Draft Show: Who Will Draft A QB?

with us. I got my scouting buddies here. Dane Brugler, David Hellman, King Garrison executive producing this show today. Boys trading on you this weekend. Huh, guys moving up in this draft, you know, get to spot certain spots, teams moving around. Kind of talked about this Thursday. Didn't we sit around all week waiting for some stuff to happen, just you know, it's free agency drafts getting closer and then all held sites to break loose on the weekend.

You know, Yes, typical when we talked about this on Thursday in the Draft show about how teams are going to be aggressive moving up for quarterbacks. You know, we know that, and we singled out the Colts as a team that was going to be open for business looking to move back. Now. I didn't think we'd see a trade this early, but it shows just how desperate the Jets are for a quarterback, right, And I don't correct

me if I'm wrong. I don't remember a trade like this this early, when they're clearly trading on for a quarterback. I don't buy the sequon Barkley. I don't buy I don't buy it at all. Sure they're trading on for a quarterback, there's still two teams picking in front of them. Oh I know. I mean they must feel comfortable with three quarterbacks in this draft, at least three quarterbacks, because there's no way you can know who the Browns are going to take and what the Giants are gonna do

if the Giants even stay at two. So they must like three this quarterbacks, which I'm glad you said that. I would love if that's the case. I would love the refreshing honesty, because I was joking about this over the weekend. Like every team in the league, they love to say like this was our guy, this was our number one guy. We got our number one. Everybody else can do what they want. But there's four quarterbacks that we feel really confident or going early in this draft. Sure,

what are the odds? I mean, as many as two of them could be picked before the Jets get on the clock, assuming there's no more movement. And so you're going to tell me that the guy that could potentially fall to third is definitely gonna be there, Guy Like, that's seems risky unless that they are willing to admit that they feel good about multiple quarterbacks. Yeah, that's what most teams don't want to admit that. They want to say we got our guy right. Mike mcagnan is a

friend of mine. He's a general manager for the Jets. Mike and I worked together nineteen ninety in NFL Europe. He was a young general manager actually player personnel guy for the London Monarchs that won the championship that year. Right out of school. This kid goes right end up being a you know, worked in working in nflure. Mike's great. Mike's a great guy. He's desperate right now, but he's desperate and this might be somebody else's problem next year.

You know, when you start talking about trading away picks and multiple picks and all that and trying to move into draft. Him and a head coach are clearly clearly on the hot seat there, and you make moves like this to try and keep your job, and if it doesn't work, Mike mckegnan will go back and be director of college scouting or director of pro personnel or director

player personnel somewhere else. But this is a move clearly that was made out of desperation for to try and find a quarterback, because again, their jobs are on the line. That's that's the type of move I personally, I personally would have not made that move unless I was going to two. I'm not sitting at three and hoping that things work out. They must done. They must like three of these quarterbacks. Yeah, well, if you're gonna make a

move like that, you're going to like one guy. I don't know how you could sit there and cast a net out and say, Okay, we like three of these guys. That's how quarterback desperate they are, though. Yeah, but then then that's really poor evaluation on his partner. I love Michael like a brother. Well not if they like three these quarterbacks though. Yeah, but you don't make that move. What if the tags are touching and there's clearly one tag above the other three tags, two tags, but you

know you're not getting the one. The Browns aren't trading out of one and number two with the Giants. We don't know what's going on there are the Giants and the Yeah, are they watched the Buffalo for Buffalo to trade three number ones? Because but we know Buffalo's two number ones this year is Getleman waiting for Buffalo to throw in that sweetener next year's one to go up to number two. Maybe it's interesting to hold New York New York. I mentioned it last week, New York New

yorked at Dynamic, they've never made a trade. Yeah, these two franchises, it might have been at that right there as a non starter for them. So three might be as early as the Jets were gonna pick. So they might not have had an option to go up to one and two. They go to three, they feel good. Okay, let's just say from the Jets perspective, we're sitting here, we think Sam Donald's going number one to Cleveland. Sure,

we don't have time for Josh Allen to wait. Okay, but we feel good about Baker Mayfield or Josh Rosen coming in being capable and NFL starting quarterbacks. We're gonna go up to three. We feel we're gonna get one of those two quarterbacks. I mean, the logic is there at least which and honestly, I would find it refreshing if a team was willing to admit that that's how

they were thinking, because it's all a crapshoot anyway. You know, don't don't try to convince me that you got your guy at three when odds are he's probably QB one aka Sam Darnold. Just admit it. And honestly, I mean, nobody really has a consensus on how these quarterbacks stack up anyway. So you get up to three, you know there's no way all of them are gone, and you just hope for the best with the guy you get. I don't I get what you're saying, Like that's kind

of scary to admit that you're just leaving it to chance. Yeah, you gotta do what you gotta do, But yeah, you're right. I understand going up and I understand giving it up. But I also understand, though, what I'm going to get. YEA We've been very clear they're going to get a quarterback. We've been very clear about this that we our little group is willing to trade up for certain players. Oh sure, not just the hope that somebody's gonna be there. Our

jobs aren't on the line though. Not only that, but on this show, we've been you know, every time we do that, we're like Roquan Smith or Derwin James. It's like always one, it's never We've never been able to come to a consensus on the guy. Here's the other thing, too, is they're not the only team. Look, Arizona Buffalo. They had to do it before anyone else is going to trade up. And with Buffalo having those two first round picks, having the AMMO, they Dije just said, hey, we're gonna

beat them to the punch. We're gonna go up to number three and we're going to you know, eliminate that doubt. And if if the Buffalo wants to go up to number two and trade three number ones, so be it. But we're gonna go up to the number three so they can't go to is Denver out of the mix had taken the quarterback. Now, oh they Petron case Keams a nice quarterback, but he is not. Yeah, but they talked about Paxton Lynch as a development and quarterback for

them right now. They've talked about that. You can't as they're covering their butts, you can't rule them out. I mean, how could you? What? I don't think Paxton Lynch has done absolutely nothing to make have they given him a chance to do anything. He's seen a few starts and he's tripped over his feet and I mean he's I'm not saying I'm not completely they they they they missed that one up. John Elway messed that one up. And by drafting him or what, oh if you draft him

or what, are not playing him? How about that? Yeah? How about everybody else at least has an idea what their quarterbacks can do. That's a terrible, terrible job of it. And this we don't know what's going on behind the scenes too though. Oh no, the kid doesn't work hard, right exactly. I've said that. I mean I've gone on people in Yeah, I've gone on Denver. People love me because I'm like the Denver whisperer. And if he's not pushing himself off the field, then you know he doesn't

need to see see the field on my team. So I like they botch the Packs and Lynch situation by drafting in the first place. If this is how his legacy in Denver is gonna play out, But no, absolutely quarterback is still in play. Case Keenum is a nice short term quarterback, which you're about to say something, Yeah, I'm about to ask you a big time question. Go ahead.

