FULL WED POD @SpenceChecketts revisits Jazz reset, discusses Strugglin' Utes, UHC/Jazz + plenty more

All right, what's going on Drive time on a Wednesday afternoon, about fourteen minutes past the hour, two o'clock. Chili Cold Gray. It's called January on a Wednesday afternoon, But as is every single day, it's good to have you along for the ride.

Spence check. It's behind the mic.

That's Portal Arson behind the glass producing the program today on a jam packed Wednesday show. We will get you halfway through your work week. We will get you one day closer to the weekend. It's your one day closer to football. The CFP semi final is tomorrow, and then obviously throughout the course of the rest of the week. Second game will be on Friday, and then we launch into the wild card weekend in.

The world of pro football, in the world of the NFL.

So we'll get to the latest college football storylines on the show today to get you ready for what are hopefully, least on paper, I believe will be good games. We've seen some random blowouts, We've seen some games we thought would be blowouts actually end up being pretty close. But this expanded twelve team CFP that we're all kind of experiencing for the first time continues, and we'll see how it plays out.

We'll get you ready for these games.

Notre Dame Penn State coming up in the Orange Bowl, Ohio State Texas on Friday, and the Cotton Bowl. The lines have been pretty steady, which is always interesting. Ohio State remains a five point five point favorite. That over under is a healthy fifty three point five not gonna lie.

That line feels small.

Not telling you what to do with your money, nor would I ever outside of saying just don't bet on sports. You work too hard for your money. Keep it in your pocket, keep it in your bank account. It feels like it's only that close because the game will be in the great State of Texas. Of course, a little bit of a home field advantage for the University of Texas, but Ohio State kind of feels like the side there.

It's almost like best case scenario.

But I'll say this, the Jazz have been a lot more competitive even in losses as of late, and you're starting to see some things that indicate Will really is a very bright offensive coach and some of these players are starting to pop it away that I think is good news.

We'll talk some jazz basketball.

But Trey Young with a half court heave at the buzzer to send Atlanta to a one to twenty four to one to twenty one win.

Quinn Snyder in town texted him.

I told him I was a big fan of that last play call, and he said it's better to be lucky than good. But good to have Quinn back in town and some jazz basketball on the show today. Utah men hoops, Oh man, you know, it started off so well, started off so well, and Gabe was making some shots early and it was actually a pretty close game early on last night in Ames, Iowa, a place where Iowa State does not lose basketball games. That makes it twenty seven straight games Iowa State has one at home, and

So a lot to do on the program today.

Of course, still a lot of football to talk about, both college and pro. Lean into a little Utah Jazz and NBA today. Some college hoops on the Utah men's and women's side BYU lost again last night at home to Texas Tech.

They could not make a shot, could not hit the broadside of the barn.

So a couple of losses last night for our local college basketball teams. Good S lists on this Wednesday to get you halfway through that work week and one day closer to the weekend. We'll start things off with the voice himself, Bill Riley, Voice of the Utes, Roules will stop by Neil Smith behind the glass tack a little Utah Hockey Club from NHL our guy Ck, Chris Comerannie will be live.

In studio coming up at three point thirty, and.

Then Sarah Todd stops by as well, the Utah Sports Writer of the Year for the second time. So we'll bring in Sarah Todd today, Bill Riley, Neil Smith, Chris Comaradnie, Sarah Todd, Me, Spence Checkings, all of you, the great listeners, and that guy Porter Larson on a Wednesday afternoon, Were you watching in real time when Trey hit that half court shot?

I was not, but I was.

This is the funny part about about covering sports and having to keep up with him. I was like twelve minutes behind, right, and I got the notification right as he hit the shot, so it spoiled the ending. But that's uh, that's kind of par for the course. That seems to happen to me a lot. Because when you're trying to catch up and watch all of the games, you gotta you gotta pause, you gotta gotta go in and rewind record, and that's that was the case yesterday.

If in my opinion, yes, I mean, people can think differently. The Ute started out so well, man, there's so much promise. Gabe was hitting some shots, they were guarding, getting some offensive boards, and then boom, well you bottom fell off.

You heard what Sean Mooney.

Had to say on the show yesterday, which was if you talk can shoot the lights out, which they're capable of doing, they can stick in this game. That's what happened early on. And then, like you and I talked about Spence, I just thought, if they could keep it around that spread, right, I think it was sixteen seventeen, eighteen points or something last night, that's that would be a positive result for Utah. Now, they lost by twenty three, but the game was within that fifteen to twenty points

God bless you. Good job. What No, that's as positive as you can make Last night, I can't do any better.

Is that better?

Is that not the best they've looked in conference play?

Well?

Sure, Utah basketball don't lose by seventeen our new mantra. All right, we'll bring in Ryles right out of the gates today before we get to Bill on a Wednesday. Courtesy of our friends at Standard Restaurants Supply your tailgate headquarters get everything you need to make your tailgate epics. Stop by their location thirty five hundred Southwest Temple or online at Standard restaurant dot com.

It's time now for your opening tip.

Welcome to the Drive with Spence Check. It's on Utah's number one sports talk Now into the studio of ESPN seven hundred to set the scene for the show. The opening tip of the Drive is brought to you by Standard Restaurant Supply, your one stop shop to build the best tailgate in town. Standard Restaurant Supply thirty five hundred Southwest Temple.

So I'll just say I was caught a little bit off guard last night after the show when I was sent a link to an article by Joe Coles of the Deseret News. Shout out to Joe Coles forgetting the exclusive with Mark Carlin. Mark Carlin decided to give his exclusive to the Deseret News. And you know, so Mark will be on the program tomorrow with Sean O'Connell. So Sean's show in the midday, Mark's going to stop by

Of this piece that Joe wrote.

But really a couple of months after Mark decided to take the podium following the BYU Utah game and that game, you know, when we look back on that game in ten years, I do think it's going to be the Mark Harland game.

And it wasn't just taking the podium.

Mark ran out on the field while the game was still in action at the end and had some very colorful things to say to the officials. At least that's what it looked like from my vantage point. I was down there on the sideline, and we know what he said after the game. That does not be that does not need to be rehashed. We've talked about it quite a bit. Mark was publicly reprimanded by the Big Twelve.

Incident went down.

But nonetheless, here we are, so here, here's a couple of the highlights before we catch a break.

To bring in Bill quote.

I think, as we talked about last season, just like I would say there are things that need to improve as we head into the next year, and I would say the same of myself. I think that night, obviously I reacted emotionally and my frustrations were expressed in a way that was not worthy of a true leader of a program of this stature, and certainly, as any leader should,

He reached out to Brett Yormark to apologize.

He said, he reached out to Tom Holmo and Colonie said TAKEI to apologize. He continues, quote bringing the Big Twelve and diminishing our participation of the Big Twelve was, in my view, inappropriate. As my statement said immediately after the game, I don't want at all anyone to think that Utah's participation of the Big Twelve isn't something that

But let's welcome in our first guest on a.

Wednesday batting leadoff because of his blazing speed, he can lay a bunt down and get to first. The voice himself, Bill Riley on a Wednesday afternoon. Rile's happy Wednesday, Sir. How are we doing, Spence?

I'm good And just so you know, as I listened in to the end of the Drive yesterday, I respect the sanctity of the Sportscaster and Broadcaster of the Year award, So I was very happy for Craig Bowler Jack because it's very important as a former winner myself to respect the sanctity of the Sports Broadcaster of the aarward.

See, I'm very grateful to that's your attitude, because I have my questions written down and right out of the gates. I was gonna ask you about the beef because now you've got company. You got so here's what we could do. Okay, you could be a little upset that now next to you is Craig who has also won this award three times. Or do we get robes and treat it like the Five timers? Club at SNL where you and Craig can just wear robes and brag about your awards.

We were gonna get brandy, sniffs and cigars to go with the robes and just kind of sit back and enjoy ourselves.

See.

I think that's the play.

I think we could create like a YouTube series, the Three Timers Club, which is you and Bowler.

But I'm relieved.

That there's not anger. I was just afraid there was gonna be a beef, you know, no beef.

No beef again, much like Hot or Not Wednesday, since it is a Wednesday and peace. Indeed, I respect and preserve the sanctity of the sports broadcaster of the award.

