This Tiger Tour. You're either in with him or you are dead to him. Why would he change now? There's never been any in between. Let them coexist and divvy up, Divvy up the schedule, divvy up the players, and divvy it all up. Isn't that ultimately what it seems like we're working towards.
That.
Got thoughts in my head.
Can't get him join, Not the thing Wood I'm thinking about, got my head, can't get him.
Out, John, Not the thing Wood I'm thinking about.
Hello, this is Alan shipknocking back for another Fire Drill podcast. There is a lot happening in the golf world, in society as a whole.
We thought this might just be a good.
Moment to for Matt, Janelle and I to talk about the state of things.
For me, it's kind of an exciting day.
It's book release day of Live and Let Die, which some of you have already heard about or read about. Here in New York City, doing some publicity, all good stuff. Matt's in Oceanside and fire Pit HQ. Matti, how's it going.
It's going well?
I mean I feel like I'm busy until I heard where you've been and what you've been up to so give it a little more, a little more details on sort of exactly what you've been doing today.
Yeah, I think I've done five podcasts, two or three national radio shows. I'm chipping, I've got my mint tea here, my throat. I'm losing my voice slightly. I hope it doesn't sound too bad for the view listeners at home. I came to New York because I was I had some TV stuff lined up on MSNBC today. I was
gonna do squawk Box and Morning Joe. But with President Biden flying to Israel, with the House trying to elect a speaker, with war raging in the Middle East and elsewhere, those things get better ratings, I think than golf books.
So I got bumped. Hopefully tomorrow. I'm locked in.
For CNN tomorrow and maybe a few other things. But it's all good. I'm just happy to be here and enjoying the room service of my hotel, which I haven't left this room since ten am. It's now five t I literally haven't left the room. It's just been ping ponging from one thing to the next. But of course I appreciate the interest and people wanting.
To talk about the book. And it's been fun.
I mean, I'm probably tired of my own voice, but hopefully nobody else is yet.
Probably a few people. It's probably.
I know, a few tour pros of voice to the
idea that they're tired of you. Well, but good god, I mean, honestly, given the state of what happening in the world and devastation and destruction and just terrorism and sadness, and I the idea of sort of talking about anything other than that, or seeing anything other than that is is you know, here we are covering the game of golf, and I think it's just a good reminder and perspective on you know, what it is we do and how we do it and try to, you know, certainly tell
stories that in some cases to justin Thomas's point, where you know positive stories. You know, look, it's not all positive, and it's not always positive, and I know you're at the axis of this fantastically layered, I don't know, dysfunctional fight for profet golf and for me, Before we get too far into it, it's just worth stating that, you know, it's also a good reminder that professional golf is only a sliver of what is golf. Capital golf, you know, and that to me is also something that I try
to remind myself. You know, I've certainly sent out a lot of tweets that I often think maybe I probably shouldn't have sent that out, or you know, maybe I should have sat on that an extra day or rewarded that a little differently. And you know, the more the more I read of what you write, the more i'm I'm hyper focused on the other side of the game, which is, you know, instead of people who get paid to play, people who pay to play, because I think that,
to me is is truly what golf is. And I think some of the guys who are getting paid to play, some of those guys, you know, men and women, at one point had to pay to play, and I think they're not too far removed from that.
And you know, I think.
We'd all be better served to keep things in perspective from time to time when when this kind of stuff gets so far out of control, which I believe is where it's at right now.
Well it's a good point. I mean, folks have been following us carefully, know that we're monitoring and chronicling this big renovation at Golden Gate Park golf course right in the hard of San Francisco, and I was up there just last week. They you know, I was there in February, the last day that the old course could be played by the It's this treasured little respite in the heart
of the city for the local golf community. And talking to the folks about how much the course means to them, and there's a little trepidation, like, yeah, this is our course. I mean, it's not perfect, but we, like, you know, we're sorry to lose it. And what's been created there is just phenomenal. It is gonna be one of the best part threes in the country. And so they kind of had a soft opening and they had two dozen
young women who were part of the first tea. Really they're girls, they're all teenagers, and they they came out and played and the joy that just they exuded because it's just a fun, whimsical design and a beautiful setting. And you get up to the top of the property, you can see the ocean and you can see the famous windmills out there and the outer sunset and there's glimpses of of you know, the real urban tightly packed in houses and buildings and you have a real sense
of place and just big around those those kids. As you suggest, Matt, it it is affirming, and it is the reminder of what it's all about. And I mean we tell a lot of those stories here at the Collective, you know, whether you know we gosh, let's go through the roll call of all the heartwarming stories we've done the last year or two. I mean, there's so many
like you and I are. Both of our hearts are in municipal golf and in public golf, and and we've been chronicling that, you know, pretty much non stop in parallel.
