Career Path to a Biotech CEO - Niren Shah : 3

00:00:17:22 - 00:00:18:19 Hey everybody, welcome to 00:00:18:19 - 00:00:21:11 MedTech Speed to Data Episode 19 00:00:21:11 - 00:00:24:03 with Longeviti CEO Jesse Christopher. 00:00:24:03 - 00:00:26:02 Jesse, welcome to the show. 00:00:26:02 - 00:00:27:03 Thank you Andy for having me. 00:00:27:03 - 00:00:28:03 It's a pleasure to be here. 00:00:28:03 - 00:00:29:00 Yeah, it's always great 00:00:29:00 - 00:00:31:02 to have a Maryland medtech company 00:00:31:12 - 00:00:32:03 come on. 00:00:32:03 - 00:00:34:00 So we're going to jump right into it. 00:00:34:00 - 00:00:37:15 We don't do these long intros, but I thought 00:00:38:01 - 00:00:40:05 the mission of Longeviti 00:00:40:05 - 00:00:42:11 was worth repeating here Jesse. 00:00:42:11 - 00:00:44:04 And maybe I'll describe it 00:00:44:04 - 00:00:45:22 and then you can really tell us 00:00:45:22 - 00:00:46:20 what's going on. 00:00:46:20 - 00:00:48:15 Behind the scenes there, so Longeviti’s 00:00:48:15 - 00:00:49:12 Behind the scenes there, so Longeviti’s 00:00:49:12 - 00:00:50:21 mission is to develop 00:00:50:21 - 00:00:54:12 innovative solutions for complex brain surgery. 00:00:55:02 - 00:00:57:04 So where did that come from? 00:00:57:06 - 00:00:58:10 Right it's a mouthful, 00:00:58:10 - 00:01:00:06 but there's a lot of reasons 00:01:00:06 - 00:01:02:13 why people will undergo neurosurgery. 00:01:02:13 - 00:01:04:11 And of course, as we see a market going 00:01:04:11 - 00:01:05:07 less invasive, 00:01:05:07 - 00:01:06:10 there are more and more reasons 00:01:06:10 - 00:01:08:19 still to go in for neurosurgery. 00:01:09:06 - 00:01:11:17 My background is running the East Coast 00:01:11:17 - 00:01:13:10 for a Fortune 300 company 00:01:13:10 - 00:01:15:16 and one of the biggest neuro device companies. 00:01:15:16 - 00:01:17:14 And it's a really interesting market 00:01:17:14 - 00:01:19:10 because you are very privileged 00:01:19:10 - 00:01:21:03 to get into the operating rooms. 00:01:21:03 - 00:01:22:09 And at some point, you know, 00:01:22:09 - 00:01:24:13 I realized I'd seen about a thousand neurosurgeries 00:01:25:06 - 00:01:27:03 and every hospital. 00:01:27:03 - 00:01:29:22 A lot of neurosurgeons are trained differently 00:01:29:22 - 00:01:31:17 and have their own protocols and techniques. 00:01:31:17 - 00:01:33:12 And then you start realizing, okay, 00:01:33:12 - 00:01:36:00 the companies are leaning on them for innovation. 00:01:36:09 - 00:01:37:13 How does innovation come? 00:01:37:13 - 00:01:38:12 And I really gravitated 00:01:38:12 - 00:01:39:20 towards the path of innovation 00:01:39:20 - 00:01:42:01 within my last company. 00:01:42:01 - 00:01:44:20 But it was after really uncovering how slow 00:01:44:20 - 00:01:46:20 the pace of innovation occurs in neurosurgery 00:01:46:20 - 00:01:47:22 that got me out of bed. 00:01:47:22 - 00:01:50:09 I felt compelled to quit my job 00:01:50:09 - 00:01:51:07 that I still loved. 00:01:51:07 - 00:01:52:21 It was a great company 00:01:52:21 - 00:01:54:08 to start Longeviti Neuro Solutions 00:01:54:08 - 00:01:56:02 and it was a statistic on a TED Talk 00:01:56:02 - 00:01:57:19 that I heard one in five of us 00:01:57:19 - 00:01:59:20 in which have verified, one in five of us 00:01:59:20 - 00:02:02:00 over 65 will have a neurological disorder. 00:02:02:00 - 00:02:03:14 And I've got three daughters and a wife. 00:02:03:14 - 00:02:04:19 So you do the math. 00:02:04:19 - 00:02:05:22 It would be a Greek tragedy 00:02:05:22 - 00:02:07:04 if I was rich off of stock 00:02:07:04 - 00:02:08:02 from my last company 00:02:08:02 - 00:02:09:15 but couldn't solve some of the issues 00:02:09:15 - 00:02:11:14 that were low hanging fruit. 00:02:11:14 - 00:02:12:21 So we started Longeviti around 00:02:12:21 - 00:02:15:11 five years ago now, just over five years ago. 00:02:15:11 - 00:02:18:05 And, you know, very Americana. 00:02:18:05 - 00:02:21:04 I quit my job, cold turkey, but on great terms, 00:02:21:16 - 00:02:22:20 and went into my garage 00:02:22:20 - 00:02:24:18 and started mixing plastics, 00:02:24:18 - 00:02:26:12 taking my kids toys apart 00:02:26:12 - 00:02:27:20 and really completing circuits 00:02:27:20 - 00:02:29:17 for this next gen of computer 00:02:29:17 - 00:02:30:19 interface and implants 00:02:30:19 - 00:02:32:00 that I thought that we needed. 00:02:32:00 - 00:02:33:07 And so again, 00:02:33:07 - 00:02:34:13 I'm sure we'll get into a lot of that, 00:02:34:13 - 00:02:35:15 but that's the evolution 00:02:35:15 - 00:02:36:11 over the last five years 00:02:36:11 - 00:02:38:09 of what kind of compelled me to take a risk 00:02:38:09 - 00:02:39:21 and where we are today. 00:02:39:21 - 00:02:41:02 Now, fortunately, 00:02:41:02 - 00:02:42:16 with thousands of patients that have benefited. 00:02:42:16 - 00:02:45:03 Yeah, no, I mean, that's a lot to unpack there. 00:02:45:03 - 00:02:45:23 We'll do our best here. 00:02:45:23 - 00:02:46:17 But Jesse, 00:02:46:17 - 00:02:49:23 I mean, that's a great story, just to be bold, to 00:02:49:23 - 00:02:51:21 just kind of stop what you were doing 00:02:51:21 - 00:02:52:23 and the sales 00:02:52:23 - 00:02:53:23 relationship management 00:02:53:23 - 00:02:54:17 you were working on 00:02:54:17 - 00:02:57:00 and just going all in your garage. 00:02:57:00 - 00:02:59:20 So, you know, a lot of our audience is, 00:02:59:20 - 00:03:02:12 either a startup medical device company or, 00:03:03:02 - 00:03:04:08 a VP of R&D 00:03:04:08 - 00:03:07:09 who's got that entrepreneurial sort of taste, 00:03:07:09 - 00:03:09:10 but not necessarily the gusto 00:03:09:19 - 00:03:10:16 to go and do their own thing. 00:03:10:16 - 00:03:11:20 So they're doing more of the 00:03:11:20 - 00:03:13:18 entrepreneurial thing. 00:03:13:18 - 00:03:17:08 So you quit your job, like describe 00:03:17:08 - 00:03:18:14 like your first, 00:03:18:14 - 00:03:19:19 I don't know, month 00:03:19:19 - 00:03:22:08 or two of of being out on your own. 00:03:22:08 - 00:03:23:20 What were you focused on? 00:03:23:20 - 00:03:26:15 Well, you imagine every emotion every day, right. 00:03:26:15 - 00:03:29:01 You know, did we make the right decision? 00:03:29:01 - 00:03:30:02 Was it too much 00:03:30:02 - 00:03:32:02 or are we really going to change the world? 00:03:32:02 - 00:03:33:03 There's a great quote by, 00:03:33:03 - 00:03:34:00 I think Margaret Mead 00:03:34:00 - 00:03:34:14 that, you know, so 00:03:34:14 - 00:03:36:07 few people have always changed the world. 00:03:36:07 - 00:03:38:16 So there's things that are motivating every day, 00:03:38:16 - 00:03:40:15 but also you really up against steep odds. 00:03:40:15 - 00:03:42:19 And so it takes fortitude 00:03:42:19 - 00:03:45:03 and it really takes a lot of people around you. 00:03:45:03 - 00:03:47:12 And I was really fortunate to have built 00:03:47:12 - 00:03:49:10 an immense amount of trust over my career. 00:03:49:10 - 00:03:50:22 And we have a saying at Longeviti 00:03:50:22 - 00:03:53:10 trust is production over time, there's no shortcuts. 00:03:53:10 - 00:03:55:06 I could jump in front of a bullet 00:03:55:06 - 00:03:56:12 in front of you and take a bullet, 00:03:56:12 - 00:03:57:08 and that's a lot of production 00:03:57:08 - 00:03:58:11 in a very short amount of time 00:03:58:11 - 00:04:00:10 or can give you exact change at a toll booth 00:04:00:10 - 00:04:03:17 over 20 years and still develop incrementally trust. 00:04:03:17 - 00:04:06:02 And it was interesting to see the ability 00:04:06:02 - 00:04:09:11 of translating and trust into the team 00:04:09:11 - 00:04:10:01 that we needed. 00:04:10:01 - 00:04:12:05 So a lot of people came from where I left 00:04:12:18 - 00:04:15:16 and other institutions to help build Longeviti 00:04:15:16 - 00:04:16:16 into what it is today. 00:04:16:16 - 00:04:18:03 And I think that was the most remarkable thing. 00:04:18:03 - 00:04:20:02 So took some fortitude. 00:04:20:02 - 00:04:21:08 But you can't just jump into it. 00:04:21:08 - 00:04:22:04 There's no shortcuts. 00:04:22:04 - 00:04:23:00 You need to be humble 00:04:23:00 - 00:04:24:10 and you need to reach out to the people 00:04:24:10 - 00:04:25:09 that are smarter than you, 00:04:25:09 - 00:04:26:20 better than you, faster than you, 00:04:26:20 - 00:04:28:13 and try to convince them to work for nothing. 00:04:28:13 - 00:04:29:14 Yeah. Okay. 00:04:29:14 - 00:04:30:12 That's what I was waiting for. 00:04:30:12 - 00:04:32:10 Like, there's got to be a catch here. 00:04:33:21 - 00:04:34:13 Work for nothing. 00:04:34:13 - 00:04:35:11 The other 00:04:35:22 - 00:04:36:14 kind of background, 00:04:36:14 - 00:04:39:00 as I was preparing for this interview 00:04:39:00 - 00:04:40:05 and we met years ago 00:04:40:05 - 00:04:41:16 and what struck me then, 00:04:41:16 - 00:04:43:14 and it strikes me again here now is, 00:04:43:14 - 00:04:45:01 a lot of these startups. 00:04:45:16 - 00:04:48:11 They'll say we need to go do the I-Corps or, 00:04:48:11 - 00:04:50:17 you know, understand our market. 00:04:50:17 - 00:04:53:08 But here you are after probably having dinners 00:04:53:08 - 00:04:54:19 and buying cocktails 00:04:54:19 - 00:04:56:23 for the market for years. 00:04:56:23 - 00:04:58:12 So you're starting out 00:04:58:12 - 00:05:00:10 well ahead of most startup companies 00:05:00:10 - 00:05:01:08 that maybe are trying to get 00:05:01:08 - 00:05:03:05 a better understanding of what the market needs. 00:05:03:05 - 00:05:04:06 Yeah, and it's interesting. 00:05:04:06 - 00:05:05:14 So one know your market. 00:05:05:14 - 00:05:07:00 I mean, I've been in the industry 00:05:07:00 - 00:05:08:22 this particular market for 20 years 00:05:08:22 - 00:05:12:04 and you know, it's a daunting one to enter. 00:05:12:04 - 00:05:12:23 That's probably why 00:05:12:23 - 00:05:14:14 there isn't much neuro innovation occurring 00:05:14:14 - 00:05:15:18 because it's very siloed. 00:05:15:18 - 00:05:17:12 Just statistically, think about it. 00:05:17:12 - 00:05:19:13 We've got 330 million Americans 00:05:20:05 - 00:05:21:08 and we're getting older 00:05:21:08 - 00:05:22:21 and we're able to keep our bodies alive. 00:05:22:21 - 00:05:24:08 But there's the neurological disorders 00:05:24:08 - 00:05:26:04 that are costing us more and more in health care. 00:05:26:04 - 00:05:29:13 So 330 million Americans have about 300,000. 00:05:29:13 - 00:05:31:02 neurosurgeries is a year. 00:05:31:02 - 00:05:32:22 The cost of neurosurgery to America 00:05:32:22 - 00:05:36:10 every year is around $750 billion. 00:05:36:20 - 00:05:38:05 It's an insane amount of money. 00:05:38:05 - 00:05:39:17 And we're talking about all the wrapped up 00:05:39:17 - 00:05:41:14 health care, not just neurosurgery, 00:05:41:14 - 00:05:43:02 but when you start to unpack the reasons 00:05:43:02 - 00:05:44:06 why you really see 00:05:44:06 - 00:05:45:11 an immense amount of opportunity. 00:05:45:11 - 00:05:46:08 And again, 00:05:46:08 - 00:05:48:03 you know, it's not for the faint of heart. 