Did Aaron ask for this? Yeah, all right, that's what I thought. Indeed, we've got to giveaway. Do we need to talk about coming up a little bit? We won't do that now because it would be in poor taste. I'll explain later. Aaron Falk, Saltlet Tribune, Well played, sir, Happy Thursday, Hey.
Happy Thursday. Spent. I gotta I gotta say really quick. Uh, one of the oldest, the oldest I've ever felt in a sports world. I thought. I thought was watching Chipper Jones retire someone that I grew up loving, and I'm watching this at a bar and it's his last game. I'm like, I feel, I feel something. But I'll say, listening to the commercial breaks and listening to Emma Smith on behalf of Depends drop me to my knee. Just now, I feel a billion.
Oh man, I needed that today. Thank you, sir. That combined with the bump man, you're coming in off the top, rub coming in hot man. I appreciate the time. All right, Aaron, Let's start with the very eventful Saturday night in Salt Lake City last Saturday, as Brigham Young rolled up to Salt Lake and went down to Provo with a win. In their back pocket. They're now undefeated. You know what, let's just get right to the good stuff. The holding
call has been hotly debated. I don't think it's something that can be summarized with one reductive statement, like black or white in a vacuum. Yes, letter of the law. That is a foul, and b y U fans will simply latch onto that. And that's not wrong. I want to be clear, I'm not saying that it is, but
it is a little bit more complex and nuanced. I thought Joel Klatt did a good job of equating it to a strike zone in baseball, where when the yump establishes what he's going to call that game, it kind of mandates you to adjust your swing to that strike zone. But what was your takeaway from the holding call heard around the world that Saturday night.
Yeah, I mean I think I'm in that camp of you know, you look at you look at it, and you see, you know, you read the rule and you see, you know, once once as past the point of being blocked and you see an arm extended like that, you put yourself in position to have that that flag thrown right like you know, Well, one day we can talk
about the appearance of evil and the need to avoid it. Right, But when you get into that situation, if if in fact, and I'm not smart enough nor did I pay close enough attention to know truly how how many times or that that play happened and wasn't called or not. But clearly Kyle whitting Anfield's that that is a situation that they were allowed to get away with, not just in this game, but you know, in sort of Big twelve
play throughout the year. He said, there's there is a difference between pac full officiating and Big Fuell officiating in that regard. And to do that in a moment where you know the game is on the line, you're you're the largest crowded stadium history is celebrating and you have to do it again, That's that is gutting. So I understand the frustration, and I understand the gloating on the
other side. I mean, man, it is It's truly one of those things where it goes your way and you know you are we are a big believer in backing the referees and it doesn't and we hate them all. I mean, it's it is truly just dependent on your personal bias at this.
Point, yeah, one hundred percent, and that will color the judgment of fans for sure. I try to exist in the space of being a little bit agnostic when it comes to doing the show, so I can accurately do the job, and I like you, I get the frustration of the utes, and I get the elation of the cougars for sure. But let's move over to what happened
Aaron after the game. I was there, saw you and our guy ck up in the press box, and went down, watched the rest of the game on the sideline and went and said hello to Coladi and a Rod everybody after the game, offer my congratulations, and then kind of took the scene in dodging water bottles as I was right in front of the must a lot of water bottles being thrown, And as I'm making my way home walking across campus, my phone just blows up and all
the messages were did you hear what Mark Carlan just said?
And I said, now I'm walking home, And so somebody sent me the link to the social video and I watched it and I went, oh, no, he is going to be in so much trouble based off of what appears to be a pretty no nonsense guy, and brett Or Mark the commissioner of the Big Twelve, And I actually, Aaron thought forty k and a public reprimand was a good outcome when you question the integrity of the league and you use terms like they stole it from us.
I thought I'd wake up to a voice recording of Mark Harlan asking brett Or Mark to find him two more points. So it was not a great look for the ad who, in my experience, is a measured smart guy. I wonder what your takeaways were.
Yeah, I mean I was sitting in the you know, in the press box high above the field. Audio is pumping in all and so I'm not in that room. All of a sudden, you just hear the words I've been an athletic reretor for twelve years, and my fingers took over and I'm just writing this quote down as fast as possible because I know what's coming is going to be something extremely interesting.
Right.
I think this was a stunner, And you know, you you look around and there are just so many takes where it's like I've never I have not seen an athlete di record do this. You know, it's just it's so rare, and I think you're you're spot on to use those where it's stolen it is those are it's just inflammatory.
And uh.
The thing that I'm still scratching my head about a little bit and wondering, you know what brett yor Mark really feels about all this is the is that line. You know, we were happy to be in the Big twelve and tonight we're not. And and what whatever you want to say, We've we've heard for a decade how bad Pact twelve officiating was right and and now you know, if we want to talk about maybe maybe this is
inconsistent Big twelve officiating. But this is a to me, I'm I'm still scratching my head that this is a Big twelve problem in the eyes of Mark Harlan and what that actually means. And I'm trying to unpack that, and I'm not sure I have my answer yet. But I can see that line in particular, doing a lot of public relations damage for the university, and it spans at least in truck stop country, and it is a lot of a lot of public relations.
