Hello and welcome to the Sky Sports F1 podcast brought to you by Dropbox. I'm Matt Baker and this week for our season review episode we're coming from the home of this year's Constructors' Champions McLaren. We're here at the MTC.
We're going to have some very special guests later, but for the time being, Karun Chandok and Ted Kravitz join me. Hello to both of you. The end of the longest season in Formula One history. How are we feeling? Good? Yeah, no, it's been a long year, as you say. I need my computer.
because I can barely remember what happened this season. But excited to sit pure and have a look back. I'm going to answer your how are you feeling question, the same way that Zac Brown answered Martin Brundle when he said on the grid, how are you feeling? And Zac said... Fine, thanks. How are you? He didn't feel that way for the rest of the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix. He said it was the most...
hellish two hours of his entire life. And it was that you can well imagine. But what a pleasure it is to be back in the McLaren Technology Center, not Technical Center. Let's get this right. Haven't been here for a while. We have a lovely... Altura behind us, the road car, the current car, a model just from the workshop. And look.
Constructors with the apostrophe in the correct place. Champions with a one on the I. See that little on the champions? Oh, I actually, yes. It's a one. Yes, I actually missed that. Very good. You missed it? Yeah, I did miss that.
Ron wouldn't have missed that. Anyway, a delight to be here. So thank you. Really good. Thank you to McLaren for having us as well. Ted, before we go any further, I have to ask you if you've come down from cloud nine with Brad Pitt telling you, quote, I love your segment. I love your stuff.
Well, he watches The Notebook, apparently. So at least I've got one viewer, which is Brad Pitt. Yes, who knew he was a Sky subscriber? Anyway, so we should get him on a VIP list, shouldn't we? It was lovely, lovely to meet him. Glad he watches The Notebook.
He never watched it before. He didn't call me Crofty, which is what most people call me. I don't think a lot of taxi drivers, surprisingly. You get a number of taxis where they go, oh, Crofty, nice to see you. No, that's the other one. But yeah, pleasure to meet him. And I would just like to say, maybe I should say it. this point.
I think the offer of a cameo role was a sort of joke, because I think he offers everybody a cameo role. And they were wrapping filming that afternoon. I was flying home that evening, and I don't think I really turned it down. I think it was meant in jest. returned in jest. What I should have said, of course, was, no, you're right, Brad, I'm a terrible actor, so I wouldn't be any good to you in a film, and I don't take direction well, as my director will attest.
So I almost put my cans with my director who would have told Brad Pitt, no, he doesn't take direction well. I can confirm. But yeah, pleasure to meet him. Yeah, very, very cool. And you also made headlines in the broadcasting world because we got to have a proper look around the car and how the camera... were aligned, everything like that. Anyway, let's move on. Let's talk about the 2024 season. That's why we're here. Karun, in your view, how will the 2024 season be remembered? As something...
Pretty extraordinary, because it started off looking pretty worrying, to be honest. We all got on that flight back from Saudi Arabia, quite nervous that we were going to have to work pretty hard to make...
the next 22 race weekend sound exciting. But from Miami onwards, the season came alive. So I think it was extraordinary. I can't really think of a season where we had such a turn in terms of... dominance by one team at the start of the year and then complete turnaround to have four teams winning multiple races. for the first time in F1 history. Four teams recording a 1-2 finish for the first time in F1 history in the same season. So yeah, I think it was an extraordinary season.
Two things for me. Three, actually. A different Max Verstappen. won the championship in a different way. Obviously, the domination of 2023, the not so good at the beginning, but got better of 2022. And we know what happened in 2021. So won it in a different way. a bit calmer maybe, a bit more considered, had to work harder at the factory, he said, than he ever had to before.
the resurgence of McLaren and the coming force that will be Lando Norris and Oscar Piastri, who are really maturing, and Ferrari in the background as well. So it's a real three-way fight. The only question, of course, is Mercedes, which we'll get onto later. But a different kind of Formula One coming out from this season. Can either of you pinpoint a moment where you thought, hold on a minute.
we might have a championship here, let alone one, let alone two. I mean, was there a moment in the season that you thought that? I mean, I would say around... You see, the problem was, is that Max had won, what was it, seven out of the first 10. And even that sort of layover into the summer break, you thought, oh, well, he can't do that. So for me, it would have been the second win, the second McLaren win post-summer break. There was the Zandvoort.
win for Lando, and then there was the Budapest win for Oscar. And then you thought, this McLaren is a rocket ship, and we have a championship on. And Lando knew it, and he was asking, for preeminence in the team in Budapest, which they didn't give him at the time, which they later gave him after Monza in Baku and Azerbaijan. So after those two post-summer break, and I remember saying to...
Lando, what did you do on your summer break? You know, your rocket ship, winning by 25 seconds, 22 seconds, sorry, in Zandvoort. That was the moment for me. I think it was a bit earlier for me. I think it was actually in Miami, because I think they were competitive. throughout free practices. And then they managed to screw it up on the sprint qualifying, didn't they? They ended up nowhere. They just couldn't get the medium tyre to work and they were nowhere on the sprint. And in the race...
He got lucky, of course. You know, the safety car played into his hands. But when he got in front, he had the pace. And he had the upgraded car that weekend, Lando. And he had the pace. And to me, I was like, OK, Max hasn't caught him here. And he's managed to keep in front. He then didn't win in Imola, obviously didn't win in Monaco, should have and could have won in Canada. But I actually thought to myself...
Red Bull haven't got it all their own way. Just watching how that Miami weekend unfolded, just looking at the pace of it all. He clearly, Lando agreed with you. Miami was a turning point for him because he said after, right, I've won my first race. Now for the championship. And everybody, potentially even his own team, were saying, well, steady on, Lando. But he believed it, didn't he? Yeah, but for me, it was even before.
The actual win, you know, even if we discount the last lap, it was the fact that they were quick. It was the first time that it seemed to me that someone was as quick as Red Bull. And at no point before that did we think... any other car was going to be as quick as the Red Bull. Max's fourth championship in a row. We've got to compare them, naturally, because that's what we do. It's a podcast. Was this, Karun, his best championship to date? I think it...
No, I think that it's tough to compare because as Ted was making the point before, all four of his have been different. But I think that... I go back to 2022 and that battle that he had with Leclerc. The Red Bull wasn't as good early on, but Ferrari had reliability issues. Leclerc made more mistakes. I thought Max was metronomic. This year, we saw the Red Mist a few times, didn't we? I thought when Budapest with Lewis, Abu Dhabi with Oscar at the first corner, Mexico, obviously, with Lando.
So we saw the red mist a few times. So I don't know if it was his best, but he was still, there's no doubt about it, the number one driver this year. He outperformed the car, didn't he? Yes, he did. By quite some way. You can't say that. There is no such concept as outperforming the car. He maximised the full potential of the car. The other driver failed to maximise the potential of the car. I see your point. You can't physically outperform the car.
I say this in podcasts all the time. It drives me nuts. It is not possible. I think Kareem might be the driver between us. He delivered the first, you know, he really won the championship in the first half of the season, didn't he? Winning... seven out of the first 10 races, and then Brazil and Qatar as two kind of knockout blows at the end. And I think judging by, you know, Brazil itself.
That was worthy of a world championship itself. The work, as we've already said, the work he had to do in the factory to get the car back after a wrong direction that it took. And at some points, having to be the adult in the room. When his dad was warring with his team boss, Helmut Marko was warring with other people. And, you know, there was an amount of unsettlement in Red Bull this year. And through it all...
Max often was the grown-up in the room. And even though you look at 2023, and knowing that having to keep knocking in those wins all but one of the races of the season in 2023, he won. And that must be pretty difficult. regardless of how good the car was. So 2023, I think, is, you know, some achievement. 2024, I think, has to be, yeah, one of the best, if not the best. To me, they were also...
