The following present is Del Marvis Studios Production. Welcome back to truth seekers from around the world. It's time for another edition of the Flat Earth Files. I hope this podcast finds you well. I hope you're having a little better whether than we are. We've got snow Tuesday, another couple evnches coming tonight. The chickens are not pleased. The chickens are not pleased, but we'll
continue on. I hope everybody had a great week. We have a very special guest standing by Liza, who will be joining us in just a moment. Before we do, just a couple of housekeeping notes. Don't forget the website. It is theflatearthfiles dot com. You can leave your thoughts in the forum, you can say hello in the chat room. Our phone numbers posted there in case you wanted to call the studio or reach out to me.
All that information is at the flat Earthfiles dot com. And of course, if you would like to join the show like Liza is tonight, you can send us an email the flat Earthfiles at gmail dot com. And again that is the flat Earth Files at gmail dot com. Without any further ado, let's bring on our very special guest for this evening. Joining us tonight is Liza. Eliza, how are you doing tonight? I'm doing great, George. Thank you so much for letting me have this opportunity to speak with you.
For sure, and you have a very special connection to the flat Earth community. I'll let you explain that I do. I do. I am married to a flat earther, the fittest flat Earther, as he likes to be known, and I yeah, I mean that's my connection pretty much to the community is that I have been fully engulfed and exposed to all that is truth and I am trying to find my way through it as the spouse of someone who is new to the community. And of course that is Tyler who
joined us. I forgot to pull it up before we got started, but he joined us several months ago. And of course most people who have seen flat Earth Banjo his work. Of course, I think he does most of his stuff on TikTok, right, he does. He's big on TikTok. He does have a following on Instagram as well, but he's much bigger on TikTok. And again that is fittest flatter. Yeah, there you go,
Tyler, And I think it was episode eighty five. I want to say, and I'll on bed that in the in the show notes as well. So go ahead, introduce yourself to the audience, and let's kind of start the journey of you know, your husband, who you see go through this huge transition which so many people, you know, we've actually even had people in the show before who have wrote these kind of books how to get through
these times because it is such an emotional transition. You're not the same person when you enter this phase of truth, if you will, you're definitely not. So again, I am wiva, married to the fittest flatter there. I'm forty four years old. My husband and I've been together for over twenty five years, so since we were babies, basically just out of high school, so we have been each other's first love and only love for that entire
time. So him finding his journey to truth was very uprooting and very challenging, and I'm happy to say that we are in a stronger place than we ever were before and that it is possible to come through it together when one person is seeking so much truth and another person like myself, is more resistant, And yeah, I really am here just to share my experience as watching the challenges that he's gone through, the challenges that I've faced with it,
and hope that we're able to help somebody else who maybe goes through this in the future, and maybe you two down the road can kind of write a book, you know, a survivor's God, a survivor's guide right to the truth, because it changes everything your perception, how you watch movies, how you watch TV, and if you would. By the way, I can't believe you've been married for twenty five years. You look like you're thirty at the most. Well, I appreciate that, but I will tell you that
I was very lucky. My wife was very receptive to the truth, and we've been together for twenty five years and kind of similar on when we come out the other side of this truth, it was definitely stronger, and we also made some bold decisions that I think we wouldn't have made before, and that includes homeschooling and things of that nature, because when I went through the deep part of the truth dive, not you know, everybody talks about the
JFK and the moon landing like even that the quote enormoist of normies, you know, will are willing to have that type of conversation, but when you get into flat Earth and a lot of these deeper things, it's a game changer. So I guess the first question I should ask you is, you know, when he first started to go through this, was it I'm trying to properly put this in the right perspective, So I guess what was the one thing that happened to him that made him like, oh my gosh,
how we perceive reality is not as it seems. Sure, So I think for him this has been something that has been inside of him for many, many, many years that maybe just didn't bubble to the surface as grandly as it did in the last year. You know, he definitely questioned nine to eleven years ago, and it was kind of a sensitive subject. As you can imagine, many people were affected by that in one way or another. So the topic of questioning where all that came from, who was behind it,
and things like that people didn't really want to talk about. And I think for me, I was always open to the idea that I don't know anything, and I'm okay with saying I don't know anything, but I think that I'm sensitive to other people's reactions, and I was always kind of like, I respect what you think and what you feel, but like, let's not maybe share that because people are sensitive and I didn't want to send to others. But in the last let's say a year and a half, our
marriage was actually on some rocky ground. We had been through a lot in twenty five years, and we went through a separation in twenty twenty two and took some time apart, and I think during that time we had some really deep conversations which were good. And one of the things he's always shared with me is that he felt like he had this deeper purpose and he just hadn't
found what that was for himself yet. So fast forward months later, we're back under the same roof navigating still our relationship, seeing if things are going to pan out for our future. And we have four dogs at the time, and then we lose one and then our next one is on his way out the door, and Tyler is the primary caregiver for this dog and has been for several years doing everything that this dog could need and not do for
himself. And I would say in about April of last year, it was the last couple of months of life for our dog, and Tyler really started to dive into like near death experiences, people who had come back from that, what their journey was like, and we were starting to watch them together, and I was supportive in the beginning. I was like, this feels like he's trying to make sense of everything. He's trying to come to terms. And I was like, I respect that, and however, he has
to get there. So we would watch some of those things together. He'd watch someone on his own, and then while I watched it all unfold in front of me, it still feels like it almost happened over night, and like I missed something somewhere. But he went from that on the rabbit hole with the pyramids and reptilians and all sorts of different things, and then it was kind of like I didn't know where to go from there. Right,
this is like completely new territory for me. And I wasn't sure what being a good wife meant at that point and what was the right thing to do and what wasn't the right thing to do. And that's kind of where the struggle began. Interesting And again a couple of things to take away from that. You know, when we lose someone close or you know, we add our bagel for twelve years and it's devastating, and I think we all go through a bit of transition and self searching and you know, exploring when we
have those types of things. It was the same for me when I lost my father five years ago. It's you get into a very deep reflection and I guess there is a kind of you know, what is my purpose here right? And what will I be known for when I'm when I've moved on.
