you know, ten to fifteen seconds to think and process what Tiger's about to do, predict what Tiger's about to do. And just before he hit the seven eye and at Pebble Beach, Steve looked at He said he would always look at Tiger's eyes
because that would tell Steve his intent. And he just would pick and choose the moments where is it worth an argument? Is it not worth an argument? And Tiger has just had eyes for the green over the hill. Steve knew he was going to try. There was no point arguing, so he quickly thought, Okay, well, if that's what Steve Tiger's going to do, how do I give Tiger the information he needs to execute that shot the
best visibility? So he looked at the lie and he knew that, all right, it's going to be a seven eye to get over the hill. And the fact that Steve was so intuitive it kind of like ends the argument who's the greatest caddy of all the time. I don't know if anyone had better caddy instincts than Steve. You know, I just to look at Tiger's eye contact and he's intent.
Where is he aiming? Is it a fifty to fifty?
Is he going to lay up? Could he be convinced to lay up? And the fact that Steve was onto that after less than twelve months together, it blows my mind.
I think one of the things that stood out to me was the prep the idea of knowing, Like I think it came through in the Saint Andrews part, where like if Tiger's going to ask me where I need to hit it, I need to say, without without a moment's hesitation, this is where you're going that hill right there, if the winds this way, I need to know this is where it's going. And I think that's like, that's what you want from a you know, a caddy. Is that confidence that like if.
You can, if you can answer every question that comes your way with a certain amount of confidence that it's very you know, that's confidence building for the player, absolutely, and that's what makes good caddy is someone that's incredibly confident in their ability and and there you know, their willingness to put their own cells on the line and that.
I mean, it's very easy when you're canting for a guy and you're coming down the stretch in a major and it's getting very tense in that and the guy says, oh, you know, I'm going to hit this club here, And even if in some caves won't agree with that, but they'll say yes because in the moment they don't want to be wrong either. They don't feel like they want to be the reason that at the end of the tornent, you could look back and say, well, you know, if he had spoken up, that could have cost me the
torment that. But yeah, just been able to read you know type just readers, or like Evan said, just the eye contact would tell me. You know, I didn't have to ask them. I just looked at his eyes. I mean, it was quite a remarkable thing. But once again, you know, I go back to you know, the statistics and that and I'd write all these things down now, every sort of thing. What mood was he in today? How is he walking? While he was in that mood? Was he fidgeted?
Just I wrote so many things down, and that every time a situation arose after a period of time, I knew exactly how he would react, what he would do, and just you know, it's continuation of writing things down.
Was there a particular player that Tiger would get up a little bit more for if you guys were around the same spot and the leaderboard going in a weekend, and what's a good example of that playing out?
I mean, there's no question of who that person was. Left he mister Phil Michers said, there's no player that he would get up for more. And look, whilst they weren't the gravest of mace, he had unbelievable admiration for Phil's game, and he knew competing with Phil at the same time, when Phil got over the line and won his first major championship, it wasn't going to be the
last one. And if he could be the guy there in contention every time when Phil's trying to win one of them and possibly prevent him from his first and keep that one win as lot away as long as he could, you know. So yeah, there was he absolutely every time when that you know, when he was playing with Phild, there was going to be there was going to be the utmost concentration.
Was there a particular when when Phil was there that you think he took the most satisfaction from?
Well, there were there were surprisingly how few times over Tiger's career they were appeared in the last round of a major.
But as as an Ernie fan, I like to point that out very often as a big ernie.
Guy, Yep, yep, absolutely, But look I mean look as a as a funny or not a funny thing. But Tiger won the Darrell Open, which was the Ford Drell Open in two thousand.
So when you got your car, and.
You know Ford was a film Phil was with Ford at the time. And yeah, I had a great pleasure in a bit of a laugh when Tiger gave me the keys of that forty g And some time after getting delivery of the car, and the next time I saw Phil after I've taking delivery of the car, said oh Phil, it's no good. You wouldn't have fit in it anyway.
I just had heard that.
