Draft Show: Looking Back To Look Ahead

I don't want to speak for everyone at this table, but if ever there was a year I thought the Draft Show might start later than usual, I thought it might be this one. But it is not the case. There are two seasons. There's football season and there's Draft season, and half season is underway. Welcome everyone to the Draft Show, presented by Miller Lite, the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys. Guys, good to see you. It seems that one thing that we're really good at is this drafting thing. Yeah, so

maybe that's the consistent here. We know that part now we got Maybe maybe that other side needs to work on their game a little bit more. So I'm excuse me, I'm rude. I just if you listen to the Draft Show, I just I think of you as like a long time friend. I assume you know all of these voices. Just in case you're new here. I'm David Hellman. I will be quarterbacking this thing in twenty twenty two. That was Brian brought us a long time NFL personnel guys,

super Bowl winning scout. You know, back in the day, with your height, we wouldn't have let you quarterback at no. Thank God for Kyler Murrah. Thank God changed the game. That is. Kyle Yeoman's coming on for your third, third year, third trip through the draft process. And he's quiet right now. But Jeffrey Cavanaugh's with us as well, long time radio

draft all around fun guy. What's up, Jeffrey? Just pondering, just thinking about who we're picking, just trying to figure just all right, you're just cut to the chase right now. I've adopted a new stance for broadcast. Yeah, that's what they tell I learned it from Michael Irvin and Kurt Warner. They tell you as much of the table as you can. You gotta like domineering, like Eisen sitting there just doing this.

But then on the other side of the room, those dudes are spread out, So I feel like I'm I have a presence. There's a bit of tongue in cheek in that sometimes because that that is, like Dave said, that's what we're coached to do. On the television side. I've got a stance kind of like this where it's like like one arms kind of bench straight out this way. But there are other guys that will do the big somewhere somewhere, Jury, Madeline, I'm right now. I am Jordan Davis. Yeah,

I am taking up as much space as possible. Like you're looking hard to block right now. You are looking hard to block. Get big? Well you get Do you have a name? You got a name? Just don't even think about it? What do you mean? Just have a pick twenty four? You got a name? Tyler Linderball Tyler. All right, sweet, that's and I'm glad we're on the same page. Already done. I love picked. This time of year is always fun for me because like we don't

know what we don't know. And and as we go, if you're new to this, you know you're you're gonna narrow it down. You're we're gonna get a much better idea of what we're all thinking about. But Tyler Linderbaum seems to be the early name, like two years ago. Oddly enough, it was Neville Gallimore was like one of the first guys we were talking about. We got on Layton vander esh really really quickly. I'm interested to see how that evolves. But I like where your heads at

to start thinking? There we go? Yeah, I think to me, how about this just jumping right in. Yeah, we're already off the track of what I wanted. Derek Stingley first segment. I like, what you like. We can't take Derek Stingley. He's barely even played college football. Nobody could pick him with the top twenty three people. Just let him fall to twenty four. I support what Jeff's doing right now because he's trying to talk this into existence. Lindar bombs small,

so is Nakobe Deane. I'll tell you what, Yeah, you can't take any one of those guys, you know, And like I said, you know, Sauce Gardner at a Cincinnati clearly a better corner than Stingiest. Oh. I agree, Yeah, we should just get this is good, by the way, get it out of the way. In the first episode, throw out all of the positives for these players and then the rest of the draft show just tear them down the way. If somebody picks up on it, then they slipped at twenty four. I mean we jolly act

excited about it. Yeah, just and we have Look, we have that power. Brian, you know, oh my god, this is what you're ninth year doing this. From the word go. You've tanked some draft stocks. Just compare, Oh my god, compare linder bomb through a bad center and we'll we're working with gas. He's furry, undersized, you know, he doesn't handle pressure on this still costa. Yeah exactly. Now I think to me, yeah, we've got in trouble with Bosa,

the Joey Bosa, that's the one. I compare it into Greg Ellis, you know, and Greg Ellis was a damn good player. But I'll say this though about like I say, I appreciate the fact that people trust us along the way, you know, but I also encourage people. Our show is investigate and educate, So that the first word is investigate. If you have the opportunity, however, you can to look

at these players, go back, go back. I mean there's things you can you know, there's ways you can find out how to at least watch these guys, you know, I mean even on the YouTube stuff. I know it sounds crazy, but the way they do these games now you can get tight shots of offense and defensive linemen to kind of, you know, get an idea of how at least they look and move and stuff if you can't get the all twenty two. But yeah, I encourage

don't don't. I mean, yeah, you should listen to what we're saying, but also take the opportunity to try and do your own work and maybe have your own opinion on this. It's more accessible than it's ever been. Absolutely, so we're gonna get into that, all right. If you're new to this, We're here for an hour and we're going to do this twice a week, so we got a lot of time. I appreciate that to talk about