The Other thing is, you know, when you're having these type of conversations you had mentioned, you know, now might not be the time to bring up these certain you know, whether it be a dinner party or you're aut with some friends, you know, like, really, don't bring this
up that that is something I struggle with all the time. And whether it be I'm at my sister's house and they have the big fantasy football party or it's the big family event or whatever, and like there's the perfect intro for me to mention something, right, and it's do I really want to bring that up and just be the ball and chain of the party, because you know, I've tried these things in the past. Do you put your head down and keep trying, or do you just try to be because again,
every situation is not the same. But you know, as passionate as I am about how I perceive things, at the same time, I realized that because I've tried before, people aren't really ready for that. So I think that as a truth there a lot of people can understand that when is the appropriate time to bring these things up right? And that is something I'm sure
Tyler deals with a lot as well. How do you perceive that? I mean, I agree, I think I was younger than when the nine to eleven stuff came up, I think, and I would like to stay I'm matured since then and become more accepting. It's interesting because at the beginning, you know, I was like, what's the big deal? So he has different opinions and different views on so many different things. But like, that's what makes the world interesting, right is people can have different perspectives and thoughts
and views on things. So in the one sense, I was like, I'm okay with this. Then there was you know, we have our surrounding community of our friends and family who we have been around for twenty five years and lived here, our whole lives, and you know, it was like I would never say, don't be you don't represent yourself for who you are,
because that's the person I married. Whether you change today and you're different, like it's still to you and these are still your thoughts and ideas, and I value you as a human being and I want you to be you. Like if I don't, I shouldn't be with you, Like that's not fair. But it was challenging because you have these conflicting things going on, like I have his family, who he again is so passionate in everything he's ever done in his life and flat earth and truth is no different. And
he came in very hot at the beginning. It was not this flow, steady burn of like let me show you like one thing this week or whatever it was like. And I wasn't a part of this because I was living under the same roof and I was hearing him talk about it, but like he wasn't messaging me and texting me and sending me every video he found because I was right next to him most of the time. But our friends and family, we're getting the rapid fire text messages of all these videos, all
these things. And then I'm getting the phone calls like should we be concerned? Is everything okay? And my initial response is why would you be concerned?
Like how is this any different than any other aspect of life? And then it goes to you go out together and like you said, watching movies, everything you do is different for him, and we go out and it's like the air no fault of his own, almost gets sucked out of the room because people who we don't see every day but are getting in the text messages and things want to mirage him with questions and want to prove him wrong and say something's wrong with him. And then it's like are we out with
friends anymore? Or is this like an interrogation? And am I even in the room anymore? Because you just kind of get swept the background. So it was definitely challenging. And all of our relationships just like one or two, but all of our relationships in our life, whether it be with our friends or is family in particular, are completely different now than they were eight
months ago. Yeah, I'd looked at his very first email he sent me on July eighteenth, twenty twenty three, and you could you know, I remember to this day reading that email and you can feel the energy coming from the email. And he's always been We've had seventy one emails back and forth just since j yeah, since Jillight. And it's both ways because you know, he's very passionate and they're I feel his frustration because again, I have
a friend. We've been friend since nineteen eighty three, so it's been like forty years. We've been friends since our sophomore year of high school. And that guy could talk about you know, Elvis Presley and led Zeppelin for twelve hours at a click. And then I bring up something that I'm passionate about.
And sometimes I'll even go light and bring a little lesser things because listen, flat Earth is one of the big It's like it's like getting hit with a rock on your head and people they look at you and they say, are you okay? Did you hit your head? Did you smoke a little something before we met up? And it's just it's frustrating because we as truthers understand the impact of the truth, like who really is running things down here and how evil the earth really is and how you know, Satan you can't
create anything, but he deceives. He deceives and everything is such a big deception. And you know, when we come on that knowledge, because I went on a two week trip, like when I when I came on to flat earth, I was, It completely changed who I was. And again I was excited with the information, and like Tyler, I was going to my friends and family like thinking that they would be blown away and excited to
hear these things. And nothing could be further from the truth. Yeah, and it's really unfortunate because he, like you, like you said, he was so excited and really just like has always been the most compassionate, empathetic, like loving and caring individual out of anybody I've ever met. It's why I was drawn to him at such an early age and why I knew like right away that he was going to be my husband many years before we got
married. And everybody has always looked at him in that light. Nobody's ever
looked at him in a different light. But with that being said, all of this happening, unfortunately has put blinders on a lot of people, and unfortunately it seems that like the people that he loves the most and cares about the most is where he struggles the most, and that's really hard to watch, and it's really hard to know what my role is as far as a support system for him, because I want to go to battle, right like, I want to fight everybody and be like, don't treat him this way,
don't do this. But at the same time, he's a grown man and perfectly capable of defending himself. But it is a hurtful thing to watch, especially from family. Yeah, it is, and it almost you become at least for me. I don't want to speak for Tyler, but for me it became someone who was almost like living with a secret because I have put these things out there before, and when you get that reception where you're just immediately shut down, I feel like I can't be myself because these are
