Joy to the World

back at it again, another weekend of podcasting. Here. This a course, a spin off, as you know by now. He spin off of the Overnight show, the Ben Maller Show on Fox, and this all over the podcast world eight days a week now because four hours are not enough. And we welcome in yet again, David Gascon. This is an interview podcast. It's an interview podcast. Want me to play that? Uh? I was delightful about the guest selection that you had for this week. I know this is

this is Gascon's dream come true. I assume you already know now because you downloaded the podcast. Who was on the podcast but for a very long amount of time. Gascon has been badgering me with the Babylon Be and I have come around. I'm a big fan now of the Babylon Be. At first, I was like so annoyed because you would every day with these Babylon Be stories. I'm like, leave me alone, Leave me the f alone. But I've come around, and they've blown up here this

year in this election year. Babylon b which is a satire site, and they've been in the news a lot because they got shut down this week. It's by Facebook because of inciting what was it? Inciting violence on a satire site, which is just outstanding. So we have tracked down here ask on the man that runs it. The CEO of the Babylon Be, Seth Dylan's gonna hang out with us here on this podcast, which I'm excited about.

I was it was a long time coming. I thought about the approach since we've had so many radio personalities on, and I figured this is a great time to have them on, especially because we got the election going on. People are voting, and we got obviously the huge day on November the three, and we didn't laugh a little bit. You you've had a wild week um Dodgers coming back last week in the NLCS in the World Series. You've

got Kyler Murray, you got got Republicans and Democrats. This is this is a good week for us, so that I thought it was appropriate for you. Yeah, yeah, I know, it's it's great with everything's going on. And I'm sure we'll last seth about the the President Trump retweet of the Babylon B which got a lot of attention recently as well, within the last ten days or so. So, uh,

we'll get to that as well. And for those that are unfamiliar, I don't know how you would be unfamiliar, because we talk about the Babylon B guest gun played as a game here every once in a while, B or not to be. But it's a satire side obviously. It's it's been been doing very well here. And as they say, I like the mottel they have on their

social media. I think it was on Twitter. I read this that fake news you can trust, fake news that you can trust, and uh, it's it's you know, it reminds me a little bit of the the Phil Hendry radio show from back in the day. I remember it because like if you listen to the Phil Henry radio Show. And you didn't know that it was a joke, you would be upset, right, you'd be like angry. But if you knew it was a joke, if you figured that out, and you'd be like, this is the most amazing this

like art, like this is art? What this is? And so the babila me like the way I consume it now, it's so funny when I read these stories and I you know, you know, they're satire whatever. And then the people that are hard ohs that don't get the joke. And that's my favorite part. That's I that's just outstanding. And these are people in society that have very important positions and politics and news and they don't get the joke.

It's it's really pretty funny. It's kind of piggybacking off of Sports Talk with Barry right because he would go Twitter change his name multiple times and people would just crush him or they would retweet him like he was breaking news. And that's the ya capain with the Beat because they have a good attention to detail with titles and pictures and then articles and then bang, could you imagine could you imagine if sports talk very joined forces with the Babylon be. Oh my god, you it would

be like all the superheroes teaming up in satire. It would be amazing. Uh man, all right, well let's get to it though, guess because we don't want to waste any time here. The man is standing by virtually, of course, we welcome in the CEO of the Babylon Being the man, one of the big shots that runs this thing. Seth Dylan is his name, and Seth, why don't we start with the reason we're having you on here? The Babylon Be. You guys ran a story, a political story, and got

shut down by Facebook. Kind of walk me through how this all happened, please, Yeah. I mean basically, Facebook has these community standards, and they have a complicated algorithm based artificial intelligence system that looks at various posts on their platform and links that are um posted on their platform to determine if they are hateful or inciting violence or threatening in some way, and so they're signals that they're looking for that will tell them, um, if the content

is posted violate their standards in some way. So, um fine. You know, to have systems in place like that, it's more efficient than having people looking at everything. You know, I don't think they have so much content on their system. It makes sense that they do that, but in this case, yeah, we posted it absolutely ridiculous article. It was basically a

re hashing of an old Monty Python scene. Um, you know, we we we took the scene from where they were in Monty Python and the Holy Grail where they were trying to condemn this woman as a witch and they were trying to figure out if she was a witch or not, and they decided to weigh her against the duck to see if she weighed as much as a duck. And it's just the most absurd scene ever, and they determined that she is in fact a witch and she

