Good stuff today to start off with a historic weekend at Augustin National historic weekend for the Jazz just not a good way. Sixty five l's our next guest. Good to see her this morning. Asking the great questions that we've become accustomed to. From Sarah Todd, Utah Jazz be writer from the des Red News.
Sarah, Happy Monday. How are you?
I'm good? And it feels like at the end of every season NBA season, and particularly this one, after the year the Jazz had, I think I want to sleep for like three days straight.
I was going to ask you what the energy level is like? And it is a grind for everybody, but you guys on the beat, it's a different grind for you than it is for those of us that aren't there every night and asking questions every night?
What was this like? To cover? What was history?
For all the wrong reasons And we'll get to the potential reasons it could be right for this seventeen and sixty five Utah Jazz team.
Yeah, I was kind of having this conversation last night. I think that it was it was for sure fatiguing, and it felt like maybe maybe not that it was like that it felt longer than any other season in particular, but that it felt like it dragged on. And I think that maybe one of the reasons that it did is because the if you're looking at like the process Ara Sixers and their tanking, you don't even have to think about any of those players because there's no intention
of them being a part of the future. The whole point was get players together that aren't NBA ready so that they will lose to every NBA team, And so it wasn't really even about developing talent. But if you look at the like the Oklahoma City Thunder their tanking season, it was about finding specific players to place around Shay
because they already had their central figure piece. And it's a little bit different with the Jazz because I think through so much of the season, like you know, they're investing so much time, but also I'm investing so much time and trying to figure out, like do I really care about Knte George? Am I supposed to care? Am I supposed to care about Isaiah Collier? Is this really a player I need to think about? Worry about his development?
In terms of the Utah Jazz's future and when they eventually do start trying to win championships, and so I think that they're kind of in this middle ground where there's no central figure to place players around. There's not really types of players that they need to add because they don't know what types of players they really have yet, and so it's just there's this middle ground that just feels really tedious. Right now.
Well said, and you know today with Jay z and Will addressing the media contingent and for listeners out there, of course, we have it on our website.
We just played Zank, We're going to play well tomorrow.
They're all saying the right things, and it's one thing, and that's the trouble and kind of the complications Sarah covering a team in the spot that the Jazz are in because it's almost like political filibustering, like they're saying things that have portions of truth. Yes, they are laying a foundation, they're in the middle of building a culture, in the beginning of building culture, quite frankly, and they're trying to learn about their young players, this, that, and
the other. But they're also so non competitive. I wonder from your perspective, getting to know the coaches in the front office and the players. Who do you think is this the hardest song, who the continuous losing, the non serious approach about being competitive. Who do you think has the hardest time with what they're trying to do over there?
I think i'd totally put Will Hardy at the front of that, because he's the one that has to get players buying in and playing at a level that then makes the front office believe that they can evaluate with some accuracy whether or not those players are capable of being role players in the future. And he has to
get the players also believing that about themselves. You know, they look at the win loss record and they're having the doors beaten off by the Oklahoma States Under C team, and I think that that's probably a hard place to be in for Will. And then I also think about kind of the more veteran players on this team, John Collins,
Jordan Clarkson, Colin Sexton, Larry Markinn. Some of those guys are either in their prime or they're in the final years of their in Jordan's case, the final years of his career, and they're seeing it kind of go away with tanking years and not being near being on a competitive team or being able to win and I think that it's probably hard for them to think about this being the place where it might end.
Yeah, yeah, And we'll see what the off season brings. Justin was asked about that today. But of course, Sarah, the lottery and the draft will determine what the rest of the off season looks like. So let's dig into that for a moment, and let's start with a fun hypothetical. The Jazz have the worst record in the league. Now, the Flatten lottery odds mean that it's a fourteen percent chance to get number one, but it also means they will have a top five.
Pick, which is good.
Of course, I don't know where you're at with this this group. You know, the top five according to most in some sort of way with maybe certain variants, is Cooper Flagg at one, then Dylan Harper, Ace Bailey, vj Edgecomb, and Trey Johnson out of Texas, and most people then analyze prospects as far as what they do for a living every day, believe all five of them have a chance to be very good. But of course there does appear to be one tier at the top, and that
is Cooper. So let's have fun and say, on May the twelfth Lady Luck shines on the Jazz and the way that it never has and Cooper Flag is the selection at one. How does that color the context and the approach of what you think jay Z and Danny and everyone else is going to do this offseason?
Yeah, I mean, I think I think that that at least creates a bit more urgency in the timeline, not a ton because we have to remember that Cooper Flag turned to eighteen years old in December, and so he's got a long time. But then you kind of are able to do what I was talking about a couple of minutes ago, where well, you've got Cooper, you've got Walker, you've got Lowry and you can and you've got Colin Sexton. At that point, maybe you don't even have to worry
about trading away too many things. You probably want to open up the roster a little bit, but at that point you're starting to look at trying to create lineups and pick players that you think are actually going to work well together. It's not so much about just identifying talent for talents sake, but identifying the right kind of talent to put around someone like Cooper Flag who has the potential to be a number one guy in the future.