Thank goodness. That's such a relief, and it is an appropriate day. And if the kids don't know what how or Not Wednesday is, it's probably good. So we can just move on from it, all right, Bill Man. It started off last night and it looked okay. You know, Utah basketball. Gabe was able to get loose a couple

Too many turnover spence. They ended up I think first half twelve eighteen for the game. And the thing about a team like Iowa State, especially when you've got great guards, is you know, they punish you when you turn it over. They turned those eighteen turnovers into twenty five points and to twelve in the first half. Eighteen points. You just the game plan was sound. They played hard in those

And in a way, Bill this team lacks what I think Craig's team has lacked for the most part. There have been some exceptions here or there, but there just continues to be no ball in hand playmaking initiator who can get his own or get it for his teammates. Now, that's not a mandate, right, So like, for instance, Will Hardy and the Utah Jazz, they play a free flowing San Antonio Spur type system because they don't have a Shay, they don't have a Luca, they don't have a Jalen Bronson.

I think the hope is Miro Little can become that guy. Obviously a highly to guy, four star kid. He just didn't play very much at Baylor last year. He had a lot of veteran guards in front of him. Plays internationally point guard for Finland. You know, he's growing into that, and I think the hope is because he's a pretty sturdy kid at the point that he can grow into it. He's not there yet, he's not, but I think the hope is with a little bit more seasoning that maybe

Man, I'm just looking at the Big Twelve standings.

I'm looking at the schedule.

Oklahoma State's going to be here in Sault Lake, and you know, I'm not going to be overly dramatic to wonder whether or not they're going to win a Big Twelve conference game because it's college basketball. Game will get hot one night, you know, the other team will show up and not necessarily be into it. Oklahoma State might be a good shot for them to get a win

Well, I think you hope to see the fight and the effort that you saw last night. You're right. Oklahoma State hadn't won a game in Big Twelve play till last night, and they beat Kansas State, I think, by fifteen in Stillwater. And Kansas State's not been quite the team we thought, but that's a fifteen point win, any kind of win in the Big Twelve in conference play,

State actually had one more question because on the broadcast last night, you know, we used to have this saying for Quinn it was February Quinn. When the camera would catch Quinn Snyder, he looked like he hadn't slept for like five weeks, looked like he's not eating any like real food, and it just got a little loose for our guy. And typically I don't see that on Craig's face, but I did last night. Under the eyes are big. You can tell he's wearing this, you know, on his shoulder.

Now.

Look, as you know, he is a prince of a man. He's the best guy, and he's one wherever he's been. It's not like he forgot how to coach. I just don't think they have the horses night in and night out. And hopefully that can change. But you do the Coaches Show with him, you travel with the team. How do you think this is wearing on their head? Coach?

How do you think Craig's holding up?

Well?

He has joked about it on the Coaches Show and even with me on some pre games. Yeah, he is. He is a guy that wears it because he is so driven to win. And he said, you know, I've spent a lot of late nights watching tape, breaking down tape. And it's not just that, it's you know, when your team's not doing what you want them to do, you start being introspective. Craig talks about this all the time. It's one of two things. Are they not getting it

Let me just follow up and ask you how it seems to be affecting these young men, these players you know, who, of course, are trying to put in the work to get better. But as you travel with the team, do they feel like they're connected, motivated, in good headspace or is it do you think it's getting to them as well?

Well, I think losing probably frustrates anybody. But I'll say this, this is a really good bunch of kids and really well connected. And I've not seen any you know, in fighting or anything like that. They are still a group that likes each other a lot. You're not seeing anybody, you know, pout at the end of the bench or walk off or be by themselves. It's a good group. So I think if you're a coach, you're like, Okay, you know, these guys are connected, they like each other,

All right, let's do a little college football before I set you loose for a Wednesday and before we land on Utah, specifically on Monday morning. I just sat down. I thought this would be a fun little thing to do for the show, and I'm like, all right, just do the best you can to try to see where you're at for Big twelve football next year. Just like I.

Don't know, Man, I have no clue.

I keep talking about I keep using this line where I've kind of leaned into diagnosing instead of prognosticating. Because college football is this new, like living organism that we're all witnessing for the first time, with a new playoff format, new rules to add talents, the ability to pay players and unlimited transfers and all those things. But if I asked you in January, like where's your head at as far as how the Big Twelve will look in the fall, like what's you're in, it's sure reaction.

I have no idea because Arizona State was picked dead last and they finished first this year. I mean, there's reasons why Utah struggled this year. It's namely injuries at the quarterback spot. But this league's it's a good league, Spence, there's not I know, as bad as badly as people want the Big Twelve to have a powerhouse, they don't have anybody that's on par with Notre Dame or Texas

It was such an exercise and futility. I'm like, dude, move on to something else, like focus on there's no content here for the show. Move on to something else. But I will ask you this. So I was thinking about this tough the prism of K State because K State and Utah are kind of built in a similar way.

They're a recruit and develop program.

Both of them are and Most of the success for k State in the past and Utah in the past has been from second year, third year, fourth year. You know, guys that have been in the program for a long time and understand what they're asked to do. As Kyle says, are you physically capable of doing what we're asked in you to do?

And do you mentally understand the task?

Is it still possible to be successful in college football with that mode of operation, with that being your ethos, recruit and develop and then rely on your players that have been there two, three, four years, like both case State and Utah have in the past.

I think you can to a point spence, but I don't think that that can be the only thing you rely on anymore. I think that's got to be part. I don't think that there's a one way. This is how we do it, this is how we've always done it. I think you have to have multiple paths to that. Yes, I still think you have to recruit. It's eighty five guys. You can't roll your roster every year. You've got to develop some guys in your program. But you've also got to be wide open to the portal and the transfers.

And it does change the way that you have to coach. I mean there's more urgency now right like when you get your hands on these kids, when you're able to get them on campus, when you're able to hold workouts, when you're able to start to show them what you do. You cannot rely on the knowledge they're absorbing now to pay off in two or three years, like as soon as they're on the ground.

It's like go. And it's always urgent. But for you know.

For coach with and Utah football to continue, and it would to continue what is still the golden era.

We're two years removed from Rose Bowls.

To get the team two years ago to eight wins wasnts I mean last year sucked, we all know that. But for Kyle and Morgan and that staff to continue what I perceived to be the golden era of college football, the urgency to try to acclimate right away when the kids get on the ground, it's like heightened. You know, that's got to be a tough task to try to get these Now, the good news is, I guess everybody

Yeah, I think it goes back to what I was saying a minute ago. I think you have to simplify your philosophy just a little bit. So guys that are coming in that have played football other places, you know, again it's you're still speaking the same football language. It's just kind of different dialects. So I think you have to simplify it down a little bit to what they

And you know, to the point of continuity, I suppose if that's kind of the deal. When it comes to familiarity right out of the gates, it can only be good news that Devin Dampier played last year for Jason, right. I mean, it would probably be different if Jason wasn't bringing his quarterback with him. But because Devin is familiar with what he's being asked to do, that continuity is not something you have to build from the ground up.

I guess that's one way to look at it.

Yeah. Absolutely, And your most important position on the field is in lockstep with your offensive coordinator. You've also brought a couple of other new Mexico players to the program as well, and that's not going to hurt. You bring a wide receiver to the program that now can help the wide receiver room. You bring a running back to the program that can now help the running back room. So I I think all of that certainly helps. On

So it's been a few weeks since we've been able to catch up with you, and since we last spoke, Keanutanavasa has decided to head down and play for Kilane and head down to Provo. And you know, he took some heat and you understand why. I mean, he took to social media to kind of chastise players who claimed they were all in and then left. Like Cameron Calhoun, I always I continue to give a little PSA every day on the show. You always have the option to

Well, here's the thing. I've always said that kids need to go where they're happy and where they're going to thrive. You know, we don't tell a kid that's a that's an engineering major that he can't leave. These kids are football majors. Let's just say that right now. Counta Tatabasa. He is a guy that's going to play on Sundays. He's a professional football player. He's going to be that at some point in time. And if he's going to

Yeah no, well said, well said, real quick. One more football thing. Now, Look, as you reference, there's another transfer portal window that opens up in the spring. But it feels like for now this is the group right feels like for now it's twenty five incoming freshmen, sixteen transfers, forty one new players. So is that your understanding, like, for right now, this is the group we're kind of expecting. Maybe for springball, Yeah.