I heard this last week actually and I you know, like as the caddy inside the ropes and somebody that caddy for other great players. You had to see what Tiger's presence did to other players. I heard just last week that during rounds of golf the only time ever Ernie Els chewed gum was when he was paired with Ernie Els. As someone who was on tour before, did you is there memories of guys seeing someone just do something that you would normally never see just because of Tiger's presence.
Yeah, look, I mean, you know, one of the things about becoming such an accompliss player and such a fierce, fearless player and a fierce competitor like Jack Nicholas. You know, just the mere presence of a guy having his name on the leaderboard would make make players you know, Okay, here he comes again. It's going to be difficult to beat him, and sort of thing. Look, you know, you
wouldn't know and ever would know. And any time you go to a tournament and there was a roar and it was for Tiger, it just had a different sound to it. And obviously he obviously attracted the biggest galleries. But even when you go to somewhere like Augusta and there's the same amount of people on every hole watching and that. But when he hold apart, the raw was different, and that was you know, that was a huge thing in your artillery to know that, you know, every player
on the course knows that's another birdie I've made. That's another bird I've made. Here he comes again, you know that. But you know, other players, it's very difficult playing with Tiger. You know, he attracts a lot more media, there's a lot more people inside the ropes. It was a lot more chaotic, but he became so adjusted to it that it was just the Norman and there's no player more focused than he is. And he didn't even see a
lot of things going on around him, you know. And I did my best job as I could, and somewhat, I guess, you know, I feel somewhat unfairly got a reputation probably that was not you know, Warrenton, But you know I tried to give him and the people that he were playing with, his playing partners, you know, a very fair and level playing field. Yeah, if I.
Could just jump in there to the previous question, I think what really stood out to me, which you know, like it just glazed over at the time, we didn't realize the significance of the first and second round rings and some of these iconic major wins. That whether Tiger was always going to use a slide in any playing part, or whether it was just like a Cinderella story that
was meant to be, it was just destiny. But Tiger paired with Valdo in the first two rounds at Hoylake after you know, they hadn't spoken for a year because Faldo criticized his swing. Getting paired with Jack Nicholas at Valhalla for the first two rounds and the only time ever during a major, and then there was there was two thousand and eight getting paired with Phil first time the USGA had done the one, two and three in
the world as the Marquis perring. That couldn't have been a better fit for Tiger to use that as a source of inspiration. And you know, often what was left in the end on the Sunday was a difference of one or two strokes and steves that describes beautifully in the book how maybe one or two of those shots
had come from the first two rounds. You know, where Tiger had had played well in front of Jack Nicholas because he had never played in a major with Jack Nicholas, or he was about to prove to Nick FOWLO, this swing is just fine the way it is. You know that he was gifted almost from above these pairings that.
Helped him get into contention, let alone with you.
Know, oh, you know, we covered that off very nicely in the book, and people will be very amazed to think that some of these little things made a huge difference, and they did. There's absolutely no question in my mind that some of the pairings given for the first two rounds of some of these major championships provided extra motivation.
And like we all know, this is a guy that doesn't need any extra motivation and if you're going to give him a little X motivation and the explanation point on that would be Stephen Ames and the World Golf Championship match play thing. So that's covered off in the book. You give guy, you give someone like him, but a little bit of extra motivation. That's not something you need to do.
Is there is there an event that kind of sticks with you as the biggest, the biggest missed opportunity. Obviously, most most situations you got in you came out on the right side of it. Is there one moment it could be, even a non obvious one where you kind of it feels like the one that got away that occasionally slips into your thoughts again.