You know, I have been writing.
About this, this battle for the soul of professional golf, and so hopefully that's interesting to fans. You kind of get a taste of everything and and and readers and viewers and listeners.
Uh, you know, we're not predictable. I think you're at the Firepit.
We're always always chasing different stories and and.
And some are really uplifting and feel good.
Some like you know, I dropped one today on Firepit Collective dot Com kind of gets into this this current moment in geopolitics and in what that means for the Framework Agreement. And it's it's complex, and there's it's a little dark, and it's a little it's a little edgy, and I like that mix for us and hope hopefully the our you know, our our fans are into it as well. But definitely, definitely we have We're like pictures that have a fastball and.
It up and a knuckleball and a curveball.
I think if you come to Firepit collective communit, you don't know what you're gonna find.
And to me, that's that's a great thing. But there's a wide disparity.
Well going through your your article and your book and and then all the you know, sort of the preliminary feedback, because the preliminary feedback on Phil, I think for a lot of people assumed one thing and by the end of the book they realized another, which is it was beyond fair and balanced and actually skewed more towards the positives that Phil has done and is capable of doing. But there's another side to him that you know, right or wrong, like or dislike, agree with or or disagree with.
It's just it's just who he is.
As you know, as you're navigating this free flow of politics, egos, money which comes with greed, and then this concept of like a future right because at some point we have we they it the professional game of golf is going to end up somewhere right where it is now at the end of twenty twenty three. What it will be in twenty twenty four, what I think people hope it will be by twenty twenty five is sort of what is sort of that is the heart of the matter, right, Like what is the endgame here?
Who's in charge?
And like where's the money coming from? How much money is going out? Like that to me is so we are so far from where it's going to end up. It just seems it's it's mind boggl to me.
And farther than people think.
And that was one of the reasons why I wrote this story, because even though the book's done, I'm getting I'm still plugged into so many people and I'm always.
Talking to them. And I got a guy on the phone.
He's a he's a big New York finance titan. This is just three or four days ago now, and he's very involved in the conversations around the framework agreement. And I said, it's this thing is gonna be done by December thirty first, which is supposed supposed to be when it's going to expire.
He said, no, it's not. It's like it's a mess.
There's too many, there's too many egos, There's there's too many there's too many players, too many cooks in the kitchen. Like he said, it's going to get extended and it's going to keep changing. And there's it's been leaking out in other places about all these private equity firms and other other you know, institutional investors who are trying to get in on the deal.
And it makes it makes sense.
You know what this this this this so called merger, this big deal that was trump but it was nothing more than peaky promises. There's nothing in that document that's binding except for you know, basically extinguishing the lawsuits like that. That's a done deal. That's happened.
That was a win for the tour.
But otherwise, you know, there was there's a line in there about the Saudis have the first you know, the PIFF has the first right of refusal for outside investment. That's only that was that was aspirational. That's not the truth. They that's why the tour is they've got upwards of ten bidders now who want to get in on the deal, and they can either come in alongside the Saudis or they can push the Saudis out entirely. And there's pros and cons either way from from the PGA Tour perspective.
But so this deal is miles from being done, and it's gonna it's gonna extend in twenty twenty four, and it's going to get a lot messier. So yeah, to your point, Matt, I mean to moving target, what what the game is going to look like? It's never been less certain, you know. I think the announcement the framework agreement kind of tricked people into thinking that that was the endgame.
