Pro football with our guy, Mike Yam formerly the Pac twelve. That's how we got to know him, and now he's with the NFL Network. On a Wednesday afternoon, Mike, Happy Wednesday, sir, how are you.
I'm doing great. I feel like neither one of us should talk and we should just fade back up a little Pearl Jam better man.
I'm okay with.
That, Mike.
I've long said that NFL or excuse me, fmdjs have the best gig in the world. They come in, They're like, hey, it's thirty degrees outside and here's pearl Jam.
Then they chill for like six or seven minutes.
Unfortunately, what you and I do for a living, we actually have to fill the content.
Although you're not wrong.
All right, let's start with the uncomfortable stuff, which is a question I have for you about my freaking New York Football Jets. So it looks like they are going to move on from Aaron, which I applaud. He is a locker room cancer and he's not good at football anymore. So what do you make of where we find ourselves with the Jets? What do you think is next? Do you think they're going to bottom out? And try to find their way through the draft.
So this is a really big subject because if there's one team in the NFL where there's a real case study on what to do, what not to do, what direction, if you're thinking about going down.
And isn't a good idea bad idea.
I will give them a lot of credit in this regard, and you probably would agree with this. They went for it, and they had a really good team a couple of years ago that seemed to be deficient on the offensive side, so they said, hey, what's our best option right now? And they went and they signed Aaron Rodgers. And I think there's a couple different ways to look at this. It clearly didn't work out, and it's probably a good thing that both sides are free and clear of this.
But I will say this, they just trade for Devonte Adams right and were willing to continue even as the wheels were falling off, and they had fired Robert Sala at that point. They said, hey, let's keep building, let's keep trying to make a push here, and clearly it wasn't enough. But I think the organization had to say it in themselves. This is what Aaron Rodgers does. This is the offense and said he brings to the table.
He's at a stage in his career two years ago where it's like, yo, he wants the guys that are comfortable in that system understand where they need to be when they need to be there, and they're not going to make a bunch of play calls and not to go on a tangent here. I was talking to a polleague of mind an NFL network, Isaiah Standback, and he's
down in that Dallas area. We were together for the Shrine Bowl a couple weeks ago when the Cowboys decided to go a shot and Himer and he turns to me and you see, you know why this is a really.
Good move for Dak. It's because he doesn't.
Have to worry about remaking an entire offense right and like learning things from scratch, there's some continuity that is going to be in place. Rich On the him are in the fold, and I think the same thing could be said Faron Rodgers. They try to make him as comfortable as possible. Look, it didn't work out. The first season gets hurt, obviously. A couple snaps into the game and we're now seeing where if you're coming off an
Achilles injuries. Sometimes you're just not going to look right, like as Kirk Cousins, the Kirk Cousins that I saw for most of this year, or is he closer to the one that I saw two years ago when he's really healthy. I would argue like, Kirk's not as bad as what we witnessed there. I just don't think he was healthy. And I think as Aaron Rodgers started to get a little bit healthy as the season went on, he did start to look a little bit better, but you know, a little too late, and they had to
go and move on. I feel like I'm not even answering your question here, but it does feel like the Jets have two paths to go. Do we rebuild in this draft and I don't think that this is a great quarterback class, which is what they need. Do they find that bridge guy and insert him in in free agency to sort of piece this thing together? Maybe, but there's a part of me that says, you know, they might just try to pick this thing apart in the draft and rebuild.
Do you think Aaron's done? Do you think that's it for Aaron Rodgers?
No? I don't.
I think there's going to be interests because of who he is, and I think we saw enough flashes late and even where I think there's a team that's like, you know, maybe he's got a little left here in the tank and maybe it's good enough to bridge the gap before we go to either a young quarterback or we see what happens in the draft next season.
There's god.
I was talking with Brian Baldinger about this the other day. You look through the top ten, you make an argument, like, sixty seven of those teams need a quarterback. There's not six or seven first round arms in this year's draft, and lord knows, there's not six top ten quarterbacks in this year's draft. Last year, what we saw with the run of six guys go in those first twelve picks, like, that's not going to happen again this year. At least
it's not my opinion that that's going to happen. And if that's the case, guys like Aaron Rodgers, I think, do find a home. And by the way, do you think he wants to finish.