Yea, look, that's a great question, Andy, But yeah, I can honestly tell you, in all my years of canting to Tiger, there wasn't one time where I thought, you know, he should have came up on top and he didn't. I mean I never felt that amazingly, you know, it was incredible. I mean, if you went over a highlight reel of all the puts he made on the eighteenth hole that he needed to make either the win, to tire,
whatever it might be. I mean, it was almost freaky that he hardly ever missed a part on the eighteenth hole. I mean, you look at that putty made the presents come and south after in the dark to tie the President's Cup. I mean, come on, no one's going to make that part and some of those pluts he made on the eighteenth pole at bay Hill, you know, to
win the tournament. I mean there's that one big part that he made at bay Hill, that big forty five foot of left to right that he made hold out, and I believe that was to beat phil On even. I think that was. But you know that part there he wins the tournament bay Hill, incredible part, forty five foot part with about six to eight feet to break left to right, incredible part the hole. Immediately following the presentation at Bayhill, he lived at Ireworth, ten minutes down
the road. He went back there and he hit like two hundred five irons, so I think it was one hundred and eighty. I counted because he hit a five iron for a second shot and he hated the way he hit that shot and where he left the board. He went home to Ireworth and we Australia in the range and I'm pretty sure I counted it was one hundred and eighty five lines he hit because he just he wasn't going to go to bed on the thought that the last swing that I made today was ratchet.
I'm going to go to bed. I'm going to have as many five eyes I can because I can replicate the shot. I mean, which player in the world would do that, none other than Tiger Woods.
Steve does describe in the book like a few final rounds, not necessarily shots but fine rounds that got away. And if we're thinking about that obsession to Egal or beat Jack Nicholas's record, you obviously think about three major championships, and you know two of those were at Hale's team where Tiger just didn't have his best stuff in the final round I think against Rich beaming Birdie the Last Boar and told Steve he was going to Birdie the.
Last war but it was just wasn't good enough.
Pinehurst in two thousand and five, it was a pretty pivotal moment where Tiger hit a really shitty pitchhot on. I believe it was the sixteenth hole, and he could have really put some pressure on Michael Campbell at the time,
but didn't. And then Oakmont in two thousand and seven, Steve, you sort of told me those were the final rounds that got away from him and the ones where there was maybe if you had just played as good as you know he was capable of, we could be sitting here saying that they're equal on eighteen majors each.
Yeah, Like there's always going to be those tournaments, and it's not like in those tournaments that you know there are, there's probably three of them that got away from him, but not got away, but ones he certainly felt he could have, you know, either got him to a playoff or one of those three that we mentioned. There was only one where at Pineus where we actually hit a poor shot. They were they were there were some opportunities like at Oakmon't there you know, you can drive it
on that seventeenth hole there. And you know on Sunday going head to head with Cabera that you know, you obviously needed to put the ball in a position there where where if you didn't drive it on the green you could get it up and down. He didn't. But they weren't you know, poor shots or they weren't likely. You know that there was never I never came off the golf because and say, man, that was you know, a golden opportunity to loss. He gave that one away,
you know, he never gave it away. He was like, oh, you know, either beaten by someone down the stretch or just didn't execute some of the shots, you know, as good as good as you'd hope. But you know I never walked off a major championships. Well that you know, we should have won that. I mean, yeah, I think you could have. But there's a big difference you could have and should.
Have right now.
I'm just curious if you've ever thought about how catting would be in this generation for tiger like Tiger Mania, in this generation with the cell phones, Like, how much harder has it become for a caddy? I mean, I know you occasionally your moonlight is a caddy. Now, how much harder is it with the phones then it was, you know years ago with the cameras in the Hoopla that was presented.
That well, I mean, you know, there's been a lot of talk about the art of cadding. You know, it has been greatly diminished because caddies used to used to have to compile yardage books on their own and so forth and that. But everything's given to you now and then all the players have the access to shot link and to track man and all this so that they know how farther ball goes. I mean, so the actual
skill of a caddy has been greatly diminished. And as far as you know, cadding these days compared to you know, with the say of the Tiger Mania was now, well, you know, it would be an extraordinary difficult task, you know, to give them the way you know, golf's evolved in the last you know, ten to fifteen years where there's a lot more younger people attend golf tourments. And now you go back twenty years ago and look at the galleries.
You know, well, prior to Tiger coming into the game, you know, the galleries were you know, an older generation and a more quiet reserve sort of scene. But you know, you bring players into the game like you know, John Day, Tiger Woods, Bryce and to Shamba who bring a whole different follow into the game. And I think it's great.
