I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset.
When I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.
And when I find my.
Ball in a brid egg Friday Egg, the dreaded Frida egg Friday Frida Egg brid.
Egg, Lie, I'm about ready to run off of the up course.
Welcome back to the Friday Golf Podcast. I am Andy Johnson, your host, and today I am excited to chat a little bit about the Ryder Cup. We haven't talked about the Ryder Cup on this podcast. Uh, obviously it's one of the huge subplots to the rest of the year in golf. We have one major left, we have the Open Championship. Our podcast will be out on as it traditionally is, before the Open, but I thought that this was a great time to chat about the Ryder Cup.
A quick note just you know, for you guys, if you're looking for a golf course podcast, a golf course specific podcast, I thought Garrett and Matt did an awesome job on the Designing Golf Podcast breaking down Royal Port Rush, so I would go check that out if you're looking for a little bit golf course content before the Major. As well as our video on YouTube Royal Port Rush preview video which we did so. I am joined today by Joseph Lamania from Friday Golf as well as Sean
Martin from the PGA Tour. One of my favorite people in the world of golf to talk golf with is Sean. Sean is the senior manager Content Development of the PGA Tour. There's a comma in there. They use commas and titles. Sean is so big. Thanks to Sean for joining. Before we get to Joseph and Sean, this podcast is presented
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at MBUSA dot com. Also, just a quick note, Ludwig in the field at at the Open will be a big factor in the Ryder Cup. He's a Mercedes guy, so check that out. Check out MBUSA dot com and big thanks to Mercedes for presenting this podcast. All right, let's talk Ryder Cup. Joseph Sean, welcome on. You get you guys. Want to give one one quick open nugget that you're excited for before we get into the Ryder Cup discussion.
Does this coount as one of our things? Is a pre thing?
Now, this is a pre thing, pre thing, This is an unplanned pre thing just off the top of your head, Ryder Cup thing, open championship thing that you're.
You're Open championship.
I think, oh, open Championship. I met We're the week before. We're still you know, this is kind of multi service pod.
Now I think big thing for me. I think in light of this pod, doing some research, it's going to be a big factor in team selection, just points wise. But then also I think Rory obviously a big thing looking forward to. I think been kinding up and down a couple months after the Masters win. But I'm sure Port Rush and beth Page or two things that are circled on his calendar, and so it'll be interesting to
see how Rory shows up for port Rush. I was talking to Paul Hodwanick on our staff before he departed for overseas, and I love that Rory and Shane last time we were port Rush really showed the blessing and the curse of a hometown major. There's like the crowd support that you get that third round. I'll never forget it. At port Rush when Shane Lowry shot I think sixty three to take like a four or six shot lead, they were were acting like he'd won the tournament. It
was an incredible scene. They're practically carry him on his shoulders. But then obviously he saw it to with Rory, just the pressure and what happened to him there without you know, getting his first t shot will be so I think it might have our conversation. It's a huge for team selection. And then too, I think just seeing you know what Rory we see rock up to the first team this year.
I totally I think like the home game thing is like it can be like a It's totally like a blessing or a curse. Like you if you get off to a good start, I feel like it's like the greatest thing ever. But there's also this element of like golf courses that you know really well, you also know like all the things that can go wrong on them, like and sometimes if you go watch like somebody that's played a golf course their entire life, I'll never forget.
I played a Usam qualifier at a golf course I'd played hundreds of times years ago, and I played one of the holes one way my whole life. And we're playing this Usam qualifier and literally I'm seeing everybody hit driver on this hole. And it was a hole that like, because I had played it so many times as a kid, I just always thought the play was like just you know, I hit it to the one hundred and fifty yard marker. Play in that way. I watch all these and it's
like it's funny every time. I've never forgotten that because then I just started hitting driver in the hole got so much easier. And it's because like you just have this like built up memory of playing a golf course and you have the way that you play golf course your whole life. So anyways, I and also then you also know all the bad spots. So anyways, that's a quick tangent, Joseph, what about you, Andy?
That is just classic back in the day, Andy playing the angles laying back. I mean, that is the most Andy Johnson anecdote that I think you could give. Learning that hitting driver makes holes easier is the perfect way to start this podcast.
You know what, I think that you are under rae the way this hole is set up. And also this was way before this is way before any of the data revelations. This was probably before Twitter existed. It was definitely before Instagram existed when this happened.
Fair enough, all right, the thing you probably.
Were You were probably like five years old when this happened, Joseph.
Who knows? Who can say the main thing I'm looking for at the Open Championship, I think a really interesting storyline is how does Scotty putt? And we've seen the return this year. He's being branded as a much better putter and he has been a much better putter. Is that like, has he truly become a good putter? Or no offense sean or the PGA Tour setups like consistent,
he's kind of learned how to put on those. And when he goes overseas to grainier, slower greens where you have to strike your putts better, can Scotty Hank can he gain a shot a day on the greens or something like that or does he finish tied for seventh and we look at it as another like ball striking exhibition where the putter held him back. I think that's a huge storyline going into Port Rush.
I do need to bring something up. I texted Andy about this. I think Scotty's open record is underrated. I think he finished twenty first in Saint Andrews in twenty twenty two. That was the year that he was in contention through two or three rounds that had a bad final round and the reason was revealed later. I think
it's the tour championship. Someone asked him about it and he had what amounted to basically an ingrown hair on his butt, A painful, painful injury, an unlikely one, but it made it hard to even pick his ball out of the hole. And bendever said to grind Through that I don't want to go into too much detail, but it's on his transcript from the twenty twenty two Tour Championship and then Royal truon last year. John Wood, who was on the ground following it, called one of the
best ball striking grounds he's ever seen. During that third round, when the conditions were awful, wind is blowing across the golf course, I said, Scotty worked in both waves in the wind to flight his ball and curve it into the wind. And then you remember he almost hold that three wood on seventeen. I think Scotty was a victim of the draw there at the Open. So I think the story behind Scotty's Open record I think I think that's better than what it looks like on Wikipedia.
