Jon Morosi, MLB Negotiating Table

and a very very happy Friday to you. Do we have baseball ow hell now, but we do have the Fifth Hour with Ben Maller and Danny g back for another weekend here. And we're always debating the the balance, But who do we have on on Friday? We like to bring somebody in and chat. And so this week, considering the big story that we've talked a lot about on the Overnight Show has been the labor dispute in

Major League Baseball. Who better to comment on that. That's someone that has covered baseball for years, that is a friend of mine. I've known this guy for many, many years from MLB Network and he's all over this here on Fox Sports Radio all the time. You have seeing him over the years as a reporter on baseball coverage on Fox Sports and FS one, and he's multidimensional. He

covers hockey as well for the NHL Network. John Paul Morossi better known It's just John Morrossi, and he joins us now on the Fifth Hour with Ben Maller and Danny g to talk all things baseball, labor. What We're gonna try to make this relatable in layman's terms, because listen, I'm not that bright. So let's just get into it right now, and we welcome to John to the show. And the thing that has annoyed so many, including yours truly who love baseball, John, is the delay in getting

the talk started. Now. I know they talked a lot recently, but this should have been done months ago. Why do you think both sides ended up procrastinating so long to get the negotiation jump started. Well, Ben, it's an excellent question, and it's been asked by people close to the process and people who are fans of the game and love the game. I think the reality is that both sides perhaps needed the deadline, which effectively was the deadline that

we saw pass on Monday or Tuesday. We should say, uh to not sacrifice any regular season games that perhaps we were not going to see a real negotiation, a real grinding of those last details until that arrived. So I do think if there is any blame on that, it's somewhat universal to say that there were aspects of

this that could have been worked through earlier. But I suppose the facts that deadlines tend to motivate was perhaps evident by the reality that we didn't see a deadline missed on Tuesday, and then a deal happened the next day. This is I think on some level we are all creatures of deadlines and and routines, and in this respect, and for better or worse, this is a deadline sort of a game, whether it's a trade deadline or arbitration

salary figure deadline. Unfortunately been this was one deadline that was missed, and I think the blame is is shared around the game, and the reality is the fans of those that are are suffering the most right now. All right, So I have a theory, John. I was on the radio, I do the Overnight show and whatnot, and we were on the air when all this was was going down, and because they went past two in the morning, and my theory is if they had just stayed there until

the sun came up. They if you believe the reporting, they were close to a deal on Monday and that's why they came back on Tuesday to to finish it. My theory is they would have gotten something done they the moment they left. Both sides left. Then then other people entered the conversation and were able to change their mind. People go to bed, they wake up, they have different feelings from the night before. Uh. Do you agree with that?

Do you think if they just stayed a few more hours, we would have had a deal done Monday At six in the morning, they would have gone out and had eggs and bacon and then played baseball. It's possible, Ben, I suppose we'll never know. A couple of points on that where I I believe that that your argument is valid in a couple of different ways. Number One, even on Tuesday morning, we heard different different opinions between the union side and the league side as exactly how close

they were the night before. Perhaps MLB thought they were close to a deal, the Union seemed to think they were close enough to continue talking. And those are two different related but to different conceptions of what was going on. Uh. I also think that to your point, it's a correct point to make that both sides of this are made up of rather diverse constituencies. And on the MLB side, this is not always the will and the best negotiating

wisdom of Rob Manford Dan Halum. It is what can I put out there that two thirds of the owners will ratify. And on the player side, it's the same thing between large salary earning players and those that are

earning closer to the minimum. The analogy I've made is to a majority leader or a minority leader of the Senate, and when a negotiation is happening on legislation, the individual whims or beliefs of that majority or minority leader might be X. But if that set of values is not going to pass with the three the two thirds majority of of your constituency, of your caucus, if you will