I mean, you know, whether it be whether you attend a baseball game or golf tournent, that you want some kind of atmosphere and some excitement, and the younger generation bring the excitement and okay, it might get a bit loud and now of control sometimes, but you know that's exciting. It brings a bit of enthusiasm and pumps up the torn I think it's great.
Last question, I want to be conscious of your time here. Is there something when you look back that you miss about catting for Tiger Woods?
Yeah? I mean you know that the pasting an ultimate goal gave you something to get up every day and be motivated to, you know, and every time Tiger took one of those steps, it was just one step up the ladder, one more, one more wrung up the ladder, trying to get to perhaps break Jack's record of eighteen majors and get to nineteen. So you know, every time when you got on a plane, there was you know,
there was a purpose. Everything was a purpose. But you know, when that dream was sort of shattered, something that you'd something you dreamt about, or put it this way that you know, I envisioned that moment when Tiger got to eighteen majors and nine and then eclipse jack record of nineteen majors. I could picture that in my head clearly. I thought about every day. Wasn't a day go by what I didn't think about that, whether it was winning
majors not winning them. I fully believed in my mind that he would get to that record and it was going to be not only, you know, arguably the greatest moment in golf, but probably one of the greatest moments in sports to eclipse a record that no one would ever going to break. And it's a shame that it got derailed because I don't think anyone's ever going to be. We're never going to talk about another player that caposso
break Jacks record. It's just too difficult now. And you know there's this you know, not that there wasn't a lot of great players when Tiger was playing, but through the modernization of equipment and so forth in the way everything is, the players have just got better and better and more confident because the equipment's allowed them get more confident, they hit the ball further, and it's just a whole
different ballgame. You know. I grew up getting in the late seventies and eighties and just absolutely marveled at players like Gary Player and Lee Trevino how they got around a golf course. When I got the opportunity to get paired with Lee Trevino and watch him play, you know, he's an absolute legend. Now he must sit back now and watch and just think, well, that's not even the same gay. You know, I'm one of the best players ever, it's not even the same game they play, and it's
not so Yeah, I think we looking for Tiger. In the air that Tiger played, not only was it fun, but it was very satisfying. In the air that they played. You know, if he had to come along. Now, the same guy came along now hit the ball equally as far and compared to his competitors, you know, it might might not have been as exciting as it was back then.
So you know, he left a great stamp on the game, and you know he enabled the game to grow, which is a huge thing to be able to say you've been able to do and for me to be part of that and say it was pretty special.
I was, I said last question, but I got to ask one of the things I've always wondered about is, you know, if technology didn't didn't advance, where would Tiger have gotten to Can you talk a little bit about what happened with technology and his peers and did they diminish anything, did it amplify anything about Tiger? And did it diminish any of his advances.
That's a great question, Andy. I mean, you know, I feel like the continue improvement and equipment probably hurt, you know, like it took away some of his advantage. You know, for sure, the guys that were incredibly schooled at being able to move the ball, to be able to shape
the ball. You know, Tiger played you know, like one of the two the biggest common thing between Jack Nicholas and Tiger Woods, the two greatest players have ever played the game, is that they when they looked at a shot, they played the shot as it's supposed to be played. If the pinners on the back right side of the green, they're going to booth the ball and left to right. If it's on the left side of the green, they're
going to move the ball and right to left. If it requires a tiger hit every shot the way it was supposed to be hit and played. The golf course of like was supposed to be playing, and that's what made it easy to dissect the course. But with the advent of the of the golf ball and the equipment became more difficult to be able to shake the ball. And guys don't even need to shake the ball now even when it's you know, the balls are so good in the wind. They just stand up and they just
blasted and they go straight. I mean, you look at how high some of these guys hit it in the wind, and you think, how can you kin have control over the ball hitting that high in the wind. But the equipment's just made it so good. So as he went along and as the improvement in the equipment came along, it took away some of as advartas no two ways about it. Would you agree with that.
