Ted's Austrian Podbook | Stormy media days, Max's Red Bull future and could Checo return to F1?

Hello, everybody, and welcome back to the F1 show, back to the Sky Sports F1 podcast feed and to Ted's pod book, which returns after a week away as the F1 World Championship for 2025 moves to within a race of its midway point. course that midway point will be next week at silverstone the british grand prix but we've got one more race to go before that and that is the austrian grand prix here in the lovely styrian hills uh and um yeah i'm joined by craig slater

Inside our hotel, which also doubles up, Craig, as the Ulrich von Lichtenstein Musikschule School of Music. A name which, if it didn't exist in reality, you'd have to make up. Yes, Ulrich von Lichtenstein. Well, of Lichtenstein, which is a small country not too far away. A brass eye for those older listeners would have created this as a fictional German. Exactly. But... It has been, I think it's been a bit of a stormy day today in Formula One.

First of all, I'll do the meteorological sense because we got here and it was 31, 32 degrees. The weather app said it felt like 39. I don't know how they can work that out, maybe because it was just quite humid and close. But it was a hot day. And then the...

Paddock was alive because everybody got an alert on their iPhones, if you're an Apple customer. I don't know whether it affected Android users as well. There was a weather alert put out by... presumably the austrian local government through the local telecoms department everyone's a siren alert i think they call it everyone went i was interviewing alex alban at the time he pulled out his phone and said are you getting this alert as well i said yes and it said warning thunderstorms coming and

My goodness, they did, didn't they? Hailstones the size of golf balls. I mean, I... I haven't experienced anything like that here. People say it does happen in the mountains. I suppose it's something to do with the way the air circulates and so on. But yeah, I was with Anthony Davidson and the cameraman and all three phones went off simultaneously, which...

It certainly was a good and effective alert. You were on air at the time? I was at the time, but we didn't make any reference to it because, I mean, it... I thought it was a bit bewildering. It was in advance of the event, though, which was pretty effective, really. That's not only sports news. That's sports news that's about to... That's news.

in the context of sport that's about to happen. Absolutely. Yes, you're right. And just as well, it didn't happen on a track day, I suppose, is what we would have to say, because that would have been quite a danger possibly to the big crowds. And there were a few thousand people.

like the track anyway today but it would have been uh it would have compromised the whole event if i didn't see any lightning i don't know if you saw that no but the fact the hailstones were pretty heavy and as you say between sort of ping pong ball size and sorry table tennis size and

golf ball size. Large, large marbles. They were pretty big. It could have damaged, it would have damaged some body work, especially if the cars were moving at speed, which they wouldn't be. But, you know, if you have a look at some aircraft who've been through a hailstorm. it can really do in the nose and really damage the skin. That's aluminium most of the time. So I can absolutely see that it would have been just as well it wasn't in during the track. No, it's wonderfully calm.

It's the calm after the storm now, isn't it? What a beautiful evening it is. It is. Shards of sunlight coming through the clouds and a beautiful... Austrian church with its dreaming spires in front of us as we collect our thoughts after this, as you say, stormy media day. Stormy in other ways too, potentially.

Yes, which was the only sort of real stormy one was in the official FIA press conference. You can watch it for yourself on catch up or if you didn't see it live where Max Verstappen was selected because it's Red Bull's home race and he has a very good record. around here and it started to go wrong from the beginning when Tom Clarkson the mediator said Max you're on the cusp of winning your

You've won four times. You've won four times at the Austrian Grand Prix. Are you looking forward to winning the fifth? One was a so. Max said, rather than just... He said, is it four? Do you mean five? Because one of them, I think, was the Styrian Grand Prix, wasn't it? In Covid year, I guess. So he's won five times here previously.

So immediately, Max wanted to put Tom Clarkson right. And Tom was like, didn't want to kind of engage and say, yes, I was talking about the Austrian Grand Prix, didn't count the Styrian Grand Prix, but yes, do you want me to rephrase the question? So it started with, well... disagree with the premise of your question, Mr. Clarkson. Somebody then asked about the penalty points and he said, is this a trap?

