It's @SpenNelson on MWC leading USU, Runnin' Utes/BYU in Big 12 + more local CBB - podcast episode cover

It's @SpenNelson on MWC leading USU, Runnin' Utes/BYU in Big 12 + more local CBB

Jan 31, 202528 min
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Episode description

Catch “The Drive with Spence Checketts” from 2 pm to 6 pm weekdays on ESPN 700 & 92.1 FM. Produced by Porter Larsen. The latest on the Utah Jazz, Real Salt Lake, Utes, BYU + more sports storylines.

Transcript

Speaker 2

Got my rundown.

Speaker 1

Put me in a good mood on a Friday, not just because it's Friday, but my man, my friend, my guy who hasn't joined us in a long time. But we'll do some college basketball whatever else comes our way with the legend Utah State pro Hooper overseas and my former partner on Utah pre eff and Post, Spencer Nelson on a Friday.

Speaker 2

Happy Friday, my friend, how we been.

Speaker 3

H Spence check. It's so good to be talking to you. It has been a long time. Hey. Of all the introductory things you said, the one I'm most proud of is being your partner on the pre half in post. That was it? The overseas YadA, YadA, YadA, YadA, Britton Johnson's friend. That doesn't matter as sent to me. But the fact that you said I was your partner on the pre half and post touches my heart.

Speaker 1

Well, that means a lot. You're lying, but thank you for saying that. But I need to start here because I don't know.

Speaker 3

Man.

Speaker 2

I just want to let you know that I'm reading this book.

Speaker 1

About anti gravity, okay, and it's impossible to put down.

Speaker 2

It's not funny, it's not funny. It's not funny, it is funny.

Speaker 3

Hey, all of your listeners, Okay, they're shaking their head and laughing at the same time. They're like, Spence, how could you say that joke on their But yet they love it. Everyone loves a good dad joke. I love that joke. Great, great material we like.

Speaker 1

Yeah, we need to we need to give our listeners context. You know, when you do late night postgame radio, you get a little slap happy, and so our guy Spencer and Nelson would entertain us with dad jokes that did not land oftentimes with Britton Johnson, but I always appreciated them.

Speaker 3

I appreciate that. Thank you will. I mean there is a certain amount of intellectual horsepower required to truly appreciate it dad joke. You and I have that. Britt is just different. He's just built differently. Don't they have T shirts hashtag built different?

Speaker 2

They do.

Speaker 1

I love Internet or intellectual horsepower. Every time we do, every time we talk, you drop something that I steal from you.

Speaker 2

So I'm stealing that.

Speaker 3

I like that. Yeah, great, great phrase. Intellectual horsepower is a good one.

Speaker 2

How's your world, man, what's going on with you? What's what's the deal.

Speaker 3

These days, man, life is good, working and family and I mean, you know, the Drill kids are getting older, which I'm grateful for, but at the same time, I don't want them to leave the house, which when they were kids, I would little I would have thought that was that wouldn't be the case. But now they're teenagers in their blast to hang out with, so that's really good. And then the Aggies are rolling, So still doing radio for the Aggies and that's been a lot of fun and man, living the dream.

Speaker 2

It's been good, very nice. So let's do We'll do some local college hoops.

Speaker 1

I want to jump around a little bit, and we'll start with Utah State, but we'll start with a question from a thirty thousand foot view before we get into topics in a vacuum?

Speaker 2

What is it about the.

Speaker 1

Basketball culture up there where it's almost like like my next gig, Spencer, I want to coach you toass eight for one year and then cash in on a big on a big contract, and then screw that job up and just retire. Like, what's the deal about the culture up there that just breeds quality basketball and has for like twenty or thirty years.

