Draft Show: Who's Made Some Money?

We are eighty eight days away from the NFL Draft in Cleveland, Ohio, and we've got plenty to break down that has happened through the first two Senior Bowl practices. One more to go later this afternoon on this Thursday. But we're gonna break it down with Dane Brugler, who is down in Mobile holding on to that hotel WiFi at the moment, and he's doing his best to bring us some on the ground coverage of the Senior Bowl this year. Kevin Turner as always up here in the Metroplex.

Then Bucky Brooks is at the NFL Network headquarters out in California and he has been covering the Senior Bowl all week as well, so, man, we've got a great crew to break this all down. Katie's gonna run point in terms of the Cowboys. Then we've got the NFL overall look and then the up close and personal look

from Bucky Brooks and Dame Brugler and Dame. When you talk about this Senior Bowl, I'm sure it's a lot different this year, not only because it's not at lad People Stadium and it's on the campus of South Alabama, but what has it been like this year compared to others due to COVID nineteen and the fact that you've gotten two practices in already. Yeah, Hancock Whitney stadiums beautiful, So start with that. It's a beautiful new stadium right

there on South Alabama's campus. You know, part of me, the nostalgic part missus lad peebles a little bit, But give credit to Jim Naggie and his staff or what they've done. Not sure if this was going to happen, but here we are, where we're going in. Today's the final practice on Thursday, and it's it's been a success. So it's it's definitely been different in terms of the access, in terms of how you know, the logistics of how

everything's working. But you know what, I'll take it. You know, we're watching football live on the field, and that's been tremendously tremendous advantage, especially for some of these players who didn't play this week or it didn't play this year in twenty twenty, and so to see them out there performing at a high level, some of these players have made money. That's awesome to hear. And Bucky, I know you've been keeping a close eye on a lot of

those players via the remote. I mean, I'm sure you your remote set up is better than anybody else's in the country coming from the NFL network. But what have you seen this week that's kind of stuck out to you. That's different even from a scouting perspective, because, like Dane said, it's been limited, but they've still been able to get there and get it done. Yeah, it's a huge surprise

that they've been able to pull this off. I think the big thing for me has been seeing how different guys have performed based on their level of activity over the course of the fall. We've had guys who have played an entire season, guys who haven't played at all, Guys who played for a handful of games, and trying to weigh and evaluate what each of those players are

doing given those circumstances has been challenging. And then when you throw in the fact that the combine is not in existence, this is kind of like the last or rough where a lot of people and some of these people never got a chance to start it. And so how do you wait all of those mitigating factors when

coming up with your final evaluation. Those final evaluations are gonna be crazy this year, I think whenever it comes to no combine, a lot of pro days in the Senior Bowl is really what you're going to go by. And the Cowboys are having to do the same exact thing, Katie, and with their being a lot of the storylines in the highlight real plays of course going to go around the offense whenever you look at the highlight reels later

in the week from the Senior Bowl. But the defenses have really had a leg up through the first two days of practices, which is not to be a surprise by any means, But what do you feel like that has done for you when you look at the defensive prospects that are down in Mobile right now, anybody that sticks out to you the fact that the defenses have

kind of taken that upper hand. Yeah, you know. I mean the first thing I always think about with the Senior Bowl is like not to freak out about it, you know, because you get all these like one on one refs and things like that. Not to freak out about it. Mutrolink it for something that confirms maybe what you've seen on tape. Well. But one thing that I've really I really enjoyed I was, you know, following this

through multiple mediums. I was watching Bucky's coverage on the NFL Network and they had Matt Rule on and Matt Rules talking about how they politicked to get to the Senior Bowl because they wanted to meet players knowing that there's not gonna be a formal combine. And I couldn't help but think, man, that is such an advantage for them picking eight two picks ahead of the Cowboy is you know, it'd be great if the Cowboys had a

lot of people there. I know they not sending a lot of coaches and things that that, but scouts are going to be there. Um, But like that is like this is a big opportunity and a big chance but in terms of like players that have really stood out. If you are a team like the Cowboys who needs a lot of defense, it's it's really hard to ignore all the incredible offensive talent we've seen. Um, but you know the guys that have attracted my eye a little bit,

Like you're looking for safety? Uh, you know what can can Richie Grant do for you? Are you interested in a natural dean? And how healthy is he even though he's that strong safety type, a little different, you know? And and Aaron Robinson the cornerback, I think as a guy kind of finding out, you know, Kenny play outside, you know, that's that's the whole thing I mean with him,

I think you've got a really good player. Um, I don't have him been kind of my group of first round guys, but you start talking about day two now, I think Aaron Robinson's a guy who might be in the mix for the Cowboys that picked forty four. And uh, he's someone that I'm really going to be watching. I have been watching, and we'll be watching as we move forward to Saturday. Bucky, in that conversation with Matt Rule yesterday, did you really get that it was an individual advantage?

To the Carolina Panthers. Of course, he's in his second year as the head coach. But what did you get from Matt Rule? I mean, the intensity of his practices were incredible, and I've known Matt for my time in Waco, But I mean you continue that to the Senior Bowl. It looks like they haven't skipped a rep. No, they haven't skipped a beat. I think this is really important in a huge advantage for the Carolina Panthers and a

couple of different things. One, they get a chance to be around all these guys and so for a week, they get to be around not only their own team, but the other team. And so to build those relationships, especially when you're not going to have the face to face interactions at the combine and maybe even private workhouts, that's a huge advantage. Secondly, they're just coming from the college game, and so Matt talked about they've recruited a lot of these players, so they already have built in

some of those relationships. And as you begin to think about guys who have played guys who haven't played, you're more likely to lean to those that you know, those that you've kind of seen along the way. I think for Matt Ruling, the Panthers they have a huge advantage over a lot of teams in the league because their college experience and what they're being able to experience down in Mobile. One of the big things he did talk about in that conversation was the fact that you want

each rep to put good tape out there. He wanted to make sure that each of these players know that this is that special opportunity for not only the coaches, but for the prospects as well. Dane, who has put some good tape out there on the defensive side of the football. I know, I was really impressed by the ad rushers yesterday and one on ones. I thought they