needs to be burned at the stink right. Well, we translated that scene into the confirmation hearing where Amy Coney Barrett was being grilled by these senators, um, and you know they're disparaging her and trying to make her look silly and whatever. So we took this duck scene from Monty Python and we made it. We made a spoof on it and and had the senators you know, suggesting that if she weighs more than a duck, and then you know she's a then she must be a witch

and we must have burned her. Well that language like we must have burned her? Was it triggered something? And fag Facebook flagged it as being, you know, an incitement to violence, and obviously it's not. But the incredible thing where it went where things went sideways a little bit, was when um, we appealed that that ruling and a person looked at it and then it reached out to us and said it is an incitement of violence. We stand by this. Uh, you need to make changes to

the article. And we just couldn't believe that that's insane. So like, you know, how's it where they assume the email you or you just go to your Facebook the babblelon bi Facebook page and you're like, you're done, that's it, It's over. Are you? Like? How how does the chain go where you find out you've been taken down, your your your financial opportunity demonetized? How did that work? Yes,

they send you a notification tour account. They have like a page quality section where you can analyze your page and see if you're compliant with their policies and and they give us a notification saying that one of our popes had been deleted because of violated community standards, and as a result of that, we were demonetized. So basically what that means is we can't make use of any

of Facebook's monetization tools. We can't use their instant articles platform, which allows you to display articles within Facebook and have Facebook ads on them for ad revenue. Um, you can't use their subscription platform to collect subscription revenue. Brand collaborations are no longer permitted. So they have a bunch of monetization tools that they restrict and turn off if you're violating the community standards. So they let us know that

those tools were no longer accessible to us. We would no longer be able to monetize our Facebook page until we fix this issue. And when we appealed and they denied the appeal, we had no choice. But they go to the media and try to make us think about this because it's just absolutely ridiculous, Like in what universe

is that article and actual incitement to violence. They say in their community standards that they take context into account when they review these things, Well clearly they didn't in this case. Yeah, so how does that you know? You you're an Internet guy? Obviously run the Babylon be You've been in the game for a long time, Like, how does that happen with the algorithm? Like, is it you know, somebody programming it obviously, or how does it end up

in that situation? And I saw your you posted on Twitter about this, and I saw a bunch of people underneath you said, yeah, I had something happened, you know, I'd said so and so, and I got in trouble with that. So like, how do you think this happened?

You know the algorithm? Well, I mean they code there out, they code their system to look for specific keys, phrases and words, and so a sentence like we must burn her, you know, burn her is clearly a reference to, you know, lighting someone on fire, and their systems aren't smart enough to look at the broader context and see that we weren't actually suggesting that Amy Coney Barrett be lit on fire by anyone. You know, the system is not smart

enough to detect satire. And then when they came out in their public statement, they didn't make a statement to Fox News when Fox inquired about this, and they said, you know, our systems have a hard time detecting satire. So we're sorry for this mistake. But but our response to that is, well, okay, your system failed, but then a person looked at and the person also failed, So you know, why did that happen? There's no explanation for that.

And to your point, yes, there are lots of people commenting underneath his posts talking about how they've been flagged and they've been disabled, they've been suspended, but they don't have the platform that we have. They can't get online and get the media involved and and push back on Facebook. They don't have the ability to do that. We're in a position where we can do that, fortunately, but not everybody can. So for those people, when this kind of

stuff happens, they're just done. They're dead in the water. Yeah, and this has a happy ending, right, Santh. I mean you you updated the story, right, So because of interviews you've done like this and other obviously big platforms, they've changed their stances that correct. Yeah, I mean, well, once we brought media attention to it, all of a sudden they're issuing apologies and saying they reinstated our account. And

this happens over and over and over again. You know, Twitter hasnt spended us before Facebook has threatened us with the platform and demonitization before. And the only time we get a positive outcome is when we go to the media, we explain what's happening, and you know, news reports start coming out about it, about how Facebook is trying to censor us, and then and only then they changed their tune and try to fix it. Said are you surprised,

like has this happened to you? Or have you had a hint of something like this happening to you in the past, or is this the first time you've been hit with a hammer like that? Uh, well, it did happen one time in the past with Facebook specifically where um, when they first started implementing fact checking, they started working with third party fact checkers, and the fact checkers snokes in particular, was rating our articles full. And it's just the most absurd thing in the world. It's like, a