to use this example, it's not gonna work. And so I really think Ben that this is a time where the beliefs along those uh continuums of players and owners are quite diverse. There are a lot of different interests that the Dodgers have or the Yankees have that are fundamentally and perhaps diametrically in opposition to the Rays or the Pirates or the Royals. It's there's a different set

of circumstances. And what I think has happened right now, Ben, is there's been a real difficulty in arriving at what that compromised point is. That the final point I'll make on this this particular topic is it is disappointing, vexing, confusing, whatever word you'd like to choose. That the issue that is probably the most significant one right now, which the CBT threshold and what that number is going to be, is in it a number and a behavior that is

entirely within the purview of the teams. Nothing in this CBA, Ben says the cb A threshold, or the CBT threshold rather is two twenty million dollars and everybody's got to spend that amount of money. That's not at all what it says. It just says that's the maximum that you could spend before you begin incurring penalties, which is entirely different. And so it really is up to to the discretion of each team if you want to spend up to

that level or not. And the irony is that you consider the World Series two years ago, you had the Dodgers, one of the richest teams in the game. We're pushed to a sixth game and perhaps could have been a seventh had a decision been different with respect to pitching against the team with one of the lowest payrolls in the sport. So, I I don't know. It's really you take a take a step back and consider where the

economics of the game are on either side. It is to meet a little bit baffling that the number that's holding everybody up is the number that affects half a dozen teams. Really, and even then, is that the discretion ben of those teams. No one is ever forcing a team to spend close to at or above the CBT threshold. And yet it's that number that seems to be the reason, the chief reason at least why we don't have spring

training open right now. Well, and the other thing to John, just to follow up and piggyback on what you were saying that I used to work in San Diego and the Padres always kind of small market team. I remember many fire sales for the Padres back in the day when I was getting started in radio, and they are they're a big swinger now and there you know, to my knowledge, the San Diego market has not changed that

they're one of the smaller market teams in baseball. And is it true, John, that there's other teams that are upset with the Podres because they went out and spent a gazillion dollars on Manny Machado and a couple other guys, And so they've got a a hey roll which is near the very top of baseball and a market where you compare them to some of these other teams like Pittsburgh and whatnot that have have spent no money like the Podres are upsetting the Apple card, if you will.

Is that a legitimate opinion. I'm sure there's a lot of truth to that. And Ben, that's also not it's not a novel concept in the game. Remember back to the stories of of when the A Rod deal was

signed with Texas back in two thousands. Uh and and there was the famous press conference given by Sandy Alderson, who was obviously not not the GM of the Rangers outside the Winter Meetings room where the deal was announced, and he was lamb basting the deal about what a terrible deal is was for baseball because uh now it was going to create this inflation effect on all the different wages and oh my gosh, where are we going

in the sports? So it's that has been a part of the game for as long as there has been a divergence in team spending. Happens, probably since the dawn of free agency. So notable, yes, novel, not at all, And and I do think it is representative of of I guess what I would say, Ben, is one data point because you might have an agent who says to another team just let's just say the Rockies for example, they're in the same division. Hey, listen, the Padres are

spending this amount of money. You had better sign my player and and bring your money more in line with what the Padres have and and the Rockies GM could say, we wait a minute, the Padres this past year, we're a colossal failure. And teams that were paying significantly less money, like the Rays were a success. Why do I have to spend for your player at all? So I think, Benny,

it it's the system. It's it's interesting because we can talk about the money, and obviously the money is huge part of this at the top line, but at the end of the day, for the vast majority of teams. If you've raft well and develop well and keep your talent and build a good culture, and have a good manager, and and and check all these boxes, you're probably going to be a successful, sustainable team, even if you're not

spending the most money. It's it's it certainly said. Yes, you've got two teams that spent over the wax Street Tax Dodgers pod Race. One was a very good team and one wasn't. So there are still multiple pathways to getting this this success in baseball that every team is is pursuing. And the point men that I would make that I think should guide everybody in this conversation. The Players Union set out to say at the outset of this,

