Fire Drill 063: Rough Lies

like subscribe comment first episode has gone great. This is another level great ones after that every Tuesday page Crawford Joe Hooks. Um, I'm super excited, so YouTube fire pick collective YouTube go there like him subscribe. Uh. This week's episode, we talked about my dad and uh I cried and please don't screenshot that and making a social media clip. Um. But we talked about my dad and his his role

in my life. He passed away a couple of days ago, and uh, we got into Patrick Read and another rules controversy, we got into live. Uh, we got into Anthony Kim, is Anthony Kim coming back and the fact that he would truly move the needle on the live thing. You gotta wonder Alan has some great insight because he's done a couple of very in depth stories on Anthony when

he was playing. Um we talked about Max Homa and what an important time for the PGA tour to have a guy who is engaging and funny and personable and also just really damn good like Max. It's just a perfect time for the PGA Tour to have that. Uh. It's another episode we talked about libraries. That is the fire drill. I talked about the smallest library I've ever been to. Uh do people even go to libraries? I mean that is the fire drill and nutshell. We talked

about all those things in libraries. So, uh, that's a watch the Grind Tuesday. It will drop on my Twitter account on our YouTube channel seven am Eastern. Go watch it, go check it out. We've really really worked hard on this. People behind the scenes. Jake is one of them who's producing this podcast. Also a million people behind the scenes that you don't see that I've made that. Marco is the main editor. Just Ah, everybody's worked their ass off

to make this thing, I think, so Uh. Thank you to everybody without further ado, here's the three of us talking golf. I got my head, can't get jan nothing what I'm thinking about, can't get them now, nothing thing what I'm thinking about. There is a lot to talk about. Um. Of course we have Max Homa, who's just turned into a monster. Five wins in the last two years, just one on a US Open course with a spectacular finish. Um, we've got melodrama in Dubai, to say the very least.

We'll get to all that as well. But UM, if it's okay with you, Ryan, I thought we we'd start with you. I mean, you've you've written so beautifully about your dad and his influence on your life and career, and you've taken readers through this long journey as he's been battling dementia. And he wrote a super moving piece about how Mrs monday Que you know, was so devoted um to your father and in his final days, and

you know we lost him a few days ago. And I know the fact that even on this podcast speaks to your own grind. Like we tried to talk Ryan out of doing this, but he's like, no, I need, I need to get back into some routine. So, Um, I just wanted to open up the floor to you, and of course, Michael is you've gotten to know the French family very well as well. I just feel like we need some closure as as your as your family, as as your readers and your listeners, Like, how are

how are things in your world right now? Yeah? Good? I mean as good as they can be, uh, I said today, like in the middle of this chaos, my parents have lived with us for a month, people in and out. We're living my brother's house, so he comes, his family comes in and out, and you, like you just every day you wish that the chaos would stop. And then the house seems very quiet today in the

chaos to stop. My brother's gone home, my mom's back at her house, Dad's gone, and it's like we're all kind of walking around like you've you've had this chaos be part of your routine for so long you kind of don't know how to get back to normal stuff. But my dad was super important to me. Um, you know, I think we'll get more into it uh in Michael's book Down the Road. But there were some pretty dark times in my life that my dad was there for

me and the Caddy trips. Uh, you know, saved my life at a at a time that just wasn't a great time in my life. So um, I I miss him, and uh I love him and I miss him. Michael, what what? Um? What can you share about what you've learned about about the French father's son relationship? You know, well, just as as the starting point, he was a Uh he was an All state basketball player. Um who you know,

maybe you could have played at at Michigan. Say, was certainly one of the best basketball players ever to come out of Alpina. And it's a telling thing because athletic skill is genetic and uh and Ryan has athletic skill and it comes straight Uh, it comes straight from the dead. And it was and it it made for a for a connection between between Ryan and his dad. Alpina is

a hunting and fishing town. It has golf. Uh. But uh it's a spectacular thing to see a father and a son, any child and and any parent uh bond over this game that lets you show emotion every which way. And uh, Howard's father, excuse me, Ryan's father, Howard French Um was a remarkable person from a remarkable family in a remarkable town. And and Alan, I would say the same of your mom and her experience and my parents

who fled Nazi Germany. We've all lost parents here in the past year or so, and they've all had a lot to do with us finding the path that that we have found. Alan and I've talked about this a lot over the years. But one year early and and Allen's writing experience, he won a golf Writer's award and his mom came down to Augusta, uh for a day, and came to a golf writer's dinner, and you know that the pride was beaming, and you know, she came out.

She had been a politician and in northern California, and you know it was accustomed to a public life. And now her son was leading in his own way of public life. And Ryan's father led in athletic life, and and and then Ryan was in his own athletic life. And you know my case, Uh, my parents were you know, totally committed to not totally committed that. They were just very active readers period. And uh, you know, I grew

up in a reading tradition and became a writer. So we're all by products, of course of our parents, and we all, in our own way devote our whole life experience to our parents while finding our own life experience. So it was a privilege for me to get to know Uh, to get to know Ryan and and and by extension, Ryan's paternal grandfather the other side of the family, Uh, the Houst decide where there was a writer and you know how these family traditions blend to make us who

we are today. You know, Ryan, I'm curious what you've heard from from your your community of of readers and followers, because, as I said at the top, you know they've been on they've been on this journey and I'm sure allow them. I feel the loss as well, and they probably feel like their pals with they were pals with with Howard because he populated so many of your pieces, and you know, there's great old photos of you guys, and and there was a lot of love and the things that you