That would be my guess. There might be maybe an addition here and there, but I think most for most, for the most part, where Utah is right now and where most of these teams are right now is pretty much what you what your spring window is going to

Right before I say you lose. I want to circle back to a topic that we've discussed. You and I have discussed it, and everybody has discussed it for years. But every time basketball season rolls around, we talk about and debate and try to maybe find solutions, be solutions orientated as to why that building is empty and has been for look a long time, if we're being real, there has not been consistent attendance outside of a year or two spike since probably the late nineties when I

It's not the only thing they want.

But if Kyle has a recruit in town for a Saturday night game at Riceycle Stadium. He can just point up to the stands and say, look, do you want to play in front of this? Now, on the other side, if I'm a Utah basketball fan, I'm saying, give me something to cheer for consistently. So I'm not blaming anybody

Well, I think it's you know, some sustained success probably brings more people back to the games. I know there's a lot I talk to a lot of people and they're like, yeah, I like Utah basketball, but I want to see them win a little bit more. And I said, you know, like you said, it's kind of a chicken in the egg. Well maybe if you show up, you know that that helps the winning, That creates a little bit more of an atmosphere. I don't have an answer.

Chiefs win the Super Bowl. And if not, who keeps you up at night? Who you're most scared of?

Probably the Bills. They they're just Josh Allen and hey, Lamar is fantastic. The funny thing is the Chiefs have beaten both Josh Allen and Lamar in the playoffs in recent years. But I think one of those teams are probably going to knock each other off. But there's something about Allen when he just seems he seems to put that tape on and go nuclear. They make me probably most nervous. However, the games are at Arrowheads, so I feel pretty good about it. Maybe somebody in the NFE.

Yeah, I just think with fifteen hunderd Center, you're gonna win. I just think you're gonna figure it out. And yeah that look, there's there's something about Jared Goth that still gives you the you know, just just makes you a little bit nervous about what it's going to look like in the biggest of moments because he's never been able to break through. But that that offense right now, you know, it seems incredibly potent with a bunch of different dudes

I hope. So, uh do you want Rex Ryan back?

As the head goes, No, absolutely not, of course not.

No.

Mike hire Mike for Abel, hire a coach. That makes sense, And you got to break it down. You got to get like, go take some ayahuasca, talk to a caterpillar, enjoy your remaining years. Aaron like, you have to move on from the entire mess. But no, I do not want Rex Ryan back in charge.

Is there a candidate you love?

Rabel?

I want Mike Grabel. It makes it makes sense. But he might go to the Pats.

If I were I don't know where i'd want to go if I were Vrabel. I mean, the Pats are certainly there. There's been the buffer coach with Grod Mayos. You're not following Belichick directly, but yeah, they also have a quarterback, and the Jets are a little little wonky at quarterback right now. So I'd probably lean toward the Pats, but I'm not sure.

Yeah, we'll see. Well. Enjoy uh once again cheering for the team that's probably gonna win the Super Bowl.

It's good to be a chief sand Bill. Thanks for the time, buddy.

Okay, Uh, Bowler and I we've you know, we would be glad to wear the robes, the snifters and the cigars and come in studio together.

Wait a second, porter, did you hear that I got that recorded? Okay, Bill Bowler robes, sifters, whiskey, three times Sports of the Year, the Three Timers Club rows.

We're gonna make this happen.

Thanks Ben, all.

Right, voice of the You, It's Bill Riley. One hour down, three hours to go. We've got Neil Smith coming up, Chris Camroanian Studio, and another trophy holder, Sarah Todd. Utah Sports Ride of the Year. Busy show on a Wednesday, don't go anywhere. Utah Hockey Club is about to start a seven game home stands. So a bunch of home games now for the hockey club, who as of late they have not been playing well at all, but coming up tonight, one of the best teams in all of

Neil, Happy Wednesday, sir, how.

Are we doing?

Happy Wednesday? I'm good. I missed you last week. I was stuck with a little bit of COVID there and miss Christmas and miss Star time together.

Well you miss Christmas? How do you miss? Like Christmas still happened? Neil, you just couldn't be a part of it. Is that what you're saying.

I just couldn't be a part of it. I didn't want Santa getting COVID.

Oh do you know what you are? A prince of a man, because if Santa got COVID at your house, he cannot deliver gifts.

So I appreciate you being selfless that way.

And that's what I was thinking about when I when I said to Santa, had put out a sign don't come here.

I love I love it, I love it, sir, Thanks for the time. So let me start with the Florida Panthers, as I just reference, only the Edmonton Oilers have shorter odds in Vegas to win the Stanley Cup. What do we know about this team who's in Salt Lake to play the hockey Club tonight.

Well, what you should know about them currently is it, believe it or not. As good as they are, they're in a gold drought. They can't score goals. They're having real trouble scoring goals, which I know sounds ridiculous for that team, but it's true. They've had real problems in their last couple of games. Said their goaltending has been

So the recent form for the hockey club has not been good, and this Neil has been a theme of the season. After a red hot starts, they got all of our expectations probably out of whack. It simply has been up and down, up and down. From mid December to nearly Christmas. They had a streak where they won six of seven, and over the past seven games they lost six of seven, two of those overtime losses. So what gives as of late is this the nature of

I think you're going to see mountains and valleys all year. But remember that they played really well against Dallas and Dallas as a contender for the Cup as well, and it took over time to beat Utah in Dallas, so I thought they were playing really well. And usually what happens in a losing streak is that you play really well in the last couple of games before you break out of it, and that's what I'm hoping. Because they did play well in Dallas, they did play well in Calgary.

Now, having said that, there's still only four points behind the Vancouver Canucks. As far as the wildcard race, you know, the Avalanche would be the first wildcard team with fifty one. Vancouver has forty five points, and it's Calgary. It's the Blues, only one point a head of the hockey club, and the hockey club's at forty one points, so they're not far out. Neil, I mean, in coach Tourney to your point, often talks about even during these roughs patches that he

Yeah, and they've got three games in hand on a couple of teams they've only played thirty nine. They've got three games in hand on the same Lewis. So when you see s Lewis is one point ahead, well they're really not, because if the games were even, you'd have to give Utah at least four points out of those the points that would be available in those games that would be you know, three games would be six available points max and then and you'd have to think they

You know, it's interesting with this home record as you reference, you know right now five seven and four, and you know, I don't know if there's anything here, Neil, but I wonder and look home ice advantage in the NHL oftentimes is not as prevalent as home court advantage in pro basketball. I mean, for whatever reason, teams can go on the road in the NHL and certainly Stanley Cup playoffs and

Does that make sense? Like this is not a spot.

Where these players have lived for years and years and years, and maybe that's one of the reasons they don't seem to be as comfortable at home. I don't know, I'm just thinking out loud, what do you think about?

You know what?

We can't read into the psychology of it. I don't know either, But I do know that when they were playing in that little bandbox in Arizona and in Phoenix, in that Mullet Arena, which was a college arena, they

On the other side, Neil, they have twelve road wins, which is good for fourth in the conference. Only Minnesota, Winnipeg, and Colorado have more road wins than the Utackey Club. They have more road wins in Vegas, they have more road wins in Edmonton, Vancouver.

I could keep going.

What does that say to you that this young team seems to be able to go away from home and get good results.

Well, what it says to me, in my intuition, is that they're a group that's very close together, and they're bond well together because when you're on the road. I can't emphasize this enough. There's twenty five or thirty in your traveling party, whatever it is. There's twenty players and whatever, trainers and coaches and all that stuff. The only ones in those building, in that building on the road that want.

You to win, just you guys.

The rest of the eighteen thousand all want you to lose. So there's sort of a thing there. It's us against the world, and sometimes when you're on the road you can use that, and if you like each other, it's even better. And it seems to me that you can't do well on the road if you're not a team

You know. I was, as we referenced earlier, I was looking at the Vegas Ods as far as who they like to win the Stanley cub Utah Hockey Club plus seven five hundred.

Nobody thinks the hockey club is winning the Stanley Cup.

But right in front of the Utah Hockey Club is the New York Rangers at plus five thousand. What's going on back there, Neil, what's going on with my Rangers?

Well, it's create.

