The First Customer - Michel Nematnejad's Journey From Freelancer to Successful Business Owner

And, I got a compelling offer from Deutsche Bank actually to do the graduate training program. I said, figured why not? Pays better than I did during college. Why not? it was good. Like it started off really good. It was a great learning experience to do the corporate route. they put you through rotations. You do everything from like application architecture to software development.

I was specifically in the, like the trading side, so futures and options, like back office operations for the entire trading of the global trading. I did that for a couple of years, then I went and joined a team called, DBIQ, which is index quant. That was a highlight of my time at Deutsche Bank. It was a great experience, really solid team. Clients were all MIT quants. really a lot of job satisfaction and pride in what I did.

It's like you're learning about all these different financial instruments. You're working with maybe some of the smartest people in Wall Street. I loved it. I was there during the financial crisis where I was like really in the thick of it in terms of developing software and supporting different financial products.

and then, the financial crisis really changed the industry in many ways where It was really risk off and people were not really Being so adventurous in the instruments that they were creating. I moved to a the credit trading side where You know while it was a strong team. I just it wasn't for me Like I just didn't like it as much it wasn't exciting.

I didn't You know, I didn't have the same responsibility which I had in my previous role long story short, I think in right when I got civilly married. not my real wedding, but I was civilly married cause here I was sponsored. I left Deutsche Bank. and we traveled the world for four months. Me and my wife, we went to six continents, like 17 countries, real, just like jet setting from continent, country, continent, went to all places, which I never thought I'd go in my life.

After nine years, I was really burnt out. Not like just working on wall street and working. Going into those big tall buildings and doing writing, working on the same platforms and applications. I went traveling, really eye opening to see the rest of the world. Everywhere from like Galapagos Islands, Argentina, Machu Picchu, Panama, went to Israel, South Africa, Dubai, Australia, New Zealand, China, Hong Kong, Vietnam, Singapore. Yeah, and a bunch of other countries.

I'm like, and four months later. We're back in New York No job living my parents and my wife tells me she's pregnant. So I'm like, oh boy The last thing I wanted to do was to go back to Wall Street But what happens headhunter calls me and says I have a job you're perfect for at JPMorgan I'm like, oh no, so I'm like, you know what I have to take the interview.

I go for the interview I thought it went terribly, like I answered all the questions, but I'm I thought the interviewer, he was like very, how should I put, not very warm, very cold. I was a little rusty from not touching software for four months, five months or whatever it was at that point. I thought I botched some of the answers. Next thing I know, they want me to come back for a second interview. I interviewed with the whole team. and it's interesting.

The lesson to be learned is when you don't want something so much. it's, it's almost like it tickles them, they're like, oh, you're too good for this job. Next thing I know is they offered me a job, which paid me very well to be on the trading floor at J. P. Morgan in the headquarter building in the city, in New York City.

I actually liked it, it was a little bit difficult to get back into the flow of things, because I've been traveling for a few months, but, you have no choice, you're starting a family, and I actually, I ended up really enjoying it. I really... Learned a lot of new things. It was working with traders.

it was nice prestigious role to have on my resume two years into the job the situation came up where they wanted to promote me and keep me because of my IP knowledge of the systems I get a phone call actually from a Woman I interned with during college. So I this woman that I randomly met she owned an insurance company she texts me out of the blue after 15 years and says, what are you doing with this? What are you doing with your life?

I'm like I work at jp morgan she's like I need a head of it someone to drive the insurance company forward. I said, let's talk.

because it was a pretty good situation where both jp morgan wants you and a Insurance company head of insurance company wants to hire you so I was able to like, Land a pretty good position From either both sides had I chosen to stay but I figured that this was a really good opportunity to just start a new challenge Leave wall street start a new industry it was someone actually named it very well.

It's being the It's being the Instead of being the tail of a lion being the head of a fox Right so being a nobody in jp morgan or being like an executive at an insurance company.

I couldn't really miss that opportunity In the end, you could say the package of J. P. Morgan was a little better because of benefits and it being a big company, but ultimately, I just wanted to just try something really new and, because it was a small company, which, is a lot less, mobility, I I put myself in a pretty, I had a pretty good package put up for two years.

And, me and my, me and this woman who's a good friend of mine, we decided if it actually works out great, but we don't know how it's going to work out, right? I was on a big contract. The company wasn't that big and they had very high expectations for growth. I said, if it doesn't work after two years, that's fine. We'll all be friends.

it just so happens with the insurance industry was going through a difficult time because, because of the amalgamation of different lead aggregators and the thickness of consumers. The business wasn't growing as we had hoped. In fact, it was shrinking to many regards. With accidents going up, claims going up, rates were going up, and just, Geico was really steamrolling a lot of our business. at the end of the two years, we figured it might be a good time to part ways.