you typed about. It was what what have you heard from your your community? Yeah, I mean super overwhelmed. I'm uh, I mean behind on text messages. I spent most of the morning catching up on d ms as best I could. Um. As Michael has learned, we we share over share in the French family and so uh you know I've taken people inside. Um you know this struggle that is dementia. That was dementia. Um and I read it two reasons is for therapeutic reasons. It's my way to kind of

tell the story and get it off my chest. And also I know a million people are going through it. I mean those are the d m s right. Uh, my grandpa's going through it. My dad was just diagnosed. I lost my brother or my dad or whatever to dementia. And so um, you know, I'm happy that people. I appreciate so much all the support, and I'm glad can

people can relate? I think Alan, you've you said it a million at times and I use the quote all the time as our job as writers is to elicit some sort of emotion, whether that sadness or anger or happiness or whatever. Uh and and uh I think people can relate. And so uh I talked openly about my not my ability to uh be the greatest words smith, but I'm pretty pretty happy with how I write. And people have related to my journey with my dad, our journey with my dad. So um uh yeah, an amazing

amount of support. I'm still catching up on d M s and text messages and tweets and uh yeah it's been. It's been great. It is, ah, it will be. It is what we all wanted. And my dad lived a very good life. And I've said many times as a lot of people would give anything to do the things that I did with my dad. He wasn't perfect, no one is, um, but he was. I mean he again, as he'll read in Michael's book, he he saved my life. And uh so I love him and I miss him.

Yeah that's really sweet. Um, I know, can we talk about just mundane golf matters Africa? Can we get to the Patrick Green stuff? But now that's beautifully said Ryan, And you know we're all sitting you hugs from far away and um yeah, I I know you feel a lot of relief, but it definitely you know, it's tough to time. So we got you. If you get to Alpina and you do the Ryan French Howard French Tour, you're gonna be amazed at how good this Alpina City

course is. Because it was like, oh yeah, just a little sires, really nice, charming golf course with beautiful greens and and our friend John Garrity would especially appreciate this Allen Grass driving range. Yes, there's no mats there, Ryan is there no mats, no mats, the most beautiful grass ever.

Now they got about a four month season, so that probably helps, right, But it's also so that's funny because there's a great three six whole facility here on the Monoe Peninsula um Band at black Horse, and they redid the rains and they have acres a beautiful turf it and it's a really expansive range and it's tree line, it's it could be like one of the all time

great driving ranges. But they often have mats out and it's so bizarre hitting off of a mat and you're surrounded by luscious turf, and I, you know, I guess it's just a cost saving measure. It takes time and energy and water, and but the turf looks beautiful and it's so dispirting. So yeah, sure, that's one observation about about driving ranges with mats and nearby graphs. I have snuck on the golf courses all my life. In my life, I have almost never been kicked off a golf course.

But you go to a driving range that's got plastic mats and grass from you take one swing and they're all over sir. For the last time I've told you you've got to get on the mat. You're like, this is not the last time. This is the first time. I'm gonna have a little the way here that it's amazing how they're all over you. But sneak on. You

can sneak on Augusta National and plays before you. I will tell my Spencer Levine, I'm a huge Spencer Levine fans as people who follow and uh, the Monday for the Farmers used to be at Industry Hills, which has a two story matt driving range, and I've snuck on that course many times. Uh, And two or three years ago I got a picture from a follower of Spencer hitting in front of the mats and then he got yelled at and almost kicked off. And so it doesn't it's just not you, Michael, it's an actual p g

A tour players. Just a quick just a quick note about that Industry Hills. They had two courses there, the Ike and the ice, the Ike and the Babe for for babees. Harris and my mother in law didn't know anything about golf. Uh, but I would go over there and she would say, yeah, did you sneak on? Or did you pay? And the other thing I had there out and you may have been there, But did you

ever know that Miller library there? For for years it was considered I think it's called the Ralph Miller Library. Maybe he was considered one of the great golf libraries of the world. And they shut it down and know why? There was a sheard in there and the library was part of it. Oh. Yes, So when I was living in Belmont Shore on Long Beach, I would drive over there and use that library somewhat regularly. Um And I

don't think I ever played the course. It was. I was like just research because this is this was like what year was at ninety eight? So that was the year I got my first email address, I remember distinctly. But I didn't even have a cell phone yet. The Internet was not really a thing. I mean I guess it was. But do people still use libraries um or for a computer access? I would guess right, yes and no. I mean there's there's two good libraries in Carmel and

they're always busy. They're ones is just dedicated kids library and that place is wonderful and I spent many hours there with my kids, and all the schools go there. And then there is there's a nice right on Ocean Avenue. Its beautiful stone building and yeah, and it's very busy. I mean, I I've been encouraging. My daughter is a voracious reader, and she finds these series that have like eight books in them. And I know how it's going because I Ding ding ding. It's like all the Amazon

