Ellie Lakers try to stave off elimination tonight, as do the Houston Rockets. The NBA playoffs roll along with two really good games tonight after a bunch of great action last night. I was on television last night at ten thirty five on KMYU, also streaming on kutv dot com. We call it five Questions with Spence, even though last night was eight Questions with Spence.
I needed more time to be filled.
And Dave Fox joins US live and studio after ditching us yesterday.
Hello Dave.
Oh sorry, we had a little station sports meeting yesterday. But thank you for pivoting and allowing me to come into This is rare because normally I'm here and then you come there and right he's just the opposite, So now I can steal all your material.
No, all good, But last night was fun. Thanks for having me. Of course, my guy Timmy writing the questions as he does.
All the time. He is just great.
He is the best. He is the best. All right, Where to start? Where to start? Where to start?
Today?
NBA playoffs, I've been fun, But for the third straight year there's no playoff basketball in Salt Lake City, Utah. You know, I was thinking about this because they referenced the Detroit Pistons have not won a home playoff game in seventeen years.
Ultimately, we're pretty spoiled.
Yeah, how many you know, how many spring basketball exciting events that we've had over the years, even though it's been three years. You know, it's it's important to remind jazz fans that markets go through this.
We just don't go through it very often.
Well, and if you talk about the grand history, Detroit has had some pretty good years too.
That's just for a long time.
Yeah, It's has been a really really long time. And I mean I can go all the way back to ninety seven, ninety eight. How much fun was that. It was just phenomenal to be a part of that. But you're right just to be involved, to say you're a playoff team, to not be stuck in the lottery in a bad position, it means a lot. It just granted, a lot of teams go to the playoffs. I get it, but still, if you're a playoff team, you're a playoff team,
and that says something. It's funny because I was looking at the NHL lotteries, is I think it's been announced as Monday, and the odds on Utah getting a number packer zero. They can't happen because they're so far down the lottery. So that's when you're kind of stuck in purgatory. That's not really where you want to be. So at least this year, Spence, the Jazz are in the best position they've been in in quite some time in terms of the hope for getting a lottery a number one pick.
Yeah, fourteen percent chance.
Unfortunately, speaking of Detroit and knock on Wood, last year, the Pistons had the worst record in Pro basketball easy, and they fell to five, which is the Jazz floor. They cannot fall past five. We have recent precedent though of it happening. So unfortunately that is not the play. Because if Cooper Flag is Jazz Man next year, a
couple of things. First of all, then we can start understanding exactly the direction the Jazz are going to take, because people ask me all the time what are they gonna do, and I'm like, well, I don't know, and I probably will not even have an idea until after we know where they're drafting. But if they draft one, and if they get Cooper Flag, then we have more of an idea of what they're going to do coming up. And also we will no longer be in a purgatory
like NBA National. People will start paying attention to the Jazz again because nobody has done that at all this year.
Well, and they get Flag and then they add Jannis and then you're talking about ten.
Look at you.
So it's on now. I have to believe that. First of all, Milwaukee will not trade him. The only way it happens is if Yannis says that's enough, Okay, he would have to ask for it.
I read this this morning. It blew me away.
So the past ten playoff games for Milwaukee, Jannis is averaging thirty two points, sixteen rebounds, and six assists, and they're one and nine in those ten games. And it's their third straight year they've lost in the first round. So it's it's a little bit like so when Lebron left Cleveland the first time for Miami, they burned his jersey. He came back to Cleveland, won a championship, left for Los Angeles and they celebrated it because he got them
their championship. Yannis won a title in Milwaukee's right, so he can kind of do the thing where it's like, look, I gave you everything I had, won your title, but now it's time for me to move on. The question is how much of that will be his decision as far as where the landing spot is, because Milwaukee's not going to trade him, and I'm sorry, Giannie is not gonna be like, hey, they've got great snow in.