Out this way?
There's a part of me that says no, like he's he wants to get back out there.
Yeah, I tend to agree with you, and it only takes one general manager to believe that. And your point about going all in to at least give it a shot is very fair. And as a Jets fan who has for years wondered when they would actually do that, I will admit to having some sort of excitement about the endeavor.
It just didn't work out.
But let's move off the Jets, and that's actually talk about the game that was played, you know, just a few days back now, and one hundred and thirty seven point seven mili at its peak, and then you add the streaming numbers and the Spanish broadcast numbers. So my first question, Mike is how has football captured this market share? And do you think we're just in for this ride where they're because every year it's a new record, it's
not going in the wrong direction. Do you think we're on this trajectory where every year we're going to see the audiences grow.
I'm going to say yes, because there's a huge, huge catalyst coming and in my mind, it's the idea of the international audience and the expansion that is happening, and finding different markets in Europe, finding different markets in South America as well. They haven't even come close to tapping
the Asian market, Like I don't even think. I know there's an effort, and there's a lot of progress that's being made behind the scenes, but can you imagine globally, Because we talked about the NFL at least in headquarters as a global sport, and I think there's a real argument for it when you talk about these games that are selling out in Munich and Brazil, and obviously we're
going to get in Ireland right now. But that's all great, but when they haven't even come close to tapping that market, like I haven't heard the conversations about a game in Japan or China or insert you know in Asian countries. So I think that there's still a ridiculous amount of legs for this sport. You think about flag football being included into the Olympics, I think there's a lot. There's a lot to be said where that audience is going to continue to grow, which is mind boggling to me.
So I don't love the whole like what does one loss mean for a player's legacy? But I do want to ask you about the winning quarterback instead of leading the conversation with the Chiefs and Mahomes because I just and look, I am no NFL scout, and I am comfortable being an observer and having an informed opinion because I've been doing this for a long time.
But I'm not some expert.
I just was never on board with the conversation about Jalen. I just wasn't like it felt like they were intentionally rushing the football because I had a great offensive line and they have probably the best running back of this generation, and a couple of years ago in the Super Bowl, Jalen passed for over three hundred like he can throw the football. And yes, I know there are some numbers to be critical of and maybe the lack of accuracy from time to time, and he might have the best one two.
Punch as far as receivers in the entire NFL.
But I just I always believed that at some point that this dude was going to get it done. I've been a fan of his way back in Bama when he lost his job and stayed in college and stayed the course.
What did this win do for the narratives around Jalen Hurts.
I think it changes it dramatically, and I think you're hitting the nail on the head, and it was something
that was bothering me. I do a new podcast with Lamar Hurt, who I know is a buddy of yours and has probably been on the show a million times that we were talking about it last night, actually on the episode, and I said to him, like, I got to the point where I was really disappointed with and it's partly my fault too, right, Like I could have spoken up on like the five hour Super Bowl Live show that I did last week, right, like You're doing all this coverage and I'm thinking to myself, like I'd
get the low hanging fruit of legacy with my homes and going for a threepeat and the tailor shirt Travis Kelsey situation.
But there was one point, Spence, like during.
The week, I was working with David Carr and in one of our commercial breaks, I turned to him and I just said, do you see it the way that I see it? And he looked at me and he's like, where are you going with this? And I said, I see a world where the Chiefs win small like, for sure they can win this game. I mean, look at the season, look at the team, look at Mahomes. Of course they can win the Super Bowl. But I see
it where the Eagles can win a close game. But I got to tell you, I also see the Eagles smashing this team, and I don't see Kansas City being able to say the same thing. And he started to laugh and he said, I've been thinking the same thing, and I go, I'm not going to say that on air just because I'm the host, right, like he's the analyst.
And he did pick Philadelphia in that game.