NOTEFID go to the library of It's Michael. Michael will appreciate this. And then we are I mean, this is classic fired or we are in a library speed but Michael, just down the road for I'm living, there is a the tiniest library I've ever seen in my life. Like we live in the middle of nowhere. And this is not even to Alpino, Michael, Michael. Alpina has its own library. But there's a Hubbard Lake Library and it might be two d square feet, but they're raising money to expand

it to four hundred square feet. All right to the Patrick read things in the tree? Did he cheat? Did he not cheat? Al right? Right? So um, well, and we haven't even talked about, you know, tegate on this podcast because I have sin since we taped our last one. I mean, it just the amount of bullshittery, the the engulfs Patrick Reed at all times, it's just wild and know, flicking the t I think was actually kind of funny, like I don't mind that, but it wasn't like he

was trying to blind him. It was it was kind of a jaunty, saucy move. But it's the tone definess of like walking up to Rory, hey man, great to see you. When you know, there's been some clarification that this when when Rory was served, you know, the for that lawsuit that wasn't strictly a Patrick Read lawsuit, but it's the same lawyer, and this lawyer's right, it's adjacent

to Patrick Reed. But even setting that bit aside, I mean, Rory has been obviously the biggest PJ Tour booster and he's made it very clear he us wants nothing to do with the live golf guys. So just on that alone, for Read to walk up to him like, you know, slobbering on him like a Labrador retriever, like, it's just it's it's bizarre it's like so it's like sociopathic, like I make it makes sense? Michael, Well, can I can

I fine tune some of you? Just by way of question, Um, isn't Rory more in like the Jeff Ogilby school to to speak up someone with whom we talked to regularly. Isn't he more of a little bit of an olive branch, you know, if they would get rid of Norman and blah blah blah. But that that there, that there should be some well, he's he hasn't made some noises the effect. He's looking at the big picture, which it's not good for golf to split up the stars. There's not enough

fan interest or money to support these warring tours. So he's pragmatic that it would make sense. Um, And if you believe Andy Gardner, who founded the PGL which was the precursor to the to Live Golf after the South, he's just ripped off the entire idea. But um, you know, Andy Gardner says that Rory was supportive of his idea early on, and that Rory saw the possibilities of how you could bring this infusion of money and interest and there was a way they could partner and make it work.

So I think you're right that Rory sees a bigger picture, But at the same time, he's that's a macro view. I think when you zoom in, he has a lot of bitterness towards the current live guys and he's fed up with them and their high jinks and there and and their their mouthiness. So I think he would like to forge a compmise for the good of the game.

But in the meantime, he's gonna he's gonna take as many shots as he can, and when the guys on your door on Christmas Eve, if it's gonna get intensely personal. And we picked up on that from Davis the same Davis. The same Davis is a Davis Love is a very reasonable, mild mannered, intelligent person. But his view of Greg Norman is, you know, he's trying He's suing me. They're suing me there, They're bringing down everything that I represent, so he can't

not become intensely personal. I heard interesting nugget. I was

down at Torrey Pines. The PGA tour has decided they're not going to help any players with their legal fees, um including and I heard Davis has already wracked up six figures and lawyer fees because he came on our pod cast, he went other places, and he's obviously a huge part of the Writer Cup efforts for the for the Americans, and that there's some hard feelings because even the staunchest defenders of the tour, the tours kind of cut Baiton said, well if you get if you get

rolled up into these lawsuits, good luck, and so, um, that's going to be an interesting nugget because it's discovery process as ownerous and I've heard the Live Golf guys are coming in and taking phones and no one wants their phone snatched from them. Um, there's what would be

the motivation. And the PGA two are not supporting the players for legal face because then they become they're essentially sanctioning what the players said even though it wasn't authorized and some of these players were a little out of pocket, and uh, it also becomes an issue of if not setting aside Davis, but anyone if a player is negotiating would Live Golf and there a tour member and there were secret deals made and there were things going on.

There was collusion, there was antitrust behavior. If the tour comes in and defends that player, then they're essentially approving of what they did. I think they're trying to they're trying to keep their hands clean, and they don't want to get swept up into the actions of any outside agencies, because then you have it's not just the players, you have you have the actual agents who are we all

know were double dealing and um and um. So I understand the tourist perspective, like they don't want to get involved if they don't have to. But all of a sudden, they're all these players are not gonna have to pay their own lawyers, and that that's that's gonna be. That's gonna create more hard feelings and not good for us as reporters because now that the well, it's obvious, but just for those two from it may not be obvious.

Sources are more likely to talk to reporters when they know there's a lawyer that's going to back them up if things go haywire, and then when there's not and they're like, is this really worth it? Knows often the

answer yeah. That's been one of my challenges in reporting this book is that a lot of people have said I'll talk to you and they come back to me and they're like, well, um, I was advised not to because they could subpoena your notes, and like, well that seems a little far fetched, but um okay, and that that's just lawyer's jobs are to air on the side of caution. So like a lot of folks who told

me they sit down and talk have renigged. I'm hoping that some have spoken to me, you know, on background where I can use information but not their names, and um, some are mulling it over. But yeah, it's it's there's definitely a chilling effect. And I mean we talked about this in a previous podcast. That's really the point of these Patrick Read lawsuits against journalists. No matter what he's being told, Um, he probably knows he can't win them. And I think even the lawyer knows they can't win.

But it's just it's a hassle when you get sued, right, and it's stressful and it's time consuming, and so they're just trying to put the chill on people and it's probably having an effect. I mean, um, like I would it would be interesting to get an AI program and monitor all the tweets and all the discourse around this latest Patrick Reed um rules controversy and dubai versus the previous ones. I mean, people maybe a little more careful because they just don't want to get in the crosshairs

of this stuff. And that's the whole point. I mean, that's the chilling effect. But so Ryan for those who have we're asleep when all this happened. Summarized the most recent Patrick Reed controversy. Sure h he a a person on Twist so he hit a ball into a tree and it got stuck and then a twitter Michael Ferrier Twist. I believe he might be he's a player. Um took a screen, not not a screenshot, but a video of uh where the ball landed. And it is very hard