00:05:48:03 - 00:05:51:06 We're a small company, you know, in waters 00:05:51:06 - 00:05:52:21 with huge mega companies, 00:05:52:21 - 00:05:55:01 very public, very global and, 00:05:55:01 - 00:05:56:00 you know, seemingly 00:05:56:00 - 00:05:57:02 still able to make a difference 00:05:57:02 - 00:05:58:20 because we're staying in our lane. 00:05:58:20 - 00:06:01:10 So you're five years in now. 00:06:01:10 - 00:06:03:23 Are you are you getting revenue from the product? 00:06:03:23 - 00:06:05:14 I know there's products on your website. 00:06:05:14 - 00:06:06:21 Oh, yeah. 00:06:06:21 - 00:06:09:19 So describe the handful of products 00:06:09:19 - 00:06:11:07 that you have on the market now. 00:06:11:07 - 00:06:13:08 We’ve released a few products 00:06:13:08 - 00:06:16:09 over the last few years, the InvisiShunt platform, 00:06:16:09 - 00:06:17:08 which helps 00:06:17:08 - 00:06:20:06 house various technologies within the cranium. 00:06:20:06 - 00:06:22:16 And so InvisiShunt helps with hydrocephalus. 00:06:22:16 - 00:06:24:14 So think of pressure in the brain. 00:06:24:14 - 00:06:25:16 Your brain's floating around 00:06:25:16 - 00:06:26:17 in liquid all the time. 00:06:26:17 - 00:06:28:00 And so when you have hydrocephalus, 00:06:28:00 - 00:06:28:20 you have too much liquid, 00:06:28:20 - 00:06:29:23 you need to get rid of it. 00:06:29:23 - 00:06:32:00 So they put a drain in and our device 00:06:32:00 - 00:06:34:08 allows that to be housed within the cranium. 00:06:34:18 - 00:06:36:03 The outcomes have been fantastic, 00:06:36:03 - 00:06:38:00 the patient feedback has been great 00:06:38:00 - 00:06:39:11 and we really pride ourselves 00:06:39:11 - 00:06:41:11 on leaning into conversations 00:06:41:11 - 00:06:43:00 with patient advocacy groups like 00:06:43:00 - 00:06:45:00 the Hydrocephalus Association and allowed them 00:06:45:00 - 00:06:47:03 to guide our innovation. 00:06:47:03 - 00:06:49:17 We feel like it would be borderline arrogant 00:06:49:17 - 00:06:52:10 to tell them what ideas are out there 00:06:52:10 - 00:06:54:13 that they should be adopting. 00:06:54:13 - 00:06:55:23 So we really listen to our physicians 00:06:55:23 - 00:06:57:03 and our patients, 00:06:57:03 - 00:06:57:19 but they're probably 00:06:57:19 - 00:07:00:05 the most exciting family of products 00:07:00:05 - 00:07:01:18 that have come out over the last year 00:07:01:18 - 00:07:04:00 and a half are the ClearFit implants. 00:07:04:00 - 00:07:05:18 And so ClearFits are quite literally 00:07:05:18 - 00:07:09:03 imagine your skull under your skin being replaced 00:07:09:03 - 00:07:10:19 when it undergoes surgery. 00:07:10:19 - 00:07:12:02 When you undergo brain surgery 00:07:12:02 - 00:07:13:23 with a clear window? 00:07:13:23 - 00:07:14:20 There are a lot of cases 00:07:14:20 - 00:07:16:06 where we have to reconstruct the skull 00:07:16:06 - 00:07:17:10 and there's a number of materials 00:07:17:10 - 00:07:18:16 that you can use that neurosurgeons 00:07:18:16 - 00:07:19:22 have been using for decades, 00:07:19:22 - 00:07:22:13 you know, from plastics to metals to titanium's. 00:07:22:23 - 00:07:24:23 And it's seeing this firsthand. 00:07:24:23 - 00:07:26:10 In my last career, 00:07:26:10 - 00:07:29:05 it seemed like a really expensive day 00:07:29:05 - 00:07:30:23 for the patient in terms of the real estate 00:07:30:23 - 00:07:31:18 that's exposed. 00:07:31:18 - 00:07:32:23 And if you're going to go in there, 00:07:32:23 - 00:07:33:19 why not leave them 00:07:33:19 - 00:07:35:10 with as much function as possible, 00:07:35:10 - 00:07:37:00 as much diagnostics as possible? 00:07:37:00 - 00:07:38:11 And it really led to, 00:07:38:11 - 00:07:40:02 you know, this concept of Longeviti. 00:07:40:02 - 00:07:43:01 So most, a lot of our implantable 00:07:43:01 - 00:07:44:20 functional products are within the ClearFit 00:07:44:20 - 00:07:46:08 platforms themselves. 00:07:46:08 - 00:07:47:09 So when I talk about ClearFit, 00:07:47:09 - 00:07:48:06 you've got two families, 00:07:48:06 - 00:07:49:17 you've got custom and family 00:07:49:17 - 00:07:51:22 that can do anything from just be an identical 00:07:51:22 - 00:07:52:15 skull shape 00:07:52:15 - 00:07:55:09 or house electrodes and various other components. 00:07:55:18 - 00:07:57:09 And then you've got ClearFit off the shelf 00:07:57:09 - 00:08:01:04 which frankly are put in very small sizes, 20 00:08:01:22 - 00:08:04:15 millimeters to 50 millimeters to allow 00:08:04:15 - 00:08:08:02 post-operative imaging of the brain. 00:08:08:02 - 00:08:09:14 And why that's profound. 00:08:09:14 - 00:08:10:15 And I'm going to get into in a second, 00:08:10:15 - 00:08:12:01 but imagine this, 00:08:12:01 - 00:08:13:12 neurosurgeons are the only discipline 00:08:13:12 - 00:08:14:11 that can't use ultrasound. 00:08:14:11 - 00:08:15:23 Every other discipline, cardiac 00:08:15:23 - 00:08:17:20 have been using ultrasound like their stethoscope 00:08:17:20 - 00:08:18:21 for now decades. 00:08:18:21 - 00:08:20:07 And just for our audience. 00:08:20:07 - 00:08:22:06 Jesse, why can't neurosurgeons 00:08:22:06 - 00:08:24:00 use ultrasound imaging? 00:08:24:00 - 00:08:25:12 Our brains are protected by the 00:08:25:12 - 00:08:28:07 attenuation abilities of our skull so we can't 00:08:29:04 - 00:08:32:11 have the ultrasound penetrate an adult skull. 00:08:32:11 - 00:08:33:04 Some infants, 00:08:33:04 - 00:08:35:06 you can certainly use it and certainly neonatal. 00:08:36:03 - 00:08:39:01 But for the adults, you're relegated CT and MRI, 00:08:39:01 - 00:08:40:10 which are both costly. 00:08:40:10 - 00:08:41:02 And for patients, 00:08:41:02 - 00:08:43:06 the experience is going to a strip mall, 00:08:43:06 - 00:08:45:06 or down to the radiology department, 00:08:45:06 - 00:08:46:23 whereas now that post operatively, 00:08:46:23 - 00:08:48:14 some of these ClearFit recipients 00:08:48:14 - 00:08:49:14 can use ultrasound. 00:08:49:14 - 00:08:51:07 It's going into my doctor's office 00:08:51:07 - 00:08:52:07 while I talk to my doctor, 00:08:52:07 - 00:08:54:10 while he or she is imaging my brain 00:08:54:10 - 00:08:56:14 and showing my brain to me and in motion. 00:08:57:02 - 00:08:58:13 So the things that are really exciting now 00:08:58:13 - 00:09:00:00 about ultrasound over the last year 00:09:00:00 - 00:09:01:00 that we've been digging into 00:09:01:00 - 00:09:02:09 is that unlike CTs, 00:09:02:09 - 00:09:04:21 you can see, active live brain and in motion 00:09:04:21 - 00:09:05:19 for the first time we can, 00:09:06:18 - 00:09:09:07 you know, chronically image a moving brain. 00:09:09:07 - 00:09:10:23 And so our our collaborators 00:09:10:23 - 00:09:13:04 across the country, and globe now, have taken this 00:09:13:04 - 00:09:15:11 and really are doing some amazing research. 00:09:15:11 - 00:09:17:14 And so I'm going to geek out for a second, too, 00:09:17:14 - 00:09:18:08 because, you know, 00:09:18:08 - 00:09:20:14 this isn't your grandmother's ultrasound, right? 00:09:20:14 - 00:09:22:15 We think of ultrasound as images of babies 00:09:22:15 - 00:09:24:16 that we're trying to make out inside of the womb 00:09:24:16 - 00:09:26:20 that was my experience as a father several times. 00:09:27:03 - 00:09:28:10 It wasn't until recently 00:09:28:10 - 00:09:30:20 that I understood how far ultrasound has come. 00:09:30:20 - 00:09:32:18 And so you've got to think of ultrasound 00:09:32:18 - 00:09:34:09 as an energy of three frequencies. 00:09:34:09 - 00:09:36:03 The one we're most commonly 00:09:36:03 - 00:09:37:23 familiar with is in the mid-range ten, 00:09:37:23 - 00:09:40:15 I think around ten, and that is the imaging. 00:09:40:15 - 00:09:42:11 Okay, your black and white images, 00:09:42:11 - 00:09:45:00 you see some companies using low frequencies 00:09:45:08 - 00:09:46:17 to ablate tumors. 00:09:46:17 - 00:09:48:23 I’m sorry, to ablate parts of the neuroanatomy 00:09:48:23 - 00:09:50:22 uninvasively, which is fantastic. 00:09:50:22 - 00:09:52:15 So companies like Insightec 00:09:52:15 - 00:09:54:14 are out there doing some amazing work. 00:09:54:14 - 00:09:55:11 You've also got companies 00:09:55:11 - 00:09:57:05 using the high end spectrum, 00:09:57:05 - 00:09:59:01 which now we're doing research with Caltech 00:09:59:01 - 00:10:00:11 because that high end 00:10:00:11 - 00:10:03:17 spectrum gives resolution 5 to 10 times 00:10:04:06 - 00:10:07:10 that of functional MRI, and it's uninvasive 00:10:07:10 - 00:10:08:17 and it's real time. 00:10:08:17 - 00:10:10:09 So what we're saying is 00:10:10:09 - 00:10:12:02 you can actually see with ultrasound 00:10:12:02 - 00:10:15:05 motor function, so thought intention 00:10:15:05 - 00:10:16:12 to move your arms and legs. 00:10:16:12 - 00:10:17:22 And so that's really interesting to now 00:10:17:22 - 00:10:19:12 think of ultrasound for us 00:10:19:12 - 00:10:21:07 as a machine brain interface. 00:10:21:07 - 00:10:23:09 So just talk a little bit more about 00:10:23:09 - 00:10:24:10 maybe your most 00:10:24:10 - 00:10:26:18 interesting application where, you know, 00:10:27:04 - 00:10:28:14 let's just talk about the off the shelf. 00:10:28:14 - 00:10:30:09 I think of them as like windows, right? 00:10:30:09 - 00:10:34:17 It's like a little opening to your brain. 00:10:34:17 - 00:10:37:00 Are these like, epilepsy patients, brain 00:10:37:00 - 00:10:38:19 tumor patients, like I don't know. 00:10:38:19 - 00:10:40:06 What do you, just characterize 00:10:40:06 - 00:10:41:00 that market a little bit. 00:10:41:00 - 00:10:43:08 And then describe the ultrasound application 00:10:43:08 - 00:10:44:15 a little bit more for that patient. 00:10:44:15 - 00:10:46:22 So it’s good to understand the market itself. 00:10:46:22 - 00:10:49:06 So there's 300,000 patients getting surgery 00:10:49:06 - 00:10:50:05 every year around. 00:10:50:05 - 00:10:53:04 So it's got 70,000 are hydrocephalus. 00:10:53:04 - 00:10:54:18 Those patients for Longeviti 00:10:54:18 - 00:10:56:05 can receive an InvisiShunt 00:10:56:05 - 00:10:58:03 and sometimes that's accompanied with a window. 00:10:58:03 - 00:10:59:00 So that 00:10:59:03 - 00:11:01:09 excuse me, that window will allow a physician 00:11:01:21 - 00:11:03:06 to follow the catheter 00:11:03:06 - 00:11:04:20 with ultrasound down into the brain 00:11:04:20 - 00:11:07:16 imaging and see the ventricles change. 00:11:07:16 - 00:11:09:06 They can actually watch the CSF, 00:11:09:06 - 00:11:10:14 which is that fluid that your brain 00:11:10:14 - 00:11:11:14 is floating in, 00:11:11:14 - 00:11:13:06 flow through the catheter and drain out 00:11:13:06 - 00:11:15:16 and make sure that was a successful case. 00:11:15:16 - 00:11:16:19 So that's one application 00:11:16:19 - 00:11:18:09 for a large swath of patients. 00:11:18:09 - 00:11:20:05 Another one is for tumors. 00:11:20:05 - 00:11:21:11 Some of our physicians now 00:11:21:11 - 00:11:23:19 in Israel, and New York are placing this window 00:11:23:19 - 00:11:25:14 because for your minute, for your 00:11:27:04 - 00:11:28:18 your benign tumors and 00:11:28:18 - 00:11:30:02 your meningiomas. 00:11:30:02 - 00:11:32:15 Those come back around, I think, 90%. 00:11:32:15 - 00:11:33:14 You're going to check my math 00:11:33:14 - 00:11:35:23 90% of the time in the exact same location 00:11:35:23 - 00:11:37:19 and 85% over 25 years. 