They didn't think it was going to be a wrecking ball the way that he didn't say it was going to be a wrecking ball the way that it turned out. But as Jalen Hurts is on that podium spense, I started thinking to myself, why not the Eagles being the new dynasty. And I'm not suggesting Kansas City is going away.
All I'm saying is Jalen Hurts is young. Right, So they got a guy who's in place who two years ago was in the MVP conversation that who's built their coordinators two seasons ago off of that loss, and it was a bad year for Nick Sirianni.
It was on the hot seat. People were talking about this losing his job.
Now he's a super Bowl winner, they get stay Kwon Barkley, they got a young defense. Like, think about what Kansas City has done. They've built around the home. Philly's got Jalen Hurts, they got skilled position players that are in the fold. Kansas City kind of lost some of those dudes. But the reason why the Chiefs were in this game is because of their defense, fense, and what they've done
in this draft. Look at what Howie Roseman has done, their general manager Eagles GM, Like he's starting to build a team that's got young studs on the defensive side, on the front half of that, in that front seven, and in the back end. I just look at that and go, hey, Billy, I don't think is going anywhere. And maybe I'm just being dramatic because it's they're coming off the Super Bowl win. But I really do think the framework is there.
For this team, and that's where I wanted to go next. And I know you got to go in a minute. So I have one Kansas City question for you.
I got I got a couple.
I get a couple, So whatever you need, Okay, cool, Okay, I just got a text of a meeting got canceled.
Oh cool, Okay, great more Mike am is better for us.
So you know, we talk a lot about you know, Mahomes twenty nine, Josh Allen, Lamar twenty eight, Jalen's twenty six, and Sequon's twenty eight, AJ's twenty seven, DeVante's twenty I mean, look, when you win at a high level, you are going to lose coaches, which they have again, and they are going to be players that need to get paid, so they're not going to run it back entirely. But the bulk of their team is in place and they are young.
What are you willing to say about what is now possible after watching them just dismantle this modern day dynasty in Kansas City.
So do I think they can get back and win another super Bowl in the next two to three seasons?
Yes, I absolutely do think that that is the case.
We and you, and I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I've been on with you enough to know kind of like we think similarly in terms of some of the personnel and some of the teams that are out there are like, I don't think this is going you know, the hot take like the AFC has got better teams collectively but if you said to me, who are the most complete teams in the NFL, two of them are in the NFC and one is in the AFC, and that's the Baltimore Ravens, And then I
would throw the lines in with the Eagles.
You know.
And it's not to say that Kansas City is not good.
It's not the same.
Buffalo low if not good, or you know, the Houston Texans on the rise, whoever, you know what Washington's gonna end up being in the next couple of seasons. I just think right now, based off of those rosters, those three teams, to me, are the most complete. And if you've got the most complete teams, I think you got
a chance at the end. And to me, that's why I think Philadelphia because of some of those ages that you reference, and because they have a general manager willing to wheel and deal to get this team to this point. Like the Eagles always seem to be active, always seem to pull the right strings, and it's usually not a train wreck like they don't have like these god awful, you know, seasons where you just shake your head and go, what the heck happened?
Like maybe they don't live up to the hype.
But that's why I really do think like the Eagles absolutely are in the next the next couple of seasons.
All right, now, let's move over to the chief side of this. And you know, I don't know where you were at Will while you were watching the game. I was shell shocked. I thought Kansas City was going to win a close one because it just got sick of I thought Buffalo, I thought it was Josh's year. You
just get sick of picking against Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes. So, actually, before we get to the Chiefs question, at what point during the game, Mike, did you say to yourself, all right, that's it, that's a rap.
So d hops drop made me think to myself, like this just might not be it. And obviously at the end of the first quarter, Patrick's eyes got I sound like so dramatic, dude, Like I don't need to be that guy. But they're like, you know, like, am I
the only one who saw that? Like you're you're sitting there and you're you're seeing Mahomes kind of run around and you have flashes of the you know, a Todd Bowles defense in a huge game like the Super Bowl, just like the dude's head was on a swivel, and you look at the tackles on that offensive line and they weren't holding up, and they weren't holding up even when Philly wasn't think I think I saw this guy.