Speaker 3

I am more than happy to put a good word in for you. I don't know if it goes any far, but here's the reality. The spectrum is magical. You toss, it has a great tradition. I mean, we go back to Stu. But you know Craig, Ryan, Danny and now Jared. But I will say, we've got to give the administration a lot of credit over the last four hires. Like Craig's a great basketball coach. And I know you toss how it struggles and that kind of stuff, but he

is a he is a good ball coach. And let's give Tim Durry some props because he had a lot of good pieces. And then Craig brought Nemi in and and he did a great job of coaching those guys. Ryan Otam, you see what he's doing at VCU. But before then, you know he's a good basketball coach. Daddy sprinkle Man, good basketball coach. Very different than the previous two,

but a good coach. And I got to tell you, I don't know how much interaction you've been able to have with Jared Calhoun, but man, he's a good coach. I really like him. He's a Bobby Huggins. He's from the Bobby Huggins Tree, and I mean, he speaks truth, he's tough, but he has a good relationship with the kids, and I think he's a really good coach. And so honestly, I think coaching does deserve a lot of credit. That the narrative is, man, you can plug anyone in, but

these guys are our good basketball coaches. So administration's done a good job. And then the pieces that have stuck around. Now, Danny's amazing thing was no one stuck around and he was able to do it. I guess Mace was here, so that's not completely true Mason and Fish, but from the other ones, I mean it's huge that Jared got Ian and Mason and Fish and Carson templan to stick around and those guys are playing well. And then inter brought in some great transfers. So Utah State does have

a great tradition, a lot of winning. I mean going back to Stu, but Larry and Rod and those guys. But these guys are good coaches and you got to give them credit for what they're doing.

Speaker 2

No, one hundred percent.

Speaker 1

And obviously I was being a bit facetious, but just seems like the coach takes over and boom. Everyone asks questions, and more often than not, the teams near the top of the conference, they're either qualifying for or threatening to be an NCAA tournament team. And it's just wildly impressive because the basketball culture in Saul Lake is rich with history. But it's been a rough stretch for not just Craig

but other coaches too. We'll get there in a moment, but I want to follow up about Jared Calhoun, who I don't know outside of just listening. I love listening to coaches postgame because the ones that don't want to get pithy and sarcastic actually do teach you. And you know, I think he has been impressive. He seems a little bit more mentally balanced than his mentor, Bob Huggins, a great coach, but you never knew if you didn't know what Huckey Bear was gonna do night in and night out.

Jared doesn't strike me as that type of guy. But as you've been able to get to know him both on and off the floor, what makes him who he is as a coach and a person and schematically how does he like basketball to be played?

Speaker 3

So I think you know, as a person he comes off and everything I know. I mean a family man. He's got a wonderful family. He's got daughters who are involved in sports and getting involved in the community, and just really good people. Zero ego. Like, that's probably the first thing the first time I met him. He just came across as extremely down to earth and zero ego,

which I really appreciated. And then from the standpoint, I think that carries over to the players when I see him interact with the player, with the players, same thing, zero ego. Just really straight of who he is and comfortable with that. And I think in a world of a lot of facade and things that aren't real because of social media and that kind of stuff, I think people can appreciate someone that, hey, this is who I am, and I'm comfortable with who I am, and so the

players see that and I think they respect it. From the way he coaches schematically, you know, the big thing at the beginning of the season was the matchup zone. It's a very unique matchup zone that he runs, and he's got a couple different zones and kind of hybrid

versions of it. But the thought was, Okay, not a lot of teams are going to be able to be prepared for this because it's a one off compared to the other twenty nine games they're playing this season, and so we're going to be able to kind of throw teams off with that. Early on, they were I think conference team. At least the guys that I've seen are more more comfortable. UNLV was very comfortable with their matchup zone.