00:11:37:19 - 00:11:40:09 So if you have a window here for early detection, 00:11:40:09 - 00:11:43:13 you can monitor these, you know, benign tumors. 00:11:43:18 - 00:11:44:18 There's an advantage there. 00:11:44:18 - 00:11:45:13 And a quote 00:11:45:13 - 00:11:46:13 that we hear all the time from 00:11:46:13 - 00:11:48:15 physicians is time is tissue. 00:11:48:15 - 00:11:49:16 And so that's another thing 00:11:49:16 - 00:11:51:04 that we're really interested 00:11:51:04 - 00:11:52:12 in is a lot of trauma 00:11:52:12 - 00:11:53:22 facilities are using our windows 00:11:53:22 - 00:11:55:16 so they can see blood afterwards. 00:11:55:16 - 00:11:57:15 It takes sometimes even, 00:11:57:15 - 00:11:59:18 in the best facilities, a couple of hours, 00:11:59:18 - 00:12:01:17 to get a patient down to a CT scanner, 00:12:01:17 - 00:12:02:17 to get those images, 00:12:02:17 - 00:12:04:01 to get a radiologist to read them, 00:12:04:01 - 00:12:06:02 and then back to the physician or the staff. 00:12:06:10 - 00:12:08:20 You know, sometimes you can actually just, 00:12:08:20 - 00:12:09:22 now, our physicians 00:12:09:22 - 00:12:11:08 will at least start with an ultrasound 00:12:11:08 - 00:12:12:05 if they have the ability 00:12:12:05 - 00:12:14:05 and they can still get the CT scan. 00:12:14:05 - 00:12:16:09 But that frontline imaging really can help a lot, 00:12:16:09 - 00:12:18:09 especially when a patient has minutes to hours. 00:12:18:09 - 00:12:20:04 Is the procedure, the implant, 00:12:20:04 - 00:12:22:08 always associated with some sort of 00:12:22:08 - 00:12:23:12 intervention, 00:12:23:12 - 00:12:25:00 or is it can it sometimes 00:12:25:00 - 00:12:27:04 just be you aside from the shunt, 00:12:27:04 - 00:12:27:19 you know, 00:12:27:19 - 00:12:29:09 can it be used like purely for like, hey, 00:12:29:09 - 00:12:30:18 we're just going to study you now. 00:12:30:18 - 00:12:32:12 So it's interesting you say that, 00:12:32:12 - 00:12:34:01 we do have a lot of interest 00:12:34:01 - 00:12:36:21 in an extra dural implantation. 00:12:36:21 - 00:12:39:01 And so what our window allows is diagnostics 00:12:39:01 - 00:12:41:08 of the brain fairly un-invasively. 00:12:41:08 - 00:12:43:15 So some facilities are starting to talk about 00:12:43:15 - 00:12:44:23 an outpatient procedure. 00:12:44:23 - 00:12:46:17 You don't actually need to expose the brain. 00:12:46:17 - 00:12:47:16 It's covered 00:12:47:16 - 00:12:50:16 by a leather type of membrane called the dura. 00:12:50:16 - 00:12:52:18 And the dura is fairly tough and robust. 00:12:52:18 - 00:12:55:02 So if you can expose the, 00:12:55:02 - 00:12:56:14 you know, small incision in the skin, 00:12:56:14 - 00:12:58:15 remove a small window of bone, replace this 00:12:58:15 - 00:13:00:12 very strong implant that gives you a window, 00:13:00:12 - 00:13:01:09 put your skin back 00:13:01:09 - 00:13:03:01 and the patient recovers very quickly. 00:13:03:01 - 00:13:04:20 It's an outpatient procedure. 00:13:04:20 - 00:13:06:01 So some of those technologies 00:13:06:01 - 00:13:07:16 I've mentioned early on about this, 00:13:07:16 - 00:13:09:23 the spectrum of ultrasound, 00:13:09:23 - 00:13:11:20 that’s where we're doing a lot of research right now. 00:13:11:20 - 00:13:15:01 It might be a value proposition for a patient 00:13:15:01 - 00:13:16:14 to go in and get a window, so they can 00:13:16:14 - 00:13:18:11 then receive one of the two high 00:13:18:11 - 00:13:20:03 or low end frequencies of ultrasound, 00:13:20:03 - 00:13:23:02 either for motor function or to ablate, 00:13:23:02 - 00:13:24:03 a part of the brain 00:13:24:03 - 00:13:25:10 that otherwise they couldn't get to, 00:13:25:10 - 00:13:27:07 which would be a lot less invasive 00:13:27:07 - 00:13:28:18 than actually go surgically remove 00:13:28:18 - 00:13:30:19 that part of tumor or that motor dysfunction. 00:13:31:14 - 00:13:32:09 Does that make sense? 00:13:32:09 - 00:13:33:19 It does. 00:13:33:19 - 00:13:36:06 Let me take a step back. 00:13:36:06 - 00:13:37:18 As a founder CEO, 00:13:37:18 - 00:13:40:13 It is very important 00:13:40:13 - 00:13:44:18 that we were very respectful and diligent 00:13:44:18 - 00:13:46:10 on the patient 00:13:46:10 - 00:13:48:01 and understanding the circumstances 00:13:48:01 - 00:13:49:17 in which they're undergoing surgeries. 00:13:49:17 - 00:13:51:03 And we really, as a young company 00:13:51:03 - 00:13:53:12 need to listen to what's already happening. 00:13:53:12 - 00:13:54:01 And, you know, 00:13:54:01 - 00:13:56:05 these disorders are already teaching us so much. 00:13:56:14 - 00:13:59:03 But to your point, we do think that in the future 00:13:59:03 - 00:14:00:01 there is a scenario 00:14:00:01 - 00:14:01:13 where you could be getting these windows 00:14:01:13 - 00:14:03:17 and probably should be getting these windows 00:14:03:17 - 00:14:05:02 for various other technologies. 00:14:05:02 - 00:14:07:11 And that’s what makes it so fun right now for us. 00:14:07:11 - 00:14:08:22 There's so much opportunity, 00:14:08:22 - 00:14:10:13 with just even this one technology, 00:14:10:13 - 00:14:11:12 let alone all these others, 00:14:11:12 - 00:14:12:17 we don't have time to talk about it. 00:14:12:17 - 00:14:14:09 Yeah, I mean, you're, 00:14:14:09 - 00:14:15:19 in some ways to think about it 00:14:15:19 - 00:14:17:17 sort of decades ahead of 00:14:17:17 - 00:14:19:20 the pharmaceutical applications 00:14:19:20 - 00:14:22:03 for neurodegenerative diseases or, 00:14:22:03 - 00:14:23:22 you can see a future where, hey, 00:14:23:22 - 00:14:25:16 you've got these biomarkers, 00:14:25:16 - 00:14:29:01 you might be at risk for some future disease. 00:14:29:01 - 00:14:30:16 Let’s start some sort of low, 00:14:30:16 - 00:14:32:10 you know, low frequency 00:14:32:10 - 00:14:33:20 ultrasound therapy or 00:14:33:20 - 00:14:36:02 something like that is kind of maybe where 00:14:36:02 - 00:14:37:11 what you're envisioning in the future. 00:14:37:11 - 00:14:38:02 Is that right? 00:14:38:02 - 00:14:40:08 Yeah, and I hate to bucket it in one 00:14:40:08 - 00:14:41:00 because there's probably 00:14:41:00 - 00:14:42:09 about a dozen different projects 00:14:42:09 - 00:14:44:09 already underway with various institutions 00:14:44:09 - 00:14:46:07 and some of the best institutions in the world 00:14:46:07 - 00:14:49:13 from, you know, Penn and Hopkins to USC, Caltech, 00:14:50:04 - 00:14:51:03 across the country. 00:14:51:03 - 00:14:52:18 And we're starting to work with children 00:14:52:18 - 00:14:54:09 now, which is very exciting 00:14:54:09 - 00:14:56:04 and near and dear to most of us. 00:14:56:04 - 00:14:58:01 On the executive team, we're all parents. 00:14:58:01 - 00:14:59:04 How do you manage 00:14:59:04 - 00:15:00:17 all these different initiatives? 00:15:00:17 - 00:15:01:23 It sounds like you've got, 00:15:01:23 - 00:15:04:20 you know, on market, off the shelf platforms, 00:15:05:04 - 00:15:06:04 you've got research 00:15:07:14 - 00:15:09:06 relationships and partnerships 00:15:09:06 - 00:15:12:03 and I'm sure a bunch of other sort of DARPA 00:15:12:03 - 00:15:13:08 or something like that, you know, 00:15:13:08 - 00:15:15:05 upfront sort of R&D, like 00:15:15:05 - 00:15:17:12 how do you manage all that? 00:15:17:12 - 00:15:18:12 And these are all important. 00:15:18:12 - 00:15:19:23 I can see your vision here 00:15:19:23 - 00:15:21:09 as you're describing it, 00:15:21:09 - 00:15:22:12 but I also kind of 00:15:22:12 - 00:15:23:17 want to ask the question like, 00:15:23:17 - 00:15:25:02 how do you manage to 00:15:25:02 - 00:15:26:03 kind of run the company 00:15:26:03 - 00:15:28:09 when you have all these different sort of 00:15:28:09 - 00:15:29:08 things going on? 00:15:29:08 - 00:15:31:09 You know, it's really important 00:15:31:09 - 00:15:32:09 for a young company 00:15:32:09 - 00:15:34:20 and a lean company like ours to have focus. 00:15:34:20 - 00:15:35:19 So although 00:15:35:19 - 00:15:37:15 you might hear me talking about a lot of things 00:15:37:15 - 00:15:39:16 our executive team is pretty focused on, 00:15:39:16 - 00:15:40:11 you know, 00:15:40:19 - 00:15:43:17 two or three major initiatives per year. 00:15:43:17 - 00:15:45:18 And this year it's just overwhelmingly 00:15:45:18 - 00:15:47:07 to teach the market ultrasound 00:15:47:07 - 00:15:49:02 and focus on our core products, grow revenue, 00:15:49:02 - 00:15:51:18 so we can support all the other R&D. 00:15:52:02 - 00:15:53:17 The good news too is it's exciting. 00:15:53:17 - 00:15:55:09 So a lot of our collaborators, 00:15:55:09 - 00:15:57:01 frankly, are eager to do the work 00:15:57:01 - 00:15:59:14 and if we can allow them to work at their pace 00:15:59:14 - 00:16:01:20 because of that and it doesn't set us back. 00:16:01:20 - 00:16:04:23 But there's the traditional setbacks. 00:16:04:23 - 00:16:06:22 I mean, as I'm sitting here as a CEO, 00:16:06:22 - 00:16:08:14 there's probably a half dozen projects 00:16:08:14 - 00:16:09:16 we can't fund right now. 00:16:09:16 - 00:16:12:11 And just the Sophie’s Choice of our, 00:16:12:11 - 00:16:14:03 you know, of our economy. 00:16:14:03 - 00:16:16:00 Real quick on that. 00:16:16:00 - 00:16:18:20 So clearly executive focused certainly helps. 00:16:19:15 - 00:16:21:01 And those other ones are out there, 00:16:21:01 - 00:16:22:20 but you're not kind of working on them actively. 00:16:22:20 - 00:16:25:06 But can you just talk a little bit more? 00:16:25:06 - 00:16:26:01 We don't talk about this 00:16:26:01 - 00:16:27:10 enough on the podcast about, 00:16:27:10 - 00:16:30:01 you know, you're on the 00:16:30:01 - 00:16:31:15 frontier of this market. 00:16:31:15 - 00:16:33:04 So it seems like a lot of your work 00:16:33:04 - 00:16:34:13 is educating, 00:16:34:13 - 00:16:36:16 or teaching the market about ultrasound. 00:16:38:13 - 00:16:40:09 What are you actually doing there? 00:16:40:09 - 00:16:43:05 So it's twofold and that's a great point. 00:16:43:05 - 00:16:45:23 It's probably the biggest 00:16:45:23 - 00:16:48:04 task at hand for the for the company, 00:16:48:04 - 00:16:49:12 is not only training ultrasound, 00:16:49:12 - 00:16:51:00 which ironically internationally 00:16:51:00 - 00:16:52:03 our neurosurgical community 00:16:52:03 - 00:16:53:15 is a little more familiar with, 00:16:53:15 - 00:16:54:13 but in the United States, we have 00:16:54:13 - 00:16:56:02 CT scanners, MRI's everywhere. 00:16:56:02 - 00:16:57:12 So there's less of a need. 00:16:57:12 - 00:16:58:23 But when you start looking at 00:16:58:23 - 00:17:00:19 the numbers behind patient transports 00:17:00:19 - 00:17:02:04 and what it means to move a patient around 00:17:02:04 - 00:17:03:12 just to get an image versus 00:17:03:12 - 00:17:04:21 doing it at the bedside 00:17:04:21 - 00:17:07:00 again, the costs and the adverse events 00:17:07:00 - 00:17:08:13 associated are overwhelmingly 00:17:08:13 - 00:17:10:08 in favor of keeping the patient 00:17:10:08 - 00:17:12:11 where they are and getting real time imaging. 