to see. To be fair, it looks like it, but how much of that is like we know it's Patrick Reed, Like if I saw that ball and it was uh Max Homa be like, I have no idea where that ball went, you know. Uh, So it looks like it goes in this one particular tree on the right. It it does, but it is very difficult video to see. And then Patrick comes up and identifies his ball in a different tree, and to be fair to Patrick, uh,

the rules official used so they used binoculars. Patrick said he could see his markings and the rules official looked up at their and said that he could see his thing. Everybody thinks it's the wrong tree. I don't terribly disagree, but there's definitely some like it could have bounced into the other tree or maybe the video the video is not by any means like like, yes, it went in that tree, I would guess a good it looks like it goes in the first tree. Uh. But this is

what it has made me think of t Gay. This is the p g A. I mean, it's a The much deeper view is it's so sad that golf has split, but the live tour has taken all of the villains. Like this would be such good golf if this was a week to week thing, If Rory and and Patrick really hated each other and the tea thing happened and all of that stuff, it would be so interesting on a week to week basis. We never get they're never

going to play together. Obviously the masters were not like pare them, although I asked them two in a tweet, like golf golf. Golf needs a villain, and and the live took all of them. That's lived problems. They have all villains and no good guys. Maybe Cam Smiths a good dude, but like they have all the villains, like this would be so fun. And this is the cart I r L thing that I always bring up. It's

like it's divided and we're gonna forget about. Like it's just it's just a sad look that this is what golf is well. And the last thing I'll say is the tea gate is the most golf fight ever, right, Like how key players literally literally throw fifths every day, right like they get on an actually have a physical fight, pound each other in the head. And then like that's it.

And we're talking about a man flipping a t at the ass of another player like it's the you know, like the greatest fight in the history of the world,

like it's Ali Fraser or something. Yeah, well, I mean they may wind up playing together more often than you think, because the whole reason Patrick Green and other live guys are playing on the European Tour right now is that there was this injunction that was filed and um Ino in only a couple of weeks away where this is going to go before the courts in the U K. And they're going to have to decide um can the very narrow issue of can the European tour demand releases

for players and and that whole system of sort of stricting who can play when and where is is being thrown into question. And this has been ruled on by the High Court in Singapore years ago. The Asian Tour um find some players who played in a conflicting event and without getting a release, and they're repudiated by essentially the Supreme Court of of of Singapore and they read they Asiano had to pay back the fines and basically said you can't do that. And there's a ruling in

Australia years ago involving cricket players. They had an analogous situation and the High Court of Australia ruled, or the Federal Court of Australia ruled in favor of the cricketeers, saying that they should be able to play wherever they want, whenever they want. And so there, you know, these are different parts of the world, but there is an emerging body of legal thinking that the system that's in place

now is not going to hold. And so and there's even folks who feel like the European Tour may want to lose this case because then they can say, Jay Monahan, hey we tried our best, we went to we went to war for you. But this is what the court said.

So now they get all their players back, and that would allow um, you know, Martin Kaymer to play the German Open, and Lee Westwood to play the the British Masters, and you know all Sergio to play the Spanish Open, like these are important draws for these tournaments, and just they say nothing of Ryder Cup involvement. And then there's a major Writer Cup implications. So um, and obviously if if Europe lets all their players play, that's gonna put the pressure on the U S side to open it

up to the Dustin Johnson's of the world. And so this is this is a very important legal case. How long it's going to be argued, how long it's gonna take to get the ruling back is a fundamental question that nobody can answer. But there will be a decision at some point and that will that will shape this

debate in a profound way. So if if the tour loses and the players win, then you're gonna see the live guys all over the European Tour because they want the world ranking points and they have, you know, a lot of history at these events. And then of course it does we know they're gonna see each other at the Majors and that's gonna add a lot of juice.

So um. You know, remember in the old days, Michael and the U s g A. They would do funny pairings, like one year they put all the fat guys together and um, they they had they had a little bit of an edge, and the pairings like you're not gonna get Patrick and and and and Rory at the Masters. You you might get at the US Open because like just because they're a little more muckreakers and they liked the attention. I don't know that would be epic. I

agree though. Yeah, just one quick note. I've probably have said this before, but I would have never guessed that Patrick Reid would join this live tour, uh for any number of reasons. You know, what was this thing what do they call him on the Ryder Cup teams? Captain what Captain America? Captain America? That was the start of then of course that you know the red and the

black and the following Tigers thing. But this, above all else, here's Tiger who really, when it's all said and done, even north of Rory, is really the spokesman for uh, the PGA tour um, you know, as the ruling king of professional golf. Patrick Read owes his golfing life, I think to the act of Tiger Woods choosing him for that President's Cup team and then embracing him after that cheating scandal at at the Albany event. Um, things could have things went south for Patrick Reed, but they were

been way way worse. And then Patrick Reed played very poorly the first couple of days, maybe the first three days, and there was the thing with the caddy and all the rest. Patrick's read Patrick Reid's career could have spiraled out of control without Tiger's support and uh and it didn't. I mean he was holding on but it but it didn't. Well, It's true when when you go down the list of of the big name players who to live, they were

old or they were injured. Basically, whether you're talking about Bryson, you're talking about Phil, you're talking about Brooks, Dustin not that old, but possibly you know, he's told people he doesn't want to play forever like he he's he's an old whatever thirty eight. So read is the one guy that doesn't fit the profile because he's young and he's healthy, and he was playing very well on the PGA tour.