Utah, so my guess he is not a hockey guy. Got hockey time up there. So uh that that's a really good point. And it's getting back to what you said about uh Lebron Jannest. Like you said, he has the title. I think that changes your mindset to a degree. You never stop the pursuit of getting titles, but at least he has one. You look over the careers have stocked on them alone. They were fantastic. Never got a title,
but they wanted it. In that granted, free agency and demanding trades wasn't quite as prevalent as it was back then. But uh, it went bad quickly when and when I don't mean bad, but I mean once though they had those two runs, then it was like off off the cliff. Few years later, Carl's in l a and and John retires I don't know how uh Joannis will continue to be. Maybe he really loves Milwaukee. He's got his title, and
he says, well, I'll just I'll ride this out. But that team, that team does not and I think you'll agree with me here, that organization isn't even close to being title connectors, especially with the problems now that they have with Damian Loward. I think they put a lot into that basket. And who knows what his situation is going to be. That's tough injury to come back from at his age. So yeah, well we'll see what kind of patients Jannis has. But we would welcome him here
with open arms in our wonderful community. Take him up do some snowboarding if he would prefer. I'm happy to take him up to Alta and put the boards on and you know, do some surfing in the summer whatever.
NBA players are not allowed to do that, well they can are not allowed to do that. And yet Malone who got to drive around on Harley all the time, Well he wasn't.
Supposed to, but he did, but he did.
You know, I was call him alone, but no, I mean, look, even with Dame, we saw where their ceiling is, and at times it looks pretty good, but they're not close to competing with Dames, so they're mile away without him. Game won't be on the floor next year until probably the spring f at all. But he's under contract for two more years at about one hundred and twenty million, a lot of money. So Milwaukee's in trouble and Phoenix is in trouble. There will be teams that will be
moving on from star players. Kevin Durant will be traded, Giannis will be traded. I just think the Jazz have probably three years too late, but they finally have accepted their fate and they're gonna play this long game thing. I don't think, like I don't know that Danny Ainge will ever utter the phrase big game hunting again. I just think they've leaned into this long term play and we'll see if they get Cooper and then they go from there.
If I can circle back to yesterday's show, and I listened to your show every day, so your NBA guess not. Dave mcmanimum Tim McMahon, and he brought up an interesting point in the same subject in that no, there's no chance Kevin Durant's coming here but the Jazz could be a facilitator in a deal that involves Durant somewhere. They already have been with Phoenix once before, right, and you know you kind of got into the whole, you know,
is there another year of tanking? And I think you both kind of agreed that if you get Cooper Flag, you don't necessarily have to go into a full year of tanking, if I if I heard that correctly. But the temptation to try to add debansa is great. But Spence one are the odds on getting the number one pick two years in a RUW.
It doesn't happen much. And you know, I do, I do think.
There is a chance that if Cooper Flag is here in Salt Lake City, the Jazz decide, and may have already decided that their timeline starts now, That's what I think, and their timelines to get to the Cooper flag. And look, the draft class next year, and you know, people analyze the draft day to day for a living in a way that I don't. But the draft class next year is thought to be every bit as good as the
draft class this year. And so we love you, Lowry, but you're about to turn twenty and even a guy like Walker Kessler's agent a little bit, which sounds hilarious to say, but if you get Cooper Flagg at eighteen, and I remind everybody every time I bring up Cooper Flag, he turned eighteen three and a half months ago. He reclassified and should have been a senior in high school. So it's like Trevin Nell's what twenty seven like, you know,
so he is not some season college basketball player. He should have been a senior in high school this year. He's a young eighteen. So there is part of me to believes the Jazz have already done their calculation and they're saying, if we get Cooper, our project starts now with him.
But I don't know about dismissing Kessler yet, He's not that much older.
I'm saying, I don't think anybody would be safe if they get Cooper Flagg probably.
And Lowry right is even more. And then you go down the line guys like Jordan Clarkson, done, John Collins. You know, maybe they would have traded Jordan if they could by now. Yeah, well, no, I don't know, may not be, it may be part of the facilitation of Kevin Durant we'll see where that all goes.
I'll tell you what's beneficial now with both Clarks and Collins is now that we enter the final year of their contracts. So if another general manager you say, okay, that money does expire. Instead of trading for John Collins. Last year, gms are saying I don't want to trade for John Collins because I'm paying him twenty six million dollars next year. But now this year you're saying, okay, that comes off the books. It's expiring, so we'll make that deal.