That further approves the logic and what the Jets did is like, even at six, you can't just sit back and assume that you get a guy you feel good about. That's why Buffalo is traded up to Yeah, and we'll see if Buffalo can get there at three somewhere, we just don't know where. We don't know where. At three, the Jets are guaranteed to have a chance at one of these prospects that everybody considers. You know, here's my question, where's betting on? Here's my question? And the gentleman, go ahead.

If you're Woody Johnson, which current NFL GM would you like draft for you? The owner of the New York Jets. You gotta make that pick. You guys, tell me, everybody's telling me that man, they've got three guys, they like, give me a current NFL GM that you want drafting for you in that spot at three, then I just put everybody on the spot a little bit. Yeah. No, I mean I'm like going through my well, through my memory banks, right, Who's gonna pick me the best player

at three? Well? You could talk to Mickey, Yeah, Mickey would I don't know. I mean there's plenty of general managers in this league who I would trust with that pick. I don't know if one necessarily stands out as being, you know, a quarterback guru general manager who nails the quarterback evaluations more so than like another. So you're okay with Mike mcagnan making that pick. I'm okay with him

making that pick. Sure. I mean I'm not saying that I would prefer him out of thirty two general managers pick. But he knows the Jets better than any other general manager. No. But if you but if you had to have a guy that you know this is, this is a guts pick right here. I really, because you guys are telling me, Hey, they like multiple guys picked the multi pick the one

guy you like. I really I respect your guy, John Schneider a lot everybody busts picks and then um, Kevin Colbert in Pittsburgh is another guy who always seems like he does a really good job. But that's I mean, franchises have to make big picks on quarterbacks so infrequently, at least the successful ones, the ones that aren't constantly

turning over their general managers. It's it's not like there's a guy out there who's got this amazing track record of like, well, when he drafts a quarterback, right there you go. So I mean, take your best shot at it with a guy who's got a good track record. I mean, I don't think there's one guy that stands above anybody else. Mike mccagnen in New York has been on the outside looking in on some of these top quarterbacks last few years. He's helped own a lot of

resources at these quarterbacks. I mean he Bryce Petty in the fourth round, Christian Hackenberg in the second round. He's tired of doing what the same? What that's not the same? Yeah, I mean he's been on the outside looking in, Like you know, he hasn't gone for it in the first round on one of these quarterbacks. You're always jobs on the line. Now, absolutely so he needs. When you're talking quarterbacks, big assets are like top ten picks at like what

the Jets just did, that's big assets. Hackerberg was a lottery ticket. Spending pick fifty one on Christian Hackenburg is not a big roll, That's what I mean. Obviously it was a miss, don't get me wrong, but like, that's not when it comes to finding your quarterback for the next decade, that's nothing. I don't think that the Jets never looked at Christian Hackenberg is saying that's our future right there. They looked at him as saying like a und pick, it was a lottery ticket. It's they saw

him as different. It's different for quarterbacks. Everything is different for quarterbacks. Have this argument every year, unless unless it's a top ten pick or you're trading and something crazy to get up there like the Eagles, that's big time stuff getting up to get wins the way they did and it worked out. What are the Jets just doing? No exactly, but this you're saying they've been throwing stuff at it for years. I'm saying that's half If you look at a two and a four for a quarterback, Yeah,

they're throwing stuff out there. No, again, those are lottery tickets. That's not the same to me. They never I don't think they looked at it too become a just because it's a quarterback. Say it's a lottery ticket too. I don't think they ever looked at those two quarterbacks instead, this is our future. I mean, christ Iver hasn't taken a snap. I mean, I don't think they ever really viewed the I mean he looked at it as how

many isab is it? How many quarterbacks taken outside the top thirty five picks have ever blossomed into anything meaningful? Like maybe half a dozen? Ever, I mean Russell Wilson's you got your Russell Wilson, you got your your Drew Brees, you got your dad. Yea, yeah, it's not a long list, Tom Brady. It is not a long list. It works out really well sometimes it's not a long list. And so the second round pick not becoming I mean, when you're talking about it, it's not it's just it's a

it's not a guarantee. You draft a you draft a linebacker fifty first overall, he'd better be a starter right now. He better be a good player quarterback. You're just like oh this works. Yeah, yeah, it's a chance because there's a reason he's not going in the first. But then all that argument you guys made with me about trading fifty up because you wanted to make a pick. Yeah, what's your point? Well, my point is, though, you guys are just kind of treating it like a lot. I mean, oh,

just a quarter that's a lot. I feel like we did this last year, or maybe it was the year before, which makes me no. I just can't get over the fact that you guys are just saying that a second round pick for a quarterback is a lottery. Everything is different about quarterbacks, everything everything one hundred it just throw the rest of it out the window. Let me change the subject here. Can Buffalo make the Giants move out

of two? Yeah? Sure, three first round picks? You think that's what it's going to take this year's They have two picks in the first round this year plus the first nick because and this is different because the Giants are you're not off the look. I need a GM by the way, too, you're gonna give me a GM. Uh, I'll go with I'll go to Dorsey. Dorsey's got guts. He took a Yeah, he's gonna have to pick a quarterback Toomes last year, Yeah, and Mahomes or John Dorsey did.

He was at his house from June until December last year, sitting at home watching tape on spending most of his time on these quarterbacks. Right. I remember I received a text from him in August. He said, Dan, give me your top four quarterbacks. Yeah, I'm gonna start looking at these guys. I said, in my top four quarterbacks. And he he has been working on these quarterbacks for a while now. He has a probably a better understanding of who these guys are more than any other general manager.