were good for the second straight year. After going last year and really being impressed by a couple of those guys, I thought they backed that up and continued to have some success on the outside. Yeah, and the real quickly to back up what Bucky just said, I think he's absolutely right about the Panthers having an advantage here because not only are they going to know who's going to fit for them, they're gonna understand pretty clearly who's not going to be a fit for them and be able

to eliminate guys based off how it things go. And look, all teams are gonna have access down here. They've got a you know, plexiglass set up down um, you know, in a in an interview kind of station for all the teams at night to go through and talk to these guys. But the opportunity that Dolphins and Panthers have is profound, so especially this year. But in terms of the defensive guys, you know, I think that you know, Katie mentioned Richie Grant. I think he's definitely flashed. You

see the play speed. You see a guy that trust when he sees, he goes and he makes plays on the ball. Even when he gives up a completion, he's still ball searching and trying to rip the ball out and sometimes he's been able to uh the USC defensive tackle. It's been tough for blockers to contain him. And then both Notre Dame defensive lineman I've really stood out day a goodness, did jay I butchered that? But his length, I tell you is really he's showing why length matters,

rushing from inside, rushing from outside. Blocker's having a tough time with him. And then Dalen Hayes. You're seeing his athleticism off the edge. And one thing that's really stood out with Hayes is when he's come off the field from a rep, he's immediately running over to a coach and I'm watching this from the stands from twenty feet away. He's having dialogue with this coach, going through the technique

that he's using and just having that interaction. And this is a player that understands the value of this week and the opportunity that he has. He's not treating it like just another practice. He's treating this like a job interview. And so far, so good for Dalen Hayes. Hayes had a strip sack of Phelipe Franks in the one on ones area. Wasn't even one on ones. It was in the middle of I think team drill. He came up

and had a strip sack from behind. I mean, he was impressive yesterday, Katie'd you see anybody on the defensive side of the football that really stuck out to you? I mean, of course, Cowboys are very interested in looking at defensive talent while they're in mobile. I was looking yesterday, and I mean they've taken a look into the majority of those guys that are down there at the moment, Hey, yeah, you know, I mean I look, defensive line is also an area that this team is going to need to

look at, whether it's inside or whether it is rushing. Um. You know, I thought Basham had a good day on Day one from from But but you know, another another guy who I think I really liked his twenty nineteen tape and his twenty twenty tape. To me, I kind of would view it is maybe a little bit of a regression for probably a multitude of reasons. But I

thought Marvin Wilson's looked okay in what I've seen. Obviously, I haven't seen every rep that that's been down there, as I'm not there, but like Marvin Wilson to me, is a guy who I still think has that potential to sneak into Day two and kind of be a guy who could play the one for you, play the three if you need him to, and kind of do a little bit of both at the defensive tackle position.

Is you know, for me, I'm not comfortable with just saying Okay, Tristan Hill and Neville Gallimore go get it. You know, I do think they're gonna have to add a defensive tackle, and will they want to invest in that, you know position in the first three year ounds. I don't know if they would do that. I don't know how much, say dan Quinn is gonna gonna have and

how they draft. You know, I can't help but think about some of these It's amazing when you watch these one on one drills when we're talking about throwing the ball through the air, and I can't help but feel bad for some of these defensive backs and one on one situations. But some of these shifty guys who are getting open, and I'm just like, Okay, I'm not gonna knock this cornerback too bad, because you know what, covering am Maari Rodgers is a real hard thing to do, right,

So I'm not gonna kill that defensive back. But I felt really bad for the Florida state safety Hampson nasual Deed, who's got to take part in these drills. And one he's not one hundred percent, it doesn't appear. And two he should never ever in this world, ever be asked to cover you know, a faster guy, you know, and you know he burned a couple of times in one on one drills, I'm like, oh, I kind of feel bad for my guy Hompsa there, because you know, in a real game, no coach is gonna put him in

that position. But here he's going out there and he's competing and doing the rep and sometimes it's maybe not working out as well as you like. But it's just just little things like that. I try not to over I try have to overhype it. You take what you you see, you just kind of add it to the context of the full thing. And I learned that from Dane. Dane taught me that you always add what you see to the full context of the tape. Study, Bucky, did

you see some of that same stuff yesterday? Whenever it came to maybe the secondary I thought, when I was looking at Marvin Wilson, I was pretty under und I guess impressed. I wasn't very impressed with Marvin Wilson. Yeah, underwell, and that's the word I was looking for. But I was not very impressed with with Marvin Wilson whenever it came to his tape. And like Katie said, I haven't

seen every rep either. I mean we haven't been able to see every rep like you guys have no So the funny thing about Marvin Wilson is I actually liked his tape from two seasons ago. Like I think he was a big time high school recruit. He comes in, he's powerful, he does a really good job of using

his power to his advantage. He's not necessarily a twitch athlete on the inside, and so the thing about defensive tackles, and I think in today's game, it's hard to really put a high grade on an interior player if they can't really rush the passer consistently. And when I look at his game, he can do that. I do wander down inimobile how much the knee is affecting him, because he's not necessarily the same explosive, dominant player that we've seen at times, and so I would like to see

more of that. I think Levi Anserrique, I think the first day he was really impressive in the fact that he hadn't played all fall. He goes out there, he has the technique. Now he missed his day two, and so you just kind of wanted is that him trying to get his sea legs back? Is he going to do anything else but for me the snap to pop the ability to play with his hands. I think his

hand skills are very, very impressive. I kind of wrote in my nose like he's kind of missed Yagi and turns of the way he waxes on and waxes off to get to the quarterback. He's really intriguing in the

back end. You know, it's really hard because I'm looking at some of the small school standouts right Like, so Robert Rochelle from Central Arkansas to me as a natural player, super fast athlete, and the thing that I kind of want to see is not necessarily like how fast and how explosive he is, but how far away is he from being a guy that can be a frontline player, Like looking at his raw ability, how much seasoning would he need before he can get out there and do

some things. But he's really explosive, and the fact that he gets his hands on the ball when you watch him at Central Arkansas, I think it makes him a very intriguing an option, particularly if you're the Cowboys and we know that they need more corners, particularly with all those guys that could be impending free agents. With Robert Rochelle, and you can see that speed right away, you don't have to squint, that's for sure. And even when he full steps or he's out of position, he he's able

to recover really quickly. And that's uh, that's pretty evident. And you know, going back to the Marvin Wilson conversation, it's you know, I think the it did not start as a great week for him at weigh ends when he came in at three twenty. Uh. You know, I think he's a player based off that twenty nineteen film where he was more in the three or five range.