Listen. I think he should be the best Open player. What works well when the conditions get went like ball striking is like the premiere. You know it's hard because you talk about like Augustin National you say the same thing, like right, but you know, there's a reason that the
best players play the best in majors right consistently. And for the open, where you can get those like really tough crosswinds and those really difficult conditions, that is an opportunity for or someone who hits the ball like Scottie to really separate themselves from the field. That being said, I think the slow greens where you actually have to hit a putt is something to watch. Per Joseph's thought is like these greens are much slower, so what you
see is like longer strokes on six foot putts. And you know, I think like what gets miss construed as skill putting is like the reality of like pro golf in America is that putting's really about just like hitting a line, and the greens are so fast that if you hit the line, it's going to go in. When you have slower greens, you have a wider range of stroke.
So you know, if you use this for a cross sport, analogy is like you know, PGA Tour golf putting wise is like a quarterback who just has to make short throws, right, It's like that's the skill when the greens get slower, you you have to make the short throws still, you have to have the short stroke putting, but like you also have a wider your stroke has to be good at at a longer level too, because you have long putts that are slow that you have to hit hard,
So your dynamic range of putting stroke is much greater. And that would be my case for links golf and slow greens illuminate more skilled putting. Just just to follow the data would say something different, I know, just to follo up.
On I don't know the data would say something different, Andy, but just to fallo up on Sean's point, Like Scotty does have a good Open Championship record, I believe we have three years of Open Championship strokes gain data. He's lost strokes putting in all of those, and he's lost strokes putting a lot of places over the last three years.
But it's not like that his Open Championship record defy as some of the narrative around him potentially struggling with the potter on these types of greens, like it has been something that if he had put well at Truon, he absolutely could have won that golf turn he probably would have won Night Golf turn.
The interesting thing with slow greens, you know, so when Scotty puts poorly, it looks like he desails, and you would think slow greens would help him because you can, in theory, just hit it a little harder without the worry of that kind of running out right, Like I think a lot of us, probably, you know, we weren't as let's say, finally tuned as a PGA Tour player, but you'd take a little shorter stroke and accelerate a
little bit more. But now I think guys are so dialed with kind of the tempo and pace of their putting stroke that they, just, like Andy's saying, take a longer stroke to hit at that extra distance on the slower green versus just you know, putting a little more pop into it. I'll at brand Snedeker, but it's interesting. I think Scotty, when he puts poorly and misses those short ones, it looks like he's de selling on them.
I almost feel like maybe on the slower greens, if you just pull a more pop into stroke to make up for the you know, less get on the greens, might be a fix. I don't know, I'm not a putting instruction This could be horrible advice.
Maybe we should get us putting instructor on real quick, see if one's available, and see if they can join. All right, let's get to the topic of the of the podcast, the Ryder Cup. Scottie Scheffler is on the American team. What we did for this podcast is we each prepared three I'll just call them storylines that we are paying attention to for the rest of the year. For the Ryder Cup. It could be European team, it
could be US team Sean. Since you are the you come in from a different organization, we'll give you the right to go first. Here. Joseph, you can go second. I'll back clean third.
Here sounds good. You know, I wish you always had Kyle Porter on here. I love Kyle, but this is just somewhere we don't agree. You know, Kyle loves the story of the European camaraderie and the motivational films and the chemistry and how it all works together. And to me, I think the Ryder Cup in this era is a
logistics contest. And I think that honestly, jet lag might be United States' biggest enemy and they don't have that this year obviously, So I think of all the advantages of being a home golf course course set up being one, I think the United States has severely mismanaged its travel when it's had long road trips recently, going back to
twenty eighteen, part of that was scheduled unavoidable. The Ryder Cup in France was the week after the Tour Championship, so literally those guys had to hop on a red eye Sunday night after Eastlake can get into Paris Monday morning. You look at the twenty nineteen President's Cup, which, if you remember, the US was down three points going to singles. They played the Hero World Challenge the week before. Obviously Tiger was the playing captain. I'm sure that had a
lot to do with it. But again they arrived in Australia the Monday of after a long flight, whereas a lot of the international team played the Australian Open the week before. And then last year you have a month between the Tour Championship and the Ryder Cup, and yet again the US team takes the Sunday night red Eye the week before or the Sunday before and arrives Monday morning and you're behind the eight ball. You're getting off that red eye flight, You're just trying to stay awake
to go to bed at a normal time. You're probably sleep walking through practice. Now you do have that extra day because the Ryder Cup starts Friday, but I think in hindsight, when you look even at player quotes, and I think even Zach Johnson's quotes later in the year, they realized that was a big mistake. The team also
got sick that week. You can't control that. But if you look at it for last year's President's Cup, it was in Montreal, so we're not talking big travel, but that team arrived the Saturday before, and they said a big reason was they learned what a big mistake it was arriving that late to a road Ryder Cup. And so I think luckily we've learned. I would be surprised if the US team doesn't arrive at the latest Sunday
before a to beth Page. You do have that month between again the Tour Championship and the the Ryder Cup, which I think doesn't work to the US advantage because the only thing in between is the event in Napa, Whereas one thing in Europe's favor is they.
Have a year you have to play that nap event they.
Have to or you either you go to beth Page and you have a three to four day team bonding practice event like the European team did last year, because I think you wouldn't take a month off before major. I don't think you should take a month off for the Ryder Cup. And then Europe they're going to have a similar thing what we saw in twenty twenty three, where they have a lot of good events on their schedule to play and get momentum and bond you've got.
You know, you have the Tour Championship, which a lot of their guys will play, but for the guys that don't make it, the British Masters is the same week. Then you have the OMEGA European Masters, and after that you have the Irish Open, which this year it's at the k Club which is a very American style venue, whereas last year is at Royal County Down. I don't
think that's a coincidence. And then twoaks for the Yder Cup, you have the BMWPGA, the European Tour, the DP World Tour's biggest event, and so I think the US gets to avoid big travel and I think learned from that, but the schedule, they still need to plan a way to hit the round running and be successful for Beth Page, which I think we saw a Royal Montreal with them arriving early, which was a conscious decision based on Rome.
But I think they just need to make sure that the week's leading in the Ryder Cup are used the best possible way that they can, which includes rest of recovery, but also includes practice and preparation.
Do you think that's something for not necessarily Brian Roll app not to derail it, like a full month off between the Tour Championship and when the Ryder Cup is historically played, Like you could pretty easily sell me that pushing back the Tour Championship a little bit kind of makes a little some sense from both a weather standpoint and there being less of a layoff between, Like playing NAPA is not the best preparation for playing the Ryder Cup.
