Marcus Flashford and the Full Pardew - FA CUP FINAL 2016

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like this. Welcome, ladies and gentlemen, to the Final Countdown, the podcast looking back at great finals within the game of football. I'm Lewis here, my Co host Adam, hello there. And we are continuing our run of FA Cup finals, the the oldest and possibly the greatest cup competition in the world. Well, definitely the oldest. Yeah, definitely factual. Come on mate, what other domestic cup are you saying is? Bad. Well, we're English.

We're not gonna say, oh, you know, I really like the Spanish Cup. The Copa del Rey. I knew you can resist, I know, but that is inaccurate. Haven't. Let's let's move past the Spanish Cup because that's not what we're covering. No. And we, you know, spoiler alert, probably never. I can't imagine we'll do that. Although we could pick the top three, which will ultimately just be Barcelona, Real Madrid. Cup 5 We suddenly get a massive Spanish listening burrito caliente.

And we've lost all our Spanish listeners. It's Spanish. It's just hot dogs. Yeah, sure. Yeah, we speak nonsense in Spanish and we speak nonsense in English. And with that, let's talk about what turns out to be a bit of a nonsense final only because of people's reactions to it. So there's there's one very specific moment of utter nonsense, utter woke nonsense that we want to talk about.

But let's talk about the 2016 FA Cup final, hotly contested between Manchester United and Crystal Palace. Yes, yes. Yes, yes, comes flooding back exactly. So quite a bit of nonsense, but Crystal Palace will give a bit of context as to where both clubs were at this time because it's a funny time for both of them. Palace obviously have had a resurgence in the last year or 18 months where they have become kind of a lot of people's favorite second club.

Think a lot of really well. I just think a lot of people admire their style of football. I think they admire the fact that they. Mean now or then. Yeah. No, no. No, now, now, yeah, OK. I'll give you that. I think under. Yeah, sorry. I thought I meant under Pardue like well. Absolutely not. No, nobody liked. Nobody likes to party, and that includes the Crystal Palace. Spoiler Lewis really doesn't like party.

I don't. Know why we'll get into it maybe but anyway, so we're talking about the 2016 FA Cup final. Manchester United were making their first FA Cup final appearance since 2007. So we've obviously spoken a lot over the last two episodes of Wenger and Arsenal and their state of things. And it's funny really that we haven't once really spoken about, you know, being pushed or, or having a rival in the cup like Manchester United. So they haven't been there. So been.

No, but in a way they had a manager history that proved that. Yeah, yeah, the opposite of the Wenger kind of stick. Stick by the guy. You know, I just kept trucking managers out and bringing the managers. In yeah, exactly. Hoping some would stick. So despite the poor season, United entered as clear favourites in the most media predictions. As you'd kind of imagine, even though United weren't anywhere in the cups, they'd been doing OK in the league. So who was manager of United?

So it was Louis Van Hire. Louis Van Hire's Red Army Queen's Park Raisins. I just love doing lady saxophone. Big applause. Every human being who is. Crept with the hair only with with sex. Muscle casement then it is allowed but not in other. Situations. I just love my Louis Van Hal quote impressions. But the key storyline here is that United, under manager Louis Van Hal, had sought silverware amid league struggles. So in the League Cup they've been knocked out by middle.

So this is this season, 2016, they've been knocked out by Middlesbrough on penalties in the fourth round. In the League Cup they had been knocked down in Champions League Group State each. They were in the Champions. League they were in the Champions League, they got knocked down the group stage. They were then demoted to the Europa League, as was the way back then and they now they then lost two rivals, Liverpool in the Europa League.

So it hadn't been very successful at all in the round of 16. They finished fifth at the end of the season outside the Champions League. So it's kind of. Yeah, nowadays a successful in it. Which is a crazy thing to say, but yeah, you're not quite yeah. But. Back then, this was seen as really kind of well, we're still. It's the post Ferguson era, isn't it? We're talking about three seasons since he left after this.