But it's really not, wouldn't you say that Where we are today, and based on this article and some of your reporting, even after you hit send on the book, you feel like they again it professional golf is further away from a clean and clear future than it was the day they announced this so called pinky promise or promises.
Yeah, it makes sense from Jay Monaghan standpoint. I mean, the tour needs two billion dollars of investment. That's the number they've settled on. They can't pay their bills, their models outdated. It's time to basically shift the tour as business model it And that's a good thing. I mean, you look at the money that's flooded into in this
premiere soccer and every other sport. Really it was time for the tour to have access to that because the old model of every year you got to go back to some corporation and some and try and squeeze another million or two million dollars out of them. Like now the tour is gonna have a war chest that it can it can invest in its product, better TV, better streaming, better social media, and you know, more interesting tournament offerings like they will have the money to do that. This
is a good thing for golf fans. The issue is where is the money gonna come from? It can It can be entirely the piff, but we know that comes with political risk. I mean, the lawmakers on Capitol Hill are watching this very carefully because it would set a
precedent for all of professional sports. Because you know, if the saudiast can take over golf, why wouln't they try and buy an NFL team and a Major League Baseball team and an NBA team and so this is something that the professional sports is gonna have to grapple with. And it just turns out that golf is they're the first guys in the door. So if I think the dream scenario for the tour is that y'a seer to maintain his position as in this new entity and you know,
have the proverbial seat at the table. If you would allow some other US based investment to come in alongside the Saudis, which would dilute their equity and dilute the Saudi influence, that becomes much more palatable to the golfers, to the golf fans, and to Congress and say, hey, yes we welcome the Saudis into this as a minority investor alongside all these other companies, these blue chip American companies,
and that becomes a much easier sell or. They can they can totally cut bait with the piff and go all in with US money, and that would obviously make a lot of people happy in the golf ecosystem. But the risk in that is then you make you live golf a staunch competitor again. And now yes, here's pissed,
and he still got the checkbook. So they're you know, they're the tours trying to thread the needle here, and that's why the negotiations are bogged down, and that that's why the future is so uncertain because they have the there's, you know, kind of these three different possible outcomes and each one has has has a definite upside and has a definite risk and so and so now you've introduced
all these other all these other people into it. You know, all these private ec re refirms are Emmanuel from Endeavor, the big Hollywood agency. Like their bidders, they have their own advisors and lobbyists and lawyers, and so the cast just keeps expanding, the conversations keep multiplying, and and you know it's this is just it was already a complex deal and now it's it's uh complexity squared.
Tiger Rory Steinberg Tigers inserting himself and a seat on the board. And again from where I sit and all that I know and what he brings. Look at how much money they've raised for their you know there you know they're sort of I don't know what you call it.
The it's a breakaway league. It's a breakaway league, right like just like it's just like Living Golf.
It's another you know, you know, I can't wait for that to get official World Golf ranking points before Live, which, uh, but you know it doesn't, doesn't It Like Tiger and Rory's and Steinberg have drawn lines in the sand, right they they are. And so that's like when you say, like the tours trying to thread the needle, I guess my my response to that is, yeah, maybe the tour is trying to thread the needle, but isn't Tiger and Rory and all that comes with that that you know, business,
that's the first thing they want to do. They actually want to do anything butt thread the needle. They'd rather create the money on their own, generate the money on their own, be solely, you know, be independent. They've made that very clear. And thus the scenario of having Live then go and be a separate entity and pick players and essentially have a little now now the Tiger Tour, which is what you should probably just call it at
that point. Once once that that then becomes separate, this Tiger Tour versus the Then Tiger's the guy who's like, Okay, if you go over there, then you're gone. Like that's the way he's always operated. You're either in with him or you are dead to him. Why would he change now, there's never been any in between. It's very clear that would be. Then the Phill League versus the Tiger League.
It's you know, it's the Saudi money, the Piff money versus any other money other then whatever that is, and then let it be, and then let let let them coexist and and divvy up, divvy up the schedule, divvy up the players, and divvy it all up. Isn't that ultimately what it seems like we're working towards.