all these guys. But what I want to do first, we didn't have a mid season show, right, and going back to the top of the show, I think that's probably because a lot of us thought we wouldn't need to worry about the draft as early as mid January. Anyway, I would like to look back Cowboys twenty twenty one draft class. We don't necessarily have to like grade these picks. It's still only one year, but just revisit and tell me how do you feel about where things stand with

what they did? You know, they went defense heavy. Obviously Micah Parsons kind of speaks for himself, but just how do you feel about where that class is moving into its second year? Somewhere between okay and good. Parsons has obviously been incredible, but outside of that, I think early on you might have felt better about OsO Diggi Zoowa

than you did by the end. Like I think he showed that he can contribute and hopefully become a nice player, maybe a solid NFL starter, But most of the rest of that draft is kind of a wait and see. Micah Parsons has overachieved the twelfth pick. He's overperformed, outperformed what I thought he could do. I had no idea he was the best edge rusher in football when I watched him at Penn State. The rest of this draft

class is kind of wait and see. Quentin Bohanna gave you a little bit, Gholston gave you a little bit. Osa gave you some hope. Joseph gave you a little look. But I do think that a lot of this will be determined in the next year or two. It's hard to have a definitive opinion about a lot of the guys that they've picked. I'm worried about Nahan right already,

are you? Yeah? Why? Probably my thoughts of him when he was picked, combined with it was clear even in camp they put Kelvin Joseph on the side that was competing with somebody. They put Nashan Right on the side to watch Treyvon Diggs when guys were getting banged up. There's never a question who was going in the game. It was Kelvin Joseph. It wasn't Nashan Right, And maybe you're gonna lose the coach who wanted Nishan Right to

begin with. So it's an interesting point. Yeah, there's I believe this will look back at this draft class and we'll say Parsons is the best defensive player in football or one of them and osa Gholston Joseph were at least hit ish. And I'm still a big believer in Jabril Cox, who we didn't get to see, but I said when they picked him, I think Jabril Cox is going to play in Pro Bowls, and I believe that because that's the sort of player to me that translates

to today's NFL. The great coverage linebacker who's acceptable in the run game. Those guys can develop into something really good, but we haven't seen it yet. So my early reaction to this draft class is Parsons is awesome. That's Parsons is great. And I think that's the early part about this is you can't necessarily look at the draft class with a guy like Michael Parsons at the top of that and label it as a failure of a draft class.

But you do feel disappointed with the way that picks two through eleven ended up turning out because they did have so many defensive heavy guys. But you can really count on one hand and it doesn't take up the whole hand how many guys made an impact. Nashan Wright, the biggest impact he had was recovering a fumble on special teams throughout the season. He never got any starting snaps.

And even Kelvin Joseph, He's a second round pick, and I know that there was a crowded room at the cornerback spot and there was there was competition there, but you still expected him to really jump in there and at least be in the rotation, and it took into what week twelve through seventeen to really see that finally happen, and it took injuries for that to happen. So I'm with you. I would say I would say it's a good draft class based off of the fact that you

have Michael Parsons. But moving forward, those guys are going to be under the microscope. And talking about even Jabril Cox because of the injury, how is he going to return? Can he get into the rotation a linebacker? And then Chauncey Golston as well in the way that he didn't necessarily make a ton of impact mostly due to injury. Yeah, I think Jeff's right. If you saw everything that was going on with Parsons and rushing the past and all that from that Penn State tape, you need to be

a general manager of a team. You know you've got some some incredible talent of evaluation there, because again, you saw a guy that could blitz, You saw him on the stunts and things like that. You knew he could close, you knew he had power, you knew he could run all these things. You actually saw him. You know. I talked to a scout about him from another team. He said, listen, this guy plays on three levels. He could play as a rusher, he could play as a linebacker, and you

can use him in coverage. Those are things. I mean there's a lot of guys that just can only play on two levels. He plays on all three levels. So that in itself, right, there was a home run. You know, for a while there, dan Quinn was tread and water with his group. Though he didn't have you know, Gallimore and guys like that. I mean, he really had to lean on some of these young guys and it wasn't perfect. I'll say this though. The disappointing thing to me was Joseph.