joke isn't true or false. It's a joke, right, it's in its own category. Um, you don't when when Jerry Seinfeld is up on stage tracking jokes in a nightclub, you don't stand up and yell that's not true. Whenever he tells a story that's that's fictional because it's a joke, right, so, um,

it's just it's silly. But Facebook was was wodenly interpreting these fact checks to mean that we were putting out fake news, and they had strict policies against faith news, and so they would they reached out to us and threatened us. This was a few years ago, well, two thousand eight teens. They threatened up to with the monetization and uh in suspension of our page for for for pushing fake news. And again we made we got a

lot of media attention there. Eventually they apologized and said we realized it's a satire now and we need that we need a better way of handling this stuff so that we're not threatening satire companies, you know. But there's been a lot of effort on the left to in to insinuate, imply, um that we are not in fact a satire site, but we are actually a purposefully misleading disinformation campaign that pretends to be a satire site to

certain invent Facebook rules. And I'm not as a kidding like that sounds crazy, But there's a recent article in um in in New York Times published like five days ago that says that we capitalize on Fusion Um in questions whether or not we're doing this on purpose. Well, set, I'm happy to bring that up because because Ben and I like Ben, Ben Monday through Friday is typically compelled to hit all that is sports talk radio. It's great.

So some of the stuff that he does on his show, or some of the stuff he wants to do on the show, just can't because obviously that kind of a spectrum, it doesn't cater to it. But on the podcast, which we obviously invited you on, we do things a little bit different. And so, like I said the email, when I introduced myself to you, I was kind of like one of the original fans of the Babylon b and to kind of pull the curtain back, I would send

articles to Ben. I text him like in the middle of the night when his show is going on, and his eyes would just roll because like, what the funk is this right? And then before you know what, some of those other friends that are at sports that the media started retweeting you guys on the regular, and then Ben's followers and listeners to a show started retwitting stuff and then tagging the minutes. So so yeah, and it

blew up. It I mean, I know you guys have done great, and this is like, uh, let me ask you this a little said I. I I. When you told the story about you know, the New York Times and and their your their article like it, it it reminds me. I used to have a Boston radio that didn't get like I I don't you know, I do a sports show obviously, but you know, occase, let's throw some satire in. And I had a boss that did not get had

no sense of humor. What is it like? It feels like there's a lot of people, said, that have no sense of humor. What is it like to do a satire site in when no one has a funny bone anymore? It seems well, okay, so there's a couple of things that play there, and there is there is um. You know, there's a lot of hesitation to do comedy and for

certain audiences because of the PC culture, right. I mentioned Jerry since all a minute ago, you know, years back, he announced that he would no longer do shows for college students on college campuses. And the reason is because they're so politically correct, you know, anything he says, they're gonna think he's racist or sexist or something thing, you know, or homophobic. So um, they they they're just ready to be offended by anything. And that kind of culture does

make comedy a little difficult. But when it comes to not having a sense of humor, Look, people on the left love to laugh as long as it's the right targets that are being hit. You know, these late night comedy shows. I just saw something the other day. It was something like their jokes when they're making political jokes are about Trump, um, and only like three percent of them or something, or about Biden. Well, you know, they like to laugh at certain people, they like to laugh

at certain ideas. They're they're very they're very willing to laugh as long as it's it's not it's not pointed at them, right, So, um, it's a very selected thing. It's a double standard. A lot of these media companies that that are very hard on us and and have this uncharitable assumption that we have some kind of ill motives where we're trying to mislead people on purpose. They never think that about the Onion, for example, the most

popular web you know, satire site of the last twenty years. Um, they never assigned ill motives the Onion. They think the onion is funny and that they're doing genuine satire. And the only reason that they question our motives is because they disagree with us politically. And I don't know if they see that or not, but it's definitely disingenuous and

it's double standards. Said, let me what percentage of people I remember I read a study years ago, I said of Americans will believe anything like what percentage of people read your stuff online? And they're like, they don't get the joke, they don't understand the sets. How do you have any idea just a ballpark figure on how many people you think just don't get it? Um, I don't know that. I wouldn't say that's probably as high ascent.

There's absolutely people who don't get it. Now, there's a couple of reasons for that, right, there's um satire is successful. The jokes are funny when they're when they're closer to the truth rather than further away from it. You know, it's they depend on having a proximity to the truth.