I mean, it's everyone who's compromised in this. You know, Tiger and Rory are on the board of directors of the PGA Tour. They are also the co founders of this t of this TGL, and so which the tours invested in. They share intellectual property.
So Tiger and Rory want to protect.
This new league they've created, and but that really benefits them and the players they've given a.
Piece of the league too, which are all tour guys.
No live players have been invited, not Brooks Koepka, not Dustin Johnson, who everybody still loves like it's it's to the TGL is become a vehicle to continue to buy the loyalty of these guys who have stayed loyal to.
The PGA Tour. And it's like a reward. You get to be you get to be in the boys club. And so.
When when this deal gets presented to the Board of Directors of the PGA Tour and whatever fashion is, Tiger and Roy are gonna have to vote on it. And something I've learned is that it has to be unanimous. Two, it's it's it's in the tour constitution to change the tour's bylaws and to change it's it's it's fundamental governance structure, it has to be unanimous vote by the Board of Directors. So now you have Patrick Cantley, who we know is a rascal.
In the middle of a lot of things.
And it's going to be like in Congress when you you know, there's one holdout in the Senate, you know, to break a tie, and all of a sudden, Oh,
he's what. We're gonna build a new military base in Alaska, and we're gonna like you know what, like all the all the pork that goes into these these all this all these bills like potentially facing that scenario where the tour has has made a decision, you know, the jaymon Ands and Jimmy Dunn's, and they've kind of hammered out a deal and now the players have to ratify it.
But they have their own selfish interests which are very different from the you know what, Tiger and Rory, their concerns about the TGL have nothing to do with what you know, Peter mal Natty's trying to keep his card, you know who's on the board as well, and a web Sinson who's coming to the end of his playing days.
It appears like.
So it's this whole process is so interesting and so revealing, and so yeah that how who's going to vote, how they're going to vote, and of course there'll be tons of conversation to get to that point. And it was quite interesting that you know, this guy Colin Neville, he's a he's at Rain Capital. He was appointed to be an advisor to the player directors. Basically, the Tiger Rory can't lay Websinson Peter Malnaughty to advise him on the deal.
Like so, so Jay and.
Jimmy cannot pull another end around, you know, like especially like say Jimmy Dunn. He's a very very sharp businessman. He understands seeing at a granular lefs that no mere golfer ever could and so he can out fox these guys. But you know, they brought in Colin Neville to kind of joust with him and explain it to the players
on this this human level. And so it's you've got all these warring camps that are potentially going to have to have to come to a unanimous agreement for anything to get done.
So the layers of.
Intrigue, I mean, it's like trying to elect a new pope or you know, it's just there's it's all happening again in secret, and we're gonna just have to wait for for the next puff of smoke to come out the chimney, and and and see where this process is.
Part of the negativity or the response to your excerpt latest excerpt and the book in general, just me you know, going through some of the some of the comments certainly maybe by the players too as they try try to kind of move on or brush aside or get to where they need to go, is that you're bringing up a lot of stuff that took place a year ago.
You know, you're you're bringing you're bringing back up or revealing stuff that was said when tensions were high amongst those players, when stuff was actually going down in terms of guys were leaving or not leaving, had one toe in, but didn't, you know, ultimately pulled back for whatever reason? Is that?
Is that fair to say?
Is that the sense you're getting is that that a lot of these people involved would just assume not have all that stuff come out now, given the fact they're trying to like move on and come to some sort of you know, comprehensible or comprehensive conclusion.
Yeah, Oh, they would love to sweep all under the rug of course that that serves their interests, you know, like, yeah, that was that was justin Thomas's critique. They can't you just say only nice things and.
You know, not not dwell on this other stuff.
But it's like, this is how we got to this moment, And I just think it's so important for golfers to understand, like all this this all just happened in the shadows, right, and so no one knows how we got to this moment. It's it's just been it's been a series of cover ups in low key cover ups and these information wars where everyone's trying to control the narrative and what bothers a guy like Justin Thomas is he can't control me, and I'm just gonna I'm just gonna tell it.
Like it is.
What everything I've learned, everything I've been told from both sides, synthesize it and create.
You know, what I.
