Start things off on a Tuesday afternoon with one of my favorite guests now a podcaster, Kyle Bonna Gera.
Kyle, Happy Tuesday, sir. How are you.
I'm doing great, Spence are you?
I'm well? So let's start with your new project.
And I recall hearing about this, but now as a result of you know, I read the entire piece that you and Adam did this morning. When I saw you were going to be on I pulled this up. So Paul Wolfe's mother, of course, Paul was the head coach of Washington State for a number of years. Dolores wolf disappeared in July of nineteen seventy nine, and it is quite a fascinating story that I'm not sure how many
people are fully aware of. So let's go back to the origin story kind of when you heard about this, and then why you and Adam decided to do this entire project.
Yeah, no, thanks for willing to chat about it. We're really excited about the project. So I think the most obvious place to start, just for your listeners is that Paul wolf is now the head coach at cal Pauly, who Utah will will host its first home game this year. So a little bit of a Utah youth connection. It
fro from the jump here. So in twenty twenty, Adam and I were kind of, you know, going through the COVID motions, right, were trying to report about college football during during that weird season, and he received a tip that he saw this interesting story about Paul Wolfe and it's it's something about his mother. And so he's like, hey, this is kind of interesting. We should we should look into this. And so the short version is that when Paul Wolfe was was twelve years old, He's the youngest
of four children. One night, his mother disappeared, never was seen or heard from again. Almost immediately, his father was telling both him and his other brother who was still living at the house, that she was she was gone, and she was never coming back. It emerged very quickly that he was the primary suspect in her disappearance. But three number of factors, you know, they weren't able to ever prosecute him. He's never you know, never never went before a jury to face an HR. But you know,
it really impacted the trajectory of his life. Of course, right, he moves out of his house and his dad he effectively lost both parents when this happens, is raised by his aunt and uncle, a really fascinating uncle who's had a crazy military career that we get into as well.
And then forty one years later, in the summer of twenty twenty, a cold case detective in the Bay area and near where I live, you know, it's kind of tipped off about another case and went down this went down this rabbit hole and eventually determined that Paul will Smother had been found just six weeks after she went missing,
but no one was able to identify her. She had been in cemetery one county over for four decades, and they were able to do DNA testing through Paul to make the determination that this, this woman who had only been identified an unmarked grave as Jane does sixteen, was in fact his mother. It's a crazy story. We wrote about it in twenty twenty twenty one for ESPN where we kind of outlined the whole process and there was
a lot of just wild stuff that happened. There's just too much to get into, but like it was the most incredible story that Adam and I heard had ever worked on, and so we published the story. It was very much through the lens of Paul and this coach. It is in the ESPN story, but there was so much more to it that we couldn't get into in
our story. It was a story that we both felt deeply deserved to be told more broadly to a wider audience interesting trips of like not not sports fans specifically, and so ESPN, with it with its blessing, allowed us to pursue the project kind of on the side of the podcast, and so over the past year or so, a little bit more than a year, we've been kind of working on it in our free time, and the first episode of the podcast was released yesterday. It's called
The Unforgotten. It's season three of a pre existing podcast, and the season is called Finding Dolores Wolf.
Yeah, it's a gripping story.
I mean, the written portion that I read starts out with Paul as a young man, and the way you framed it was great because it was just one of those things that the gripshoot to the point where you want to want to read the entire thing. In March of eighty five, Paul, who was eighteen, had been summoned to a meeting to confront the suspect in his mother's murder, and then you revealed that the suspect is his father.
And I can't imagine what that's like when you're eighteen years old and you're asked to sit across your father to try to dig for information to find out whether or not he's the one that actually is responsible for the mother's disappearance. I mean it is written through the lens of Paul and excited to listen to the pod, But how would you say all of this kind of shaped him? And you know, through the lens of what he became, which is a high level player in college and then of course a coach.