You know, the team imploded. We talked a little bit about this two weeks ago, and since you and I have talked, it's it's not gotten any better. They played Dallas last night in Madison Square. Garden got a three nothing lead on them early in the game. Dallas scored it near the end of the first period to make it three to one Rangers going into the locker room. The game ended on an overtime goal by Dallas to win four to three. So or five to four, sorry,

What and you know, I'm putting you on the spot here, but we're gonna expand our imagination in the New year deal. We're going to get really weird. And I know there's like the Carolina Hurricanes, I think in the early two thousands, you know, the Mighty Ducks, who are no longer than Mighty Ducks. I know there have been long shots that have won the Stanley Cup. I don't know that that's ever been there's ever been a plus seven thousand, five

Know, if you should really be smoking whatever that would be that would make you think you could win the Stanley Cup. But I will tell you that the biggest long shot win had every series. They were the road team on every series, meaning that the other club played four at home and only three in this team I'm going to say's building was the La Kings when they won their first Stanley Cup. They were an eighth seed in the West and ended up winning the Cup, and

So what you're saying is, maybe don't put money down on the Utah Hockey Club to hoist the cup this.

Year, not this year.

If you want to put money on them to hoist the cup, just wait at least till the summertime.

Okay, fair enough. Let me fill up with this because according to the Vegas ods, they're essentially saying there are three teams that have a legitimate chance. And look, I'm just talking about the odds because crazy things that could happen. As you said, eight seeds going on to win. But Edmonton, Carolina and Florida are the only teams that have short I'll call them short odds in Vegas. Everybody else has at least plus one thousand, including Dallas, New Jersey, Toronto, Colorado.

I could keep going.

Do you believe that the Stanley Cup winner will come from that group of three Edmonton, Carolina or Florida.

You know, Vegas likes they love Edmonton. I don't know why when I mean, I know they went to Game seven, but they've never really to me, shown that they've got that Stanley Cup pedigree. They've got two of the best players in the league, for sure, but I think and Carolina, I don't know that they have the goaltending to win. They you know, they're going to have a goaltender to prove that he can win, has to do it. In

Why does in Vegas like Winnipeg who just won't slow down. They're plus sixteen hundred, I mean, they're smoking everybody, and I ask you about them every week, but they're not even close as far as the betting outs go to even making the Stanley Cup or hoisting the thing.

Why do you think that is?

I don't know unless the guys in Vegas don't have a clue where Winnipeg even is on the map, you know, I mean, it's it's probably antithesis of Las Vegas is Winnipeg, Manitoba, where my mother was born and raised one of the coldest places on earth. But you know that Winnipeg's even behind Toronto, and Toronto has not had the year that Winnipeg is having and enjoying. They and Winnipeg has Connor Hellibuck who won the Visita last year, and I will tell you is in my mind is the odds on

So we already saw Chicago move on from their coach, Luke Richardson.

Is there?

I think, are there any other coaches out there you think are in danger based off of a poor I guess I'll say halfway home almost start to the season, Well.

I thought Derek Lalan was in trouble for a long time in Detroit, and then he did get let go and and they brought in Tom McClellan to coach the Red Wings, and so then they have actually gone on to win, gone on to a winning streak right now. Who knows why, but Derek Lalande was gone to I don't know if in the other situations we saw three coaches fired so far, Drew Banister of course, Jim Montcomery four. I think Jim Montgomery in Boston, as I said, Derek

No?

I was just asking you because I honestly don't know. I'll just kind of that time of year, I.

Think those three have been, those three are have changed, and I don't think any others will. I hope none do. I hate firings. I just hate them, but we'll see. I mean, the problem in pro sports, as you well know, is there's so few moves that an owner has or a general manager has, that he can do to try to get his team, you know, jump started. The coaches are the first thing that always goes well.

And as you know, organizations that usually find the most success have ownership, front office and the coaching staff really all on the same page, pushing in the same direction. And when you have a meddling owner, which I think you experienced, that thinks he knows better than anybody else or someone else, you.

Know, not pulling in the right direction.

Oftentimes, these things never really are fully baked because you have to have everybody on the same page, which is pretty rare. But it seems like the most successful teams have kind of that trinity.

They absolutely you hit the nail right on the head. You sound like the offspring of a sports executive, because that's absolutely true. If you don't, if it starts at ownership, and if the ownership doesn't hire and trust the people they hire and let them do their job just the same as they would want to do their job in whatever made them all their money that they could afford a pro sports team, they are not going to win.

And when you look.

Around the league and look at teams that have been successful, and what we say successful, we just mean a contender. You don't have to win the Cup every year, but they're not meddling teams. And the ones that are meddling all the time, I think they've got a better way of doing things. They rarely get anywhere because you just can't operate in those conditions. If you're a sports guy, you know there's certain things you've got to do and

From your advantage point. Before I say you, Louise, I will ask you.

And I know you don't know this ownership group well, and it's their first go around trying to own a hockey team, so I'm sure they're going to learn as they go. But what would you say to our community about your knowledge of Bill Armstrong and his staff and coach Tourney and his staff and kind of the synergies that exist between the two and the right people to kind of build this thing moving forward.

Well, well, they've been together for quite a while now, this group, and I mean they were completely handcuffed in Arizona financially, and now that Ryan Smith has bought the team and moved into Salt Lake City and has I think Ryan Smith has shown some great patients by bringing everybody from Arizona and keeping the same crew and letting them prove whether they belong there or prove that they don't belong there. So you know, I think it's the right group. I like what they've done, and I believe.

In them all right, Neil, Where can our listeners, our new hockey fan listeners in the community find podcast to yours.

On any platform that you can find podcast, Spotify, Apple, YouTube and everything else. And it's called NHL Wrap Around. We do it four times a week now, Spence, we're doing it. So we have NHL wrap Around, We have New York Centric, which is just about the three New York teams, and then we do two updates a week called short Shifts on Wednesdays and Fridays, just to bring the listeners up to what's been happening in between. So you know, I'm not up to your level yet, but I'm trying to get there.

I'm sure you far sur pass my level on the hockey side, Neil. I'm just doing the best I can and bring you on and ask you questions. It don't sound dumb, but I appreciate use.

You sound great.

You sound, as I said, you sound like you're from a sports family, and I don't know if I'm right about that or.

Yeah there's something to that. I should look into it. I should look into it. But look, I really appreciate your time. We'll get you back on soon and keep up the great work on the pod.

Okay, thanks so much for having me, all right.

The great Neil Smith, former general manager of the New York Rangers and the New York Islanders, won a Stanley Cup with the Rangers in ninety four, spent some time as the chief scout for the Red Wings back in the eighties. He is a hockey encyclopedia, a historian, and it's great to have him on every week to help us learn about this new sport, pro hockey in our market. If you haven't been to a Utah Hockey Club game,

Yeah, Nil's a little timeless, in my opinion, not fair enough.

Chris Camaradnie live in studio Hot Neil Neil young Tek, Let's get it there. Yeah.

I think for me, the Eagles are kind of the quintessential overplayed band, and I always think of the Lebowski scene He's just getting out of my cab. I love that he had to take a cab from Malibu all the way back to the city. That's an expensive cab, right it is.

Then he throws him out of the cab because he doesn't like the Eagles. But Big Dave also overplayed the Eagles, so I can't absolutely, I can't do it. It was there a band that was overplayed in your house when you were younger.

No, my mom has really really good taste in music. She like went with the times, so we never overplayed anything. It would it would, you know, evolve sixties, seventies, eighties, nineties, I mean like we had we had a pretty good repertoire going. I mean we would we would go from like you know, Jefferson Airplane to the Eagles A lot of you know, almost famousy stuff. And then as the

Nice.

We had a pretty good catalog of music in our house.

See, I kind of nobody cares about this, but I care, do you think so?

I think so?

Frank Layton has advice to me, was who cares? Nobody's listening when I first took the job. So that's kind of how I do the job. Nobody's listening. I was lucky that deb My mom Motown. Oh yeah, loved it. Yeah, so learned about all that as a kid dreams. Yeah, oh yeah, for sure. Dana Ross, no doubt anyway, Chris, Happy, Happy Wednesday. Why are we getting you on a Wednesday this week?

Because my kid's a taken?

Oh I see, you know usually you're on our Friday staple.

Yeah, free days. The kid is not in daycare on Fridays.

Okay, fair enough. How's your January going? Things going?

Well?

Yeah? Was I in here last week?

You were?

And it was after Yeah, yeah it was I got back from Rosebwell, yeah, so I've seen you sin since the New Year. But yeah, January's good man, Yeah, yeah, yeah, everything's cool.

Just the first Monday in January, as I talked to you about it, just kind of it's where.

You're like, it's like a Seinfeld episode.

Yes, and I tore my rotator cough. I don't know if I told you this, No you did. Yeah, it's a partial tear. Shout out Dave Petron, my guy imaging imaging imaging, Yes, imaging X ray as well as the ultrasound. And I saw it's a partial tear, not a full tear. No surgery.