I don't know. I'd be surprised if I guess eight years from now there's still that that significant of a gap, or that there's not a better event placed between them.
I don't know, what do you instead of playing NAPA. I think a four day trip to beth Page Is is the solution sufficient. I think it's the better option of the two. Yeah, but a month off is too long. I don't know exactly what goes in with this coordination. Obviously we saw in COVID all the organizations kind of coordinating schedules have done before. But a month off is
a long time. And really the DP World Tour has some big events between the Tour Championship and the Ryder Cup that really give an opportunity to kind of gain some momentum like we saw in twenty twenty three.
I it would be cool if they did like some sort of event at beth Page before and had like I mean, that would be like you know, you talk about like ways to make cool stuff and make the tour more like you know, approachable and different things you could do a whole like if they actually did matches that they created content around while they did these practice sessions, you know, and treated it like you know you always see like the footage of like the Dream Team scrimmages, right,
Like these things would be really neat content ideas as well, you know, I wish Paul McGinley was here to push back on the On the camaraderie side of things, I don't think.
I don't think it hurts, but I think that I think you have two pretty evenly matched teams, and I think that the advantages are in course setup and logistics, and I think those are really the difference in the Ryder Cup. I think I always say to Kyle, if the camaraderie thing was so big, you know why didn't work in twenty twenty one or twenty sixteen. Or I'll buy into the huge I'm not saying it doesn't help.
The guys talk a lot about the logistics. You know, being so well ronic gives them confidence because they don't have to think about anything. They know where they need to be, when they need to be there, who they're playing with, how to prepare. It eliminates a lot of questions. But I just I'll believe it has a humongous impact when it leads to a winning a road Rider Cup.
And actually going back to the events thing, I like what the USCA has done with the Walker Cup in recent years, where like in twenty seventeen when the matches at LACC, the USAM was like two weeks earlier at Riviera, so both teams could play. This year the Walk Cups at Cyper's Point in the Usam's at Olympic Club, so both teams can play. And so I think when you doing that where you allow both teams to play in a tournament two weeks ahead of time, they're both kind
of preparing the same. You get people they get a chance to play competitively two weeks ahead of time, and then they get to go see the venue in plenty of time. Like I kind of like that idea and that execution.
Something I had which I'll just butt in here. I'm screwing up the order, but it's my podcast, so I can do that. I thought a nice question I have, what's the best setup of Beth Page for the Americans? You know you brought up setup. Is it no rough really like short rough and you know is in softer or is it thick rough and like kind of more the PGA Championship style set up that we saw a few years ago. Or do they do what they did with Hazel team where they really like mow the rough down.
I think that's a fascinating question because in a way, the European team looks a lot more like what those prior US teams like before the turnover and that European Ryder Cup roster where they were trotting out Ian Polter Lee Westwood. You know, these these shorter, more precise players from a different era. Now that European team is filled with a lot more pop, a lot more long hitters.
I'm really fascinated as to how the US looks at course set up and figures out how they have an advantage there because this team and I think like some of this, like the back half of the roster, is going to depend on that. But they do not have a lot of like what I would call bombers on the team, don't. I don't know how you go about, like what your avenue of setting up Beth Page is with their current team method makeup.
I want to leave that to Joseph. That's his area of expertise.
I think, yeah, I think it depends on who fills out the back half of these teams. I think there's a pretty good case that Team ussays would be in their best interest is having shorter rough and allowing some of the good iron players and recovery players to potentially have a chance I don't think these skill sets are going to be that different between the teams, which is probably one of the biggest stories coming in. They have their mix of long hitters. You got Bryson, you got Rory,
You've got the shorter, accurate Fleetwood and lowry. Team USA is going to have that too with your JJ spawns, potentially Russell Henley Morikawa. So I actually don't think these skill sets are going to be drastically different, but you know, potentially speak on the team crafty iron player from the short rough like I think Bryson obviously has a tendency to bash it around and get a little errant and could be somebody you want to lean on. As TMUS.
I think there's probably a pretty good case that you want to cut the rough down, especially since they will be small favorites and I believe should be small favorites, and generally the shorter the rough, that's there's going to be less variance. So I'd probably lean as Team USA towards cutting it short. But again we don't know the full team yet.
I think you can go graduate a rough, which I know Joseph is a big proponent of, and there are some potential captain's picks where you could kind of load this team and make them a more kind of accuracy bias team. They'd be probably some controversial picks, but you know, if you really wanted to like suit a team to a corese setup style, I think you could kind of make some of your captain's picks some more accurate players
depending what happens over the last two months. I'm still a big proponent of like just pick the best players at the time or who've proven themselves over a good period of time.
I mean, that's one of the tricky things though about about the date that you eliminated with like a month off. It's like, you know, we see how much golf can change in a month, right, Like you think about like the month after the Masters. Where where we were at after the Masters, and then where we were at one month later completely different. You know, players that are hot, like you know, like sam BYRN seemed completely out of the picture for a Ryder Cup spot. Now he seems
like probably going to be on the team. So I think the I think the thing is that's tough with with picking the hot player. It's easy if it's right after the tour championship, it's a lot harder to when it's a month after and two.
I think that's where it's a little bit harder for the US team with the smaller like field sizes in the playoffs where obviously you want all you guys to make it to East Lake, but they probably won't, and so their season ends at BMW. Let's say so, they've got another week off in addition, whereas the European Tour, they've got an event in Scotland the week of the FedEx Saint Jude. They've got the Danish Golf Championship, which you know amount of candidates for the captain's picks or
some Danes. And it's a period where some guys last time in Ludwig and Nikolai Hoygard like they separated themselves or established themselves as captain's picks in those weeks where a lot of guys were competing in the Fedest Cup playoffs and if they were American they'd be sitting at home, whereas as Europeans they can go back over to the DP World Tour and play in some of those events, earn their captain's pick with their play and then join the rest of the team and go play like the
Irish Open and the BMWPGA, which the BMWPGA in twenty twenty three is huge. That European team, I think like they all finished like top fifteen, They spent the whole week together, they repaired together, and then they made a quick trip over to Rome to get ready for the Ryder Club.