So forget about big game hunting and think more about the we use the word again, the facilitating things that could, in a roundabout way benefit the Jazzy because they have a lot of other assets to deal with. Hey, did you call any of Jackson darts high school football games? Several?
So he turns out to be QB two in the NFL draft process, which I think is pretty interesting.
You know, starts at USC, goes goes to miss.
Brian Dayball, who was Josh Allen's offensive coordinator in Buffalo, trades back into the first round to take Jackson.
What sort of NFL player do you think he's gonna be?
I think he's gonna be a really good one when I the games. I still remember his first game. I think we called one of his first games at Corner Canyon. And remember he played three years at Roy and we actually called a few of his games there. But he wasn't showcase there the way he was at Corner Canyon. You know, Eric Kerra just turns out the quarter there. And the two things that caught me. One he was
incredibly accurate with his passing. But when he took off and ran, I mean he ran like a running back.
A kid that's built really well too, that.
Big, strong kid, and just a great kid. Beyond that, it's just a lot of fun to watch. I love him in the NFL, and I think you talk about the Giants, sorry about the Jets. You mean to bring what.
Are you Doing's asking you about the Jets's talking across town? Uh?
They added Skataboo, So I'm thinking four or five. And I'm not a Jet, you know, me and my Cowboys. I don't like the Giants. I don't like anyone else in the NFCS, but I think there might be a nice little foundation there, and that's a team that traditionally loves those fans will eat up a running back like Scataboo, you know, a strong kid and Dart. I just think four or five years from now, that's going to be a heck of a tandem in that in that city.
Do you think Jackson in fact Porter get on the microphone, Oh, Jackson Dart NFL prospect juxtaposed to Zach Wilson.
Good question, And it's interesting you mentioned the corner Canyon thing. They've now put out two first round quarterbacks in a time span that I'm not sure many colleges around the country have. Yeah, I think that Jackson is he has a lot more of like the refined stuff that Zach had. Clearly a great arm, he could sling it. But Jackson
seems to really know playbooks well. He seems to know pre snap stuff really well, a lot of the stuff that I actually think Zach struggled with and with the reason although he was great at BYU was not a great prospect. Jackson seems to have a little bit more of that pocket presence pre snap stuff.
I think more experienced too, played for Lane Tiffin. But I'll circle back to what you said too about the coaching. That's a big part of it. So Zach goes into a coaching situation where you got a head coach who's the defensive guy. In fact, he's back with the Niners, right, he's the defensive coach. Again. I just think it was a bad situation. And again, I don't mean to fall back on the Jets, but they're terrible.
Yes they are, and I can census.
And they brought him in and he had to play. Well, that's not the case with Jackson dark because they have uh, mister unlimited, don't play it, don't play it, Russell Wilson, Mister unlimited.
Right, have you ever heard have you ever heard the Russell Wilson mister unlimited? You don't want to It'll ruin your day, don't but don't play that.
Jameis Winston. They have both of them, so theoretically, who knows what they're going to do with him, But he's gonna have plenty of time to learn if they so choose to do that. And I just think it's a great situation for him. And may I have a hard time saying all this because I'm not a Giants fan in any way, but I'm probably going to become one.
Just because of Jackson Dart. Help me understand what they've got cooking at Corner Canyon. Why have they been able to turn these kids out like that? Well, Eric, first of all, has a great system. Now this isn't just sticking a quarterback behind the center, right. The one thing that people don't talk that much about. He always has a great line, great offensive line. Jackson powers or powers
Jackson is another great kid who's with the Raiders right now. Yeah, uh Fee now coming up, he's going to be a sensational well in some respects, he's not directly, but their yeah, their family.
Uh.
He always builds a great line and he has a decent defense to go along with it. And you know how much that can mean to a quarterback if you're not on the field the whole time. So Eric's just built a machine out there. They're gonna be good. They've got a quarterback this year. Helam and Kasuga, who's going to be a senior. Watch out for him. He's going to be really he committed to a college. Uh, he's still out there. Cool, but he's only going into his
senior year. So heavily recruited. Uh. And it's it's funny because what Eric has built this Corner Canyon at Corner Canyon has forced the other teams in that region, and I'm talking about like Lehigh and Skyridge and Loan Peak to up their game. And now you've got this. It's we always me and a lemon. Frank always called the sec of high school football in Utah.