If it's too detached from reality, it's not funny. So that you know that saying there's a grain of truth in every joke is it's popular saying for a reason, there's truths to the things that we're joking about, and that's why people believe them so readily. Um. There's also the world has gotten much crazier. People have much more extreme views. They're saying much more extreme things. There's really wild, crazy things happening today that would have never been normal

or acceptable years ago. UM. And so in that environment, when when when you're trying to exaggerate the truth a little bit, which is what satire does, Um, it's hard to stay one step ahead of it. So almost everything is believable today. I mean, and from my experience what I see in the headlines, I see headlines every day. I'm shaking my head in disbelief. I'm like, I can't believe that really happened. I can't believe they really said that.

I can't believe they really did that. In that kind of environment, UM, it's hard to write stories that people aren't going to believe. So it's reality's fault, Honestly, it's not. It's not that our satire is too close to reality, which is what we're accused of. It's that reality is too close to satire. That's the problem. And on that note, is that what inspired you to create Not the Bee?

Because you guys have had some articles on the babel on Bee that you know they've turned from satire to truth. So is that look you to create Not the Bee? We call them, we call them fulfilled prophecies. But yes, we have in some cases, mere hours after we published a story, whatever we were joking about actually happened. Um. And that's a perfect example of how reality is, Like it's hard to stay one step ahead of things when they're this crazy. But yeah, that's the that's the inspiration

for Not to Be. It's that there's there's enough crazy stuff happening, these wild headlines, they seem like they should be satire but somehow aren't. Um. Not to Be is really targeting those stories and in isolating the stories and amplifying them. So um, it's just really there's so much low hanging fruit today out there and what's going on in the world. We thought that there was a great opportunity to do kind of a spinoff of the Bee where it's just this absurd like should be satire but

somehow isn't. And you guys do things on a national level, But is there a particular state that you target the most. I know, you guys hit California pretty hard, But is it in California or New York or Florida and Texas, anything that you like in particular, you mean in terms of hit pretty hard. Like we make fun of them a lot. I mean, we will pick on people, uh, anybody that where you feel like basically, you know, satire

what we try to do with his ridicule, bad ideas. Um, that's one of the that's one of the main purposes of satires to criticize you know, bad thinking, bad ideology, hypocrisy, double standards. So when we see like governors uh you know with really heavy handed, um kind of authoritarian rule in their states, you know, and they're doing crazy ridiculous things or contradictory things, we make fun of that. And and you've got a lot of stuff. You've got a

lot of stuff going on right now in California. They're in the headlines all the time, like they don't have enough they don't have enough electricity of power their state, for example. So you know, we we condom for those kinds of things. Um. So yeah, I mean I think the ones that are in the headlines, the most are the ones that are gonna get picked on the most. We're really piggybacking on whatever is in the news. And and Sepia, the October sixte President Trump retweet is that

the Mona Lisa for the bab al embie. Oh man. You know, there's a lot of debate about that that. Actually, we don't normally get media attention outside of like conservative media, you know, like we get Fox News pays a lot of attention to us, a lot of the a lot of the players on the right like the Daily Wire and the Federalists and the Blaze. You know, they pay attention to us, But we don't get a lot of immediate media attention on the other side, like with Slate

and Box and CNN or any of those places. But but when Trump tweets our stuff, all of a sudden, they pay attention, and they they look at that as just a prime opportunity to make fun of him as being an idiot. But um, we actually know, I mean, we know people in his administration, um, and we have it from we have close contacts of his who have a short up that he knows what the babylombie is. He thinks it's funny. Um, he reads it all the time, and so we believe that he knows that it's satire,

but um, it is it is. It's possible he's just trolling people on the left and and uh and sharing satire just to see a kind of reaction he can get from them. I would not put that past him at all. Seth, who's the biggest celebrity or or I guess personality that you guys have fishhooked? Is it like Alissa Milano or who? Is it? Very good question. If Trump was confused by that headline and thought it was real, then it's Trump for um. But I don't think that he was. I'm not sure. I'd have to go back

and look. I do know. We recently did a piece on after Ruth Vader Ginsberg passed. UM. We photoshopped Lebron James wearing like a lace a white lace collar around his black shirt, honoring Ruth Vader Ginsberg, so it looks like he was dressed like her. And UM, people on the left we're sharing that like crazy. So there were like New York Times reporters who are sharing it talking about how beautiful it was, now meaningful it was that

the NBA was honoring Ruth Bader Ginenberg in that way. Um. And so you know, depending on what we do, we get a lot, a lot, a lot of attention um from people. You know, they love to say that we're we're fooling our own audience with this stuff, but they get fooled by it all the time. And specific names of like celebrities are escaping me. I'm not sure. But there was another one too, we did about how Trump said that he's done more for Christianity than Jesus himself.