But Quinn and this defense caught a break because their corners didn't let them down. Yeah, Brown played well enough, Lewis played well enough, and then Digs of course, you know, he played well enough with the turnovers and stuff, so they didn't have to go with Joseph for right here, and so that they caught a little bit of a break there of not having to use those guys. I'm excited about Jabril Cox, I really am. I think he's

gonna take Layton vander Esch's spot. You know, I wouldn't be surprised if this team you were throwing out names of guys. You know, Dean we talked about at Georgia. I mean, we're going to get into Devin Lloyd of Utah as another guy. I wouldn't be surprised if his team adds another linebacker to this mix. But overall, though, I think I was a little bit more disappointed with Gholston and what he could have done, and I thought

there was better. You know, he was very similar to like, play the run, keep you a little bit of a pass rush. Didn't see him do all that much. Bohannah, big guy Kentucky kind of thought he was going to be a run stopper in the middle. Didn't really do all that much. So I think, overall though, the defense, those guys plugged in and played, but the expectations were I mean, well, the results were really great with Parsons, everybody else kind of gets a hey, we'll see what

happens to you next year. I think you all kind of touched on this, But this is what I think is so interesting and I'm not so much concerned about so the late round guys are Semi Phihoko, Quentin Bohannah, Israel Mukuamu, Matt farneyac. They all sort of bounced between doing nothing to not be an active exactly. All of those guys spend time on as healthy and actives. Yeah, not so much worried about them. That's late day three

that that'll happen. But the names that I'm looking at are all the way through your fourth round pick other than Micah, all of these guys, You're like, like, I kind of saw some flashes, yeah, flashes, yeah, And I'm just curious, and I think this applies to everybody. So Kelvin and Nishan Wright play a position that you desperately needed, and guys are running out on their contracts. You know,

Anthony Brown's entering the last year of his deal. OSA and Chauncey Golston you can never have enough defensive lineman. Jabril Cox y'all hit on that perfectly. And then the other one, Josh Ball, who we got nothing with red shirt years, the epitome of a red shirt year. And I just wonder, how do those guys weigh in your brain when you're trying to decide what this team needs right now, Like how you just said you think Jabril Cox and I agree, is capable of starting. Does that

affect your mindset toward linebacker in this draft? Same thing with like does having a Josh Ball on this roster matter? No? No, not at all. I Mean the one thing that I learned when I was in Green Bay with Ron Wolf was when you feel like you're strong at a position, go ahead and add another one. You know that that that's what met That's what gets your real depth this team. I know, Jeff and I we talk about it on our show. You know every every year in the spring

about drafting the best available player. This team has found a way to like have players fall in their lap and it's like, wow, well they need they need Chase on defensive end, Chase on, Chase on, Chase on Ceedee Lamb's the pick, you know. I mean, you know that's the kind of stuff you know that you look at this team and they've had a really good run of just drafting their board with the way it was, the way their stack was. So yeah, I think at twenty one you have to be open. Would you like to

have another linebacker? Absolutely? Would you love to have another offensive tackle or a guard or a center. Absolutely, you know, I think there's would you like to have another wide receiver? Absolutely, you know there there's there you can you could be really open sitting where they're at right now and and really bang this draft out and have a really good one that way. And it also goes back to kind of what you were talking about with it being those

middle round picks. And even if there are expectations or the possibility of guys like Jabril Cox becoming a starter at linebacker, he's not a starter yet. So if you have an opportunity and into Kobe Dean from Georgia, finds a way down and he's there, and you find a way to he's the pick at twenty four, then all of a sudden, you've got competition there. If Jabril Cox still turns into a starting caliber Jabril Cox down the road,

then you've got a surplus at the linebacker spot. So I completely yeah, the only guy, the only guy that the only guy that showed that, Like maybe you don't we talk about linebackers, but Parsons, I mean that's the one guy. Everybody else is still in that. If you drafted a guy, the raft, the draftable guy would be competing with a guy that you're still kind of waiting

to see. So that's not keeping me from picking. If if I draft a guy that's better than a guy drafted last year, and he's and he proves he could play by all means play the other guy, you become a backup. Well, and I would add this, I'm just one idiot with an opinion here, but if Real coxenter training camp, I call, my god, he's incredible. He's going to be a starting linebacker. And you drafted a first round linebacker. I don't care. Yeah, because Micah Parsons showed

me he's one of the best pass rushers in football. Yeah, Micah Parsons in my world is going to spend a lot of time lined up outside an offensive tackle going after the quarterback. Yeah. I need a linebacker. Whether Jabriel and Parsons are your quote two linebackers or not, I still need one. That would be a nice problem to have you touched on this, and I'll put you on the spot because you can't really answer this question right now. I can answer any question. Appreciate that. Yeah, yeah, answer.