You know, I think it's it's foundational and who he became as a person. Right. You can't live through something as traumatic as that and not having any impact to you, like to your core, right, And I think it started and I talked a lot about this with Paul over the years. You know, he moved in with his uncle and aunt who I mentioned earlier, this guy who was a Vietnam that a really interesting guy who we have a whole episode devoted to, Like his military career is
just crazy. That's episode four US, so look forward to that. But he was like, he was a guy who was very involved in the community as a coach, like coach little league baseball, you know, youth softball, was involved in slow pitch softball recreationally, like just like coached all his kids in all their sports. Was you know, he he estimated that he you know, coached maybe five thousand kids
over the course of his life in this community. And being raised by someone like that after you know, after the separation of his immediate family, the guy kind of stepped in as his protector at a time when he really needed it. Right, those are foundational years for anyone, right, but for someone who's twelve and goes through what he went through, now this is the mentor figure.
You know.
He treated Paul like a son who was a better father than his actual father had ever been. And so I think he gravitated towards coaching and being around the team and having that camaraderie. And then I think what kind of stands out to me after talking with Paul about it, is like, look, he's very he feels like he can really relate to a lot of what these kids are going through and have the perspective of like football is very important right, that's why they're all there.
It's it's a big part of everyone's life who's involved in these high level teams. But there's other stuff going on in everyone's life, and it's it's tough at times, right, And so he's very sympathetic to family struggles and outside of like, you know, whatever somebody's dealing with, and being kind of accepting of them and being able to kind
of relate to them in those ways. And so I think all of those elements that he went through, like he like, formed him and allowed him to kind of have those deeply personal relationships with all of his players and coaches.
So one of the well, several interesting portions of this. But the connection about his mother's body having been found was made by a lady named Stacy Sherman who was looking for additional victims of the Golden State Killer, a man named Joseph James DeAngelo, who was arrested in twenty eighteen on eight counts of murder.
Were there, ever, any other.
Suspects outside of Carl Paul's father or did this appear to be Okay, this is just one person and we just don't have enough evidence to pin him down.
Yeah, it was very clear to anyone who was around then, And we did extensive interviews with the investigator at the time, the district training at the time, lots of family members, like many many hours like kind of looking into that possibility, and like everyone knew, the community knew, the family knew, the police knew, the district attorney knew, everyone knew who
did it. But at that time it was just, you know, getting a murder conviction without a body was almost impossible at that point in time, Like there was physical evidence tied to it. There was blood on a blanket, there was like her missing earing was found in the trunk. There was like enough there. But the DA and we discussed this with him fairly recently, Like it was a lot of circumstantial stuff. They made the decision at a certain point to like, well, let's keep looking for the
body and hopefully we find it. And then once we have the body, it's a slam dunk, but without it, we think he'll probably walk. And so what actually happens is the six years go by with no arrest, and so finally the family is fed up and so they push They pushed the envelope a little bit and take the case to the Attorney General in the state of California, who looks at the evidence is like, yeah, there's enough
to year to pursue a murder charge. We'll go ahead and handle it if the local BA doesn't want to, And so at that point Yolo County, which is north of California, outside of Sacramento, it says, okay, they didn't want to be bigfooted by the Attorney General's office and kind of relents and says, okay, we'll prosecute the case. So the fire is eventually arrested and there's you know, weeks of you know, evidentiary hearings in front of a judge to determine if the case could go to trial.
And what the judge ruled is that because they took six years to charge him with order, they violated his right to a speedy trial, and therefore the case could not proceed. So it wasn't anything about the evidence, it wasn't anything about he wasn't proved innocent. It was really just a technicality that let him walk and that's why he never never faced justice.
One portion also alludes to the fact that Carl Paul's father tried to come back into his life later on, when Paul was a college football player and a coach. Did that connection ever manifest anything lasting? Was Paul ever open to trying to have a relationship with his father when he tried to come back into his life.