But do you want to tell the people how you tore it?

Shoulder presses, how many moving weight around? M oh Man, I don't know what RepA was. All I know is I dropped the dumbell because I heard so bad.

So what described the pain? As soon as like?

Was it a meaning stinging shooting pain? It felt like somebody shot me in the arm.

Not like so I mean, first people, there's a lot of people who have been shot.

So is it like I also have never been shot.

Let's be like a like a when you get a shot at the doctor.

A little bit big needle tar, yeah, a little bit just like it wasn't like a dull pain.

I didn't feel pop.

It was just like a stinging pain right away.

And as soon as you put the weight down, did it alleviate or no? Continue?

No? Continued. So I went home, called my guy. Yeah, and the bummer is that it happened on a Friday, and so I had to wait until the ortho was open on a Monday.

Yeah.

So I'm just ibuprofen.

I scene, you know, did you get the sling?

No sling, because again, partial terror. I can do this, right, I just I can't do the side. Okay, how's your.

Health, by the way, it's great, man.

What's the worst. What's the worst injury you've ever had?

Oh? I I've had like lots of minor ones. It tore my MCL when I was like nineteen, didn't get surgery. To me, the most debilitating injury I've had was like a I don't know what the official diagnosis was, was like a lower back issue. Right before COVID. My friends and I were playing spike ball a lot, okay, when we were younger. This was like, you know, in my early thirties, and it requires a lot of diving and

And that was a back issue. Back issue. Back issues are the worst. Anyway, there you go, enough enough conversation about aging and hurting yourself all the time. Let's see where do you want to start today?

C K or not Wednesday? I'll tell you probably not. I'll tell you what's not hot? Back injuries?

What is okay? Not hot? Well, okay, back injuries not hot?

Hot?

What's hot on a Wednesday?

Right now?

Going to the gym? Apparently?

No, I'm not hot, not hot at all? What do how many listeners have any frame of reference for what we're talking about? As far as we.

Can talk about traggers if you want.

An old feature back in the day, now we can move on from it, all right? The uh uh the you know what, here's what I'll ask you, and uh, you know, I'm quite sure if we could find an answer, we do people uh big time favor.

I am.

I am still stunned, even though it's been a number of years that the Utah basketball program cannot consistently find their way back to even semi relevance, And I feel bad being overly critical because I like Craig and he's one wherever he's been prior to this stop, and I watch every game I watched last night. I don't view this as a coaching issue. Craig enters the gym every night with a talent discrepancy and a talent gap that

Well, I'll go back in time. My junior year of college was Jim Boylan's best year.

Jim Boylan, Luca Dertca, a little five seed.

I believe Tyler Kepke, Carlon Brown, Kim Tilley was that Luke Neville. Yeah, yeah, they made They were a five seed that year and then they got they drew Arizona's twelve and they lost. But I know Larry had a couple of good teams. He had some pros, Kyle and Delon and yakob Ah. I don't even think you need pros in college basketball. You just need to have an engaging style of play. Look at what Utah State's been able to do in the last decade with five different

Well and jack a.

Larry's good year was with Bogut who rick recruitre Right And all due respect to Ray, you always seem like a nice guy or whatever, but you bring up an interesting point, and I don't think this is mutually exclusive, Like, for instance, Alabama has an all basketball team and an awesome football team. But it does seem that the Utah basketball program kind of started its slide into somewhat irrelevance

Well, they're probably spread thin. They probably don't want to necessarily shell out shell out money bus season tickets for both and I know that, you know, college basketball season tickets are much cheaper than college football tickets, even though there's more home games. But I think it's I just don't know if we're in a market where people are going to be locked in from August all the way

So it could be something as simple as consistent performance and showing that you have the ability like because to your point, there's always been this one year spike where it's okay, we're back in the tournament and then then boom. So maybe I don't know, three four five years of consistent, winning, entertaining basketball and I don't know how you do it these days. But players that stay here used to be kind of the thing. And again I'm doing the Majeri's thing.

But and you're also talking about schools that get that from a single sport, not necessarily the two big revenue earning sports. Yeah, I'm trying to think, like off the top of my head, like you mentioned Alabama, but Alabama really hasn't really come on from a men's basketball standpoint until like the last four or five years. Traditionally they were. They were pretty bad, fair even you know, before Nick

Yeah, consistently. Yeah, there's always Texas As Spurts here there on the basketball side. But no, it's a fair point. Just curious to get your thoughts because again, I feel bad saying this. I'm watching them play these Big twelve games and it doesn't even feel like it's a fair fight.

Yeah, going back to your point about guys who stay like it is hard to recruit in this current landscape of college athletics, I get it. But you're also if I'm and it might be unfair to compare to other programs in the state. You look at a place like Utah State. Yes, they lost their head coach, they lost great Olsibor, who's a great player, no pun intended, But like, you have lots of guys that are still in that program.

Yeah, yeah, most. I believe how many.

Utah players are on Utah's roster currently, I honestly don't know. I mean, I know the Hunter Erickson kid is a bench player, he's a Utah kid. Yeah, But the Mats and brothers are not from Utah. They have the Finnish player, the big guys, the tall guys on the team. I don't know their names. I don't think they're from Utah. So it's like, I don't think you necessarily have to

Jake Wahleeen is from Provo, but you already do that, Yeah, Wallen Hunter Erickson is from Provo as you referenced, and our guy Brady Smith is Logan.

Wait, Brady Smith didn't he used to produce this program.

No, that was Brady Clark. Okay, shout out to our guy Brady Hope. He's hanging in. He's a Utah State and so he's probably having a good year.

But like, I don't understand you. You're a basketball guy, so you can tell me how this works, Like how is UTAs State able to do this? And I know they're playing at a conference level that is way different compared to the Big Twelve, which you can argue is the best in the country. But like UTASA was doing this when Utah was in the PAC twelve two, and they were doing it when the PAC twelve wasn't that good. So how is it that it works at Uta State, which Craig had a direct hand in before.

Yes he did, Yes he did.

So how are they able to spin it forward?

All due respect to our friends about forty miles down south watching a college basketball game of the Spectrum, it's the best, is second level. I mean, it's one of the best college basketball environments in the whole country. And I've been to a grip of college basketball menus, and I do think there's something there. If you're a high school kid, and let's say you're a top shelf high school recruit and you go out to Provo and watch a game of the Marriott Center, You're like, this is dope.

Agreed, Yeah, it's true. I mean like the spectrum will be full for like San Jose State, and it's cool and it's cool. Yeah, I agree, Yeah, the ambiance matters.

All right, We'll save our football for the next segment. And also our guy Joe Cole's got the exclusive with Mark Carlin today, We'll save that from the next segment.

Let's do it.

We got a couple of minutes with this this segment. Let's do a little basketball, a little more basketball. And here's what I want to ask you, because you and our guy TJ. Tony Jones, a few years back, you did a really good piece on Donovan, so you know, chattered with him. My guest has got to know him a little bit here or there. And tonight we've got the Calves and we've got Okac. And it's the first time in NBA history that at this point of the season there are two teams on pace for more than

Comes spring, right, but I think he's gonna answer them. I don't think they can.

Win it, but in pro basketball, there's a saying if you got a shy, you've done a good job. I was never on board to believe that, and Quinn was here last night, and I never thought that group was going to win an NBA championship, But there were a couple of postseasons where I thought they've got a shot.

Just I wanted your thoughts on that.

I don't think it's I don't think it's hyperbolic to just say that the team didn't gel, they didn't like each other, like they played well together. And it's I'm not saying every team that you know me, I'm with you. I'm a results over a vibes.

Guy, John Paul, hope you're listening.

But like.

The they came to the end of the road. Spence like, I just don't really think there's really any other way to put it, because Quinn left before they traded those guys.

Wrong, wrong, Okay, Yes, and that's what I I'll always wonder, See I got my timelines off, yeah, and I'll always wonder. Now I'll have to look at the exact timing. They may have started, as Rudy was first correct, and they may have alluded to like, hey, we're going to break this down and Quinn, we want you to leave this

But you're still in the middle, man, But.

Could you have found your like if if Larry was what he was two years ago? Next to go bear with the rest of those pieces. Is that a championship team? No, but it's not breaking down to the studs and really show at this point no clear direction in a rebuild, which I think is frustrating a lot of Jazz fan But you are.

