Richard Smith is live in studio for an entire hour on a jam packed Monday afternoon.
Smitie, Happy Monday, sir.
How are you? I'm doing great. How are you doing? I'm good.
There's so many things that I wanted to talk to you about. Let's start with a quick like JJ Spawn, Oh my gosh moment, because you and I are both golf fans, and it's interesting watching the best players in the world just have no answers for the problems that a coat of course like Oakmont presents. You know, the best, the best players in the world. Some of them missed the cut, most all of them fell apart, and JJ Teeter two bogeying five of six and I wrote him off.
I'm like, okay, he he's not ready for this moment. Sam Burns probably feels hard done because of the ruling. I mean, water was everywhere, Adam Scott falls apart, and after the weather break, JJ Spawn rolls back into the thing and wins it with a sixty footer on eighteen. I mean, a life changing moment. It's my favorite thing about watching sports like that. Dude's life just changed right there. How did you digest that moment?
It's the whole thing spens about a live theater, you know, like you go to a Broadway show and you sit down and there's been reviews of the show, and you're going there because you're excited to see it, and you're gonna be there for three hours, and you know what you're gonna get in terms of entertainment, and you know how how the play ends, right, the guy gets the girl and everybody's happy at the end or whatever. You
know it's coming. But in sports, and you know, in these kinds of moments, you have no idea what is coming next. And for those guys to be put in the position of the weather, the rain, the wind, you know, Spawn goes out five bogeies in the first six holes. Okay, well, you know it's just those are the conditions, and you got to hit the ball in the fairway. You can't get it out of the fairway, and if you do, then you know everybody's in the same boat. And he
just held on and you know, grind and grind. And then in thirteen and fourteen, there's like five guys all tied for the lead and three other guys one shot back, and so all these guys on the leaderboard had a legitimate chance, with four or five holes to play, to come out and grab it. Who's gonna grab it?
You know?
The one Masters I was fortunate enough to go to Spens in twenty eleven. It was the same sat a beautiful day, night's weather on that particular day, but it was the same scenario on the leader board. Everybody had a legitimate chance to come up and grab it. And
who does it? Of all people? Charles Schwartzel, who wins his one Masters in twenty eleven, comes down the back nine and goes birdie, Birdie, birdie on sixteen seventeen eighteen and just runs by everybody, like in a horse race analogy in the last you know, fifty yards, runs right by everybody and ends up winning by half a length,
you know whatever. And so jj Spawn is a grinder, thirty four year old guy, you know, a journeyman guy who's had some success, but one of those guys who's really playing from year to year to just keep his tour card. And he's able to grind something out on a special Sunday afternoon for him, and then to do it with that that putt that he didn't need.
The putt obviously he had to. He just had the two putt to win it.
But for that thing to go in like it did, for him to win and clinch it right at that moment on the last stroke you take of a major, that's that's your defining moment. That's what you're gonna have to carry with you the rest of your life, which which is a great.
Feeling, legendary. I mean, it was really and I don't know, I didn't know much about JJ. I'd seen his name near the top of the leader boards, he has one on the tour before, and he's been right in the mix. Do you think we've seen the birth of a star on tour? I mean, he's got to be getting consideration for the Ryder Cup now, doesn't he.
Yeah.
I mean he's he's uh, you know, he's in to me, Spence is in a mix with there's a whole bunch of guys that are like him. Okay, not to diminish what he did, and not the diminish him as a play He's a he's a regular, a tour player, but he he has been a grinded out kind of guy and he has been, you know, from year to year, really has been playing to get in a mix every now and then, but mostly to have enough success to be in the one twenty five so he can keep
his tour card and keep going the next year. Right, And so now he's thirty four years old. He gets on top of this mountain at the moment, and he should be feeling really good.
About it, you know.
But there are a lot of those guys, whether it's Gary Woodland who did it several years ago, you know in LA You know guys who come up and they win there one Charles Schwartz I just mentioned in twenty eleven. You know Mike Weir, who's a long time pro, who's one of our favorites from from the local area. You know, who won the Masters, you know when his one major.
You know, these guys who are who are great, excellent golfers on the PGA Tour, but there's always something that separates them from the real top guys.
And it's such a fine line.
And you played seventy two holes and like we saw this this past weekend, and you played in the in the all kinds of weather conditions, and the thing that separates you from the next guy is a sixty five foot pot is it, or or as one missed fairway where you had to hack it out just another thirty yards to get back and play, and that costs you an extra stroke and now you lose the tournament.
By one or two or whatever.
You know, It's just it's just that's how thin that line is over a four day period with the top golfers in the world. That's that's what makes it so daunting. But that's also what makes it so exhilarating as a fan to watch that live theater.