And you know, we're just playing on Trump's ego there. He's constantly you know, talking about how great he is and how and how he's done, you know, better than anybody in history at whatever he's doing in that moment um. And but you know, the the left believe that that was true, that he really said that, and that one was shared very wide, and I know there were a lot of celebrities who are who are condemning him for that, you know, being so arrogant to say he's done more

for Christianity than Jesus. So I'd have to go back and try to pick out name because they're escaping me at the moment. But there's been some big ones. I sins for sports guys. Well, I'll ask you this one. Is there a favorite sports story that you've done, because Ben's hit it up with Colin Kaepernick obviously over the last couple of years. And I think one of the ones that I noticed the most was when he got put into Madden and then you guys published an article

it says Madden introduces throw a Malotov feature. I think, for us, the perfect intersection, you know, because we have a very we have like a large conservative Christian audience. So whenever we do it Tim Tebow joke, it's like the perfect nextus of things because we're roping in the sports on the one side, but also like the Christian fake stuff on the other side. So one of them, uh it was. I wrote the headline for this one.

It was Tim Tebow suspended for using performance enhancing Bible verses, and it got shared like a million times. It went like crazy viral. So I think whenever I think, whenever we do a Temtebo article, it goes crazy viral because it's that kind of perfect, you know, combination of the Christian stuff and the and the culture and sports stuff. Um. But yeah, in general, steth. How how do the sports

stories do? I mean, you guys obviously deal with politics mostly, but like, how do the how do the sports stories do in comparison? They do really really well. Um, we just don't do that many of them. We need to

do more of them. Part of the problem is we have our writers are more like it's funny, you know, our writers are are like a mixture of things, are like computer programmers or or they have a creative like art background and and and so they like they like board games and video games and stuff like that much more than they like sports and not sports guys, Right, So we need more people on our staff who get sports and want to write about sports. Like the founder

of the b is actually really into sports. He loved like he loves like m m a, he loves baseball. You know, he's reallyly into sports. Um. But but we need more people on our writing staff. Writing day today, we can tap into these things because like whenever, you know, whenever there's something going on, like we we make we like to make fun of soccer and how Americans you know, aren't aren't We make fun of Americans for not being super interested in soccer and and uh and and feeling

like it's boring or whatever. And so when we when we've got like sports shut down from from COVID, we ran one on how American sports fans we even watched soccer at this point. You know, well it gets shared hundreds of thousands of times. So well and Seth, I gotta tell you, and you know, being in the sports radio game for a long time, and it has never been more tribalistic in sports. I the the the Arizona Cardinals quarterback the other day completed two passes the rest

of the game. He was terrible. He completely like, you know, nine pass in the game, and I ripped him for having you know, I didn't think he played well. And the Arizona newspaper wrote a story ripping me for ripping him. Um yeah, I mean so that is a gold mine for you guys. I know you mentioned you've done well with the sports, but a lot of sports fans these days cannot take any criticism of the hometown team and they just go nuts like you're not allowed to rip us.

It's it's crazy, it's you know that that stakes to kind of a broader thing goes beyond sports. People are just not willing to hear disagreement anymore. And I don't know, you know, it's it's that's it's manifesting itself in the sports world. I get to be bleeding into the sports world. But that's kind of like a general principle, now, isn't it. Yeah, totally it's it's totally true that you're not allowed to criticize us. How there you I don't want to hear.

It's like put their their ear muffs on. They don't wanna hear anything other than they want to be fed, study diet of what they believe in. It's crazy. Well, I do want to do you guys. You know, um, I definitely want to do more sports stuff. That's for sure. It does really well for us, and we got to tap into that more. All right. So are you are we the first sports personalities that you've done an interview with?