Do not say Frank Stam on this radio show. You and Alemma and the other you can say that adultce no no, and the bald weird dude. How you can put that the bald weird dudeh thank you.
Uh. And in fact, this year, I've already got our schedule done. We're going to do a lot of games out of that involved those four teams because they're just so good. But that's what Eric has built there and it's it's just going to continue. They're really good. He's got a quarterback you probably don't even remember, Devin Brown. He's on Ohio State's roster right now from a couple of years ago.
So good. He's got he's got it going on there. Yeah, I mean, it's just, uh, it's impressive.
Let me ask you this, did uh did Jackson transfer from Roy to Corner Canyon to play for Eric was likely exactly right.
He played three years at Roy, going into his senior year, and he had the blessing of the Roy coaches. Fred Fernandas was the head coach and and he knew he had something special, but he didn't really have the offense or the team to really exploit that. And he goes to Corner Canyon and Spence. Within weeks he's getting offers from all over the place, and of course he landed at USC and if they had not had a coaching change, actually, I mean, what do you expect that that's gonna have?
But when new coach comes in, he brings his quarterback with him. He was pretty good and he's with the Bears now. But he he uh, he instantly was being recruited everywhere. Best move he ever made. I'm not sure where he'd be at now if he had not made that move to Corner Canyon.
Was there?
I mean, this is a silly question.
I'm sure Utah would have liked Jackson Dart to play for them, Like, what was there any conflict?
Did he just simply want to go to s C.
I couldn't tell you this inner workings other than Cam Rising was there at the time and made it a little bit of a he was young that the title kid too Well, well, he came and went in a hurry.
I mean, was there.
He's still playing somewhere.
I think he truly was there, not much of a need.
I think that the issue because the same issue with Zach Wilson if you go all the way back, remember Zach originally committed to Boise State and then made the move to BYU, which turned out great for him, but they end up with Isaac Wilson, and you know, we'll see where that goes. But I've you know, you look, I mean, hindsight's twenty twenty o cold look at Obviously, if the youths could do it over again, they would have loved to have Jack. He was great in Mississippi
and that's and the rest is history. Now he's off to the NFL and we'll see how that goes.
Is it any sort of an indictment or concern that Caleb Loner was the only ute drafted and there were zero BYU players drafted. Yeah, BYU teams had a really good season in the Big twelve.
No NFL guys and no other ute NFL guys. That's what I'm saying, and that was one of my five questions for us yesterday because I thought the same one of your eight questions, sorry, one of my eight questions. Eight questions. Suspension just doesn't have the same rings, so I just hide him in there. But I thought the
exact same thing. In fact, I had to read over the draft and draft by school two or three times Saturday afternoon to make sure I was reading this correctly, because in a way, there's a there's a bit of comedy to it. But on the other side of it, good for Caleb, and you've mentioned some of the other tight ends that have gone through this. It's it's a great story for him. He didn't get overly used on
Utah's offense last year, but he had a couple. He had the touchdown at Utah State and a few other big catches, and you will see what he can do in the NFL. I don't know what his blocking acumen is, but uh, for a pass catching tight end, I think it's great. But yeah, when you when you look back at the draft, and boy, the NFL draft is eternity. We know that. And that's the only kid that was drafted between BYU and Utah Jalen Royals course for Utah State.
Good for him, goes to a great situation with the Chiefs. But that's the only kid out of those two schools. Is it's I think it's less an indictment on Caleb. I have no issue with that, good for him, and more of what where are all these other, you know, kids that we thought were going to get drafted? But you brought up a great point yesterday when we were talking about Shadur Sanders. The media's perspective of draft projections in the NFL's perspective of draft projections are two completely
different things. And we learned that, didn't we.
Yeah.
I mean, if you're a talent evaluator for a team, you're taught to remove emotion.
Can the kid play right?
You know?