the things that interest me. This is my passion, and I want to have these conversations and all my other family members have the opportunity to talk about those things that they're passionate about. No matter how trivial that seems to me, I still give them the platform and the interest. When they tell me about their new TV show that they found and I say that's you know, that's cool, and I tell they tell me the plot there's this new show
called Like Them or They or something. It's just the hottest thing. And I just listen to people and I say, that's that's cool. But if I turn around and say, you know, hey, you want to hear the truth about you know, World War two where the Gulf of Talking was a lie or any of that stuff, they just crazy Uncle George, and then just you lose reception. It's very frustrating, and I think most of this is due because of this matrix that was created the thirteen years that when
you go through school where you're taught not to question everything. You were told what to believe. Right in fourteen ninety two, Christopher Columbus Sale the Ocean blue and everything else, and you're just supposed to trust and accept it. They just don't teach critical thinking anymore, which is something we implemented here at
our homeschool a couple of times a week. Simple things like you have one hundred dollars, go online to the grocery store and you need to come up with two weeks of food, or you have five hundred dollars, you got to get to Los Angeles, go on travel lot, just little things to just kind of provoke the mind, not just you know, a B or
c that kind of thing, because that just doesn't really bring creativity. And it just breaks my heart to see people who aren't willing to think outside the box or even listen to these type of things because they've been trained to believe that way. I fully agree with you. You know, it's interesting because
I always thought that I was an open minded individual. And you know, when Tyler first approached me with everything, I was like, I'm so accepting, I'm so tolerant, Like I can be around anyone that believes anything and as long as they're kind and caring in their approach, like I'm down for it. But I realized as this journey has gone on, like I wasn't open minded at all, Like I had a completely misconception, a confused idea
of what open minded was. To me, open mindedness was acceptance and tolerance, And in reality, that's not open mindedness at all. That's tolerance, and Tyler has brought me to see that, Like open mindedness is the willingness to say, you know what, Like I have my beliefs, I have my ideas, but I'm willing to challenge those and I'm willing to accept the fact that they may not be correct, and that there could be another version of this out there, and that mine may have been wrong all this time.
And I think I'm much better about that now. Like again I said it earlier, I'm definitely okay with saying I know nothing and anything is a possibility and I just don't know. But it's very difficult to stay in that place and to continue to be open minded when you have outside forces. Are friends, for example, you know, they look at me now and they're kind of like, has he like brainwashed you yet? Has he brought you
in on his way of thinking yet? Like they don't like outright say it, but it's like you go out to lunch or you see a friend and the conversation is usually well do you believe in plat Earth or what do you think? And like do you agree with him? And then you know his
family's perspective is really upsetting. That one is still you know, Tyler played football for many years in high school and a long time, and they're very much so like, is this CTE is that it's a brain tumor and they haven't really let that lie yet, And that puts a lot of pressure on you as a spouse, right Like, on the one hand, you're like, I'm supposed to be supportive and by your side and do all these things
with you together as a partner. But then you have this outside force saying, well, on the one percent, the one percent chance that something that they're saying is true and that they could be right, would I then feel all the blame, which I would if they're right and something was wrong with him? And many months ago, that's where I struggled. It was everybody's saying he's sick, there's a tumor, cte, a mental disorder, something. And then I'm like, well, shoot, I'm the one that lives
with him. I'm the one that's here every day, and if I'm missing it in six months from now something catastrophics, I will own that and be like, oh my god, why didn't I listen? But as the journey has gone on, I'm like, no, I'm the one that's here every day, and I'm the one that sees the transition. I'm the one that
listens and participates. And I've actually listened to quite a few of your podcasts, which have really helped me hear other people's stories and things like that, and I'm like, I feel like if our family and friends were to open themselves up to hearing more people that have gone through similar journeys, they would recognize this is not like an isolated thing. This is not someone who with
mental disease or someone who has a physical disease. This is truly about someone who goes through a life changing experience and goes on a journey of truth seeking, uncovers a lot of truth, and then gets to where they get to and you come to the understanding like a person can't go through all that, discover all the deceit and lives that they've discovered, and come out the other
side and be the person they were before. And I'm good with that, and I understand that, and I love and accept my husband for who he is today, and the person he is today is the person I want to be with. But so many of our friends and family are still like waiting for him to go back and hoping he will go back, and trying to find a way to make him go back, And I'm like, that's never going to happen. And until they come to terms with that, their relationship
can't move forward in a positive direction. You know, that's a very important point that you made. Is you know that they jokingly say once you go flat, you'd ever go back. But on top of that, once you take your journey to the truth and you see these things, there's no going back. This has been me for the last decade one hundred percent. And you know, the more you research, the easier you discern the type of
lives. Like you know, you're told as a child, if you work hard and go to college, that you could be president of the United States. What was the headline today, Michelle Obama sneaking into the race. You got people from the same families, the Obamas, the Bushes, the Clintons that are running that are president of the United States. But you think that Steve from Iowa, or George from Delaware, or Larry from Nebraska, whatever, you be president. These you know, these people are selected, not
elected. And that is one of the biggest example I used to people who get worked up and that this is another divisive topic. Right, it's twenty twenty four, it's an election year, and you saw how deviceive the country was four years ago, and it's just part of the old playbook. And we you know, the truth or slash critical thinkers. You know, we see these things and we know what's coming. And the same people who laugh at us get all excited about MAGA or riding with Biden or whatever it is.