I can't catch either of y'all a question that you can't answer, you have to do this every day. Um, how much does it concern you that the guy who created all this success for Micah Parsons is the hottest interview candidate in the NFL right now? A little bit? I think the defensive coordinator evaluation is really challenging. Like I think you take whoever is the hot coordinator candidate any year, and he's gonna go get his head coaching job, And I say, okay, so he had a really good defense,

like sure, and he was responsible for that? Sure, who were his best players? And then you just start ripping off names of really really good players, like Brandon Staley was the hot name beforehand, right and it's like who did he have? Oh yeah, Aaron Donald and Jalen Ramsey, And like dan Quinn and the staff did a really good job of identifying that Michael Parsons could fill in it edge and be a badass. I think dan Quinn did a good job of showing that he has the

adaptability required to be a good defensive coach. And I think he's a good teacher and I think he's a good leader. But I think a lot of times our ideas of how impossible it is to replace a guy get skewed when if you've got really good players, a lot of times they'll get good results. Michael Parsons is gonna play good football. Treyvon Diggs when he has a chance to is going to catch the foot ball. Those things are going to happen. So I would rather have

him than not have him. But I don't think most teams are going to be derailed by losing a coordinator. Yeah. I think the thing that Dan Quinn did that was really smart is he came in here with the ideas last year. The previous year before he got here there were some things they did really well, and he didn't

totally just scrap everything that they had done. And you know, if Joe Witt gets this job as the defensive coordinator and he's interviewing for jobs right now, Seattle, the Giants, the Jets, I think he's on the path of doing those But you know it's up to a defensive coordinator, whoever that is, whether it's one on staff or one that comes from the outside. For example of Mike Zimmer. Mike Zimmer would sit down and look at your tape and say, wow, okay, he knows what it's like to

play with Anthony Barr as a rush linebacker. So there's some things already built in. If you were interviewing defensive coordinators, it's like, well, who plays the scheme or to what we want to do. Mike Zimber does because he understands that, and that's the coordinator's job. It's Will's job to go shoulder and shoulder with dan Quinn as he's going to State College Pennsylvania, Lexington, Kentucky and Corvallis working. You know,

that's where Will has got to help. You know, He's got to go to all those places and make sure that the players that these coaches want that they can go get. And I think that's really the most important thing going forward as you work on these drafts. I was just kind of thinking on the way that you

outline that, Jeff, in terms of easy to replace. Is it easier to replace a coordinator now that dan Quinn has kind of unleashed the blueprint of how this defense could be successful, because that's one of the reasons why he is the hot candidate right now. It's not just because he had a good defense. And sure, you've got the parsons and the digs and the names that are going to rat a lot, but it's the complete area

of the turnaround that here. Real quick, I think he's getting jobs because everybody in NFL knew that Dallas's defense could potentially be a train wreck, and he came in and not only changed the personnel like Jeff's talking about, but he also he also used players like coaches give you that lip of well, we put players in position to make place. No, dan Quinn, damn did that. You know?

These coaches damn did that? You know? And so that's why, all of a sudden, if you're a general manager of a team that fired your guy, you're like, wait a minute, this guy could take my players, make them work in a scheme. Huh, that's an interesting idea. Maybe I should have this guy's my head coach. So yeah, I think

this is why there's nobody in the end. We were all I know, on Jeff and on show there on one oh five three, you know, we were talking about it, if this defense could be just middle of the road, just middle of the road, you know, were it's like, you know, this offense will carry this, you know, if

they could just be middle of the road. But yeah, they got enough players they drafted some good guys and you know, the coach did a great job of putting that all together, and then the defense ended up being the identity towards the end of about to say, let's not talk about the fact that the offense wound up letting them down. Look, this is and I'm looking at the list of the twenty twenty one class. It's it's remarkable the way dan Quinn put his imprint on this.

I'll never forget being here last year when six four corner after six four corner and kept getting talked about. So it's so dangerous business, it is. And that's well if the coach knows what he's doing. And you know, there's people you talk to in Atlanta, they were like thinking that dan Quinn was a half of football away in the Super Bowl from still having a job. You know, there's people that say, hey, Dan works hard, he's got

a good eye. But Atlanta has had some poor drafts along the way, So there was some scary there was some scary times there, and it's it's just it's gonna be interesting to see how whatever happens shapes this process, because it will whether some by some miracle, Dan returns or whoever winds up getting hired. I think it's going to have a huge impact. Plenty of time to talk about that again. We're gonna take our first break, and

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Draft Show. Welcome back to the Draft Show, presented by Miller Lite and this segment is presented by Liberty Tax. Liberty Tax is a proud partner of the Dallas Cowboys schedule and appointment today at Liberty tax dot com slash Cowboys. And if you are a long time listener, you know what this segment's really all about. And we're back to an hour format in the offseason, so we can call this Twitter on the twenty. I don't beam. I don't know if you got the dropper on the Twitter. I

like Jeff's better, honestly. And they've tried to cut you guys out of the show. We just I fought for you guys. Dave was like, you know what, maybe let's not take questions from pets. I said, let's keep them. That's ridiculous. This is always Could you do that on your YouTube channel? Right? Yeah? My YouTube channel is take all these questions yea and very fan friendly. I am

thank you as the host this year. I am determined that we are actually going to answer more than one or two questions per Twitter on the twenties is because of the luck I tried that too. Are you directing that at me? Who talks about I'm directing it at all of us? No, all right, let's get into it. We're gonna get to all of these. I hope this one's from Tendall Curtis. He points out, Michael Gallup Cedric