00:17:12:11 - 00:17:14:07 So, you know, how do we do that? 00:17:14:07 - 00:17:15:19 We teach the ICU team. 00:17:15:19 - 00:17:17:06 So after our surgery, 00:17:17:06 - 00:17:19:08 the whole team that takes care of this patient, 00:17:19:08 - 00:17:20:10 we will go in and we'll do an 00:17:20:10 - 00:17:22:06 in-service, will bring in a GE unit 00:17:22:06 - 00:17:24:00 we've hired some great people from GE. 00:17:24:00 - 00:17:26:04 We've got a good relationship with GE actually, 00:17:26:12 - 00:17:27:12 so we'll go in and 00:17:27:12 - 00:17:29:09 co-train them on how to manage these patients. 00:17:29:09 - 00:17:31:02 What are the protocols? 00:17:31:02 - 00:17:33:09 What are the first things you're looking at? 00:17:33:09 - 00:17:35:07 Midline, skull base, ventricles? 00:17:35:07 - 00:17:37:21 Is there blood, you know, completed checklist. 00:17:37:21 - 00:17:38:15 But it's really interesting 00:17:38:15 - 00:17:39:03 to watch this 00:17:39:03 - 00:17:42:03 grow grassroots from Hopkins to NYU 00:17:42:03 - 00:17:43:06 and some of these other hospitals 00:17:43:06 - 00:17:45:04 that are really writing the protocols 00:17:45:04 - 00:17:46:10 at Mount Sinai, for example, 00:17:46:10 - 00:17:48:00 they're doing some amazing things with, 00:17:48:00 - 00:17:49:07 you know, blood evacuation. 00:17:49:07 - 00:17:53:07 And so we're sitting back and kind of watching, 00:17:53:07 - 00:17:56:12 watching our our physicians lead us to the right 00:17:56:12 - 00:17:57:21 place responsibly. 00:17:57:21 - 00:18:00:14 So these are, you mentioned like protocols. 00:18:00:14 - 00:18:01:07 These are 00:18:01:07 - 00:18:03:21 the physicians that have patients of your 00:18:03:21 - 00:18:06:04 of Longeviti’s with implants 00:18:06:04 - 00:18:08:05 that they can now study longer term, basically. 00:18:08:12 - 00:18:10:13 Right, and so we have probably three fold, 00:18:10:13 - 00:18:13:00 we've got our Longeviti Initiative Education, 00:18:13:00 - 00:18:14:09 which is on brand. 00:18:14:09 - 00:18:15:11 And, you know, our have 00:18:15:11 - 00:18:17:17 our industry enough is very regulated. 00:18:17:17 - 00:18:20:00 So there's only so much we can do and say 00:18:20:00 - 00:18:21:03 there's, 00:18:21:03 - 00:18:23:02 you know, courses like the one I'm at today 00:18:23:02 - 00:18:24:06 and frankly, I'm talking to you 00:18:24:06 - 00:18:25:12 from the Big Island in Hawaii 00:18:25:12 - 00:18:27:12 from the Western Neurosurgical Society meeting, 00:18:27:12 - 00:18:28:05 where you've got 00:18:28:05 - 00:18:29:22 some of the most brilliant physicians 00:18:29:22 - 00:18:31:12 and neurosurgeons in the world 00:18:31:12 - 00:18:32:21 getting together once a year 00:18:32:21 - 00:18:34:00 in a friendly environment, 00:18:34:00 - 00:18:35:23 talking about what they're working on, 00:18:35:23 - 00:18:37:08 what their life's work is on. 00:18:37:08 - 00:18:38:22 Can we implant T cells? 00:18:38:22 - 00:18:41:02 should we be doing this one procedure invasively? 00:18:41:02 - 00:18:42:11 And it’s very interesting 00:18:42:11 - 00:18:45:05 to see the real controversy today and, you know, 00:18:45:21 - 00:18:48:19 and civil way of having these conversations. 00:18:48:19 - 00:18:51:13 And let's face it, too, I mean, 00:18:51:13 - 00:18:52:06 there's a lot of risk 00:18:52:06 - 00:18:53:21 sometimes to having these open dialogs 00:18:53:21 - 00:18:56:05 and this community needs a safe place 00:18:56:05 - 00:18:56:20 to have that. 00:18:56:20 - 00:18:57:11 And so, you know, 00:18:57:11 - 00:18:58:23 we sometimes this industry feel 00:18:58:23 - 00:19:00:14 very privileged to be able to be at places 00:19:00:14 - 00:19:01:21 like this, to listen to that 00:19:01:21 - 00:19:03:11 and to see if we're on the right track 00:19:03:11 - 00:19:05:03 or if we're listening to what they have to say. 00:19:05:03 - 00:19:09:11 So, you know, supporting and partnering with, 00:19:09:16 - 00:19:10:08 you know, 00:19:10:08 - 00:19:12:07 these education societies that already meet 00:19:12:07 - 00:19:13:08 is another great way 00:19:13:08 - 00:19:15:04 to really further the education. 00:19:15:04 - 00:19:17:17 And then lastly is really macro economically. 00:19:18:01 - 00:19:19:22 We're working with large facilities 00:19:19:22 - 00:19:21:00 like North Wealth in New York 00:19:21:00 - 00:19:23:07 that has 26 hospitals, Hopkins, 00:19:23:07 - 00:19:26:07 Kaiser to understand, you know, follow a dollar 00:19:26:20 - 00:19:29:02 as that patient goes through the hospital system, 00:19:29:02 - 00:19:31:10 let's follow the dollar that follows them. 00:19:31:23 - 00:19:33:01 And it's a lot easier 00:19:33:01 - 00:19:34:17 said than done in some cases 00:19:34:17 - 00:19:36:14 takes years, even within an institution 00:19:36:14 - 00:19:38:05 that wants to do it, so. 00:19:38:05 - 00:19:38:22 But those are kind 00:19:38:22 - 00:19:40:14 of the three pillars of education we look at. 00:19:40:14 - 00:19:42:05 That's real, there's a lot of work there. 00:19:42:05 - 00:19:43:07 So, you know, 00:19:43:07 - 00:19:44:22 it brings it back to, 00:19:44:22 - 00:19:48:18 the name of our podcast, which is Speed to Data. 00:19:49:05 - 00:19:51:09 And as you're talking, it's 00:19:51:09 - 00:19:52:14 maybe a better way to frame it 00:19:52:14 - 00:19:54:01 with you is sort of 00:19:54:01 - 00:19:58:05 like the marathon of kind of educating 00:19:58:05 - 00:20:02:04 and slowly getting data to be able to kind of 00:20:02:04 - 00:20:03:16 point to that killer app 00:20:05:02 - 00:20:08:02 that will, skyrocket sales, I would imagine, 00:20:08:08 - 00:20:10:04 of your implants. 00:20:10:04 - 00:20:11:15 Yeah, there's a couple of things 00:20:11:15 - 00:20:13:03 now that we think will do that. 00:20:13:03 - 00:20:14:12 We're already seeing early indications 00:20:14:12 - 00:20:16:12 and we've been grateful for physicians, 00:20:16:12 - 00:20:19:12 frankly, tweeting out and posting on social media 00:20:19:12 - 00:20:21:02 some of the amazing images they're getting. 00:20:21:02 - 00:20:23:14 So there's a good grassroots groundswell. 00:20:23:14 - 00:20:24:18 But to your point, 00:20:24:18 - 00:20:27:08 we also expect there'll be some some real, 00:20:27:08 - 00:20:29:17 you know, step ups in terms of adoption. 00:20:29:17 - 00:20:32:01 When we have certain standards and indications, 00:20:32:16 - 00:20:33:03 we're hopeful 00:20:33:03 - 00:20:35:10 for an additional reimbursement code 00:20:35:17 - 00:20:36:21 to come next year. 00:20:36:21 - 00:20:40:09 And we've got some great partnered physicians 00:20:40:09 - 00:20:42:01 that are explaining the value proposition 00:20:42:01 - 00:20:43:16 of being able to ultrasound at any point, 00:20:43:16 - 00:20:47:03 any time, as well as some research 00:20:47:03 - 00:20:49:05 that will point to statistical significance 00:20:49:05 - 00:20:50:15 around things like the InvisiShunt. 00:20:50:15 - 00:20:51:22 And so once we feel like these 00:20:51:22 - 00:20:53:09 things are out there again, 00:20:53:09 - 00:20:56:10 we'll continue to see, you know, step ups. 00:20:56:10 - 00:20:57:04 But to your point, 00:20:57:04 - 00:20:59:13 I mean, we're in it for the grind. 00:20:59:13 - 00:21:01:15 I think Ray Lewis being from Baltimore, 00:21:01:15 - 00:21:03:01 the last time we won a Super Bowl, 00:21:03:01 - 00:21:06:21 that was our motto is, embrace the grind. 00:21:06:21 - 00:21:08:04 And, you know, for a company 00:21:08:04 - 00:21:09:21 that started in a garage 00:21:09:21 - 00:21:11:15 that has, you know, really 00:21:11:15 - 00:21:12:21 bootstrapped its funding 00:21:12:21 - 00:21:15:06 and made it through a pandemic, been able to grow 00:21:15:06 - 00:21:17:02 and now is internationally selling, 00:21:17:02 - 00:21:18:21 we know what that means. 00:21:18:21 - 00:21:20:06 And so every day we get out of bed 00:21:20:06 - 00:21:21:15 and we're embracing the grind. 00:21:21:15 - 00:21:22:21 We know it's not going to be easy. 00:21:22:21 - 00:21:23:21 And all of the things that I mean, 00:21:23:21 - 00:21:26:03 you heard me talk about, we take seriously. 00:21:26:03 - 00:21:27:21 We don't want to fall on our face 00:21:27:21 - 00:21:30:05 and we want to be very respectful to the patient. 00:21:30:05 - 00:21:31:01 At the end of the day. 00:21:31:01 - 00:21:33:14 I guess, what do investors ask? 00:21:33:14 - 00:21:36:16 Because you are doing quite a bit of market, 00:21:36:16 - 00:21:38:21 you know, education here 00:21:38:21 - 00:21:40:21 and is sort of like a tech, you know, 00:21:40:21 - 00:21:42:15 sort of like a non-med device tech company 00:21:42:15 - 00:21:43:16 where like you're building 00:21:43:16 - 00:21:45:23 this platform, it’s going to take a long time. 00:21:46:07 - 00:21:48:13 Like what kind of questions do investors ask 00:21:48:19 - 00:21:50:06 and how do you answer them? 00:21:50:06 - 00:21:51:20 Yeah, it's a great question. 00:21:51:20 - 00:21:55:02 We are very fortunate to have a very supportive 00:21:55:02 - 00:21:58:19 investor group through our, 00:21:59:02 - 00:21:59:21 and considering 00:21:59:21 - 00:22:00:21 the size of our industry, 00:22:00:21 - 00:22:02:05 smaller rounds 00:22:02:05 - 00:22:04:07 and we're also very fortunate to have revenue 00:22:04:15 - 00:22:06:08 so we have 00:22:06:08 - 00:22:08:05 path to profitability for a young company 00:22:08:05 - 00:22:10:10 in this space is very difficult. 00:22:10:10 - 00:22:12:14 But we also recognize there's 00:22:12:14 - 00:22:13:21 a lot of opportunity for growth. 00:22:13:21 - 00:22:15:11 So as I sit here talking to you, 00:22:15:11 - 00:22:16:16 our board and myself 00:22:16:16 - 00:22:18:15 are contemplating really accelerating. 00:22:18:15 - 00:22:19:15 What we already know is, 00:22:19:15 - 00:22:22:03 is this possible in pockets that we're 00:22:22:03 - 00:22:22:23 seeing success. 00:22:24:00 - 00:22:25:10 So, you know, 00:22:25:10 - 00:22:27:12 that's kind of where we sit 00:22:27:12 - 00:22:28:16 and how we look at it 00:22:28:16 - 00:22:29:19 and how we have our discussions. 00:22:29:19 - 00:22:31:15 So it's kind of out of both sides of your mouth, 00:22:31:15 - 00:22:33:22 but very transparent, you know, hey, look, 00:22:33:22 - 00:22:35:17 we might have another pandemic, 00:22:35:17 - 00:22:37:17 so we've got plan B in our back pocket. 00:22:37:17 - 00:22:39:21 We also know that there's a lot of opportunity. 00:22:39:21 - 00:22:41:10 These are real value 00:22:41:10 - 00:22:43:19 propositions for patients all over the world. 00:22:43:19 - 00:22:45:06 And we're seeing it firsthand. 00:22:45:06 - 00:22:47:12 We can't unsee what we've seen now. 00:22:47:12 - 00:22:49:23 So, you know, how do we treat both of these? 00:22:50:12 - 00:22:51:08 You know, and it 00:22:51:08 - 00:22:53:22 and it takes really having multiple plans, 00:22:54:05 - 00:22:55:19 you know, good communication with your board 00:22:55:19 - 00:22:56:17 and your executives. 00:22:56:17 - 00:22:57:21 and so I feel like that's 00:22:57:21 - 00:22:59:08 where my particular role 00:22:59:08 - 00:23:01:12 is this most important? 