And it's just how do you not see that they're all on the same team and we're the ones who lose all the time. And it's just one example out of thousands to say, stop believing in this show that they put on and again there's no going back. And it's hurtful to me when I hear things like that, the relationship he's gone through, and hearing things like does he have CTE? Because I've had that mention to me once or twice too, man that I adem us to really, you know, scramble to
his brains. I've heard that before too, and that's not the case at all. And it's very frustrating, and it's, to be quite frank, it's it's rude, and that's being nice just because I have a different belief from you and most of these people we will tell you. You know, they'll cite the Constitution and freedom of speech, but if if that speech goes against their beliefs, they'll automatically put up they don't want to hear it. So it's really it's a catch twenty two. It's us. It's sometimes it's
maddening to be honest with you completely. And you know, Tyler also being a teacher puts him in an uncomfortable position as well. Right, Like we were having this conversation today with the freedom of speech and stuff. It's like,
you do have freedom of speech to an extent. When I was looking at different things, say, like everything's really geared towards protecting the school system and protecting what they want people to think and believe, and doesn't really protect the teacher, like you know, his social media and stuff like that, Like he's sharing his beliefs, he's sharing what he finds to be true and what he's passionate about. And you know, really they could pull the plug
on him at any time with his career. But you know, he has to decide who he wants to be a person and what's important to him, and I think he stands true to that, So I mean, I support
that completely. It's a little scary at times, you know, with him being the breadwinner of the family, but I don't want him to be someone he's not and he would never ask that of me, So I just, yeah, I find all that to be really interesting but also very upsetting, just the way that the world works and that people are okay with that. Yeah, I was very I'll never forget waking up a few years ago and having an email from PayPal and it said, we've shut down your personal account,
your business account. You need to take the PayPal logo off your website because you know, I did an episode on Blackrock and they said you're done. And you know that's what I used for donations and things like that, and that was you know, of course, the the prideful part of me is like you know, I was. I served this country for twenty four years, and part of the lie I was told when I was over in Iraq for all that time was, you know, I was defending the constitution,
so you know, where's my freedom of speech? And that's really when I got punched in the face and realized that that that's just another another big lie. And you're right. We saw doctors lose their license if they spoke up against COVID. We've seen so much to get canceled over the last several years, and people will still look at you in the face and tell you we live in a free country. You know, we have that document that tells us we live in a free country, but if the government doesn't abide
by it, then you should probably realize that we don't. And there are we're in a time now where you do have to be careful. But you know, I feel like Tyler the same way. Right you have to stand toll in your convictions, and if you want to make change in the world and you believe in what you say, it's really hard like to just keep your mouth closed and sit on the sidelines, especially when you see everything that's
going on in the world. There's so much you know, there was probably as much evil back in the seventies, eighties, and nineties, they just hit it better. But it seems like in the last decade or so they're not hiding it anymore, and we live in a really upside down society. Would you agree with that? I do agree. I think there's a lot
going on in the world right now. I often say this to Tyler, and I'm like, I'm really not sure if it's any different than it's ever been like for all I know, especially with him huncovering so much truth and different things. For all, I know this is the way it's always been, but because neither one of us was ever looking before, we just didn't have the privilege or the lack of privilege to be it right in front of
our face. But yes, I mean I go through all the different things every day and I'm like, this is really blowing my mind just how much is happening at once. And I do think that for me that was again another reason I struggled with Tyler's just like truth is this number one thing in life, and whether it was about the world truth that he's come across in the last eight months, even before that, truth was always the most important thing to him, And for me, I value truth, but I value
love and ki above it. So when this all started taking place, I was like, I'm pretty uncomfortable with some of the stuff that you're trying to share with me, and I find some of it to be really evil and dark. And while I want you to share with me the cool, interesting things, I'm not sure I'm on board with learning all the darkness. And I know there's evil. I don't just like shut a blind eye and be like there's no evil, but I'm like I don't know that I want to
know every single thing that's evil, and I still struggle with that. But again, for him, it's like truth is truth, and he's like, I'm not going to not look at something because you think it's evil or because somebody else says it's evil. He's like, I want to know the darkness so I can find the light in all the things. And that is an area that we struggled, but we've made a lot of compromise on and we've
worked through. But I just I don't know. I think that that could partially be why so many people are resistant is because so many people struggle with mental health and different things and they don't want to rock that boat. And I have respect for that and understand that, but at the same time, I think that you can't not allow the people in your life to be who
they are. That's a great point and it's important. The two things that you mentioned is compromise, because anytime you have a relationship relationship with someone, compromise is very important. And I completely get it because you know, when you're going down the rabbit holes, some of them are very very dark,
very very dark, and they're hard to un see. As well. One thing I wanted to ask you that I haven't really asked you yet was what was that very first conversation like when he kind of explained flat earth to you? Well, he went and looked into flat earth, I want to say, maybe many a year ago. You know, there was that Netflix documentary that came out The Law Yes, and he, you know, watched it
and was like, oh, yeah, No. I tried to get on board with that because I'm an open minded guy and I just couldn't get on board right. So I knew that he was looking and then honestly, by the time he came to be a flat earther, my initial reaction was, what's the big deal? My initial reaction was I'm not surprised. You've dug up everything under the sun in the past several months, Like, why would one more thing that happen? And how is this any different than anything else
you've tried to share with me or shown me. And on top of that, I did the totally unallowed thing and I googled it, and I googled and said how does one become a flat earther? And the response I found rings so true to who my husband and was like usually there's a marital issue going on, or some sort of life changing circumstance going on, or a loss of a family member, and I'm like, well, here we are.
We were separated, we're still kind of navigating that. Here we are we lost our dog, a terrible loss for both of us, but especially my husband. And then it was like and then they're seeking something to hold onto. So they go and start looking at things in rabbit holes and finding truth, and they discover there's a lot of deceit in the world, and I'm like, yep, right in line with what's going on here. And then it was like and then they get to flat Earth. Then they can't
discern that that's not true. And I was like, interesting, that that's the one thing that they put the stop on. They have no problem admitting the government has lied about almost everything and saying that your person uncover all this truth and the government is liars about everything, but that this one thing is true. So I took it with a grain of salt, and I was like, all right, who's to say that. He told me before Googling.