The first guy to point out that you can't tie forty percent of your cap whatever. It's no offensive big yeah, and like it might make more sense in Minnesota where you have a superstar player, like a Truce star player. But clearly, I mean, I don't know what Minnesota's record is right now, but I know it's somewhere around five hundred. Yeah,

I agree with that second point. I wonder do you think there's anything because Donovan had two years left on his deal.

I mean you could have waited another year.

Well, and you also chatted with Donovan, and if my memory is serving correctly about you know it was COVID. It was this summer of Black Lives Matter and the murder of George Floyd, and Donovan started thinking differently as a black man, right, and he admitted it, like he learned things about his history that he didn't know about and leaned into being more of a voice, which there's

It, being like super handsome with his cool sig but.

Rudy is donating millions to Pete and no one knows about that, so that was always a little odd. But the first few years here Donovan and I look, obviously, was it Stuart Adams who was like, go learn about your own history? Obviously dumb ass thing to say, period, end of story. And I don't begrudge Donovan for not necessarily feeling as welcome here. I don't know what it's like to be a black man in saw Lake where there's two point three percent of the city that looks

I think it played a role in it, for sure, but I don't think it was a major part. I think he is a guy that realized that whether it was the ownership group or the front office or the roster, he just feel like he felt like he couldn't reach his apex here. His apex mountain was not here, And I guess he was right in a sense. But to your point, he isn't a markedly different player right now.

Yeah, go Beart is more like more like a Jared Allen.

I mean, I mean, I feel like you would know. I feel like people thought at one point that Evan Mobley could be like an MVP caliber player. In this second, I mean, he's proven to be very good this year. Again, I think it worked out for the Jazz because he

Yeah, no, one hundred percent. And when you don't have the ability to retain the talent you drafted and developed.

Like there's no chance. It's hard.

All right, there's there's a little basketball on a Wednesday. But coming up next we'll react to what Mark Carlin had to say with today's desrat news piece. The CFP semi Finals get rolling tomorrow. Chris Camaradi Live in studio on a Wednesday right here on ESPN seven hundred, Chris Tom Ronnie Live in studio for one more big segment. Wait a second about this? Diego, Luna, oh A, Mecca and Nelly shout out in a bench called into US Men's national team camp in January.

Huge, pretty exciting. Yeah, I mean it's it's the camp where all of the fringe guys get a shot. Okay, but it's cool that your guy, Mariso Pochettino's giving some marsl.

Guys some looks.

Is one of the great great Spurs managers in club history.

Indeed, the Spurs are playing right now, aren't they.

They were playing in the Carabell Cup, which against Liverpool, which I know you know a bunch about.

Tell me they won?

They did they it's the first leg.

Come on you, Spurs, big Spurs man over here. That's what you're supposed to say. That's that's like the fan thing, Come on.

You, Spurs. Impressive for Mecca for a number of reasons, like the most prototypical like MLS development story guy smart ivy league dude who got drafted to be a right back in Salt Lakes or Sandy let's be honest, Harriman and has now developed into a guy who's made the national team camp. Luna I think is a bigger deal because I do think Mexico at one point wanted to see if he would be willing to switch switch to

Do you think there's any shot either those two playing a World cid M you think the team is kind of set?

I mean, they're so good right now. I mean, all their best players, if they can stay healthy, they're just their players are starting now at these big clubs. I mean Milan has like two starters, Juventus has two starters, Peppi is finally coming on in the Dutch League, Luna and Nelly maybe, but Tyler Adams has been hurt a lot. But McKinney Adams musa. It's hard. But I guess said, I'm just fascinated to see how they look playing in a national team Jersey.

Yeah, it'll be fun. So is this like the Gold Cup cycle?

Kind of? This is kind of like the first look of the potential Gold Cup roster, because.

Kyle essentially parlayed a really strong Gold Cup into a World Cup.

Yeah?

Correct, Yeah, So I just think unfortunately for both those guys, they play positions where the US is currently pretty stacked. Yeah, I mean Luna as you know, more of a central ten.

Obviously we don't I call the moon, but that's me.

We don't. We as the US don't really employ a prototypical number ten. And but you know, Potch moves things around. We're no longer under the casting spell of Greg Berhalter, so who knows.

So this is this is a little bit like when Tony Beltrom got a call up and you're like, sweet, but you'll be back here soon.

I think, like Tony played against Mexico at one point. If I'm not miss you're in like a pretty like big game. I think it was one of his very limited caps. I think I just remember because he got to wear the really dope lollipop jersey. But it was like the red, white and blue stack.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, and that was the coolest one.

I think.

Yeah, now I remember that, good, good memory, all right. Shout out to our guy, Joe Coles exclusive with Mark Carlin, University of View to Athletic Director and you and I spoke about the situation following the BYU game the week that it happened, and we don't need to go back there. But of course, as the story goes, I was walking home from the stadium. You were typing away with your piece. Lovely photo we got that day with you, me and Aaron. Good good picture, look good.

We did show my wife and she's like, dang, you look good.

Nice. Okay, yeah, we'll take that from shout out Amanda, And suddenly fun blows up.

Are you listening to Harlan? No, here's the link? Oh my gosh.

And I thought his statement after the fact was something I missed the Mark, and I said that on airon My guess is Mark probably wanted that moment back, and what he expressed to Joe I think was probably a little bit more on lockstep what I thought he should have expressed in the moment. But hey, we all make mistakes, and then sometimes time can give us perspective. And we now know that he called Kilani, and he called Tom Holm, he called Bret Yormark to apologize for the comments he

Yeah.

Reading part one of the two part series, to me, what stood out the most was Mark pushing back a little bit on the notion that Utah wasn't able to retain its best players. I think he found a let me find this quote, something along the lines of, I look at this last year and buy and large, we've been able to retain all the key players that we believe will lift us back to success in twenty five

Yeah, and you know, obviously, if you're the ad, you're going to try to spend the most positive you know, you know, you know, storyline and narrative surrounding your program.

Yeah, and in this culture, we have to do our best of not overreacting to one thing, and by one thing, I mean just one calendar year. And I've said this often on the show recently. It's like, seventeen out of twenty is a pretty good clip for winning, winning programs in Utah football, you know, men's basketball, we've talked about. The women's team is really turning the corner and becoming, you know, a.

One of the best products locally to watch consistently.

Too.

It's the Larry thing, to me is interesting. I mean, Chris made Larry a top ten paid coach in college basketball, which is which is impressive if you consider some of some of the programs that were way ahead of Utah for a long time. And I think the last time Utah made the tournament was like twenty sixteen. It had been a while, and I don't think that necessarily was the wrong move. I mean, I didn't know Larry that well,

Yeah, and it's worth your time. He talks about nil, he talks about, you know, raising money at this point, which is probably as important as anything else you're doing on the fundraising side of things. He said they've been able to double their output to their athletes. And the problem without really any data is you just kind of have to take people at their word, and that's hard to do. And there I don't think there's any proof or any data one way or the other.

The Utah is.

Having a problem keeping talent because everybody loses talent every single year. The national champ will and some of the best teams in college football already have. So it makes it hard to understand what real and what's real and what is And the nice thing about sports is there's a scoreboard, as we say, So, if what Mark is seeing is true, next year should be better for the football program, then this year.

Was, well, yeah, if you get average to above average quarterback play, Utah this year is probably in a much different place. As Bill said earlier on the show, next year is just going to be a question Mark man, And I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. They're just going to have a bunch of players that nobody's ever watched, a lot of new players on offense, a lot of guys that you don't know how they'll be deployed.

When he got a healthy quarter exactly.

Well, healthy quarterback, healthy weapons, healthy running back, deep running back.

It worked.

Jason Beck's offense is a little more tantalizing, a little more New Age by all accounts, less intricate, less difficult to pick up, and you're bringing in the quarterback that I'm not gonna say mastered. Because while everyone's freaking out about Devin Dampierre, he did get thirty one total touchdowns last year, but he through twelve picks, he threw twelve touchdowns and twelve interceptions. The hell of a player on

You've covered Utah football for a long time. For a while, you were the Utah guy for the athletic You have moved on from that beat and you do more macro level things and you have freedom to do other things, which is good for us that are a fan of your work. But you know as well as anybody. And I drew the parallel to ky State because I was listening to this Big twelve podcast. There they were going through the exercise of how this conference will look next year.

I'm like, dude, all right, good luck.

I tried to do it myself. I've a zero clue. You can pull up the rosters, you can see who's returning, and you can kind of see who's already the transfer portal.