Wilson are both free agents. On top of that, Malik Turner and Noah Round as well, wide receiver in the first round. You wanna can you buckle your Can you buckle yourself to that wagon again in twenty twenty two? All day, every day. Wide receivers are fun. I love wide receivers. Yeah, I can take one all day every day. Next we can go back to team forty Burger. Already, Jamison Williams, you want some speed on this team, let's go. I didn't necessarily forty Burgers this year. I can hear

people rolling their eyes. What what do you go? Oh? I'm absolutely I'm okay with that. This game has turned into that. These guys working with these guys over that radio station, they've they've told me that running the football is important, but also throwing the ball is important as well. Having these receivers they make a huge difference. And yet and and there's several them. You mentioned Williams. The Burkes kid at Arkansas is a really good player if you

want a Deebo Samuel kind of a guy. So, I mean, that's what I'm saying. If people are using people are using wide receivers as weapons and using the only in the passing game. But if you put him in the backfield, there's studies about these guys and the way they run the football. It's almost like it's a shock to the defense to see him back there and before they know what,

the ball's seven yards up the field. So, right off the top of my head, if if this is something that interests you, Jamison Williams at Alabama, Garrett Wilson at Ohio State, Traylan Burke's at Arkansas. Yeah, I like in London, from US and then there's dots and from Penn State are the ones I've seen so far, And to me, I think those are those are like the those are the guys that we're expecting to be the first round guys. I will be interested to see what happens with the

medical on Williams. I think that's something that maybe that puts him back a little bit to where he falls to you like you're talking about, but he's a hell of a football player. Yeah, you better take him because if you don't, he's gonna be a chief and you're gonna let me get the Kansas City or something. It's me, Tyree Hill and Jamison Williams. Do you have something real quick? Yeah? I was gonna say this year. I've always been on that wide receiver bandwagon, even back to the Cede Lamb.

I ran a stupid half marathon for the dude. So I'm out this year in the first round wide receiver. And the reason why is because I'm not as impressed with this draft class as the draft class is the last three or four seasons in terms of that wide receiver position group. And I think that plays into the Cowboys hands in the later rounds rounds two through seven.

Sign me up, let's go get some wide receivers. But I think this actually plays out well the way that this thing is kind of turning out, because there's not gonna be those four or five guys going in the top fifteen. Like we've seen the last couple of years, You're gonna see a lot of those guys go from fifteen to thirty two, and then there's gonna be a run in that second round. Do you think that's fair? I think it's fair. I mean, the ones I've seen

so far. He's absolutely right, because again, Christal Lobby to me is at Ohio State is a hell of a football player. Here's a guy talk about attention to detail. When he catches the ball, it's not get one foot down, let's get two. He knows he's about to play on Sundays, so that's the kind of player he is. But yeah, I think that that. I don't think that we're going to see the receivers go with that top up in the top of the draft, so you're going to get

an opportunity to pick the best one. I think. Russ notes, and this appears to be a first round that is stacked with offensive tackles. At twenty four, he wants to know, have you seen any that you think have guard flexibility? And I know we're early, so if you haven't seen that much tape, that's fine. I'm just curious. I think I know I think that to me, with the tackles, the ones, the top ones, I've got it and this

is the way I have it. I have a cross from Mississippi State, the Quonwu from North Carolina State, and then I have Neil from Alabama as my third all first round guys. Neil third, Yeah, hat's Alabama? Have him as a top five potential, him as the number going overall? Yeah, number one. I'll tell you why because there's times when you watch him there's there's some one shot blocker to

his game. Now, the one SHOT's pretty good, but overall sustained for a man and that big I think there's you know, to me, there's I'm I'm more likely to pick a guy I think that's a better athlete right now because they could get second level stuff that can backside scoops and things. Neil's outstandings three hundred and fifty seven pounds, don't get me wrong. I got him as a first round tackle. But cross of Kuanwu better athletes now, you know, like Penning, you know, uh, falle Lee from

from Minnesota. That's another mammoth man. Uh. You know, I don't really see if you want to put one of those guys, I don't see Penning, you know, Northern Iowa as a guard. I think if you want to guard, you just straight draft one and you you came with a guard who could play tackle. Oh yeah, so that's Green was your guy. So I was thinking either Kenyan Green or But my guy that I'm thinking about is Darian Kennard from Kentucky. He played tackle at Kentucky translates

as a guard. Yeah, he's right, fantastic run blocker at Kentucky as a tackle, And I was thinking Kenyan Green. Well, those plays guard, right guard, left tackle, and right tackles all this year. But I think he's an NFL guard. Yeah, but he's held up just fine at right tackle. The only thing with Green is I don't know, and this is still super early on, but I don't know if he's going to be even where anywhere close to twenty four.