So for the Jets or the MCA, the owner said, hey, let's get out there and watch these cats play every day. I'm not mccagnan is one of the hardest working jem Oh. I love Mike. You go to a pro day, you go to the shrink, he's gonna be No, he is gonna be there, Absolutely he is. But he his job is on the line. Exactly. You made me pick a guy. I gave you a guy. Okay, I'm with you on Dorsey. All right. Back to the Giants, Uh, they're going back. If they trade with Buffalo, They're trading out of the

top ten. That's a big drop to go from two to outside the top ten. Now again you're picking up three first round picks, but that's a big drop, and so it's going to take a little bit more than you know what other teams have traditionally gone up for. Throw the trade value chart out the window for quarterbacks, especially if they do know, especially the quarterback, it does not matter, that's right. It's it's all that you know, second round picks or oh, it's all the rules change

when you're talking about quarterbacks, every single one. There are no rules. That's it. I mean, it's and I'm not saying that what the Jets did taking Hackenburg, they're taking a chance, was the right thing to do. I had a fourth round grade on Hackenburg. I just you know, I'm not gonna say, oh, because they use the second round pick on him, that means that, you know, that's they thought he'd be the future. I think they just thought it would be you know, they saw some promise

and that hasn't you know, come to fruition for him. Okay, time to move on. Christian Hackenburg will not be in the jests next year. Does that bother you I just let me ask you this. If you're the Giants, you move three first round picks. I was you know, I was just thinking when Dane was saying, like, we're watching the Draft Day show. What I mean, what's that show with Kevin cost What was that movie Draft Day? I

think it was it called Draft Day? So yeah, I told, like, guy by the way, I fast costs right, un told a guy in Seattle, pick that ga Vonte mac no matter what, right, pick, no matter what. Yeah, if you want to go ahead and pick that guy, yeah, pick that guy. Nobody comes to it. I never even saw it. I heard it was trash, not worth your time, it's not good. But the draft, come on, it is kids. The movie Officiano here by the way, Um, what was like?

Oh no, I turned that down. I get I get what you're getting in return, but it would be hard for me to go from picking second in the draft to twelve. Oh you earned that spot, and then twenty two. I know. That's what I mean. If it was like eight, I'd feel alive. So while you're picking second, because you're not any good, That's what I'm saying. Yeah, I'm going to add. But see here's I don't I really don't think much like the Cowboys the year that they were

up there. I don't think they're as bad as the record would indicate. And I think that's what makes it tempting to do a deal like that, because you talk and you had two first round grades to or near first round grades to your team, can go a long way toward putting you back in contention. Does Gentleman get killed if he doesn't make that trade three first rounds? Depends on who they get as if they won't Cleveland. Does I think they need to look at a quarterback

like I know Eli Manning. They think he has another two to three years. They don't expect me picking a top five very often. Sure, well, I'm taking a quarterback while I can now. If they're not taking a quarterback, then you take that deal and run. And I know it'd be tempting to stay there and take Barkley, stay in there, take Chubb, you take three first round picks, and you rebuild that roster. At number twelve, you're gonna get a good player. You're gonna get you. Could you

get a quarterback or twelve? Sure it's possible, bar Jackson, I don't. I don't know. I mean you have to you're contending with think about okay, think about the owner trading in front of you to get a quarterback. Five could be off the board by the time you pick Lamar Jackson or Teddy Bridgewater from Louisville. Just in general, just in general, just coming out of coming out of Louisville, they're very different, Lamar. You have to with Teddy's knees. I mean you have no, no, no, just coming out

of just coming out of Louisville. Still, Lamar, I mean, if they're all perfectly, I mean I had a higher prospect. And the reason I'm asking this is because the guy who coached Bridgewater is now you're head coach with the Giants. I don't even who who is the job? Suremur yeah, thank you, sorry, I mean Bridgewater is in New York, the other New York though. Yeah, I'm just saying, coming out of college, who would you rather have, Lamar Jackson

or Teddy Bridge. I had a higher grade on Teddy Bridgewater as a prospect than I did do Lamar Jackson as a prospect. But again, Teddy Bridgewater with his twelve I'm too intrigued by everything. Lamar Jackson can do for you. I just and there's a good chance he's not going to be there at twelve. Yeah, I mean, if you want a quarterback, you take him at two, or you don't trade that far down. I will. It's very I was thinking about this because we had a mail bad

question about it today. It's interesting this conversation. It's interesting being on the outside of it because we were on the inside a couple of years ago, and everybody on this show was not firmly anti draft a quarterback, but we leaned more toward getting a Zeke Elliott or whoever else was talked about. Oh for no. But what I'm saying, you know, from the outsider's perspective, I agree with Dane.

I'm like, the Giants should get a quarterback like Eli Manning's not getting any younger, blah blah blah blah blah. You're not gonna be in the top five that often. But two years ago I was like, Romo's still got some time left and you can help him out a lot. So like, I'm fascinated to see how that conversation gets resolved on their end, because we know exactly how the Cowboys. My point is that Patch coach that style of a quarterback. They he they thought enough. I don't think Bridgewater to

get back in the draft, am I right? I don't think there are anything similar though. Yeah, I mean I'm just saying that's quarterback. I mean, not compared to Lamar Jackson. Yeah, so, but you liked but you liked Jackson. Are you assuming you liked Bridgewater to hire prospect grade on Bridgewater because he's a better pastor coming out of Louisville than Lamar. I mean, Lamar offers so much more as an athlete, a much more electrifying player with a ball in his hands.