00:23:01:12 - 00:23:02:11 I need to be the connective 00:23:02:11 - 00:23:03:19 tissue between our investors 00:23:03:19 - 00:23:05:03 and our executive team. 00:23:05:03 - 00:23:06:18 And together, we need to translate 00:23:06:18 - 00:23:07:13 as an executive team 00:23:07:13 - 00:23:10:17 to our employees what the vision is. 00:23:10:17 - 00:23:13:14 But the investors look, 00:23:13:21 - 00:23:14:16 you know, the pandemic, 00:23:14:16 - 00:23:16:18 they want to make sure that we're not, you know, 00:23:16:18 - 00:23:18:00 imploding, which fortunately 00:23:18:00 - 00:23:19:23 we grew, you know, about 50% during, 00:23:19:23 - 00:23:20:20 which is encouraging. 00:23:20:20 - 00:23:21:18 But, you know, 00:23:21:18 - 00:23:22:05 we're very 00:23:22:05 - 00:23:24:02 we give a quarterly newsletter 00:23:24:02 - 00:23:25:17 proactively to our investment group, 00:23:25:17 - 00:23:27:14 which I think satisfies 00:23:27:14 - 00:23:29:02 a lot of questions that otherwise, 00:23:29:02 - 00:23:30:19 if you're not hearing from a private company, 00:23:30:19 - 00:23:32:06 you know, public companies you can hear about. 00:23:32:06 - 00:23:34:14 But we try to fly a little under the radar 00:23:34:14 - 00:23:35:20 and most of our posts 00:23:35:20 - 00:23:37:17 are, you know, within health care. 00:23:37:17 - 00:23:39:09 Yeah, I like staying ahead of it 00:23:39:09 - 00:23:40:23 from a communication perspective, 00:23:40:23 - 00:23:42:09 particularly with your investors, 00:23:42:09 - 00:23:43:03 it's a smart move. 00:23:44:12 - 00:23:46:19 So you mentioned just the word vision 00:23:47:05 - 00:23:49:22 and on your home page, 00:23:49:22 - 00:23:52:09 there's a picture of one of the implants 00:23:52:09 - 00:23:55:08 that has a battery, a circuit board 00:23:55:17 - 00:23:57:09 and some sort of antenna 00:23:57:09 - 00:23:59:20 and some sort of connection to the brain. 00:23:59:20 - 00:24:04:04 Are you up to talking about what that actually is? 00:24:04:04 - 00:24:06:01 Yeah. So I'm glad you brought it up. 00:24:06:01 - 00:24:06:12 And I encourage 00:24:06:12 - 00:24:08:05 anybody who listens to go and see it. 00:24:08:05 - 00:24:11:01 It's really easy then to understand 00:24:11:01 - 00:24:13:04 what you and I have been talking about 00:24:13:04 - 00:24:14:22 in a snapshot. Right. 00:24:14:22 - 00:24:16:21 And so that image, you see 00:24:16:21 - 00:24:18:06 one of the projects we worked on, 00:24:18:06 - 00:24:19:18 it wasn't intended for a patient, 00:24:19:18 - 00:24:20:16 but it was really flexing 00:24:20:16 - 00:24:21:23 some of our engineering muscles. 00:24:21:23 - 00:24:23:15 And to date we've got seven patents 00:24:23:15 - 00:24:24:22 and I think 33 underway, 00:24:24:22 - 00:24:27:00 and I have to check my math on that. 00:24:27:00 - 00:24:27:12 But, you know, 00:24:27:12 - 00:24:29:09 it's really about the implantability 00:24:29:09 - 00:24:31:20 and the conversion of the cranial plasticisty, 00:24:31:20 - 00:24:34:12 your bone, your cranium into a functional, 00:24:35:08 - 00:24:38:12 you know, apparatus, batteries, apps, 00:24:38:22 - 00:24:41:06 various function, medicine delivery, 00:24:41:06 - 00:24:43:21 you know, stimulation, recording. 00:24:43:21 - 00:24:44:11 And so what 00:24:44:11 - 00:24:47:12 you see there, that's actually an infrared camera 00:24:47:12 - 00:24:50:03 to look at brain and blood flow 00:24:50:03 - 00:24:52:06 because there's no light in the brain. 00:24:52:06 - 00:24:53:07 So there's a tiny light, 00:24:53:07 - 00:24:54:10 there's an infrared camera 00:24:54:10 - 00:24:56:04 and the whole thing is completely autonomous 00:24:56:04 - 00:24:59:06 and it can emit through an antenna to an app 00:24:59:06 - 00:25:00:00 what it's seeing. 00:25:00:23 - 00:25:02:16 There's a number of projects that, 00:25:02:16 - 00:25:04:20 you can basically imagine implants, 00:25:05:05 - 00:25:06:11 power and function. 00:25:06:11 - 00:25:08:05 That's what we need, right, form, power, 00:25:08:05 - 00:25:10:22 and function is what we consider at Longeviti. 00:25:10:22 - 00:25:12:09 Form and power, really, 00:25:12:09 - 00:25:14:09 we consider our our strong suits. 00:25:14:09 - 00:25:16:05 We realy look for function 00:25:16:05 - 00:25:18:05 and have had some great collaborations. 00:25:18:05 - 00:25:22:09 So again, you know, from pressure flow 00:25:22:09 - 00:25:24:01 diagnostics, we've got various 00:25:24:01 - 00:25:26:06 partnerships out there that we're just proud of. 00:25:26:06 - 00:25:27:19 So that image is repeated 00:25:27:19 - 00:25:29:23 in several different projects underway 00:25:29:23 - 00:25:31:14 and there's also patients with other devices 00:25:31:14 - 00:25:32:21 that look like that in them. 00:25:32:21 - 00:25:35:08 So there's RNS device out on the market 00:25:35:08 - 00:25:37:18 that's a fantastic device for epilepsy. 00:25:38:03 - 00:25:40:15 Some patients won't have bone to anchor it too. 00:25:40:15 - 00:25:42:02 So how is that 00:25:42:02 - 00:25:43:16 within a cranioplasty to implant for them? 00:25:43:16 - 00:25:44:18 And the electrodes will come out 00:25:44:18 - 00:25:46:13 underneath, into the brain. 00:25:46:13 - 00:25:47:15 Therefore, when the patient 00:25:47:15 - 00:25:49:03 then has to get a battery replaced, 00:25:49:03 - 00:25:50:18 they don't actually have to have their 00:25:50:18 - 00:25:51:18 brain exposed again. 00:25:51:18 - 00:25:54:00 They've got a little compartment, like a toy car 00:25:54:00 - 00:25:55:16 where they pop up the plastic, 00:25:55:16 - 00:25:56:15 replace the battery, 00:25:56:15 - 00:25:57:20 and then close the skin over top. 00:25:57:20 - 00:26:00:12 And there was a much less invasive procedure. 00:26:00:12 - 00:26:01:21 So the surgeon would actually have 00:26:01:21 - 00:26:03:22 to make an incision to open it up right? 00:26:03:22 - 00:26:04:19 Right. 00:26:04:19 - 00:26:06:17 And so that's not a commercial product. 00:26:06:17 - 00:26:08:07 That's just like the concept. 00:26:08:07 - 00:26:10:06 So that particular one is a concept, 00:26:10:06 - 00:26:12:04 but we have various products like that 00:26:12:04 - 00:26:13:03 that have been implanted. 00:26:13:03 - 00:26:14:12 And again, there's 00:26:14:12 - 00:26:15:21 a number of different functions out there. 00:26:15:21 - 00:26:16:21 So I'm not trying to 00:26:16:21 - 00:26:18:09 beat around the bush to just, you know, 00:26:18:09 - 00:26:19:06 literally, you know, 00:26:19:06 - 00:26:21:09 different disorders and different needs 00:26:21:09 - 00:26:23:10 that are required from various research 00:26:23:10 - 00:26:25:08 and non research collaborators. 00:26:25:08 - 00:26:26:18 So we do quite a bit of work 00:26:26:18 - 00:26:28:14 in the drug delivery space 00:26:28:14 - 00:26:30:09 here at Key Tech working with, 00:26:30:09 - 00:26:31:22 you know, AstraZeneca, BMS 00:26:31:22 - 00:26:34:16 and you know, body worn infusion pumps and 00:26:35:17 - 00:26:39:11 there’s a lot of talk about design for clinical trials. 00:26:39:23 - 00:26:41:07 So I guess when you're talking 00:26:41:07 - 00:26:43:23 about these various applications and concepts 00:26:43:23 - 00:26:45:10 the first step has to be, 00:26:45:10 - 00:26:47:02 you know, creating a, 00:26:47:02 - 00:26:49:14 a clinical device for use in trials 00:26:49:14 - 00:26:51:04 is that what you're you're targeting? 00:26:51:04 - 00:26:53:03 Or is it kind of animal studies? 00:26:53:03 - 00:26:54:10 So the interesting thing, 00:26:54:10 - 00:26:55:22 it depends on the product, right? 00:26:55:22 - 00:26:57:14 So for our ClearFit product 00:26:57:14 - 00:26:59:12 line were cleared for implantation 00:26:59:12 - 00:27:02:13 and to have ultrasound 00:27:02:21 - 00:27:03:19 passing through it, 00:27:03:19 - 00:27:07:07 which is a pretty broad clearance from the FDA. 00:27:07:07 - 00:27:10:09 So we can frankly skip animals in a lot of cases 00:27:10:09 - 00:27:11:19 because there are thousands of patients 00:27:11:19 - 00:27:13:11 walking around with ClearFits 00:27:13:11 - 00:27:14:08 in their heads today. 00:27:14:08 - 00:27:15:07 And a lot of volunteers 00:27:15:07 - 00:27:16:19 have come out and allowed us to 00:27:16:19 - 00:27:17:18 to map their brain 00:27:17:18 - 00:27:19:03 or to look at various anatomies 00:27:19:03 - 00:27:20:16 or the physicians sort of 00:27:20:16 - 00:27:22:19 normal follow up are giving us the data 00:27:22:19 - 00:27:24:10 so we can learn more about it. 00:27:24:10 - 00:27:27:20 So a lot of our research is in IRBs right now 00:27:27:20 - 00:27:29:23 and in active cases, 00:27:29:23 - 00:27:31:21 there are the more technical you get, 00:27:31:21 - 00:27:33:16 the more batteries, the more function, 00:27:33:16 - 00:27:35:01 the more long term we're looking. 00:27:35:01 - 00:27:37:05 So there are some really exciting projects. 00:27:37:05 - 00:27:39:07 Perron Genomics is a great collaborator of ours 00:27:39:07 - 00:27:40:06 and so we're really excited 00:27:40:06 - 00:27:41:17 about what they're working on. 00:27:41:17 - 00:27:43:04 And there's a number of other partnerships 00:27:43:04 - 00:27:43:23 with BlackRock 00:27:43:23 - 00:27:46:08 and other companies out west. 00:27:47:00 - 00:27:49:06 You know, it's important for us. 00:27:49:06 - 00:27:52:05 We look at the functional platform 00:27:52:05 - 00:27:53:16 that you see in that picture 00:27:53:16 - 00:27:56:13 as kind of like our F1 team. 00:27:56:13 - 00:27:57:23 Ford has an F1 team, 00:27:57:23 - 00:28:00:17 they don't sell the F1 car to everyone, but 00:28:01:04 - 00:28:04:05 trying to make it more efficient, faster, leaner 00:28:04:05 - 00:28:07:21 and in performance enhanced as possible 00:28:08:10 - 00:28:09:12 spins out innovations 00:28:09:12 - 00:28:12:14 that we then see in the Ford Taurus or the F-150. 00:28:12:14 - 00:28:14:03 And that's what we've seen at Longeviti. 00:28:14:03 - 00:28:15:17 So while we work on these projects, 00:28:15:17 - 00:28:17:08 some of which might not see the light of day, 00:28:17:08 - 00:28:19:23 some might really help the masses. 00:28:19:23 - 00:28:21:06 The innovations alone from 00:28:21:06 - 00:28:22:09 problem solving are already 00:28:23:13 - 00:28:24:12 being seen in the market. 00:28:24:12 - 00:28:26:03 So from ultrasound to the envision 00:28:26:03 - 00:28:27:19 housing of technology. 00:28:27:19 - 00:28:30:13 And we're encouraged to then 00:28:30:13 - 00:28:32:08 internally to keep working on this. 00:28:32:08 - 00:28:33:21 As long as we have the revenues 00:28:33:21 - 00:28:36:07 to reinvest in this R&D, 00:28:36:07 - 00:28:37:15 we know that will then spin 00:28:37:15 - 00:28:39:22 out of the low hanging fruit of innovation. 00:28:39:22 - 00:28:41:16 It doesn't have to be the holy grail 00:28:41:16 - 00:28:43:11 of a complete headectomy. 00:28:43:11 - 00:28:45:22 And now you can replace, you know, 00:28:45:22 - 00:28:47:00 your entire brain. 00:28:47:00 - 00:28:48:18 So you mentioned the ultrasound. 00:28:48:18 - 00:28:51:11 Again, just being clear with the ClearFit. 00:28:51:11 - 00:28:52:09 So just 00:28:52:09 - 00:28:53:14 we touched on it earlier, 00:28:53:14 - 00:28:55:20 but just for our audience, 00:28:55:20 - 00:28:59:13 it's only imaging or is it ultrasonic therapy? 00:28:59:13 - 00:29:01:15 So it's ultrasound. 00:29:01:15 - 00:29:03:17 It's ultrasound signals. 