And at which point I said, I am not going back to work for another corporation. I have to start my own business. I think my wife was pregnant with my third child. Son at the time, my third child, I'm like, if I'm going to put these guys through college, I've got to build myself a business to have a platform for them to give them the life that they want. And I said, there's no better time to do it. I was 35 at the time, but I figured, now is the time.

So I started, I decided to build a data analytics agency. Now the problem was, is that I had never, ever had to acquire a customer personally before. I'd never had to solicit any business in my life. It was always internal clients or captive clients Within an operation. I had to go after my own business.

so I started as data analytics great really cool name Bought the domain names like every other business The first thing you do is but because you don't know what else to do I went to some industry conferences and I just didn't have the I didn't have that killer instinct of hunting for a customer, really difficult. especially when it came to like data analytics, it's you're going after big contracts, you need to like maybe subcontract some parts of the project.

So in tandem, because of my experience with insurance, which we were spending millions in marketing or lead generation a year, I had my hand, I was, my fingers really dirty with marketing. Google ads, meta ads, that whole stack of different marketing products, digital marketing products, which I really got my head around because I was just like diving into the data so much. Like conversion rates, cost of acquisition, like that whole data model I understood very well.

That process flow, building a funnel, building the acquisition funnel. And then I, I have friends who were looking for digital markers. I'm like, you know what? Let's do it. Why didn't I do this while I, while I build out my data analytics business? And lo and behold, it was picking up. I did one account, I got two accounts, three accounts. My digital marketing business really accelerated in, what was it, what would be now, 2018.

tandem, I think the basic way to approach that was, it was going through Upwork. It took me some time, but I built a really strong profile, 100% rating. that's I think when we connected, you approached me for the project for Purify. That was actually my second big project on Upwork. I had another project for a shipping company as well, which was doing very well, where we're building like calculators and different data models and calculators. the project for Purify was very different.

I don't know how much we can talk about it, but. basically it was the work which people were hiring me for was like advanced Excel work, building data models, building custom measures and metrics to calculate the performance of an aspect or the entire business so you can roll up the measures up until the whole organization to see how the business is doing. and I was like, executives and CEOs that come to me and I, the wheelhouse isn't working with data models or building dashboards.

They have certain numbers that they like to look at. My job was to create those measures and calculations and introduce them to different insights, which allows them to basically make better decisions for their business. And that's when you brought me in. I think that I, you could say the project I did for, we did together was very simple. It was a lot of like technical problem solving. There's also, Working as an external, as a contractor working with internal employees.

There's a certain amount of flexibility you get because you know you're not there for a long time. to do a job and you don't have to worry about any politics or anything like that. Your job is just to get the job done. it's very performance based and short lived. the business, both the data analytics business of, building different types of reports.

and calculators for businesses across the country was on one side and the other side was my marketing business, which, eventually evolved to like local businesses, e commerce businesses. Now I've got a portfolio of different customers that I cater to on a marketing level. And some of them, they just keep me on as an advisor. They have an internal team of marketers, but they keep me around just to, keep their employees in check, report to them the numbers, show them the dirt.

Because with marketing, you can always show the good numbers, right? you can always show the happy numbers, which makes the executives happy. Revenue is great, but then your cost to buy the, to buy that revenue was stupidly high, right? they bring me on to just speak plain English with them. Or some of them even call me the translator. I translate their information for them. Which is, I actually really enjoy it, because...

You don't have the stress of performance, but you get to really introduce different ideas, show different strategies, really work closely with these executives, which are working on very different businesses, which I love. so now at this trajectory, am I talking too much, by the way? I don't know. No. So at this trajectory, what I'm really focusing on is, rather than building a business just through referrals and These freelancing platforms is to actually build a business.

And and this is my struggle. My struggle has always been, can't, do I keep these businesses separate or do I sell them as one? do I build a business that is digital marketing and data analytics? Like a one stop shop? Or do I keep them very separate because that's how people purchase it?

what I decided to push is just to push it as one brand and basically push all these different products. That's a one stop shop. And I don't know if this is right or wrong. it's, it's diametrically opposed to the idea that if you niche, you can focus and specialize and just grow. It's a lot easier to grow that versus like just casting your net out too widely and not catching anything.

but I do, there were some things that I want to poke at a little bit, did you ever, do you ever feel like you got over that hurdle of being able to go out and get customers and go out and sell yourself and go, and if you did, how did you break through that, over time? Yeah.