But Teddy was a more polished pastor coming out of Louisville. So I have had a gray on Teddy. Obviously with his knees, you don't know what you're getting. And now with New York they have McCowan Bridgewater, plus they're gonna draft a quarterback high. It's gonna be an interesting quarterback room for the Jets. Are you trying to make them? You're trying to make the point that the Giants could trade back and still get a quarterback. Yeah, it's the

point I'm trying to make. Yeah, just because maybe the guy who's Maybe they go to Louisville again, maybe they look at that system, maybe they say, wow, this guy gets coached this way. This is why you know. Yeah, I get it. Lamar Jackson is not the passer of Teddy Bridgewater. I get it. I think that. I think me personally, if you gave me, you give me one or the other. I'm taking Jackson every single day. I'm

just that's me. I'm taking. I'm just saying, if you're Pat Shermer and you felt like that, you know what we could what if they do you think you could get the Oklahoma guy twelve? I doubt it. Not really too many quarterback and needy teams. And he's saying the Jets are gonna take him. I think the Jets are gonna say Mayfield or Rosen. Okay, they don't have to, I don't. They don't have time to wait for Josh Allen mcagnet and Todd Bowles. They got to win pretty

quickly here. And even if Josh McCowen or Teddy Bridgewater is a starter for you guys, he's killing my questions here today. What's the question? This quarterback is ready to start? Now? What the rookie give me a guy. Yeah. Rosen and Mayfield I think are the closest of these quarterbacks to starting right away. Doesn't mean then necessarily should, but there are the closest of these top five quarterbacks. Mayfield's uh,

four year starter. I mean the guy. He There's gonna be a transition from Oklahoma's offense to what they're gonna ask him to do in the NFL, but I think he can handle it. And then Rosen, he's been running a pro style scheme at UCLA. He's ready to step Ryan. I keep calling him Matt Ryan. Yeah, he's very close to that. So he's I'm not saying think Mike White's ready to start now. To be honest with you, I think Mike White's gonna be a great backup in this league.

Mike White's gonna be I think. I think, I like this is the Western Kentucky quarterback by that was a good player. He's a really good player. I'm interested. I'm not saying he's ready, but I'd be interested to see what Jackson could do in the same way that Deshaun Watson's athleticism all I mean, Deshaun Watson's not a polished quarterback and by a pro standards by any level. But his athleticism allowed him to do a lot of stuff. And I wonder, I wonder if that guy they yeah,

he did. No. Absolutely, that's what I'm saying. Lamar Jackson's not ready to play quarterback in the NFL in the way that you think about it. But he could make something. But he can make things happen, which presents problems while about learning. Absolutely, yeah, And if that's what's I'm okay with quarterbacks starting right away as rookies if they're ready. I mean, we saw last year with Deshaun Kaiser. All

I heard was he's ready. He's ready. He wasn't ready when ready, But you know, I just again, Mike White's ready. Do not keep saying, do not try to predict who you're starting quarterbacks gonna be. Hugh Jackson came out and said that Tyrod Taylor's starting quarterback. I mean, that's fine. We everyone knows he's going to be. We don't why you come out and say that. It's dumb. You wait and you let training camp decide that. Yeah. Do not come out and say you're starting three or whatever, one

in thirty one whatever. That I didn't get that either, and like, why why why I throw that out there now? I don't know nothing. We're gonna have a new staff there in Cleveland. Get ready. That's the way it is. Sorry, Dane, and go save that franchise. You door see Elliott and all those guys have fun room. You get a quarterback, you said at Jackson, Right, you think it's gonna be interesting? I think, well, what like my my QB one? Like, I don't do the ranking stuff. I'm just saying you,

who's ready to start? You said at Jackson. I didn't say he's ready to start? I said he has. The question was he has gifts that the other guys don't have that could make him a viable threat in an offense right away. I mean as a runner, getting out of bad situations, extending plays. But if you if you're the Giants and you do really like Lamar Jackson, do you feel comfortable trading at twelve and still getting him? I think I would. You're not worried about another team

trading up. But Aaron, let me ask you this. It's sitting a fifteen training up to eleven to get him. That's Miami moving right well, any just in gen But That's the great debate is like, why get cute if you feel good about a guy? Let me tell you what if I what about the Giants? What how much do you think about Alan? Do you think Alan would be there at twelve? No? Because the NFL teams are stupid. Okay.

If Buffalo is going up to two and quarterbacks are going one, two, three, right, okay, and then we think, good chance Denver could take one as long as the quarterback they like is there at five. That's four quarterbacks right there, there's one quarterback left. Let's just say it's actually two, two three, five, and then okay, let's just say, for hypothetical sake, it's Lamar Jackson. Who's the fifth quarterback? So between pick six and eleven, that's gonna feel like

an internity. Yeah, for a team like the Giants say, if that's who they really want, and I don't. There's not a single team in that stretch that really fits the mold of needing a quarterback. So you're talking about I mean trade candidates like if an Air Arizona, what you start? So you got San Francisco in there, you got Oakland, you got Chicago, you got Tampa a whole lot of teams that don't need quarterback, does Arizona. Arizona signed Sam Bradford for a whole lot of money that

he doesn't deserve. What they got to do something at quarterback? They can't be done. Yeah, no, they got to make a bold move here. Could go from fifteen to eleven. Sounds doable. Absolutely well, they wouldn't do that, un let's say neither to see their quarterbacks in position to trade for right, I mean, there goes your let's go to Miami to eleven. That that well, I'm just saying when when if the quarterback gets to eleven, that's when you

make that trade, not now right? Well, no, sure, oh, I don't think Arizona would do something like that right now until they're on the clock. But right, I think Dane's point is that the Giants probably shouldn't trust that nothing's going to happen on draft night. Yeah, that's if they really want Lamar Jackson. I don't think you go to twelve and you feel great, you're gonna get them there.

I think you have to be I'm okay doing that deal because you're picking up three first round picks, but then you better be prepared to move up from twelve to eight something else, because if you last year in the first round, the Saints they were ready to take Pat Mahomes at eleven. Right, they were sitting there thinking, okay, well, sure quarterback of the future, Chiefs leap frog him, huge, huge jump. They get Pat Mahomes at ten, and it worked out okay for the Saints. They got Marshawn Latimore

there at eleven. But you cannot sit back and wait for your quarterback to fall to you. You need to be aggressive, go get your guy if he is your guy. I'm so fascinated by this and by this conversation, mainly because of Lamar Jackson, which we're sitting here saying he might not last till twelve. And then you can look at a boatload of information on the Internet that tells you he'll prest mock draft round. Where's in your mock draft fifteen to Arizona. But I don't predict any trades. Yeah,

fall as late as like twenty seven. Yeah, and so for three first round picks, I might roll the dice. I would do it. Yeah, But like I said, I think you need to prepare to package two threes to move up three or four spots or something. I got you Oakland Gruden, here you go, get in there, John. Thank you boys for that. I appreciate you in lighting me and just decided to say nuts to the schedule today. Wow, what do you mean twenty eight? Just the conversation's too good.