No, that was after right already. Okay, so first of all, it was after me last race in Canada. It was, guess who's... turn it is to be put away by Max Verstappen after naming the man with the name that I shouldn't name at Red Bull who doesn't have a name and who shall not be named it was your turn to be put away by Max Verstappen I knew he would probably

Not wish to speak about the Red Bull appeal and the alleged unsportsmanlike behaviour by George Russell, which Red Bull contended had happened. I felt I had to ask the question anyway. sure enough max said all that needed to be said about canada had already been said which was kind of sphinx like or delphic in its response

Did he mean that he stood by Red Bull's contentions or did he stand by what he'd said in the immediate aftermath, which was along the lines that he didn't think Russell had done anything particularly wrong? I suppose both could be true. So, I mean, I wasn't trying to trap him into just going against his team who'd submitted a trenchant and relatively pithy... document alleging that russell had tried to coerce max into into maybe getting a penalty which would have seen him suspended for a race

He clearly doesn't want to get involved in unpacking these kind of controversies. I suppose it sticks with his position that... what goes between drivers should stay between drivers and maybe stay in the stewards room as well. Nevertheless, Toto Wolff had complained about this being a frivolous and petty protest. So I felt you had to ask the driver at the centre of it, was it? All I was trying to ask him, was it a reasonable protest?

or not and and actually one or two people i think within the governing body maybe did look at the weekend in totality and wonder well if not whether George Russell was being unsportsmanlike or not was he trying to leverage Max's situation just a little bit given the comments he made on the Saturday press conference about having more points to play with than Max had so did all of that when you

add it together and what happened behind the safety car maybe amount to a little bit of a bit of gamesmanship or the dark arts by Russell. I mean the fact is that Because all of this only came out, the protest only came out later after we'd gone off air and certainly wasn't decided. The protest was only decided once Max's jet was more or less over the North Atlantic. He left without knowing whether he would have won.

won the grand prix and george russell had been disqualified or given a five second penalty or whatever um and whether the protest the red bull protest was uh was was had been successful or not so we hadn't heard from him uh since then and the live subject whether they want to discuss it or not and they didn't that max is still on the cusp of a ban if there is a penalty point someone i think it was a german journalist asked him about it he said is this a trap

I've said, you're going to go on this again? And then Tom Clarkson, who was the last one to get his ire about asking it after qualifying, I think it was, sort of looked at Max and was like, well, you go for it, son, you know, if you want to. I mean, I've got to look.

I am of the, well, it's just a personal opinion and maybe this isn't, well, this is the one forum we can express that. I think the double penalty, the penalty within the race plus the license points, and actually Peter Gasly made that point today saying we're elite drivers, I'm not so sure.

sure about the whole penalty point system why not just have a stiff sanction in the race itself to match the crime in the race and do away with this this accumulating potentially enough points to get you a ban um during the

over a whole year. I mean, when Grosjean got his ban, it was for one very dangerous manoeuvre which could have had dire consequences for Fernando Alonso, what was it, 2013? Spa. Yeah, Spa. And then... I think Magnusson's was in a tight enough... set of races that that was kind of merit I think he almost felt he was going to get that the way they were manipulating races by having him deliberately block so I you know this has rather caught

F1 unawares, I feel slightly, this Verstappen situation. I don't want to see him missing a race. I don't think he necessarily deserves to either. I don't think he does. And any event would be poorer for him not being there. Yeah, well, I think it's not going to happen. I wonder if he's uncomfortable about it. I wonder if that's slightly behind some of the prickly responses. It would be the sort of thing that would be raised about him whenever people talk about Max.

which happened about you know but he had this edge and remember when he got a race ban i i that would be unfortunate if that was maybe there's just no more to say really about it obviously he's going to try not to not to get a ban and um i think certainly from red bull's protest