So yeah. And it's there was more turmoil to come, which obviously history tells us, but they were only on their second post, folks and manager, weren't they? It was more he's then. More he's stand on hall, yeah. Then they get Jose Marina we'll talk a little bit about and then Solshar and then run it just. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Absolutely ridiculous. But yeah, United, despite having huge history and it being in recent memory, that's the difference between now and then, is United are faltering as they are now. But this was, like you say, it was so soon after Ferguson. It was like, at some point it will click and United will become a giant again. They will become a team. Certainly their fans expected

that, yeah. I think most people that have grown up with United being the top team kind of assumed at some point they would because they always. Did. Yeah, exactly. Obviously the main difference was Ferguson was no longer there. Yeah, I mean, having grown up in the 90s as a Liverpool fan, it was just you just got sick of United being that kind of boogeyman.

And you just always thought like, it's like Freddy Krueger, man, United were Freddy Krueger. It's like I'd shut my eyes, I'd go to dream and actually it turned into a nightmare. So we're like, oh, great, United have won again. United have taken the lead again. And I just, yeah, I still have those flashbacks where I'm just like, it will happen. United will just come back,

dominate. I think that relentlessness, the ability we've talked about before on the podcast, that relentlessness for Ferguson to recreate. So, you know, Arsenal came along and he came back. Chelsea came along and he came back. It, you know, it was a bit kind of like how many times can the guy reinvent the team? And I think because of that, it didn't feel like, you know, when, you know, Chelsea had a couple of good seasons, you didn't think of Chelsea as they'll. Always be good.

Whereas United, it's taken a while for a non United fan to accept the fact that they aren't a top team. Yeah. Yeah, no, you're right. And I still, I still consider them a top team because of the emotional scarring of being back. Yeah, maybe. Yeah, yeah. I still can't accept that and it was proved right this season already, but when Liverpool played them I was like United will beat us because even though we've had an incredible record. But then none of us. But I doubt and we'd go back.

But I doubt the predictions any of us thought United were finished top 4. No, no, I'm certain which. Is a good indicator of this is actually what you think of the team now, Yeah. And back in 2016, there was a lot of disgruntled United supporters, mainly for the style of football that Van Hal was doing.

A lot of crosses, a lot of fairly stodgy defensive play and there was still that sense of no, there's a United Way of playing and this and the other to highlight that they had 49 league goals, which was the clubs lowest in Premier League history up until that point and anti Martial was their top scorer in the league with 11 goals. So kind of tells you where they're at end of the season,

their top striker, 11 goals. Palace, on the other hand, managed by Alan Pardew. He's spoken about and he has history in this competition. So I wanted he does. Yeah. I wanted to be unbiased and give a, a, a fair appraisal of where Alan Pardew was at. So obviously a player in 1990 when Palace reached that first over final which ironically they lost to Manchester United. He scored in the semi don't. He did. Scored the famous swimming goal against Liverpool.

He was manager for West Ham in the Gerrard final so he'd managed to get to obviously 2 finals, 1 as a player, 1 as a manager. Lost both. Palace hoped to land their first major trophy in the club's history, which they've now gone and done happens. Well, not with Padre though. Nice. Thank God we'd never hear the end of it would be. But Palace started the league brilliantly at the start of this 2016 season, so they were fifth at Christmas.

But unfortunately things kind of went down from there. Their form collapsed in the second-half of the season. They went 14 games without a win between December and April. So that's why despite United's kind of faltering position in the league, that's why United were favourites, because the momentum, well, I wouldn't say it was with United, but it certainly wasn't with Palace anymore. 14 games without a win. He did well to hang on, didn't he?

That's quite right, Agree. Yeah, I completely agree. But yeah, maybe because they achieved in the first half first kind of like, oh, maybe we've been unlucky etcetera, etcetera. But yeah, 14 league games without a win is relegation form really. But nevertheless they they kind of managed to rally and just finished low to mid table. But that's why Man United were favourites despite not being in

impeccable form. So in the ethic up itself, Crystal Palace's path, just to kind of highlight who they've beaten on route. They beat Southampton, they've beaten Stoke, they've beaten Tottenham, Reading and then Watford. So a mixed A. Mixed No massive win there. Is no. I mean, Tottenham has a cup team, not that that's really been true in the 20 tenth. Yeah, it's not actually. Yeah. No. So there's nobody. I suppose you could argue they would have had Kane, wouldn't they?