And one thing that I love is that he's not so stubborn that he won't adapt and he has gone demand at different points in times, which I don't think that's his default of where he wants to go. But this team is actually a good man to man defense team. Now they're only playing at a few minutes a game at times, but yet they are able to switch that up and that has given them some flexibility to throw other teams out of rhythm and not get used to

just playing against his zone offensively. And every coach in the country says this, we want to run, run, run, run run, but literally that he does. I mean you, UNLV plays a slow pace. Every time that rebound is coming, Calhoun is swinging his arms and telling the guards to push it, push it, push it, which opens up easy opportunities for buckets in the paint, layups, dugs. This team actually has a lot more athleticism than you would think, and they've taken advantage of that. So it's fast paced

and then I would say, just quick hitters. It's get out and transition and if you got to play in the half court, then it's going to be motioned. But a ton of quick hitting sets to get ian and I think there's a little bit of a pro mentality from there that I like, Like he is specifically targeting guys that he wants to get the ball in certain positions and then let them make a play. And Ian Martinez has done a good job throughout the season he struggled against UNLV Mason has done a good job and

teams are adapting to that. But get the ball in the guy's hands, which is a very pro mentality, and then hey, do what you do. And I think the players have really liked the freedom and flexibility to play that way as well.

Speaker 1

And also their shot profile appears to be a modern day shot profile as far as what the numbers tell you you need to do to win basketball games. Of the ten or eleven guy Spencer, he plays, you know more than ten minutes a night. Seven of them seem like they can shoot it from the outside. You know, it's not like they hunt it in the way that the Celtics do, but it does seem like offensively. The shot profile is a modern day approach to analytically winning basketball games.

Speaker 2

Is that kind of driving with what you're seeing?

Speaker 3

Totally? Yep, they got a bunch of shooters. Now some of them are better than others. Absolutely. Carson Templan went on a streak and he struggled. Maybe who they thought was going to be the best shooter in the year. Tucker Anderson has really struggled. He's a conundrum in the sense he's shooting, like I don't quote me on this, it was like seventeen percent from the three point line at home and then like thirty six on the road, and last year he shot high thirties coming from Arkansas.

So he's really struggled. But Ian man Ian Martinez takes and makes really tough shots. Mason Falslip has shot it better. Drake Allen struggled a little early on but has really got a swag. And then the guy who's been the most consistent shooter is their sixth man, Dexter Ocono transfer from Oregon State. That's been I mean, he's been huge for him and really consistent providing a boost off the bench. But he shot it at a really high level. So

your analysis is exactly right, Spence. They shoot, they don't hunt it crazily, but they got the guys to be able to shoot it if it's open, and they move the ball so well that it's open often enough that they're putting up a good number of threes.

Speaker 1

All right, let's move over to uts now in Craig Smith, who, as you referenced, once upon a time was up in Logan did a really good job.

Speaker 2

Craig as one wherever he's been.

Speaker 1

And this is year four for Craig, and I think it's a five year contract. So look, the pressure is real and he knows this. We're gonna have Craig on the show in just on an hour from right now. And you know, there are pieces on this roster that individually at times I really really like. And you know, I'm gonna ask Craig about his rotation. He's tinkered quite a bit with a bunch of different starting lineups, a

bunch of different rotations. Gabe Matts in their leading scorer. Mean, teams just sell out on him and he has no space at all. So you look at the numbers, it's thirty one percent from three. It's like, what gives. It's like, well, everybody's gapping them and blitzing them off screens, ball screens, and he's got to find a way to be smarter with his decisions. He's been better as of late. They were finished, they were picked to finish last in the

Big Twelve. They're four and five right now. They had a nice win here at home over Brigham Young. They're going to be on the road to Oklahoma State. The Houston game didn't even it was not even.

Speaker 2

A fair fight, like, it was just rough.

Speaker 1

And so look it's a tough conference obviously, But what do you make of I'll say, what you know whether or not you feel like there's progress being made down here, and what you know about Craig do you feel like still this is the guy to get this thing back to where it needs to be?

Speaker 3

Great question? So just a couple thoughts. When I saw Utah was finished last to pick to finish last in the Big twelve, I laughed, No, Craig Smith is going to finish last. Team is going to finish last. He's just too good of a coach. And I know people will be like, well, they're not winning a lot. You may not have the guys or the horses to finish in the top three, and they don't. They obviously don't.