I'll go with my first one then, kind of going off both of what you guys have said. I think this is a we're really putting home home course advantage to the test here, and like the concept of home versus the setup, because I do think this setup will not be necessarily favoring one side or the other like we've seen in the past whistling straights like at le Golf Nationale. Those are two pretty extreme setups and teams
with very different skill sets. Now those skill sets and the talent gaps are much closer, and I personally, like I've I believe a lot in the home advantage. And it's a cool question across sports of why that even exists. Is it because of travel, which again both teams are getting better at. Is it because of the crowd, which I do think is a significant factor. And you watch tennis tournaments where sometimes the home crowd like does seem
to boost the local player. During the NBA Playoffs, they talked about how role players tend to do better at home versus on the road, Like, where does that home advantage come from? Is an interesting question, and I think we'll get another data point around it after this Ryder Cup. Is it the better you know? Is it the back end of the roster, those guys struggle in the away crowd.
It's just an interesting inflection point the Ryder Cup and how much home course advantage matters when you have two pretty similarly skilled teams on a setup that shouldn't favor one necessarily more than the other team I say, blows out Europe, it's going to go a long way towards furthering that narrative.
Yeah, that's that's one of the more compelling aspects of this year's Ryder Cup. I think that you laid out is that we've seen this like huge advantage to the home team to the to the point where like after last Ryder Cup and after France, and you know, there was discourse of is should this exist? Should the home team get to set the course up because it's causing these blowouts and there hasn't really been like if you look,
the Ryder Cup hasn't been very close. But this year, I think like the makeup, I always go back to that Whistling Straits one where it's like, oh, the US is going to win the rec of these forever and you looked at like the European team and I think like one of the stories out of that was like the the next wave of European players is actually continental europe player European players, and you're seeing that come true and their power players and they you know this this
team looks so much different than twenty twenty one, where like the team, the type of player is very similar, and it it's just you know, this is this is the year, and you know, I think like something you can you can pull on off of this is like the US team has so much more to lose than the European team, and if they lose this, like it's going I feel like we're going to have another situation of like what do we do to fix the US Ryder Cup? Like that's gonna be the discourse if they lose.
I think twenty twenty three was a wake up call, like I'm going back to the travel thing. Like I think you look at post twenty fourteen Ryder Cup, the task Force Air you can call it, and the US had won six of seven team matches entering twenty twenty three, and that was like they dominated in twenty sixteen a Hazel team, twenty seventeen Presidents Cup they almost ended on Saturday twenty twenty one Ryder Cup's record setting, and I think that twenty twenty three was a real wake up
call for them. And you know, Jim Fierrich talked after the President's Cup last year of like it was the players who decided to get in the Saturday before at Royal Montreal, and I think that's new of like players,
you know, they're very protective of their time. When would you hear of a guy saying, oh, yeah, let's get into Saturday before before And so I think and then you saw a lot of the usual pairings I think kind of get disrupted at the President's Cup as well, like they were, you know, Scotty and Russell Henley paired together. Well Sam Burns, I kind of wrote tongue in cheek
like in the story I wrote that day. But like Sam Burns, who's from like small Town, Louisiana, paired with a couple of Californians in like Calinmorre Collo and Patrick Cantlay Like it's guys that maybe he normally wouldn't And I think that I think twenty twenty three was a wake up call that like they were on such a great run that I think they thought they could show up Monday morning, it'd be fine. And I think now maybe they realized that that that's not the case.
All right, Sean, what's your next thing?
My next thing, I think is the back end of the lineups. I think Joseph when he said it about role players in the NBA Playoffs, I think, I think, I don't know if it's gonna be one on the
back end. I think the Ryder Cup format does force your back end of your lineup to be a little bit more useful because you have five matches in three days, and so you know, basically playing all five is anathema nowadays, so you're gonna need to use It's not gonna be like nineteen ninty nine where Andrew Coltart and maybe Yarmo
sat until Sunday. And so I think I think both teams like their first eight spots are set, and I think that really it's the back end where I think there's a lot of questions marks per usual, and I think really looking at Europe, I think that their last three spots. I was looking at names and there's really no one that I think pops out of, like this guy's definitely on the team named to fill it, Whereas I think I can make a decent case for nine through twelve on the US team.
Are you not including Rose? Are you not including Rose?
In that he was he's on like my candidate's list, but ever since the Masters, he's played pretty poorly.
I I had, so one of mine relates to this, and we can just lump this together. I had the European I think there's only one spot on the European team.
Wow.
So I wrote down the names here and it's like get when you when you have a question, like get to me, say like no, Rory Fleetwood, Terrell Hatton, Bob McIntyre, Shane Lowry, Sepstraca, Ludvig Abert, h John Rahm, Justin Rose, No, Victor Hovlin. And that's eleven. Maybe Rasmus. I have Rasmus, who's seventh in points.
I think Rasmus is a question mark.
So that's I had ten. I had question mark around Rasmus. It's like, I think though where he is in the points. He's seventh, seventh in points, but.
He hasn't he has no top tens this year. I mean I have nine guys. I have all the guys you named except for Rose. I have as a maybe. I mean Roses twenty three in the world ranking. It's built on two incredible finishes runner up finishes at the Open last year and the Masters. But since then he's played horribly. He's played really poorly. Plug your ears. But Thomas Deetrie has a win but hasn't done anything since then.
I'd like to point out that University of Illinois great Thomas Deetree was not listed.
I think, you know, I think Rasmus probably gets on the team and that gives you ten. But then I mean you look at their their points list. You know, Roses ninth, Matt Wallace is twelfth, Jordan Smith is thirteen, Nicholas nor guard and then honestly, I think Rasmus Nierguard Peterson I think could show some stuff in those couple weeks. I think he's honestly like you're Ludwig of this year for them.
I think I think I think R and P is probably their best choice for the twelve guy. If I was gonna pick one, just based off of like what I watched him at the US Open. I'm really impressed with his game.