He's like, don't use Google. Google's going to tell you what they want you to think of flat Earth, there's and all the things, and I was like, don't tell me where to do my research, let me do my thing, let me be me. Yeah, but I still I was like, all right, I'm not just going to take Google's word for it, but I'm like I shared with him. I was like, the story adds up, so like it's not a stretch for me that there's something else that you believe you're being lied to about. But again, I was
like, I don't get why this matters so much. And it took him saying it over and over again to me on why it mattered so much for me to really get it. And I've always been a believer in God. My family grew up Catholic, raised me Catholic. We say grace at every meal that we have as a family together in my family's home, and you know, they all go to church and my grandparents go to church every day, like it is a thing for us. My relationship to God was a
little different. Matt Tyler and Tyler's Stanley I always thought was big God believers, but like they were not the church going unless it was you know, funeral or wedding, and so I kind of had my own relationship with God privately, and you know, would do praying when I prayed, and didn't really have it in our marriage so much. But when Tyler became a flat earther and explained now that he knows God is real and that this has changed to me is I was like, well, that's that's different. Like I'm
on board with this. I like that we're like coming together in this. I like that you have found God in your own way and all right. And I think that made me more receptive because that was like, wait a minute, I'm finally seeing that there's a positive coming from all this versus all the turmoil it's causing in every direction. But like, if you found God, to me, that's something we should be celebrating and something we should be
talking more about one hundred percent. And I get overwhelmed sometimes when I get emails. We get them every week. You know, people who have not you know, have never you know, been a part of God right or you know have maybe growing up went to church and then as an adult kind of you know, you know, busy with work and you know the old cats in the cradle and kind of forgot about God and then they stumble on the podcast. And this isn't like me, you know, patting my back.
This is to all the people like yourself who come on and open themselves up and saying that they've you know, they've come back to God and there is That was the exact reason why the very first episode we ever did was called Why the Lie, because I think it was important to let people know that this is just not some fringe podcast where we think, you know, this isn't another secret society that is cloaking that the true nature of our earth,
that this is literally the hand of Satan deceive people. And everything in your textbooks goes along with that. You know, the Earth is fourteen and a half billion years old, the moon was caused by Mars crashing into it and the moon broke off, and you know, dinosaurs, Big Bang theory, evolution and everything else. And that's something I talk to my local ministers
about all the time. I was dropping some salt off to them the other day when we got our snow, and it's like, you know, we spend an hour or two a week in church and then we send the children off to thirty five hours a week and these schools that go against everything that we preach on Sundays. How do you navigate that? How do you fight that battle? And obviously not everybody is in the same position where I am, where I'm able to homeschool my daughter because I'm in a different place in
my life. A lot of people are out there, they're single parents working two jobs. My goodness, at the grocery prices are through the roof, insurance rates have doubled everything. You know, people, it's tough for people to even you know, make ends meet, let alone try to you know, homeschool their child. But you shouldn't have to have those type of worries where especially if you're you follow Christ, your believer in God, that you know, all the work that you put into them at home and at church
is going to get completely undone when you send them off to school. And I think that's one of the biggest battles that we face today. Yeah, I agree. I think it's really unfortunate that God was forced out of schools and I think that should have been a big warning flag for a lot of people. And I think people just kind of took it lying down and were
like church and state, okay. And I think it's a mistake because I look at you know, we said the pledgeable legiance and different things when I was young and in school, and I mean, I know times have changed and all the things, but like I think, the first school shooting was literally the year I graduated high school, and all that stuff has gotten worse over the years and has gotten deeper and deeper the more we have pushed got out of our schools. And I think that, well, I obviously can't
predict what would have happened. I do feel deep in my heart that things would have been much different if it didn't work out that way. Was that Columbine? Yes, you know, it's funny. I graduated PLDC, which is when you get your stripes in the army. That day, we just finished school and I was back in my barracks room, eat a pizza and drink and a beer, and I turned on the TV and that was literally going on. And that's funny. That date, that April nineteenth, April
twentieth date has a very occultish date to it. Waco and Oklahoma City happened on April nineteenth. The shooting happened at eleven nineteen. In reverse that you got your nine to one one so I do think all of these major type of events are well I'm not even going to get into that particular conversation tonight.