But his guys are gonna play hard, and they're gonna be well coached, and they're just not going to finish last in the league. I laugh at that, just because a well coached team and if they play hard for you, and I know his guys aren't gonna quit, they're not going to finish last. However, it is it's a matter of and you know this, in the Big Twelve or in any of the power conferences, it's pros. It's how can you get one NBA guy on your team? Can

you get two? If you can get one, you're going to finish in the top half of the league for sure. If you can get two NBA guys on your team are pros, legitimate pros, then you're going to compete for a conference championship in the Big Twelve. But if you

don't have two pros on your team, you're not. And you look at Houston, you look at Kansas, you look at Iowa State that it just plays out that way and then a really good supporting cast, and you know, you talk about gage mats, and you're right, guys are selling out, Teams are selling out and taking away. That thirty one percent is the threes he's taking. I mean, ninety percent of them are really hard threes to be taking.

He'll get some open looks occasionally, but they're very different looks than some of the other dudes on the team are taking. I think the BYU win at home was huge in terms of excitement and you know, I'm not saving your job, that's not the right way to say it, but just reinforcing, hey, I'm the guy to do this. I can be here and I can be successful here.

And then they have some good wins against you know, the middle and the bottom half of the Big twelve, and that's where I think Craig has to continue to win those games, and I think that he will. And they ultimately where they finished. They finished like ninth in the in the twelve which has sixteen teams, right, and so they're finishing middle top, top of the bottom type of thing, just because they don't have the guys and it's a whole different world now to go get the

guys right. I mean, everyone's talking about what's going down in Utah County. BIU is paying this amount of money for their team. It's professional sports now, and I think the other challenge for Craig is just allocating the right money to the right guys who can produce. And that's a challenge in and of itself. And so guys that are getting paid money on Utah's team, they're not producing, So what happens to them? And how do you take care of the guys that are producing next year to

keep them around. It's a huge challenge. But I think he's a good ball coach. Time will tell. I don't have a strong opinion if he's going to be able to turn the ship around, because there's a lot at Utah that's got to be turned around in just momentum and excitement from where it was when you and I were around, you know, playing and growing up. It's just a very different environment up there right now.

Speaker 1

And you know he is going to get a chance to see this thing through next season because according to Kassel reported today, the UTA Athletics reported a seventeen million dollar deficit this past year. Now you dig into the numbers what they received from the state, and it's not necessarily like, hey, we only lost seventeen mil and the football team and the basketball team are still profitable. But ultimately, I don't think they're going to pay Craig to not

coach next year. So I do think he is going to get one more year. But let me follow up with something you kind of alluded to, because look, the bottom line is, in the modern day and age of college athletics, whether it's football or basketball or even other sports, you have to have your collective in order to be able to attract talent and be able to pay the

players that you need to get here. So you have the horses, and from my vantage points, Betzer, almost every single night, almost every single night in this conference, Craig is going to have a coach on the other side that's we has more talents.

Speaker 2

That's my opinion. Give me your thoughts on that.

Speaker 3

Yeah, yeah, I'm with you most every night, maybe not every night, but most every night in the Big twelve. Given right now, now, when I heard the numbers, and I don't want to say it publicly because I don't have anything verified, I was actually pleasantly surprised at the number that I heard that Utah had for their collective. I was like, wow, that's more. Now it's a matter of just allocating it to the right guys and being

able to go get them. Is it less than, you know, the number that you hear from the valley or from Utah County? Yes? Is it more than the number that you hear up in Logan yes? Type of things. So it's the collective matters. What your paying dudes matters. And that's a whole nother conversation. But you're right, you have to go get it. And I may have said this to you before, but it's interesting. I had this kind

of epiphany moment where in Europe. It's funny I played with a bunch of differ guys in Europe and the same is true now. Is I still stay decently connected to it? There are not a ton of dudes. There are some, but there are not a ton of dudes that played at the blue Bloods that are playing in Europe. A few. I mean I played with John Shire and

the Deuhan was over there for a little bit. I mean there there are a few, but what it kind of opened my eyes to the elite teams in college basketball are one of two things, and most of it is the latter. Either really old and really experienced, or they've got a couple pros on their team surrounded by good college basketball players but not great college players that are going to go play professional and the impact of having I mean, you look at what Craig did at