At that point, yes, they would have done That's that's a bit of a win. Yeah, they managed to to scrape past Tottenham one nil. United's path, however, was arguably even easier. So they had Sheffield United, Derby County, Shrewsbury Town and they had to beat West Ham United in a replay. So they managed to win 21 away after A1 all draw at home and then they be Everton 21 in the semifinals. Giant killing, that is. Well, some might say that not many.

In fact, you. I think the person opposite me is the only person. I'm mocking my own team there. It's a healthy thing to have if you're in everything. So I just think it's interesting looking at the types of teams that have made the finals in the last few episodes that we've seen. So we've seen Wigan make a final, we've seen the whole make a final, we've seen Aston Villa make a final, we've seen Palace make a finals.

So there's kind of four or five years in a row where an unfavoured Top 14, yeah, yeah, not Top 14 has managed to play off against a traditional. Do you think that's about Europe? Interesting. There was a lot more English teams involved in European competition. They would have prioritize those, or at least not necessarily prioritize. But by the time the FA Cup came around. They just got wasn't the priorities.

Well, if they were still in it and they're gonna you know, they if you get through the pre Christmas Europe, you're in the competition really, aren't you? You would be round 16, possibly quarter finals. So when the FA Cup comes along, you're like, well, we're in the quarter finals of this thing as in the European competition, you might prioritize that. And English teams typically do go quite far in European competition. Yeah, certainly. Yeah, No, that's a really good point.

Maybe that's what contributes to it. I just thought it was interesting that we go through this little phase of having this unfavoured team against a kind of traditional giant. But with that, let's let's stop talking about the context and get into the match itself. Or added minutes and Gerard stunning. I'll take a bow, son. I mean that take a bow, you have been immense. So as the game kicked off, United started far more assertively.

They were controlling possession and tempo with, and I don't know if you'll remember this, but Wayne Rooney started central midfield from Man United. I was just going to say this is near the end of Rooney but he is still there, isn't he? Is yeah, and he, I think he even capped into the side on this occasion, he. Yeah. Yeah, very true. But he's starting center mid 31 years of age, which compared to the likes of Hurricane or whatever like seems relatively young nowadays.

But I think it's fair to say Rooney, he wasn't the most gifted physical footballer in terms of his. He had to fight his body to yeah. Definitely, it seems that way. Yeah, exactly. To to get to the way, but also the way he played football, health, leather, thrown his body into everything from the age of 16, playing men's football. I just think it took its toll, saw kind of Rooney burn out a bit quicker than some of the

other players that maybe. I think it was generation, yeah, he was 120% when he was, he was relentless to the way he played. Whereas someone like a cane, I'm not saying he isn't physical, but you know, it's probably easier for him to drift in and out of games and make impact. Yeah, I guess you could argue the same with people like Gerard and you know Lampard, people that keen even that people that were the engine room of their teams probably didn't last as. Long, I mean, Lampard wasn't too

bad. I think Lampard got. But again, it's fair to say that the last three years of his career were not like the 15 that have gone. But yeah, Gerard's legs kind of started to go and no, I think you're right when you are the the core of your team. But nevertheless, Rooney would play an important role in this game. So he started to dictate the the pace. However, Crystal Palace a little bit like they do now we're known for their counter attacking.

So they had Wilfred Zaha, who back in this era of Crystal Palace was their shining star. And then you had the hold up play of a young colour Wickham, who was their kind of target man striker, didn't really ever go on to achieve. Much because they're not thought about that name. No exactly. During the 1st 15 minutes United dominated but they couldn't get any clear cut opportunities. Can I, can I just check is this Pogba United? Not quite yet. He would be signed from Juventus

the start of the next season. Yeah. So Pogba isn't quite there yet. It's a very thin on the ground United team. When you look at the kind of the lineup, it's not particularly spectacular. So it's Wilfred Zaha who led the counter attacks of Palace, obviously with a massive point to prove. He had signed for United a couple of seasons beforehand, hadn't established himself at all there despite being a mainstay in the Crystal Palace side.