As I said, I think at the time, I think the best course of defence and the fact that the stewards might have said, well, why were you so close to George and for the moment get your nose ahead, even though you didn't actually overtake him. The best form of defence was attack and going on the attack.

and trying to get Russell a penalty. But that didn't happen. A couple of other news lines from Red Bull before we move on to McLaren and Ferrari. Sebastian Vettel. Max said Seb was always a good friend of the team and he would be welcome coming back into Formula One as a kind of replacement. There's always a place for Seb in Red Bull. as maybe a replacement if and when Helmut Marko decides to hang up his advisor's hat. He also said, I can't wait to see Checo Perez in the paddock again.

because I need to give him that helmet, the crash helmet that we were going to do, a helmet swap. But yeah, putting a little bit of fuel on the rumours that Checo is near the top of the list for the Cadillac drive next year. Yes, I mean, I've been at Cadillac actually in the last couple of days and you see an interview with Graham Loudon in our coverage over the course of the weekend.

And he'll talk about that Valtteri Bottas video, which Bottas posted, which drew many people to conclude that he has already agreed a deal with Cadillac. Let's see Loudoun's response to that when it comes. Could they go for the sort of double veteran lineup of Perez and Bottas? Maybe now. Not beyond the realms. I think that's a distinct possibility. Especially when Perez's stock only continues to rise in...

temporary retirement given that Yuki Tsunoda is having a continues to have a complete nightmare hasn't scored now in the last three races and his confidence is completely on the floor and I said to him look he mentioned Imola the crash in Imola again to a previous interviewee interviewer and I said look you know I thought you I thought you racing drivers have to let these things go or is it that you know the team can't need to remind you about Imola because you suffered

from subsequent subsequent races not having the upgrades on your car not having the good bits on your car because you damaged them in Imola and he said no I just need to get a car that's more predictable because this car I don't know what's going to do from lap to lap really and he just has no confidence in it

To be fair to Max Verstappen, he was the first person to make the point that Perez's form in the second Red Bull was a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself. And that's now, I think... what everyone accepts, that it's this difficult car which only Max really has the sensitivities to handle and the incumbents that have followed Perez just haven't been capable.

Yeah, I mean, very interesting just on the Perez subject. He was offered a question by Ian Parks, our colleague, who offered Max the opportunity to comment on Perez. observing that Max is someone that holds, in a sense, I'm paraphrasing his words, a grudge or something he's not happy about inside, and then lets it all out on track.

And in contrast to all the other difficult questions, Max took that with a big smile and said, no, not at all, no problem. That's not what Checo meant. And he is a perfect, you know, as though he was, he sort of indulged Checo having. that potential opinion, which wasn't a particularly flattering one for backs, but it just shows you.

Some things annoy Max and some things that you might expect would annoy him don't at all. He has a large S in other areas, which is interesting. And he also pointed that he did not want to comment about Perez's claim that since... Adrian Newey has gone. Red Bull have... That's been the trigger of all Red Bull's issues. People tell me that they... I'm not saying Max and Adrian Newey had a kind of problem relationship at Red Bull, but I'm not sure that they were the closest of...

companions in arms, if you like. Really? That's the first time I've heard that? No, that's been expressed to me by... No, no, I mean...

I'm not saying... It's interesting, though, when you weigh up all of this and you're talking about where Max might go next, which I think we might be talking about, is it... conceivable that this idea that everyone thinks is very straightforward. Max will go to Aston Martin where new he is. Maybe the personal dynamics don't push that way. Okay.

interesting. I hadn't thought of it like that. I always thought that Adrian has the highest regard for the person who can get the most out of his cars. And I can't think of any other reason why he wouldn't really... in Max's corner he's developed he's defended him professionally I think they do hold each other in high regard but what I'm seeing is I'm it's been expressed to me by one or two people that they didn't maybe click as personalities maybe right before

Before we move on to the where does Max Verstappen go next? And I think we probably will just turn this into a Red Bull special because we've already done 16 minutes. We haven't got time to do many other, although I'll touch on Landon Norris. There was a brilliant moment. Max actually had his... had his quip ready for when somebody asked Pierre Gasly in the press conference they said Pierre Brad Pitt has singled you out as the potential, as the only driver who could really turn his art to the...

to a hollywood star um you know what kind of things would you be interested and straight away max max cuts in says yeah romantic comedies He's not seen the film yet, and nor has he seen the F1 movie yet. No, he made proper reference to something he knows it's not on Apple Plus TV yet.