Yeah, I thought I thought it was awesome. I was captivated.
All right, Smitty, let's start here and then we'll kind of move it into a direction and involve our local basketball team, the Utah Jazz. H.
So there's a method of the madness stick with us.
So kind of us shocking trade, kind of a trade that nobody saw coming. It was announced yesterday and made official that the Memphis Grizzlies traded Desmond Bane to the Orlando Magic for Contavious called Well Pope call Anthony for unprotected first round picks and one first round pick swap. Okay, So let's start with what that says to you of the mentality of the Memphis Grizzlies.
Why does Memphis do this deal? Well, I think probably what.
They're looking at is is that they're trying to a get off some money, okay, trying to manage their their books a little bit. B They look at what they've got going and they see, Okay, we're in the middle of the mix, but we don't really have anything that's going to jet propulse us, you know above and you know, to get in the top three or four teams that you know, if everybody's healthy in the league, which you
never can count on. And so we're making a calculated guestimate that that it's gonna be better for us as long as we can get Morant and Jackson on the floor. And we have two guys, okay, all right, we're giving up our third guy. All right, maybe we can find another third guy somehow, Like they found Bain, who was
an early second round pick. And we're talking all all spring Spence about the draft and missing out on the top pick and having the fifth pick, and you know, what are we doing when I can get a guy and whatever? You know, Desmond Baine, it was an early second round pick, you know, by Memphis and were always talking about you can find guys, but that's what your
job is. When you're in that position. You have to go identify them, you have to evaluate them, and then you have to figure out a way to procure them. And uh, you know, Memphis is looking at it, I think probably in saying, well, you know, if we we can keep on Morant and Jackson for the next several years, then we have to just find another third guy and maybe we can get in another trade, or maybe maybe Cacp. I don't think he's that guy, but I think he's
a good rotation guy now in his career. But maybe we find another young guy that we like to get in the mix, or maybe we get lucky in the draft, or maybe there's a guy we see in the draft that nobody else is seeing and we got him in our back pocket. So we're gonna go ahead and make this move because we think we can get.
That guy, you know.
And again, who that would be, I don't know, but you know, that's that's one possible scenarios. They've identified a guy they like that they're they're hearing around the league nobody else is even talking about. And you know, so if they can get another Bane like they did at thirty one, thirty two, whatever it was several years ago, and.
Uh, and do something like that.
Then you know, then they're they're feeling like they're they're getting their books down, but they're also giving themselves some more flexibility going forward to build that roster out and try and be competitive as long as Morant and Jackson are there to help them.
So I'm glad you brought that up. One more thing, and then we're gonna bring the jazz angle into this. I've heard and read several people's surmise Memphis is open for business, this is a yard sale.
I don't read it that way.
Jaws under contract through twenty eight, and you know, it's actually kind of a reasonable deal for who he is when his mind is right.
And I don't know what sort of market there would be for him.
I would say, prior to all the gun chaos and off court bs, there was probably a robust market for a talent like that at his age. I don't know what sort of calls they would receive if it was out there that he's available. Jaron Jackson Junior is up for a contract extension. He's going to get paid. I believe he's up for the Supermax because he won Defensive Player of the Year. Right, So look, if they put Jared Jackson Junior on the table, I think they get
a lot of phone calls. I don't know that they get a ton for JA right now, But I don't know that. I read this as Memphis is now open for business and everyone's available.
What's your take on that?
Yeah, well it could be you know, maybe there maybe they're going to take a page out of the Utai Jazz book and just trade all their guys and start over. Because they're looking at the g and landscape from thirty thousand feet and saying, well, let's see, okay, see the youngest team in the league, and they're they're about to maybe win a championship, and San Antonio is about to get a guy another guy, and they're all all of a sudden going to make a big leap, and they're
young guys. And then and then we've got the Denver is still sitting there in the in the weeds. And then we get you know, Golden States, or they just got Butler with you know, we got Dallas just and they're looking and going, well, where are we going? We can't get anywhere we're gonna get so yeah. So so maybe they're looking at what the Jazz did a few years ago and saying, hey, maybe while our guys are you know, good and highly thought of, and we can get something for him.
You know, maybe we do that thing because I don't know where we're going.
You know, we with our group that we got, now, we like them, we think they're competitive, but these other guys are a step or two or three ahead of us. So we can grind and play hard and have everybody healthy and all that and end up you know in six seven eight, and so where are we going?
You know. So there's that scenario because.
You have to always marry that idea spends the basketball stuff, roster building with your financial and the business part of it. And sometimes you have to look at and say, spending this amount of money on this group for the expected end result just doesn't make any sense. And so you know, we're better off re calibrating a step or two and trying, you know, maybe to reinvent ourselves on the fly. I could see somebody saying, yeah, that's behind the closed doors, that's what they're trying to do.