That's the player we want to see because he flashes power, he flashes you know, foot quickness, but he needs to put it all together and play just with more consistency than what we saw on the twenty twenty film. So, uh, it's been an up and down week for him. Uh. Defensive tackles, it's just not a great group down here, like we've talked about. So teams are searching for those defensive tackles. They want one of these defensive tackles to emerge.

Maybe it'll happen on day three here this afternoon. But I agree with Bucky uh Levi onz workI has been just uh, you know, the first day he was terrific. He's he's showing why he has a chance to go in the first round. Uh. You know, he played out a position at that nose tow spot and that Washington Odd front and you know, get him here where he can just kind of let loose and you know, get those one on one matchups. You see the violence, you see the hand strength, the quickness that he plays with.

He's a fun player, Ansoique. Whenever it came to Day one, I mean I was impressed, much like Bucky was. And then he wasn't on the field yesterday, and you just mentioned kind of the special player that he could potentially be as a twenty twenty opt out. I'm interested in him in the second round if I'm Dallas, I really am.

I think in this at forty four, if he makes it that far, I mean, I think he's probably the best chance to maybe separate himself a little bit whenever it comes to this defensive tackle class, because like you said, it's not a great group and mobile that's not really a great group overall when you look at this twenty twenty one class. But Dane, have you heard anything on his availability? Buck He said he missed yesterday, But you have you heard anything. Just being in Mobile, I mean,

he's probably out for the week. I would guess. I'd don't know that, but I would guess during Tuesday practice, the first practice, he actually he left with one of the trainers real quick and then came back, so I wasn't sure what was going on. And then he decided that, you know, just to be safe, probably shut it down, which you know, it's it's tough when you opt out of a season like that. You're putting all your eggs in one basket in the pre drift process, and all

of a sudden, now we don't have a combine. So okay, now it comes down to the Senior Bowl and you've got one practice, which is not ideal. But you know, he puts some good stuff on film, so it's and like I said, it's gonna be interesting this year with the defensive tackle group that we have. You know, are these guys are gonna get pushed up a little bit just because teams still need into your defensive line help. So the Christian Barmore's, the own Zeriqus, both USC defensive tackles.

These guys are gonna get pushed up maybe five ten picks earlier than they would normally go just because teams are looking for those defensive tackles this year, Katie, you think the Cowboys would be go for it, Bucky, No, I think Dane is his nail something because I do believe supplying to man, because they're not many those who flash a little bit will be overdrafted or drafted before we expect. And so like a guy like Ozerick, we can say, hey, will he be there for the Cowboys?

He may have a chance that when you're at the bottom of the first round and you don't have another pick until late in the second round, you may have to say, look, I need a defensive tackle. I'm gonna take him now, even though it's not necessarily where the grade equates, because I just don't know if you go to the second go round, if there's going to be a guy that's even comparable to those kinds of talents. Dan, do you have a compet there's a big drop off.

Go for a KT he get go ahead, Caw, You're good. I was just gonna ask Dane real quickly, do you have a comp for Levi on Zerika? Yet? I don't

think I put an exact comp on him. I you know, he's he's tough because I gave him I think he was number forty three overall my top one hundred coming into the week because I wanted to see him this week's wanted to see how he would do, because, like I said, we saw him the two nineteen stuff at Washington where he's playing head up over the center, you know, seeing a lot of doubles, not getting a chance to

really let loose. But he's so active, and I mean he's the prototypical three technique in a lot of ways, you know, not the biggest guy, but so quick, so violent. Just he needs to be a little more leveraged with his attack, but it once he figures that out. I mean that this is what a twitchy big man looks like, his own Zurique. So I think Bucky's right, You're sitting there in the late first round and you really want that interior defensive line help get that juice, and you're

not liking your options in a late second. So it would him not be shocked at all if we're talking about own Zerique at the first round pick. He kind of reminds me, like a on film anyways, of a Justin Mattabeke, at least what he looked like from Texas

A and M last year. I see a lot of them two together in a couple different spots, Katie, whenever you look at defensive tackle, I know the cow Boys are absolutely interested in and do you think they would be willing to be one of those teams that stretches on a guy in the second round like that? Yeah, I mean I think they'll do. You know, I hope they have the philosophy have taken the best player. But you know, looking at their history, they've popped some guys

in the third round and Neville Gallamore and MALIEK. Collins in recent history, they've been a team that definitely roadmaps the draft. You know, they they really pay attention to depth of the draft, and they kind of gauge it that way, like I have I need to get a guy here. That means I'm gonna have to go secondary here. They do those types of things, and I think that's what it might come down to. I mean, you know,

we go back to whole. I think when you do have a regime in place, even though it's changed with Mike McCarthy, it's still Will McClay and Stephen Jones primarily picking players you do have a history and something to go off of and kind of how they like to operate, and it really feels like they like to stand in there, make the pick and hopefully that's the best player. I'll say this, and we're talking talking defense, it'd be really hard if you're a Cowboys scouting you're out there at

the Senior Bowl. Uh, and you know about your injury history and the offensive line though, if you're not seeing some offensive lineman and they're not making your mouth water a little bit as well. So I mean they have to add a defensive tackle or two, whether it's through draft, free agency, they have to do that. Um, you know, if if anso Rique is there at forty four, maybe that's your guy. Uh. Well, we're kind of talking about the the drop off like and not necessarily a really

defensive tackle. It can be defensive end as well. And they're gonna be another defensive end as well. Like you start talking about, Okay, well I want one of these Pittsburgh guys to step up, Like is Rashad Weaver or Patrick Jones going to kind of separate themselves? And then if we're just going like on a board. Lonzo Rique is a way a better player than uh, you know, than than a Weaver or a better player than Patrick Jones. And those are the kind of guys who I want

to see. Those guys who you may have, you know, round four, round three, round four type of grade on maybe you're on fives, have a grade on how big of an impact can they go have this week to bault themselves into the conversation on day two and you're looking for that, So like all eyes on Rashad Weaver, go make some plays, all eyes on Patrick Jones, who now I love his build and I love some of his tape and then some of it I'm very wishy

wash you on. So those are the types of guys who you really want to really have their stock rise. Let game stop this week. You had to throw the game stop in there. Huh. I like that. That was fantastic throwing in the game stop reference. That's good. I want to talk about Patrick Jones at some point and maybe even Ellison Smith out of Northern Iowa. I think both of those guys as ed dreshers made some money

this week. I liked with Patrick Jones brought to the Senior Bowl this week, but we'll talk about that coming up here just a little bit, because we have to take our first break. And the reason why we're taking our first break is because we've got Twitter on the twenty. On the other side of it, we've got a ton of great questions surrounding the Senior Bowl. How much of these all school guys improved their draft stock like game stop. We'll talk about that next when we return on the