I think interesting follow up on both of those. Nierguard Peterson excellent driver of the golf ball, which will be at a premium. The biggest knock is that he has done almost nothing in strong fields. He's a T twelve at the US Open, and outside of that, there's there's he was playing Challenge Tour for a lot of twenty twenty four. Like, there is not much to point to
on his resume. He's other player I think that we haven't mentioned that we should is David Pooge, who, despite being on Live and you know, we don't see him as often, he's an excellent driver of the golf ball and he's shown some promise too. Why I'm bringing both of those up together is that at the BMW International last week Luke Donald played with one of them. I
believe I believe he was. Yeah, he was paired with David Pooge and then Dodo Molinari was paired with rasmusnierguard Peterson, So I do think those guys are on the radar. And them being paired together, which I know that they have some influence in being able to weigh in on, I think is evidence that they're looking at those guys.
I mean, just one other name, one other name we have not mentioned, veteran major champion Matt Fitzpatrick, who Sergia has shown some life. He's got two top tens, you know, and he had a good finish at the PGA.
You know.
I think a goal you know, Quail and Beth Page aren't are actually fair comps. So that would be one that I would just I would just put on the radar. I mean, if they wanted, they wanted to go experience. I mean that team when you look at it, if you if you have Rasmus is in the eleventh spot and Fits is twelve, that is a team that's got some like real bona fides and.
Fits is showing some signs of life and switching to Mark Blackburn, So that is an oversight probably on my part. I think he's trending in the right direction real quick. On David Pooge, he better from here on forward. Be reference in the shot and start is David Puige Gyasiel's brother. I want to make sure that's a guarantee. And then there are a couple young players at the top of the race to Dubai. Like you look at Laur Cantor
is third in race to Dubai. He played well enough this year to at least crack the top fifteen in the world ranking and has a candidacy. The people in Europe are very excited about Martin Kouvra. He's in a feature group this week at the Genesis Scottish Open. And then you've got Christopher Wright hand another one of those young kind of continental players. I was fifth in the raceist Dubai, so maybe some outside candidates.
Do you think Kevin Waugh will be able to play on the on the on the international team at mcdona, No, you.
Don't get to pop bunkers.
When I was a you or Brandon had said when someone told you it was Patrick Waugh and not Patrick Roy, that blew their minds. I remember that exact moment in my childhood as well. I was like, I don't understand how that doesn't make sense.
It's just to I guess not necessarily Tiebo, if we want to keep going. But I think if you made things, if you stop things right now, I think Matt Fitzpatrick would be in my top twelve. He's trees trending in the right direction. And I think Justin Rose similarly, like those are guys that you expect to show up. So Fitzpatrick's results from one are.
I would be astonished, you know. I think, like I think Justin Rose probably could miss every cut the rest of the year, and he's on the team because of his his track record at Ryder Cups. I mean, you're talking about like a legend who almost won a major this year, and like I think, like you've seen him be able to just like flip the switch.
I beg it was one of major last year.
Yeah, real quick to former Mighty Ducks goalie Gee Abar. I don understand how it wasn't Guy Herbert but Gieber.
I guess I'll just go off this then, since we're talking back.
In the teams, I think the fun thing is both teams are gonna have to like bypass some guys on their points list, which is gonna be fun discourse.
I think that's kind of where I'm going with my second one. I think the Patrick Reid discourse is going to be all time fun if he has a good finish at the Open Championship. That if he doesn't have a good finish at the Open, it's not that strong of a candidacy. If he finishes top eight, top ten, outperforms a lot of these other guys on the bubble, you have to consider putting him on the team. And that's where so many of these conversations are gonna unfold.
It's gonna be about the boys club. It's gonna be the opposite of the Justin Thomas discourse in twenty twenty three. We're gonna learn about who has the power in the locker room and does Kegan Bradley have the goal to extend him a captain's pick. That conversation is going to
be very, very fun. So I think that's one of the most fun things to watch for with the Open Championship generally, in this Ryder Cup, do they even consider Patrick Reed And you know, obviously almost won the Masters this year, was in the mix late just one on liv If he finish his top ten at the Open Championship and you're not considering him. I think that's pretty crazy with the.
With the US roster. Sean, you mentioned eight guys locked in, Joseph, I think you said something so much.
Yeah, I think seven the top seven I lost, nine are.
Locked, nine are locked.
You just I'm just going to run down the list. You guys where I'm at with eight, and you guys agreed disagree. Scottie Scheffler, Xander Schoffley, JJ Spahn, Russell, Henley Bryson, De'shambeau, Justin Thomas, Colin Morikawa, Keegan Bradley is can't Ley locked in? Yes? Yeah, so that gets you to nine.
He was like my very first of my next level.
So I say eight, eight or nine, Sam Burns could get you to ten.
Yeah? Yeah. And then I think, I mean, honestly, I think Ben Griffin ate. I think Barring just falling off a cliff, maybe literally a port rush and injuring himself like is a lock. I mean the guy that his MC at the Deer ended a run of six right top fifteens, which was a TA at the PGA, winning Colonial runner up, a memorial and a T ten at the US opening that span. Now, obviously there's a lot of time left the lock and change. And it's interesting too.
You know, you had that quote after Oakmont where Adam Schreiber JJ spond swing coach said like, oh yeah, Keegan told us no rookies are going to be picked. They have to make the team. But then today on golf we dot com, Keagan refuted that and said he did not say that. So I don't know.
That's what I was gonna say. If there's no rookies outside of automatic births, you know, then then p Reid maybe bumps up.
What about I mean, what about if Brooks does something in the Open?
I think that I don't think that Brooks is even Yeah, I guess like, yeah, that's yeah. I had that same thought though, as like if he finishes third at the Open, I.
Think you need to give him a little more credit than that. Even though I'm not super inclined to pick Brooks, I think he does. He's in the mix if he finishes fifteenth at the openin's T twelve at the US Open. Like I wouldn't be super inclined to pick him, but I think he's probably pretty squarely in consideration. Having won five major championships.
Won the PGA at Beth Page obviously, you know course history does matter per read.
You know who else won at one age talking about one.
Of FedEx Cup event.
Before that, Beth Page, Wait for it, Lucas Glover.
Lucas Glover.
It's not crazy consideration, but it's not crazy.