I think he's oh, like you may go early. I think he goes to the problem with that game is will apply it and will apply He's going top fifteen to twenty five. Guys. Actually, because I did it to see its true, I did it to CD. It was like people would send me mock drafts. I think you took CD LAMB. You should have rebooted to simulate. Yeah, like they're gonna do it with Kenyan Green, We're gonna do it with linderbaum N Kobe, Dean, Devn Lloyd and just of those four names, I bet you one makes

it Like I'm pumped that you said that. Wait, you have something real? Yeah? Have you taken a look at Zion Johnson from Boston College? I have, Yes, I have Okay, see I have Johnson over yeah, I do now having both the second round. Actually they're touching tags. They both have early second rounds. See. I think Green's clearly a first round guy because I think the flexibility part. I think I think Zion Johnson from Boston College could play both too. Is he strong enough to play? He is?

Because I wasn't super impressed. Sure he is punch excited. Yeah, I mean I think, I think. I mean, there are guys like you watch him. I thought he was going to come out last year. I did him. I did him last year thinking he was going to come out and he didn't. And I was like, going, okay, this at a but to it's the second one I tried to get into. I'm out. I just wanted to ask. I tried to get into I just wanted to ask because I wanted to see where I wondered. Yeah, I

wanted to see where he had Canardian relations. Johnson, the reason we do this show is so that I can hear you talk about some guy by his last name, wondering if he's strong enough. Like That's what I'm here for. Jerry though, and I think this is a good point. Uh. He mentions, he's he literally specified yourself as the GM.

Jerry out stop it. We're not going there. Sorry, he wanted with the He brings up Creed Humphrey, left handed center, second round last year, second round pass pick sixty three, played at an all pro level for the Chiefs. Guys missed him there. He wants to know if you can spot a difference between him and Linder Bomb. And the point of his question is basically, there's a lot of sentiment that says there's no way the Iowa Center falls to twenty four. There's no way, There's no way, and

there is history indicates that that is very possible. He's a two hundred and ninety two pounds center. By the way, you're Linda Bomb, and it's also what six two something? Yeah, so he's not gonna see you talk about the best players, we talk about the Georgia linebacker. What's his? What's his? There you go, he's two hundred and ninety two pounds. See, people will look at that. Old crusty guys like me will go, God, can't take that guy. Not big enough. No,

that's what happens in What do you think? Oh? No, I love them both. I love them both. I mean again, I'm telling you I like the athletic offensive lineman. Look what you had. How much better your team was when you had a guy like you know, with Travis Frederick. The ability to cut the defense in half, the ability to get the second level? What happened a lot of

be honest, got better as a year war on. But there were times would they just could not get somebody up, They could not get somebody wide enough to hook guys. Just to play Devil's advocate, because I know somebody's going to bring this up throughout the process. But Travis Frederick, if you're comparing the two, I know you're not. But if you're looking at Tyler Linderbaum six foot three, two ninety and then you've got Travis Frederick, who was six

foot five pushing three ten. I mean they're bigger player. It is. Travis Frederick was Travis six five. I don't think he was six There's no way I put around Travis a lot. Well, maybe he was taller than me, but if he wasn't he was really he was really script. But see that's the thing about Okay, coming out of now maybe foot four. Sorry, maybe this is wrong about because I went back and looked at my Creed Humphrey

notes he's six four three twenty eight. Yeah, that's a little different, right, that's a that's a but you talk about a guy that was really really light on his feet. Yeah, he's he's the best center athlete I think ever measured. Yeah, if you use like the combine numbers, it's crazy, you know. And you wonder why why did Humphrey fall to sixties

because scout's got freaked out he snaps left handed. That's the tape was honestly to me, because his tape was good and he was a phenomenal athlete and he got better, like Tyler Linderbaum has better tape than Creed Humphrey ever put on at Oklahoma. I agree, way better. His tape is the best center tape I've ever seen. Tyler Linderbaum's a stud. There's not a block he can't make. There's not a reach block he can't reach. There's not an assignment he's gonna miss. There's not a stunt that's going

to fool him. There's not a second level block he's gonna miss. Your only question is going to be if he lines up against jarn Reid, will he get pushed around? That's gonna be your only question because everything else and then, But that's important, and that's also part of going from college to the NFL's get bigger, get stronger. Yeah, Tyler Linderbaum's a stud. If he's at twenty four, I don't need to know who else is there. So for the next four months, you're not allowed to talk good about

ty Linda Bomb at all because now I'm upset. Now I'm so he just I'm putting it out there. If he's there it, I don't care who else is. I agree, there's not another name that matters he's at all. No, Yeah, to me, not even a little bit. Did you did you feel it? Did? Okay? Then I know what you're saying because what if green was available to drafted guard Linderball.