Damage sure, and it also does not help the narrative and I don't live online, but I certainly am a human who does this for a living, So you have to stay plugged in to some extent. And I think it's very fair to say that several members of the Utah fan base were very how shall I say, confidence about year one of the Big Twelve, and probably with merit because this team was picked to win the conference
by Vegas and the media and others. But that brought a lot of pushback from other people in the conference about the narrative that you think you're too good for us, you think you should be in the Big Ten, but you're not, and this is a necessary home for Utah until the next shift happens. And then when Mark says something like that, I just think it furthers the narrative that is permeating throughout the Big Twelve that Utah thinks they're too good for that conference. And you add to
the fact they have one conference win. It's just, you know, the Utah right now taking someone else in that direction. What are your thoughts on that?
Yeah, I mean no doubt, and I guess to go back to it, and you know, I think you could you could break this down in a in a level of conspiracy theory, and we tried to reach out to UH, to mister Harlan to get some some more information on what he meant here. You know, I think maybe maybe you can get some more. But I mean, if it's a big twelve issue, is it refereeing consistency or is it a big twelve issue that a conference leading team is getting set up better to be to be better
positioned for a college football playoff spot. I mean, I can see how some conspiracy theorists go down a very deep and scary rap, and that's where I'm really really like questioning what that means.
Yeah, that's a really good point, actually really good angle to take, because you just try to take him at his word and then give him the benefit of the doubt, because we certainly all deserve that. And I've had emotional moments in my life where I'd very much like a do over. I want to ask you one more thing about this, though, because I honestly erin from the minute I heard it Saturday night, I have just been thinking about his why why would you do that? You didn't
have to, ads don't do that? Is it showing his head coach that he has his back. Is it really believing to your point that something doesn't smell right here? Like if you're a smart guy, like if I guess the simplest explanation emotional after loss five straight l's heat of the moment, robbery game stuff from you know, the scale of simply emotional to all the way on the other side of maybe something's afoot here. Why do you think he decided to take that approach?
Yeah, I mean, you know, I and so I'll walk it back and be you know, more more measured now here. But I think you the most likely outcome in any in any situation is we are emotional beings. This guy was pissed off, right and and that's the only reason that you see him walking onto the field in in the run of play, uh and and drawing that penalty.
This is why you you know, you see him, you know, sometime after having at least enough time to pause and and and maybe have somebody say don't do this, to still be that fired up. I mean, he was clearly, clearly, clearly angry. I think that's the most likely you know, are we are we just sending a message or are
we just venting that? This has been a very tough year and in this moment when you think you have a chance to you know, save your season a little bit, that everything just boils over and that that's probably the most likely outcome. I don't know that it's as conspiracy conspiratorialism as maybe it could be, but nevertheless, like wow, like a few people could have stopped him, he could have stopped himself, and here we are.
Yeah yeah, and uh, you know, uh, the news cycle will move on and people will hone in on something else. I do think in ten years there and this will be known as the Mark Carlan game. You know, we we we often label these games with a beck to Harlen, a fourth and eighteen, a Brandon Burton block, a Brett Ratliffe. Crazy. This in ten years has to be the Mark Carlin Knight, doesn't it.
Oh no, no doubt about it. I mean, and and that is you know, I'll say this, We can will break this down with a with a level of of of seriousness and scrutiny as we should right now. And it is absolutely the thing that becomes lore that that makes uh college football something that we that we care about and and focus on because there are moments like
this there are, there are emotions like this there. You know, the stakes are this high in Mark Carland's mind even in a season like that, And that's why ultimately weak care, why fans care, why anybody's in that stadium.
What is your I don't know. I was going to say, what's your favorite part of the off field dynamic of that week? But what are what are some of the things you're You're a local, you're a resident. You are
an aggie, not a cougar or a ute. So you're a bit agnostic in a way where I think you'd have a measured approach to the question, because the off field stuff, to me has always been so fascinating when it comes to Utah BYU football specifically and the week leading up and then the reaction afterwards, because you've got a BYU fan base that so badly wants the moral high ground all the time that after the game you're getting tweets about send me every video of a youthe
fan that said anything bad to you, and we'll post it and we'll call them out. And then you've got like the other side of youth fans that want to call out the piousness and the judgmental holier than that attitude of the BYU fans and we're all this really weird, you know, extended family that probably has a lot of dysfunction. And I do think at the end of the day there's respect and love between the coaching staffs and the programs.
But what are some of the elements about this week and this thing off the field that stand out most of you? Oh?