You know, I don't know, and I would also throw.
In the wrinkle that that I would guess that if that's a scenario, that there's some weight on the idea that you know, they've they've grown tired of the jahn morant, you know, soap opera, and no matter how talented he is, you know that it's just not worth you know, all the heavy lifting it takes on the rest of the organization, you know, to try and keep the ship going forward. And so maybe it's just time to cut bait and figure out what our plan B is.
So one more follow up.
Then we're going to bring the jazz into this, because there's an interesting jazz portion concerning job.
And I can remember when.
And this isn't a fair parallel, a perfect parallel, but you'll understand where I'm going. When so news comes out and this was before social media, it was before twenty four to seven, inundation of information that Lachreal Spreewell had choked his coach, right, and it's like.
Okay, what exactly what does that look?
Because he was such a great talent, came out of Alabama, nobody really knew what sort of NBA player he would be. Golden State kind of rises up to be this real exciting, great defensive wing. They could get up and down finish on there. But he's never a great shooter. But he was a really good player. And then the thing comes out about Carlssimo and it's like, Okay, what's the deal. The Knicks at the time had an aging roster and they were trying to make sure Ewing's final years in
New York were supported with a good team. And I can remember when the opportunity came down for the next to trade for Latrell spree Well, and part of the package was going to be John Starks, who was like the heart of that team in the nineties, and there was a real debate, internal debate, and my dad flew Spree out and he sat down with Jeff Ernie Grunfeld was the one that was kind of like somewhat against this,
and you get it right now. Jeff was all for it because coaches want to win, and he knew he could coach, and he knew he was awesome. So with a talent like job, I suppose there's a market for it. But let's say you're running a team and Memphis calls and they say, what about jaw you? What do you say, how does that process go down? And if Jaw would be available, do you think the market would be robust enough to get what you should for a talent like that.
Well, so as as in any you know shoppers market spence, it only takes one one guy. So it only takes one general manager or one coach who has a lot of sway with the organization, you know, to say hey, I want I want that guy, or I can work with that guy, or you know the the you know, other people are afraid of him or or don't know how to handle him.
I know how to do it, you know, whatever, whatever it's going to be.
Or you have a GM who feels like he's too talented and he you know, you have to get him if you can, and then it's up to the coach.
To to figure out how to work with him.
And you know, and you have those conversations before you do anything like that, because you want to make sure
that that everybody's on board. You know, we we had a scenario I won't mention names, but we we had a scenario years and years ago with the Jazz where we were looking at adding a player through free agency who we thought would be a good piece to what are our core was still going on with stocking them alone, and one of our guys went out and made a bunch of phone calls and talked to people who knew
were on the league or whatever. Comes back to a meeting and says, yeah, yeah, I did a bunch of homework on that guy.
Yeah, what do you think?
Well, well, I was oh for seven and we're sitting around the table going, oh for seven, what does that mean? Well, I talked to seven guys and none of them can support the idea of us bringing that guy in for whatever the varying reasons. So everybody had a different view, a different touch, a different experience. And then he said, however, having said that, I still think we need to bring him in because I think.
He can help us.
And so there was a lot of debate about that and a lot of discussion about well, what are we doing and how is it going.
To affect our overall group.
And you know, at that time, we had you know, two heavyweight guys and stocked in them alone, who we felt, you know, could along with obviously with coach Sloan uh, you know, could could deal with whatever the deal the fallout was going to be or the or the the tough parts are going to be and so you know, eventually that decision was made to go forward, but it was, but there's a lot of discussion around you know, when you're adding someone like that into a mix that you
have to really be uh, be confident that your group, whether it's the coach, whether it's a couple of assistant coaches on your staff who know the guy, or knew the guy in college, or I had prior experience with him on another team, you know, whatever it could be, that your group will be able to handle it in a way that's professional, that is going to get you the desired results that you're after, you know, in that kind of move And and with with those kinds of things, Spence,
there's a there's always a lot of moving parts and there are a lot of things you have to consider before you really decide to pull the trigger on something that's going to really have a big effect, maybe one way, maybe the other way, on how your group performs.
Well said, let's move over to the jazz.
And you know, it's interesting to consider exactly what the Memphis deal says on a number of different levels. And I bring that up because I didn't know Desmond Bane was available, right, So I bring that up because there are always players that are available that are really good that the public just doesn't know about.
But you knew Doncis was available. No, you knew that.
Another good example, right, Like that's why this league is wild. You wake up and you're like, wait, they traded who?
Right?