And then also if you get a guy like Cooper and you have kind of this nice looking foundation of a basketball team, then that might look a lot better for players potentially coming here to play with that group.
Trading is a lot more specific, because again you're looking for specific pieces that are going to work around Cooper, and so it just it gives more direction when you have a piece like that on the team instead of just kind of trying to just gather and mess talent without knowing where it's all going to fit into the puzzle.
If it is not number one overall, if it's not Cooper flag and I suppose it just depends on how well you know what the calculation is on some of these other players, and only you know Danny and Justin and their staff know what they think about Dylan Harper at two, or Ace Bailey at three, or VJ at four or Trey at five or whatever you know the take is on those other four players. But it does feel like those are the top five players as far as all the mocks I look at in whatever order
you want to go. So, if it's not Cooper and it's one of these secondary yet very good players.
How does that color what do you think the offseason looks like?
Again, I think that because some of these players are coming in with such a higher profile than some of the other young players that are already on this Jazz team, even if it's not Cooper, it starts to give a little bit of directionality. So like, if it's Dylan, then I think, you know, you picked Dylan at number two, then you you kind of have to go into that pick with you know, the money that would be guaranteed to that contract, and think, this is our point guard
of the future. So then you're not experimenting with Keyante Isaiah anymore. You can make Isaiah a backup point guard if you want to, but you know that's something that can be kind of nearly set in stone, is like, we're going to put him in this position, and that's our plan so long as it pans out. And so, you know, last year's rookie class was I mean, it was no secret that it was weaker compared to this one.
And so if you get one of those top five players, it at least gives you somewhere to begin to start to like kind of put in place things that feel like they're a little bit more solid than they are now, because right now things just feel like so fluid and kind of like a big shrug emoji.
Yes, accurate, Yes, that's an accurate emoji to use in this scenario. All right, Justin and Will in a different sort of way, they were both kind of asked today what will next year look like? And I'm asking you to read teeleies. I'm asking you to look into a Sarah Crystal ball because.
We have no idea.
I mean, the NBA these days, with the amount of player movement, coaches being fired, good players being traded, as Jay Z alluded to, with the Jazz clean books and draft capital, they are prepared should something exciting come their way. There are a lot of teams with very high payrolls that have decisions to make. Phoenix is going to move
off of Durant. They might even have to move off of Booker because they don't own it their own draft capital in twenty thirty two, and there are other teams that are going to have financial decisions to make where they're gonna have to jettison off good players. So we'll have to see what the lottery brings. We'll have to see what the draft brings. We'll have to see what
the roster construction looks like. But there is this draft coming up next year with the Boozer Twins, with aj DEBANTSI is going to be playing at BYU that has thought, and there are a bunch of other young kids. I don't know, but what I read about them, there are a lot of draft analysts that believe next year's draft has a chance to be as good, if not better than this year's draft. So the Sarah Todd take, what the six Utah Jazz seasons go look like?
Yeah, I've been saying that for a while, and I fully expect for the Jazz to tank again next season. I think that there are obvious variables that you're talking
about that could change that. If the Jazz get Cooper and then chaos around the league this summer does end up with them getting kind of a blue chip player like Devin Booker for example, or like you know, if if Yannis or Devin Booker or someone of that ilk and somewhere in between those players, right, if someone like that would be traded to the Jazz or for them to be able to offer a contract to someone like that, then the timeline changes because then you've got Cooper and
like a top twenty player, and and whether or not you're able to keep guys like Lowry or Walker throughout whatever trade it would take to get that kind of a player to come to Utah. But still then you've got kind of a foundation where it's too good to tank, and you might that's going to accelerate the timeline and it start to start it's time to start trying to
win games. That being said, I think that if the Jazz get Cooper but not like a big blockbuster trade player over the off season, they are not going to want to go into the twenty twenty six draft and not have a pick, because they that's going to be a very good draft. And you mentioned aj Debonsa and Cameron Boozer, and I also know that there's a lot of people within the Jazz front office that really like Darren Peterson. He's I'm pretty sure that he's out of Ohio.
He's one of the guys that plays on these prep teams that plays against a bonsa and he's very very good. He's incredibly developed for his age, and he's going to be a player that a lot of teams are going to want and so that's you know, top three right there. And I think that the Jazz would be more than happy to have any one of those three. And I don't think that they want to miss out on that.
And so if there's not a very very clear cut, big blockbuster move that happens, then I fully expect for the Jazz to tank again next season.
How do you think that resonates with this fan base? You know, justin today the first thing he referenced, and a lot of it was blate boilerplate stuff, and so you kind of have to focus and pay attention and then take away the things that actually are real. But one of the things Jay Z referenced is the Jazz fans packing that building. I think it's three hundred and
thirty three straight sellouts or something like that. And I think I was there for ten or eleven home games, which is the fewest in years.
I mean, once upon a time, I was there, as you know.
For everyone, and every game I was there, even if the opponent wasn't all that exciting.
The building was packed.
Now TV were down massively, Sarah, as you know, you know, during the heyday of the Quinn Gobert Mitchell Jazz.
The Jazz were second.