No, So like the last time they ever they ever met or they ever spoken person was in nineteen I believe, nineteen eighty eight. And so Paul is a player at Washington State and it might be in the year's rock, but that the story is the same. Like did they had played Ucla? Ucla was the number one team in the country at the time. Washington State was a middle of the road team. Went to the rose Bult and beat UCLA up at the number one team in the country.
Big deal, right obviously for Paul, for the team, all of that, And outside the locker room after the game, his dad was there. He had come to the game. He wanted to see him, and so Paul, you know, gave him a couple of minutes. Since the day it's probably not a good idea for you to be here. A lot of his you know, friends and family were
there and he was persented Mangrad around the family. It was like, basically, you need to leave and He's like, well, I want to have more to do with you in your life, and Paul's like, look and tell you, tell me more about what happened to my mother. We're not going to have a relationship. And that was the last
time they ever saw each other in person. There was one more phone call to following the spring between Paul and his father about hey, like kind of one last chance to try to solvage the relationship from his father's perspective, but you know, they never talked again after that, so it was it was less several decades of the man's life and Paul had no contact with him.
You referenced the uncle who does manifest himself throughout the written portion of what I've read here as a very very interesting, interesting guy. Slick was his nickname, and you know, he and others were pretty hell bent on making sure that Carl did not enjoy his existence at all, even while he was a free man. Can you elaborate on some of the things that they did to him to just try Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And this is some of my favorite part of the of the story. And we have got a couple of episodes devoted to this stuff. So episode three will be basically all the all the stuff they did to this man crazy and drive him out of town. And the fourth episode is basically a you know, we profile Slick and he's just incredible. We spent some time with him at his apartment. He's telling us wild stories. But so anyways, they're basically the family that there had a large Portuguese
family who all lived in the community. Carl had no family in the area, so he was surrounded by her family in this small town outside Sacramento. And after she went miss me, they I mean, they made his life a living hell. I mean, they would cut off his power. They would write like murder on his garage on his garage door, and animal blood. They would grow dead animal carcasses on his on his law of his property. They would chase him out of grocery stores, they would stalk
him around town. At one point there was a jar of urn that they threw through his living room window into his into his house. I mean, they really they really pushed the envelope, stopping short of physical violence. Certainly a lot of it would have, you know, been illegal in its own right or what they were doing just intimidating this man. But again, like everyone knew he was responsible for her disappearance and likely her murder at that time.
So the police in town basically looked the other way and let them kind of have their way with this guy, because you know, they felt, you know, like the police in the small town felt like this guy should face justice, and if this is all they're going to be able to do, then they were kind of happy to look look the other way. And then this guy slicked the uncle of Doris's Doris's brother, who they had a really tight relationship. Then we get into that in the pod.
He was someone who, before the Vietnam War had really broken out into a full scale war, was in the one hundred and first Airborne Division of the Army and had been parachuting in under the cover of darkness, you know, assassinating enemy years before the war had broken out. He was killing people with his bare hands. This is I guess maybe a little violent disclaimer here, Like there was like a lot of stuff that was really graphic that he described with us, and we get into that on
the pod. So here's the guy who was responsible for a lot of death on his own as a member of the as a member of the military, and he did that. He did all this like in like he was conditioned to believe it's in service of the country.
Right.
You can understand this is the fifties, right, That's that's like what he was assigned to do, right, And so he executed the cast that he was told to do, but still took a real toll on him. And what he told us is that or he told his son, is that he would have to get work himself into a frenzy to be able to do these, like these
acts for the military. He would have to. He told him that he had to pretend like these people were harming his sister, and then he would get he would get into a state of mind where he's able to kind of act in the way that they asked him to. And then he gets back to the United States after going through all of this, and then his sister really is taking from his life. He knows who's responsible for doing it, and showed had to you know, had to
show some restraint. And it was tough because he he told us, and this is all laid out in the interview, is like he thought about, you know, exacting revenge on him and told a few graphic stories about plans they had to to torture Carl wolf and get some answers out of him. He decided ultimately not to go through that because he made the choice to raise Paul Wolfe and his brother. It was a real kind of inflection
point in all of their lives. But it was like morally, he always he felt like he was kind of sealed. He religious guy, and kind of what's done is done. What's one more? It won't affect me, you know, ultimately, right, It is kind of where his mindset was so really fascinating characters, a lot of really good storytellers throughout the family. And I think that's the podcast medium was really the perfect way to text you, hut this story.