That's for another day. But I think you're right. I think right around that timeframe, the ninety nine to two thousand and one, when we had nine to eleven, I think that was another point where evil really weird its ugly head and the world really stopped hide and how evil it actually was. You know, that is something that I think about all the time. Is just when I was in school and I graduated in eighty seven and things
were so different. We didn't have all these things to worry about, misgendering and I mean just craziness that's gone. And in the church today you have the entire Methodist Church. We grew up Methodist three years ago, the church actually split because half of the church except at LGBT. There's churches now in
the Methodist Church that have actual like drag queen pastors. And you know, it has gone from the schools which we were just talking about, but now this evil has actually entered the churches, which is really scary to think about. Yeah, it is, So where do we go from here? I know you had mentioned that the Flat Earth Conversation how the original one went. How has the last eight months been, and how have you been navigating and have you taken the time to do some research yourself. I know you had
mentioned listening to some of the podcasts. I guess I should ask you where are you and your kind of journey to the truth. I know we mentioned beforehand that you're not completely on board with flat earth, and I know much of today was talking about your support and being on the other side as a spouse, if you will, of a flat earth or someone in the truth community, and all the things that you've had to deal with. But where
are you personally on this? So while I am not someone who's a proclaimed flat earther, I would say I'm not someone who's a proclaimed what we I I see the things my husband shows me, and I'm like, I understand how you get to where you are. I don't take time to do research. To be honest with you, I feel like that's where we find our cheet and our balance in our home because Tyler invests so much time and then
I do not. And then we can talk and I can listen and we can share, and then I can also share other things that are maybe different than what he would normally spend his time on, and we find our balance that way. That's just what works for us. I know that listening to your podcast when he was on it back in July was one of the first
things that really helped us get over the hurdles that we were facing. And you know, it took months and months, but we've gone on more road trips in the past year for some reason than we ever have in our entire relationship, and the hours in the car are a great time to have conversation and listen to podcasts instead of just listening to music and numbing it out right. And he went on your podcast and then I think we had a road
trip that was significant. I think are one too. I think we went to South Carolina and he was like, will you listen, and I'm like, absolutely, I will listen. I am on board and I listened, and at the end of it, he kind of paused and was like, well, and I was like, I really enjoyed it. I'm like,
I didn't expect to really enjoy it. I don't know what I expected, but I'm like it is just refreshing to hear like minded people sharing ideas and for their not to be judgment and for their not to be pointing fingers and hostility and anger, which is all I'd witnessed. And I think that makes it really hard for someone in my position is to witness so much anger and so much turmoil among the people that you've always seen get along so well, and to try and be like, why is this happening? And how do
I make this stop happening? So definitely listening to him on your podcast was a huge turning point for me. I was nervous in the early months of how my family would react. My family has always been the judgmental side and his family has always been the more accepting side. And it's interesting that the rules are reversed in my family. I mean, I love him very much, so if they ever listen to this, I love you. But they nitpicked me apart, like my entire existence. And I really was like,
oh, there we go. The moment they find out all of this,
it is going to spiral. And my dad, my dad's a character, but my dad is very malleable for lack of a better word, and you know, he was a one day fishing and hanging out in our backyard, and I had a cousin in from college that was visiting who you know, red pilled or whatever you all call it on your side during COVID, and he's younger, and he, you know, has found his way to a lot of different truth And they were just talking and my cousin and Tyler were
talking and I was like, oh, like all right, so like my cousin's okay with this. This is comfortable for me. Like usually I would be like I need to get up and walk away, but I'm like, they're not speaking poorly to each other. I can sit around for this. And then my dad kind of chirped in and he's like, wait, what's fletter And I was like, it's when people believe that the Earth is not a globe and a spinning ball, and they believe it's something different and that
there's like an ice wall and stuff. And he was like, all right, I'm on board with that. He was like the only reason I ever thought it was a globe is what I was told. And I was like, I could literally tell you tomorrow it's globe, and he'd probably go back to be like, okay, you said, it's like whoa fine but like just the fact that like he wasn't like what are you serious, and like didn't have immediate judgement. Sure, I was like, well, this feels
good, Like this feels like a safe space and is okay. And then on our trip to South Carolina, we listened to several more of your podcasts with different individuals, and I was like, oh, like this is really
a thing, Like this is really a community. And you know, We've gone on a couple of road trips since and I've listened to yours, I've listened to some other people's podcasts, and my one overwhelming takeaway is that there's not a single person that I've seen who has come to the truth or flat Earth that is out to hurt others, and that is not someone who just genuinely cares for people. And majority have come to God. Not everybody's come
to God, but majority have come to God. And like this is a really strong, positive community that I'm really happy that my husband is found, and I'm really happy he's a part of and I'm really happy that he has since he doesn't have it in his normal circle of people in his life. And I think for me that has made me more open and more receptive to listening to more, to learning more and accepting more things to be truth.
But again not something that I spend my time researching, but definitely something where like I'm not like when is this podcast over or when is this book over?
I'm like, oh no, Like I'm interested from start to finish and hearing and it's part of the reason why I wanted to come talk to you today was simply I've listened to so many of them, and the thing that I keep hearing is, oh, well, my spouse and I divorced because I was a truther and they weren't a truther, or you know, my mom has disowned me, or the different things, and I'm like, this
is so sad. These are relationships that were so strong and thought they had such a deep foundation, and then because somebody came to a different journey in their life, we're basically just like written off. And I'm like, it doesn't have to work out like that. And I didn't want that to be
our story. Like from the beginning, when we struggled every day, I was like, I don't know, we're going to make it through this, but I don't want our story to be We didn't make it through this, and I don't want it to be because we couldn't find our way to navigate this and go through it. And I really I just hope that like other people who are in my shoes today, tomorrow, whenever, are like there are examples of people that can find their way through this, and it doesn't
have to be a bad thing that happens in your life. It can turn out to be like a really positive thing. And I will tell you this has been one of the most important conversations that I have had, because I get emails all the time, not even including the people who have come on the program before that are going through difficulties because one person is so strong about
the truth and the other one is completely opposed to it. So hearing your story and coming out the other side stronger than before is very important to share. I have a couple more questions to ask you besides flat Earth. One of the more divisive things that have come up in recent years was COVID. Was that something that affect you were the extended family and became divisive very much
so. Tyler and I I think were kind of on the same page, which you know, up until the last eight months we were always on the same page, like we were the same brain and thought alike, did alike, and all the things. But we did not want to get the vaccine. I my reasons weren't necessarily because I thought the government was doing things out
of evil intention. It was more so like this feels like a rash decision and doesn't feel like it is something that has been tested nearly long enough, and like so many things that have been made and created in the past years down the line, and you're like, oh, that ended up being really
bad for you and really terrible. And I was like, if we're staying in our homes and we are on lockdown and we are wearing these masks and all these other things, I'm like, why do I need to leave my home and go being in a group of a large group of people and get jabbed in the arm. At my knowledge at the time was I did know a significant about a significant amount about vaccines because I had worked for homeopathic doctors in the past, and I was like, there's really bad stuff in there.