But here here's what I think it's all about. He liked the outlaw spirit of the live guys, and I think he knew he was going to be unencumbered when he got there, just to be himself. And I think that's why these lawsuits have touched off, because the tour would not have supported him. If he was going after reporters, it would have been a lot of blowback. It would have I'm not sure would have even been possible if

he was a tour member. But we know that that anything goes on the live tour more or less, and you're free to be the asshole that you are. They encourage it, and so I think obviously the money was a factor, but Patrick Reid was making a hell of a lot money on the PGA tour. I think honestly for him it was like sticking it to the man, just knowing that all his colleagues in the poor hated him all the battles he'd had. Um it was sort of a fresh start. But more than that, it was

he was unencumbered. He could be more himself. And it's also why Live has a chance to sign Anthony Kim, because part of what drove Anthony Kim off the PGA tour was, and he told me this a few times, he hated all the PGA tour um guys lording over him, the suspensions and the find like he was always in the principal's office and and he never vibed with his colleagues on the PGA tour, who, as we know, skew towards conservative, religious Southern and again like it's a different

scene on on live golfs And obviously the upfront money is intoxicating, we know that. But I think for a guy like Patrick Green Priy, for like Anthony Kim, they feel more at home there because as you said, Ryan, it's a bunch of it's a bunch of dicks, and they're they're at home. But I and I also think that Patrick read Michael and is so out of touch

with reality or lives in his own reality. Like again, like Alan said it, who would like, if you're Patrick Read, you like any person would go like, hey, I'm not gonna go up to Rory and say hello, he obviously hates me, right, And the same thing with with the ball in the tree. Any normal human would be who's gone through the things that Patrick read Is has in the in the rules department, you would look up there, right and you'd go, you know what, I think that's

my ball. But just to be safe, I'm gonna go back to the tea because I can't undercent identify it, and I'm gonna win over some hearts and I'm gonna lose a couple of strokes. Like it's not about money, it's just he lives in an adverse like a reality, an adverse reality, like any person that has had as many rules controversies as him goes up to that tree and goes, yeah, I don't know, I don't think that's I'm pretty sure that's my ball, but I'm not positive.

If we can't shake it down, I'm going back to the tea, like anyone that that is the rule you have to positively identify. So, I mean, heats up on the tree and it's just like he just lives. He doesn't think about Tiger helping him out. He doesn't think about anything. He just lives in this adverse like this, this world where just his own world. And it's why his arrogance is astounding, and and and and it was on display for everybody who's interested to see at Tory

Pines a couple of years ago. You know when when he said to the rules official, but I'm gonna let you, I'm gonna let you. I'm gonna let you. That's the rules officials doing his job. Patrick Greed is not doing his job. And and the tone should be Ryan, just what you what you said, I'm gonna bend over backwards here to make sure you get it right. That's what golf is supposed to be. So you know you're right. But I would have thought at the end of the

day he still would have showed difference to Tiger. That that's where I sort of that was the line I thought he would never cross, but obviously he did. Allen, you would know you would know the most is is there any chance there's been a lot of Twitter that a K is coming back your personal thoughts or anything

you're hearing. Do you think there's any chance he comes back. Yeah, I spent a lot of time with Anthony Kim when I was doing a big feature on him for UM for Sports Illustrated, and that was peak a k It was. It was like a week after the Masters when he almost won that thing. He made like whatever ten or eleven birdies on Sunday and uh, he was flying so high and um, and then of course things went sideways.

And then I wrote the big story that the kind of cracked the code about this insurance pout he'd gotten and that was part of why he's on the sidelines and the injuries. But I probably underplayed it in that story and I learned more about it after it was published, Like he really had the driver yips and some of that was swinging um changes that were necessitated by the

injuries and compensations. And you know that happens. That happening David Duval, Like when you get hurt and you start swinging the club differently, it goes from physical to mental. But but Anthony Kim had a severe case of it. And so the two questions are can his body hold up? It's it's not just tournament play, it's how much practice

you have to play to be tournament sharp. You know, he's had obviously a lot of time to recover, but he's also now he's getting close to forty, and so the big questions are what is the state of his body, but also what is the state of his mind? Like the driver, hips has ended plenty of of of careers, and running away from the game doesn't really cure it and almost makes it worse. If you quit when you

have them, you're not fixed. You're gonna have to come back and you're gonna have to look down a fairway with all kinds of hazards and lined by people. And in his case, there would be an intense media scrutiny

for every swing. It would be an event. He's there's no easing into it, you know, if if that's the route he goes and so, and he was tired of that scrutiny because he was playing really poorly for almost two years and he was always getting in trouble by the tour and he was just burnt out on the whole thing. So maybe he's had enough time to miss it and to refresh and recharge. But I still think it's the longest of long shots. But but would wouldn't wouldn't live golf give him an easy out for all

the problems you just outlined. In other words, there's no there's no ferries lines with fans, but it will be you're paid up front, yeah, for sure. But the lights are still on on the c W. I mean, there's a the c W audience is waiting to watch Anthony Kim. He's there demographic actually you know, teenage, but all the people they have, he would one bringing the fans in at least temporarily, I mean, like for the first five

six tournaments. And if he plays well, like the guy was uh a lightning bolt, I mean, so he would bring fans in for at least the first few offense. Now, if he has the gifts and he's shooting a d every time, that will obviously end relatively quickly. But at the beginning, golf Twitter will be locked in on Anthony Kim absolutely, And there were all you know, as he's as his game was deteriorating and his body was breaking down,

he became and I read them all. I mean, there was a lot of what's wrong with Anthony Kim's stories and that it really nettled him and he so I would I would say, it's it's one chance and we all have a price. We all have a price and that. So he got this big insurance power and supposedly he was a very savvy investor. He had smart people around him and apparently made just sent a picture on Instagram