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We are the official tractor provider of your Dallas Cowboys. Here it's nineteen o eight. Don't you think we should get electricity and stop using candles to see it night? It's just electricity lights up the room fast. It's more reliable than candles blowing out, and people seem to love it nationwide. Well, candles, dear, did you just run into the wall. I have a new candle. Please, Historically, switching

to new technology is a no brainer. Today it's AT and T five G fast, reliable, secure, and nationwid switch to a T and T five GET. It's not complicated. Five GET requires compatible plant may not be in your area. See at dot com slash five G for you for details. Is the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show. On to the second segment. Here at the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show, we've got Bucky Brooks, Dane Burglar, Kevin Turner, und Kyle Yeomens. It's time now for some Twitter on

the twenty. On the twenty, Chris Beam as always punching those buttons in the back and doing a fantastic job. And I want to spend a split second here to thank everybody who's sending in these questions because they've been great. I mean great questions were not only just this week, but all year long. And then everybody keeping up along the way with the Draft Show. I mean, you guys know what's Senior Bowl week, and so we got a ton of really good Senior Bowl questions to kind of

keep with the theme. Today, we're gonna start off with Jason Pruett and this is a question I had for Dane and Bucky and Katie throughout yesterday's practice. But how far do you think guys like Quinn Mayners, the center out of Wisconsin Whitewater, known for flattening trees and going viral on Instagram and Twitter throughout the off season. He's the center who really had a good first couple of days. And then Duwayne Eskridge, the wide receiver from Western Michigan.

How far have they risen due to their performance so far? In Mobile Dane Brugler, no one has risen more than Quinn Miners, No one. This guy has been dominant this week. It's been amazing. The watch and listen. I'm a mount Union alone. I go out of my way to talk nicely about Wisconsin Whitewater. Okay, the twenty seven Stag Bowl still stings, No, it pains me a little bit, But I tell you what, Quinn Miners, what he's done this

week has been fantastic And it's funny. You watch. You know, he didn't play this year twenty twenty Division three, they did not have a season. But you watch this who has a nineteen film and it's good, but it's not great. It's not like you know, he doesn't necessarily dominate like you would expect at the Division three level. I remember watching Ali Marpette coming out of Hobart, Uh, you know,

sitting down watching this left tackle just dominate. And then he goes to the Senior Bowl, does the same thing with Miners. He you know, he wasn't He wouldn't even be here if Landon Dickerson doesn't have his injury, and so that opens the door from Miners. He comes here and you can tell he's been working his butt off the last year with no season, he's been training. You know, his body looks completely different than it did on tape, and he show he's showing a better understanding of how

to use he used that body. He's playing low, he's playing controlled. The foot quickness is there. You can tell he's a very smart guy with the way he's reacting. But I tell you talking to a scout last night about him, they had six seventh round grades on Miners just based off of his two nineteen film. Now now is the great debate is how much do you elevate a player like this based off of three days of

practice compared to three years of film. Obviously, competition that he's facing this week is like nothing he's ever seen at the Division three level, but still it's it's it's a really fascinating topic. I think it's fair to, you know, talk about him in the top one hundred conversation. Now,

you know, I think he's worked. He's gone from the late rounds to early day three and now teams in the top one hundred looking for a guard center who has the quickness that he does, the intelligence, the nasty that he plays with, they're gonna have Quinn Miners conversation. So it's been really fun to see him and Dwayne s Gridge, who you know, I in my Senior Bowl preview I kind of pegged him as maybe a guy that could be like a Terry McLaurin in terms of

being a riser because he's his max stuff. This year was just great. He looked like, uh, you know, the cornerbacks in that league were just kind of standing still with the way he moves out there, and he hasn't disappointed. His play speed has allowed him to get open with ease. And it's not just his play speed but his ability to be a natural catcher of the the football that allows him to play fast because he can really focus on

the football and be a creator after the catch. So both those guys have been two of the winners so far this week. You know, Dane is funny that you bring up the minors conversation because I think that is one that is fascinating. I know he had worked with Duke manny Weather for the offseason. I think Duke has done a really good job of helping him with the technique.

But in our conversation, we had a chance to talk to him and he talked about the work that he put in and how he came down with a single mindset to being able to dominate and to be able to take the things that he has learned along the way and put him in the practice. And he said that the Miami Dolphins he's on the Dolphins, they have he talked about they have thrown a lot at him to know and learn and to make the checks and

to do all that stuff, and he's embraced it. And as you talk about, whenever d three players shows up at the Senior Bowl, you always want to see that they look like a fish out of water. And the fact that he has been able to dominate elite competition, to me, I think it changes a narrative, even though the tape in the past may have been up and down. To see him physically kind of man handle some of these guys, I think it's certainly it's gonna make him

an intriguing prospect. To Watson, you talked about top one hundred. I think he is right there in that Day three third round conversation because everything that he's put on tape this week has been outstanding. Yeah, it really has been. I mean I'm getting flashes of you know, Ryan Jensen. Wow. Yeah, that's a good comparison. Yeah, and you know Ryan Jensen obviously came up. You know, the Ravens were able to find him, and then he signed a good sized deal

with Tampa. Uh. It's it's been fun because, like you said, he has not looked. He has not looking I mentioned how he got the invite. He's a Landon Dickerson. Uh. You know, you would expect on paper to be a huge drop off from Dickerson, who his first round tape compared to a D three player, but it just it hasn't been a huge drop off, which has been fantastic to see. And uh, you know, now now that the conversation switches to okay, So where where do you where