I mean he's top thirty in the vetex of he I mean if he makes it the East Lake and some guys don't, I think, like, look, you don't have to pick it based on one week. But he's had some flashes. He's an incredible like driving accuracy guy. If you want to build out some foursome teams around it. Look, the two thousand nine US Open was wacky as far
as like the draw was insane. Ricky Barnes said the US opened thirty six whole scoring record, like Tiger finished I think fifth, and he won his side of the draw by like three shots. Because it's just a total draw disparity. So I'm not advocating for the two thousand and nine US Open a factor into the selection process, But like Lucas is having a solid year and brings like a very particular skill.
Set, I am advocating for sixteen years ago to have a heavy influence on what you know, Ricky Barnes, maybe we should be considering Ricky Barnes.
I think, though, what you we're all touching on is that this ten to twelve spot is really up for grabs. We haven't even mentioned Maverick McNeely, who has a strong case. He's finished top thirty five, top forty in all the majors this year, has some really good finishes outside the majors, a couple of thirds, finished second at Tory like, he has a decent candidacy, and that's where this next month is going to determine how they round out the back
end of that roster. Spief is another name where he he's he's withdrawn his most recent finish, Like is Jordan Speed healthy? Like I would put him on the I'm inclined to put him on the team. But the back of the spot's ten to twelve, or if you want to call it ten to sixteen, Like, there's a lot of discussion as to who's occupying those spots right now.
I do think with mav I got to think high correlation between success at Tory pines at that page black and he finished second of the really get off the tea, Yeah, Genness is there. He finished fifth Memorial, which is I feel like a quasi major. And then you do have a guy who's coming off back to back fourth place finishes, who's known as a generational driver of the golf ball.
On New York's own Camon Cameyon, A gun to your head. Who's your back end of the US roster right now?
I have I'm not gonna go down the points I had, Ben Griffin, I think, Keegan. I think we haven't mentioned Harris English. He's tenth in points. I think with another solid two months. He was on that twenty twenty one team toy. They wanted Tory, and then Patrick Cantlay and Sam Burns round out my team. Yeah, it ended right now. I don't know exactly how many spots you picked there. I have nine as locks, including Russell Henley and Keegan Bradley and a lot of those names you mentioned Andy,
including Cample. My final three in right now would be Sam Burns, Jordan Spieth and Ben Griffin, and then subject to change with the Open Championship. I do think that's an opportunity for people to really move in and out. The thing was stif he's gonna be one of those guys who he's gonna have to do some work to make it to East Lake, and I mean I think even you know, make the top fifty. And so is he a guy who if he is.
Don't think forty spster's exemptions into east like.
They did not. Yeah, he's forty six in Fedest Cup points. So like, hypothetically a guy who doesn't eve qualify for BMW and then you make him a captain's pick after missing, like sitting out for two events, and it's hard, I think, to pick a guy, you know, even if other candidate, you get into this quasi thing where it's like, do you then hold it against guys who play in those two events but don't play well over a guy who was sitting at home and you know, didn't have to
play in them basically a time, I mean speed. Obviously, he finished third at beth Page in twenty nineteen with like gaining ten strokes on the greens, so I wouldn't really it doesn't feel very replicable. But at the same time, I think the thing with beth Page is the greens are like really flat and it's possible to do it. It was kind of like the deer if you look
at the stats from the deer last week. Guy's tons of guys racked up just huge weeks on the greens, and so I think if there is a place where you can rack up strokes on the green is probably best page because the greens are pretty flat.
Yeah, I don't know. I struggle.
I don't He's not on my team right now, but.
Well I do that if you're arguing that, wouldn't you like what about Denny McCarthy.
Yeah, he had I mean Speed is in like he's in what I call Missouri. He doesn't show me categories. You know, he's in the show me state.
One thing Speed has going in his favor, just that we haven't hit on, is he is a much better driver of the golf ball than he's been at most points in his career, like consistently driving the golf ball very well. So I think there's still question marks there. If it ended today, I'd take him. But if he doesn't show up at the Open Championship for a couple of weeks, he misses out on the playoffs, like he's not in.
Yeah, for me, I think you almost go chalk points till ten and then you then you have can't lay and Burns at fourteen and fifteen. That feels to me like nobody's gonna yell about who you picked Harris, so be Harris English Ben Griffin and then you have can't Lay and Burns at fourteen and fifteen. I think like
Cam Young's Cam Young. If he plays well in the open, which he has played well at opens, like he he's a bona fide major championship player, like all of a sudden, then you look at it and it's like, well, he's played played really well at Oakmont, played really well to open, and like it almost feels like you'll have to take him.
Honestly, Burns too has been in the mixing majors recently. I think he was second going to the last round at Troon and then played poorly ten nineteen and the PGA this year and then t seventh US Open, which really until the rain delay, looked.
Like it was his.
You don't love her.
I'm one of the biggest Cameron Young supporters in the world. I think he needs to show he needs to do a little bit in the next month to be a serious, big Cameron guy. You are.
One of the things I heard anecdote I heard about about what was going on at the end of Oakmont, which you know I was curious about, like, you know, why the water was affecting certain guys. More is like the ball was effectively like hydroplaning, and if you hit a cut, all the guys were just hitting it where they on their start line, but the ball just doesn't move because of the water. And that's why you know Burns hit that shot way left right. Is that the water.
It's like basically they you know, uh, the all the guys that hit cuts like and just they struggled coming down the stretch.
I think I'm not a scientist. I don't have like a guy spirting my golf balls and putting on a launch monitor. But I mean you do have less friction I think on the face when it's wet. What that means. I'm not going to I don't want to go there. I don't want to look at the comments.
If I try to explain it to say, I feel like I'd be over my skis too. But JJ Spahn, it's a nice cut.
I know.
That's the thing that that I was wondering if there's like something about the way he strikes it that's just like different than I think like he does compress it a little bit more than like a Sam Burns.
Sim Burns is not a great ball striker, that is true.
So I don't know, just an anecdote that you know, I threw in there. Last things I've already used all mind, So.
Sean, go ahead. I'm trying to we you know, as per usual, kind of zigged and zagged out of a lot of things.
I can go if you want me want of you go.
I just try to see what's still in my notebook.