we want younger players to be paid more well. In the last proposal, the minimum seller ran up more than a hundred thousand dollars and and to the credit of the union they should be congratulated for that number. And also the creation of the arbitration bonus pool to pay for the players who have not yet achieved salary arbitration, so that the players who have between two and three years of service, that is new money, found money, if you will, thirty million dollars just put into that to

incentivize great performances by superior young talent. Then to me, that seems pretty darn good. Maybe you could argue that that numbers should go up more. But because we've never had it before and the Union has put put press for it, and mL we put it in there, it's really hard for us to know what the fair number is. It's never existed. It's like putting something on the market and say, well, what what is this worth? Well, we've never seen this before, so I don't know. I don't

know what it's worth. And I think that's part of the issue that they're dealing with right now, is what that number ought to be. That certainly there are still some distances been to be able to bridge. I'm encouraged that on on this Thursday, there was a smaller conversation reportedly between Dan Ailum and Bruce Meyer, the lead negotiator for MLB, the negotiator for the union, Great Small group Workshop.

The ideas talk about a lot of different ideas, and I am still opal that there's enough sense here on what this agreement could look like that there is no reason for us to lose all of April. And I've heard plenty of conversation about well, the national TV contracts they pick up in May and the owners will make that they'll make more, or that they'll be coming out just fine if they don't pay any wages in April

and then come back and May. That might be true for the balance sheets of April and May of two. But whether it's the owners or the players, then you you host a show that talks about all different sports. You understand this frankly better than I do because I work largely in baseball and hockey, so I've got my

two sports that I focus on. This is an issue where if if baseball goes away for a while and and and fans and people around the country find other things to spend their summer evenings doing, they might not come back. And then what you gained with some pyric victory in April or May of evaporates because the overall business is not growing in the fashion that you expected

to grow. And so ben as much as there's a lot of points being scored on either side, frankly, both camps have to take a step back listen to what the people who are actually paying the tickets have to say for them. For themselves, and realize that if we don't get this game back on the field and improve the quality of the product, with the with the pace of play, a lot of other issues, if we can't get to a point where we can talk about these things,

the business is going to shrink. It will become continually less relevant, not irrelevant, but just less relevant, which is which is to me concerning I love the game, the game is my liveli and did it matters a ton to me. We have to find a way to get it back, end the deal, to talk about the things that will actually resonate with the people who buy the tickets, and then that will hopefully allow this national pastime to get to a better place. All right, So, John, you

know I've known you for a long time. I love baseball as well, and I do talk about everything on the Overnight Show. And so I'm at the point now when it comes to the fan issue where I am convinced both the owners and players they both use the fans as ponds, but I don't think they truly either side is really concerned about the fan. I think it's just rhetoric that they toss out and it's a good talking point. People like it, but I'll tell you what's

gonna happen, John, What's gonna happens. People are just they're not gonna worry about baseball. They're gonna do other things. We saw this a couple of years ago when the pandemic started and there was no sports for a hundred days. People just you know, they find Netflix or whatever else

to watch and then if sports come back. I think this is this is the argument that the owners and the players both both will make that if it's July and it's eighty degrees and you want to take your family out to a game, and you know the weather is wonderful and you want entertainment, it's an experience, you're gonna do it. And so I'm convinced both sides know that whenever they get a deal done, assuming there's baseball,

they'll be they'll be out there. But in terms of relevance, yeah, I mean pretty much all we do in sports radio these days is obsessed about different free agents in the NFL. That's pretty much what we do. And it's it's very frustrating, uh you know, from that perspective, because you know, everyone's talking about the fans, both Tony Clark and uh and also Rob Manford all these other guys that if issue statements is all about the fans, this that you listen.