And something that I'm working on, so I'm, I've built, we just built a new website with a lot of pages. over time we'll be fleshing out this content. And, and, running separate campaigns for these different silos of the business. meanwhile, there's no way I could fulfill everything. So I've got the, I'm building out the relevant team to fulfill things for me too. At a very high standard and quality.

You know what it is, it's just, it, my personality isn't, I'm not a sales personality and I think that's okay. I think, you don't need to be talented in sales in order to do sales, but you, it is something that you do need to work on by you. I mean myself, it's something that I need to work on over time and I'm doing it. I'm working on, I'm also planning on. Creating a lot of content as well. specifically in the YouTube Shorts and Instagram Reel side. I think that's where the traction is.

Just bite sized valuable content that people can absorb, pick it up, get value out of it. And one thing I learned today, actually came across today, is when you create a piece of content, does it provide at least 5 dollars of value to whoever is listening to it? So that's something I never thought about it from that standpoint.

if you actually want to run a business And, be approachable where people can come to you and ask them to solve their problems. You need to have that, tool in your shed,

Alright, you hear their problem, you repeat it back to them, but you interweave the solution to the problem that they're solving, so they hear it from another perspective, and they go, Oh yeah, that is exactly what my problem is, and that sounds like a great solution.

I need to know that I'm solving a problem before I engage with any type of prospect. And that's a personality thing. other people can sign a contract before, talking to someone. They don't care. They're like, we'll get, we'll cross that bridge when we get to it,

I was looking for somebody like you to feed me the stuff that I needed from the technical side. And you did a great job of doing that, but I can tell you've gotten more comfortable in your role as like business owner guy now, which is a little bit different than you were consultant, Michel, back then your business owner, Michel today. and it seems like you figured some stuff out. so I'm proud of you, man. that's good stuff.

I, it's hard for me to recommend people go start there like I did 10 years ago or whatever, I think if you started there a while back, it's a little easier than it is today if you want

I don't, I have to do an a ridiculous amount of underwriting on whether I want to take on a client on Upwork because if I think that they don't have reasonable expectations or they're just going to blackmail me for the rating afterwards or scope creep everything and they're not clear with the scope of requirement. Then they're going to, they're not going to be, they're not going to be pleasantly surprised with the delivery.

You've got to make concessions when you normally wouldn't, to preserve that digital business card, a digital bill. It's almost like a billboard. It's a billboard, you get your face shows up and, you need that to get those hooks in. Let's, let's switch gears real quick. I heard about your first customer. you didn't bring it up directly, so I don't want to ask about that. But I, as a dad of five, and a business owner, and, we're all over 30 at this point, we'll leave it at that.

what are three kind of things you're doing to increase your longevity health wise, personally for yourself?

but now it's I'm trying to make sure I'm getting healthy, getting at my ideal weight. So one thing I've actually been doing is I started doing yoga in my bedroom,

But I want to get back into running and swimming. Those are Swimming in the summer, now the pools are open, I'm going to go swimming outdoors, a week and jogging as, as my knees allow me. But those are the things, I, it's very important because every time I do it, I just feel like my decision making and my mood is much better.

Like I just, you feel differently, your patience level is different. so being active is the number one thing that I always hear, and I totally agree. so last thing, mystery question, you've done a lot. Your bucket list can't be but so big. So non business related, non, the answer can't be I want to grow my business to be the biggest thing in the world. what is something you would do If you knew you couldn't fail.

because the kids are going to fail, they are going to make mistakes, and, We need to allow them to do that, but that I don't know if that really answers your question like if what am I doing exactly? That is not funny. I think it would be solving that problem.

our parents, balance checkbooks and shit, we don't do that. we don't have that, that locked into our day to day finance thing, and I, that's, I think that's why a lot of those companies fail, is because just this generation, number one, doesn't care, but they're also scared to look, and then when you're scared to look, it's like, it's hard to build a

They need to have that, that, that hunger and I guess, forthrightness to go hunt. I think the earlier they learn that, The better that'll grow up with them. And I was, and I thought it was really amazing. I, I, as a, looking at my kids from a fishbowl perspective, of how they handled the idea of customer acquisition. Getting their first customer for the lemonade stand. It was

Kids aren't taught anything about personal finance in school, which I think is ridiculous. It should be one of the first things on the curriculum, if you ask me. more so about, more so than, the Revolutionary War.