Last thing on this, Kyle, then we'll do a couple of other things for us that you lose. As if losing your mother allegedly at the hands of your father as a young man wasn't enough of a tragedy to handle throughout one's life. Paul Wolfe was handed another very, very tough blow as his wife, Tammy, in nineteen ninety seven was diagnosed with a brain tumor and was given three to five years to live, and she later on
passed in March of two thousand and two. I always find if I always find it interesting when you hear stories behind people that you only know of as like a coach or a player or someone with some sort of notoriety. I mean, I don't know that I really have a question, but this is just another piece of the Paul Wolf puzzle that I think deserves to be talked about.
You know, you know, he's really like I think, because he had such a high profile stint at Washington State that did not go well, right, They had the record, His record there was not good. It was historically bad in fact, but I think like he was so hardened by these scenes that he had gone through his life that just the fact that he was able to become a head coach of Easter Washington. It was the head coach at his alma mater, where he tried to clean
up a mess. I mean, he certainly had the program in much better shape to hand off to Mike Leach than when he inherited it from Bildoba. It was just kind of in shambles when he got there. They didn't
really have a chance. But I think a lot of people just formulated their opinion based on those years and the win loss right, and you didn't hear about what this guy had had gone through getting to that point, right, And so I gained a ton of respect for Paul over the last several years getting to know him and learning about him and his family. They have, everything they went through and how they banded together. The story is really it's a true crime story. It's a sort of
search for a missing woman. But you know, I've been telling people, it's a story about a family and like this family bond that was unbreakable in many ways, just the ties that they have the last is over several decades, all unified behind like this single cause is really impressive. And then for Paul to progress through all of that and be very successful, like the winds went there at
Washington State, but he progressed through. He was on, you know, hard about stuff with the Niners when they went to the Super Bowl. He bounced around in college, and now he's back in the headshat Poly you're trying to resurrect that program as a head coach once again. So I'm glad he's got another opportunity to try to make the best of a of a cool situation down there at Cutler.
It's the best way for people to find the pod. Kyle.
Yeah, so it just called The Unforgotten Season three, Finding the Worst Wolf. It's anywhere, you know, It's on all podcast platforms, so anyone who's who's into the podcast scene should have no trouble finding it. I've tweeted a little bit about it, kind of broke out of my Twitter hibernation to promote it a bit. So they just want to find me on Twitter. You can easily navigate. But yeah, The Unforgotten Finding the Worst Wolf. Any googling, any searching, should be pretty easy to find.
There you go.
All right, let's move over to the Coach's bull that was released yesterday. My question is how much stock should anybody put into this? How serious of an endeavor is this for any college football coach?
Yeah?
Deeply, like deeply unseerious, Like if if you're like if there's twenty five teams ranked, or I forget, how many actually voting members there are, Like how many actual coaches
is voted? Like the percentage is very low. It's a lot of sids like staffers, assistance, those sorts putting it together, and a lot of them are just looking at way too early lists and using that as a starting point, making a couple of adjustments just so it's not the same, right, this is like these people do not take this seriously. That being said, I love this stuff, like I love
the scene where it starts. I think it's just like part of the part of the tradition of college football are a right, let's let's see where it moves and but looks like at the end of the year, and it's like nowhere near right, It's always going to be a lot different, I think in like in this era too, it's so much harder to predict it. Collegeable has always been hard to kind of project what, you know, the top twenty five, But now with all the transfer stuff,
no one knows anything. No one's ever known anything. But now it's it's really thrown you know, your blindfolded throwing darts here. But you know, it's a good it's a good talking piece and sets expectations and storylines. It's always kind of evolved from where those rankings are at the end of the year a few.