Let's be honest here, John, just like you and I, if we're in the negotiation, you're looking at the players are looking out for the players, the owners are looking out for the owners, and you know the fans are somewhere down the list here. And so I every time I hear the fans this the fans lad from owners and players, I kind of cringe because being completely transparent, that's not the case. You you buy that or you

don't buy that. Well, I mean been on some levels they have to on a macro basis listen to the fans because they're their customers and whether or not they whether or not they are truly considering the fans wishes.

And I believe certainly with MLBS moved to the change pace of play, eliminate the shift, universal d H, some other things that fans want, I do believe they are listening to the fans in that respect and want to change and improve the game because all these the rule change has been When you consider where we're at with with a lot of different sports, rule changes happened quite frequently all the time in fact, for baseball, that there is this retstance change the game too much because it

is sort of this high bound traditionalist sport. And look around. I mean you know what again better than I do when you consider the popularity of the NFL, the popularity of the NBA. Uh, certainly you look at soccer. Soccer is in a very differ in place now that it was when when best when baseball was last on strike. So there is a tremendous competition for the hearts and

minds of of people, and certainly young people. And if you cannot find a way to develop a passionate following among younger people to watch the game for three hours, three and a half hours, it's a long time. It's a long time for it. Don't to sit and watch

one thing. And so if we are going to grow the game, as we always talk about, so the the Zeit guys were talking to hear about growth, mindset, growth, business probably going to grow the business, how are we gonna make families and young people believe that a baseball game traffic, paying for the tickets, paying for the concessions, whatever it is, it is worth our time and money and if your point been, a lot of people in the last two years have reevaluated what that time and

money ought to go to, and there's been a lot of soul searching for out of of a reason, and that that process is very much ongoing, and I would say been the worst thing that you can do. The worst thing that you can do is remove your your conversation piece, your sports, your brand from shows like yours. And if you take baseball off the airwaves, you take baseball out of circulation for a while. Consumer preferences and what kids are into and what all people are into

change so quickly. Now, Ben, and we know this that if you take yourself out of circulation for a period of time, there's no guarantee that you're ever going to get back in the rotation of of the family's mindset. In Illinois, in Michigan, in Nebraska, in Texas, in California, wherever it might be, they'll move on. And I think expecting America to have routines like America has always had routines is not really a winning strategy at this point

in time. You have to stay above and in the head of the curve and and just fate and you cannot do those things if your product is not being played at a given time. So how much money we talked about? I read that the salaries per game that has been canceled. I read a number. It was like twenty million dollars per day if you know all the games are canceled, which we've already seen some in the teams are gonna lose like a hundred thousand per per home game in in revenue. Do those numbers sound right?

Is that? Does that sound like a ball? That seems low to me? On both sides? Is that is that where we are? And that is that we've heard there's differing estimates, I think based on market size, based on team, uh, depending on circumstances. Again, obviously, the the national TV revenues

for baseball, and that's that's real. Where that that really starts to kick in and may there are some make goods that exist for the local regional television piece that only really start to become a factor if you have missed twenty games or more. So those things are admittedly

a bit on the line, but it's not forever. And oh, by the way, April fifteen is Jackie Robinson Day, anniversary of his debut, and that to me is as sacred of an occasion as we have, certainly in baseball, definitely in sports, and arguably in our country when you think about what that day means, uh, in American history. And so that is to me one of the most hall old days that we have to observe in our in

our corner of the sports universe. And and darned if we cannot find a way to get major league games played on the seventy anniversary of Jackie Robinson's debut, and shame on all of us. Really, I mean, there's there's no there is no credible excuse for that for anybody. It's just it's it's unforgivable from what I said. If that's if that's the outcome, so uh, And if that's

going to be the outcome. To avoid that, we've got to get a deal about the next ten days, which, by the way, they can do the number I'll repeat the number that is the most significant pediment here is the competitive Palace Tax special, which is an entirely discretionary amount of spending on a per team basis. If you say, as a team, I don't really want it to be two thirty eight I wanted to be too twenty. Okay, then don't spend more than two twenty. You have that