So kind of his he had a point to prove and you can see he's very, very busy in this final. Doesn't influence it as much as maybe you'd hope for. Nevertheless, it's Zaha who is the main creative outlook. And then a major flashpoint happens. Wickham, Connor Wickham burst through about 15-16 minutes in, shrugs off Chris Smalling, who we will talk about a little bit later on, but nevertheless the referee Klattenberg, So Mark Klattenberg.

Gladys does. Really. Well, The thing is, he doesn't like the physical game back then, I can tell you that now. So as Wickham shrugs off Chris Smalling, he manages to cut inside and he scores a really good goal. However, he blown his whistle a second earlier. People had stopped play in order to give Crystal Palace the advantage, as in to give them the free kick, when if he just allowed advantage, Palace would have gone one nil up. Klattenberg at the end of the

game. Upon review, does upon review, it has been a judge that he kind of said, look, you won't go on my. First whistle. Chris Smallick, you will go on my second whistle. A man. A man who loves himself. He does. Yeah. Yeah, he does. But nevertheless, he kind of admitted that he made a few mistakes at the end of this final, Which part of me is like, well, well done for fronting up, but the other part of me is like, just stay quiet. Like, does it make Palace feel any better?

Referees can't win though, can they? They can't win like when they when they come out and say treat us like humans, they're like, you know how many mistakes you making? It's like, well then don't ask. Yeah, it's just a bit. They can't win. It is literally a human being making a judgement in split second time. Like I, I got a some refs annoy me but I actually got quite a lot of sympathy for refs. I it's thankless. I got to say, are you head of

the like refs? Thankless mate, it really is, especially with the way that football's attitude is. I think it's telling that no former football has ever become refs ever, because that's the ultimate. Like, why on earth would I ever put myself in the position of what I've given to the refs over the years? But nevertheless, it's a really poor piece of refereeing from Klanberg, you've got to say. And if you watch the footage back? He's an idiot mate.

I mean, so unsurprisingly, Alan Padre kicks off. But again, he's justified. I feel like this is my reclamation project with Padre. I'm trying to give him credit where credit's due. He does kick off because, rightly, he can feel aggrieved. For the next kind of 10 minutes, United start to find their rhythm. So Anthony Martial, their top scorers. We spoke about tests. Wayne Hennessy with a curling effort. Fellaini starts to win his aerial duty. Yeah, this is a strange Man

United squad. Starts to win his Aeroj. What was that number 4? The guy is 7. Foot 5 foot that his hair to be fair but nevertheless Fellaini starts to throw his weight around a little bit Palace start to sit back and look to counter attack. As you'd expect the best chance of united half though comes not long before the first end of the first half.

It's Juan matter. His low cross reaches Fellaini 6 yards out but unfortunately he's got the worst first touch in the world and it bubbles over to Wayne Hennessy and it's like this golden opportunity that you're like Matt has done the hard work. Fellaini just a little bit of quality, but it evades him with David Hayer, he'd barely been

troubled in the United goal. A Palace had kind of countered through Jason Punch and Wilfred Zaha, but again, no clear cut chances and the half finishes nil nil. Quite drab, fairly kind of scripted in terms of you'd expect United to dominate palace to counter attack, but at this point it doesn't look like anyone really wants to to go and. Win it. That's interesting as well because we talked last week about FA Cup finals that get to nil, nil and it was.

It was 4 wasn't for. The last 20 years or something like that. So it's the fifth. Yeah. Yeah, a bit strange. Yeah, it's a bit unusual, but I guess the state of where these both these teams were out. But it's different when it's like, oh Arsenal, you know, you were a swaggering attacking team, be less. It'd be more unusual for them to be nil. Nil and probably incredibly

important for both teams to win. Yeah, as in the you know, not to say Arsenal tournament didn't give a monkeys, but the the the emphasis on these two teams to win this final was enormous. Yeah, absolutely. From their, you know, from their viewpoint. Yeah, of course.

So as the second-half begins, Palace start to press higher up, they start to be a lot more aggressive and a bit more on the front foot. Rooney however, starts to be more aggressive from midfield and I don't just mean throwing elbows, Phil Bosley knocking out style, but he does. He just starts to be a lot more aggressive and you start to see the the kind of big game player that Rooney could be even in his advancing years and in a a deeper position.