do you put him on the draft board? And that's that's that's a really fascinating conversation that teams are gonna have to have. So it helps that he's, you know, the work ethic, that he shows the way it not he can just he can talk to talk and walk the walk, which has been been great. And you know for small school guys like you know Dave Moore from Grambling State who has been here h first day he looked like a fish out of water a little bit,

but on day two he made some necessary improvements. Him and Carlos Basham had some really good battles on day two and that's what you want to see from a small school or is that gradual progression? But it wasn't like that with minors. He hit the ground running from

that first snap. One of the first draft scouting lessons I ever learned whenever I took over the hosting of the draft show last year was Katie and he said, if you see a small school guy, he wants he needs to look like a grown man playing against eight year olds. And that's what the tape looks like for miners. And then he comes out and he does the same thing for the Senior Bowl, and the way that he

dominates the Senior Bowl is just impressive as well. But Katie, this is actually go into our second question on Twitter on the twenty and Grady asked what small school guys at the Senior Bowl could interest the Cowboys more. Of course, Dallas being a scouting department in a front office that's very heavy toward the bigger school guys at least for

the most part, with some of those premium picks. But is there anybody out of these guys or anybody at the Senior Bowl that are from the small schools that could potentially interest you? Well, right, I think you know, we've seen the Cowboys well we know, we know offensive line is something they might have to consider. We've talked

a lot about Trey Lance and things like that. Maybe we need to talk about the tackle Dylan Raduns at North Dakota State, you know, for him, My question coming off of watching his take was how well can he handle a speed rush? Now watch this one on one drills, Like, obviously you know the guy's pass rushing you, so like you're ready, you know, But to me, I've seen a little bit of you see the power, the ability to stay balanced, how faster his feed is kind of what

I'm watching for with Dylan Rdons. But that's a guy who could be in the mix and maybe be someone that the Cowboys would consider, you know, whar we're talking day two, maybe maybe a fourth round type of guy. You know him on tape. I have him as a third round grade. So you know, that's a small school

guy that we need to get some love too. And you know, Bucky mentioned you know Robert Rochelle earlier from Central Arkansas, And I think one thing that I was kind of piecing together as you think about Will McClay and how he kind of has looked at defensive backs over the years. One thing that they really love. They loved those spark scores. They love those guys who can test.

And you know, I've had someone text me, you know over the last couple of weeks, Robert Rochelle is gonna be a guy that is gonna you know, if he was invited to combine, would would test really well. And when teams do get his testing numbers, they're gonna be blown away by some of the numbers that he puts up. And I think that's a guy. You know that We'll

have the Cowboys interests no matter what. But I'm glad these all school guys are getting some love and getting some shine because it's always some of the like some of the fun, but also difficult things. When you're watching tape of these guys, as brought us always says, there's a bounce house, you know, back there while they're playing and things like that, and there's ten people in the stands, it could be hard to go okay, Well, how was that gonna stack up when it's time to go block

Nick Bosa. Well, it's probably not gonna go well for anyone who has to block Nick Bosa, But like you really have to try to go okay, how are they going to handle this next level of competition? And to see these small school guys Jalen Moore's another guy. To see those guys do well is very encouraging because it's something that helps you with your evaluation a lot. I'd throw Kay Johnson in there as well. The South Dakota Yeah, wide receiver. He's done a really nice job this week.

He's he's undersized, but he's catching everything his way. His route quickness has been impressive. And this isn't the guy who was a walk on at South Dakota State, not just an FCS guy. He had a walk on, which is really impressive. I know, Bucky, you'll appreciate this, but I got some Dennis Northcut vibes from Kase just you know a slot who's tough, he can work the middle of the field. You know the quickness that he plays with. So he's a good player. He's a really good player,

very productive. I think when you look at his numbers one hundred and thirty nine receptions, twenty five hundred plus yards and twenty five touchdowns, the ability to put the ball into paint, to me is really important. I like to see guys score touchdowns because most guys who score touchdowns at Laura levels, they score touchdowns in the pros. I think the one thing Kat you brought up about Robert Rochelle, here's something that I think we all can learn from when we talk about like a guy who's

a freak athlete. This year more than any of the year, going back to people's high school track times, that is going to matter the fact that he ran ten eight in high school in Louisiana, which has produced some track and field athletes. That helps him because when you don't have the combine in pro days all subjective, the fact that you can pull the page and say he was a ten aide in high school, you can kind of

project out what that looks like. He is a guy that is going to probably be drafted and higher than most of us talk about just because he's a size speed phena and he does have ball skills on tape. Now, I think that's a great point. I think that'll help Dwayne Eskridge as well, who he won the two hundred meters as a junior and then as a senior won one hundred meters and the two hundred meters. I think he was a ten five guy. So uh yeah, So I think that'll that's that's a great point, Bucky, because

that's some of those, uh some of those numbers. You know, we don't know what's going to come from Pro days and all that, but if you ran fast in high school, then you know, I think that kind of sets the stage for the type of athlete you are. That's some Bucky Brook speed out there is what Dwayne Eskridge is putting on film. Yeah, No, not like that, not even close to Bucky brook Speed. That's what we're talking about now.