And on the media side, certainly for a network like ESPN who's a partner with the NFL and has the NFL Draft, their one motivation is to get you to watch their TV show exactly, So how do we do that?
We create a narrative around should our Sanders?
And we have mel Kuiper lose his mind every five minutes about how he made God? And look, I honestly don't know if that is Mel Kuiper being sincere as a draft analyst or as a TV character. I really don't know, because he seemed to be playing it up to the camera, like every five minutes, let's go back to Mel and he's freaking out.
Looks like his hair is gonna fall out.
He did he did he really think should our Sanders should have been the number one player drafted? Or is he playing up to the audience so you turn on ESPN.
Well maybe it's a little bit of both. But think about this. He had him high on his board and he doesn't want to be wrong. It's you know, it's funny. I always think about when you look at replays in the NFL and the NBA, these officials don't want to have to overturn a call because if they do, they admit they're wrong. They're wrong. Yeah, but that's what replay has created. Well, maybe it's the same situation with with Mel. He doesn't want he has to defend, and he over
defended himself his projections of the draft. When this kid who he had highly projected, I think he had him as the second quarterback. No, he thought he should be, so he had QB one and he drops fifth. Obviously he's gonna raise a big stink over it, and boy, I think you you hit on it too. There was a little bit of theater with that because how many times did they go to mel I thought he was going to come to blows. At one point, who was he fighting with? I can't remember. He was fighting with
Reese Davis. It Rys Davis. Yeah, when he started yelling.
About how the NFL gets a wrong a quarterback and Reese of course wants to protect the shields, he said, stop yelling at the NFL piece.
So it was really kind. It was really good.
But that's the point Dave like, as a media member, Okay, if you're a media member and you're quote analyzing the draft, your whole motivation is to get the most amount of people to click on your stuff or watch your show, unless you're trying to impress the NFL team because you want a job, and there are several media slubs that believe they should be working for NFL teams or whatever. But you always have to remember, as a consumer, the motivation for TV networks is one thing and one thing.
Only turn on the TV and keep it on the TV on our station. As long as possible. You know this, that's how you say advertise.
Well, Steven A. Smith did the same thing, though, of course very that's very harsh show. Yeah, then that's that's his stick for you know in h twenty twenty eight, by the way, running for president?
Would you stopped it?
So that is stick? You and I don't argue enough on them on my TV show.
Do you want to argue more? We can argue more.
All that, I'm pretty much a softie and I have it. I have this weird tendency to almost agree with just about everything you say. Well, I just don't do combative radio. Yeah, I don't think well, and.
I could be wrong, because maybe if I was more like Steven A. Smith, I could sign a one hundred million dollar contract. But I don't think people turn on the radio to escape from their day to listen to two people yell at each other.
Don't. Maybe I'm wrong, but that was entertaining. Uh, no doubt about it. That It's just funny stuff.
So Caleb, only local player besides Jalen drafted, but only you.
No b YU players drafted. I'm gonna flip the script on you.
As far as what you asked me last night, and I'll just stick with the Utah perspective. We saw spring football. We saw Devin Dan Pierre play a lot. We saw a lot of hitting. We saw a lot of live hitting. I mean I was down there on the sidelines. Well, of course, don't touch the quarterback, but I was kind of taken back. And I talked to Morgan about this after the spring game, like you guys were hitting. He's like, yeah,
we needed, we need some live action. What gives you the most confidence the year two in the Big twelve for Utah football will be better?
Okay, A couple of things. First of all, and you and I were talking about before the spring game, we didn't even think we would see some of these guys all that much. And I wouldn't blame Cotton. I wouldn't see the past couple of years geez. But and I'm going to go back to when I was on your show and I did disagree with you. I said, no, I think they're going to play him a lot because they need to see him. So thank you.
Where to go.
To toot your own horn. That's that's good to give yourself To circle back and answer your question.