So maybe there's the reason I bring it up in that context is Brian Winhorst goes on TV and references that he's been told the Jazz are going to try to level it up, whatever that means, right, So like, I don't see that path, but I want to be fair. Maybe there are things out there that we have no
idea about. So if that's the mentality of the Jazz, now, if they're like, Okay, we're gonna do the thing, we're gonna take this off season, we're gonna add some pieces, and we're gonna be right in the mix next year, what does that look like? I don't know that I see it, And we'll get to the other path in
a moment. And the other path is I just talked about with Tom Aberstrow engaging with the San Antonio Spurs or a team that's ahead of them, if they've identified the player they like to go, move up in the draft to get a young player they can grow with their other young players. That seems more sensible to me. But when Horses plugged in, he's an NBA reporter that
people seem to trust. So if the Jazz are serious about adding to the group this year to take legitimate steps up next year, what do you think that looks like?
Well, I mean again, Spence, there are a lot of different options and a lot of different ways they can go. And you know, as the old saying goes, it takes
two to tango. So you can have an idea and you can say, this is what we want to do, and we can lay out a plan, and we want to add this kind of a guy, and we want to add that kind of a player, and we can shore up a couple of things on the wings with a couple of long defensive guys, because we're one of the worst defensive teams in the league the last several years,
and so we've got to start addressing that stuff. So, you know, if you're looking at building a foundation and trying to get better incrementally better, you know you have to do it you know the old adage brick by brick. So you know, if you need to lay a whole foundation, you know, you may do it just one piece at a time and just keep waiting and waiting and waiting, or you can try and add three or four or five at one time. But it's going to take you know,
you have to pay something for that. You just don't get that stuff for free. And so you're gonna have to give up players or draft picks or you know what have you to be able to do something like that. But does it make sense in what your overall objective and your long range game plan is like? For example, I heard you mentioned in the earlier segment with Tom about you know, just a hypothetically guy like Porzincis or a guy like Drew Holliday. Okay, older guys. Porzinkus isn't
isn't old, he's he's writ in his prime. But a guy like Drew Holliday who's near toward the end of it, or if you had a chance that Kevin Durant who you know, you know, somebody like that who's still a very good player. But you know, what is it gonna take to get them? And what real impact are they gonna have on what you're trying to do, you know, going forward and being sustainable for a while. That those
are the things you have to factor in. You know, you can say all you want about you know, we're gonna we're gonna go fast and we're gonna get you know, stuff done or whatever, you know, but you know that is much harder to do, uh, to say, than this to to accomplish. And those are the things, you know, Look, Austin Inge is gonna really work hard at it. He's gonna he's gonna give it a maximum attention and effort
to trying to do those things. But but he doesn't come in with a wand you know he's he doesn't have a special potion just because he came from the vaunted Boston Celtics. You know, that doesn't that doesn't fly. You know, you come, you come with your own set of abilities and your skill set and your sensibilities to try and do what makes sense. But you know he
doesn't have any magic answers. You know, if if there was such a thing, Danny Ainge would have had them, because Danny Age had already been through those kinds of mills several times, right, So so he's gonna come in and Austin Ainge is gonna try and do what he thinks make sense, and he's gonna throw stuff against the wall and something's gonna stick and something's not, and he's gonna come across some things that that he might be able to act on, and there's gonna be something that
comes out, like you know, you're referencing Defen Dane and and we mentioned, you know, a guy like Luka Doncic, but something of that nature is gonna come around the corner and he's gonna blindside you, you know, whether it's the day before the draft or whether it's in the middle of the summer whatever where you know, like the Jazz did with Gobert and Donovan Mitchell and all of a sudden, you know, somebody's best player is on the market for whatever the reason, and the Jazz are gonna
try and and get involved in that. Are they able to do something, does it work? Who knows, you know, But those are the kinds of things they're trying to give the fans hope that we're trying these things. We're gonna try a lot of different things. So hang with us because if we can get some stuff done. It's gonna be exciting, you know, But are they gonna get
stuff done? Who knows? It's it's you know, the whole thing is a crapshoot when it comes to working with other teams and what they're after and what their their goal is is in the deal as well. You know, other teams are gonna want good players, right, so somebody's gonna want marketing, right, or somebody's gonna want a young Kessler because they can add to their group because they
think they have a chance to kind of win. Right now, the Jazz are trying to add guys who can help them to build a foundation of winning and getting better going forward, without any expectation that we're going to be the Detroit Pistons, who I know you mentioned last time, the Detroit Pistons had several.
Top five draft picks.
Okay, they were a bad team, but they kept drafting and drafting and drafting, and they had a couple guys, have a couple very good players that they got high in the draft.
But those guys have.
Been in and out the last few years, have been hurt, and this year the guys are healthy and they're playing and they added the right veterans, by the way, with big influence from Dennis Lindsay who's now with Detroit and who knows what he's doing. And you saw the leap the Pistons took to get in the playoffs, and now they're expecting to be able to take that next leap going forward in the Jazz are hoping to duplicate something like that in their work.