Years ago because the conversation that you and I are having on air now often you know, kind of transpire where talking heads wonder whether or not any coach actually takes this endeavor seriously, or if they even fill out their polls. So I texted an in state coach a few years ago, and I told him it would be off the record, so I've never brought his name on air, And I said, have you ever done this before?
And if so, how serious do you take it? He said, I haven't done it once.
You have you had any conversations with coaches about that dynamic, whether or not they even do the thing?
Yeah, so I have. And so I talked with David sew Wan. He was at Stanford. I was around them quite a bit in his early years. He actually did fill it out for one year and he's like, I felt like, you know, if it's called the coach's poll, like he's felt like in an obligation to do it himself.
But then he did it for one year and realized like what an exercise and futility it was, and so he stopped, Like he stopped participating in Stanford, stopped participating after his one season, and he's like, look, it's called the coach's pull. It should be the coaches. But now that I've done it, I realized it's I don't have time for this to do it, like spend the time to really do it correctly, so we're just not going to participate. It's the only one I've ever talked to
who admitted to actually doing it themselves. Like no one else I've ever talked to has been upfront and said, yeah, you know, you know, I do it each week up and down. I think some of the coaches probably have like who do you want to be number one? Who's your top five? And they have their staffer whoever is still out the rest there's like some I think that involvement is like somewhat common, but let's certainly not all the way through.
So the main takeaway here locally is that Jake Rreetz laugh departs for Tulane, yet BYU still cracks that top twenty five.
They come into number twenty three.
We still don't know who's going to start under center McKay, Hillstead, traycon Borget and Bear.
Bachmeyer the three battling.
So my two part question is your thoughts on BYU actually cracking the top twenty five and if Jake stays, where do you think they land.
Yeah, that's the good. So I think like the fact that they're in the top twenty five. I think it's probably a lot of this is so based on where you did, what you did last year, independent of like what your what your roster looks, right like, right so, I think because when they went eleven games last year, you were you're always gonna get a shot to start in the top twenty five, regardless of what happened with Retslaw.
Obviously that's they ended up in twenty three eight with him, you know, probably top fifteen, I would imagine, and some some people punished for for not having a returning quarterback of course, you know, is it fair? Yeah, Like I look at it. I haven't actually pulled up right now. I kind of thought Texas Tech would be a little higher.
Like I'm actually surprised that you are. And I didn't see where the Big twelve preseason predictions were, Like with all the money that Texas Tech invested in its program, I kind of thought that would be a little higher, not that I'm looking at now, but again, like it's just there's no rhyme or reason to why, especially when you get when you get out of the top ten, in particular fare them people are I think they try to do it well at the top, and then the
lower you get in the process, it's like you can't really differentiate between these teams. So anyway anywhere from like I don't know, fourteen to twenty five, all those teams you could probably just throw into a hat and pick out randomly and then probably ended up looking pretty similarly.
And just because we're the home of the Utes and there a mile away, I'll ask you about Utah technically coming in at thirty with others receiving votes, and whether or not you think the a people next week will kind of reflect a similar area for the Utes.
Yeah, they'll get votes. And I think the defense was so good last year right in the quarterback playoffy and you guys and your listeners no more than I do. But like you bring in, the defense was not an issue. It won't be an issue again this year. You bring a quarterback who had worked with his offensive coordinator, had success. It's a proven formula to resurrect teams, right to have
that sort of camaraderie. And now that you have a player who's proved proven he can run an offense and run into this exact offense, you know in theory it solves the problem, right, and so you have this elite defense. Even if you were like somewhat competent offense, if you taught, like the team would have had a lot more wins last year. And so that simple, very rudimentary combination like makes me optimistic that they can be a lot more
successful this year. And I think kind of showing up at thirty or whatever is kind of reflects this same sort of logic.