He starts to control the tempo of the game, starts to drive United forward. So Marcus Rashford who had kind of emerged under Van Hal, a very, very young Marcus Rashford. He was the great hope of United. He had kind of emerged. And to be fair to Van Hal, there are a few youngsters that got their starts with him and he kind of trusted the youth quite a bit. And Rashford is one of the few kind of bright sparks that you look back on Van Hal's time and go, OK, he looked after

Rashford, promoted him. He brought him in, however, as Flashford. Flashford Hey. Marcus Marcus Flashford great player. Yeah, he's not, not as consistent as we like, but I tell you what, he's got a lovely bit of skill in him when he wants it. Marcus Flashford. Marcus Rashford flashes across the across, across goal. I can't do this or something. I've only recently recovered from a bug. We'll blame it on that. You won't see them or hear them, but they might.

Mistakes Lewis is making today. Isn't so It's great editing. It's great editing, right? Let's see if I can get this out in one go. Marcus Rashford flashed a cross across goal. I mean, you've written. Yeah, you've written a really difficult sentence. There we go. The arsonist had oddly shaped feet. The Human Torch was denied a bank loan. Marcus Rashford flashed across across goal where Marshall's header hit the inside of the post. So United go very close to

breaking the deadlock. Unfortunately denied by the woodwork. United start to increase the pressure, though, starting to get past the hour mark. Fellaini's chest control sets him up for a really good volley that smashes off the crossbar. So United to start over him. Yeah. And they're starting to think, you know, is this going to be our day or not? Is this one of these cursed games where you've got all the pressure, you're not taking your chances, are you?

Kind of going to suffer. And the answer is yes, albeit briefly. So 72 minutes in against the run play, Palace end up striking first so Jason Puncher of. Course. Just on for Yoan Kabai latches onto Delaney loop pass on the back post. He controls it really well on his chest, smashes a shot high and pretty venomously past David to hair and goal, gives Palace the lead. The crowd go mental. The players go mental. Alan Pardew turns directly to the camera. He makes eye contact.

Is he the camera? He looks at the middle-aged married women looking at home. He's beams into their lounge and he does the cringes dad dance in the world and it is just horrendous. And what's terrible, part of why I hate Pardue so much is what an incredible historic moment for this club. Yeah, they've got one up against you like they've never won a trophy in their life. It's latish in the game and you think there's a real chance they go on and win this. What does Pardue do?

Make it about himself? I can't stand the blow. Do you think the Palace players through the game because they're alive? We win this. Yeah. That's all you'll see. Yeah, For the rest of time. They they are fans of football first and foremost, fans of Palace second. They thought, lads, we've got to do this for the sake of football. It's just not good enough. It's just outrageous. It'd be a crime against humanity if pardon was in the Hall of Fame for forgiven that dance.

But nevertheless, because there's the thing, surely, I know I'm going to rant, but surely you would get lost in the passion of the moment like. It just seems a bit like as he arranged to do that. Yeah, as he thought that laugh. We go on and off. I'm going to like rub it in their face or something like that. But despite the fact that I am very clearly a Liverpool fan, I have no desire to see Man United happy. I was a little bit happy that only three minutes later United

would equalise. So United end up hitting back. It's Wayne Rooney, picks up the ball in the halfway line, surges past 3 Crystal Palace players, does really, really well. Just rides at them. Yeah, absolutely. And it even at 31, you're like what? A player he starts drive past and he gets driven just to the kind of right hand side of the six yard box and chips a really delightful cross to the back post.

Who's there? Marian Fellaini, who chests the ball and do you think he's going to set him up for a volley? But as the ball rolls off his chest, Juan Matter comes in on the left hand side, strikes a shot that gets slightly deflected. But nevertheless, Juan Matter scores from A really well worked. Rooney, he's a good player. Yeah, yeah, me too. And he gets he gets united back in the game only three minutes later. Palace and Pardews. Joy I. Do not dance in that.

Well, he can only last three minutes. That's what I've heard, but I won't tell you what source I've heard that from. I don't wanna know where you read that from. Yeah, the less we talk about party and his 3 minutes the better. The less we talk about party, half this podcast has been to right party. How's he taking up the airwaves still? I'm just part of his game. He's pulling the strings. He's the puppet master.