Not that I have a problem with it now when people get fired up, I'm all for it. When we come back, we'll have a little Twitter on the twenty Stay tuned. It can be hard to find the right resource for learning about important financial matters. You search how to build savings, you end up reading about the one weird ingredient from supermarkets that can make you taller. That's why Bank of America build Better Money Habits dot com, a safe little corner of the Internet for answering your

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can you love for details. This is the Dallas Cowboys dot com Draft Cowboys. We're back here in the SWBC Mortgage Studios. Brian brought us Stain Bruger, David Helma, Kent Garrison, Executive Producing. I've got a couple of guides and stuff coming up for your hair that you need to get your hands on. The one I'm holding in my hands right now, Ken't Garrison. I know you get a shot of that, I'll hold it steady. That's gonna be our Dallas Cowboys. That's gonna be our Star magazine Draft guide

right there. Good job Kent moving that thing around. As you can see, we got three Texas kids on the cover there. Kids from the state of Texas only, but some quality receivers there. Chuck full of information everything you need to know about the draft. Kind of a little supplement for you and working hard on that. A lot of guys working hard, a lot of guys and gals both working hard. That should be out the first of

April or the week first week of April. This one also will be out, Dan Burglar, this will be the Beast. Tell us about the Beast. I'm hoping April second. That's the date I'm hoping for it to be out, So we're that's two weeks from the day, so it's I just got anxiety thinking about that. There's it's a lot to do to figure to finish it up. There's gonna be a ton of reports, more details than you could possibly want. I'd give you a word count, but it's

gonna be there. You go right there. Those are just scouting reports on guys. Dan, just promise me you won't lose sleep if you you know, if there isn't a tidbit about like why this guy got his name and like his nickname, and like what year it happened, like, it'll be better than that. It'll be okay. You know this is I literally work on this three hundred and

sixty five days a year. So if i'll like it happened last year, where I finished it, sent it out, and I'm cleaning up my office and I found a post it note about exactly what you're talking about, Like this guy's nickname was this, and I was like, oh no, damn it, I forgot to add this, like I just that kills me because my favorite Seials, Captain Runch, got into Scotting Report. Yeah, well, I'll tell you what though, that's what you need to get though the Star magazine.

Dame Bruger's part of the Star magazine coverage as well. Yeah, that's our preview. Goodies in there, some goodies for you, and then again the Beast. That link will be on his Twitter page. It'll be the best way to find easy to order band it like I do. You can't take it to Kinko's fed Exos people, they'll put it

together for you. But it's so worth to have everything you want to know to get you ready for those three days here in the irving as we get ready, all right, David Hellman, give me a little twitter on the Twitter. Thank you very much. Let's do it. Let's cover some current news inside this team, okay, and how it pertains the Cowboys draft, you know, as as I think it's out there Cowboys are hosting some free agents this week. They're getting involved in the cheaper aspect of

free agency. A couple veteran linemen, a couple of veteran receivers, I think making their way through here at our point this week. So Daniel wants to know would a veteran offensive line signing eliminate offensive lineman as a need at eighteen I'm trying it to ninth nineteen um. And we got the Patriots guy whose name escapes me right now, Flemming, Thank you Fleming, and then Marcus Martin from Bright. Those are a couple of guys that I've looked at myself already.

My question real quick on Fleming, Patriots lost Nates Soldier. Yeah, he's got a forty one year old quarterback. Yeah, Fleming, is that good? How are the Patriots letting them walk out to walk him out the door? Solder? I get he got a lot of money, yeah, but how are you letting I think they want this guy? Yeah, I think they want this guy back. I do if they

want him back that badly building. But I think it's a situation where they're gonna it'll probably be okay, go get offers and then come back, they come back to us, and the Patriots have a weird way of doing that. They get guys to they get shopped offers, and so you got to if if it works, it works. If not, I mean they'll let guys go. But yeah, I I don't think it. I don't think it takes him out of that mix. I really really don't don't either. I mean, I to me, we've kind of heard that, you know,

the thirty visits will tell us a lot. You know, that'd be I've checked on that. Would that would be. We're probably two weeks away from those starting here, and I think that'll tell you from what I understand, Hernandez is one of the visits that they brought in. So with that, you know, maybe it's a situation where they signed one of these guys and still visit Hernandez. You know, we've seen that from this team in the past, where they've signed a running back and then all of a

sudden they draft Ezekiel Elliott. So I don't think this keeps the Cowboys out of We thought Colton Miller too. You and I were talking in pre show Coulton Miller or hearing rumors that he's one of the thirty visit guys for the Cowboy. That's a tackle right there. So I think it's about looking at, you know, what's available on free agency and what can help us in this draft. I don't think that stops him at all. Let's fold

this over on itself, because that's another thing. I mean, with these veteran lineman coming in, you know, word going around that the Cowboys would at least consider signing a starting right tackle and moving Lyle Collins back to left guard. So Tom's asking about that, and really, I mean it's a question that I have too, because that kind of changes how you view this whole puzzle if that's something

they're actually talking about, which and on it. Like, for my part, I don't even know what to make of it. I don't know how you could try to make switches like that before you even have a guy on the roster who can do that job. Also, Fleming, I think has twenty starts over the last five years, which that watched him. I watched him in preseason, I watched Martin in preseason. Fleming I watched play the Super Bowl and a playoff game and against the Steelers during the year

he was at right tackle at right tackle. How'd that go? You know what? Against Philip Dolphyeah, I was good that. It's encouraging to see that he had some good snaps against him, because that's a team you played twice a year if he has to play. But I the guy I liked. I liked Martin at guard. I mean Fleming to me is I think Fleming is a for three

hundred and over twenty pounds. I think he's a good athlete, but I saw him at I mean positionally feet and hands and body balance and stuff kind of a little bit everywhere, but he's such a good athlete that he can recover when things go back. I mean I saw some guys getting the edge on him a little bit. So if this team signs hyothetical they signed Martin, do you think guard is still in play at nineteen Well,