But it's such an exercise and futility.

But the way they were talking about k State is exactly the way Utah football has been built under Kyle, which is recruit and develop, And the most successful Utah football season is just like k State have been. When these programs have players in their third fourth fifth years. Is that still a way you can build a contending winning football team in college football in twenty twenty five.

I think you could look at the Big Twelve title game as a dichotomy of how you can do it. I think Arizona State a lot of transfers, a lot of new guys, young head coach was able to galvanize that group to a surprising season. Iowa States in the same boat as the Utahs in the Kansas States. You know a lot of guys that have been there in that program for a long time, longtime head coach. There are a lot of recruit and developed programs in the Big.

Twelve, is BYU or recruiting developed and that obviously worked for them this year.

Absolutely. I mean, like if you're trying to think out of their kind of quote unquote breakout players this year, Like I said, nobody took a flyer on Jake. J didn't have an offer, he had to go to a community college, and nobody does anymore. David running back.

L. J.

Martin recruit and developed elst the offensive line outside of the kid who went to Oklahoma State, receivers Aaron and those guys did a good job BESSI they went got guys like Lassiter, Marion, transfer guys, Chase, local guy defensively, defensive line, mostly local guys, linebacker, room, very very good, all local guys, secondary, some some some transfers, but some

It is since you referenced Colorado, every time an NFL job comes open, and a lot of people think the Cowboys job could come open pretty quickly, although they didn't let Mike McCarthy interview with the Bears, which is weird. Raider's job is open, Giants' job is not. Thought it might be, but maybe it's just the media trying to create a story, because Dion is a story no matter what he does. But if the right team that has the right pick comes along and says, hey, we'll hire you, We'll drop your.

Son Dion in Vegas, is that.

Enough to make Deon jump and Lee boulder?

I don't think so. Like I think one thing people overestimate is people overestimate Dion's Like I don't want to say ego because I know Dion believes in himself to a level that a lot of people don't, and for good reason. He's an NFL Hall of Famer and is clearly has proven people wrong in the in the coaching realm, but the NFL, man, it is unforgiving. You've seen so many coaches in the last few years get their first job, get their first taste, finally made it fired after one

Yeah it's fair. Then you've done stories on him, so I knew you'd have good perspective. All right, let's end on this. I can ask you a philosophical question Orange Bowl? No, who do you like in the Orange Bowl? Who'd you like to win it?

Who's playing in the Orange Bowl?

That's the cotton is Ohio State, Texas. So the Orange is Notre Dame, Penn State.

I'm gonna go to Notre Dame.

Who do you got in the cotton Ohio State? Does anyone getting in Ohio State's way?

Not?

If they can make life hell for Will Howard that's the only way.

Yeah, we'll have to.

Say ak to philosophy.

So I have a philosophical question for you, because topically on the show, we've discussed because we're a basketball market, you know, we're a jazz market, We're a pro basketball market. We do not have an NFL team. If college football transitions into a pro model and BYU and Utah and involved in that, it will be as close to an NFL team that we've ever had here, and it will have that field because we'll have blue bloods in town every week. Let's just hope that if that happens, Utah

It was Michael Jordan's last game.

So crazy, yep, but it has not been And to be frank, it wasn't close then, but the NBA was experiencing.

Growth while the NFL was kind of flatlined.

Then they never closed the gap and they never will. But why do you think it is? I mean, concussions, domestic of violence, everything that pretty smart people have predicted would put a dent in the world of football consumption in this country has not come close to it.

In fact, it's only ground.

Why do you think our appetite for football in America is what it is to the point where it's the number one sport and no one else even lives in that cold desact.

I mean, this is not a hot take, but this is my opinion. The savior of the sport was fantasy football.

M h yeah, like it.

It revolutionized the approach to fandom. It got even fringe people involved. It's one game a week for not very long. It's September to January. It's during generally the harder months of the year where you want to be inside because it's cold. If you live in a cold weather place. A lot of these places that our NFL markets are cold weather places. I think the demand of basketball is just a lot. I think it's asking a lot for

I gotta.

I know it's bedtime, but I gotta se Johnny jusaying in the corner. I'm just being honest, like, just it's asking a lot. And I understand that every back and what's really cool and something we don't eat. We complain a lot about everything. It's insane that you can basically watch whatever team you want to watch on any level of any pro college model. These days, you can find a way to watch. Back in the day, we were pouring through the box scores on the paper or trying

Tim mcgride and where he had the big chew as the dad.

The dad was great. It did a good Jobsane like one of his first acting jobs. But we're on the West coast, man, like we are. I talk about this with my colleagues at the Athletic all the time. It's like some of my friends cover Ohio State or Texas or Penn State. Like there are places in this country, man, that are twenty four to seven, three sixty five, no matter what day of the year, no matter who's in the hospital, you are going to go to the message

Yeah, I know I have homework, but sphe Makai Luke is starting tonight. Who's at no it's your take on I know it's bedtime, but Johnny Jews AG's gonna shoot corner threes, all right, c K. Great to see my friend. Best to Amanda and lit Leo and now will Chattoo.

Thanks man.

That big NBA game tonight, really big NBA game tonight in just about twenty minutes from right now. Actually it is the Cavs and the Thunder the first. It's the third time in NBA history two teams on fifteen game winning streaks have played each other. Both teams are on base for over seventy wins. So little NBA action. The Jazz were in action last night with the chaotic ending.

Second of all, how do I refer to you moving forward?

Thank you so much? Since I mean I think that now that I've taken once again my rightful place atop the throne, let's just say you refer to me as you see fit and we'll see how it works out.

My extreme queen, Sarah Todd joins us on the program today I mean I.

Should say jokes aside, like I'm proud of the work that I do, but I just, you know, when I got the news that I'd been given the award again, it just it feels like on a daily basis that I'm this isn't a job, right, Like I get to watch basketball every day and I get paid to do it, and I think that basketball is the greatest sport in the world, and so I'm just really really lucky and I'm proud to be.

Doing But how good does it feel every time you win? It that Andy lost again, I mean, that has to feel so good.

I mean, I sometimes I don't even think that like I'm getting an award. I just think, like Tony and Andy are not getting an award.

That was my reaction was that was my reaction, But obviously we could. We love our guys, but very happy for you, very well deserved Sarah. So congrats Sarah Todd Utah sports Right of the Year for the second straight time. I got to know what the reaction was last night over where you guys sit after that chaotic ending.

It was so funny because usually on press row, you know, we're pretty stoic. I think that you know, during a during a tanking season, we have to find smaller ways to keep engaged throughout the season kind of, you know, as the beat writers and so so at the beginning of the game yesterday, right, Patty Mills comes in and he takes nine shots in the first six minutes on the floor, and so then at that point it became a game for all of us, like, yeah, let's let's

Out out of our seats.

It was it was just an insane moment. I'm frankly like it looked good is the second that it left in.

Hand, you know, that was the thing.

As I was watching it, watching a real time when it left his hands, I said, that's got a shot, because Trey's one of those that practices those shots, right. I mean, we see certain players in the league and I always say to people, and it's not always possible, but if you go into a Jazz game, try to get there early to see Dirk warm up back in the day, which was amazing to watch to see Steph

Yeah, yeah, I mean there's a number of players that are practicing him. And I think that a lot of people will see players practicing these types of shots or putting up a few of these shots pregame, or maybe they see some clips on social media of them doing a couple of them during practice, and they think that it's, you know, for fun, and sure there is an element of fun to it, but as you said, like a player like Trey, he's actually practicing like it's not just

Guys do that.

I keep in mind also when you're seeing it that that's not always just you know, for the fans, they're getting a couple of reps in.

Let me ask you this before we move on to just more Jazz exclusive stuff. You know, it's been an interesting few weeks where the Jazz have either welcomed in old friends or they played old friends on the road. How should Jazz fans remember Quinn Quinn Snyder his eight year stint here as the head coach.

Yeah, I mean I think that you know, Quinn came here, and I don't think that he necessarily had an easy job of it at the beginning, right, Like, there was nothing certain at all about the team or the players

I'm glad you brought that up because I want to move over into that space next tonight.

It's a massive, massive, NBA game.

We don't get a lot of these regular season Like, holy smokes, is this historic start real?

And on one side, we'll be the thirty one and four Cleveland.