I agree with Ted's point. When they were struggling, I thought that qualifying lap to get on the front row in Singapore... bag those 18 points that was so important being the only race they lost in 2023 yeah could have been a banana skin yeah yeah and he did a fantastic job there You know, Brazil is the obvious highlight, right? He picked it when Simon and I talked to him in Vegas after the race, Max himself. But actually, Barcelona...
for me, was an outstanding drive and is one that isn't really talked about because McLaren, I thought, had the quickest car. Lando got Paul by a comfortable margin. Max... at the start, got ahead of Lando, but George got past them both. He knew if he got stuck behind George in the first stint, he would cook the front tyres. He took the initiatives, used the battery deployment in the right way, past George.
to get in front on the opening lap, and that set him up for victory. Lando got stuck on that stint behind George, and that was a difference. Lando finished within two seconds of him, but he lost all that time behind George. And to me, that kind of summed up the season, is that Max... seized every opportunity that came through even when he didn't have the best car.
The relationship with GP Lambiazzi, let's not forget. Stronger than ever. I think tested more than ever. Yeah, tested more than ever. You know, I mean, that radio message. Can you guys at the back remember, you know, wake up? Because...
There are some points to go here, and I know it's not very much, but we're going to need these points at the end of the season. I mean, he didn't in the end, but he might have had to. And, you know, he was right to sort of call that out sometimes. He was always on it. The big question now, I think as we sit here is, can he win a fifth title?
without having the fastest car for the whole season? Because, as we were saying, at least for the first six weekends he had it, he built that buffer of 60 points over Lando, which he needed. Can he win a fifth title without having the best car? Because I think we'd all be surprised if the Red Bull will be the quickest car next year. That's just a matter of how competitive...
F1 is at the moment, and that they've lost Adrian Newey. Okay, if it comes out and they start the year like they did with the RB20 last year, I will eat those words with a knife and fork. But I don't think it's a rogue view to suggest that we're not expecting Red Bull to start the season with the fastest car.
Now, before we get on to meet our guests from McLaren, a quick word on our podcast sponsor, Dropbox. Because in Formula One, as soon as one race concludes, the focus shifts to the next, with the team reviewing terabytes of data after each Grand Prix.
where milliseconds can make all the difference, sifting through this content is a race between races. As an official technology partner of the McLaren Formula One team, Dropbox helps them quickly search and manage this vast amount of content and data. the team can find the information they need in a flash, reducing time spent searching.
Want to learn more? Take an exclusive behind-the-scenes look at how Dropbox fuels the McLaren Formula One team's speed and performance by visiting dropbox.com forward slash McLaren hyphen F1. Okay, I promised we'd be joined by some special guests. We've got not one, not two, but three.
guests from McLaren. Please welcome Will Joseph, Director of Race Engineering at McLaren and Lando's Race Engineer, Tom Stallard, Director of Human Performance and Race Engineer for Oscar Piastri, and Randy Singh, Racing Director at McLaren. We've got that out of the way. I did double check. The first question I have for you guys, tell us about the party on Sunday night. How, Tom, you've already got a smile on your face. How was it? What happened? I mean, the party on Sunday night was...
Somewhat unexpected because we all jumped on a plane and flew to Bahrain. We only really kind of got announced to the team like after we'd won the championship, obviously. It would have been awkward if you'd lost, obviously. Yeah, everyone would go and sit on a plane. And so we left the garage with sort of champagne still dripping out of the overheads and got on an airplane, flew to Bahrain.
They'd changed every bulb in Bahrain to papaya orange. So from the air, the whole of Bahrain was bright orange, which looked amazing. They changed the mobile network to McLaren F1 Champs. So yeah, it was really cool. It was really nice to celebrate all that.
I think it was great that every single member of the team was invited. And not only every member of the team, but if people had their family and friends there, they were invited too. So that was one of the things that we were very keen on happening. It wasn't just going to be a party for a few. It was going to be a party for all.
And I think that's testament to how the team runs and team operates. We are one team, not small factions of teams. But no, it was a fun night. Not much sleep, but a fun night. Well, only two out of the three of you had to go back to work the next day, didn't you? I think Tom got the day off. I had to go in earliest as well. So 58 minutes of sleep and then in for a team manager's meeting. But somehow I was there first. And a release of tension, of pressure.
Yeah, to be honest, I don't know how Tom and Will feel, but we treat all the races the same and we said that was our mantra through the whole year. And to be honest, the race just felt like another normal race. It was really when we saw the videos and the photos from everyone here celebrating, and that's when it starts to sink in, when you see everyone when you come back as well.
So just a small plane-spotting exercise, if I might, to my fellow pilot in the middle here. The Royal Bahraini Flight, was it a 747? It was, but we weren't on it. What? We were on the, well, we were a group of many. So we were a few hours later on a A320. Nice. Happy? Yes, happy. I mean, you know, it's a bus. They essentially got a bus to the party, and then a bus from the party back to the office. Those buses happened to be the Bahraini Royal Flight 747 and the A320, so...
Yeah. Very, very cool. Nice bit of detail I wanted to know. Sorry, go on. Randy, you said you treated Abu Dhabi like every other race. How on earth do you keep yours and your team's feet on the ground? during a championship battle? What tools did you use? Because if it were me, I'd get really excited middle of the season. I'd find it, you know, but you have such a large operation here. How does that happen?
Yeah, I think to be fair, we have a lot of support. There's a really good culture here. We don't focus on the results. We just focus on what we're doing. And I think that's something that builds up over the year. So, you know, we've had wins. We've had races where we could have won and we haven't won. And so I think everyone...
just builds up that approach for the year. The team does an excellent job of putting support in place so that we have people to talk to if we are feeling stressed. I think actually all of us probably spoke to our teams through the Friday, Saturday, Sunday to make sure that they were not feeling any additional...
pressure um and that's why i think it also just then takes a while to sink in afterwards because actually you've just done a normal race and you've won the race but it takes a while to sink in that actually won the constructors as well well can i ask you about the Drivers' Championship and Lando this year. Because it was somewhat of a breakout season. It's almost hard to remember he hadn't won a race before the season. So much has happened this year. But on Sunday morning at Miami...
You know, you were 60 points behind Max at the end of the year. You're 63 points. There's been a lot of talk about, you know, did the first laps and the starts and all this stuff cost in the championship. But really, it's the first few weekends, isn't it? How is that going to mold the way you guys go through the winter and start next season? Because let's be honest, we're all thinking of you as the favorites now based on the form. How do you start next year not giving away that deficit?
I mean, I think you're right in the fact that it's not a single race. It's not a single thing that happened that meant we didn't win that championship. Yes, I think we could have done better in a lot of those races. But as you said, what we need to do is we need to hit the ground running.
2025 we talk a lot about raising the bar and the reality is if we go into 2025 at the same place we finish here we won't win we need to do more we need to do better so everything that has gone wrong we need to go back and find a
and why we couldn't do it better. Do we need to change the way we work? Do we need to change the information that we're sharing? There's a lot of work in the background that goes on to raise the bar and the responsibilities on us. You know, Lando has a shared responsibility and he's the... first person to say there are things that he could have done better um so we'll go through those together we'll go through those as a group
as individuals and we'll come together and hopefully come up with a plan. You know, it's big on Randy's agenda to make us better in a lot of the things we do. That's one of his big responsibilities and it's our responsibility to be part of that. play our role in, you know, crossing every I and dotting every T. So you're hardened in battle now, or more, because it's a young group from what you were...
a few years ago and you've been in position to win now. Do you feel those, maybe the decisions that you didn't get right? I'm thinking Silverstone, maybe Canada as well. in a way, you had to go through some of them to know. And Lando had to go through, and Oscar had to go through some of these things that didn't quite go right, that put the drivers slightly out of your grasp this year.