According to both this Coach's poll and then pretty much everything else, including Bill Conley's rankings for you guys over at ESPN, it does feel like Arizona State is the prohibitive favorite and there's a bit of a gap between them and everybody else. To your point, we look at what you did a year ago, and we know what ASU did a year ago. Seventy nine percent of their production is returning, including Sam Levitt. Does it feel like they are the deserved favorite in the Big twelve this year?
Yeah? I think so. I mean, like loudn Scattaboo is tough, right because he, I mean, he was so much of what they did as a rusher, you know, as a pass catcher. But and it kind of goes back to what you were saying about Retzlaf, like you have a if you have a good team and your starting quarterback is coming back, you're getting That's just like people are just gonna think expectations are going to be high. And that's the case with Ascu. Elevit's coming back. He had
a good year. I think the expectation is it'll be better. He'll be better this year and even relied on more without Scottaboo around to carry the ball their back and burnning back. His name is escaping me off hand, was pretty was a pretty good player last year. Kind of relief, so that he's something they feel I can kind of step in and have a really productive year as well. But yeah, I think like it's earned right after after the year they had and the good showing in the playoffs.
I mean, they probably shouldn't be Texas. I think they probably felt they should be Texas.
I guess.
So the fact that it was a it was a coin flip game against a team with a ton of talent, you know, shows that ACU is for real. And I just think that, you know, the coaching turnaround there has been as impressive as any in college football, and you have so much of college football is the coaching staff, right, that's coaching Madison football more than any other sport, and so I think they're in a they're operating from place of strength there as well.
As I always say, I will not ask you about the depth of real Salt Lake and whether or not their third left back is something you think can lift them into the playoffs. But Kyle sonce you and I spoke. Diego Luna had himself an ice little Gold Cup run. He's been back on the ground here for a little bit, and he he is by far their best most productive player. They did bring in a couple of summer editions, one DP a nine and then what their manager calls a
nine and a half. But do you think Diego Luna has done enough to solidify a spot for next year's World Cup?
You know, it's I wouldn't say like fully, it's not fully set in stone yet. I expect him to be on the team, and I'm almost ready to think that
he has a chance to play like he hasn't. I don't think he's proven to be in that spot yet, but I think that that that's in play, and the fact that he's come so far so quickly that like, that's fascinating, right, It was just a few years ago that you know, I don't know how many, maybe four years ago now that San Jose like didn't even like he was an academy player and they dropped him from the academy, goes to the USL route, you know, lashes up with the RSL is really has really taken off.
And the fact that he that we can even have this discussion about whether he's gonna be on the team, whether he's going to contribute, what his role should be. I mean, that sort of trajectory is so rare in American soccer, to jump so quickly through the USL, through an MLS team and to being contention for a roster spot when there's so many of the other guys that
his position are playing at big clubs in Europe. Right, I think, you know, RSL fans should enjoy him as long as they can, because I think he's got a future that's going to take him places with much brighter spotlets.
One more soccer question for you.
I wonder and I've drawn the parallel on the show between Rest in Peace, Grant Wall, the Beckham Experiment, the David Beckham MLS partnership that has continued into his foray into ownership with the Miami Club, and Grant wrote a great book called The Beckham Experiment that I read that I thought was awesome. And then the parallel between David Beckham and what Lionel Messi has brought to the league now I always hesitate to do it because then you get soccer p I know that Messi is twenty times
a player that Beckham was. I understand that, and maybe when you're that good, you don't necessarily have to be the type.
Of statesman that Beckham was for MLS.
I mean, Beckham came multiple times, and Kyle he stayed after matches for hours and signed autographs like he got it.
He understood what the deal was.
He understood that he wasn't the player that he was once upon a time with man U or the English national team, and so he was here more of like a rep for the game and a rep for the league. And he just could not have been better. And maybe it's just because Messi is Messi, he doesn't have to
do those things. But doesn't show up to the All Star Game, they suspend him, which felt a little bit wild, But do you think MLS is getting the ROI whether and you can define that in any way, shape or form with this Messi experiment that they've undertaken over the past couple of years.