of him in a private plane. It's like how like yeah, like he obviously still Like how does Anthony Kim still afford I mean, as far as I know, he doesn't do any speeches or anything like that, Like you's just living off of this insurance thing, or or maybe he's on a private plane because he's getting a large check

from Greg Norman. It's Greg's plane. Um. I mean supposedly he he invested a lot of his money in these medical device companies that went crazy, and like I was told by people close to him who who knew that, like he set for life and so I don't know. It's it's an interesting it's a tantalizing question. His Instagram picture, he needs to eat a cheeseburger. The dude is rail thin, I mean like rail thin. That's interesting. Yeah, because he was a little he had a little baby fat on

him back in his heyday. Um, a lot there's a lot of a lot of calories and Louis the fourteen Konjak or whatever he was buying for thousand dollars a bottle. So um yeah. I mean again, like we haven't we haven't really touched on the live golf schedule which has

been released, or the TV deal. It's all it's the drama is like, it's we'll see how much if they can sustain that, because for that was one of the keys to their existence, was just the energy and the it was part of the conversation constantly, and it you know, Sports Business Journal named it the biggest story in sports, like that was not about the competition and the open there lingering questions and we're gonna pay attention to the competition, but look at the we're already off to this start.

We got a k we got t Gate, we got all this stuff. It's like, oh my god. I mean, we have talked about how impressed we all are that they are this far. Uh, but they definitely need a splash in the signing department. It seems this offseason, you know, there was a lot of rumors of top guys, can't Lexander all those guys, and they've all kind of sworn it off, and it seems like they've been telling the

truth like they haven't. You know, there's a lot of rumors that Meteo Pereira has gone, he's joined the agency, that uh, all the lift guys are under now. Daniel Report said that, and um, you know, so they need a splash and a K would be a splash Meto prayer not a splash. Yeah. The only thing about cant Le is he always says I'm committed the PGA Tour.

I love the PGA Tour for now. All those two words are always tacked on at the end, so um yeah, I mean it was interesting talking to people down at Tori, like, um, that's the one name that keeps popping up. Xander, I think is is definitely Team Tour forever. But Cantle's name still gets tossed around. Who knows. But I mean he's now on the board of Directors of the PGA Tour, like it would that would be. He was in the

Delaware meeting like it would be a big deal. There's still some bitterness that um um Joaki Neiman went because he was part of some some very rarefied conversations and he was you know, he's a great top young player who everyone had a high hopes for a one Tiger's event at Rivieria, like and and I'm still detected bitterness that he was kind of a double agent because he was part of some high level conversations on the tour

and then he went to Live. So Catley would be a much bigger betrayal, I mean in that context because he he is one of the keeper of the keys for the PGA Tour now. So I don't know that that's the problem for Live Golf is they've set this benchmark so high, like you've got to have the buzz, You've got to always make a splash, you you always have to be bringing in some impactful signing. But it seems like the bottle lines have been drawn and there's

just the only players available or kind of fringe. Did either of you have a moment where you saw the headline calling Mari calling Marikawa and and Adam Scott joined new Golf League and he thought, oh, they've joined Live and that you know, Tuesday night thing or whatever it is. Do you guys have that experience at all? Yeah, I mean a hundred percent. I forget about this Tiger Electronic game. I mean, like, what, it's not a new golf league.

It's what. I don't know what it is, but yes, for a moment, I'm like, oh my god, oh well, it's it's a money laundering scheme. It's like, how can we pay these guys more money to stay loyal to the tour? Uh? I mean, I'm gonna I'm I'm gonna watch it the first one. I might actually trying to attend the first one just for giggles, but maybe it's gonna be amazing. I'm trying to keep it open mind, but it just does seem like a way to get

these guys more, you know, unsanctioned money. But I think it is good to keep an open mind about it because, like I remember, I've probably have told you this story, Allan, but I'm probably not. But I happen to be standing under the trade Augusta National and Chip Brewer, the CEO of Cali, who was talking about some new investment they were making in this thing called top golf, and he described it very accurately. Was what it turned out to be? Like what a waste of money? You know? How wrong

was that? All? Right? Before we go, we got to talk about Maxima winning at Tori because we need to feel good story. And you know, Home I started out is kind of this fun, cuddly character with lots of jokes, and he's into an absolute killer. I mean he's winning on big time courses with really stout, precise, thoughtful golf. I mean his game is so built for the majors as obviously only the next step you went five times and twenty five months, like you've proven you you can close,

and he's closed. Now he's just gotta take it to that next level. But um, I don't know if you guys caught the tell the essentially the third round telecast when he was miked up in the round and he was talking to the announcers and he had the thing in his ear, and that was a major breakthrough coverage wise.

I mean he's talking strategy, he's talking the mental game in competition, and he's got like four different voices in his year because all the announcers are are hitting him up, and I mean, shows what a good sport he is. Um to take that on, But it was also it was great TV and this guy has become such a star because he's kind of proven you don't have to be an asshole to be a great player. You can be genuine and funny and sincere and sweet and also

a killer. I mean, what a what a combination. This, It's it's great stuff. He knows. He's got a really nice manner with reporters and with fans, with with his fellow players. You know, he's really the full package. He looks great, he's got a beautiful swing and um, and he doesn't quote just say the right thing. I mean, he actually tells you what he's feeling and thinking. I think he's been tourific for for the tour and you know,

going into l A. I mean he's shown that. I mean he's grew up in l A. And I'm sure he knows the course well, but way beyond that, just seems to love the grass in the air on the West coast. And uh, he looks like he'll be good for for for a long time to come. He's been terrific. Did a Monday Qualifier ever figure in his rise? Ryan, I'd like, yes, not only that, but I tweeted many times and tweeted about it yesterday. Yeah. Two things. One, Uh,

he was headed back to Q school. He was on the corn Ferry Tour, the top seventy five make it into the corn Ferry Finals. Max bertie four of the last five holes in the last regular season event to make the cut and keep his corner or get into the corn Ferry Finals by like ninety dollars or something. Then went on to get his PGA Tour card. But as I always try to give everything back to Monday's, he started the next tour season and played like shit.