I mean, I think just that it does create those types of bonds you know, within and we can, you know,
debate how healthy it is from time to time. But just the fact that you know, you you went, you went to the U. I'm sure you look across you know, you don't you don't have this bond because you shared chemistry class with somebody, right, you don't have you don't have this bond just because of of that moment like this, uh, like the game itself and what that means is is so is so responsible for the like the love that so many people have for their college experience that I mean,
I think it's it's a just so it's incredibly cool how powerful that is. Now sometimes it's a bit scary, but I think, you know, just just to know that there's something like that has that kind of ability. Is
is awesome. And then you know, I mean there there are so many like dumb and and good quality rivalry things happen, and like credit credit to the latter day sayings, so like that, put the score up in the in the hymns on Sunday afterwards, and are and are bringing our bringing smack talk to the pulpit in the name of the Lord. That is so funny. I'm sorry, it.
Is, it is. It's awesome. The whole thing is hilarious to me. It's you know, and when you kind of remove the emotion and just more mostly observe the whole thing, it really is a fun week. And I thought it was a fun game. All right, let me move over here.
So I did not know who Brandon Rose's mother was until today, So shout out to I think it's Laurie Rose, Laura Lynn something like that, she said I And I'm sure the folks up at the Utah football facility are just thrilled this today because she sent out a tweet that said prayers for Brandon please. This is Brandon Rose's mother via social media. He'll be having surgery today and Saturday night's game in the second quarter, just before halftime,
he tore his Liz Frank ligament. They gave him heavy pain meds and a steel plated insul so he could continue playing. The doctor couldn't believe he was really even able to walk. This is extremely painful and your foot is totally unstable. Fortunately, with surgery, he'll make a full recovery and come back stronger than ever. I'll be with him in Utah for a few days to outbout. We appreciate the calls, text messages and support now in the
order of fairness. Earlier in the show, I received a message from a source who will remain unnamed, saying he did not get shut up, nor did he get any pain meds, nor has any athlete ever received pain medication opioids to return to the sport At the University of Utah. He received an anti inflammatory pill and he did not have a fracture. And I'll just say that that's coming from somebody who would absolutely know. So what's your reaction to this That apparently it was a second quarter injury.
They marched him out there played in the second half. Maybe explains the anemic offense or performance in the second half, But obviously this is something that broke today and give me your thoughts.
Yeah, well, I will say this, like one thing that I always have to do in moments like this, and uh, it's it's hard and it takes a little bit of time. Is like, I truly don't know if this is Brandon Res' mom It probably is, but I have no like, no other other than someone saying that they are. That's the only like I followed that account because I have never had any interaction with that before. So I'm trying, you know, I think we're all trying to figure things
out in real time. And like I said, very very likely that it is. You know, I don't have any any specific reason to doubt it at the moment, but like I always kind of come from a place of doubt,
So I don't know. Part two, I am curious, and I'm glad to hear that that you've got that from from a source, because I am curious exactly how extensive you know, a halftime evaluation is in that moment, Like and just to say that there's no fracture would mean in my mind that there was an X ray right, like there was something something done to to to prove where we are, because I think the reality is, you know, you look at these guys and and you know, it
is a sport that breeds warrior mindset, right, and you're supposed to push through. Not only that, but you have a ton of adrenaline, you have a lot of peer pressure to go out and do it. So and and
and it probably a desire. I mean, Brandon Rose has been waiting a very long time to be a quarterback that plays for the University of Utah, right and here he is in the middle of his moment, playing well, and he's probably not incentivized to say, hey, you know what, I don't think I can go back out there because he doesn't want to lose his job. He doesn't he doesn't want to lose that moment. So, you know, do I I think it's it's probably imperfect on a lot
of levels. Do I think somebody was saying, Brandon, I don't care, suck it up, go out there and do it. Maybe not as much as as it is just internalized by the entire setup of you know, here I am, I have my moment. I cannot say take me out right, And so when he doesn't, look if he goes through those checks and he's saying he's gonna he's gonna go and he doesn't look bad. Then I think you have to be like, you know that that makes sense. It makes sense that that that happens from time to time.
The one that you know, I think I feel like just kind of eye test wise, rising against Arizona State was one where we're like, maybe he says he can go, but the eye test here says this is not working. Right. That's that's more of a head scratcher to me than than maybe the Brandon Road situation. But again, I don't know all the ins and outs of what happened in that medical check or not.
All right, buddy, before I say you loose, what was it like introducing the children to Gordon?
Uh? You know what? They love him. They you know Gordon Gordon brings a uh some some great historical knowledge and he doesn't take himself too seriously and he's down to help them out like that is the beautiful thing. I think a lot of people that have done these jobs for a long time and all of a sudden you get some eager, you know, twenty two year olds who maybe you know know or think they know things that maybe they don't or whatever it could, it could
red you the wrong way. Gordon is there to help out and it's awesome.
Gotta love it, buddy. Appreciate the time. Have a good weekend.
Okay, hey, you too. Take care.
Aaron Falk, editor of the sports section of the Salt Lake Tribune, and get him on Twitter at Aaron Falk is where you find him. And he's got two a's in Aaron, so check that out.