So that's really interesting because it's been massive, undoubtedly, Like the exposure that the league has gotten as a result of having Messi in the league is significant, and now like how does it meet the other side of now it doesn't meet expectations, Like whatever Messi does, and it'll probably be for the rest of his life, Like he goes on vacation in his seventies, he'll still draw a crowd. Right, He's that type of just talent and just like personality.
It's just that people just gravitate to him, and he's like a god for people in Argentina and really around the world. So I think he's been an overall it's been incredible for the league, but I also don't think the league has done enough to make to maximize him at the same time, if that makes sense. So like there's so it's kind of too pronged at least, like it's been huge, it's really it's certainly benefited like a lot of the people who bought Apple Plus subscriptions just
to watch Messi. It's probably hard to calculate. I mean, there's a reason that that was part of the deal for him, right, he gets a cut of subscriptions to the league just for internationally, just because they're not buying the subscriptions to watch MLS. They're buying subscriptions to watch Lionel Messi play soccer wherever he's going to be.
So I think.
Ultimately what we'll find out is long term, like when he's gone, what does the league look like and how will his time in the league have have pushed it forward. It comes at an interest time with the Cup coming and that's also going to have an impact. But I thought there was like a really strong wave of Messi storylines and just like involvement when he came over. But I really feel like it's tapered off quite a bit
this year. There's the Club World Cup where he participated, which I think was a nice boom to kind of have him. They advanced through the group, which was they were the only MLS club to do that. But then you know, you get to PSG and you see there's levels to this, So yeah, it's it's it's an interesting again, Like I just think after the fact, how many what will m l what will attendance look like in Miami when Messi is gone? Right, we'll find out because it's
not there. There are not very many inter Miami fans. There are Messi fans who are going to support him wherever, and so we'll find out. It's hard to calibrate right now.
Last thing, I'll set you loose. Less than a year away from the World Cup. What's the Kyle Bondeger A confidence level in our team? Whatever that means to you, I mean, get out of group whatever, something that could be somewhat exciting for.
The World Cup.
Yeah, I mean I think you have to get out of the group more. It's a massive failure, especially with an expanded World Cup, right, so you go from thirty two teams to forty eight teams. That inherently is going to dilute the competition. And so it should be easier to get out of the group because there's less good teams. And you got out of the group last time and a tough group in a sense, and you have known who's really aged out, right, so you should have that.
You should have essentially the same team, but guys who are like further deep into their prime. You have a coach who is you know, on paper better, right, he's certainly a bigger name and has achieved more at a higher level of the sport, but that hasn't shown up, you know, in the last two years. Obviously Burhalter was with them during during Copa and that they crashed out early.
The Gold Cup.
You have a small complement of the full team in the tournament at all, which was so you can't really evaluate the team and how they've done. You're not going to have the qualification process. I feel like interested in the US national team is really down right now just because of all those factors. So yeah, I mean, if
you don't advance, it's an abject disaster. And you probably because there's an extra I believe there's an extra round of the of the knockout phase two, so you probably need to win a win a knockout game as well to really define as a success. But I think if you had asked me about expectations about this team after the last World Cup, I would say, look, you got
to make it to the quarterfinals. But now you know, there hasn't been a lot of positive developments for the team recently to have those sort of expectations.
Kyle, thanks man for the time, excellent work on the story and the pod. We'll make sure to send it out on our socials. Have a great week and we'll chat soon, all right.
Thanks.
Ros A bone Gera ESPN covers college football and soccer. This new podcast that he has with Adam Rittenberg is about the disappearance of Paul Wolfe's mother, and I read the written description of the disappearance of Dolores wolf I have not listened to the pod yet, but the story is gripping and it is something that is definitely worth your time. At Bonnegera ESPN. That's his social channel. You can find the link to all of his work up there. Like any good coach, it's time to update the game
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