Yeah, I think I can go on that one because I bear some of the responsibility for those decisions, which we do as a team. I think we have a really strong process here. We review all the races, all the things that have gone well, all the things that haven't gone well, and we treat it very rationally. so we don't get stressed about that's a win that's gone instead of a seventh place in previous years.
And I do think we've learned a lot, like from some of the wet races, some of the races where the drivers have both been at the front, which is not a situation we dealt with before. And the field has been incredibly tight this year. I think this year has been the most challenging racing strategy.
that I remember. So I think we're always improving and I feel like this year we've improved a lot through the year. I think the races at the end of the year compared to those at the start show that and we just need to keep that trajectory up.
Tom, let's get on to Oscar, because he won two races this year. I thought, you know, some of the weekends, the highs were very high, no doubt about it. But I remember talking to you after Budapest, and we were saying how last year, he was 29 seconds behind Lando. And we'll come back to Team Order stuff in a second. But just his pace and the development of Oscar.
Can you shed a little bit of light on what it was like to work with him and how much he changed? Sure. So, I mean, I think it's easy to forget now that Oscar's only done two seasons. So that means a lot of the circuits on the F1 calendar, he's only been to twice. So he's actually still very much in a learning phase in that regard, even though you might say, oh, he's done well over 40 Formula One races. And this time last year, when we looked at his results, it was clear that...
particularly the circuits where rear tyre management was the challenge in the race, then he was generally found wanting and struggled to manage them in the best way. So we worked very hard through the winter and through the opening races to try and fix that. And I think this year he's been, you know, in the races in a much, much better place. And generally his tyre management certainly no longer looks like a weakness, no longer looks like a problem. There's still opportunities.
um the next thing that we need to do with oscar is take a small step in the qualifying performances because he's generally been a little bit one or two tenths only like normally on the same row as lando but there's probably one or two tenths that we want to try and find into next year. 0.171 on average, according to my spreadsheet. So if we can do that...
Then I think what has been very impressive this year is what I would call his race craft, like around other cars. Probably the clearest example was racing in Azerbaijan when he made the fantastic overtake on Schal and then had to defend. To defend tooth and nail for pretty much every lap remaining. But actually, there have been a number of situations and the way that our two drivers work together in the sprint in Qatar with Oscar defending against Russell, who was very quick at that point.
is another good example. He's been good at safety car restarts. He's generally been going forwards at the race start. And that despite qualifying among the kind of established top drivers, if you like. So very happy with that aspect of his racing. So there's just a couple of things we're looking to put in place next year. And then I think he'll be in a...
very strong position. Just to underline that, he knows how to put championships together. Of course, he's done it in the junior formula. Only driver on the grid to have no DNFs. Yeah, he's actually... Lando had the Austria. Yeah, Lando had Austria. So Oscar has not only had no DNFs, but he's completed every lap. Every lap. And that's how you win a championship. He's the fourth driver only to do that. Yeah.
But the other three all won the championship that year. So that's a stat which our design office are phenomenally proud of. For Oscar, there's a little bit of a bird in the back of that and he wants to put that right next to you. Your design office, what, in terms of reliability of the car as well? Yeah, I mean, the reliability...
our cars, we've had no kind of mechanical DNFs all year. Does that mean that your resources go into making the car faster, not fixing the car and putting money into that side of it? I mean, that kind of reliability only comes with a lot of effort and investment and time. And it's not like you go, oh, now we've had good reliability. We don't need to think about reliability anymore because it's always the snake waiting to bite you.
So I think what it does allow is you're not spending money on repairing broken parts, clearly. And the main thing is it just means that week in, week out, you keep, you know, even if the weekend doesn't go well, you keep getting a little dribble of points here and there, whereas as soon as you don't finish, you don't score.
Randy, what's it like on the pit bull when they are running close together? Let's go back to Austria, you know, where it was quite clear, and I said it at the time, a lot of people... disagreed. I thought you guys did the right thing for the big picture of the team and I got a whole lot of abuse for that. They're throwing away the championship for Lando and stuff.
How difficult for you guys, the three of you on the pit bull, because you two have to make the phone call to the drivers, tell them what to do. You're very much in that conversation with Andrea. What's it like now when you, you know... We've taken away the pressure of the weekend. Just give us a little insight into that. Do you mean allowing Oscar to win in Hungary? Yeah. Okay. Sorry, I thought you said Austria. Yeah.
Sorry. You did. Oh, sorry. Long season. We're all friends here. One of 24. Yeah, so I think... I think what's not visible to people outside is how well that process works. We discussed stuff prior to the race with the drivers. We discussed the races after with the drivers, with Tom and Will as well. We make sure everyone's on the same page. Everyone, we have some...
principles the McLaren team comes first that will always try and be fair with the drivers and that fairness may take many races or seasons to repay sometimes but we'll always try and be fair and upfront and honest and we do stick to that. It can be stressful and it can be... I could hear Will getting fairly stressed. He had to remind...
Lando, a few times. Yeah, I think the times where it's been a bit more stressful is really the situations that we haven't had as much time to prepare for that we've not anticipated. So I think we've learned a lot from every single instance of sort of teamwork that we've done between.
the drivers through the year we've learned more and more and we try to keep a record of fairness and and we're very open with everyone so I think actually it probably seems a lot more stressful to the outside and it can be stressful during the race because everyone's on high adrenaline and you're trying to get the best result but to be honest every discussion that we've had about
teamwork between the drivers between the two sides of the garage has always been very productive and we've often come out of it thinking okay at least next time we know that we won't make this small mistake again everyone's like direction was in the right place so we just move forward as a team. Tell me about Andrea Stella. What's he been like to work with the last couple of years? Tell me you're smiling. We all love Andrea. But I think one of the things with Andrea is he joined the team.
in 2015 when Fernando joined and originally was going to be a race engineer. And he's been very much like in the center of the kind of track side group within the team for a long time. And to be honest, every time Andrea has been promoted, you know, we've all thought maybe this one's a step too far. And then he smashed it out of the park. And he's done that consistently to now be team principal and done exactly the same.
um you know we've all got a huge amount of respect for the guy and what he's been able to achieve In my head, at least, as someone who's predominantly got a trackside role, that kind of started with the trackside group. He got the trackside group to a pretty good place. And then he's been able to spread that kind of culture and environment and supportiveness to the whole of the factory team as well.
I mean, I disagree a bit about the point about thinking it was a step too far. I think when Andrea was made team principal, I was sort of relieved and really excited on the fact that we'd known just how influential and important he could be the race team if he could share some... some of that behavior and some of that drive with the whole factory.
What could we become? And the answer is this, you know, all of that that we've been exposed to for a bit longer than the factory and people here has led to us becoming the world champions. But Tom's point is real about he'd never been a team principal of...
any team before. So coming in, it was a bit of a surprise. And I agree with Tom in the sense that we all thought, well, okay, this is one of the biggest teams in Formula One, McLaren. He's never been a team principal. Okay, he's been all these other things. But he knew the team. I know. He knew the team and he knew already.
what to do to extract the best from the team. It didn't take someone else to come in and learn about the people and about their environment for a year or two years. He was immediately able to accelerate the team on the path that we needed to take. achieved this year at the end of Abu Dhabi.
I'd like to almost rewind to the early part of 2023 because I remember getting to the first race. I wouldn't. Honestly, because I remember going to the early part of 2023 and talking to Andrea and he said, we're going to be nowhere at the start of the year. We're going to be nowhere.
But I promise you, mid-season, when we get the bits, the car's going to be great and we're going to be in a much better position. What changed? Because you were sort of, you know, if I rewind to those previous few years, you were there... third, fourth, fifth, you know, sort of fighting that. But something changed in this building to elevate you guys to becoming race-winning contenders week in, week out.