I'm waiting. I'm waiting for a Burgler to bring out a compy like, Oh, he reminds me a lot of Bucky Brooks back in the day. How about that? But do com let's go DD on Twitter ass thoughts on a wake Forest quarterback Jamie Newman so far and what he could bring as a mid round option at quarterback once again, another opt out and somebody who actually transferred then opted out and never got to play a snap at his various schools. But Bucky, what do you think

about Jamie Newman and what he's brought so far? You know, it's funny. He's a wild card to me. But I think right now the quarterback position, in terms of evaluating it, I have no idea how to do it based on the players that are playing in the league. I'm seeing John Wolford start for the Rams and they're talking about

him competing for a job with Jared Golf. I've seen Taysom Hill go from being a guy that was a runner only at by U Taxi starting games, and so now I'm more than ever you have to use imagination. I think for Jamie Newman. Look, he's a talented doing thread playmaker. He's more of an athlete than a passer. You go back and look at him at wake for us, when he runs the football, he's rugging and all that. But he's a hit or miss passer, and so what do you do with that? And so I see him

as a developmental prospect. I think the thing that he's done best down at the Senior Bowl is when they get him on the move, particularly when he's rolling to his right. He can do the movement stuff. But I think he is someone that a coach has to take a personal interest in a less take him, less develop him. Let's see who we can get as a guy that comes in as a later round prospect, someone that we can stash on the practice squad and maybe down the

line he can pop and do something for us. Then one thing I'll say about Newman is I think you expected a little bit of a rush factor with him this week, just because he you know, he's been throwing obviously, but he didn't play this year as an opt out. But to his credit, he has looked pretty smooth. You know, he has looked as consistent, if not more so than a Kellen Mond in terms of throwing the football down

the field. So that's a good thing for him. The biggest thing for Jamie Newman this week is probably going to be behind the scenes and the interviews. Um. Just you know, their teams are going to grill them and say, Okay, well, you know you you you left your teammates at Wake Forest for what you thought was a better opportunity than you left that opportunity without even suiting. You know, they're gonna grow them on some of his decisions, and you know,

it's it's he has to be ready for that. I'm sure he's prepared for those, uh, those questions, but he has to come up with the answers that are really going to satisfy teams for why he made the decisions that he did. I hate quarterbacks, um, and just swhere I'm at. That's the quote of the day. It's just I hate quarterbacks. I'm gonna make T shirts quarterback. I don't enjoy scouting them anymore. It's not fun to be anymore. Uh, quarterbacks are difficult, man, Um. And you know what, Dak

might have been the one that ruined that for me. Uh, it's like, oh why didn't I have him graded higher? Why did I not have Dak stuck granted higher? Maybe it's that I hate quarterback action, Katie. I think it's a different it's a different times it's evolved, and it's involved right in front of our eyes, because I mean, you talk about Dak, I mean Dak ad Mississippi State, like we talked about like he was a runner. He

was really a phenomen running the ball. He was tough, there was that tebow stuff that people had talked about, and you liked him, but who knew that he would be what he's become as an NFL player. And as the NFL has changed, I think our eyes kind of have to change in terms of what what could they be? What if? And what if you get someone that likes him, they're willing to revamp their offense to allow them to play. That didn't used to be the case, which makes it

even more difficult because you just don't know. I think one of those other guys that go for Katie, I'm sorry, col it's all you, but not you, buddy. I was no, You're good. I was just gonna say one of those

guys that's gonna make you hate quarterbacks more. I think it's Mac Jones who's actually down in Mobile at the moment, because I don't I don't know what to think about Mac Jones because I was of the thought process kind of like a lot of the nation was, is that he was a backup quarterback going in to the twenty twenty season, and then he comes out, he has a terrible for three weeks of the year, then he tears it up the rest of the way and wins a

national championship, has a Joe Burrow like rise, even though I don't necessarily want to compare it to Joe Burrow, but I mean it was comparable. It really was the season that he had. And now he comes to Senior Bowl and he just shows out and he's the best quarterback, head and shoulders above everybody else. Bucky, tell me why Mac Jones has gotten into the conversation at the top ten pick for me, because I've really liked what I've seen.

I love the leadership, the build. I mean, there's a lot of guys and MG asked me that too, well. MG asked it on Twitter. He said, has Mac Jones already done enough to get in the top ten quarter conversation at quarterback. No, I don't think. I don't think he's in the top ten conversation. I think people are going to talk themselves into thinking he's a first round pick. I think the tough thing is when you're looking at quarterbacks, like the guys that are ahead of him, the Trey

Lances to Justin Fields, to Zach Wilsons, Trevor Lawrence. I believe you could take those guys and drop them anywhere and their talent would show up. I don't feel the same way about Mac Jones. I know he's playing in a perfect environment. Everything is right around and right play caller. I think because the NFL game has changed, it's hard to play with kind of like that traditional guy that doesn't move around at all. So I like what he

does in terms of processing. I like the way that he can kind of finesse the ball in time and touch and anticipation. But the big question mark to me is what is he going to be like when everything isn't right around him? Can you win with that quarterback? And it just makes it hard. I know he's probably

gonna go into first round. I just would have a tough time if it's my team saying okay, I'm going to take Mac Jones and I know he can't make it right when I'm wrong, And then it might gonna be Sean McVay mad at Jerry Goff all over again, because it's kind of like this same thing. Sean McVay is mad because Jerry Goff can't make it right with his athleticism. Is someone gonna end up being frustrated with Mac Jones because he also can't make it writ in

that regard. Yeah, Bucky's right, and it's so much about his fit. I mean, think about Mac Jones in that Chargers offense. You know you see Justin Herbert moving around and using his arm talent. I mean, Mac Jones can't do anything close to what Justin Herbert did this past year as a rookie. But maybe if you dropped him into that Saints offense, you know, it'll look a lot different with what Mac Jones is asked to do. So, yeah, the fit is going to be huge. And something about

this offseason, this might be this. I know this sounds hyperbolic, but this might be the craziest off season when it comes to quarterback movement. You know, we've got to Shaun Watson Matthew Stafford is Jared Goff on his way out. I mean, there's so much quarterback turmoil from team the team. I mean there could be you know, twenty teams that are looking at their quarterback situation, and you know, are are looking at all their different options both in the

draft and then throughout the league. So it's going to be an exercise of musical chairs. You know who's going to be left without that chair and who might feel maybe compelled to take a mac Jones a little bit earlier than maybe they normally would. Yeah, two minutes before our show started, it was reported an official Deshaun Watson is like, yeah, I'm asking for a trade. So like the hiring of Culley is not even gonna like, that's not gonna help keep him there. So maybe he like

this is you're you're right. I do love quarterback movement as much as I hate quarterbacks. I love quarterback chaos. I like that. Matt Jones for me, I mean, like to me, I view him as like, I mean, in you're right, Dane fit Matters, can you develop him? Can you are you asking him to come in and start right away? I don't. I don't think I'm ready for that. I don't think I'm gonna say he did what he did.