I think he becomes the Joe Looney player. I think Martin becomes the center guard Joe loo you sign which And that's kind of the same thing with Fleming. I mean, until until I'm told otherwise anything's possible, And they have their personnel meetings and decide to move all back to the left guard, which I don't like. That, but until I'm told otherwise, I would assume either one of these signings would be guys that you're signing to fill the

role of departed free agents. I get Looney and Byron Bell. Yes, and honestly, he's trying to upgrade those spots, and even Jonathan Cooper to a to a point, yeah, Fleming sounds like just based on his resume, sounds like a massive upgrade over what they had, Oh, no doubt. Yeah, And I mean you could play with this, which was no question you could even if you took like I would be willing to drastically overpay him to be my swing

tackle if it meant that. I felt, if you if you don't like, if you don't like Chaz Green and you don't want to do anything, and you draft yes and Tyron Smith and Tyron Smith at the back. I mean, now again, I watched Fleming play right tackle onely, he's made some starts of left tackle. I've only saw him play but in the game, in the big time games, the Super Bowl, the playoff game against Jacksonville, much better against power being Pittsburgh than he was Speed Jacksonville and Philly.

But so that's what I'm just saying. And to go back to Dane's point or Dane's question, if you make that signing of Martin or In whatever, just put in a veteran guard there. You're thinking of that more as your depth swing interior lineman, leaving you open to drafting your starter sure somewhere in the draft. I don't disagree with that. I don't disagree. I just think that you got to look at it. This is a chain. Dane's not buying it. I mean, skeptical look on Dan's face.

Give me a starting guard, I mean they're not. You can find a cable starting guard for Oh, I don't think I think Martin can start. I personally think Martin could start. I do so. But you still think there's an option of guard at nineteen. I think that if you said, if you said, okay, if they're looking at him just at the question, was was he they looking at him just as that swing player. Yeah, I mean he did. But I just going a little deeper. I

my notes. I wrote down, I wrote down original ron Leary. I mean, I'm talking about the big Ron Leary, not the slim down ron Leary, the one that remains. I'm talking about a big guy that's physical, that's got some upper body strength. You know, ron Leary wasn't always great getting to the second level and you know all that. But this guy he's got he's got some ron Leary traits to him. From what I saw, I would just

love I'm with Dane in this. I mean, and they need they need a swing guy too, but I would love to just get that need out of the way. Well, if they might, they might draft, they might draft again. I think Dane's gonna be right. They they probably won't take a guard at nineteen. They probably won't if they signed Martin they I don't know if they will. Along the same line, Like I said, there's a couple of veteran receivers come gard. I think Sean wants to know.

Would signing a veteran receiver kill the dream of taking a receiver early? Not not with the Wednes. That's why I I think Justin Hunters one of them. Yeah, out of here, Justin Hunter's we're talking about maybe a fourth receiver. We're talking about like vet minimum signings too, like not, Yeah, don't there was a time when Justin Hunter I thought it was gonna be the next aj Green Tennessee kid.

Right at Tennessee, he looked like, recruited him, coached him, he looked like the next day J Green, and then towards acl Mesta, he hasn't looked the same since, hasn't done anything, uh, since he was a second round pick because the Titans way back when. So yeah, that's you're trying to replace Bryce Butler with those picks exactly. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, all right, we'll wrap up the last of this like current events, um with a question from d Davis, which, Okay, I haven't seen this from any

credible source. I think it's just fans speculation. You correct me if I'm wrong, But he wants to know, would you take the colts thirty sixth overall pick for David Irving. Seems like there's a lot of speculations out there, bad

Eber coordinator. Yeah. Yeah, And the Colts now have two second round picks, which I think I read if they were to do that deal, they would have to surrender their air own, Yes, their own, and Chris Ballard was in CASEC when Irving was originally on that roster on the practice squad, but which okay, hey, I'm there's a lot of links that make this makes sense. But have you heard it from anything credible other than this makes sense? No? Either, have I what kind of messes that up is? I

think Chris is really focused on the draft. Yeah, I don't think he's looking too because they got out some money to spend and they've barely spent any dollars. Yeah, so they they've looked at somebody's price tags and said, well, we'll go wholesale, not retail. We'll go build through the draft. We'll get these draft picks, and next year we'll we'll see you. I mean, we'll save up some money, maybe resign some of our own guys. I mean, I think Chris is doing it the right way. He's not just

throwing money out there and seeing what happened. So I would be surprised if we saw anything happen with Irving, especially with the Colts. Who knows? Are the Cowboys doing it the right way? What do you mean with the way they're handling free agency? And it's hard to say that when they're literally the only team that has not signed a player from the outside. But no, but you praise Balor for what his his because they're not in

a Colts aren't winning this year. You know, he's not trying to put a band aid on some holes and trying to mean trying to build something. They're in a pretty different phase of their roster building. It seems right Cowboys are willing to there there they need to shoot with with seventy million dollars, shouldn't he be trying to rebuild his roster then for the right price tag? Yeah, it's it's the same philosophy applied to a different situation. Obviously,

the Colts have a lot more money. I think. You know, the conclusion I've come to is like building through the draft and doing it that way is overall the right strategy. But you're not going to get where you want to go without bringing in some outside help, I don't think. But yeah, the Colts are in a different spot where, like I think it's probably understood that the Colts aren't expect to contend for at least a year or two, and so that's not something they need to be doing

right now. Where if the Cowboys were bad, we would be if the Cowboys just drafting guys, If the Cowboys were bad, they would have tens of million dollars more in cap space and probably a lot more draft picks or higher draft picks to work with. Like you look at the Jets, that's a desperate team. The amount of money they gave Tremaine Johnson. I mean, Tremaine Johnson's a nice player, but they gave him a lot of money because they're desperate and they have some money to spend,

so they're going to try and win right now. Indianapolis doesn't need to do that. They need to build for the future. And I mean, I get some of the fans, Indie fans, being upset because they haven't spent a lot of the money, but I mean, I don't know, it's hard to get too upset when I think they're just trying to build for the future, not necessarily, you know, plug a few holes when they're not going to win next year. Plus they had to factor in Luck is

kind of holding that franchise hostage right now. And not Luck specifically, but his injury, his arm injury, it's the shoulder, it's you just don't know. But the fact that they've unknown there, the fact that the Cults are willing to trade out of a top three pick tells you they must at least feel optimistic about him. Oh yeah, and I think they do, but I don't. You can't go all in for this year, yeah, you know, no without knowing for sure Luck what's going on with him, and

then the state of your roster. But yeah, I think the cults are gonna be interesting because I don't think they want to move back, but they're going to be open to and it's gonna be pretty enticing if they get some more offers. But I think they'll be perfectly fine sticking at six and taking Quentin Nelsen. Yeah, if