Max knows it's in cinemas first. And he was asked, have you seen the film? He said, no, I went on Apple TV. Maybe he's a Severance fan or he's been watching the studio like I have. I went on Apple Plus the other day and it's not on there yet. It was like, you know, you know, he took me down today, but I do have to say the guy is box office. And I, you know, his joke about his joke about Pierre Gasly, who, you know, loves life.

shall we say, being a star of a romantic comedy. And the put-down, I think, that is inherent in there was just... It was dripping with... Sarcasm underplays it. It was very well delivered. It was very well delivered. Beautifully timed. It still makes me laugh now. Yeah, Pierre, romantic comedies. Sorry. Right. The other thing he said, can't remember who asked. It was Christian Nimervoll who said...

Sorry, Max, can you just confirm in this sort of perennial question or is it an annual question? Can you just confirm that you are going to be at Red Bull next year as your contract? says and yet again for the 492nd time of asking he would not say yes i will so he hid behind his consternation at the question being asked again or at least began his response that way. Now, and then how it developed from there, he sort of looked at the room to see, is that enough?

That was a really interesting moment today. So he basically, and to explain what I mean, he... He tried to cast that question as an equally ridiculous one to one or two of the others that he batted away earlier in the day. I thought for a moment he was going to mention the contract that he has, which runs to the end of 2028, but he didn't. To be fair to Max, he was saying...

I answered this half a dozen times. I've written it down. He said, I've had that question. I don't think we need to talk about that. It's not really in my mind. I'm just trying to push the performance. Then we concentrate on next year. But he did have the opportunity. to say, yes, of course, I'll be a Red Bull next year. And once again, he decided not to take it. I mean, yes. On reflection, I think he...

Could have said that, but I think he thought we would all accept the notion that this was an irritating question and that Max... was entitled to make that point in that way. Which is fair enough. But at the same time, you have an interview that we've had with George Russell. This is really interesting. This is for the first time someone at Mercedes, George Russell, acknowledging that talks are underway between Verstappen.

and Mercedes hierarchy. Exploratory talks, you've got the exact quote there, Ted, but it was, Russell volunteered this information. I think it's come up a few times, hasn't it, in the last week about... Perhaps the reason why he hasn't got the deal over the line yet to extend to State Mercedes is because theoretically Max is still on the market and it's holding it up.

Mercedes are waiting for Max to see what's happening. And we've all asked Toto Wolff the same question I did at the New York launch of the film after Canada. And Toto gave the same answer. Oh, why are you spoiling this nice evening?

Yes, to quote Wallace and Gromit, Toto will prevaricate around the bush about this and not really give an answer. But George said, look, you have to understand that Mercedes is in Formula One for the best of everything. The best pit crew, the best engineers, the best mechanics and the best drivers. So they have to, it's Toto's job to assess every driver that's on the market. And it's only normal that conversations with the like of Verstappen are ongoing.

Why do I think for George to be as upbeat about as he is? And you detected a reluctance from Russell to... to be critical of Red Bull protesting him for his alleged unsportsmanlike behaviour. I did. I mean, just picking up on the Red Bull protest, which, as I say, we didn't talk about at the time because it hadn't been lodged and we've all been...

we were all on planes and going away from Canada. But I said, George, you know, when we finally saw the details of the protest, which included this clause about you acting in an unsportsman way, unsportsmanlike intent, what did you think of that? You know, knowing that George rather prides himself on at least being, you know, sportsmanlike, and as does Lando, and I guess as does Max and everybody else that does. And George said, well, it was a little bit strong.