I mean I think he had one made cut in eight events, and it was like a T sixty was at the waste management Monday. Uh, Monday qualified obviously a good event even before was an elevated event, and finished twenty six. Next week went to Pebble. An underreported story is, uh, somebody on the last hole in the final group missed a put to knock him from T eleven into two T ten to get into next week at Tory played

well there six weeks later one. So basically what I'm saying is every basically almost everyone's career always comes back to a Monday qualifier one way or another. Well, and it's gonna be painful for you to see what's happened to Patrick Reid because his whole career was built on Mondays, Like he could have been your Corey Connors. But no, no, he's not. I mean, I know it's still sad because like he is by far the most you know, famous,

infamous uh Monday qualifier. I mean he not only Monday qualified six times, but did well with him and then got in a car that Sunday night or on a plane and drove with Justine to the next one and she caddied for him, and he'd get through again and play well again. They did that four weeks in a row once. That's insane. Uh, it's beyond insane. That is,

it's almost mathematically impossible. Oh well, I'd like to say, Michael said, cue Michael's clip about cues Michael clip when he said, I'd like to clearly state that Patrick Reed is a wonderful man. I would like to say this about Patrick Reed if I may. Patrick Reed is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life.

That was often the Manchurian candidate. Right is that where yeah, I didn't I didn't get it then when you said it, But back and listen to the podcasts like god, Um, yeah, the PGA Tour needed Maxima. Like he was always a big figure because of his social media following, but now that he's backing up with amazing play and obviously going to be one of the favorites at the US Open, he plays well in California. Uh, Like, I mean, this

came at a perfect time. There could not be you know, Cam Smith is is super quiet and and seems to be a good dude. Um, but like take the other top players that live and max it could not be more opposite, engaging, funny, uh and a stone cold killer. All of a sudden, the PGA Tour needed Maxima badly and they got it. The dude is killing it and at a perfect time for the PGA Tour. Oh yeah. I tweeted this once and like ten people replied, Oh, you just made that up. I was like, I didn't

make it up. I actually I'll never forget. I saw on Twitter. It was as at a tournament and I was just checking out and and it was a couple a couple of friends on Twitter. We're talking about who they were going to watch that day, and um, and one of them tweeted his buddies suggested Brooks and he's like, I don't like Brooks. He's like, let's go, let's go watch Max Holmer or Joel Damon because I like those guys that relate to them and I feel like I

know them. Um, that really did happen. I really did read that. I showed screenshot it. But that was like, this was years ago. This is the way I think. Maybe they had one combined Victory Home and Damon and that was a lightbulb thing, like how how much it's changed. It was almost like the players were the gods before and you watched them with Awe and Tigers. The quintessence of that, like he was just he wasn't even really

he didn't even interact with the fans. He just gave you this regal performance and you were privileged to get to watch it. You would never know him, he would he would never talk to him, he'd never sign autograph, he would never say anything of note. Um, but that was that was what it was. And now there's been such a sea change where um, because you know, these guys do podcasts and they do fun this than that, and they have their social media presence. The most popular

players are the relatable ones. And kind of the nice guys and the ones who who make their their Twitter followers feel special, and um, it's really been like this democratizing influence. And of course Home is obviously clearly um the king of that and and just surfs on this

good will. I mean, I was out there at Torrey Pines and people absolutely love the guy and they're they're they're they're talking to him as he's going down the fairway and they're shouting at him, and you know, he gives the nad the tip of the cap like there

really is a connection that. Um. If you know, I came up watching Faldo and Sevy and tournaments and Tiger and you know, Monty and these guys were they were so glad, worrying and so remote and they gave you an incredible golf to to enjoy and and to stand it off. But you they were these unknowable, untouchable figures.

And it's so interesting how that's flipped to me. Anyway, Alan, you may have picked up on this, but when Max Homa was paired with with Tiger the first tear rounds of the Open uh this year at at at St. Andrew's, to me, he looked just totally distracted, Uh, knowing that he might be playing with Tiger Woods at Tiger's Final Open on the Old course. Uh, he just you know, talk about not being a stone cold killer. I mean at that moment, I don't think you for those thirty

six sols, I don't think he was. He's a fan and there's something charming about that. You know, he's almost like he didn't try and hide it, you know. And back to Max's interview on the course. Uh, for those that say we're PGA Tour like he's that's a percent because of lift, not that Max is not a good dude and wouldn't agree to it, but just in a ations in the in the watching product, the PGA Tour didn't have any reason to be innovative, like zero, they

like people watch their stuff. They didn't have any competition. The innovations in the broadcast are to live. It's there is no if you dispute that you're wrong, like and like and and and the players agreeing to it. Not that Max is not a good guy and he wouldn't agree to it, but he knows. They know that there's competition, so they're more open to do stuff like that. Knowing