I should.
You would think I would have gone through our postgame research pack at like eight hundred times. But I'm almost positive that Philly did duplits in that game and still was able to generate that much pressure.
So when I see Mahomes have.
That type of looks, that's at that point I was.
Like, oh, like this, this ain't going to be good for these dudes.
Yeah, no, you're You're right, and he was seeing ghosts and that's what happens where every time you drop back, you're running for your life. I mean, I don't really view this, and I'm not a I don't think wins and losses are a quarterback stat that's just me. I mean, we kind of do the thing like Mahomes was eight to zero against Vic Fangio prior to the Super Bowl. But moving over to the Kansas City side, I mean Andy Reid's coming back next year. Mahomes is still in
his twenties. We'll see what happens with Kelsey. This does feel a little bit like the diagnosis we all did after the Tampa Bay Super Bowl loss where they couldn't protect Mahomes at all. They obviously have offensive line issues, but they're among the favorites in some sports books, the favorite to win it again next year because they have
fifteen hundred center. What does the offseason look like and do you anticipate a recalibration and maybe a second or third act with this Kansas City Chiefs team.
Look, I think they're going to be in the mix again next year because of the Mahomes factor, right, And I think it's even more magnified to me. Some people might say, hey, that's a lazy take, but my pushback on it would be think about what Mahomes was able to accomplish this year when there were clearly flaws on that team, and I think they were magnified in the
Super Bowl. And I think the one thing that Bert Beach is needing to sort of figure out here in the next couple weeks ahead of the draft is how do I fill some of these gaps? And there were gaps on that offensive line. People felt like the shift with Joe Tounei on that offensive line. Moving him to left tackle was going to be enough, and for eight weeks or so, it was.
But I think we forgot what the.
First half of the season looked like for Mahomes. Interceptions were piling up, sacks were piling up for him, and there was an unsteady nature around this offense. I think clearly they need a playmaker on that outside to go along with an Xavier Worthy be hop Unfortunately.
You know, wasn't that guy. They had to deal with injuries with Hollywood Brown. You know, they need to.
Figure out that backfield, but Checko was banged up, you know, like they just never really got that production. But first and foremost is how do you solidify an offensive line in front of Patrick Mahomes? And then how do you add some depth and some pieces on the offensive side, And more importantly, because it's the defense that carried them these last two years, how do you make sure you're
in a good spot. So I think you know, in no particular well actually in a particular order, offensive line's got to be like first, second, and third, and then it's another playmaker, whether it's a running back or a wide receiver. And we got to add some depth to that.
Defense on a couple of other just questions around the league. Then I'll set you loose and if you need to hang up on me, Mike, you know you can in my.
Feelings, So I'm good.
They just swift.
I know, I told Porter that I had now time, but they just they shifted my meeting. So like, I'm good for a few minutes whatever you need.
Okay, great, because I did want to ask you.
I mean, Jayden Daniels was nearly a ute and then he ended up down to Arizona's date and you were with the network and we had him in the Pac twelve footprint and I remember watching him and being like, yeah, he's fun, Yeah he's exciting, but come on, man, like nobody saw this. And I've got a buddy who's a Commanders fan, and we kind of below our football misery with me being the Jets fan and him being the
Commanders fan. And if you're a Commanders fan, now they've got some work to do because he was so good. I think he was able to cover up some real holes at Philly exposed. So what do they do this offseason to make sure they do not Wiye, who clearly is a generational talent and attendant to that, How surprised are you to watch this kid do what he's doing based off the fact that you saw the start of his college career I spent I was.
At his first start against Kent State. That was a game that was unpacked twelve Network. We were doing our road show there. He was the first, you know, true freshman to get a start in at the quarterback spot for ASU, and he played I don't remember the exact numbers, but I know it through like maybe two touchdowns in
that game and he looked good. And it's funny this time last year, as he's getting ready for the draft, Michael Robinson, one of one of my buzz and colleagues of NFL, kept telling me, he's like, yo, man, I think I might like I'm better than Caleb. And it was so hard for me to boot the skinny, thin kid, who, by the way, you know, goes to LSU and has eyesmen.