right as a team. And and we have seen many, many times that teams that spend more money don't always benefit from those expenditures. And and so I just I am, I am a little bit just dumbfounded, frankly as to why that number is the big issue here when it is one that a team like Tampa Bay or Pittsburgh or Kansas City will never even come close to. So

what's the difference to them? I just, I just I don't I do not get the reluctance of of of the teams, frankly to move that number up a little bit, because they that's not the concern of a majority of the teams on a functional basis, right look at them. It is not a number that is entirely relevant to

that many teams. Well, and I don't, like, you know, my head is spinning by all the numbers in these negotiations and all the you know, I'm not a math guy, but the I'm generally against salary caps and salary floors. But that really sounds like the issue that the players, they're big complaint. They want a salary floor in here where every team has to spend X number of dollars. But as we have seen John over the last ten years fifteen years in baseball, the owners, uh to their credit,

are tremendous robber barons of baseball. They they have figured out how to bend whatever rules they have. When you're talking about Tampa Bay, which is like a Frankenstein's Lab for baseball with what they've been able to do with finding players off the scrap heep and all that. So whatever rules are in place, they're just gonna go out and hire a new crop of IVY League guys to come in or wherever they find the next crop of GMS,

and they'll just bend the rules. But it's it's like the middle class in baseball just doesn't exist, and is there really any way to get back to that. You either have guys that are making, by baseball standards, not a lot of money, and then all of a sudden they get two hundred, three hundred million dollar contracts, but there's there's no middle ground. It's not like you don't go from zero to a hundred in real life. You normally have to stop somewhere in the middle. And then

go all the way up. But in baseball, it's either you're at the very bottom or you're at the very top, and you're not in the middle. And I, frankly, John, maybe you're you're smarter than me. I don't know how you get that middle class at baseball back. I don't see a path to that. Is there a path to that? Well, A couple of things. I mean, number one, do you look at the NLCS this past year, Braves Dodgers, the

team with low pay roll one Houston. They had the richest player, ryland Or was not was not pitching because he's hurt. They weren't able to resign Garritt Cole George Or left, and they got to the World Series again. So it's it's an interesting dichotomy there. And I should point out before I go any further, the players. Briefly the notion of a salary floor was on the table, but then it was discarded. So the players are not

even asking for that anymore either. So there is no there is no minimum to hit that is that is not part of the conversation right now. It's just the maximum. And even then it's it's it's not a hard it's not a salary cap at all. It's not a hard cap. It's something that you can go over if you want to. You just have to pay a tax on it. That's that's all that means. So I think the Braves have been a team has been successful while spending somewhere in

the middle range. Obviously, the Dodgers, they don't win the World Series without Mookie Betts, and he's someone that their market size allowed them to sign to a multi year deal and keep long term. Now, of course, the Dodgers they lost Corey Seeger. They can't even spend on everybody, and in fact, someone are you It's not even always in your best interest to spend on the biggest superstar. Look at the free agent contracts of for example, Robinson Canoe,

Albert Pools, who the biggest contracts ever signed. Uh, they have not necessarily aged as well towards the back end of those deals. And then, to me, this is a little bit of a granular point in baseball, but I'll make it because I think it's important. The players ought to be thrilled with the reality that there is no longer direct draft pick compensation tied to free agent signings.

Once upon a time as recently as less for example, last offseason, I would be talking to team executives and say, listen, this player is a good fit for you. Why don't you sign him? And the answer would beat John off

the record. I can't give up the draft pick because the draft is the most efficient way that I can add talent to my organization, and I'm not going to give up that ability to sign a player to a multi year deal into his thirties when I'm not entirely sure if he's gonna be worth that money the longer e place. I might be willing to take that risk if I didn't also have to give up a draft pick.

That draftick compensation Ben is now gone. That is a huge deal on a level that I wonder if the players fully appreciate how significant that victory is for them in this negotiation. I think that part of this Ben has not been talked about nearly enough when you consider how important that's going to be in the free agent market. Well yeah, yeah, I haven't really read much about that.