Chubb gets there, they'll be fine taking a guy there. Spencer, going back to what we were just talking about, Spencer says, just whatever, pick a name, it doesn't matter for this exercise. But just assuming the Cowboys address their offensive line in a satisfactory manner over the next few weeks, would that make you more or less likely to trade up? And I think his logic is that if you do that, with the exception of wide receiver, I guess the vast

majority of your needs are on defense. So does that make you more likely to use draft capital to go get a defender that you really feel good about or trade away from it? If there's not a guy that fits at nineteen. I guess I recently did a mock draft just posted on Twitter today, and the top defensive players available at nineteen in this scenario Tavin Bryan Florida

three technique, Layton vander Esch linebacker. Both those players went twenty and twenty one his mock, Marcus Davenport with twenty three, Harold Landry, Mike used or On Pain. So those are the defensive players that would just available be available in this scenario. I don't know if anyone necessarily sticks out as yeah, we should stay and get that guy. I don't know if who would you wind up picking for Dallas.

Calvin Ridley? Yeah, I think I feel better about Calvin Ridley than any of the guys you just named off. You want to go? Where did you pick? Roquan Smith thirteen Redskins? We're We're back. No, I'm back on this. No, I'm just I'm just thinking Derwin James. You have him, Sampa seven, Tampa Minka went nine to the San Francisco Can I ask a quick question about him? Which one? Mika Minka? What do you got? Is he really sliding? Is he gonna slide? I don't know. No, he's not sliding.

Dane Burglar told me a couple of weeks ago to mark it down that he was going forward to the Browns. So wow, he's sliding. Dan, No, I don't think he's sliding. It's he's a top ten pick. I mean, I don't think he's a top five lock. Where's the top ten pick? So I don't If he goes nine doesn't mean sliding. And we get so, well, we thought he was a top four pick, didn't we Just because we had n't

going forward doesn't mean oh, definitely going top four. Yeah, I mean we get so like locked in this, like we had Minka going forward was a staple in mock drafts. Oh sure it was. And then all of a sudd and when he doesn't go forward, it's like, oh gosh, he's falling. No, No, I'm just asking, No, I know, I get that a lot, how Minka is falling. You're being kind of combative today. I feel like it's Monday falling.

Okay because along the top five. No. But the funny thing this happens too, where like we in the media go away from a guy and in the league like their opinion never changed. So all of a sudden, the media catches up to what the teams have already learned. But I feel like a lot of times the media will spend it even further forward than that, and all of a sudden, a guy they're projecting to go at twelve goes at five, and everybody's like, oh, that's so surprising,

when it really it's not at all. No, it's not surprising at all. People get so a little over the top of some of these. You know, if a player we had projected going top five falls to eight or nine, doesn't mean he's falling. It's just there wasn't a natural fit at five, six or seven, you know. I mean, it's just Quentin Nelson. You know, he could fall to eleven. That's a really good point. Like wait, I mean we've the very first show we did in January was like,

that's he's the best prospect in the draft. He's gonna be on the cover of your book. It's not absolutely he can fall all the way to like twelve, yeah, and it's you know what could happen. So since Leonard Williams fell to five, yeah, six, about six exactly? All right, let's we gotta take we gotta take a quick breakcare and thank you everybody on Twitter. We appreciate that take a quick break. We'll come back. We'll finish up with

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I am hey, okay, I'm frazzled. All right, we're good. I'm worried about you man. A little bit story about you've just been throwing grenades at him for the last hour. Oh no, he's tough. It gets tough. He handled that. He could surely hang on the handle. That okay. David Hillman Kent Garrison as well. David, let's called blue. Will tell me more if we could. I did this one just for you, Brian. Thank you because I listened to you and I respect your opinion. And you haven't shut

up about this guy. So I want you to tell me more about Memphis linebacker Jennard Avery. Jenard Avery, do you want to talk about him a little bit yourself? Like you're a guy, This says, the guy won't shut up about So I love I love this guy. Hold on, I gotta get my notes all pulled up. Leave Dan alone. And by the way, his first name Jennard, Jennard Avious, Genard Avious. Yes, he's a flyer Avius related to my guy Mingo at a lsu or Jennard Avious and Barkivius.

This guy's a six foot two hundred and forty eight pound missile. This guy is four or five nine on the speed. By the way, not bad run a little bit, ya. I'm looking for those guys. I'm looking for guys to have got again just over six foot two hundred and forty eight pounds. Like I said, I'm looking like guys that will step up, take on blocks, be physical, play the point of attack. This guy's a violent tackler. I saw that. I mean, at times a little bit too

aggress if at times an overrun some plays. But yeah, I'll tell you what you know. The guy plays with some balance. I thought he could work through the trash. He works against double teams. He could split those and do all right. He's quick to read plays, he could get outside in a hurry. He never gives up on a play. I just see a relentless player. I mean, I like how he comes back. If he goes up to field the balls there, he comes back, makes the play,

retraces his steps close down on the edge. This this guy. There's a lot to like about this guy. And they use him though as a rusher. I mean that's his big thing though. He is a guy that they take off the edge and he can get low and dip and get around the corner and cause some problems in the pocket games. I watch Central Xtreme Connecticut, Tulane sim in Central Florida with the games, I took a peek at this kid. I'm just not sure where you're gonna

play him. I mean, maybe he's just a MIC linebacker, don't I don't see that at all, because he can't cover, and he can't he's a downhill only player. Well you know what though, That's what I'm saying though, when you you don't and as as mike linebacker, they could take him. I mean they could use him. They're using Jalen Smith as a rusher. Now, Jalen Smith is going to end up being a MIC linebacker rusher. Let me tell you that. If you're gonna use this guy as a strictly a rusher,