Utah State. Great coach, but he had two pros, right he had he had Nimi and he had Sam Marrow. Of course he's going to win a conference championship in the Mountain West and and San Diego State, by the way, had one NBA dude and then a couple of year and pros on their team, so they were really stacked as well. But in the Big twelve, that's what it comes down to is how many pros do you have? How many NBA level guys do you have on their team?

Because I guess if we're going to play on words, all of them are pros now because they're getting played, they're getting paid to play basketball, so they're not amateurs anymore. So I'll articulate it better and say how many NBA level dudes do you have on your team? And right now they don't have any right, that's just the fact of the matter, and a decent number the Big twelve does have an NBA guy or they've got some European pros.

And there's probably a couple of European pros. He had Brandon Carlson the last couple of years, which was a pro And so can you go get those dudes, because you're right right now, you just don't have We talked about intellectual horsepower, he doesn't have the basketball horsepower to go and finish in the top three or top five of the conference.

Speaker 1

Right now, Let's move down to provo here and talk about a coach that certainly has the horsepower because the collective is stepped up. According to reports, both Yegor demon and Kenon catchings or seven figure players for Kevin Young. And you know, Cannon had a really nice game against Baylor in provo, but prior to that, it didn't look great.

You can tell why pro scouts love Yegor. I mean, he's really long, he's really big, he's got a good feel, he can see over the defense, and he's averaging six assists a game. Three point shot hasn't been great for him, but you can see why scouts love Yegor and over the past few games they've started to figure some things out. Mostly it's a make or miss team in a lot of ways, but three straight wins after that loss to Utah,

they've won four or five. I think Ken Palm has them of like thirty eight in the net and thinks they're going to be an NCAA tournament team. But I mean, talk about a coach that does have horses. But when you have the talent on paper Spencer, you got to prove you can coach, right, So what are your thoughts on what BYU has done this year and what do you think they can do.

Speaker 2

The rest of the way.

Speaker 3

Yeah, expectations mean everything. Right Going into the football season, I think people had really low expectations and Colonne blew it out of the water. Going into the basketball season, extremely high expectations and they've done well. But because those expectations are so high and the dollar figures you here throwing around, you're like, Okay, what's going to happen? I think Bill finish well. I think toughness and physicality have been an issue. I'm sure they're addressing it and that

they've got to address it even more. You know, when they went to Providence early in the season and just got just beat up, and I don't mean from a score standpoint, just physically just outmanned. And you've seen that occur. But that's gonna happen when you've got a bunch of freshmen, I mean, and you're playing those dudes, and they're going

to have to get tougher. They're going to have to get more physical, and especially when you get into the second half of conference and you get to the conference tournament than the NCAA tournament, Toughness, I mean, toughness always wins out. And so that's been kind of the question mark is how tough that team is, and early on I would say not very tough. I think they're getting tougher. I think kind of the the bigger picture for BYU,

and it's going to be fascinating. You know, are they going to continue down the one and done NBA almost like John Calipari program strategy, and just continue to try to go after those dudes, or are they going to spread that money around a little bit more and hit the transfer port of more and instead of paying the dude whatever three million, four million, five million, I who knows exactly spread out amongst two or three dudes that have played at other Division one schools and pay them

seven fifty to a million. But they've proven that they can do it already, and I think that's going to be really interesting to see how they play out, not just for this year, but I'm talking about from a program level. Are they really going to go all in on the one and done model or are they going to try to fine tune it? And a lot will depend on the success this year and next year. If they don't have success, and when I when you're paying that kind of money for a team, I mean you're