00:29:03:17 - 00:29:06:22 So that can be any ultrasound. 00:29:07:17 - 00:29:10:21 If the ultrasound is indicated for imaging, 00:29:10:21 - 00:29:12:11 then it can be used for imaging. 00:29:12:11 - 00:29:15:05 If it's indicated for ablation, 00:29:15:05 - 00:29:18:01 it can be ablated. It's an ultrasound image. 00:29:18:01 - 00:29:19:03 And now we've done studies 00:29:19:03 - 00:29:21:16 to show the attenuation and what's happening 00:29:21:16 - 00:29:23:06 to tissues to understand, 00:29:23:06 - 00:29:24:04 you know, the safety nets. 00:29:24:04 - 00:29:25:04 But just to put a perspective, 00:29:25:04 - 00:29:26:21 ultrasound used directly on the brain, 00:29:26:21 - 00:29:28:04 sometimes intra operatively. 00:29:28:04 - 00:29:30:19 So it's a very safe imaging modality. 00:29:30:19 - 00:29:32:11 It's just using literally Doppler 00:29:32:11 - 00:29:33:22 and sound waves to 00:29:33:22 - 00:29:37:09 to to hear and see and convert that into signals. 00:29:37:09 - 00:29:39:21 All right, quick pivot. 00:29:39:21 - 00:29:42:05 And again, this is an educational podcast. 00:29:42:05 - 00:29:42:22 So, 00:29:43:05 - 00:29:44:18 Jesse, we're looking for some advice 00:29:44:18 - 00:29:48:23 that you might provide to startup companies like yours 00:29:48:23 - 00:29:52:18 maybe not in your space, but interacting with FDA. 00:29:52:18 - 00:29:54:02 What do you, 00:29:54:02 - 00:29:56:05 and generally regulatory bodies, 00:29:56:05 - 00:29:57:17 what do you recommend for that? 00:29:57:17 - 00:29:58:21 You know, it's changed 00:29:58:21 - 00:30:01:05 since I started Longeviti before the pandemic. 00:30:01:05 - 00:30:03:15 And so my advice today would be lean in 00:30:04:15 - 00:30:07:22 the people that we've worked with at the FDA 00:30:07:22 - 00:30:09:04 have been very receptive 00:30:09:04 - 00:30:11:12 to concerns and questions. 00:30:11:21 - 00:30:12:18 And we've seen that 00:30:12:18 - 00:30:13:22 not just from our own experience, 00:30:13:22 - 00:30:15:09 but other companies in our space 00:30:15:09 - 00:30:16:06 that we've been talking to. 00:30:16:06 - 00:30:18:05 So certainly as of late, 00:30:18:05 - 00:30:19:01 they really take, 00:30:19:01 - 00:30:22:07 you know, enabling innovation safely, seriously. 00:30:23:03 - 00:30:25:01 And so my advice to them, 00:30:25:01 - 00:30:27:06 younger companies would be approach them. 00:30:27:18 - 00:30:28:11 I'm not saying 00:30:28:11 - 00:30:29:20 necessarily go sit down about your 00:30:29:20 - 00:30:32:00 specific product for a 00:30:32:00 - 00:30:33:14 pre-submission, but there 00:30:33:14 - 00:30:34:14 are a number of 00:30:34:14 - 00:30:35:14 venues that you can go 00:30:35:14 - 00:30:38:00 and have conversations with people from the FDA. 00:30:38:00 - 00:30:39:02 So I highly encourage 00:30:39:02 - 00:30:40:12 one of which we took advantage 00:30:40:12 - 00:30:41:20 of was a preceptorship up. 00:30:41:20 - 00:30:44:02 So the FDA had a preceptorship 00:30:44:02 - 00:30:44:23 with Johns Hopkins, 00:30:44:23 - 00:30:47:10 which would send out individuals from the FDA 00:30:47:16 - 00:30:49:03 to startups like ours, 00:30:49:03 - 00:30:51:06 but not in the same market. 00:30:51:06 - 00:30:53:09 So we would have someone from gastrointestinal, 00:30:53:09 - 00:30:55:11 you know, division. 00:30:55:11 - 00:30:56:15 But to learn, you know, 00:30:56:15 - 00:30:58:08 the trade offs of decision 00:30:58:08 - 00:31:00:10 making we were making as a young company 00:31:00:10 - 00:31:02:12 so that they can then go back and talk about it, 00:31:02:12 - 00:31:03:09 how do we make it easier? 00:31:03:09 - 00:31:05:06 Which I thought was very encouraging. 00:31:05:06 - 00:31:06:09 It gave us a great insight, 00:31:06:09 - 00:31:07:06 and it let us know, too, 00:31:07:06 - 00:31:09:00 that there's people behind the FDA 00:31:09:00 - 00:31:10:11 and they're very human. 00:31:10:11 - 00:31:12:09 Most of them there to help. 00:31:12:09 - 00:31:14:04 Yeah, I hadn't heard of the preceptorship, 00:31:14:04 - 00:31:14:23 but that makes sense. 00:31:14:23 - 00:31:17:03 You kind of want this sort of unofficial meeting 00:31:18:01 - 00:31:19:17 with the regulatory body that’s 00:31:19:17 - 00:31:21:20 kind of off the books, maybe 00:31:21:20 - 00:31:22:11 so that you can 00:31:22:11 - 00:31:23:15 you make sure your plan is sound 00:31:23:15 - 00:31:25:12 before you go back in there formally. 00:31:25:12 - 00:31:27:05 Another question for you, Jesse. 00:31:27:05 - 00:31:30:23 So what, you know, being an entrepreneur, 00:31:30:23 - 00:31:32:08 like if you were to go back 00:31:32:08 - 00:31:36:12 and start this again, 00:31:36:12 - 00:31:39:02 what do you think you would do differently. 00:31:39:02 - 00:31:40:06 Man, 00:31:40:06 - 00:31:42:14 so many things just went through my head. 00:31:42:14 - 00:31:45:09 You know, I heard a prior, 00:31:45:09 - 00:31:47:03 from one of our first investors 00:31:47:03 - 00:31:50:05 and it still holds true, hire slow, fire fast. 00:31:50:20 - 00:31:52:09 Our success is really determined 00:31:52:09 - 00:31:53:16 by the caliber of people 00:31:53:16 - 00:31:55:00 we've been able to bring on board. 00:31:55:00 - 00:31:56:07 And we've been successful 00:31:56:07 - 00:31:58:12 because we brought amazing people on board. 00:31:59:11 - 00:32:01:07 And there's still been a couple of instances 00:32:01:07 - 00:32:04:15 where we took too long to bring someone on, 00:32:04:15 - 00:32:06:10 but I had identified them 00:32:06:10 - 00:32:07:04 in several instances 00:32:07:04 - 00:32:09:05 where we didn't have the quite the right fit. 00:32:09:13 - 00:32:11:00 And I think those things lingering 00:32:11:00 - 00:32:13:01 also set us back disproportionately 00:32:13:01 - 00:32:14:16 because of the size of our company. 00:32:14:16 - 00:32:15:15 And it's very delicate 00:32:15:15 - 00:32:18:08 and to talk about on a podcast. 00:32:18:08 - 00:32:19:18 But I'll just say generally, 00:32:19:18 - 00:32:21:20 don’t be afraid to overly vet the people 00:32:21:20 - 00:32:23:19 you're bringing onto your team. 00:32:23:19 - 00:32:24:18 And don't be afraid 00:32:24:18 - 00:32:26:19 if you know it's not a good fit 00:32:26:19 - 00:32:28:16 to have that difficult conversation. 00:32:28:16 - 00:32:31:00 I call it the “are you happy” conversation? 00:32:31:00 - 00:32:33:19 Because if a person is not engaged in a startup, 00:32:34:07 - 00:32:35:20 they're not going to get engaged 00:32:35:20 - 00:32:37:18 and it's only going to linger. 00:32:37:18 - 00:32:40:08 And that can really have a significant impact 00:32:40:08 - 00:32:42:09 when your team is really stretched in bandwidth. 00:32:42:18 - 00:32:45:15 So your culture and your team is so critical 00:32:45:15 - 00:32:47:16 early on. I can't emphasize that enough. 00:32:47:16 - 00:32:50:03 Yeah, I mean, I've found just in the handful of years 00:32:50:03 - 00:32:51:07 I've really been focused on 00:32:51:07 - 00:32:52:12 building the biz dev team 00:32:52:12 - 00:32:54:11 and some of my teammates are on the line here. 00:32:54:11 - 00:32:56:01 So they're going to 00:32:56:01 - 00:32:57:05 they're going to hear this, but, 00:32:57:05 - 00:32:58:10 you know, think things evolve. 00:32:58:10 - 00:32:59:08 That's like one thing 00:32:59:08 - 00:33:00:10 when you're in the hot seat 00:33:00:10 - 00:33:01:07 and it's like 00:33:01:07 - 00:33:02:22 you need to place these bets 00:33:02:22 - 00:33:04:14 and you don't know 00:33:04:14 - 00:33:06:04 what four years is going to look like. 00:33:06:04 - 00:33:07:15 And, you know, 00:33:07:15 - 00:33:08:23 I try to look for like people 00:33:08:23 - 00:33:11:19 with leadership qualities who, you know, are, 00:33:12:12 - 00:33:14:02 you know, can can wear a lot of hats, 00:33:14:02 - 00:33:16:20 but also know how to focus and get shit done 00:33:17:08 - 00:33:19:00 when things like need to get done. 00:33:19:00 - 00:33:20:17 And and then six months later, 00:33:20:17 - 00:33:22:14 when things kind of pivot a little bit, 00:33:22:14 - 00:33:24:11 you have to kind of, change course, 00:33:24:11 - 00:33:26:01 but you're generally heading 00:33:26:01 - 00:33:27:00 in the right direction. 00:33:27:00 - 00:33:27:23 That's what I look for. 00:33:27:23 - 00:33:30:05 But I'm only running a handful of folks. 00:33:30:05 - 00:33:31:09 I'm not running a full company. 00:33:31:09 - 00:33:34:03 So I recognize the challenge where you sit, where 00:33:35:15 - 00:33:36:21 where you really need to kind 00:33:36:21 - 00:33:38:07 of build out a org chart. 00:33:38:07 - 00:33:40:09 And they're very specialized, 00:33:40:09 - 00:33:42:02 you know, roles you need to fill. 00:33:42:02 - 00:33:43:01 But to that point, 00:33:43:01 - 00:33:44:12 what I found as a father, 00:33:44:12 - 00:33:46:01 as a manager, as a director, 00:33:46:01 - 00:33:50:19 and as a CEO, that, you know, intrinsic value. 00:33:50:19 - 00:33:52:12 And well, 00:33:52:12 - 00:33:53:10 let me just say, as a father, 00:33:53:10 - 00:33:54:16 free will is a bitch, right. 00:33:54:16 - 00:33:55:08 You know, 00:33:55:08 - 00:33:58:10 making someone do something is almost impossible. 00:33:58:10 - 00:33:59:23 You need them to want to do it. 00:33:59:23 - 00:34:01:23 And so that gets back to what it makes you 00:34:01:23 - 00:34:03:13 maybe a good father is probably 00:34:03:13 - 00:34:04:20 what's going to make you a good manager 00:34:04:20 - 00:34:06:02 and maybe a good CEO, 00:34:06:02 - 00:34:08:13 because you need to hold people accountable 00:34:08:13 - 00:34:09:02 on the mission, 00:34:09:02 - 00:34:09:19 but you need to understand 00:34:09:19 - 00:34:10:16 where they're coming from 00:34:10:16 - 00:34:13:04 and make sure that they're a good fit for them. 00:34:13:04 - 00:34:14:21 And because if it's not a good fit for them, 00:34:14:21 - 00:34:15:23 you're never going to 00:34:15:23 - 00:34:17:03 the second you turn your back 00:34:17:03 - 00:34:18:07 or the second you can't, you know, 00:34:18:07 - 00:34:19:10 do a certain thing. 00:34:19:10 - 00:34:21:18 You can't expect them to do it just on their own. 00:34:22:05 - 00:34:23:09 But I'll say that, you know, that, 00:34:23:09 - 00:34:25:13 the core tenets of good management. 00:34:25:13 - 00:34:26:05 Like I said, 00:34:26:05 - 00:34:28:11 I feel like the laws of physics to me, 00:34:28:11 - 00:34:30:22 very simple and scale, 00:34:30:22 - 00:34:33:04 humble, hardworking and hungry, 00:34:33:04 - 00:34:35:07 how are people that people like to work with 00:34:35:07 - 00:34:36:17 that are hardworking and smart 00:34:36:17 - 00:34:38:07 and you've got a great team 00:34:38:07 - 00:34:39:14 once you hire them, don't lie, 00:34:39:14 - 00:34:41:06 don’t cheat, don't steal. 00:34:41:06 - 00:34:42:09 It's simple enough. 00:34:42:09 - 00:34:43:18 Those are fireable offences. 00:34:43:18 - 00:34:45:05 This shouldn't be an excuse to do this 00:34:45:05 - 00:34:46:13 if you hire the right people. 00:34:46:13 - 00:34:48:07 But then, look, you know, to your point, 00:34:48:07 - 00:34:50:05 change happens and should happen. 00:34:50:05 - 00:34:51:08 So you need to have a very 00:34:51:08 - 00:34:52:23 transparent, supportive team 00:34:52:23 - 00:34:55:11 so you can weather those things together. 