It's not like I need to see him play really well in his last stop, but it's hard sometimes to boot you those early perceptions that you have of a guy. He's been terrific. He's the reason why people watch the draft He's the reason why there are, you know, a bunch of teams in the top ten who feel like they are just one player away from changing the fortunes
of an entire franchise. And it's not to say that Caleb's not going to be good, but we saw bo Nick have some great flashes for a Denver team that we didn't think was going to be able to play as well as they did. Kudos to Sean Payton in that regard as well. The only pushback and by the way, I'm not the only one saying this, and I'm not saying it's going to happen, but no, c J Strout took a little bit of a step back, I thought this past season, and how do you ensure that that's
not the case for Jane and Daniels. I don't know what I would point to other than I think some teams figured out how to make CJ a little uncomfortable. They had some real injuries that they needed to navigate, and I thought that was a factor. They were rushing him defenses. I felt like he was under more pressure
this season than he was in his rookie campaign. But it feels like Jane's got a slightly different skill set because of his mobility, what he does with his legs, where he might be able to negate some of that stuff and be just as good, if not better, in year two.
So you're referenced Caleb, and it's interesting. There are a lot of people that have dissenting opinions on who he can be, and I like him.
I think there's a lot there.
I know that some people don't love the perceived Prima Donna stuff or whatever. I don't know, man, I think we saw a lot during his rookie year that indicated that he was getting better, and now they bring in Ben Johnson and I don't know, Mike, it's interesting.
I've never been one to like Nick Sirianni.
His opening press conference made us all cringe and we're like, is this dude okay?
And he just won a super Bowl.
There just isn't anything about Ben's personality that I've seen so far that makes me believe he's like a Dan Campbell culture builder. But maybe you don't have to be because he's so brilliant offensively. How does this look now that Chicago has an offensive minded coach for a young quarterback who I still believe can be really special.
Huge in it in such a meaningful way. I'm with you, and I think the people that I've talked to around you know, that team that franchise or at least no Ben. I think that's part of the concern, right, Like, can Ben get in a room and own it the way Dan Campbell can? And by the way, he doesn't need to be Dan Campbell. There's plenty of different personalities that
are out there. By and large, I think there's so much optimism around getting an offensive guy who can really work and mold the guy that I thought was a generational type talent coming out of school in Caleb Williams, you know, and I would give.
This context too.
Jared Goff was almost left for dead, and I couldn't be happier that this guy is balled out the way that he has.
You know, they've had.
Some great pieces in Detroit around him, but then was able to get the best out of Jared Goff. And now I think, hey, you've got a guy like Caleb Williams and there are pieces to that offense that are pretty talented. Can you get this team over the hum And there's a part of me that says, you know, They're one of those squads who you know, I thought they'd be good this year. Obviously there were some real struggles for him and the wheels fell off for him.
But I do think next year I would point to them as a team that would be one of the more dangerous ones.
Let me ask you about another Pac twelve kid, because as a Jets fan, I actually thought the Jets had found their future when they drafted Sam Darnold.
It did not work out, and maybe that's a Jets problem.
I'm sure Zach Wilson's family online too as something to that. But I was very happy for Sam to see what he did in Minnesota this year. Although it didn't end the way he was expecting, it feels like he's earned a shot somewhere.
Yeah, where do you think that is?
I think the Raiders potentially are a good fit. I know there's a lot of people pointing to Russell Wilson in that regard. I'm with you on Sam. You know, I made references. I said this the other day about say Kwon, and someone hit me up on social media and I'm like, oh my god, Like, you guys are so technical. I talked about how remember that Rose Bowl I said a couple of years ago, it was twenty eighteen.
You know, Sorry, my frame of reference sometimes, like I don't realize that I'm getting old and I'm forty three now, and you know, like twenty eighteen wasn't just two years ago. I'd also argue college isn't seen that long ago. But you remember that Penn State match against that Sea and you know, just kind of like the head to head stuff, and there were so much buzz around Sam and I know it didn't play out great for him in his NFL career, but this resurgence has been has been remarkable.