Number one, number two. They're putting the virus inside you so that your body can combat it. And I'm like, I just I don't support this, but we got a lot of pressure from both of our families. My family was very strongly opinionated about it because my father has a compromised immune system. He's been in a wheelchair since I was one years old and has gone through so many struggles in the last forty four years. And then my health at the time was terrible. I was one hundred pounds heavier than I
am now. I had never taken care of myself and my mom was like, this will be terrible if you get it, and then we have to take care of you, and basically guilted me in that way. And then Tyler's family was well, listen to the doctors, listen to the government,
this is the right thing to do. As well as my niece was being born and it was the first grandchild on that side of the family, and it was being leveraged as if you're not vaccinated, you can't be around the family, and it was like, well, family was everything to Tyler. Him and his family have always been so tightly knit that it was like, oh, I don't want to do this, but I also don't want to not be around my family, and what do we do? So we did.
We caved and we both to this day, I regret it and really are upset that we didn't stand in our own convictions and let people pressure us. But in the end, we made our own decisions right. Nobody held our hand and forced us. We made those decisions. But would we do it again now? And his family is all still getting vaccinated, which is
their choice. Sure, sure, but even today, like that's a really hard thing for Tyler, especially because he's like, knowing what I know, sharing it with them, they refuse to look at it, and then they go and get the vaccine and all of them are sick all the time and
all these things. It's like, he's like, how do I live a life where I am around them and socialize with them and spend time with them when one I can't really talk about what I believe in and be myself, And two the things and the choices they are making are so against what I feel and believe. And I'm watching like the ramifications right in front of me, and he's like, and I can't stop the train that's come. You
can't. And then on top of all that, you're belittled for that, and it's just you know, you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't one of those situations. If you don't bring up you're guilt. You feel guilty for not saying what you believe in. If you do bring it up, you know, they belittle to you. You get the eye roll and everything else. So and listen to everybody who's listening to this podcast feels the exact same way. And when you said listen to the government,
it's just that is like one of the scariest things. Reagan was the guy who said the nine words you never want to hear is I'm from the government and I'm here to help. It's just they can't get out of their own way. So that was a big red flag for me. You know,
if the government's behind it, no thanks, hard passed. Something I really did want to bring up was and of course there's no correct answer for this, but have you obviously you have thought about this, But how do you guys have that conversation about trying to mend that bred like you and your husband, Tyler, you guys were able to compromise. How can Tyler and
his parents get to that point? You know, we talk about it all the time all the time, because they'll have a day or two where nothing comes up, and then day three a hurtful jab is thrown or something is said. And for a long time I was, you know, trying to keep the peace, and I was like, you can't control them, You can only control you, Like, what can you do to adapt and what
can you do to compromise and make the situation better? To be perfectly honest, I'm at the point now where I've seen too much and I'm kind of like the hurt is there and I really want. I know how important his family is to him, and I respect it so much. I don't really have a relationship with them the way that I used to because of the separation and things have inspired since then, but I still want that for him. And one thing I've learned in years of working on myself is that relationships are
your choice and they are not guaranteed. And blood doesn't guarantee a relationship and it doesn't mean you have to have that relationship. And I think so many of us were led to think that at one point. We were led to think, Hey, they're family, their blood, anything goes you forgive and forget no matter what because they're blood. And I just don't think that rings
true for me anymore. I think that you have to choose people in your life who build you up, and if somebody is tearing you down, you have to stand up for yourself and say, hey, this doesn't feel good to me, This isn't the type of relationship I want to encourage in my life. Here is what I need in order for our relationship to work. Tell me what you need for a relationship to work. If we can agree, let's move forward. But if we can't agree, then we have to
part ways, whether it be a temporary parting or a permanent parting. But this has to be in the best interest for both of us. And if
it's not, then what are we doing? And you know, Tyler and I are making a lot of life changes in the last year, and one of the things that we intend to do is to move, which is a huge thing for us because, like I said, we've been in the same town our whole lives and we're fully intending to take that step together and move somewhere different that is going to be far away, and we're both on board.
But it is a struggle to leave for him with the relationships in the way that they are, and I know it's important that he wants them to mend. But then like, in my opinion, and again I'm no expert, but in my opinion, maybe the distance will help, you know, maybe saying, you know what, we weren't very respectful while it was here, and now that he's away, like we realize, like how much of
a great person we're losing by not having that close relationship with him. And he's distanced, far away, and maybe they'll be like, I don't agree with everything he says, but I can't have a relationship with someone if I'm expecting them not to be who they are. And maybe they'll come to a point where they're willing to compromise, and right now we're just not there.
So it's it's sad and I'm hoping and praying on it that like everybody understands that they play a part in this and that there has to be compromised on
both sides. One hundred percent, that really comes full circle. You know, when I was in the military, a platoon start, you always had the soldiers you spent The old joke is you spend ninety percent of your time on one person you're trying to fix that person, and while it's not the exact same situation, a lot of times you can spend so much time trying to get that one person to think your way or just you know, to see things, and you may forget about the other relationships that are going on.
And that is something that I've put forth. At the same time, we all have family struggles within our family. We all try to be supportive,
but it is very frustrating. And everybody who's listening to this podcast completely can resonate with what you just mentioned with not being able to be ourselves around our own family members who have known us our entire lives, right, and it's something we're passionate about, and the fact that we can't have these type of conversations can be disappointing and you feel disenfranchised and you don't feel authentic when
you're around people and you can't share your basic convictions with them. Yeah, and it's like, how are you supposed to like consider that a relationship anymore? Like if you're not being authentic to yourself and you're just playing the part that they've placed you in, like that's not really a relationships. So you're going to mourn that loss but like, really you're mourning the loss of somebody that you weren't anyways. So it's like, is that the boundaries for yourself?