I'm okay. With that, not strictly as a rusher. I'm talking about a point of attack player that's physical that he play sideline the sideline there. Yeah, if you're gonna use him strictly only going downhill, you might have something there. But what's your draft grade on him? I got him the third round, Okay, so so I'm getting him at eighty one for me is for him. He sounds like

he's gonna go. Well, I meant at all eighty one. Overall, that's not the steepest price in the world to pay for an early down linebacker, Like if you got to take him off the field in obvious passing situations. I mean third, he's pick eighty one, He's not picked nineteen. See the thing about it is though he has not seen any film with him cover. That's why he's making the adjustment thing. Oh sure, no, nor your analysis was

he can't cover, but he plays as a rush. He gets I've seen him getting throwing lanes and see him tip balls. I mean what started wanted him to do. That's not he said. But for seven years a year he started a week side linebacker. They use him as a rush. They use him as a rusher because he can affect the pocket. You haven't seen him cover? Say that, No, the second half of the year he played as a pass rusher. The first half of the year he plays a week side linebacker. I've seen him cover plenty. He

not just not very that's not his forte. He can rush, he can get after the quarterback. He's at his best when he's going downhill. He's very aggressive, sometimes over aggressive. Like you said, Yeah, I just if I'm going to take a player in the top one hundred, I need a guy that I feel more comfortable staying on the field in any down situation. And with him, I don't feel that I see. To me, he's more of a

nickel player, a sub package guy. I don't know. I just I finding the exact position for him is my biggest struggle with this guy. The Cowboys like the Cowboys creativity with legendary so I mean, I'm sure they get true hear it out. Yeah, um, let's stick at linebacker right here. I got one for you, Clemson's Dorian O'Daniel. There's a guy. Tell me about that guy. That's another guy where you kind of you picked all the guys. Everybody's going, oh, hey, what does he some people of

some people say the film has gotten bad. I never saw a great film on him. No, but he didn't have terrible film either. You know, he's but he's kind of a safety. He's an overhang linebacker. Another guy where where you're gonna play him you kind of have to specialized position for him because he's he's not a true linebacker and he's not a true safety. He's kind of a hybrid in the middle. And you can use those types of guys, sure, but again you have to have

a plan for how you're going to use him. Uh Nickel's safety. I mean, that's why I put him my Yeah, No, I agree with you there. He's because he doesn't have the ideal measurements that you want, right have the ideal speed. He's a little bit of a tweener. And again, you can use those types of guys, but you have to have a specific plan in place for how he's gonna fit your defense. That scares me more than it. Like when you tell me that about a guy, I'm just like, ah, well,

they're not gonna I mean he's basically a box safety. Yeah, that's basically what he is. And I said the last line, I think you don't want him carrying receivers down the field. No, that's that you know. Now you talk about somebody they can't cover. Yeah, Oran O'Daniel can't cover, and he covered. I think he covers like a box safety. One of my one of my favorite names in this draft for sure, though it's just fun to say, rolls off the tongue. Um.

Everybody knows about the NC State defensive line. They got a couple of good guys on there, but one guy I don't remember talking about is defensive tackle Justin Jones. Yep. And it's easy to overlook some of those. Yeah, there's like they're, uh, yeah, they don't have talent anywhere else. All four of their defensive linement are gonna get drafted. Um, yeah, Justin Jones is probably the if you're gonna talk about the four, Cantavius Street, Bradley Chub, B. J Hill, Justin

Jones is probably the least talented of the four. But that's not I mean, that's not a knock against him. It's just those other guys are three really talented guys that are probably drafted in top five rounds. Yeah, Bradley Chubb, top five, BJ Hill to me's a top one hundred pick and I than Cantavious Street, probably in a top five mix, top five round mix. Justin Jones probably more

of a later round guy. But in my notes, get off handwork, uh struggles to disengage or win to the point of attack you can too easily neutralize by interior threats. Yea loves to play the bully role. Um. He can provide depth on an NFL roster as a block eater, so I think he can help. But he's more of a rotation guy, not so much. You're gonna step in expect to be a starter early on. I agree. That sounds like more what they need. In my opinion, I

canna live with that. Yeah, no, you will. What's this, uh the m of this team and drafting your one technique tique? You're yeah, late in the draft, so six seventh round. Yeah, hey you never know. Hey, maybe you get a lucky and find a bo Allen. There you go? How about that like the Eagles? Yeah, sure did, I've actually watched this guy, but I still want you to tell me more about Vanderish. No, well, we need to do a whole segment on him. Yeah, that would be Yeah,

usc wide receiver Deonte Burnett slot player right day. Yeah, and give him credit. He was really productive this year. Um. Sam Darnold said it. As much as we talked about Sam Donald having an off year, He's the only USC quarterback to ever throw for four thousand yards and he did that this year. So not bad. Deonte Burnette was a big part of that. He had almost thirteen hundred yards receiving. He's a smallish guy and he plays small.

I mean he he'll make some Yeah, he'll make some highlight reel catches, you know him do some impressive things. But for the most part, he's a smallest receiver. Uh, he's got some reliability issues, focus issues. But out of the slot, you know, he's your mid round not he might not go top one hundred, but maybe four round slot option. He's used a lot on screens, is what I saw. He can he can break some tackles for

a small guy, which is a little bit surprising. But I think the thing about him, the most important thing is like the slot stuff, he knows how to find space, he knows how to get open that way. But I think that he you know, he doesn't deal with much press coverage too, so I never really saw him having to deal with how to you know, you know, but his size again at five eleven, one seventy, that's going to limit some of the stuff. What he's gonna do. Yeah,

he's the underneath player only. Yeah, got another show after this. We gotta get to Oh that's true. Well, we gotta we want to piece out. I got one more piece out, all right, we'll save it, save it for the next day. That's fine. Yeah, we've got a show coming up here next with Shannon and Nate and uh, Kurt Daniels and those guys. They're coming up next here. Stay tuned on us, So stay tuned for that. Uh for my buddies, Uh, Dane Burgler, David Hellman, Kent Garrison. Thank you guys so

much for joining the Draft show. We'll be back eleven a him next Thursday with more coverage. Make sure you guys keep watching that tape. We'll see you then.