But let me ask you this, Jane. As far as the rule changes, I've talked to a number I want to talk about the shift here because there's always a pet peep of mind. You talk to some of these old time guys that played in the seventies and the eighties back in the day, and they will tell you they know how to beat the shift. It's called choking up on the bat and you're hitting the ball the

other way. The players are so stubborn that the owners have to put the ban of the shift and they have to implement an actual rule because the players are unable to adapt that. That to me is very frustrated when just like basic baseball, just choke up on the bat, hit the ball the other way, get a base it They're giving you the entire side of the field. It's very frustrated they have to do that. And the pitch clock, Uh, that's also the's like certain pictures just take forever. And

in baseball has always prided itself on not having a clock. This, that and the other thing. Uh, those two things. I don't think the base thing, the oversized base thing, is that that big a deal. But the banning of the shift seems unnecessary. And and the pitch clock is that is that going to go over like a lead balloon? John? And first of all, I agree with you on the on the shifting aspect, we shouldn't have to do it,

but here we are. And I would point out too, this is the thing then that I just shake my head every single year. You look at the way the playoffs playoff, look at the look at the Nationals. Okay, when they won the World Series. Who is the player that the Dodgers couldn't get out and that even the

Astros couldn't get out that year? Howarde Kendrick, one of the oldest players in that World Series, someone who didn't really ever have like a forty homer season, but he put the ball in play, had good at baths with short, simple approaches late in the game, and Howie Kendricks was

the reason why the Nationals won the World Series. And every year, every winter bend, there are players on the open market like Howie Kendrick, and they never get the respect they deserve because the skill of putting the ball in play, moving runners, having a professional late late inning at bath is totally forgotten about until it comes time to decide the championship. And everybody says, you know what,

why fill in the blank? How many times do we read the obituary of a particular team in particular series. Oh my gosh, we struck out too much. We couldn't catch up to their Their relief pitchers were throwing up ninety nine and we just couldn't catch up. We struck out too much. But yeah, jeez, you could have signed Howie Kendrick ten months ago for a song and you didn't do it. What were you doing back then? It's

not like Howie Kendrick won the World Series. In the World Series was was in like a black and white movie reel from that was like two years ago. And I think teams just don't they don't watch. They just don't watch the games. You know, they don't watch. When when the Royals won the World Series seven years ago, putting the ball and play al city Is Escobar, uh, players like him, Eric Cosmer, These guys were not like

fifty Homer players and they were winning players. Okay, they won, and I just I it baffles me every year react like, oh my gosh, I've never seen this before. Yeah, yeah you did. It was like in the World Series two years ago, Howie Kendrick, Alfis Escobar, Eric Cosmer, Lorenzo Caine. Players like that win you championships, So go sign them. And they're not gonna cost you fifty million bucks a year. So I I think I'm with you on the frustration

of the lack of an adjustment. The pitch clock works and part of the reason then why it works is that you don't have to spend a minute to shift somebody from one side of the field to the other, get the ball and go. Your defense is more active, Uh,

throw more strikes. But again when when the whole focus is you gotta throw a hundred thirty five hour to get scouted now, and and the ball is spraying all over the place because they can't control it because they've been focused on just throwing the ball to the radar gun for their whole lives. Yeah, you get problems with command, and they don't work as fast, and you don't have a lot of Mark Burley's anymore unfortunately. So it's just that it's it's funny to me because a lot of

these things were talking about. Now, this is not like I'm not an analytical genius. I'm not a genius at all. I just watched the games and and these are common sense things that that are there for any of us that actually take the time to watch. And I just think there's way way too many calculations, and there's too much reliance on the numbers, not enough reliance observing the way the game is played and and making your decisions

based on that. I'm hoping that the CB will represent some of these concerns and address them and getting better in players like Howie Kendrick respected and paid what they deserve in the market. But there are a lot of issues right now, Ben, I think we've we've touched on a lot of them over the last half hour, but there are certainly other things that still sort through here in the in the days of weeks to come. Yeah. Absolutely.