I know that you did some stuff you mentioned on on a couple of news sites, but are we the first on the sports side? Yeah? I think so. I mean, even though we've had some kind of viral sports stories, we've never really had any sports reporters or media sites reach out to us for any kind of like comment on it or UM, you know, and no, I don't think I ever have. You'll never forget your first and seth, do not ever cheat on us. I got a question. I'm curious. You don't have to say, I know it's here.

You know Intel how you how you make the make the hot dogs? But like, like, how does this work? You have an editorial board that says, hey, look at you know so and so when you're when you're coming up with stories each day, we kind of talk us through how this works here when you come up with the stories and with your writing staff. Yeah, So we have a team of writers, UM and contributors, and we

communicated a number of different ways. We have a Facebook group that's kind of a broader, larger group has some people that are not on our staff but are very creative that we've invited into that group to kind of pitch ideas to us. UM, and then we have kind of our internal flack channels where we're talking on flack and pitching ideas back and forth. We're in a bunch of different locations, so we're not all in the same room.

So UM, we basically just look at whatever is going on in the news each day and and try to think to ourselves, what's a funny take on this, and and we throw headline. It's all the joke is in the headline. It's always the headline that comes first. So, um, it's just headline pitches, one after another. We pitched dozens and dozens and dozens of ideas based on whatever is going on in the world. UM. So we do that day in and day out, and the ones that rise to top to get a reaction that you know, our

editor in chief decides, you know, he wants to run with. Um, we pick out of those, out of those pitches. So it's really a small percentage. It's probably like, honestly, like two percent of the headlines we pitch get published, and most of them are just junked. Um. But it's to refine the process. You know, we go through iterations of it.

Someone might pitch something that's not perfect as is, but then you know, someone else will do an iteration of it that's a little bit better and would you know, connect better and better worded. So we play off of each other and just work together very collaboratively to come up with these ideas. And once we have a really good headline, you know, one of our writers can can take on the tap you're actually writing out that article and populating and getting up on the site. So, um,

that's what we do every day. It's fun. It's crazy that this is our job because we just make up funny stories, uh and then photoshop crazy images to go along with them. Um. We hitch ourselves sometimes crazy than anyone does for a living. But it's a lot of months. Wwe holds massive Royal Rumble event on Zoom that was pretty solid. Yea. Writers declined to sign Colin Kaepernick. That was another good one, that was pretty solid. You guys, Uh,

you guys continue to shouting. Now, how big is the staff? I know you said you have some outside people, then some internal people, but how big is the crew? Are writing staff? I think we have about a dozen people right now writing, and not all of them full time, so it's a pretty it's a pretty small crew. Um, some several of them all have other jobs and our work is like part time contributing writers. And how's the the advertising market these days? And we're still in the

apocalypse right and business is still slow? Are you guys being able to still monetize it and make some money on this? Because you guys, are can imagine tons of traffic these days with all the people freaking out of your stories. Yeah, we're doing record traffic numbers. Um. We're trending up with that. Um we did. At the start of the whole pandemic. If you go back to like March April, are advertising took a big hit and and

our earnings went way down. But they've they've really come back quite a bit, pretty close to where we were before the pandemic started. So we're really bouncing back on that. But we're also trying to monetize in other ways. We have a subscription now where people can subscribe either just to support us because these big tech issues that we're having, or two uh, to gain access to premium content feature

that isn't otherwise available to everybody. So we try to make some we try to throw some value add in there so it's worthwhile for people to subscribe. So we have a mixture of revenue from like our store where we sell stuff and the ads we run aside, and the subscriptions where people are paying for access awesome sets. So listen, I appreciate you coming on with us. I don't They're not gonna take up your entire day here.

But I was a little skeptical when you when my guy David used to send me the Babylon be stuff. But I have become a big fan as well. I love it and I I feel like we're in on the joke because I when I see people who you mentioned the lebron story, when I see people who don't get it, I just it just makes my day. It just I just smile. I have a cheshire cat smile from ear to ear when I see It's just it's wonderful.

So thank you for your time. Fun. And you know, people people who try to act like it's dangerous that people are believing our stories. Come on, it's hard. These are jokes, and if people don't get the joke, you know, that's on them. But we're not trying to mislead any buddy. We're just trying to have fun. We're just trying to think, well, what would be a funny take on this and then

come up with something. So that's all we're trying to do. Awesome, all right, thank you said, I appreciate it, all right, Thanks guys. Be sure to catch live editions of The Ben Meller Show weekdays at two am Eastern eleven pm Pacific