Evan, Oh, yeah, absolutely, I think I think you actually raised this maybe. I mean, going back to what Andy said, one of my favorite stories that didn't make the book was I don't think we had room for the time that you said. Sergio was probably one of the most
the biggest victims of modern equipment. He came out ninety nine swing and obviously challenged Tiger at Madona, could work the ball in ways that weren't imaginable, and all of a sudden, you know that the ball was going so much straighter, the equipment was so much more forgiving and shot making that there was less of a sort of
owners on that. And Steve, you said that Sergio might have won more than one or multiple majors had the equipment not advanced to the point where he lost a lot of his balls striking advantage.
Yeah, no, I no question about it. I mean, you know, he obviously modeled himself around Savriana Bellistaos, and he was able to move the ball left to right, right. You know, he was a shot maker, and you know he's a guy that the equipment absolutely hurt. I mean, if the equipment hadn't made such traumatic changes through you know, the two thousand era, the twentieth century, I mean, you know, he would absolutely I believe he would have had a better major Telly than he has currently.
There's Adam Scott quote, another guy that you carry for a couple of years ago, where he was talking about modern strategy and he was like, I'm still trying to sort out this idea of me just hitting a driver as hard as I can is the best strategy on most holes. And if it's in the rough or if it's in the fairway, it doesn't it doesn't really matter. And I just think about, you know, I feel like
an old person. I'm thirty eight, but I think about when I grew up with a smaller head and the wound balls.
How much more it was just you had to hit the ball in the sweet spot.
Oh yeah, I mean, you know, I look back for the very first time I came in a professional toron for Peter Thompson, you know, the great Australian player that was.
That was your first first professional termament UK for Peter Thompson.
Yeah, nineteen seventy six and when I think back in the way he played golf and the way he moved the ball around a golf course to what it does now, it's not the same game. There's no question. It's not the same game. So, you know, the modernization of the equipment and so forth, it's just and that's what they do. Guys just they stand up on every team and they just hit it as far. Not every hole, but for the most part, they hit it as hard and as
far as they can. And you know, you look, you look at a course like Saint Andrews, it's an absolute architecture. You know, it's as good as a guess. But last year at the Dunhill Links tourn on the last day, if you didn't shoot sixty six you lost places. Now, twenty years ago, to shoot sixty six round there was unbelievable because you know every bunk isn't play. But now you know nine percent of the bunkers don't even play. The guys go over them. You know, the course is
just so short by modern standards. It's truly a shame how the game has got to where it is where a lot of these absolute masterpieces of golf course architecture are no longer relevant because of the distance of guys at the ball.
I you know, it was what I was reading.
I can't remember which tournament it was that Tiger averaged like three to eleven off the tee that you guys talked about. I was like three eleven in two thousand, was like, I think that was probably ahead of everybody else, and it's like, now it's like middle of the road.
I think that was Madonna.
Yeah, nine, it's it was an awesome read as someone who came of a it like came my golf love was wrapped up so much in so many of these tournaments, like where I've developed my love of golf. I can't recommend the book enough. Congratulations guys. That was a fun, fun read and it's amazing to see the stories. And thank you for joining the show to talk about this.
Well, Thanks Andy, thanks for having a song. We're delighted to be on the show. And yeah, great pleasure to be honor.
Yeah, big fans of the podcast, so it was an honor to be on and thank.
You for the kind words about in the book.
It really is kind of like a good time to reflect on Tiger at the moment, and if I may say so myself.
It's yeah, I agree, it's a really fun read. So to just taking Steve stories.
And package them for the golf world, for the sporting world, it's it was a lot of fun to write and and I hope it's as much fun for all the readers out there to be government read.
All Right, thanks again for listening to another edition of the Friday Golf Podcast. We will be back next week, as I said at the top, with some master's content. We're going to do something on augusta National I'm gonna start gathering guests for that. Big thanks to PJ Clark for editing and producing this podcast. Sorry PJ for the Johnnies, and we will be back next week.
Thanks everybody for listening.