Yeah, I can't talk so much about what changed in the building, but I think Andre really embodies what he preaches for the culture. And I think some of the principles are, we're very honest. So he was honest with you about where we would be at the start of the year. We're honest about whether upgrade... work or don't work that hasn't always been the case in my experience in F1 you know people become precious about this is my bit of work I don't want to say it's not going to work
And there's none of that with Andrea. He really embodies the honesty and there's just no blame culture. Like I remember many races where Andrea said, it was one last year, Andrea said, this is going to be a red flag. And I thought it was going to be a safety car. And I did what I thought was right for a safety car. It turned into a red flag. Didn't work out for us as a result. And Andrea didn't say a thing about, like, I told you, so I was right.
And he just gives everyone the space to do what they think is right, work out how to improve, improve, and just do it in a very honest way. And certainly my experience in Formula One has been very different to that up until pretty much when Andrea took over. A couple of quick questions, I think. A few more minutes. You've got to go and do some work. Actual work. People might not know this guy's name. He's called...
Kari Lamanranta. He's from Finland. Kari, I think. Kari. Kari? What did I call him? Kari. Kari Lamanranta. But I've pronounced the surname okay. You did the hard bit. It's pronounced Lemon Fanta. It's pronounced Lemon Fanta in Finnish. Yes. Okay, good. All right. He's from Finland. He's the chief mechanic, and he's in charge of the, with you, of course, on the pit stop, with you all on the pit stop crew. Unsung hero, been at McLaren since I can remember.
That final two-second pit stop of Landos, when a cross-thread or a jack failure or something, this might not be on the wall, but for that. your thoughts on him and the pit crew and all the boys and girls in the garage? I mean, I think, you know, Kerry does a phenomenal job and not just in pit stops, but in everything he does. He's a true leader within the garage and he gets the most from people.
He's the type of person that when something's going wrong with a car, you know, that he'll be able to dive in and get involved. But at the same time, there's many people in the garage that can take on that responsibility. And we no longer need single figureheads that have to take that responsibility because everyone... sort of bears that together. The particular pit stop, you know, they did a fantastic job when the pressure was on their shoulders.
You know, we had said when we were racing, we'd let Carlos pit first and we'd pit the lap after. We knew the undercut power would be fairly strong. So we knew we had to make that stop. But no one sort of worries about it, about that particular stop. or we don't put pressure on that particular race. We just try and do our best job at every single point and that leads to these results.
you know you try and take away that pressure rather than mount the pressure on people so carry and everyone took that and uh yeah it was a fun you know absolutely fantastic stop Final question then. Can you go one better in 25 and the Drivers' Championship? It seems silly to talk about it, given you just…
And a very successful 2024. But next year. That is the big question all of us want to know. Can you do it? Who's the competition? I think the competition is going to be everyone because the field is tight. I think all we can do is just... Keep plugging away, working, elevating our standards. I think it's way too early to be thinking about what the results will be. But yeah, I think if we keep doing the same thing, hopefully the results will be good.
And the reality is it started already. It's not what can we do? It's what are we doing? You know, the bar has been raised and we're ready to try and jump that bar. Randy, Will, Tom, thank you so much. We have a well done present. In honor of papaya rules, remember papaya rules. Remember them well. On all the things that Will used to say and all of this stuff. Have a special Christmas present to the engineering team.
I think that's the first whole papaya I've ever seen. There you go. It's the most what, papaya? It's the first sort of whole papaya I've ever seen. I'm sorry, it's the first papaya you've ever seen. I mean, we go by the colour rather than the fruit. You might want to get a refund on the colour of that t-shirt. I've got you a Christmas papaya. Who said papaya rules most? It was you, wasn't it? Papaya rules. On the radio probably. Trust the car.
There you go. I'll turn this into a pudding. I have got you a Christmas present and a well done on winning the constructors from my local fruit shop. It's slightly sticky. So that's where you know it's a real papaya. I want to see it. served up eaten with a knife and fork in the office party? I'll do a cheesecake or something. Okay, good. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Thank you.
Okay, so we've shrunk down. There's now three of us. There was six. There's now three. Really interesting insight, wasn't it? And I think... Just goes to show you, the first title in 26 years for McLaren, it was hard fought, but they deserved it, didn't they? So they weren't there. I mean, Andrea Stella was, in 1998, Andrea Stella was...
26 and he was studying he was doing his phd in aeronautical engineering or aerodynamics at bologna university or somewhere in italy um they were i think they were still in college stallard and will Tom was probably rowing. At that point, wasn't it? Probably, yeah. And Randy was doing the same. So, yeah, there are a few people. The only person on the McLaren race team that was there in 1998 was Mark Norris. Actually, he's one of the sort of chief commercial guys there at the moment.
And a certain yours truly, of course, was there as well. I know you don't believe me, Matthew. So I've brought some proof that I was there. Amongst my Oyster card and my tissues. I was going to say, that Oyster card. Oyster card and the tissues. Oh, look at this. There you go. I brought some proof that I was also there in 1998. Fantastic. 26 years ago. When I remember Mika Hakkinen, I've got my pass. Yeah. From 1998. I see the picture. There you go.
You can see the picture. Oh, wow. I need to zoom in. Good luck to Kieran for getting the picture on there. Yes, the hair was more sort of, yeah, thick back then. Started to lose it back then. But there you go. T Kravitz. Makes me wonder what else. You've had a papaya in your pocket. You've had a pass. They kept the papaya. Seeing as a podcast is both an audio and a visual medium, I'd bring my pass from 1998.
I really should have got someone at McLaren to sign it, shouldn't I? There you go. So I was there back in 1998. They, you know, they were still... There were so many few people who were there who remember, all right, you can argue where they should have won the construct, should have been given the construct. Well, in 2007, when they messed up with Alonso and Hamilton and got it removed anyway. Same in 2008 with Lewis.
winning the drivers um but you know maybe kobe line and didn't score quite as many points maybe they deserved it around the sort of late 2000s when they were able to win the drivers but they didn't the fact is that they were disqualified in 2007 weren't they and They didn't win it in 2008 even though. Maybe they should have done
Shall we move on? And I've tried to thematically move through some of the other big topics that we had this season. This next section is called Ferrari forwards, Mercedes back, because Ferrari made a huge step forward this season. In 2003, they finished third in the Constructors, obviously finished second this year. Mercedes finished fourth this year, and they were second in 2003. So a bit of a swing between the two. Let's deal with Ferrari first. Karun, I'll start with you.
I whisper it quietly, but it was also quite a good storyline if Ferrari won the Constructors' Championship, wasn't it? Carlos Sainz's last race with the team, he was going out, Lewis was coming in next year. As happy as I am for McLaren, and what a win that was. Both would have been great stories, wouldn't they, for Formula One? And actually, when you look back at the season, all it kind of sort of hinged on is Baku. If Carlos Sainz and Perez hadn't have had that...
awkward crash with a lap or so to go, then Ferrari would have been constructors champions. You know, that was the difference because Lando gained a couple of places. And Carlos would have been second or third, which would have been 18 or 15 points. And that would have been enough. So, you know, it was that close at the end of the season. One incident here or there. You could argue lots of these things. Ferrari had a double DNF in Australia, did they not? Canada. In Canada, sorry.
No, I agree. But for me, that one, that crash was a kind of a clumsy one, wasn't it? It was like an unnecessary, it was just a clumsy, unnecessary accident, I felt, where... You know, it's just one of those frustrating, unlucky things where both drivers were kind of heading for the same road at the same time. But they won, and then there would be a dip.
So after Leclerc's win in Monaco, there was the sort of dip after that. They had a double DNF in Canada, of course. Too many cases for Ferrari have just lost points. Yeah, they went missing, didn't they? I think in terms of the development of the car... We saw them having to back-to-back an old floor. And then they introduced some new bits. It created bouncing in the high speed, which created issues in fast corners, you know, places like Silverstone as well.