Respect yourself and say this is who I am, this is what I need. I would love for you to be a part of that journey with me, and if you want to be, you're welcomed. And if you don't, then you know, love you, but we're going to have a
distance between us. Yeah, this has been tremendous and I hope for all the people listening who may be in relationships with others who who are having struggles, I hope you'll share this episode with your loved ones and hopefully it will help them bridge and you know kind of some like you said, you know, meet halfway and still be able to move on, and like you and
Tyler, you came out the other side stronger. Was there anything else that you wanted to mention that you had in your mind that you wanted to mention to the audience so that we haven't talked about yet. I really just think that in any relationship, whether it's about letters, whether it's about anything, it really comes down to listening and talking and accepting your person. And I think that it's really important that you build up the people in your life and
that you don't tear them down. I just think that that is so critical to survival. I think when we feel beaten down, it just takes away so much of who we are. And like, my biggest thing is like I want people to know they're not alone. Like that was my biggest struggle in all of this is I felt so alone for so many months, Like I didn't talk to friends or family. I was like, I don't know anybody else that had become a truther, and I don't know anybody that knew
anybody that had become a truther. And I was like, how do I tell somebody what I'm going through when I don't want them to judge me my husband, our relationship, and I just want them to like help me through it. And I really just like felt so isolated and I don't want that for anybody. So yeah, I think that is just like my biggest thing
is like there are people who have been through it. I think listening to podcasts, even if it's not one like ours today where it's like talking about the relationship aspect, can be so beneficial just to hear that there are other people out there going through a similar situation and just really pray on everything. Yeah, praying is very important, and also I think it would be awesome.
And again I'm just throwing it out there. I'm not trying to put you on the spot, but this would make a heck of a book. It really would. Because podcasts are awesome too, Don't get me wrong. I'm listening to these type of conversations. But there's a whole other audience for books too, and that this is a platform, a category, if you
will, that is really not broached to its fullest. You know, there's a million books on whatever, just the most generic fringe things, but there's not really a whole lot of books out there who people who see things differently and how to compromise. And that is the big word, to compromise.
And we as truthers have to remember the same thing. If you know the person we're talking to, as long as they're not breaking us down, if we have the conversation and they don't agree with us, you can't tear them down as well and just yell at them. How can you not see this? You just have to respect their journey and what they see so it is.
I should mention that it is kind of a double edged sword. You have to respect other people's opinion as well, but the fact that you know it tears down and people you know ridicule you that that is unacceptable, but it does work both ways. But you know coming on here is I appreciate it so much you sharing this story. It's very important, and we're going to have Liza's email in the show notes, so make sure you check it out if you'd like to reach out to her. Her email address will be
in the show notes. And I hope you consider continuing sharing your story because it's very important. There are so many people out there who are going through this. So again, I appreciate you coming on, and I would like to give you the final word. I really appreciate you. I appreciate you
being open to our email to you saying what we'd been talking about. And you know, Tyler and I have so many deep, meaningful conversations these days, and you know, I really came to them of a place of like, gosh, I wish I had someone like George or a podcast like what you have on here, where I could have gone and been like, that's
a resource. For me because I really I looked high and low when we start going through things and couldn't find any anything that came close to not being judgmental or felt like it was like a safe space to really hear what was going on. So I just hope that this does that for somebody, even if it's just one person. I hope that people continue to be themselves and who they are and have people that love them and support them and build them
up. And again, I know you've been such a godsend to my husband and to our marriage in general, and I really just am so grateful for that. Tyler is very grateful to you, and fit is flat Earther is very grateful to you. And I just appreciate you taking the time to talk with me and share my story. I appreciate you what's very humbling, and
I'm glad to be just a small part of this community. I'm so glad people so many people have come on to share their stories, and it's so important for people to realize that they're not alone, that there are, you know, hundreds of thousands of like minded people out there, and it's just finding that community, and more and more people are finding that community. And I look forward to having more of these type of conversations. And again,
thank you so much Liza for joining us. I'll have that episode with Tyler in the show notes, and we'll have Liza's email address if you'd like to reach out to her. The next podcast will be Sunday night at eight pm Eastern Time with Kara, who I'll be interviewing in about ninety minutes. And I hope everybody is a great weekend. If you're in the way of this storm, be careful, God bless you all. Keep your head on a swivel. And until we meet again, my friends, we will see you.
I knowing it's been a struggle. I don't know if you've had spain. I feel the tie held down all the way. Yeah, I know you feel them. You smile ain't the same I saw well go from you feel like you've lost your way. Don't give up. No, don't give it and never is home. Don't let all the primise. It ain't done. Got he's gone up playing Why it's a way time, got up? Let me come? Why wait, God up, y come. I can see the straight beside you. Childs are putting up the five. Oh you're
stronger than any thing. You guy, you're gonna be all right. You're accepting a dead found you beautiful. You're shoving bride. Yeah, you're living, breathing, move you can hold your head a pie. Don't give up, No, don't give in, never lose home, don't let go on the primies. It ain't done yet's got up? Lat w a wain town the god of me became. Don't give up. No, don't give in you never lose home, don't let go on the primis. It ain't out of life. It's worth living. What's a way down the god? Up
cold? Why it's a way down? Got up? Oh? Yeah? What's the play down the god? Oh yeah, got TV. Don't give up, No, don't give in. Neverles hol do they go of the primem smell me and done? Yes, got a plan, watch and kind of in a coat, and don't give no dog giving whatever its hold. Don't let go of the primes. It ain't done. Others worth living in. What's the god of agy coors? Oh? The god of these gos? Whits? Don't god? You're listening to the Fact Hunter Radio Network. Just the facts, ma'am.