One more thing here, we'll catch a break, we'll do some NBA finals coming up and talk about some more potential I we'll do a little draft on the other side too. So player rankings are arbitrary, and it's eye of the beholder stuff. I get that, and every outlet does it. The ringer does it every year. Then they updated throughout the course of the season. Desmond Bane forty seven, which actually feels low to me. Lowry market in fifty three.
So that's essentially indicates that maybe they're in the same could the sack, Maybe they're in the same area as far as and look at like, what do you need. It's not like they're different players. I understand that. But if we agree to say, okay, in the ecosystem of pro basketball, these two are around top fifty guys, which again might be a little bit low. And we see what Memphis just received as a result of trading Desmond Bane.
Is it a similar type expected return if the Jazz do decided to deal lottery.
Yeah, it would be. It's always Spence. All those things are different. They are all. Everything is predicated on what you need, what you are trying to accomplish, and how much you value being able to get to the goal that you're trying to get to. For example, you know,
we talk about the donchen A d trade. You know, everybody says that Nico Harrison you know, got way too little and you know whatever and settled, you know, for thirty cents on the dollar or whatever, you know, in terms of value of what he got.
But to him hard to believe we're still talking about this, But to him it.
Was he valued getting Davis, an All NBA player and defensive player and a big who's a top level player when he's healthy, and moving out, someone who he think fit the culture of what they were trying to build in Dallas. So other teams who aren't working with Doncice every day for six years, you know, saw differently said, are you kidding me, what's going on? So everybody looks
at it through a different lens. That's why you see guys who are you know, you know, and you know, not really related, but just just comes to mind, you know how You I of the beholder in the draft with Raphael Adoujou, the player from BYU right Toronto. For whatever their reason, Okay, they valued him high enough where
they took him number eight in the draft. Okay, all of our research when we were in that draft showed us that if he didn't go eight to that one team that decided to make that pick, he would have gone in the mid to late forties. Okay, So that's how everybody else viewed it. Okay, guess what. Everybody else was pretty right, But one team saw it differently, and one team interpreted what they saw through a different lens.
And that's what makes you know, the drafts so fascinating because you can get you can get a UJO at eight, and in another year you can get Jalen Williams at eight, or another year you can get Steph Curry, who I think was seven, right yo. But the point being that you know those things, you look at it and everybody's got a different take. And that's why you don't have one guy in your room just making decisions. That's why you have a whole group of guys who are doing
it all year long. And so you're sitting there, you know, right now as we speak, ten days away from the draft, and those guys who are hammering it out and discussing and debating and throwing stuff at earth across the room at the other guy who said, you know, you want to take Spence checkets, What are you nuts?
Guy doesn't guard, but don't leave him open.
But that's that's that's what happened, and that's what's interesting to me, also, Spencer about the draft stuff. It's really fascinating to me that the Jazz ownership, Ryan Smith, right, he's a decision maker, decides to bring in a lead
decision maker three weeks before the draft. So you have a group in the room that's been working all year, and they've been working with each other, and they've been cross referencing and cross tracking guys, and they've been going to see guys and they've been discussing in November and December and January about different guys and hey, Spence, you got to go see this guy. I just saw him last week. You know, we want to put him on
our list. Okay, I'll go see it. Whatever you got all of that, you know, working together, you've got that flow, You've got that energy from the group, You've got the equity of the people in the room who have been there all year doing it. I've been listening to Spence checkets every week in our meeting about what he's been saying about this guy, or how he changed his mind two months later, and this and that, whatever it is.
And then here it is in the you know, use a baseball reference in the ninth inning, and all of a sudden, a.
New guy walks in the room.
And we're not just adding a new guy in the room to the discussion, but it's a new guy who's the guy calling the shots.
Right.
So now we have a new boss in the room three weeks before the draft. That has got to be very, very awkward for all the people involved. It's it really can can really tip the balance of the discussions of the the vibe of the room, of what people have been discussing all year. It's really interesting that they chose
to do that at that moment. They could have easily done something to add Austin as to the group in some capacity, and then in August said, hey, you know, we've discussed things and blah blah blah, and and we're gonna make Austin Ames the boss going forward or whatever.
But they do that now, And so that's that's fascinating to me because being in those rooms for a lot of years, doing something like that, you know, can be very unsettling to a group that has been working in a certain direction for for a lot of a lot of months and and putting a lot of time and effort into it, and then having someone else come in, uh proverbially at the last minute and maybe, you know, rock the.
Boat or have it.