But the last five minutes of normal time are fairly uneventful. Michael Carrick gets brought on for Man United again towards the end of his career. To try and say brought on, why was he on there? Yeah, he's coming up towards the end of his career, but it means that extra time beckoned so Rashford would go off injured earlier. I mean, Flashford, Flashford, Flashford was not doing any more step overs this game.

No more of honors. He's been taking off and it's a young again, a young Jesse Lingard. People. Absolutely. Yeah, Jesse Lingard. So United started to show their tenacity and they started to kind of turn the screw a little bit in the second, in the extra time. Sorry. Fellaini continued to dominate, as you'd expect. He's really quite focal in this, which is strange because. He was that kind of player, though. Weren't he, let's say.

I think him and someone like Scott Mctominay were really good players in the United squad that was really suffering. And I think that that's so Macdominy. But certainly Fellaini, because the way he looked and he'd come from Everton as a Moy signing, yeah, was kind of ridiculed. But Fellaini and Macdominy were actually really important for United and. They were. Rather, they weren't the problem.

No, absolutely. Yeah. And yet they were easily kind of pinpointed when actually it's like, hold on, we've seen now they definitely weren't. They were kind of play as you needed, maybe not the ones that you associate with United, but what they needed at the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. However, 105 minutes in, so right at the end of the first half of extra time, Chris Smallink had already been booked. Halls down, Yannick Bellassi to stop a counter attack and gets

his second yellow card. So a red card, so we're covering. Loads of them in there. Yeah, it's like London buses. You don't get one for ages and then all of a sudden they come along at the same time. It must have been one in the 1st 90 years of this competition and now that's up to 5 or 6. Nice. Crazy. Yeah, absolutely ridiculous. So United down to 10 men with the second-half of extra time left. However, with Palace pushing forward because they knew they they kind of had the advantage.

Now everyone's knackered, you've literally got 10 minutes to win the game. Palace With the younger squad, Palace were the kind of relying on their speed and were trying to use their energy to their advantage. The ball broke loose inside the box after it was cleared. However, Jesse Lingard reacts quickest. He meets it first time on the half volley, A thunderous strike. It's a really good goal, it's worthy of winning an FA Cup. Ten men are striving for a good

breakthrough here. They've got it, Jesse Lingard, with a dumping goal. History before your very eyes. Jesse Lingard, who again, through happenstance happens to be there because Flashford got injured. You do wonder, like, yeah, I don't know. I think This is why we love looking back at these finals because there's so many like domino moments of butterfly effects, like if Russia doesn't get injured, do. Does Lingard get this moment? Exactly.

Or actually, do Palace end up kind of nipping, nicking it and then things change and Padre stays on as Palace manager and becomes England manager and England in the World Cup? It's a funny one with Jesselyn Garden because he was, he was like of such a mainstage, certainly of that early. Southgate era, massively so. And then he just, I guess he screwed it up. I can only I don't know. I think there's a lot of off the pitch issues, not like scandal necessarily, but I think he he just.

Just wasn't focused. Yeah, that's what exactly. Yeah, that's what seems. Come along. He kind of is interested in his fashion, interested in other avenues outside of football. And I think he just kind of fell out of love with the game. By all accounts, he seems to be enjoying himself in South Korea now.

But but yeah, nevertheless, it's it's a bit sad to see where Lingard's ended up. He's of that generation of Deli Alli. And I know there were much different reasons for that, but he's kind of before Eric Dyer joined Monaco, he looked like he was going the same way. But actually there's kind of yeah, Ross Barkley like that era where there was a lot of players in the similar England sports Fabian Delphi spoke about last episode that didn't quite kick on and and achieve their full potential.

But nevertheless, he'll always have this moment to look back on it. So scores an incredible goal, pure instinct, the technique. Wembley was stunned. United's bench explodes and United go on to lift the FA Cup

trophy. Well, you have. Just witnessed 90 of the most. Gripping minutes of European football you'll ever. I've ever seen the good. News is there's more to come, so an extra time is worth noting. Just a few talking that extra time of our podcast, not the game. Of course, it's worth knowing Wayne Rooney, Man United captain, was given man of the match. Does he lift the cup? Yeah. Well, is him and Carrick a joint? Obviously Carrick came on as a

sub. I think like you said earlier or mentioned earlier, it's difficult to think of who else would have been Man United captain at the time, because those two are really the kind of the veterans and the people that were withholding. Well, holding the changing room together. Really. Yeah, exactly. What you read about now? But yeah man, the match at that age is pretty decent.