Cavaliers with Donovan Mitchell really playing a different brand of basketball. I don't know how much of this is Kenny Atkinson. I don't know how much of this is Donovan aging a bit. The numbers are about the same as they always have been and they were here, but he's taking less shots, and he's admitted on a few occasions that he's actually trying on defense, which I'm sure Jazz fans

I don't know. I'm paraphrasing meat on the bone here in Salt Lake.

Now.

I tend to roll my eyes at that, because really, behind the scenes, it was Donovan who was kind of blowing the whole thing up. Everybody knows that. I've talked to people in the front office, and you know, it was odd Sarah, you covered him for the first like

Now.

He's going to learn how to do this and at some point we'll have some playoffs success. But as you watch Donovan evolve into the stratosphere as maybe a first team NBA guy and a team that is legitimately a contender to win the thing, do you think it stings Jazz fans a little bit to hear him say that he thinks there was meat left on that bone? Did you think it was as untenable as most and do you think the Jazz should have tried to maybe squeeze a little bit more juice out of that roster.

I think both things can be true. I think that you can think and it's hard to say it. I think that there's probably different perspective and it's hard to look at it and say it from like me saying it versus Donovan saying it, like we're going to feel

And so I think that it.

Can be true that like it was time to move on, blowing the team up was the right thing to do for the future of the team. But that doesn't mean that Donovan doesn't have more to give elsewhere and that that can't be placed somewhere and we and we see that with the Cavaliers right now. As you said, I mean, I think it strange him having sort of the same numbers and and saying you know that he there's more

Yeah, now that's very fair. All right, Let's move over to the Jazz specifically, and this iteration of the Jazz specifically, as you referenced earlier in a tank season, sometimes from a fan perspective, it's hard to see the forest through the trees.

I'll ask you this just from a.

Macro standpoint, What are the positives that you're seeing that you can share with Jazz fan. This is such a tough ask of a basketball community, and the Jazz certainly aren't the only ones to do it. Philly ask their fans to do it for like six years and then they got embid. And I'm always sympathetic to a fan base that is accustomed to winning basketball, that's asked to invest in the team that's unseerious about winning in the name of hopefully getting back there at some point if

The positives are, I think, first and foremost, the improvement that we've seen out of Walker Kestler, the kind of glimmers of potential and slashes here and there that you see out of some of the young players. That all comes with a caveat that like they're going to need a lot more time than people think they are going to need to. You know, I'm not ready to call

A part of this.

Now, that's not true for every guy on this on this team, like certainly many of them will probably not be a part of that future, but they believe they can be. And I think that you know, we don't know a lot about how Will Will will hardy will coach and if he's going to be successful once the team is actually trying to be successful and so there's you know, coaching question marks there. But so far, what we've seen is like he has done an incredible job with this.

Team, and he does a really masterful job because I listen to I've always been a sucker for coach's post game, So whatever game i'm watching, I want to listen to the coach after the game. And you know, he and Quinn have much different approaches. Quinn could get how shall we say, a little agitated, and then he would look at Andy Larson like he was to behead him if

But if you hone in.

On more of the trends that seem to be encouraging with some of the young players, Will talks a lot about the process and how things actually went really well tonight, and yes, Trey Jung hits a fifty footer, but what can we do? So I'll ask you what have you seen as of late that's allowed them to be more competitive, even more often than not leading to losses.

Yeah again, I'll say Walker Kessler has been incredible. I mean, he had ten rebounds last night against the Hawks, eight of them were offensive rebounds. Like his strength, his body position and kind of just like the force that he's playing with, it has been raised to a different level. It makes me think so much more about his potential

You know, like we know a lot.

About his offensive game, but kind of when you're thinking about the future, it's like you need a guy like Larry Markin to actually not be a negative on.

The defensive end too. And so that's been.

Great for a lot of the a lot of the young players. You know, there's there's good and bad, and like I said before, like a lot of them probably won't be here, but the little things that we've seen, like Cody Williams needs thirty pounds, right, Like, he just needs to be stronger. No one's asking him to like

His teenage years.

So that's what we're dealing with, and the Jazz understand that, and he's going to be given to time to like grow into his body. But he's in the right spots. He's making good decisions. It's not like he uh is completely out of position or he is making mistakes a lot on the court. That's not it's not perfect all the time. He's still a rookie and there's there are mistakes, but like, for the most part, he makes really good decisions.

Yes, no, well said, and it is important for the process. But before we say you lose saracence, it's been a little while. Every time I pull up like a trade guide, primer or somebody rights that you know, this could potentially go down prior to that February trade deadline. The Jazz are involved in every single, every single trade and you know it's every single preview and it's easy to understand

Yeah, it's it's interesting that I think generally what I'm hearing is that there's more of a chance that they're not active than there is that they are. I don't think that this is going to be like a big, flashy trade deadline or even one that we've seen over the last couple of seasons where you see a lot of moves. They're obviously not flashy, but the Jazz kind of getting rid of as many guys as they can.

Well, Sarah, what do I say about it back that we're at two time Utah Sports Rider of the Year Other than thank you for gracing us with your presence.

The honor is all on this side of the table.

Okay, oh oh, the honors all mine?

Please all right?

The Great Sarah Todd covers Utah Jazz for the des Red News. The Utah Sports writer of the year, appreciate her time on this Wednesday. All right, wrapping up the program for this Wednesday afternoon, don't forget K State Utah women's hoops tonight. K State fifteen and one. They're the number twelve team in the country and the Lady Utes are twelve and two. They're the number twenty two team in the country. So it should be some fun basketball

Good question, based on the definition, yes.

Like literally an unidentified flying object.

Yes, but I don't know that that's necessarily an alien. I think it's probably our government if that is fair.

Look at you.

Are you a conspiracy theorist guy.

Uh, it's a dangerous question in the mind of I don't know, because it depends on you know, what is a conspiracy? No, not really, Like I'm not one that thinks everything's a conspiracy, because if that is the case, then nothing is. I like to have some reason and you know, semblance of science or something behind it.

But I don't know.

I I think there's probably things in the sky that folks have seen that they don't know what.

It is, and that unidentified.

But you're not saying it's some extra terrestrial from a far away galaxy that's here to steal our soul.

I don't necessarily think so.

But I also do you have a deep belief that believing that we are the only things out here, like with this conscious thought and you know, modern way of living in the entire universe, knowing how small we are.

I think that's a little selfish.

I think a little egotistical for our our human race to think that way. There's something out there somewhere. I don't know if it's close enough to like be in our galaxy. But I'm not a I'm not a astro.

What are they?

What are they called physicist.

I'm not a I'm not an astronaut.

We are we are just in a simulation, spinning around on this blue marble. We're essentially a speck of dust bro right in the in the galaxies.

Yeah, yeah, we're monkeys on a spinning rock, a speck of dust in a much larger thing. But does that mean that there's like green guys flying around and spying on us?

I don't necessarily think so.

Yeah. For me, like, if it's it's a real thing, I'll deal with it when it comes. In the meantime, like I'm busy, I can't story myself with things like this.

How long are we going to do this where it's like, oh, maybe we kind of have some evidence, but not really like seventy years plus that we've been doing this. If you go back into like petrol glyphs and stuff, they were drawing UFO, So we've been doing this for like two thousand years and they haven't said hello yet.

So, like you said, I'll wait until they do.

All right.

Well, in the meantime, maybe that gives you some perspective to not worry so much about mundane things.

How about that exactly brought it back around. We're a good message.

On a Wednesday, all right, port before we get out of here, what comes our way?

On a Thursday edition of the show.

Yeah, in a Thursday edition of the show, we'll welcome back our friend Tony Jones, a little NBA chat with TJ. We'll have a big hour both Craig Bowlerjack and Gordon Monson in studio with us. Of course, as we do each Thursday, little sports court action, catching up the legal story in sports. And I think still TBD on this one, but I think Ted Robinson will join us. Of course, I don't really know what Ted's January looks like. I

Also keep in mind Mark Harlan will be live in studio to catch up with Sean O'Connell, So tune into The Sean O'Connell Show from eleven to two and then spend your afternoon with us on a Thursday Well say good Night special. Thank you the voice himself, Bill Riley, Neil Smith, Chris Comroddie, as well as Sarah Todd for the sound he made. Miss from the show. Website is ESPN seven hundred sports dot com. Download our mobile app, Take us on the goat. That's how I listen to

Give us all the stars. It helps. He's porter.

I'm Spence saying tonight, joy some Utah women's hoops tonight and we'll talk to you on a Thursday Drive as always. You can find it right here on ESPN seven hundred.