Maybe maybe it's good, you know, maybe that's a good thing. I don't know, but but I certainly know that you know that the changes the vibe and the flow in the room. And that's going to be fascinating too when we get to see what kind of decisions the jazz Employee's.
Still amazing that Ryan was able to hire Austin without ever mentioning a word to his dad.
That's that happens all the Time's incredible. Yeah, people gett out of the loop all the time.
And Austin or said anything.
Yeah, yeah, no, for sure, you never talk about any of that when it comes to changing your life entirely. Smitty's taking a victory laughter and the break about his Red Sox beating my Yankees over the weekend. John Carlos Stanton will be activated tonight, Spinny about that?
How about that? And you know what he's being activated.
He's in New York and nobody knows about it because Otani's pitching to in LA.
You know, we probably don't talk enough about Otani, right, like in the context of really being as unique as any player has ever been to his respective sport, right, I mean, he probably deserves more airtime like everywhere, every every time I see a highlight or see a stat and don't really understand how specifically unique he is.
I'm like, we should talk about this this dude more than we do.
Yeah.
You know what's interesting, though, Spencer, you have guys that are like international players, and they and they're reticent to speak the language. And some of them can speak, you know, somewhat, and you know, but they just they're uncomfortable in front of a media and and and and the public speaking because they don't want to make a mistake and they don't want to look look foolish, and so they err on the side of not saying anything and and talking
their native language through an interpreter. And so sometimes that, you know, loses a little bit of the luster or or the attention you might get on on what you're doing, you know. But but Otani, this is this is like a generational guy, like just you know what he not only what he does, but how he handles his business every single day and goes about being a two way player. Now we're going to see how much of his arm is still there and and how he eases back into it.
He's going to open tonight, maybe pitch just the first inning. If he gets through the first inning, and maybe they'll see how he feels. And he says, yeah, I can go on through another ten pitches. So we'll let him go out in the second inning and see how that goes. And and he's him into it. But he still wants to be in the rhythm of pitching and hitting and pitching and hitting and playing all the time.
That's what he's used to doing.
That's where he gets his rhythm for being able to focus all the time, and it's it's gonna be exciting to see to see how he performs tonight, first time in almost two years.
On the mound.
Total non sequitor, random question, but it was based off of what you said last segment about Raphael Rougeo. Yes, who I can remember like scouting during that time in Washington playing and being like, well, he's bad at basketball. I know he's big and strong, but he doesn't do anything. He can't shoot, he can't dribble, he doesn't move well,
but he's just big. So stunned that he was drafted eight, I wanted to ask what was your because that had a really unique experience at the Mountain West Conference tournament when for debt was for debt when Jimmer was jimmering, and it was actually Danny Ainge who said, comes sit by me and let's watch this game.
It was when Jimmer went for like I don't know every thing.
It was forty two against Kawhi and San Diego State, and I said to Daniel said, what do you think as far as Jimmer is an NBA prospect?
He said, he said, he has no shot test, have a chance.
It's like, well, you're a BYU guy right, and he kind of walked me through his assertion as to why he didn't believe for that was an NBA player.
He was a lottery pick and BYU fans love to be.
Revisionist historians will say he wasn't used correctly by Keith Smart and then you know that hinder disagree he would have led the NBA in scoring if he landed. It's very Zach Wilson Jets. You just don't want to say out loud that he might not be very good. What was your calculation on Furdet as a pro?
Yeah, yeah, we well we thought our group, you know, really was mixed on him, mostly about whether he could be a fridge a rotational guy, or whether he just wasn't good enough to play at the NBA level. I personally always thought that he was the kind of guy, you know, who would thrive either in Europe because of
the way they play. I really thought he'd be a good player in the euro League, which is which is a top level league, or a place where he ended up which was the best thing for him in the long run, playing in China where there is no defense and where he could shoot thirty five balls a game, which he did, and he did it, and he was the star. And he was playing in Shanghai and which is like playing in New York City. So he's getting all the endorsements, and he's getting all the love from
the fans and all that kind of stuff. And he didn't have to worry about playing defense. He didn't have to worry about, you know, not being very athletic.
Uh.
And and that league is that way, and and it was a good good spot for him. Made a lot of money, got to play a lot for him.
You know.
He was you know, bounced around several NBA teams just not athletic enough, not not quite good enough, you know, to stick with the team to be able to offer something like that like we we had we had j. C. Carroll in for a workout, uh when he was coming out of Utah State of Utah state's all time leading scorer. And I remember meeting with JC and saying to him, hey, you know, you, uh, you have to have one skill you can lay on and you have to be able to do that at such a high level to just
get a foot in the door. And for him, it was going to be you know, being his catch and shoot jumper and and and it wasn't going to work out in the NBA because he's a six to two shooting guard. But he went to Europe and and got his foot in the door with Real Madrid and became a a UH main guy and a rotational guy and a key piece to several UH euro League and La
Liga championed ACB Championship teams in Madrid. And UH became a mainstay in Real Madrid for over a decade and UH, you know it was it was a very good player in Europe. And Jimmer I always thought he could have been that he had one year Pantonikos and Athens and there there a can be a top level team. I just won the euro League but last year. But they they're a team that UH where he could have a chance.