Think is is the true story of what actually happened. But people, you know, the players, the other other Jay Monahan, Greg Norman, they don't want that.
They want only their version to go out.
And a guy like Justin has been spoon fed a lot of stuff from Jay Monahan and Jimmy Dunn and basically told it's fine, we got this under control, don't worry about it. We're looking out for your interests. And in the end it turned out not to be totally true. But it's like they've they've become reliant on the official
version of events. But that's often not the case, like how many press releases go out, you know, but an officer involves shooting and it's you know, the passive language, and it seems you don't really know what happened, and no one pays attention to.
Then the truth comes out and it's something darker.
And I'm not saying that this battle is on par with that, but there's there's like the official version that the that the powers that be are peddling often turns out not to be the case.
And you know, my job in this has.
Been to cut through all that and and find the real truth and the real the real heart of this story. So is that inconvenient for some players and some bureaucrats, you know obviously, but that I don't think that's really my issue.
It's there.
Well, the other thing is isn't And and this is my sense again because we spend a lot of time comparing notes and having conversations for every Justin Thomas or Brooks Koepka, who are obviously in these elite level of you know, fraternities and boys clubs, per you know, how we saw the Ryder Cup play out and how you know,
just the whole dysfunction of that whole process. But for every Justin Thomas or Brooks Kopka that says, oh, we're sick of Alan Schipnook, I would imagine you probably get a lot of text messages, phone calls and DMS from a whole slew of other players saying, thank god for you because we don't have we don't have a voice
in the room. We don't actually have any idea of what's going on, and never will because we're that that filter of communication and information is never it's always going to cut short of me being ranked fifty sixth or sixty fifth or one hundred and sixty fifth in the professional golf world. And they're like, please ease, You're our only source of actual information because whatever else we're getting is just it's just a bunch of bullshit.
Yeah, it's been interesting.
I have gotten those kind of comments, and it is just such a polarizing subject. And even the media environment got polarized, where you know a lot of people reflexively pro tour anti live, and I tried to not get sucked into that and kind of understand what was going on. So like when when the framework agreement was announced, and you know, Jay and Jimmy were doing their media tour saying we won, We've got all the power, We've got the board seats.
You know, this is great for us.
And I've been talking to people on Live all along, and so they were telling me their version of events. And when I when I tried to counter this prevailing to our narrative that actually Gasra has the money, he has the power.
I got so much pushback from E.
There are other even other members of the golf media, but you know, they they had not been to a live event, they don't have any sources there. They won't talk to any of the players, they don't talk to any of the executives. And so just by trying to tell a complete story, it bothers some people because they
only want to hear that one version. And I mean, of course, it's symptomatic of modern life where you know, look at political consumption of news, like if you only watch Fox News or you only watch Rachel Maddow, you know you have a very specific worldview.
And when when it.
Gets countered and people get upset, they get mad, they start shouting at you. It's like, well, I'm not saying I'm right and you're wrong. I'm just saying, have you considered this? And but it's an increasingly difficult conversation to
have in America today on any topic. And because this is this has grown from a golf story to a political story then and of course Trump's in the middle of everything, and he's obviously a very polarizing figure that it definitely it's turned the volume up on all this. So yeah, there's definitely there's naysayers, and there's supporters, you know, at every level, whether they're players, whether they're they're fellow
media members, whether they're just people on social media. But I try and tune all that out and just like focus on telling the story and whatever, whatever the reaction is, I can't control that, but this is this is what I think the story is, and if you stick to that, I think you can avoid getting sucked in and getting off track.
But I didn't see you, Ben Affleck.
I see as Ben Affleck in The Accountant when that in that room where he sequesters himself for like a day and he goes through all the pens and he writes the you know, the the long equation of how all this adds up and the sum total of it is just he finds he essentially finds all the all the darkness in the in the equation itself, and how the numbers don't match up and they don't like what he finds finds out and and you're just ripping through all these pens and all this paperwork, and you get
into the sum total of the of the dysfunction agreed, the egos, the politics, and the bullshitty.
That's a that's a great image. I love it.