00:34:55:11 - 00:34:58:01 If sales are down, it shouldn't be on 00:34:58:01 - 00:34:59:02 one person's shoulders. 00:34:59:02 - 00:35:00:12 If they're doing everything they can 00:35:00:12 - 00:35:01:19 and executing the strategy, 00:35:01:19 - 00:35:02:07 it should be, 00:35:02:07 - 00:35:05:15 how can we help this person get better resources? 00:35:05:15 - 00:35:07:07 So when it comes down to it, 00:35:07:07 - 00:35:09:17 it's, you know, humble, hardworking, hungry, 00:35:10:02 - 00:35:11:14 don't lie, don't cheat, don't steal. 00:35:11:14 - 00:35:13:15 And then after that, it's just regular, 00:35:14:00 - 00:35:15:07 predictable communication. 00:35:15:07 - 00:35:17:20 So every year, in fact, next month's, 00:35:17:20 - 00:35:19:05 when we have our meeting, 00:35:19:05 - 00:35:20:07 I get a wall calendar 00:35:20:07 - 00:35:22:01 and we put every single society meeting, 00:35:22:01 - 00:35:24:13 every conference, every executive meeting, 00:35:24:13 - 00:35:25:11 every weekly meeting, 00:35:25:11 - 00:35:26:11 every team’s meeting, 00:35:26:11 - 00:35:28:03 everything we possibly can think of 00:35:28:03 - 00:35:29:00 on one calendar. 00:35:29:00 - 00:35:30:20 So we can see it as a visualization 00:35:30:20 - 00:35:31:08 and understand 00:35:31:08 - 00:35:33:01 when our real crunch times 00:35:33:01 - 00:35:34:08 are going to be throughout the year. 00:35:34:08 - 00:35:36:01 But that also then sets the expectation 00:35:36:01 - 00:35:37:01 for the entire team 00:35:37:01 - 00:35:38:04 that then waterfalls down 00:35:38:04 - 00:35:40:04 is that we're running out a clock here. 00:35:40:13 - 00:35:42:04 And also it helps our collaborators 00:35:42:04 - 00:35:43:03 that know, you know, 00:35:43:03 - 00:35:44:02 we've already got our whole year 00:35:44:02 - 00:35:45:23 planned our budgets planning 00:35:45:23 - 00:35:47:23 now you know, two of my favorite quotes are 00:35:47:23 - 00:35:51:09 “If you fail to plan, you plan to fail.” Right. 00:35:51:09 - 00:35:53:00 Is that Eisenhower or somebody like that? 00:35:53:00 - 00:35:54:17 And then “Everybody has a plan 00:35:54:17 - 00:35:56:09 until they get punched in the face.” Right. 00:35:56:09 - 00:35:57:20 You know, we've heard these a lot of times. 00:35:57:20 - 00:35:58:22 That's Mike Tyson. 00:35:58:22 - 00:36:00:04 So these are both true. Right. 00:36:00:04 - 00:36:02:00 And so I try to remind my team, yes, 00:36:02:00 - 00:36:03:00 we're making this plan. 00:36:03:00 - 00:36:04:15 Yes, we're making a wall calendar every year. 00:36:04:15 - 00:36:06:22 And some year there might be a pandemic 00:36:06:22 - 00:36:08:00 that's completely erases it. 00:36:08:00 - 00:36:10:00 But that exercise 00:36:10:00 - 00:36:11:07 forces us to work through things 00:36:11:07 - 00:36:13:12 and sets a really comfortable environment 00:36:13:12 - 00:36:15:04 for us to openly talk 00:36:15:04 - 00:36:16:05 about the struggles 00:36:16:05 - 00:36:17:20 and obstacles in each department 00:36:17:20 - 00:36:19:08 or person's place. 00:36:19:08 - 00:36:21:13 So, you know, the communication and 00:36:22:09 - 00:36:24:01 the openness to talk about change to 00:36:24:01 - 00:36:25:11 your point is really critical. 00:36:25:11 - 00:36:29:07 Yeah, it's also helpful to have those like 00:36:30:02 - 00:36:31:15 challenging conversations 00:36:31:15 - 00:36:33:12 when things aren't going well, 00:36:33:12 - 00:36:36:04 when everyone knows like that higher level 00:36:36:04 - 00:36:37:01 like plan. 00:36:37:01 - 00:36:38:18 I feel like that's really important 00:36:38:18 - 00:36:39:06 because otherwise 00:36:39:06 - 00:36:40:22 people feel threatened or, you know, 00:36:40:22 - 00:36:42:16 they just, at least that's how I operate. 00:36:42:16 - 00:36:44:13 I want everyone to kind of know what's going on. 00:36:44:13 - 00:36:46:16 So when it's just like, okay, this one little, 00:36:46:23 - 00:36:49:00 little cog isn't working well, 00:36:49:00 - 00:36:50:10 there's a larger wheel happening. 00:36:50:10 - 00:36:51:13 This cog is important. 00:36:51:13 - 00:36:52:11 Yeah, you know, it's funny 00:36:52:11 - 00:36:54:13 you said that, because by being transparent 00:36:54:13 - 00:36:56:05 and putting the obstacles out in the open, 00:36:56:05 - 00:36:57:20 you can help people save face 00:36:57:20 - 00:36:59:19 that otherwise, it might linger. 00:36:59:19 - 00:37:01:13 And there's a funny statistic 00:37:01:13 - 00:37:03:06 I heard about driving, 00:37:03:06 - 00:37:04:03 nine times out of ten, 00:37:04:03 - 00:37:05:01 when somebody cuts you off, 00:37:05:01 - 00:37:05:23 it's for a reason 00:37:05:23 - 00:37:07:06 that they might not even see you. 00:37:07:06 - 00:37:08:19 But nine out of ten times 00:37:08:19 - 00:37:10:03 we think that person's doing it 00:37:10:03 - 00:37:11:11 because they just want to cut us off 00:37:11:11 - 00:37:12:20 and be a jerk, right? 00:37:12:20 - 00:37:13:11 So as a company, 00:37:13:11 - 00:37:14:22 we try to, you know, get ahead of that. 00:37:14:22 - 00:37:15:15 And, you know, 00:37:15:15 - 00:37:17:02 there's a bunch of humans here 00:37:17:02 - 00:37:19:00 and we really want to respect their lives, too. 00:37:19:00 - 00:37:21:12 Yeah, so one other follow up question to your comment 00:37:21:12 - 00:37:24:04 about regular predictable communication. 00:37:24:04 - 00:37:25:12 And one of the things that, 00:37:25:12 - 00:37:26:05 you know, as Key Tech 00:37:26:05 - 00:37:27:21 continues to grow, 00:37:27:21 - 00:37:29:09 we're trying to solve and I'm curious 00:37:29:09 - 00:37:31:08 how you're doing this just 00:37:31:08 - 00:37:33:14 I mean, there's like communicating the plan, 00:37:34:03 - 00:37:36:10 but then there's like all this information 00:37:36:10 - 00:37:38:06 that's coming into your organization, 00:37:38:06 - 00:37:39:16 you know, daily 00:37:39:16 - 00:37:42:13 that decisions are made, you know, all around. 00:37:43:00 - 00:37:46:13 How are you disseminating information, technical 00:37:46:13 - 00:37:48:15 information, insights from UPenn and, 00:37:49:00 - 00:37:50:18 you know, wherever else, Northwell, and, 00:37:50:18 - 00:37:51:23 all these places 00:37:51:23 - 00:37:53:16 that could affect some phone call 00:37:53:16 - 00:37:54:17 you're about to make. 00:37:54:17 - 00:37:56:02 You know, at four in the afternoon. 00:37:56:02 - 00:37:57:22 You know, that's my nightmare, is not being able 00:37:57:22 - 00:37:59:15 to keep up. The industry we're in 00:37:59:15 - 00:38:00:21 and the size of our company is 00:38:00:21 - 00:38:03:08 fairly mismatch. There's a lot happening. 00:38:03:08 - 00:38:05:07 And so I wake up every morning, you know, 00:38:05:07 - 00:38:06:07 what's happening that 00:38:06:07 - 00:38:08:09 I need to know, that our team needs to know, 00:38:08:09 - 00:38:10:20 and visa versa, that we need to communicate. 00:38:10:20 - 00:38:12:06 We try to just, you know, 00:38:12:06 - 00:38:14:07 again, overly communicate 00:38:14:07 - 00:38:16:00 on all the platforms that you see. 00:38:16:00 - 00:38:17:19 We've got a really good support 00:38:17:19 - 00:38:19:15 group of physicians that keep us informed. 00:38:19:15 - 00:38:22:15 So from texts, to reading articles, you know, 00:38:23:12 - 00:38:24:17 from Pitchbook, frankly, 00:38:24:17 - 00:38:26:10 Pitchbook is one of the best 00:38:26:10 - 00:38:28:12 applications that we pay for as a company. 00:38:28:12 - 00:38:29:12 It's an investor tool, 00:38:29:12 - 00:38:30:19 but it gives you a really good insight 00:38:30:19 - 00:38:31:19 into the private markets. 00:38:31:19 - 00:38:32:10 So every morning 00:38:32:10 - 00:38:34:01 I start off looking at Pitchbook. 00:38:34:01 - 00:38:35:14 What are you looking for in Pitchbook? 00:38:35:14 - 00:38:38:15 I monitor two groups, I monitor the investors, 00:38:38:15 - 00:38:40:05 in the neurosurgical 00:38:40:05 - 00:38:41:15 who's investing in neuro tech. 00:38:41:15 - 00:38:43:16 And I'm also monitoring those companies and 00:38:43:16 - 00:38:45:20 and what they're doing so you know 00:38:46:19 - 00:38:48:18 who's got recent FDA clearances, 00:38:48:18 - 00:38:50:01 who's buying who, 00:38:50:01 - 00:38:52:12 who's moving internationally, 00:38:52:12 - 00:38:55:12 what research programs have just been launched, 00:38:56:09 - 00:38:57:07 who got fired? 00:38:57:07 - 00:38:59:04 You know, it's informative. 00:38:59:04 - 00:39:00:17 So not to put a plug for Pitchbook, 00:39:00:17 - 00:39:02:21 but I find a valuable, certainly for raises too. 00:39:02:21 - 00:39:03:11 It's not cheap. 00:39:03:11 - 00:39:04:06 Or for a young company 00:39:04:06 - 00:39:07:05 going through rounds of funding, 00:39:07:19 - 00:39:08:23 you kind of have a leg up 00:39:08:23 - 00:39:10:08 as opposed to companies that don't. 00:39:10:08 - 00:39:11:13 It's the tool that we found 00:39:11:13 - 00:39:13:09 most of the VCs are using anyways. 00:39:13:09 - 00:39:15:05 So the state of Maryland 00:39:15:05 - 00:39:16:14 so you mentioned that you're on this 00:39:16:14 - 00:39:17:21 life sciences. 00:39:17:21 - 00:39:19:11 Is it the Life Sciences Advisory Board, 00:39:19:11 - 00:39:20:06 is that right? 00:39:20:06 - 00:39:21:12 That is right. 00:39:21:12 - 00:39:23:20 Can you talk a little bit about what that is 00:39:23:20 - 00:39:25:21 and what some of those initiatives are, 00:39:25:21 - 00:39:27:19 and how you're partaking in that? 00:39:27:19 - 00:39:29:18 Yeah, it's a great group, 00:39:29:18 - 00:39:31:17 as you know, through its name. 00:39:31:17 - 00:39:34:15 It's trying to foster, both the economies 00:39:34:15 - 00:39:35:22 and the technical skill 00:39:35:22 - 00:39:37:17 sets of our local community 00:39:37:17 - 00:39:39:05 in the areas of health care. 00:39:39:05 - 00:39:42:01 So Maryland is health care rich 00:39:42:01 - 00:39:44:10 from literally having a NIH and the FDA 00:39:44:10 - 00:39:45:09 government facilities 00:39:45:09 - 00:39:49:01 Walter Reed in that state or adjacent to the, 00:39:49:09 - 00:39:49:17 you know, 00:39:49:17 - 00:39:51:05 the first academic teaching 00:39:51:05 - 00:39:52:14 hospital in the country, 00:39:52:14 - 00:39:54:07 Johns Hopkins, to, 00:39:54:07 - 00:39:55:14 you know, other great facilities 00:39:55:14 - 00:39:56:18 like the University of Maryland. 00:39:56:18 - 00:39:58:12 So it’s a fantastic state 00:39:58:12 - 00:40:00:17 and a great fishbowl for its size 00:40:00:22 - 00:40:02:14 and frankly, proximity. 00:40:02:14 - 00:40:03:21 We've really benefited from it 00:40:03:21 - 00:40:05:05 as a company at Longeviti, 00:40:05:05 - 00:40:06:00 which was why 00:40:06:00 - 00:40:08:00 I was really turned on to this ecosystem. 00:40:08:00 - 00:40:09:09 I wanted to learn more, 00:40:09:09 - 00:40:11:01 and the Department of Commerce had this program, 00:40:11:01 - 00:40:12:07 which was fantastic. 00:40:12:07 - 00:40:14:22 So, you know, we meet quarterly 00:40:14:22 - 00:40:16:06 and there's several initiatives. 00:40:16:06 - 00:40:18:14 You know, interestingly, coming out of COVID, 00:40:18:14 - 00:40:19:17 a lot of it was out of whack. 00:40:19:17 - 00:40:21:22 But mostly it's around job creation. 