But they were they kind of have a goofy owner, you know, who gets involved in everything there and UH, and he didn't get any traction with them, and and I think smart for him he went back to UH to Shanghai and and UH where he could play his game and and and make some money and and UH
and have a good successful career that way. So you know, I don't think Jimmer was taken ten by Sacramento, and he was the perfect example spence of how the CBA is set up to work, and that is on the one end, you can have like a Gordon Hayward, who if a team drafts you and they like you, and they develop you and they want you, the team controls your career for the first seven years, and then in the back half of your career you control where you
want to go. And we saw that with Gordon Hayward when he had the free agency after the seventh year and chose to go to Boston. Jimmifer Debt was taken the first round. You get two years guaranteed money. You have a third year team option, and a fourth year team option. Sacramento took him. They had him for two years. They liked him as a player, they liked him as a guy, as a person, as a worker, all that stuff. They determined after two years he's just not an NBA guy.
So instead of continuing to have him on the roster and to pay him money and we just don't believe he can do it, We're just gonna.
Cut our losses.
So in that example, they drafted him, they go for He played for two years, he gets the guaranteed money, and then they let him go and now he's a free agent and do whatever he wants. But then the team is out of the obligation and they can move on to make other decisions. That's how the CBA is
set up to work. Oddly enough, two guys involved locally that we know very well, jimmerferd Dead on one end and Gordon Hayward on the other end, that there are prime examples of how the CBA is set up to work in the way that the teams choose to do.
All right, let's do one more Jazz thought because I didn't get to this last segment. Then we'll end with your thoughts on tonight's game five. It's a massive game. It's about two hours and twenty minutes away. You can hear it on our station. It's okay, see Indiana Game five in the NBA Finals. So we discussed the win horse stuff, where he's been told the Jazz are going to try to take steps forward and add to the group and maybe win at a higher level next year.
I'm not buying it because I just don't think it's the right approach, as I have said a million times and we'll say another million times eighth pick, top eight protected pick that goes to OKC. At this point in your journey, you have to hold on to it.
That's my opinion.
So the other avenue that Tom Haberstrow and I had spoke about out is if san Antonio is willing to move on from two and the Jazz have done their determination, that Dylan Harper, as you would say, is a guy, the guy somebody that you can say, Okay, maybe this is Arcade, Maybe this is our Bancaro, Maybe this is our Tyres, maybe this is our Maybe this is the guy that can actually be a guy that we can build around san Antonio. It's interesting, like they're not gonna.
I don't think they would trade Devin Vessel. They're obviously not trading Wembin Yama. They're obviously not trading Stefan Castle. So the framework of a deal Smithy that could work would sound like this Kelton Johnson, who there's some things I like about Kelton Johnson, Like he's still young's twenty five, doesn't shoot it all that well, he's about twelve points
five boards last year. And Harrison Barnes in exchange for lowry marketing number five, you move up to two, you bring in Johnson and Barnes just for salary matches, and you go up to two and you grab, you grab Dylan Harper. Something like that seems to make a lot more sense than like, if you add Porzingis and Holiday to this team now for nothing in return, you're still treading water. So that direction seems to make more sense to me, just generally speaking. Give me your thoughts.
Yeah, well it makes sense, Bence. If you've determined that that you know in this scenario that Dylan Harper you think he's gonna be another the next John Morant or the next Damian Lillard or the next Gilgess Alexander whatever. If you think he can be that kind of a guy and drive a team that way, then you do. If you're in the jazz seat, you do whatever you have to do to get that guy, because it doesn't matter because the other the guys you're giving up, the
assets you're giving up, what does it matter. That's why you have them. So when you have an opportunity to land on a guy that you believe can be one of your main guy's long term going forward, you do that. Now, I do remember and I don't know if it's been talked about reported on lately. You know, in that framework, way back early in the season, I remember there was some quote from his dad saying something about, yeah, yeah, my son, I don't want my son playing in Utah
or something. Yeah, he sent out something on social media. Yea, it was something like that, but okay whatever. But but you but those those are real things. So if you you know, you know, that's how Eli Manning got from instead of being San Diego, got to New York Giants because he said he's not going to play in San Diego. And that's what John Elway did you know he wasn't gonna play for for Baltimore? Are you you know?
That's how we ended up in Denver and all these kinds of things.