But you know, part of why we kind of wanted to have this discussion is because there's so much happening all around us, and like you just came in hot from Las Vegas.
There was this big convention of sort of.
Thought leaders in golf around sustainability, around water, and you know, you and I just talking offline it really it really sparked my interest. I want to can you take people into the room a little bit, Matt and what you learned and just kind of set the scene because again it's like we're all affected by what's happened in Palestine. Has happen anything to do with water consumption in Las Vegas?
Of course not, But somehow golf gets mixed up into all these things where you know, NBS puts out a statement that can affect the framework agreement, What what happens the future water is going to directly affect golf and how we all play and enjoy it. And so you know, you and I are always trying to connect these threads.
But what what did you learn out there? Well, yeah, I was.
I was asked to go to Las Vegas, of all places, to talk about water, which, on the at the face of it, you're like, oh, they're having a It was the Colorado Basin Golf and Water Summit. The National Golf Course Owners Association put on back to back days of Golf Business Tech. It was Golf Business Tech con that rolled right into the Colorado Basin Golf and Water Summit. To summarize what I learned, being sort of in the bloodstream of both those days would be would be very tough.
I'm still processing a lot of too copious notes and was learning from a lot of different perspectives, voices, experts, panelists, you know, tent poles of the game.
Golf.
Here's here's you know. There's The good news is there's a lot of smart people trying to figure out the issue that revolves around water, not only as it relates to golf, but as it relates to humanity. So I walked away feeling much more positive about the amount of research, the passion, the experts you know that are involved in trying to make sure that again forget golf for a second, that we as a society will continue to be able to,
you know, have a sustainable future. I mean that, that's you know, and I think that was shared by a lot of people in the room. I wish more people were in the room to hear what was said, to
ask questions that they might have or not have. Jay Karen, National Golf Course Owners Association, Rhett Evans of the Golf Course Superintendent's Association of America, Don Ray, vice president of the PJ of America, Craig Kessler Southern California Golf Association of Matt Pringle from the United States Golf Association, all in the room. Okay, so that's that that was important. You know, Don Ray from I don't know if you know him from the pg of America.
Vice president in line the reputation.
Oh my god, a powerhouse. Uh, someone who grabbed the microphone never spoke from a single note, talked about how and pointed out how the National Golf Course Owners Association should be commended for the fact that they're one of the most underfunded organizations in golf and yet they put together these these you know, conferences, these summits to to to create this this this you know these days of information and best practices and information sharing situation that that
I think a lot of people benefited from that. You know, Don Rey stuck out to me and as and as an organization that you know, has the sixteen thousand members, he said that four thousand of his members are going to be directly impacted by water on an ongoing basis. Right, So that's think about the members of the PGA of America. A fourth of his membership are going to be dealing with water issues on a regular basis. So he admitted, Hey, maybe we haven't been in the room as often as
we probably should have. We are here now, and we are here to stay like that was a big takeaway for me. The PGA of America. You know, the USGA is doing things can and are going to committed to doing ongoing things to try to create you know, better practices. It relates to water and sustainability. We're seeing what's going in and Alistair McKenzie's famed greens at Pasa Tiempo and understanding better about how that irrigation process you know works,
and and all of those little things matter. You know, what's being done at Golden Gate Park. You know, the removing of all the thatch that comes with a golf course that's gotten you know long in the tooth. Well, that matching is a problem because that water is not going into the ground and therefore, you know, it's not being sort of, you know, reused in a way that is sustainable. So I mean at a federal level, this
woman Stacy Wade was in the in the room. She provided a lot of incredible information about what's happening at the federal level to try to support the states as they manage and try to create better sustainable futures for the states. A woman by the name of Kolby Peller you can't make it up. Colby Pellegrino, as a deputy General Manager Resources at Southern Nevada Water Authority, was an
absolute rock star. So between I don't know, Don Rey and Colby Pellegrino, I was like, these two really stuck out to me as people who are making a difference and they're going to continue to make a difference from you know, a state level sheet. You know, Nevada will be at an all time low in terms of how much water they're using from the Colorado River in twenty
twenty three. That's important because almost all of you know, all of their water is imported, right, They're not getting any natural water.