But I didn't lose any sleep over it, which is easier than I thought he was going to go on Christian Horner, Paul Monaghan and whoever it was else who put the protest in. So you've got Max Verstappen refusing to... be critical of Mercedes' critical words about Red Bull and you've got George Russell refusing to be critical about Red Bull's critical words about him so which which if you were well

If you were inclined, you'd think, are both keeping their options open at both these teams? Does neither driver wish to antagonise? this rival team which might be a destination for them sooner rather than later Definitely. That's what I thought today. Yeah, I think you were right. You raised that, particularly with Russell. But it fits with the way Verstappen dealt with my question as well. It does. It does. And that is all at the heart of it. So that's why it's been a stormy day today.

There's been lots going on. A lot of it to do with Red Bull because it's Red Bull's home race. We're at the Red Bull ring. It's the Austrian Grand Prix. And that's why we've done a kind of Red Bull special. I will just give you the quick line on McLaren because they're leading the championship.

Oscar Piastri saying we spoke about what happened when we got back. It's all good. No change to the papaya rules. We're still free to race. Lando said, look, I don't have the car that I'm massively comfortable with, but that's my job to get used to it. The championship is... Definitely still not over.

Um, he wouldn't really address the fact that he can't, well, the point I put to him that he can't really afford any more did not finishes, but he said, look, you know, obviously I've made my mistake and I need to, uh, uh, move on from it. And, uh, we're going to be working hard. Uh, we've got a tough job, but there's no reason to.

expect that we can't win and um yeah it's not he said we've got difficult moments in a year that we have the best car i would like things to be a bit easier but that's life uh said lando norris so yeah they go again

They weren't, yeah, it's so, I think it's complicated for McLaren this just finally. The end in Canada, and I was speaking to Bernie Collins about this. McLaren pit, Piastri first, reducing his... lengthening his final stint partly in order to protect Lando Norris from Charles Leclerc and the result is Norris has two laps younger tyres because that's the sequels they have to pit them if they pitted Norris first they might have

he might have undercut Piastri which they clearly can't do but then you've got Norris able to attack Piastri on slightly younger tyres it's not an easy balancing act this it's complicated but Yeah, the big faults are in Lander's way. I didn't really ask the question. You felt that perhaps Andrea Stella was warning Piastri.

He maybe thought Piastri's defence was interesting. A little bit stout, unnecessarily stout. That was the impression I got from Andrea Stella after the race when I felt that... He hinted that they will have a discussion about it and whether Piastri had to defend quite so hard and race each other quite so hard, given that they are teammates. Piastri did nothing wrong.

But I just wonder whether Stella would have had a little line for Piastri in there saying, look, if this does happen again, you know, you could maybe help. He was nodding away, Piastri, about the pit stop sequence, which I think he thinks... OK, you think that's more about him not giving... But then, of course, why should he? It's just very difficult if they're on slightly offset strategies, and you wonder if they'll stop doing that at McLaren.

Because you end up with one driver with a tyre advantage over another due to unforeseen circumstances. And how fair is that? It's a tricky one to manage. It is. OK, but you can find out exactly what happens when you join us, hopefully, for the Austrian Grand Prix this weekend. practice one starts at midday.

tomorrow with a session starting at 12 30 this is uk time and then for sunday if you want to join us qualifying's around 1 p.m i think the session starts at 2 and then it's a 12 30 on air for a 2 p.m as the usual European time. Right, they're all coming out at the Ulrich von Liechtenstein Music School, but well, are we going to hear...

The Dutch National Anthem followed by the Austrian National Anthem for Red Bull. Or are we going to have the Australian National Anthem? Or God Save the King for Lando Norris or Oscar Piastri for McLaren? Who knows? Ich nicht in Lichten. Whatever it is. Your street anthem. I don't know. Exactly. The German finance minister. Okay, Craig, thank you very much. Thank you for your company. Look forward to seeing you on the other side of the telly. throughout the weekend. Bye bye everyone.

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