that they want to get people to watch their product. Alan, did you ever have a moment of what it would be like to watch Phil Mickelson in the booth as opposed to Trevor Mmelman. Uh? Yeah, I think. I think Trevor is good. I like him, but you know, he doesn't have Phil's needle, and he's not a star in the way that that Phil is. And Um, I mean, clearly it's a miss. I'll be curious if how much will get filled into the booth like they they'd be crazy,

not too. I mean the problem is, you know, Um, at a regular tournament, you can play in the morning and you can go in the booth in the afternoon, like players have done that through the years, and now with a shotgun, he fills playing whenever everyone else is playing. Like I think, hopefully he'll come down with a mysterious wrist injury or something and he can just sit there up with Charity and shoot the scenery and it would be epic and it would help them a lot. It

would happen during the San Diego event. Bones appears and ads and filled is not. I know, it's San Diego all places, I mean, it's wild. It's these are These are strange and and interesting times. Um, but at least we got you know, the fall into the winter early parts of the winter. Now not things are going gangbusters. I mean Tori Dubai is a great double header as far as two big time tournaments and and of course

next week Pebble beats Home game. For me, I know people have feelings about the format and then there's not a lot of stars, but just to watch those golf courses on TV is so special and um and by the way, Episode two of The Grind is going to drop next week on Tuesday, and it's all set at the at the Crosby clam Bake where one Ryan French is catting for Mark Baldwin. And I watched episode a

bunch of times. Now it is a plus plus. It is so well done and if you want to know what it feels like to be inside the ropes at a tour event, and for a guy whose entire life can change with a few swings like this episode brings it home with such immediacy and it is it's a great it's a great watch. So I know a lot of these listeners probably watched episode one and we're into it and I can just tell you Episode two is it takes a whole different level, and then the third

episode is is a completely different feeling. It's about Page Crawford, who travels the the Mini tours in a van with her girlfriend and they're like, do you remind me of les sort some of these women I know in Big Sir, Like they've got their their free spirits and they're they're rock climbing and they're hiking in the hills, and there's just a sort of ethol quality about about Page is so winning. And if you watch that and you don't wind up rooting for her, then um, you might be

patrick reed. But it's it's um the grind. We're really proud of it, and it's just gonna keep coming. So you can subscribe to the fire Pit YouTube channel and they'll just be delivered to you. You can find it on fire pit collected dot com. That'll be on on Tuesday, um the thirty one to January, so look forward to that. And Ryan has I mean Ryan is honously the star of that episode. It's so fun and um, first of all,

the episode is amazing. Obviously I'm biased, but it is great insight into the pressure and the joy and the the ups and downs of being a golfer on the fringe of of this life, being good enough to play, uh, to be out there and not be out there, and the the amazing highs Saturday afternoon and amazing lows Sunday afternoon for us, and uh, it's just great insight. But also, uh, I do gain forty pounds within the episode. The first

interviews are when I was at my best. Wait, and the second part of the interviews we needed to go back and reshoot a couple of interviews or at the Baracuta. And I've gained thirty pounds, so please just like, let's not talk about it, okay, I'll just I'm just getting it out in the open. I was skinny and in shape at the Baracuta. In fact, there's a line, uh the second hole, Michael and and Allen will have to help me. Second roll it. Monterrey is like, what's the

part three? Down the hill? That's amazing the second my Prince of country Club four. Well, the third hole is a downhill. Part three? Yes, so three, So you have to walk up to this big hole, to this big t that's way up the hole, way up the hill and I say to Mark, and it's in the cliffs, Like, thank god, I'm in shape. I would have fucking died on this hill and now I'm fat again. So hey, I just want to is it out there? Okay, let's just not bring it up. I brought it up. Let's

please watch the video. You keeping enough? Does the does? The episode? One is great? I haven't watched two yet. Is there a nod in two to Steve Young's t shot on twelve that Mark Baldwin described for me today? Oh my god, so is it in there? No, it's not particular shot, but you get a great feel for Steve Young. Mark, Steve Young double hit a full shot. I have never in my life. It's impossible. It is literally impossible. He hit it here and here and it

went back and over his shoulder over there. It's you, like you try it as much as you want to pop it up, like he got kind of chunked it. But it's a full shot and he has like he's obviously in great shape and very athletic. He's not a good golfer, but like he's very athletic, and he has a fast swing. I don't know how you do it. Like it's not like if it was a very slow old swing like okay, I could see it. He took

a full swing and hit the double hit. Was not like you know, all double hits are here here right, This was like here and here he hit it back over his shoulder. It was a great insight into like it just lightened us up. We started laughing so hard and and and on that whole Uh. Mark said, you know, I've seen a lot of things in my pro career. I've never seen a full shot double hit. That's so great. I love it. That's in the director's cut that will

be released to a later date. Anyway, all right, well, fellas, it's always fun. Um. We'll dedicate this episode to the memory of of Howard friend. Um. It was. It was meaningful to hear hear all that um really rich and um and thoughtful commentary from both you guys. That I had a little tear in my eye. So that uh. But as always there's a little bit of lovity here on the Fire Drill, and there's various diversions and so this was a fun one for um for Michael Bamberger

and Ryan French. I'm Alan Schipnik. This is Fire Drill Podcast. We'll do it again next week. Thanks for as always for listening, and go watch the grind. I promise you're gonna enjoy it. That's the end. A bed big and I played to win, made a fortune, win my ship game, and I ran the table. Never thought I could fall. Then the winter time hit me like a cannon ball, and now I can't shake this, losing the stream. Every

road I take is a dead hand stream. I got thoughts in my head, can't get joy, and not to think what I'm thinking about in my head. I can't get him out, and not to think what I'm thinking about. Told