Yeah.
So I don't know Paul Rotzer from you know, from from artificial intelligence. He's an authority in AI. He was the big takeaway from the Golf Business TechCon, you know, the Nation Golf Course Owners Association and what they're doing, the fact that all those tent poles were in the room.
Don Ray, you know, being who he is, and the potential impact he'll have going forward, what Nevada, in the state of Nevada is doing to be sustainable, in creating a blueprint or an answer key for what other states are going to have to try to, you know, wrangle over the course of the future and a depleted water you know, water resources is the kind of stuff that I'm trying to process as I leave Nevada and and go back over my notes and try to kind of
wrap my brain around the future of again humanity, but then again golf as well. There was one guy also worth mentioning because he made such an incrazing, incredible, impassioned speech. I wrote his name down. Pat Christopher, director of agronomy at red ledges in Hebrew City, Utah, you know, essentially saying conservation works and asked the question, if we had to start building golf today, what would it look like if we know what we know now about water resources?
And you know, I did that story on Pasa Tiempo in twenty fifteen for Golf Channel during Water Week about how they diversified their portfolio and essentially made a deal with Scott's Valley who has an incredible reclamation plant in which some of a big chunk of their reclaimed water was going out to the ocean. And then you know, Scott Hoyt and Justin Mandon and the membership at Pasa Tempo were able to sprint make a deal in which they get that reclaim water from neighboring Scott's Valley. That
was a huge success story that Pasa Tempo is benefiting now. Well, if we can have more of those stories again, is that a golf story or is that is that a you know, is that a business story as it relates to you know, Santa Cruz Pass Tiempo. The people who
work come from Scott's Valley work at Passe Tempa. The property values in and around that area that the ripple effect of connecting the dots and making sure that water isn't just going out to the ocean goat Hill Park, going from pottable water to reclaim water is the reason why John Ashworth has a has a sustainable business model at this community asset in which now it's a thriving, you know, piece of the ocean side community bringing national
interest from all over the world. Well, that doesn't happen if he doesn't connect those dots and get the politicians to make the necessary changes so that he's on reclaim water instead of pottable water. You know what I mean, Like all of this is so connected and you know, positive stories as you mentioned Golden Gate Park youthon Course, how much you know we're working, you know, in step
with them. They have two thousand courses under contract and one hundred and ninety thousand kids who are now members who now have access to the game of golf for five dollars or less. Accessibility, affordability, you know, sustainability as it relates to sort of kids getting in the game of golf and having the life experiences that have changed
our lives. And so many people who listen to this podcast, Western Golf Association, Evans Scholars, Canal Shores, what Kemper Sports, WGA and so many other local and privatized investors are doing to try to help Canal Shores turn that business model around, which is going to be attached to the Western Golf Association and the kids that are going to get access to that golf course, plus the junior caddy programs that are going to be involved, you know, Maggie Hathaway,
which we did a feature on last year leading into the US Open, which we know is about to get fifteen million dollars inserted into that municipal golf course, plus Cobbs Creek in Philadelphia, Jones that success story in Atlanta, you know, and then all leading up to the Wishbone Brall which will happen November eleventh, in which Xander Schoffley, who might get dragged into some of these conversations as it relates to whatever is happening at the professional game.
Oh, by the way, this is a guy for.
The last six years has donated time and money and resources into North County junior golf. He went to San Diego State from the area. He's you know, given a ton of time and money into making sure this Wishbone Brawl which they play per Simmons at a forty five forty six hundred yard golf course with the likes of Dean Wi Wilson, Jeff Ogley, Fred Couple's, Charlie Hoffman, Chris Riley, local pros like Will Crop and Colin Featherstone is playing
this year. And then this beautiful component of the story this year in which Jasmine and Janey Leaveo, who started in North County Junior golf caddied at some of the first few Wishbone Brawls now are playing at long each state and are going to compete together as partners in this year's Wishbone Brawl, competing against Ogilvie and you know either Will Krop or Chris Riley or Colin Featherstone and Xander Schoffley and on their bags are going to be
the Lee twins Aida and Annabel who caddied for Fred Couples and Will Crop last year, Fred Couples and Jeffrey Ogivie last year, Fred Couples and Will Crop the year before. Aida and Annabel Lee are going to be cadding for Jasmine and Janey, two pairs of twins who have grown up playing in North County junior golf. So you want positive stories, that's what we're also working on.