So they kind of lost their way. But then I think since the summer break, they managed to rediscover some form, right? You know, we saw Leclerc winning in Monza. a race which McLaren should have won, really, arguably. Austin was somewhat confusing because they weren't in the front row and yet utterly dominated the race. So they... All the signs were there that it bodes well for next year. But I think to your point...
They never had the consistency that McLaren did from Miami onwards. One thing that they did say about the leadership of Fred Vasseur, which maybe we'll get onto a bit later, is that, you know, I think somebody asked Charles Leclerc after... Was it, no, it was Sainz after his win in Mexico. They said, was there a party? And Sainz said, no, we don't do those things.
after we win. We don't go crazy and have a massive party after we win races this year because Fred Vasseur has told us that's the influence of Fred Vasseur. He said, we will win. We might celebrate with a bit of champagne at the end that I'll spray on you if I'm Fred Vasseur. But, and that's it. There'll be another flag over the factory entrance in Marinello, but that's it.
You obviously didn't see the interview I did with Carlos in Brazil, where he said he didn't remember much of Monday for the amount of tequila he drank on a Sunday night after winning in Mexico. Somebody's telling Porky's there. They'll tell us one thing one day and one thing the other. That's true. But, you know, let's see. I mean, too many times the car's out the points for Ferrari. You know, Leclerc having the feel-good wins.
Monaco, even though that was a bit of an odd race because there were no pit stops, were there? They were after the red flag. And, you know, the win in Monza, let's not forget, the feel-good win in Monza. But, yeah, it might get on to Mercedes, but... I think Lewis might have made the right decision at the right time. Actually, there's feel-good stories on both sides, doesn't it? Because Carlos winning in Melbourne after 10 days earlier lying in a hospital bed. Yeah.
That for me was an amazing feel-good story. But did Lewis know... when he decided over the winter, do you know what? We haven't even turned a wheel in testing yet, but I don't think this Mercedes is the place to be. I'm going to go at Ferrari. Was that just a leap in the dark for you? Because it turned out to be absolutely true. Look at Mercedes.
They've been a bit lost this year. They never knew which kind of car was going to turn up at the racetrack and what it was going to do. It might win brilliantly like in Belgium. Then one gets disqualified because they're running it too low or whatever, too light or the wear, whatever. Do you think Lewis knew or do you think that was just a punt? I think only he can answer that question. I think it was a punt because how could you...
How could you tell what the opposition was doing? He would obviously have had a feeling of what was going on at Mercedes. And he's talked about, you know, people not necessarily listening to what he was saying and not fully taking on board some of his...
thoughts of where he thought the cars should go and things like that. You know, in reflection early in the year, he was talking about some of those conversations. So maybe that just steered him towards thinking maybe I'll go somewhere else where they will listen a bit more. I don't know. But it's funny, I was re-watching some interviews that you and Martin were doing towards the end of 2012 with people like Nicky Lauda about Lewis coming to Mercedes.
And even that was a bit of a punt because he just wanted a change of environment to leave McLaren and go to somewhere else. And I think he does, but it's a calculated risk. It's worked out once. We'll see if it happens again. you could be one of the millions of UK drivers who may be owed thousands in compensation
If you bought a car on finance from 2007 onwards, you may have been unfairly charged hidden commission payments. My Claim Group can help you check even if you can't remember your car or lender details. Text CLAIM to 866. My Claim Group is authorized and regulated by the Financial Conduct Authority. Text CLAIM to 86688.
Hi there, Emma Payton here from the Love the Darts podcast from Sky Sports, just popping up to tell you about our daily episodes from the World Darts Championships at Alexandra Palace. Each day of the tournament, you'll get exclusive interviews and behind-the-scenes access right the way. way through to the final on January the 3rd. All you need to do is search for Love the Dart wherever you get your podcasts and give us a follow. Catch you soon.
Should we just talk about Mercedes then briefly? Next year, this year has been quite painful, hasn't it? Quite a long, painful season for Mercedes. knowing how successful they've been, obviously eight-time constructors, champions in recent years, is next year all about, I don't know. use the term blooding in, which is a strange term to use, but blooding in Kimi Antonelli, getting in prepped, ready for 2026. How much of next year is even, is it just like get through next year, 2026 is the focus?
Yeah, yes. I think so. I think they've lost some people from Mercedes. They've lost Loic Serrata, Ferrari. But they are... having the same kind of feelings about the 2026 power unit, which is so different as they had about the 2014 power unit. So the noise is Toto Wolff says, James Allison says out of Bricksworth, the Mercedes engine. is that they're feeling the same kind of gains that they had when they swept the board under a new power unit routine regulation in 2014, as they will for 2026.
I'd be surprised if Mercedes are contending, even though they've got, you know, Mercedes in the background. So they still, a Mercedes engine still won the Constructors Championship, didn't it? Which is actually something we haven't really talked about this year. You know, this is the first customer.
championship victory since 2009 with Braun, really. So, yeah, fair play to them. Well, Ripple and Renault, that wasn't... They were always the... They were sort of Work's favourite team, weren't they? And also, I think the Work's Renault team pulled out. 2010 really then it became Lotus and all sorts but yeah on Mercedes I agree with Ted I think the trouble is now
you know, from January the 1st, so much of the focus in all of these factories will be on 2026. And yeah, I think there will be certainly a different... something different about the cars for 25, but it's not a wholesale change like we're going to have the year after. So I think next year is a little bit of a holding pattern, which is disappointing because...
This year, we wanted Mercedes to be in the fight, even with Lewis leaving, probably even more so, to have that final fairy tale farewell story, you know, winning towards the end and winning a championship, maybe. If you're Kimi Antonelli, though... It takes the pressure off a little bit? No. I don't think so. I think whether you're driving for the team who's finished 10th in the championship or the team at the front of the grid...
As a rookie in F1, there's nowhere to hide. You know, you've got people like us analyzing every single sector of every single lap that they do. And for Kimi Antonelli, you know, the fact that he's coming in as a rookie... but with a top team, means you're expected to deliver as Lewis was when he arrived at McLaren and got nine podiums straight off the bat, as Oscar Piastri has shown in the last two years, you know, the expectations.
on rookies is high you can't just you can't just be there um you know saying oh i'm here to learn anymore it's that that excuse is gone with the likes of Verstappen, Leclerc, Russell, Lewis before that. You know, these rookies have just... Raise the bar of expectation. We've got quite a few next year, haven't we? A lot of people to follow. This is a good segue into the next section, which I've put as driver swaps.
And we had no shortage of mid-season drama, did we? With drivers being swapped in and out, we said goodbye to Daniel Ricciardo, hello to Liam Lawson. James Vowell's patience with Logan Sargent ran out and insteped Franco Colopinto. And then, of course, we have the constant discussion around the...
form of Sergio Perez. Now, we are recording this on the 12th of December. It is entirely possible by the time you listen to this podcast, there has been some news with Sergio Perez, but we'll come on to him in a second. I just wonder... Franco Colopinto's story was quite interesting for me. Stock going up and down in Formula One. And when he came in, second race, Baku, finishes eighth. I think everyone was going, wow, I mean, this is the real deal.
And slowly but surely, his stock has decreased. Would you agree, Ted? And now, obviously, he doesn't have a drive for next year. Where do you see that? Well, yet. Anything that can happen over the winter. I think... It wasn't slowly but surely. His stock decreased. I think it was one moment in qualifying in Las Vegas, actually. In fact, I remember Martin Brundle.
saying that Alex Albon had failed to get out of Q1, Franco Colopinto had got into Q2, and was gunning, had he completed that lap, I think would have got into Q3, and was absolutely flying. And I remember Martin saying, this kid's got a great future in Formula One. And then he does a Monaco swimming pool tire on the barrier, dislodges the tire, goes into the wall, writes off another chassis. And then almost Martin had to say,
Yeah, I'm not sure that's going to do him much good. I might have to revisit what I just said. And so it turned out to be. But the thing for me about Franco Colapinto is that it wasn't a surprise. It was a surprise to everybody else, given that his Formula 2 form hadn't been spectacular.