I want you want to give him credit. He didn't make a play in the team drills where he's rolling to his right and I forgot who was rushed him and I was trying to get to come in and sack him and they couldn't. He's rolling to his right. Makes it throw on the run. But what was also evident when he was rolling to his right is how slow he is, which you know, it's not an insult coming for me, um, you know it's not. That's not

an insult. It's just you know, it was like, okay, yeah, he was lumbering to move five yards to his right, throw right on the money, beat the defender. It was a great it was a great play. I it's just not and maybe I maybe it's the whole having excellent weapons at Alabama, but I just I can't think about mac Jones in a first round. I just can't do it, Katie.

Was it the touchdown pass that you're talking about whenever he had to roll out and it was in that end of the game, that end of game drills like fourth and four from or fourth and goal from the four was Jabril Cox on his backside coming after him and he was closing in pretty quickly. And Jabrill Cox, I mean, I like him a lot as a linebacker, but he was barreling down and mac Jones had had to get that ball out quickly. He did complete it actually to an LS who wide receiver. It was Racy

McMath was. Yeah, it was the wide receiver that caught that touchdown pass. But it was a good play. But you're right, I mean it showed how slow he was and how much of a lack of mobility that he has the show compared to maybe a guy like a Joe Burrow. That a lot of people are at least throwing those two names in the pot because of the stats of their final season at the collegiate level. But it's not the same type of player, it really isn't.

All right, that's gonna do it for Twitter on the twenty Fantastic Questions and keep them coming next Tuesday at ten am when we come back, we'll continue to look at the offensive side of the football. Are there any talents on that offensive side down in Mobile that could be interested And who's the biggest riser and the largest decline from mobile so far we talk about it. On the other side of the break. You're listening to the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show. We're back in a

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show today. I feel like I could talk with you guys for like another two hours about the Senior Bowl. I mean, I don't know what you guys have going on. I mean, I'm not doing anything but watching the Senior Bowl. Oh okay, I guess that's fine. Final Senior Bowl practice today. You can catch it on ESP and you and then of course here Bucky Brooks on the NFL Network tonight, and then the Senior Bowl coming up on Saturday one thirty Central time, two thirty Eastern for all those Cowboys

and draft fans on the East Coast. Plenty to talk about here over today and Saturday, real quickly before we get to biggest risers and largest declines. Anybody stick out on the offensive side of the football. We've talked about the offensive line, but I want to hear some skills positions, some running backs, some wide receivers. I know Kadarius Tony probably the most talented player on paper, but he's kind of been banged up throughout the week with a bit

of a rib injury. He was kind of hobbled on an ankle a little bit, and so he hasn't necessarily shown out. But anybody that's stuck out to you so far this week, Bucky, that's caught your eye. Okay. I know you guys have coined the phrase like pet cat, right. The pet cat for me is Dmitric Felton from UCLA and watching how the game is shifting where people want these wingbacks on the perimeter. We've seen Deebo, Samuel Brandon, Aiyuk and those guys kind of make their way in

San Francisco. Felton, to me, is really intriguing the fact that he's been the last two years in the backfield running the ball, catching the ball out of the backfield. Then he comes out and lines out wide the first del practice and gets open. You see the speed and quickness. I just believe there's so many people that are looking at these hybrid players, particularly after watching the Kansas City Chiefs. I think he's a guy that has certainly helped himself

with his performance this week. It's funny, he's like the opposite Antonio Gibson, you know, last year coming out of Memphis and from receiver to running back at the Senior Bowl. Felton going from running back to receiver, which is just you know, it fits his skill set. I've been really impressed with him as well, soft hands, he looks good out there. So yeah, I think Demitric Felton for a team looking for that Niheen Hines type of players, that's

that's uh. Felton Felton can fill that role. I don't know what it is. It might be the It might be the UCLA Dome because I remember last year when I first met Dane and Bucky, they were talking about Joshua Kelly after Senior Bowl last year because of the kind of upstart that he had, and I mean even Bucky was talking about him being a pet cat last year. So it must be the UCLA running backs, Dan, anybody that sticks out from a skills position. Uh. Amari Rodgers

has been awesome, which I think we expected. Uh. You know, I watched the clumpson tape. You know what Amari Rodgers is, um. You know, his place strength is fantastic. U. He's been very good catching the ball, putting it away. Us been tough for corners to stick with him. Josh Palmer from Tennessee, I think, you know, once he got out of the shadow of Knoxville and the quarterback situation they had going on, Josh Palmer has been able to show out here a

little bit big. He's got good speed, better route runner than I think what we saw at Tennessee. And you know, I all got to do a stroll on the tape of him. VERSU Alabama see him go against Curtan to know he's got talent, and I think he's been able to show it here today. So I think Josh Palmer has certainly helped himself a couple of these sec receivers with uh, you know, obviously Kedarius Tony even though he's he's had he's had the drops, but uh, you know

it's good luck trying to cover him. And then uh, you know Shy Smith. He looked really good on Day one, got banged up a little bit yesterday day two. So the sec receivers have really stood out, Katie, Yeah, I'll add on to that. I mean, look, Amari Rodgers to me has been the best, the best wide receiver here. Um and Knarius Tony, who I love and have a first round grade on those drops yesterday, you know, not a full evaluation on those drops, but just something to

jot down and add to the notepad. You know, But I'm already Rodgers is he is the most He's one of my favorite players in the draft. I know Dan's been on him all along, but you know, settling again a couple of weeks ago and watching his tape and all of his tape and going holy cow that is. That's a lot of fun. Um. You know another name I thought there is And if you know me, I'm a guy who is all about the separator. Smaller guys make it easy on the quarterbacks. Okay, try not to

have a defensive back all over you. But one guy who has really impressed me, and I haven't seen much of his tape as Frank Darby of Arizona State. Um, I've liked him a little bit of wide receiver as well, and I still need gotting a full evaluation on him as we're going forward. But that's one of those names. Another fun thing about the Singer Bowl for me is like,

oh there's a name right there. Okay, all right, let's go and look at that tape a little further and see what else we can find out about the guy. And you know, we talked about Eskridge earlier, Dwayne Eskridge from We Again. He's gonna be a broken record by the time, especially if we let Kavanall back on these podcasts,

because he's gonna love him too, I would imagine. But like the separator, the deceleration, you know, along with the acceleration, like those things are just amazing when you can get that separation and make it easy on the quarterbacks, because as I told you in the last segment, I hate quarterbacks. But if we can make it easy on him, that's good. Little Maury Rodgers, Oh my god, that guy's a bit.