I'm thinking I was thinking he was going to say, I'll play with be honest, if I had green guard, I'll put Lyle at left guard and I'll move on with my day. So you have linder bamb as your one. Okay, let me ask a question. I'm sorry, I don't. I don't know. I'm not the one that she'd be asking question. Fans.

I'm enjoying. I'm enjoying this well. Were you no? No, no, no, no quit please no no. I feel like we were headed for a great debate because what I'm about to say, it's what you do whenever you put that president in the early The show needs to be two hours? Is the problem forever? Because two hours? Do you does too? I love talking draft? Do you think like like she needs to be nine hours? I guess the point I was trying to make is especial Day two and day three,

Calm down, everybody, calmed the hell down? Was Tyler Bottish as big of a week link as all of the focus on lender bombs seems to suggest that he was? Because that's that, Like I said, the prevailing sentiment right now is like we gotta get this damn center. I think it's almost an impossible question because I think everybody that plays offensive line on this team over the course of the season and especially the last two or three months,

didn't play as good as they are individually. Zach Martin got beat at times where Zach Martin's not supposed to get beat. Tyrn Smith got beat at times where he's not supposed to get beat, Lyle Collins, everybody. I think if you went through the loss in the playoffs, I think Beotish probably had the cleanest game of everybody on the line. But your offensive line let you down, and if you have a chance to upgrade with a really,

really good player, you upgrade. So like, do I think it's an emergency and you have to replace Tyler Bottish him now? But if I have an opportunity to get better at a at a position group that let me down, I'm doing it. Well. Let me ask this just to kind of piggyback on it. But if Williams is not available, let's pretend he's not even a part of this roster moving forward. Do you feel like I think that's pretty plausible,

That's what I'm saying. If if that is the case, Do you feel comfortable at the guard spot moving into the season with options like you can maybe move leo' collins over there the season, put him at left guard, and then you would go and get a center, or you could go sign a veteran guard. Can I change the line, coach while we're at it? Hey, Hey, hey, sir, just asking, That's all I mean. I mean, if that's the case, your your your offensive line might look remarkably

different if you do, if you make that change. I'm not I'm not advocating that. I guess I just did. But you know this, yeah you kind of did. Okay, but cowboy employees like there may be times where they wilt, let it rip. I went back. If we get fired, I went back, I went I went back and looked at my time. Well, come back to the draft show. Somebody else replaced Jeff Kavanaugh. Yeah, these guys were tampering, you know, see the thing about it with Tyler Beyondest.

I went back and looked at my notes, and I think doesn't play with much strength or power. Too many snaps where he gets rocked back, stalemated along the line of scrimmage. I think we've seen that, you know, his head goes down, he gets in trouble. He can you know, he looks like he can see things and all that communicate and all that. When he blocks on an angle to shield and stuff, that's all good. But he doesn't get movement one on one. And that's the thing about it.

I mean, there's things you saw at Wisconsin that are carried over to today, you know, And so if there's concerned about Lindenbaum being maybe not strong enough with a guy directly on his nose, then you know those are concerns. You have to see it, though. First you have to pull him. Give me that Minnesota game, or give me that, you know, give me one of those games where he's playing against somebody big and they're just man handling him. If that's the case, then I think you'll have to

adjust your thoughts. I've got a really great question about the Eagles, but I feel like we could do a whole segment on it. So I'm gonna save. Oh. I've always liked Don Henley. Birds aren't nice reference. Thank you? All right? Real? One quick, one quick one from Drew before we had to break We've got three en didn't we know that this will be the fourth. Okay, go ahead, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, go ahead ahead. Running back. He wants to know if it's a top one hundred in

twenty twenty two. Yeah, no, it'd be a luxury. But if they picked one that they really liked, I guess it's fine. But Pollard's gonna be on the roster's he's gonna be on the roster and this team in this building, these guys twenty ones getting the ball even though he shouldn't. You've already got a running back who can't get the ball, who's better than your starter. What are you gonna do with the third one? Get ready for Pollard's departure. Yeah, it's not a top one hundred. I think that's why

you do it. If you do it, is thinking Tony Pollard this you should be working on a departure for the other one. That's a lot easier saying. I've looked at one running back and it was Kenneth Walker from Michigan State. It doesn't seem like a very good running back.