But the job that he'd done in the previous year at Silverstone testing in the free practice for Williams had shown them a sign of what could have been and the speed that he had that wasn't there in Logan Sargent. You've got to say James Vowles, I think, made the right decision.
in replacing Logan Sargent. Solid though Logan was. And I think you've also got to say the other replacement with Daniel Ricciardo that Christian Horner, Helmut Marker, Lauren McKees, Peter Bayer also made the right decision in that Ricciardo wasn't as quick as Yuki Tsunoda.
And those two moves were the right decision ultimately. Yeah, I agree. For their teams. Yeah, no, I agree with both of those points broadly. The only thing I'd say is I still don't understand why they re-signed Sargent for this year. You know, I personally could have looked at a scenario where they had maybe Felipe Drogovic, for example, or somebody like that for a year. You know, it's...
Look, in the end, Williams have had an absolute coup, haven't they, getting Carlos Sainz. They are the big winners out of this whole driver market saga. They've got an amazing lineup for next year. And, yeah, I think... Colopinto, there was a lot of hype and a lot of excitement because he did a fantastic job early on. But obviously, one swallow doesn't a summer make. Just on the Perez, Perez's form, I sort of thought Naomi...
Schiff summed it up pretty well when she said, as broadcasters, it actually does get quite exhausting saying the same thing week in, week out about someone like Sergio Perez. It's not... As broadcasters, you don't enjoy bashing a driver. You know, it's not why you're in the job. But the performances for Sergio this season have been so poor compared with his teammate Max. And I know obviously, you know.
They're always going to be poor necessarily compared with Max. But yeah, it's just, it surely has to end that situation. No, I mean, it was absolutely clear. For me, the clearest point was after the race in Qatar, when Christian Horner brought the Constructors' Championship standings on a piece of paper into his post-race press briefing.
with the media. Now, you always know what's in Christian Horner's head with what piece of paper he brings to his press meeting on a Sunday evening after the race. After Mexico... He brought in the telemetry of Lando and Max and what corner and why he felt that the two 10-second penalties for Max were a bit harsh. And then...
completely unprompted, I think. He brings in the constructors' standings, which, of course, have all the points that Sergio Perez didn't manage to score for the team. And instead of this being on, you know, Milton Keynes... Really, they should have won the drivers. It should be. Well, when you look at how many points Mack scored. Yeah, yeah. You know, this should be really on Red Bull.
And the reason it's not is Sergio Perez's form. Now, that's why Horner brought the Constructors' Championship standings. into Qatar. And then the decision came, I think around Qatar. And ever since then, it's been about how we managed to dissolve the contract and pay him off. But yeah, I mean, as we record it, he hasn't. But he has. He has left the team. And it's a matter of engineering it. If you look at the last 18 weekends, so take away the first six weekends of the championship.
Perez scored 49 points across 18 weekends, which included four sprints, by the way. Yeah, wow. It's just not a high enough strike rate. Look, you know, I like Checo and he's been a mate for a very long time. But, you know, I think the reality is that's just not sustainable for a team who wants to fight for the championship.
His average qualifying deficit to max this year was 0.47, nearly half a second. That's the biggest deficit of anyone I can remember for some time. So, yeah, in reality, you know, I think is... He's been given every opportunity, hasn't he, to do it. He might say differently that the team favoured Max, but they have to do something.
Now, who the option? What they do is a different question. The team did favor Max, and Checo was a great team player, and he would often do things that were... He was pulled out of the Parc Ferme for the Qatar sprint to test the new suspension. settings with which Max won the next day. So, all right, it was only a sprint race.
But he still sacrificed his race. He had qualified nowhere. I know, I know. But he's been a great servant and a good team member. So, you know, he has every justification. And he was given a two-year contract. So he has every justification. question, isn't it? Why was he given that contract? That's got to be the question, isn't it? Why they signed him in May? To make him secure and happy and give him the confidence that the team had his back and that would help his performances. Simple as that.
But it didn't. But, you know, he won't have been enjoying it. So maybe as much of it's, you know, move aside. Thank you, Checo. But no, thank you. It must be a release for him. just to what at this point is probably retirement from Formula One and go and enjoy his time with his young family. Let's assume that Sergio is out and Liam Lawson takes that role. Corrine.
How is he going to fare, do you think, up against Max Verstappen? It's kind of the poison chalice, isn't it, of Red Bull Racing? Not kind of, it is. Yeah, fine. The only driver on the planet who wants to go up against Max Verstappen. Look, Liam doesn't have the experience of Yuki Tsunoda. There's no doubt about it. But if you look at his trajectory in, what has he now done? Nine Grand Prix? Ten Grand Prix?
he's on par with Yuki in terms of pace. You know, the average qualifying difference is 0.07. You're talking a few hundredths. So he's quick. There's no doubt about him. In terms of the races, he doesn't have the experience. And I think that's where the challenge is up against Max. You know, in the time that they've had together this season, Yuki scored eight points versus four for Liam. Admittedly, RB weren't as competitive as they were at the start of the year, but that's just fact.
So I think that's for Liam. It's not so much about can he be quick enough because I think he is quick. I think everything we saw in junior categories and we've seen in RB is he's fast. The trouble with driving up against Max or Fernando... It's like playing against Nadal on clay. Whatever you do, the ball just keeps flying back. So every time you've done a lap in the race...
Max has just done a better lap, and he just metronomically hammers those laps home. And I think that's where he mentally just grinds the teammates down. So can Liam mentally be strong enough? to take the grinding and rise to the challenge? That's the big question for me. He's certainly strong. You know, he went up against Sergio Perez and Fernando Alonso, you know, literally and on track as well. He's shown...
himself to be strong-headed enough for Christian Orner and Helmut Marko to think he'll be able to cope with Max. But it's an if, it's a guess. And for me, it's the wrong decision. I think Alex Albin, actually. Strange as this might sound. would have, I think, an engineering, which I don't think would have taken much of a lever to get Alex Albin out of Williams. Williams could have run Franco Colopinto and Carlos Sainz.
perfect. And Alex Albon at least would have been a known measure against Max Verstappen. Albon's so much older and wiser and knows how to handle Max and the whole situation. And I don't know why they haven't done that. Why, Ted, would you not put Yuki Tsunoda in? Why has it been Lawson, not Yuki Tsunoda? It's not me. It's Christian Horner and Helm, Marco. And for whatever reason, I think it's temperament and keeping it together against the pressure cooker that is being Max Verstappen.
teammate, they don't think that he'd be able to cope with that pressure. And that's Horner's. I don't know. I think he should. I think Liam's destroyed. He's destroyed every teammate he's had. Yuki Tsunoda. And I think he's mature enough to do it. But Horner and Marco don't. I still...
don't understand why they didn't sign signs. You know, this thing of, oh, Max doesn't want him or the fathers don't get along. Come on, it's been a decade. And they're at completely different stages of their lives. Max is now a four-time world champion. And really that... deference to to whether the dads don't get on or whether max shouldn't be a factor should it you know at the end of the day
They've lost the Constructors World Championship because the second car wasn't scoring as well as the second Ferrari or the second McLaren on any given weekend. And you have to have the best two drivers. And to me, Sainz was the obvious, obvious candidate. I actually hadn't thought of it before, but I completely agree with Ted because they've still got tenuous links with Albon, haven't they? Yeah, he's very close with Shalom Uvidio, who's the 51% owner of Red Bull. Alex is a personal sponsor.
of some of the Uvidia brands, Monsoon Wine, who's part of the Red Bull group. And so there is a link there. And as I understand it, there is a get-out clause in Albans Williams' contract. that basically allows him to leave if the Red Bull come knocking again. So, yeah. So, I agree, actually. I think... And it solves so many problems. Williams could keep Colopinto. They're sad to let him go. And the... you know, the sponsorship from Argentina. Yeah. And actually, Albon is...