So if a guy is saying right out of the shoot, you know, I you know, if that's true, I don't know if it is or not.
And it wasn't him, it was his dad whatever.
And I don't know this kid and haven't been in a room with him, so I don't know how he how he interviews, what his personality is, whatever. But if those things line up, and those things match up to what you're trying to do and his talent into something that you think is really has a chance to be a special thing, especially at the point guard position. That's a guy you want to get your hands on, because,
as we just mentioned Spence A, you're resetting the salary clock. Okay, you get out of marketing his money in that scenario, you bring in Barns, you bring in somebody to get money for a year or so, and then that money goes away. But you'd have Harper for at least a minimum of seven years under control while you try and
build stuff around him. If that's something that that you're convinced about is a real thing and that you would like to hang your hat on, then those are the kinds of things that you, as a jazz have been positioning yourself to do. And now if this is something that might be presented, it might be on the table. That's the kind of thing that you know, from my perspective, you you just grab, you do that that Jim Fossil thing.
You just push all your chips in the middle of the table and you bet on that one hand and you do whatever you gotta do to make that move happen. And that that's the kind of stuff Spencer really also regenerates or reignites I should say, a fan base, right because they because they say.
Oh, you you got a guy you really like.
Oh and you're really you're really going after and you got him and you're bringing him. Okay, let's go. You know, and you know, and then and then you see it plays out how it plays out. But those are the kind of moves that you want to be in position to be able to do and and uh and if they're there, you want to really be able to to make your full commitment to pounce on it.
Man if san Antonio added Lowry marketing and let's say VJ edgecom or Trey Johnson to this group, Hello, talk about ahead of schedule. Uh so we'll see, all right, Smadi, before I set you loose. I think my favorite thing about the NBA Finals is from my prism, all four games have been really different, right, and this is a battle of two very well respected, smart coaches and two groups that have been able to come together and in
different ways been able to find success. I keep saying since January, the two best teams in the NBA are these two teams. OKAC is one and the Pacers are two. So we saw Mark Dagnall in Game four take Shay off the ball and actually give Shay more rest and Jalen was kind of initiating the offense. So if you didn't watch the game and you look at Shay's line, he said, wait, zero assists, what gives? That was part
of the design. He was not initiating. It allowed him to stay fresh and in the fourth quarter he closed. He had twelve point I think fifteen in the fourth they outscored Indiana twelve one down the stretch to get the win in Game four. We go back to Okase tonight for Game five. Obviously very pivotal. It's two two. What do you think goes now?
Yeah, well, it's a fun series to watch, and I don't count out anybody spends you know, you like okay see, I like okay see. The defense has been unbelievable all year and during the playoffs, and they can ratchet it up. But Indiana has had some special thing going on. And you can look at all the three series they had before this, and they had, as you well know, being the next Guy, special bounces of the ball and special things that happened, and the.
Next contact to you about the coaching job.
Yet by the way, just you know I I am on the bottom of the list, but they're getting very close to me. So so we will see the But but with that, you know, Indiana has had a lot of things go their way and and and a lot
of them been because of them. You know what we would we always use the word, you know, you want to make an If you make an error doing something, you want to make an error of co mission rather than an error of o mission, meaning meaning if you're going to fail as something, you want to try and and and and get something done and try and go after it. Those guys have gone to where they are
because they just keep getting after it. And even when they're down a bunch, as we've seen in several of their playoff games, they just keep grinding and going after it. They don't give up. They don't they don't wave a white flag. They keep getting after it. And they and they've shown what you can do when you play a full forty eight minutes. You know the old Yogi berral line that it ain't over till it's over. And so you know, I don't put anything by them. I'm excited
for the game tonight. It's gonna be fun, you know, for those guys to to see both teams lay it all out there and again, Spence, you just hope it doesn't hinge on somebody having an early Jason Tatum type injury or somebody getting three early fouls and two ticki Tac foul calls and now they're out of the game
for a big stretch. You just hope they can both go full bore and and go at it and then and then see like we did in the US Open yesterday, see what happens coming down the stretch in the fourth quarter.
Should be fun.
Man.
I've been wildly impressed with both these teams for different reasons. So Game five tonight comes your way about two hours from right now, six thirty Mountain time.
We'll say good night at six o'clock. Smitty, Great to see my friend.
Great to see you. And we're gonna we're gonna be a big show next week.
Right Yes, we are draft draft, how Smitty Gordy, and we will be on location for both round one and round two. Oh good, June the twenty fifth, June the twenty sixth, And when I have all the information, you will be the first to know.
I promise you that will be the first. I'll be the first to though yeah, well I don't know yet. When I know, I promise you will know.
There we go, Yeah, there we go.
We'll see you next week, okay right, The Great Y Smith