An honorable mention was Ben Griffin playing a Max Fly and does that impact people in the future if he gets left off the team because he plays a Max FID to more people just you know, go into the accoushnet family a serious one. I think the Team USA captaining and how the narrative changes around the advantages that team you're up just being a much smarter in game
decision maker. They've always handled the logistics a little better, as you've illuminated, Sean, but especially with potentially Keegan as playing captain, the question of how competent Team USA is and should Keegan be a playing captain? How all that unfolds.
I think it'll be a There are going to be a lot of sweeping declarations made after this Ryder Cup as to a Team USA understands what they're doing, and I think some of those things the optimal pairings, that's a big one, right, I have more confidence that Europe's going to do that properly than Team USA. I think hiding people in best Ball and four Balls is another huge thing, and you get to see kind of who Europe, who they acknowledge, are their weaker links, Like, does Team
USA do that appropriately? And how do they make decisions once the competition starts, right, once you see how people are playing. I feel like that's a big area where the smart captains distinguish them. So how they make decisions once the competition starts, sticking to your game plan versus adapting to information as it comes in. So watching Keegan navigate that potentially as a playing captain, I don't know,
are you leaning on people like Kevin Kissner? Respectfully? I don't know how much I trust some of the vice captains a Team USA.
So I think on this one this was a cluse. I think I think it was like a half thing. I had Eduardo mon Auri thing kind of fascinates me. I think, you know, Luke has always been super data driven, Like his assent to number one was kind of the first success story for Stroke's game. Like him, I pact oss really leaned into the data to help Luke kind
of optimize everything. And obviously he was teammates with Eduardo on the Ryder Cup and you know, contemporaries with on the European Tour, but Europe had that great run with a different kind of data consultancy, And was just the fact that the Ryder Cup was in Italy last time, like just a little bit that pushed Eduardo over and got him into the team room versus like that other group, and then it's turned into this huge success story or is that just a quick incidents that I wonder about.
But I do think there's so much belief in in Wardo and the data because so many guys use him for their personal game, and so they know him as a player, they know that he can speak the language. They trust him from like both the qualitative side of having that player's experience and the quantitative And I do think like the hard thing with data is to sell people on it when it gives counterintuitive findings like that's the whole thesis of Moneyball, Like you literally had a
best selling book and movie about that. Like people have trouble buying in when it goes against their longly held beliefs. So I think there's a huge advantage with Eduardo because guys trust him. On the Keegan side, I actually think the Keegan captaincy. Here's my positive been on and why
I think it could be a good thing. When Fierich was talking about the President's Cup last year and like his picks, like he admitted, like you know, they get to Paris late, he admits, like his decisions are coming into late to last minute, and he's like this time, like in twenty twenty four, when the picks were made, we'd already like set our parents, like we knew our teams and we made our picks, like which I mean the way he said it made it sound like a
break from standard operating procedure for the US. If Keikan is gonna be a playing captain, like it forces them to stick to that of like we need to set these teams weeks ahead of time, so we're not making decisions on the fly. And so I kind of like Keegan playing of like cause I think what's going to get the best out of the US team, Like, yes, you can have marginal gains and kind of pairing guys
up with you know, the right statistical matchups. I think the bigger thing, frankly, is just getting those decisions in early so guys know what they're doing. Like the US especially, I think their players are very routine based. I think a lot of the like discourse we've heard of, like unhappy players in the last few maybe Ryder Cup losses is like too much stuff happening last minute and too
many like wild cards or unexpected pairings or whatever. So I think, honestly, if the way the US plays best, I think Europe they have high belief, Like the culture helps, the numbers help, They've high belief in that and they feel like ready to go and they feel like their team has put them in position to succeed. I think the way to get the US players to feel that way is just tell them ahead of time, like this is what you're doing, this is when you're doing it,
go out and like and do it. And I think the predictability and setting that framework is the way to get the best of the US team. I think he is a plane captain, kind of forces them to do it.
I think the tricky thing with like presetting it is we see this like weekend week out on tours, like some weeks you just don't have it, And like I think there's like a lot of over analysis with the Ryder Cup where it's like some weeks, like you know what, like seven of our guys kind of played like dogs this week, and that happens on tour week in week out. We see that like what happened? I just played bad?
Then you b laid out too, Like, hey, you two are going together, but if one of you stinks like you're playing with this guy, these are backup plan or plan B.
That's like where I think like that it's identifying hot hands is so important, you know, and identifying who is like the guy that would be leading the PGA Tour event if we were playing this week and then riding that is like a very underrated aspect of the Ryder Cup. Is like not sticking to your guns and being like this is like we are going, you know, is like maintaining some flexibility something like that. We all agree that Keegan's on the team right now, I'd be like shocked
if he wasn't how much does he play as a captain? Like, does this like make him?
Is he?
I couldn't imagine him going out twice any day. One of the things that's unique about Keegan is I think he like pairs well with a lot of different players because he he's just a professional ball striker. He hits the ball really well. He has for twenty years. He's been like a very good in his limited Ryder Cup, President's Cup, He's been very good. Does it does him being a captain put a cap on? You know, he played, He's gonna play three matches or two matches.
I think you think he hits the opening t shot.
I mean, there's all this politics too to him playing like I I just I'm shocked that the US put themselves in the situation where they have it.
I think you put him in the Friday and Saturday morning sessions, maybe first up, first match, and then he has a chance to play, and then he has the rest of the day to play. I think if you put him in an afternoon session like then you're just asking for chaos because he's out there playing, he comes back in. You got to get the you know, teams in for the next session within I think an hour of play ending, and it's just a scramble, and so I think you put him out in the morning. Honestly,
it's kind of like a high school golf match. Your coach usually you know it goes out and plays ahead of you, but you, uh, you put him in the morning. You put him on like the first match, and then he has the rest that he plays and he has the rest of the day to kind of observe and make picks and with assistant captains and set pairings and all that.
By the high school golf coach goes out and plays in the morning before you do.
Yeah, or the coaches the usually I think when I played the coaches, the coaches, I think played like the middle group was the coaches. So you had like four groups of players and the coaches and the like. That's all they did. I mean, like they weren't sitting on part threes picking clubs for you.
One thing.
And I think going back to the team thing, I think like we love because it's the one time in golf we get to kind of nitpick like roster building decisions and play like sideline GM. But like the reality is twenty of the twenty eight matches are basically a guy playing his own ball. Twelve singles matches, eight four ball matches. Like, yes, you can coordinate guys who birdy different types of holes and have different skill sets, so you're not you know, you're hamming and egging it. You're
not overlapping birdies. But like, in reality, like the majority of the matches are guys playing their own ball.