It's the experience to cope with that grinding that I just mentioned. Because he's been through it before, and he's come out the other side. Older-wise, yeah. And would know. Do you know what? If Max is going to beat me today, it's fine. All I need to do is to be within two-tenths of him, which Alex Alba...
absolutely can be. Win the races he's not going to. Score second or third. Be on the podium. And that's it. Happy days. Happy days. Yeah. All right. Shall we enter some sort of quick fire favourites and best moments of the season so far? Shall we start with a favourite race? Silverstone. Silverstone, yeah. I really enjoyed the British Grand Prix. It was in a full dry race. Well, we had a bit of sprinkling of...
drizzled in me. I think it had everything, didn't it? For a generally dry race, we had five drivers genuinely who could win the race at half distance. So we had no idea who was going to win it. And then Lewis winning, the crowd going wild. It was amazing. Emotional. I forgot about how emotional he was on the team radio. I listened to it the other day. And you forget he was...
In tears. And the team. Bono was in tears. Bono was in tears. There were several races where if I had a sofa in my little gap in the pit lane between the garages, I would have been jumping up and down on it. Silverstone was one. Baku was the other one. That was exciting. I was jumping up and down the commentary.
At one point, Harry Benjamin looked at me and said, the commentary box is actually shaking because I was jumping up and out. Come on, normal, let's sky. Austria until the crash at the end with Max and Lando. That was good. And Brazil. Brazil has to feature. That was one of the best races. Yeah, very good. Moment of the year.
You always pick multiples, don't you? I feel like I need to go before you because you've run out of things before you. Go before me, yeah. Go on, move into the Icarin. Moment of the year. I do think that... Brazil, you know, at the end of that race in Brazil, where Max delivered another fastest lap, winning by, you know, by 20, sorry, 19 seconds from 17th on the grid.
That moment where he could have just backed off, he had such a big lead, but yet stamped his authority on the race, I thought was a real, I'm sending you all a signal that we've had a wobbly time, the car's not quick enough in the dry, but I'm the top dog here. Yeah, and a 2-3 for Alpine, just to pepper into moment of the year as well, which also made it pretty special. Yeah, moment with Alpine in Brazil, that would be a moment for me. Just the delight, the relief.
on the mechanics faces down in the pit box. And after the year that they'd had, being somewhat of a, you know, the butt of people's jokes, oh, well, you know, at least we're not as bad as Alpine, you know, I mean, it was... And what's happening to Alpine? This is what we can do. And the drivers as well, to show what they could do. That was a moment for me. Are you going to have another one? Yeah, I've got about four. Can I pick one more then? Yeah, go on. Okay. Can I pick the science...
Win in Australia. The science wins. I've got that. The science wins. Okay. I put the science wins there. We'll flip-flop. You can have one more and then I'll go again. Oscars radio after Baku. Four. That was stressful, wasn't it? Anyway, thanks, guys. I love that. It's brilliant. That was good. The quiet, silent assassin that is Oscar Piastri. I was going to also throw in another team radio, which was Papaya Rules, which was...
A phrase that I never thought we'd ever hear, let alone lead to a papaya being brought into the MTC. Christmas present. Christmas present. Little did they know. I'm starting to think that's the first papaya that's actually been in this factory. An actual papaya. Which papaya rules. Christmas present for them. Charles jumping into the harbour in Monaco, having dispelled the curse of his home race, quickly followed by Fred Vasseur. having just given his, having thrown his phone off to stay dry.
quickly followed by Fred Vasseur. So yeah, Fred really knows how to celebrate with him. He does, doesn't he? Which one did he crash? He crashed the McLaren. The McLaren, Lando, and Miami, yeah. Even if he's not winning, he's still crashing it. All right, biggest disappointment. of the year? I think Aston Martin because they were the feel-good story of last year. Fernando racking up all those podiums and it was bizarre. I was sort of looking back at the season. I didn't even remember but...
Fernando qualified fourth in Saudi Arabia earlier this year. Like, they weren't so bad at the start of the season. And then they were just in sort of no man's land, weren't they? They were nowhere close to the top four teams. And they're kind of sort of ahead of the rest of the pack in terms of constructors, but not in terms of pace. They dropped behind Haas. They even dropped behind Alpine in terms of pace towards the end of the year. So for me...
That was a hugely disappointing season. I can't say that they're disappointing when the genius of Alonso in knocking in the performances he did to get them, secure them fifth in the constructors is not... That's not disappointing, is it? I mean, that's incredible. Just in terms of points, 280 points in 2023, 94 points. I know, I know, but they're still fifth. They haven't dropped any in the constructors. And that's down to Fernando and I suppose...
as well. So, you know, that's not as much of a disappointment for me as Mercedes still not having aced these ground effect cars and showing... Only slightly more understanding of where they're going to make, you know, these, a McLaren beta. So Mercedes would be the disappointment. Yeah. Okay. Final one. Biggest surprise. I'm going to kick this one off with saying Red Bull.
I think with the biggest surprise, their form not being what it was last year, going from winning every race bar one in 2023 to not winning at all. We were all shocked, no? I mean, that was a genuine surprise. Yeah, no, I agree. I think that's a... That's a strong candidate on the list, for sure. I mean, can I cheat a little bit and say Lewis going to Ferrari? Surely that's the biggest surprise of this, technically this year, this season. So I'm going to say that's got to be the slam dunk.
I would also say Franco Colopinto rocking up because I have to say I didn't know much about him. You know, I'd sort of watched the junior Formula races and he hadn't starred. So I have to say he was a bit of a surprise. in those first couple of weekends. A surprise, probably not a surprise, is how much fun it is driving Formula One cars. Yes, Dan! You never told me how good it was. It was. You were just so blasé about the whole thing. I was a Formula One driver. I also did all of this.
They're great, aren't they? Driving Formula One cars. And you were seconds quicker than Crofty. If everybody could do it, then it would be the most popular participation sport in the world. Formula One, driving Formula One cars. If everybody could just go down to their local youth club or whatever, or racing club, and go into a Formula One car and just drive it around for a bit, it would be the most popular.
participation sport in the world. But for me, you've spoken about Colin Pinto. The surprise was a cameo in Brad Pitt's F1 movie, but, you know, I think that was just a joke. It was just a joke. really, Flavio's, a couple of Flavio Briatore decisions. One, to make the Works Renault team not a Works Renault team anymore, and to divest themselves of their Works engine project.
to go on to other projects within the Renault Group. And the split with Esteban Ocon, the deal to split with Esteban Ocon at the end. And can I finish with one big surprise, having been told by seemingly everybody, all the existing teams in Formula One that we absolutely did not, positively definitely did not want an 11th Formula One team. Suddenly, it was like... Something's changed. Yeah, great. Cadillac F1 GM. Fine. It's happening. Don't mention Andretti. That's not the surprise.
The speed at which they said, okay, let's just not mention Andretti. GM, Cadillac, you're in. You should have said earlier. Final one, while you were talking about Briatore, Alpine's progress in the final four races. I mean, 33 points in the last four races for Pierre Gasly and a DNF in Vegas. He started P3 in that race, so it could have been far more points.
Well, he'd only scored nine points up until Brazil. I think that's a remarkable turnaround at the end of the season. I mean, half, more than half, in fact, of the team's points came in Brazil. They got 35 that weekend between the sprint and the thing.