Oh by the.
Way, Well said, yeah, it's you know, used to be this time of year was slow in golf. You know, it's like it just it just never it never ends. There's so much intrigue. But it's heartening to hear about the water symposium, and it's cool that you were there
because otherwise it would people it wouldn't be disseminated. You know, the folks in that room don't necessarily have platforms or megaphones or know how to how to get the information out, and so it's valuable that you would take the time to immerse yourself in that, and obviously it'll inform whatever reporting we do going forward on these environmental things. But anyway, it's always fun to check in with you, Matt and just see what you've been up to and what's on
your mind. Obviously I've been paling hard here as well, so it's kind of kind of fun to have these state of the fire Pit discussions occasionally and bring people behind the curtain a little bit. Anything else we need to touch on before we release the listeners.
No, I mean, I'm heading off to San franiscolp. Jay Blasei's picking me up at the airport tomorrow. I'm going to go get eyes on what ultimately is the finished product of that Golden Gate Park project, in which Dan Burke deserves a ton of credit as the guy who runs the first tee of San Franci Cisco and you know, really got the ball rolling as it relates to this this project and got you know, privatized investors into making what's going to be a huge difference just down the
street from Harding Park, you know. And Dan brought in Jay who is donating his his fees to be a part of this nine to hole restoration renovation, renaissance of the of this piece of property. Josh Lewis has has been critical in helping Jay and the San Francisco City Parks Department make sure that, you know, what they're doing from an agronomics standpoint, is going to be sustainable and make sure that this golf course remains playing and playable
as Jay sort of envisions it. So I'm going to be seeing that tomorrow, and then I'm going to a Youth on Course Board meeting on Thursday again, honored to be a part small part of of what youthon Course is doing. And then I'm going to be busting down to Will for another one of your one, another one
of your book signings at Wilshire Country Club. So, I mean, the game of golf, going back to the beginning, is so much more than just the people who get paid to play it, and it dominates our eyes and the optics of what we see on a day to day basis. But I just think it's important and everybody listening knows this. You know, we're working on a story on the father daughter Anya Donagan from Lahinch and the impact she had on the Women's US Open from a little town next
to La Hinch. I mean, what we're doing and how we're doing it is so much more than just you know, you writing these these these books, which is a huge chunk of effort and energy to try to like peel back and shine a light into those deep dark corners
and shadows of the professional game. But when you do something like a water symposium, where you go to something you like a Youth on Course board meeting, or you go to Golden Gate Park and realize, you know, everything is connected and it's important to keep some perspective and not just yell, but sometimes listen.
I love it perfect, Mike Drop. That was Matt Janella. This is Alan Shipnik.
Thanks for going along in this little journey with us through the life and times of the fire Pit Collective this minute.
We generally we like to.
Tell other people's stories, but once in a while it's kind of worth worth looking at what we're up to individually, So appreciate you.
Maddie.
To the listeners, thanks for sticking with us. As always, thanks to our corporate supporters at link Soul and at Dormy. In fact, I should actually, probably since we're paying bills right now, should say that Dormy has created some beautiful leather headcovers that have that skull icon from the cover of my book. If you're into it, it's oh.
Yeah, we have hats. The hats just came in. They look amazing.
So we do this because we love telling stories, but we like to keep the lights on as well, So thanks for our sponsors. As always, this is another Fire Drill podcast. Will be back in your ear soon. For now, that's the end. Thanks for listening.
I'm been big again. I played the wind made a fortune.
When my ship came man, I ran the table, never thought I could fall down.
The winter time hit me like a canon the ball, and now I can't shape this losing stream. Every road I take is a dead end stream.
I got thoughts in my head, can't.
Get them trying not to think what I'm thinking about.
I've got Thou in my head. I can't get them out, trying not a thing I'm thinking about.