The PR battle is also a big part of this, John, I know you a little little time left, So the PR battle is not particularly great. Rob Manford did not have a good day on Tuesday when he was smiling and chuckling and all that. The the other part of this is the players and social media. Now. I did a rant on my radio show the other night about this. I there are many people saying how great this is now because we didn't have Twitter and Instagram back the

last time there was that elongated work stoppage. But I say this is actually bad for the players, because there's many more players than owners John, and the chances that the players are going to be united on social media and some of these guys are gonna start snapping are very low. So I think this will actually turn out to be a net negative for the players. What say you, you know, it's a fair question. I don't know, to be honest with you, where where the um where the

public opinion will come down. I think that if if anything has been instructive to us in recent years, I certainly just know it just from my own experience reporting and and uh having to exist in the social media sphere that typically you you you don't often hear the concordance of agreement from everybody. It's more often than the criticisms. So I would imagine that most people involved in the process are hearing more negative feedback than positive. We all

want to see the game on the field. It's not there, so we're frustrated. And if we're gonna say anything to anybody, let's think about it. We're not gonna say, hey, we we don't have baseball right now, good job everyone. No, it's it's it's that's not what anybody is saying right now. So I think that the feedback universally to everybody is negative.

The players themselves are are perhaps a bit more accessible than the owners in terms of their their public profile, and I point this out to it and I heard Tim Kirkson talk about this recently on them We Net, We're Radio. I think it's a very good point. We don't really hear as much from the owners themselves anymore. They are not people who are frequently quoted and seeing again, maybe they don't want to say the wrong thing and have it live forever on social media, whatever it might be.

But they've been very careful. We don't hear much from them individually, and again that's their choice, but I think it it's a little harder maybe for the fan to understand what the owner wants to do, what the plan is, when they only hear from that person a time or two a year. And I do think that that just accountability availability that helps. And perhaps after this is done, it will be important for the owners to get out in front of this, be out in front of their fans,

um be humble about things. The players have to be humble about it too, I think once this deal is done and focus on how do we grow the game at that point in time, once the games have started. I don't think that if you pulled fifty thousand fans of Dodger Stadium, they're not gonna be talking about who was right, who was wrong, CBT. They don't care. They just want to see the game back on the field, and they want to see the people who are on

the field and managing the games. Front office folks. Owners realize that this is a public trust. Realize that this is not uh, this is not the most serious thing happening in the world right now, clearly, and so we have to have a certain humility about that and and earn back the trust of the fans through word and deed, and have that ethic hopefully carried the day going forward. All Right, Yeah, that's say that is the great point.

We remember when I was a kid, we had bigger than life owners that seem to always be quoted in a newspaper. We don't have that. I I I don't some of these owners. I don't even know who they are. But we'll get you out of here on this, John, your crystal ball, the John Morosi crystal ball. Is this a short term situation or are we gonna be talking to you two months from now and there's still no baseball.

We'll certainly have baseball, I believe, Ben. By my hope is by the early part of May at the latest. And I really believe that that there is still a chance, and I am an optimist in my core, there is still a chance that we have baseball on Jackie Robinson Day April. I'm gonna that will be my prayer, by hope in the days I had my friend, and let's uh, let's all work together towards that goal. Let's hope that

the negotiations progress. And so I'm gonna say April fifteenth is the one that I've got circled for for a positive reason for it to be Jackie Robinson Day with baseball. Awesome. Thank you, John, Ben, my pleasure, my friend. Keep up all they're gonna work that you do. I always enjoy listening to you, especially when I'm out the West Coast. I'll plate you do a great job of keeping the conversation going all through the night, keeping us going all the time, Benny, So I always love catching up