00:40:21:22 - 00:40:25:10 It's around tapping into the generational education 00:40:25:10 - 00:40:26:15 that we have here. 00:40:26:15 - 00:40:28:15 How can we take kids from Baltimore City, 00:40:28:15 - 00:40:30:02 plug them into the communities 00:40:30:02 - 00:40:31:09 and really teach them trades 00:40:31:09 - 00:40:32:17 that are relevant locally 00:40:32:17 - 00:40:33:16 with all the health care 00:40:33:16 - 00:40:35:05 that's going on, from the hospitals to 00:40:35:05 - 00:40:36:09 the industry to government. 00:40:37:08 - 00:40:39:11 And there's various programs from tax incentives. 00:40:39:11 - 00:40:40:17 One is which is fantastic 00:40:40:17 - 00:40:42:10 is the Bitsy, actually I, 00:40:42:10 - 00:40:43:08 I got a bite my lip, 00:40:43:08 - 00:40:45:12 I think we're still doing the Bitsy. 00:40:45:12 - 00:40:47:05 But it's been a great tax incentive 00:40:47:05 - 00:40:48:09 that we benefited from, 00:40:48:09 - 00:40:50:00 which essentially gives investors 00:40:50:00 - 00:40:52:09 who invest in Maryland based companies 00:40:52:09 - 00:40:53:16 half of their investment back. 00:40:53:16 - 00:40:55:17 So look into that if you haven’t 00:40:55:17 - 00:40:57:20 whoever's listening. Yeah. 00:40:57:20 - 00:41:00:15 And so again from proximity to just welcome this 00:41:00:15 - 00:41:02:15 we like to state that the board 00:41:02:15 - 00:41:04:22 the Life Science Advisory Board is well run. 00:41:04:22 - 00:41:05:17 You've got 00:41:05:21 - 00:41:07:22 individuals that are executives from, you know, 00:41:07:22 - 00:41:10:21 Fortune 100 companies to startups like myself 00:41:10:21 - 00:41:12:18 and non-executives, frankly. 00:41:12:18 - 00:41:14:10 So it's a really good mix of people 00:41:14:10 - 00:41:16:03 that are volunteering their time 00:41:16:03 - 00:41:17:00 because they care. 00:41:17:00 - 00:41:19:10 The projects are fairly robust too, 00:41:19:10 - 00:41:21:20 good analysis and workshops 00:41:21:20 - 00:41:24:11 on understanding our local landscape. 00:41:24:11 - 00:41:26:14 How many bio jobs do we have 00:41:26:14 - 00:41:27:16 and why aren't we hiring them? 00:41:27:16 - 00:41:29:14 Oh well, it's because nobody knows that 00:41:29:14 - 00:41:31:05 they're actually trained in bio skills, 00:41:31:05 - 00:41:33:10 like let's teach them what that means. 00:41:33:10 - 00:41:33:22 It’s the same thing 00:41:33:22 - 00:41:36:03 as automotive industry a lot of time 00:41:36:03 - 00:41:38:11 so let's let's talk about that 00:41:38:11 - 00:41:39:23 so you know those types of conversations 00:41:39:23 - 00:41:43:04 really uncover through our, 00:41:43:04 - 00:41:44:14 you know, our own anecdotes 00:41:44:14 - 00:41:45:16 what we might as a team 00:41:45:16 - 00:41:46:22 do to help the state. 00:41:46:22 - 00:41:50:08 Yeah, we don't have much exposure to more of the, 00:41:50:14 - 00:41:53:14 I guess the bureaucratic is not the right word 00:41:53:14 - 00:41:55:15 but you know, like the life science, 00:41:56:10 - 00:41:57:15 the advisory board type of things. 00:41:57:15 - 00:41:58:14 I mean, certainly we, 00:41:58:14 - 00:41:59:09 you know, TEDCO, 00:41:59:09 - 00:42:01:18 and you know, we're obviously active in Maryland. 00:42:01:18 - 00:42:03:13 So, I need to read up on it 00:42:03:13 - 00:42:04:14 to see if there are some events 00:42:04:14 - 00:42:05:13 we should consider. 00:42:05:13 - 00:42:08:12 I would say that they're very eager 00:42:08:12 - 00:42:09:14 and there's some great programs. 00:42:09:14 - 00:42:11:06 And being Maryland based 00:42:11:06 - 00:42:13:01 not to get to Maryland focused on your podcast. 00:42:13:01 - 00:42:14:15 But you know like every state, 00:42:14:15 - 00:42:15:17 we would all benefit 00:42:15:17 - 00:42:18:01 if these groups could get together quicker. 00:42:18:10 - 00:42:20:16 It's all too often, 00:42:20:16 - 00:42:21:23 I've found out myself 00:42:21:23 - 00:42:23:03 there's a group working on something 00:42:23:03 - 00:42:25:07 we totally were synergistic for 00:42:25:07 - 00:42:27:05 but didn't meet for three years after that. 00:42:27:05 - 00:42:29:09 How can we speed up these introductions? 00:42:29:09 - 00:42:30:02 So in Maryland, 00:42:30:02 - 00:42:32:12 you know, I hope that they're able to do that. 00:42:32:12 - 00:42:33:09 And I encourage everyone 00:42:33:09 - 00:42:35:04 to kind of continue 00:42:35:04 - 00:42:37:03 their engagement with the Maryland Life 00:42:37:03 - 00:42:38:07 Science Advisory Board, if they could. 00:42:38:07 - 00:42:40:01 I mean, you guys came came out of nowhere. 00:42:40:01 - 00:42:42:04 And I feel like that's a common, 00:42:42:04 - 00:42:44:05 common theme, which is, you know, 00:42:44:05 - 00:42:45:05 I feel like every year, 00:42:45:05 - 00:42:47:07 every six months, you're starting to see, 00:42:48:21 - 00:42:53:07 acquisitions and large investment sums 00:42:53:07 - 00:42:55:20 going to these companies that are in our ecosystem. 00:42:55:20 - 00:42:58:01 So it's great to see. 00:42:58:17 - 00:42:59:19 Going back to the marathon, it's 00:42:59:19 - 00:43:00:14 definitely a marathon 00:43:00:14 - 00:43:01:18 and you know, we're nowhere 00:43:01:18 - 00:43:02:22 near some of those other hotbeds. 00:43:02:22 - 00:43:05:14 But appreciate your work there, Jesse. 00:43:05:14 - 00:43:07:06 Yeah, indeed. It's a great team. 00:43:07:06 - 00:43:09:17 So, you know, I think we're about out of time. 00:43:09:17 - 00:43:10:01 You know, 00:43:10:01 - 00:43:10:20 I really appreciate you 00:43:10:20 - 00:43:14:04 coming on, Jesse, and sharing your story 00:43:14:15 - 00:43:16:14 and, you know, some of the challenges 00:43:16:14 - 00:43:17:15 you've had to overcome 00:43:17:15 - 00:43:20:21 and whether it's hiring or focus. 00:43:20:21 - 00:43:22:03 And I really appreciate 00:43:22:03 - 00:43:23:12 so some of those takeaways. 00:43:23:12 - 00:43:26:03 I'm just going to kind of share my highlights 00:43:26:03 - 00:43:27:14 while you're on the line. 00:43:27:14 - 00:43:29:20 One thing that really jumped out at me, the, 00:43:31:02 - 00:43:33:06 physician advocacy 00:43:33:06 - 00:43:35:09 on this podcast, we're always talking about 00:43:35:09 - 00:43:37:23 talk to the user, talk to the, you know, 00:43:38:07 - 00:43:40:03 just focus on the end user. 00:43:40:03 - 00:43:42:02 I don't think I've ever mentioned 00:43:42:02 - 00:43:43:03 the word patient. 00:43:43:03 - 00:43:45:14 And I think that I mean, sometimes the patient 00:43:45:14 - 00:43:48:01 is the end user for sort of home devices, but. 00:43:48:01 - 00:43:49:18 That's how we consider it. 00:43:49:18 - 00:43:51:10 Yeah, you're definitely a sales guy 00:43:51:10 - 00:43:53:13 and you got to keep the patient happy. 00:43:53:13 - 00:43:53:22 But 00:43:54:18 - 00:43:56:04 I thought that was really, really insightful 00:43:56:04 - 00:43:56:22 and definitely something I'm 00:43:56:22 - 00:43:57:15 going to, you know, 00:43:57:15 - 00:44:00:06 start falling into my vernacular more 00:44:00:06 - 00:44:01:11 and just talk about the patient 00:44:01:11 - 00:44:03:19 and the physician at the same time. 00:44:04:13 - 00:44:06:16 The other the other takeaway, I think, was 00:44:07:13 - 00:44:10:11 just this this whole window into a whole universe 00:44:10:11 - 00:44:11:08 that you're opening up 00:44:11:08 - 00:44:14:14 with diagnostics of the brain and time is tissue. 00:44:14:14 - 00:44:16:14 And there's there's got to be countless 00:44:16:14 - 00:44:18:18 different sort of initiatives you could pursue 00:44:19:08 - 00:44:19:23 kind of a fan 00:44:19:23 - 00:44:20:19 just kind of seeing where 00:44:20:19 - 00:44:22:01 that where that ends up for you. 00:44:22:01 - 00:44:23:19 And hopefully you can get some, 00:44:25:00 - 00:44:26:15 you know, some big partnerships 00:44:26:15 - 00:44:28:15 with either global pharma 00:44:28:15 - 00:44:29:20 or some of these universities 00:44:29:20 - 00:44:31:01 to really accelerate some of that 00:44:31:01 - 00:44:33:16 because people are struggling. 00:44:33:16 - 00:44:36:14 I mean, like people are getting older and, 00:44:36:14 - 00:44:40:00 there's definitely a need for better diagnostics 00:44:41:04 - 00:44:44:00 and not just like saving the hour 00:44:44:00 - 00:44:46:11 to wheel someone to an MRI or CT, 00:44:46:11 - 00:44:48:22 but like getting it faster and I’m sure ultrasound, 00:44:49:04 - 00:44:50:07 I don't know the details 00:44:50:07 - 00:44:53:14 of the resolution and specificity of ultrasound 00:44:53:14 - 00:44:55:09 versus MR and CT, 00:44:55:09 - 00:44:56:15 but, you know, all that, 00:44:56:15 - 00:44:58:21 I'm sure is, is heading in the right direction. 00:44:59:11 - 00:45:01:00 Well, thanks. It is exciting. Yeah. 00:45:01:00 - 00:45:03:07 Yeah, the preceptor thing 00:45:03:07 - 00:45:05:16 also I hadn't heard about so definitely going to, 00:45:06:01 - 00:45:07:16 you know, throw that out to, you know, 00:45:07:16 - 00:45:10:00 the startup companies that me 00:45:10:00 - 00:45:11:19 and other people of Key Tech are, 00:45:11:19 - 00:45:12:23 you know, interfacing with. 00:45:12:23 - 00:45:15:12 And then also some of your insights about, 00:45:16:07 - 00:45:19:08 you know, like leadership and communication and, 00:45:20:07 - 00:45:21:11 you know, just consistency 00:45:21:11 - 00:45:23:07 was the word that kind of jumped out at me. 00:45:23:07 - 00:45:27:15 Jesse of, you know, there's no excuses 00:45:27:15 - 00:45:30:06 if you have to report out ahead of, 00:45:30:06 - 00:45:32:19 stay ahead of that bad news or or good news. 00:45:32:19 - 00:45:34:18 So again, I appreciate your your insights. 00:45:34:18 - 00:45:35:10 This is not 00:45:35:10 - 00:45:37:06 intended to be sort of like a TED talk 00:45:37:06 - 00:45:38:18 or anything like that, but 00:45:38:18 - 00:45:40:13 we're trying to like, you know, 00:45:40:13 - 00:45:41:15 bring it full circle here 00:45:41:15 - 00:45:42:17 at the end of these episodes. 00:45:42:17 - 00:45:44:12 And I feel like your episode 00:45:44:12 - 00:45:45:05 at a most kind of 00:45:45:05 - 00:45:47:15 had a lot of like good insights I think 00:45:48:18 - 00:45:50:13 for people trying to do what you're doing. 00:45:50:13 - 00:45:52:08 And I appreciate the summary too 00:45:52:08 - 00:45:55:00 because I do think my personal experience 00:45:55:00 - 00:45:56:14 has been well rounded. 00:45:56:14 - 00:45:57:21 I don't want anybody who, 00:45:57:21 - 00:46:00:09 you know, reads about us to think that I 00:46:00:15 - 00:46:02:22 or any founder should be doing it all. 00:46:02:22 - 00:46:04:05 It's quite the opposite. 00:46:04:05 - 00:46:06:04 So, you know, hopefully that came through. 00:46:06:04 - 00:46:07:08 There are some very, 00:46:07:08 - 00:46:08:01 you know, 00:46:08:01 - 00:46:09:16 laws of physics type of management 00:46:09:16 - 00:46:10:14 that can apply to everything. 00:46:10:14 - 00:46:11:05 But outside of that, 00:46:11:05 - 00:46:12:18 you really need some great people around you. 00:46:12:18 - 00:46:13:23 Which you know. 00:46:13:23 - 00:46:15:06 Well, again, thanks for your time, Jesse. 00:46:15:06 - 00:46:16:00 Appreciate it. 00:46:16:00 - 00:46:17:00 Thanks Andy.