winning games in the NCAA tournament. In my mind, I mean that's if people are putting seven figures into guys. That's the expectation. And if they do that, they probably

continue to go down the one and done model. If they don't, then it'll be interesting to see if they pivot and try to spread it more with maybe less sexy, less flashy names, but guys that have you know, go get three or four dudes that have averaged thirteen or fourteen a game at other D one schools and showed that they can do it, and then you go that, Okay, let's get old model and let's compete that way, so it'll be interesting. Very talented, great coaching staff, a lot of money behind it.

Speaker 1

Last thing, your thoughts on the number one prospect not just in the class next year, but vortding to a lot of advanced scouts analyzing aj Debanta, he's probably the best prospect in three or four classes. And I always get a kick out of seeing people learn about BYU in real time. So he goes on first tag with his dad and announces BYU is the landing spot, and Steven A.

Speaker 2

Smith has never looked more confused.

Speaker 1

But they are going to have four or five months for the price of seven million dollars a generational prospect down in Provo.

Speaker 2

What do you think about that?

Speaker 3

Yeah, that the amount of buzz and the amount of hype. I mean, I was messaging with birds, you know, leading up to that, and they all along thought that they were a serious contender, and he felt like it was going to come down to them and k State and KU. I guess Kansas made a huge run at the end, but they felt like they had a legitimate chance, and sure enough, it wasn't delusion whatsoever. They did, and huge get.

I don't know the kid at all personally, only have seen him from a basketball perspective, and yeah, extremely talented for his size, his athleticism, his skill set is shooting ability. I mean, so we talked about pros making the difference. He's a pro that can make the difference and he will be, I mean more than likely next year, the most talented dude to step on the floor. Every time

b what you steps on the court. It doesn't necessarily mean he's the best player, but for sure the most talented guy on the court in this in terms of the ceiling and what he's capable of doing. So huge get for them, and then it'll be a matter of I mean you know this, you were around the NBA. When you have that kind of talent, coaching matters for sure, but managing egos, managing personalities, managing the locker room become

equally as important. And so whether it's the pat Riley or a Phil Jackson, I mean, Kevin Youngung and fortunately he's from the pros and so he understands and has been around, the managing of those egos and those and those personalities is just as important to keep the culture and the chemistry of a team together, and that'll be really important when you start getting that kind of talent in the house.

Speaker 1

You know, Spencer, you're a father, so chances are you make breakfast at times for your kids.

Speaker 2

Is that correct?

Speaker 3

I do? I Actually, you'd be proud of me. I'm making smoothies for my kids every morning.

Speaker 2

Nice smoothies. Nice.

Speaker 3

Well yeah, yeah, but yeah, I make breakfast.

Speaker 1

No, I'm just saying, like, when my son's in town, I like to make eggs for breakfast. And I just realized something recently, and I just wanted to share with you that you really have to watch what you say around those egg whites because they just can't take a yolk.

Speaker 2

It's not funny. It's not funny.

Speaker 3

It is hey. And you know what I was gonna say to you, And I don't know. I didn't know. I didn't know how to make a banana split. But guess where I went. Guess where I went to learn how to make a banana split.

Speaker 2

I don't know where'd you go?

Speaker 3

I went to Sunday School.

Speaker 1

Oh man, Okay, Now that's good. That's quality. That's quality. That's quality stuff. That's what George Costanza calls leaving on a high note, my friend, so I'll set you loose.

Speaker 2

Always a pleasure to hear your voice.

Speaker 3

Be well, okay, Spence, you're the man. Appreciate you and keep up the great work. It's an awesome show.

Speaker 2

Thank you, sir.

Speaker 1

The great Spencer Nelson pro Hooper overseas was a great player in college at Utah State.

Speaker 2

I always appreciate his time.

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