I think that's a very good point with all the core spit stuff, like the one guarantee is that you're playing the ball on Sunday, right, And the foursome I think interestingly with Keegan, you're saying he should play in the morning. He's a good foursomes player. So the hard part you think that would make some sense.
The hard part there is us traditionally wants to go out first with four balls as the opening session to get a lead. Right now, you could be saying, like, lead it off with foursome's you know, take the pain. If you can split the opening foursome session, that's really momentum on your side.
But well, like the other aspect is like what if Keegan goes out and he's your best.
Player, He's also your oldest player, so.
Well not if they take Lucas Glover.
That's a good point.
You know, I have disappointed in there's been noe Brian Campbell this course multi time.
That's your thing, that should be your thing.
He's not in the Open.
I think spot.
You have won multiple times and not even be in the top fifty in the world ranking is.
Something like, I wonder what Luke Donald and Dodo if you pressed him, how much would they pay out of pocket for Campbell to win the Open Championship next week?
Has that? I mean, I think in Wardo Molinari's played as many majors this year as Brian Campbell.
Guys that are just just being I mean, he brought it up.
It's a great story. I mean, I like, like, I love the story. It's a great story.
I was.
I texted you I wanted the Lipski Campbell. You know, playoffs just an old school Big ten matchup to you know, teams in leather helmets just playing smash mouth football. Northwestern.
Northwestern shouldn't even be considered like ten team at this point. Play played basketball in a high school gym.
Also, Brian Campbell played has played all the first three majors and Ward only.
Played the open.
At the end of this He's getting into the open too. As of now, he's they got like six spots and he's like third on the He who knows is camp is Cam Davison.
I don't think so, Nod.
It's tough guy. He's never going to play an open.
I think this is again though, this is illuminating how Davis Thompson is probably not going to be on the Ryder Cup team. We haven't even mentioned, like right, we never even mentioned what happens if he goes on around the next few weeks, like the back end is up for grass.
We know it's also okay, hear me out. This could be wild. But like saw Hith has been injured much of the year, Saith comes back healthy. No, now he's been out for a month with an injury. It's a big lost. I think it's a bigger he didn't. I think it's a bigger loss. It's a big loss for decent size loss for the US team.
There's a better chance that I'm on the team than I did want to know.
I was at the twenty nineteen PGA at Best Page, and I think that you know where they drop fans off matters, but like that Page is a tough course to get around. Fan wise, there's gonna be like eight hundred thousand people there, don't get me wrong, but like nine nine is like your first spot from the clubhouse.
And I'm very curious see how they like disperse fans because you have that section of like one I think fifteen through eighteen are on one side of the street because it's the story of like Keegan at Saint John's, like they would play on Mondays when Bethpage Black was closed because they'd sneak on a number two across the road. Like, I'm very curious to how they disperse fans to get them like evenly dispersed, because the distance from one tee to nine green is out there.
I don't know if you've heard the first t is good atmosphere.
I've also heard Bethpage Black is an extremely difficult golf course.
Do you think they should even evenly disperse the fans or should you stack them on the high leverage holes and really moneyball it.
Well, I think they should rope off the holes that they think don't matter.
Yeah, yeah, just rope them off.
I think one of those latter holes have like limited viewing around the green, like just because of topolicy.
Maybe some hospitality sent definitely. All right, last question that we're done with this podcast. If you're going to predict a winner right now, who you got?
I think it's the United States. I think the home field thing, the home course I think matters. I think that the trend continues. I think it's just enough of an advantage to kind of tip the scales. But I think it's I think it's the US team.
I think it's Team USA close. I do think that this is not going to be a blowout. Think we get a close one. I think both teams will be pretty prepped and optimized, and the home course does matter, as Sean's illuminating. I also think TUSA has trended a little better in the last couple of months than Europe has, like Straca's fallen off a little bit, and some euro Rory isn't playing as well as he was at the
beginning of the year. So I would say fifty six USA, and I think they win by like a point or two points.
I'm uh, I'm taking the Europeans. I think that uh. I think the US has a lot to lose and uh. And I think if the Europeans, like I think, they fit the golf course really well, uh for the first time. You know, they did not fit the last time they came to America with whistling straights and uh, I think then it puts if they can keep it close, then there's just so much pressure on the Americans to win, because if they don't win, then it's like tear it
all down. You know, we might see we might see like Tom Thibodeaux as the next captain of the US team.
Of the US everyone plays five matches, do you have Thomas Ditrie scoring the winning point?
You know with d T d TRIEU D Tree could win this week. You know at the Open he's played, He's actually played well at the Scottish On's the scott Shopen. He's on on the team. All right, Sean, you got any big projects coming out?
I'm actually on PTO this week, taking time out of a little home staycation to do this podcast.
How much I want to get on you, haven't you?
No?
I think you know, I think we got some stuff around East Lake and kind of year or two of the restoration. I think it'll be fun with that golf course is having grown in a little bit more, they can kind of utilize some more of kind of the fingers and plateaus and angles that Andrew Green built into the course. I think year one obviously, when you're restoring golf course in one year's time, like it's pretty fresh
and new when when the tournament comes back there. So I think year two will be fun to watch, maybe kind of utilize poll locations and stuff a little bit more with east Lake, But that's kind of next on my radars. It's definitely our playoffs, Joseph.
You will be in Northern Ireland excited for you to go over there, and you'll have a lot of coverage on the website. But thank you guys. This was fun and we'll chat soon. Thank you, all right. This this episode of Friday Golf Podcast was produced and edited by p J. Clark. He was cheering on every time the name cam Young was mentioned, as I mentioned at the top. We will be back later this week with h with Billy Billy Horschell uh previewing the Open Championship. Name that
I feel like the American team is sorely missing. Now that I say that, you know, we haven't edited. We haven't recorded yet, so there's always subject for some recording melt down to happen. You know, I don't want to usually don't like to jinx myself, thank you for listening and UH we'll see you at UH. With Port Rush coming here open last major of the year, I can't believe we made it here.
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