A couple of things First, of all, seeing him for the first time in person, I thought Devin was smaller, much shorter and thinner, and you know, it's kind of he's a small dude, because Isaac next to him looked pretty big. But the way the ball placement I thought was really exceptional. There were a couple of passes, a couple of corner routes, a couple of sideline routes where he put that ball on the money. That's one thing
I appreciated about too. He already seemed to have a great command of the huddle and the team UH three for as being as small as he is when you see him in person, he really got around well her Now. Granted that they can't go full bore, and you know, we're going to see what happens in the in the fall when he's not wearing a yellow vest, But overall, I thought that I don't know how much we really saw, and I don't think we saw a lot Spence, you know what I mean, because they're not going to show
that in the spring game. But I think it gives uh the ute fan some hope for what this team might be able to do this year. We'll see the main thing they got to just stay healthy. We learned that last year. That's a big part of it. And some of the main players like Barton didn't play. But I'm telling you what, he looks big. He looks like a stud. I mean, he's one of these guys that's gonna be able to play, you know, defensive line if he needs to, moving up from that kind of a
Micah Parsons kind of position, you know, linebacker and that. So, you know, if I'm a youth fan, I'm pretty excited about this offense in the direction that's going. I can't wait to see it when they could really open it up, and you know they're not. It's not as vanilla as it might have been. Having said that, it was kind of a you know, there was some wide open plays. It was fun to watch.
It really was little concerned about who who Devin's going to throw the ball to. So Zach Williams lands at USC. According to our friends at two four seven Sports, Utahs hosting a wide receiver transfer named Tobias Merriweather, who's in town from cal the number sixteen available player in the two four seven portal rankings. They've got add wide receiver to Dave. Yeah, talked about it himself.
Yeah, he is. But I will say this, there were a couple of nice catches made Williams. There's now at usc good point. There were a couple of drops early, and Kyle mentioned that. In fact, in the first quarter there were a few of them and the ball was being put right on the spot. So it's weird, though, Spence, because it feels like wide receiver has been an issue like year after year after a year, and they always seem to have plenty of tight ends. But we'll see where that goes.
Yeah, I think we'll always wonder what Dorian could have done last year. I Cam was healthy, right, I mean there's been some talent, like Tim Patrick's an awsome NFL wide receiver to v there's been some talent there, but you got to have a healthy quarterback that can capitalize on it.
Yeah.
And Patrick had that broken leg rough rough time here at Utah. But and I remember when he did that, I thought, well that this is gonna be a rough comeback for him. And he ends up, like you said, having a really nice career still playing.
He got paid by the That's right, all right, Before we say you loose, you had a very you have a very special guest on Talking Sports tonight by my count. Utah men's basketball roster right now has five roster spots left.
Yeah, and I believe.
So you had a chance to sit with Alex Jensen, tell us about it.
Came in today. It was a lot of fun. Spent about twenty twenty five minutes with him. And you know how talking sports work, we get maybe eight or nine yeats. So we're going to run it in two parts because it was great tonight. The first part we talk a lot about Alex, his family, the move they just went through coming back to Utah. You know, his wife was in the performing arts, Natalie on Broadway, that kind of thing. Great,
great lady. It's funny because he was I was asking about so she's, you know, Broadway girl, performing arts, your sports basketball? Which direction are the kids headed? And he said his two daughters already are headed to basketball? Oh really?
So yes, don't they only have girls that live three?
The three girls, well, the third is only three years old, so she hasn't made that call yet. Right, So his wife's you know, she's not overly I mean, she's not there fully supportive of what their kids do, but she's still waiting to see if she gets her dancer. We'll see, but we talk a lot about about that. And then on Sunday night, I'm gonna run Part two and we
talk a little bit more about basketball. I thought one of the interesting things he brought up, and you see this with all programs now they're going to the GMS, and he said it was really important for him to get a GM that is not a coach, literally is a GM. And that's that's what he managed to find. And that's that's where we're at in college because he because he's like he deals with all the money and I deal with all the players. Could you imagine that
phrase five years ago? You know you'd be on probation. I was a little.
Disappointed that Alex didn't contact me about the vacant GM job or what are you gonna do? He asked me about that. I told him that you're happy where you're at. Okay, fair enough. I just try to start my own role. Dave ye, heya, great to see. Okay, see great day.
Fox.
Tune into Talking Sports tonight you'll hear an interview with Alex Jensen