But not a wet race, but not actually an anomaly because they backed it up with other races. I mean, sure. The second third was a real anomaly. An anomaly. But in terms of performance, they were there or thereabouts in the other races to get top tens. Impressive. Impressive turnaround. Crofty and I had a good chat with David Sanchez in Spa earlier this year, who was telling us about all the building blocks that he's been...
putting in place and the sort of low-hanging fruit he could see around the factory in terms of where to extract performance and just change some of the thinking. Obviously, he was here at McLaren and went to Enstone. So I'm interested to see... with a clean winter, because he didn't really have much time to have an effect earlier this season, what effect he can have across the factory.
Was the Haas race pace a surprise to you? From going from tire eaters to tire whisperers? Yeah, and I think actually, I remember when Ayo Komatsu got the top job. and i i sent a text on our sky whatsapp group and
I won't name the names. There were four different people. Takes it back going, Ayo Komatsu? That's a bit of a letdown. Surely that's into him. He's going to be gone. There's going to be someone above him soon. He's only an engineer. What does he know? It was generally consensus. And actually... He's been brilliant. Certainly has. We're in the era of engineer team principals, aren't we? Quite a few of them. Right. Let's end, shall we, with...
drumroll please, your top 10 drivers of the season. I thought we were all doing it. No, we're not. Only a fellow driver. is able to say this. Wish me luck. This is where all the trolling begins. Am I counting 10 to 1? Should we do the disclaimer? Karun may or may not believe this.
This might be devil's advocate. It might not be. But he is a driver. It's his personal view. No, no. I stand by my views. I stand by my views. I was giving you a disclaimer. He's giving you an out there. That's all right. I'll take the abuse. Ten to one. Ten to one. Okay. In 10th, I've got Fernando Alonso, because I thought he did an outstanding job in a tough season for the team. Pierre Gasly, really the standout driver at Alpine.
Racked up a lot of points. Brilliant qualifying towards the late part of the season. That's interesting because those two are flipped from how they actually finished in the drivers. Yeah. Fernando was actually ninth in the drivers. Gasly was tenth. Yeah. Yeah. I did flip then because I thought...
I didn't think the Alpine was as good a car for much of the season. You didn't think Fernando deserved ninth? I thought Gasly deserved ninth ahead of Fernando. Because I thought it's... Even races like Canada earlier in the year... where there were difficult tire calls to make and Gasly was very opportunistic, went from 15th to 9th. I thought, you know, even when the car wasn't good. In 8th, I've got Nico Hulkenberg. I thought the...
The sort of rehabilitation of Nika Hulkenberg from being booted out of F1 and having three years as a super sub, occasional cameos, but now fully back in to a brilliant year. Really strong qualifying. He finished... I think he finished 11th seven times, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. 11th in the championship, but 11 times he finished 7th. So, 7 times, finished 11th, that's what I should say. Well, and also what challenge he's got next year. Yeah, yeah.
In seventh, I had Lewis Hamilton, who I thought it wasn't a great year for him. Up against George, you know, really disappointing and qualifying by his own estimation. You know, nearly... I think it was 0.175 across qualifying on average against George, which was the biggest deficit he's had. But the highs were very high. There were obviously Abu Dhabi at the right at the end, but Silverstone.
And there were races kind of like Spain and Hungary, which have kind of gone under the radar, but he drove outstandingly well. So, yeah, seventh for Lewis. In sixth, I've got Oscar Piastri, because I had, you know, again a year. Big highs, great wins, great drives, but there were still weekends like Austin, Singapore, Zandvoort, Abu Dhabi, where he was behind Lando. He was two, three tenths behind.
Yeah, the car was very, very strong and Oscar delivered very well. But a good sophomore season. Yes? Well, I want to hear who's your fifth. George Russell? If your fifth is George, then I would swap those two. Would you? I would. You know what? I had swapped them because I'd initially made... I was going to say, I've got the old one here. Because I made the list before...
the final triple header. Okay. But I thought George's performances in Vegas and Qatar were very, very strong. Kind of emerging as Lewis leaves. He's staking a claim now, isn't he? Yeah, and I thought, you know, on that weekend, always come back to drive... drivers seizing opportunities when I do these lists. And I think that's why I saw Fernando and Gasly, I was mentioning before. And on the weekend, where the only weekend this entire season, where Mercedes had the best car.
The best opportunity. Lewis made the mistakes in qualifying. George was the one who seized the opportunity to win. In fourth, I had Carlos Sainz. I thought an outstanding year for what must have been mentally very tough, knowing that you're sacked and... He's got to spend the first six months finding a new job. Yep, that's fair. A lot of distraction. Yeah. But two wins for the first time in a year. In third, I had Lando Norris in third. Really? Because...
And I'll just sort of club it with I had Charles Leclerc in second because I thought in terms of consistency, Ferrari weren't as consistently competitive as McLaren. But Charles, I thought, did an outstanding job this year. It really was a brilliant season. And he made changes as well. You know, one of those weaknesses, Ted, you know, you listen to a lot of the radio as much as I did.
was indecision on strategy and sort of they'd be dithering wouldn't they him and xavi marcos they made the decision to change to brian botsey he got jock clear in his corner still they worked well um and i thought this was a Yeah, there's a strong argument to say 2022 was Leclerc's, you know, best season because he finished second. But he made more mistakes. And I actually thought this was his best season in Formula One. Whereas for Lando...
He left points on the table, right? You know, I think Spain, Belgium, Hungary, Italy, Austin, Brazil. There's six races where he lost out at the start or the opening lap. Even Nico on the podcast the other day reminded me of the couple of mistakes in Singapore. Singapore. Where, you know, on a different day, he goes into the wall. Yeah. So that was my justification for...
Leclerc versus Lando. Yeah. And no surprise. Yeah. At the top because, yeah, the moments of road rage, as I mentioned before, and really only Baku. you would say he had a subpar weekend where he didn't fulfill the potential of the car. For the rest of the time, he did. Lesson learned. Don't talk about outperforming the car.
It's not possible. It's physically, grammatically not possible. Very good. I like Karin's top ten drivers. That's very considered and reasoned. Very good. I think that's what concludes. our season review. We've done a top 10 drivers. We are also going to do a top 10 team principles episode as well, which is going to follow next week. So stay tuned for that. Well, Ted, you've also got one as well. So we're going to debate those.
between us, aren't we? That's next week. That's next week. But in the meantime, happy Christmas. But in the meantime, happy Christmas, yes. One bit of housekeeping as well. We've been nominated for a podcast award. If you have loved listening to the podcast this year and would like to cast your vote, please visit sportspodcastgroup.com where you'll see this year's shortlist. We are in the motorsport category.
Ted, the pod book as well, is in there. No. What? You're competing against each other. It's the whole podcast. Well, it's not. It's ridiculous. My 10-minute pull together. Well, it's all part of the Sky Sports Network podcast. It's been nominated. Yes. It hasn't. Yes. Has it? Yes. Where's my phone? It's all part of the same podcast feed, you see. Oh, I see. Yes, so we are nominated. Not separate podcasts. Don't act so surprised. Sky Sports F1 podcast. Yes.
Good. Oh, well, vote for us then, everybody. So please, yeah, sportspodcastgroup.com. If you'd like to cast your vote, we'd really, really appreciate that. Until then, until the top 10 next week, have a Merry Christmas and a very Happy New Year. Goodbye. Hi, Neil Reynolds here, host of the Inside the Huddle podcast from Sky Sports. We've reached the business end of the NFL season with just a few weeks left for teams to book their places in the playoffs. But who will be battling out?
for a place in Super Bowl 59 in New Orleans. Every Monday and Thursday, I'm joined by Jeff Reinbold and Phoebe Schechter to discuss all the latest action and news from across the NFL. If that's something you fancy checking out, just search Inside the Huddle wherever you get your podcasts and give us a follow. See you soon.