I've also had some people ask me about Marquez, Stevenson, Dane really quickly thirty seconds synopsis on what you've seen from Stevenson. The wide receiver out of Houston. Pure speed, that's what he offers. Doesn't have the best body type. He's about one hundred and eighty pounds, but he can fly. You know, good luck trying to stick with him vertically. And if he adds maybe a few more branches to that route tree h he's going to see more playing

time in the NFL. How would you compare him to two two at Well Louisville, Yeah, two two he's he's he's much more under sized. I think I'm really eager to see what he weighs in at. He looks like he might be more like one seventy one seventy five. I don't know. Um. I want to see two two become a more polished receiver underneath and you know, create those those after the catch opportunities. He can fly when

he's got a runway. But I want to see a little bit more make you miss and and things like that. But he's with that speed, you know, the NFL is going to take a lot of notice, that's for sure. That would be the name of Dame Brugler's rap album or maybe rap song as he could fly if he had a runway. I don't know why that just stuck out to me as a really fun line. All Right, Biggest Riser, I like it. I think we need to

make that too. T shirts and rap albums. On this edition of the Draft Show Biggest Risers this week from Mobile, Dane will start with you really quickly, who has made the most money this week? Well, there's no doubt it's it's Quinn miners Um, but we already talked about him, so I'll try to pick someone else. What about Jontay Smith East Carolina Tackle? He's been really, really impressive And it started with the wayns O were thirty five inch arms,

the longest of any offensive lineman here. Wow. And I actually tweeted out before the Senior Bowl h some some clips of him working out and making you know, forty two inch box jumps and so you see the athleticism and it's translated. I really wanted to see how could he hold up in space with his anchor and you know, could he match power for power? And he's done a nice job tying up rushers and not looking out of place.

They've tried to make guard. I think he's he's done okay at guard, but I think he's much better at tackle. Jontay Smith. When you've got the foundational traits of the quickness and the length and what he's done this week, he's definitely going to be a riser. Bucky. That is a good one. That is a going. Now, that's a going. He's one of the guys that I've talked about. I'll talk about Michael Carter. We talked about him off air. Michael Carter to me, I think has been better. He's

been better than expected. Having watched him all year at North Carolina, you just kind of wonder how good is he? How much of it is a byproduct of the offense to feel long ago runs. But look, he's been tough and physical running the ball. He catches the ball, I think a lot better than people give him credit for it. He reminds me a little bit of claud with so Lar in terms of his timing in the screen game. He has a chance to be a really good player.

I'm not saying that he's on the same level as his teammate Javonte Williams, but he is a really good player in a very crowded running back class. Yeah, I think for me, for Riser, I'm gonna throw Richie Grant out there in the safety from Central Florida, who we talked about earlier. But you know, his ball skills will jump out and this environment of practices and things like that, you're gonna see those plays and go WHOA. You know, you're gonna be able to see a speed, see that

he can cover and things like that. I mean, it's a draft where we're kind of looking for a safety to break out too. Who can gonna be that safety that can kind of get in the mix. And everyone kind of likes Maury from TCU, Jeff likes the other safety from tcusing you Richie Grant is a guy. I feel like we're getting a pretty good consensus on a lot of people, and I know I'm included. After watching his tape and seeing what he's done a part the

senior bal. I think Richie Grant is a name that's going to continue to climb and kind of get in the mix to be that top safety in the class. All right, finally, great Richie Grant might be the second safety drafted after More. Wow, that's pretty I mean, I don't necessarily disagree. I think the safety class is pretty thin this year, and I think he's one of the guys up at the top. Now, final thing before we get wrapped up here on the show Bucky, and we'll

start with Bucky. But who do you guys think needs to show more Thursday and then of course and when the game actually happens on Saturday. I think the big receivers need to show up. So Nico Collins and Safet. We haven't seen those guys, and I know like the game is trending where big guys dominate. I just need to see them show up. I haven't seen enough wild players. We've talked about all these other receivers and we've yet to mention them. I think I need to see Nico

Collins and say Sharat show up. Dan. I would look for one of these quarterbacks to really kind of take it over. I mean, last year we saw Justin Herbert from start to finish really be the guy. This year, I don't know that we have a player that's kind of shown out as the top quarterback clearly, you know, I think Mac Jones is that guy. But be great to see one of these quarterbacks really step up and say, Okay, this is my opportunity and I'm gonna I'm gonna take

it run with it. And you know, this is why you should pay attention to me. Yeah, I had on my on my followers or guess you're who need to step up a sage sharatt the buck you said. But also I'm a fan of the you know, the freakish guys in terms of like their length at the offensive tackle. But my guy from Northern Iowa, Spencer Brown, has gotten

to look better. Yeah, just kind of getting run over a little bit, not playing with power and quite frankly, he's got a ben more and I know he's six to seven, but he's a guy who's got some projectability and has some upside. But he hasn't looked good in the first two days in my opinion from the reps i've seen. And that's a guy i'd like to see kind of get it together and get back in the

mix for some ot depth in the draft. I expect him more out of him this week, and you're right, I don't think the tape has really lived up to it. And then Bucky, to your point, you look at some of the bigger receivers that have come through Mobile and talking about physical big receivers, I mean, Chase Claypool separated himself last year and look what he had of a rookie season with Pittsburgh. So I mean it can happen.

It just hasn't happened yet with the guys like Sage Tarat out of wake Forest and some of these other bigger receivers that made the trip to Mobile. But we'll be back to break it all down for you on Tuesday. Still plenty to come from Mobile. Be sure to tune in to Bucky Brooks on the NFL Network, keep up with Dame Brugler on the app let it Katie will

be back next Thursday. We'll be back next Tuesday on the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show ten am Central Time, and we will break it down with Brian brought us Bucky Brooks and David Hellman. But Fort Dane Burglar, Bucky Brooks and Kevin Turner and Chris Beam in the backup Kyle Yeoman saying so long thanks for joining us here on the Draft Show. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.