And I do think that while the ending was not great for Sam, Kevin O'Connell and like the position he was in at least in that last game raised a couple eyebrows for a few of us at NFL Network as we were doing some of our shows around it. It felt like there weren't like a ton of great adjustments in that game in that second half, and Sam obviously struggled. But Sam deserves another opportunity. I think he gets it, And you know, do I think he gets
like a forty million dollar, you know deal somewhere. I don't know if that's the case, but you know, hell, I mean, you know, three weeks left in the season, it was looking like that.
I don't know what he ends up getting, but.
The Raiders certainly look like a team that could be one of those squads that that would do.
Well with him.
I didn't mean to make this a trip around nostalgic pac twelve questions, but I have one more question for you before I say you lose, because we are in a market where we have a lot of Broncos fans and I was on the sidelines when Bonicks rolled into town with the Oregon Ducks and they just dismantled the Utes. But I was pretty skeptical about Bo's potential to play NFL football at a high level.
And I think he answered a lot of questions.
So I'm gonna ask you the same question before I said you loose that I asked you about Washington, I'm gonna ask you about Denver. What do they need to do to make sure that this momentum continues to roll and make sure Bo's ready to go for your two.
I don't think you're alone in your assessment and what you thought it was going to be. And you know, I think the two of us are sitting here going doing a double take, like, damn they played that well, bow balled out like that. I do think another playmaker is solidifying that defense with some depth around there. There were times as I watched this team and I just wondered, like, hey, like what would they be with one of the more
talented running backs in the NFL. Did feel like bo was under a lot of pressure to deliver, and by the way he did. You know, Jaden doesn't have Jaden season well next to the guy. I mean, it's sort of the same conversation, which is how good can Washington be? How good could Denver be? Well, it turns out pretty damn good. And while people wanted to see Cincinnati sinked into the postseason, it was Denver grabbing that last spot. And kudos to that team for having that type of season.
But to me, I really do think another playmaker. And I know we had to get to play with his college buddy and in Franklin, but I do think there needs to be more of a conservative effort on the offensive side to build a round bow.
Mike, before I set you lose, what is going on? Follow back? I just followed you again. On Twitter. That's so weird. I just pulled up your Twitter page. It said follow back. I've been following you for like five years. I don't know what the deal is anyway, Twitter's weird. I don't know if you've been following the news cycle about the dude the team's down the company. But it's kind of a weird, weird spot for social media right now.
I know they call it except Yeah, but before I set you lose fried Riyse and Marinara, you've written a children's book and you also have a new podcast. So tell our listeners where they can go get your work.
No, I appreciate it, by the way, Like I didn't even follow the guy who owns I don't want to make this political deal, but like it's almost like I'm on his timeline. Like it's kind of crazy to me, which is just wild.
Anyway, I appreciate it as always.
Man you mentioned in the book, it's a certainly a huge passion project for me, Privors and Marinarra.
It is on Amazon.
Just if anyone is purchasing a review would be amazing.
I do have.
Another one coming out at the end of the year. It was just corresponding with some folks about that.
Got some football ties on that one, and then.
All ball with Lamar Hurd, one of my best friends from my days at PAC twelve is obviously the TV analysts for the Blazers. We're doing a little West Coast, We're doing some NML, We're doing a little MBA conversation. It airs on the PAC twelve Conferences YouTube page and you can listen to it as well. So I appreciate you a mentally man, even just bringing that up.
Always good to hear your voice, my friend, be well with chat soon.
Okay, you're the best man. Take care.
I had the great Mike Yam.
We got to know him when the PAC twelve was a thing kids, look it up YouTube, and now I was with our friends at the NFL. Always appreciate Mike's time before we catch break out to tell you about my friends at Prize Picks, which is the best place to get real money, real money sports action. With over ten million members and billions of dollars in awarded winnings, Prize Picks has made daily fantasy sports accessible to all.
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