Yeah, absolutely. And he was kind of just, yeah, still proving that he had it. That winning the FA Cup, however, wasn't good enough to save Louis Van Hal his job. Oh, another manager. Another manager post final. Absolutely. So yeah, like Mancini, who we spoke about previously for Man City, Van Hal was sacked 2 days later, with Jose Mourinho being appointed shortly afterwards. So it seems as though, yeah. I remember that. I felt like that was a lot to do with the fact Mourinho was

available. Yeah, rather than they. I think if Mourinho hadn't been available, I think Van Hal maybe would have stayed I. Think you're right in terms of they, man, I'd still wanted the big name manager. They needed somebody that had kind of a heavyweight

reputation. Yeah. The only thing was the fans were really unhappy with Van Hal and I think, I wonder if that would have broken the camel's back regardless, because the lack of attacking football, the lack of goals, but nevertheless, they've still got silverware to show for it. Yeah. But yeah, the rumours are that Van Hall was told immediately after lifting the cup that he was told that he wouldn't have his. Cup What is wrong with the people that run these football clubs?

It's crazy but it was announced publicly 2 days later with Jose Mourinho being pointed. So Chris Malling we mentioned this became only the 4th player ever to be sent off in an FA Cup final. So United had a record they probably weren't that proud of, which is their only club to ever have two players sent off in an FA Cup final. Yeah, Man City had had one. Different FA Cup final, it's not the second. One. Yeah, yeah, I didn't get that. 40 years apart.

It's a really long final, the replays and the replays and the replays. But referee Mark Klanberg, as I said, admitted that he made a couple of errors in the match regarding some of the advantage decisions, meaning one, it was the Conor Wickham early goal. Yeah. And here's an interesting tidbit of information. Just to finish. So 24 people have managed and played in an FA Cup final. Managed and played in an FA Cup final. Do you want to guess some of them? I'm not going to ask you to get.

Yeah, I'll be impressed if you can get 5. Yeah, Glenn Hoddle. Correct. Don't forget that moment, do you mate? Absolutely not. Glenn Hoddle Are they quite old school or? Some of them, they're big names, there's very few here that you wouldn't recognise. Padju. Correct you. Must love that Padju is Lampard. Correct. Has he? Yes. It's in there. You've done very well. Three from three so far. There's an Everton link. The Royal. Yes, there's another Everton

link that wasn't the one I was. Thinking oh, OK, Ferguson. No, no, no, I don't know it. Is maybe, maybe I'm misremembering Howard Kendall. Howard Kendall. You, oh, you must have played as. Yeah, yeah, fair enough. Yeah, yeah. Just trying to think of a couple more. One is an England England legend and featured for Man United. What's the say, Steve Bruce? He would have managed Middlesbrough half in, a suit, half in. Oh, Brian Robson. Brian Robson? Yeah, that's the most obvious 1, isn't it?

Absolutely. So a few more to add to this list. So Gianluca Viale, Roberto De Matteo, Mikhail Arteta, Barry, Bobby Gould. Sorry, Matt Busby, Bill Shankly, Don Revi, Kenny Dalglish, Terry Venables and that there are some others that aren't kind of recognisable. Yeah. I just thought that's a really interesting list of managers that is. And so many of them are actually like fairly modern day. I just thought I was interesting seeing the likes of Michael Arteta, Frank Lampard, Di Mateo.

If you were a player manager, do you instantly get that record that? I guess you, yeah, I guess you would can. You turn up once. Yeah, exactly. He was always efficient. That's why he was such a successful manager. He. Got the record done in one day. He gained the system. He knew what he was doing, so yeah, United ended up lifting the FA Cup trophy to try and take their record back from Arsenal for the most wins, yes, and we will see whether that trend continues in the 2017 FA Cup final.