In the NBA and local TV ratings to the Warriors. And the Warriors, of course, with Stephen Durant and Clay and Draymond and that group were must see TV for everybody locally and nationally, and the Jazz what I read, they had the worst drop outside of one other team in local TV ratings in the league. So fans showed up, but a lot of fans turn their TVs off. And we've seen organizations in the past, including when you covered
in Philadelphia with Sam Hinkey. You said, look, trust the process, that was this whole thing, and after a while, Philly, a great basketball city, was like I'm out. You know, fans started, you know, they started just not just turning it off on TV. They stopped showing up at the spectrum whatever they're calling it these days. So what's an expectation for these fans to keep staying loyal if next year is a lot like this year?
Yeah, I think you know. Jay Z was talking about it today, The players have talked about it before. Will Hardy has mentioned it multiple times. The fans in the building and even just like general support when any of these guys are seen out in public is very high
and has remained high in impressive way. It doesn't surprise me at all, but ratings are down because like, you know, going out for a night to a basketball game, potential to see like stars on the incoming, you know, visiting team that all feels like kind of a night out and a fun activity. But it's not really a fun activity to watch a tanking team lose every night on TV.
Like that's not fun. So I get that. But I think one of the reasons that you know, the Jazz brass have all been so adamant about how much they appreciate the fan base and the engagement being so high still is because they know how important it is, and they know that it's unusual. They know that it's abnormal. We've seen I mean, I include myself because I've seen all these NBA arenas in person. Bad teams don't get
packed houses the way that the Jazz do. The Delta Center is very very unique in that, and I think that they know that this year might not be the end of that, and so it's they're kind of the lack of a They're not begging, but it's kind of like subtle wink wink, begging like, please stay with us just a little bit longer, right, because it's probably not
going to be like this for much longer. I would I fully expect after this upcoming season, the twenty five to twenty six season, I would expect for that to be the Jazz's last tank year. I think that after that they really have to start going for it and so, and it may not be good that that might not mean making the playoffs right away, but it'll mean trying to win games for real and trying to put together a roster that is actually going to be able to
contend within the next couple of years. And so I think that there's a sentiment behind all of these words and platitudes that's just like, please stay with us just a little bit longer.
Yeah, and we'll see.
Only the fans can decide, And if you decide that you want to tap out for a while, doesn't make you a bad fan, because this is a tough ask for a community that's used to competitive basketball. Before I said, you LuSE Sarah, one of the things that Will talked about that kind of perked my ears up when he was asked, I'll use the three examples that he kind of used the same desire for their off season with Keyante,
with Bryce and with Isaiah. He referenced with all three of them, they need to be in better shape.
He used different adjectives.
I think he said for Isaiah his conditioning needs to be a superpower. Said the same thing about Keyante. Then reference Bryce his body has to be his first priority. That stood out to me. I was not expecting to hear that with all read those players. What were you what's your takeaway with that, that dynamic that will use to describe all three of them this offseason.
Yeah, I mean, couldn't agree more honestly. I think, you know, for I'll just go through all three of them, and I'll even include uh, Kyle Filipowski is a fourth one, and that like we saw so many times and and Will actually, I mean he said I need Kyle to be more solid on defense, and the you know the sub tweet and that is like, your lower body needs to be stronger because you're getting pushed off the block constantly by guys that are.
Smaller than you.
So the it's all about the things that the that Will sees as potentially like points of potential for these players. But if they aren't able to maximize their literal physical strength and get into condition that makes them, you know, an athlete that can survive playing high minutes and heavy minutes in the NBA, then they're not going to be able to sick. And so for Bryce, like he cut down a ton of weight between last season and this season during the off season last year, and he needs
to just continue to do it. He needs to just continue getting in better shape because while he's a good shooter, he's not able to like run quickly off screen kind
of a lah JJ Reddick right or Steph Curry. I'm not saying that he's going to be that type of shooter for either of them, but like that, that's what really good shooters need to do, is they need to be a threat, not just a spot up or maybe you know, dribbling into the shot, but coming around screens really fast, and you have to be in really good shape to do that. For Keyante, he has to be able to be just a defender. I don't want to
say a good defender or a great defender. He just has to play defense and he needs to get stronger to be able to do that. And part of it is his strength, but part of it is the effort. He really has to put in some effort on that side of the wall, but it's tied to how much detail and attention he pays to his body this summer. And Isaiah also as a defender as someone who's going to be creating their own shot potentially and someone who
runs with the pace that he does. And that's probably the biggest piece is that, like he's a really fast player, which can be a huge superpower for a player who plays point guard when they play with that kind of speed, but he has to be able to do it for longer without getting tired, and for eighty two games a year plus.
Sarah, great stuff. Proud of you for not taking a bite of a bagel. Then try to ask your question like our buddy Andy did today. You handle yourself like a pro. Have a great week. We'll get you back on soon.
Okay, all right, thanks a lot, Ben.
All right, Sarah Todd You Todd Jazz beat rider for the Desert Red News. You can get her on Twitter to follow all of her work, the two times Utah Sports Rider of the Year at NBA.
Sarah is where you find her