It's not he's not I'm in the second round. He's a he's a good player, but he's not a first round I think there's there's more depth to this running back class than there is that top head if you prospect pool, which is actually gonna work out, because I don't think you should take a running back of the top one hundred in that regard, But there's gonna be some decent yeah wherever, But there's gonna be some decent

guys later. You take it, you take it too far, you take it like it's imagine doing radio with him. It's worth it as a top one hundred. Maybe not the first round, but like if a great running back is they're starting around pick sixty, I'm getting interested. Question, you're only hedging his one hundred by forty picks. I'm surprised, but well, the other one would take twenty minutes. Oh

I am. I'm fascinated by the idea. The Eagles were good enough to make the playoffs and they have the why why why are you gotta cut me off like that? It's running the ball. I just said it, right, Yeah, if you run your quarterback fifteen times a game, if that's the way you want to play, we don't have a chance to win game. We don't have time to

do it. But Tim, we are We're gonna take your question. Eventually, the Eagles were good enough to make the playoffs and they have three first round picks right as a divisional Right, well, I think that's worth getting into total. Absolutely, we'll have to save it because we did. We are over, so we will head to break. We could make we could make the Eagles we got we got like four we got to I tried one year, Jeff, I tried to make the Eagles score five questions and I feel good

about that for the first show of the year. Job. We'll be right back after this. I want to use what the pros use. How about the official men's skincare brand of the Dallas Cowboys, Jack Black. Right now you can get the Jack Black Starter, a curated collection of Cowboys locker room favorites, for just ten bucks with free shipping. The starter includes four Jack Black skincare favorites, plus a full size and tense therapy lip bomb. Go to get Jack Black dot com slash Cowboys and use the code

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is the Dallas Cowboys dot com Draft Show. A welcome back to the final segment of the first show of the year. Brian, You're going to appreciate this a lot. Did you know you can invite Rowdy to your next event? Really? Yeah, you can. From birthday parties to corporate events and special deliveries. Rowdy brings games, entertainment and photo opportunities to all occasions. Visit Dallas Cowboys dot com slash Rowdy to book your appearance. Can we I used to know the old Rowdy and

he might show up at a club for you. I think I think we need to Karrowdy for a crawfish boiler or something this year. I would love to see rowdy try and peel crawfish with his rowdy hands on rowdy tossing back some Miller lights in Jeff's backyard. Let's go push him into the pool. Also on the flamingo just floating around, you guys would have abused rowdy abuse. No fine, right, all right, first segment, and good dude,

thank you for all your questions, a lot of them. Understandably, we're about what I want this segment to be about. So if that's why I that, that might be why I ignored your question, and I apologize. But so we look back at this past draft class and kind of how we feel about that, and we've touched on this a little bit. Kyle, you more than everyone else about how you're feeling philosophically about this first round and this roster. And I just want to go around. I'm gonna maybe

put y'all on the spot. You can't you can't repeat answers said the interest of entertainment. The number one thing that you want to address with pick twenty four is what And Kyle, I'll start with you. Yeah, it's the offensive line for me, and it's partly because of the need, but it's also because of the prospects that could potentially be there for you as well, in the way that the draft class kind of works in your favorite It goes back to what Brian even said in the first segment.

Last couple of years, the best player available has come to you, but it's also been in a position where you could utilize it. And I think that's the best chance that we're going to see that kind of line up together and all the stars a line as if a Lender Bomb and a Green fell to you in

the first round. I think that's the ideal scenario. And even if they don't, you're fine picking offensive line in the second and the third rounds there as well, because there's gonna be guys there like as Ion Johnson maybe if he falls to the mid fifties, or a Leviticus Smith or a Jeremy Slayer Smith from Virginia Tech and

Slayer from Georgia. There are guys that are going to be good players in Day two that even if you wanted to go away from offensive line in day one, I'm okay with that, but I still think it's the number one priority moving forward. I think almost everyone would agree with that, based on the way the season ended. Yeah, I mean, what's a cheater? He took the good answer. Sorry, okay, I'll take I was just hit me. Wait, you got something else. I just watched San Francisco not score an

offensive touchdown and win a playoff game. Yeah, if that's the way you want to try to do it, it ain't gonna work very often. I'm just telling you, though I've seen them, San Francisco has found a way with their front to control games on defense that you need to get better. I mean, your pass rush is fine, but you know, let's be honest. Nevill Gallimore wasn't good enough. We talked about Bohan and we talked about what's happening

at defensive tackle here. If somehow, some way you can address what's going on with your defensive line, you know, San Francisco is one of the worst pass defenses in the league. They held Aaron Rodgers a two hundred and twenty five yards. You could say it was five degrees or whatever. I don't care, but you want this team the last two playoff games have controlled the Cowboys and

the Packers with defensive line. Don't tell me your front doesn't matter here, you know, And if it's depending on what happens with Randy Gregory depending on what happens with Tank Lawrence in that contract. You know this team's up against it in a couple of different ways. You might be forced to be to address your defensive line at twenty four. So other than Hutchinson and Thibodeau, who are just the Cowboys have no chance of drafting. We don't really need to even talk about it. How do you

do that? At twenty four? George carluftis the which he may not be, but you know, I'll be interesting what happens with lyle from the from Texas A and U. Sorry not a fan. Well let me do a favorite. If you're gonna make that sound, let's hear a report. Yeah, I don't want I don't want yeah to Marvin Leel Texas A and M. I have him as like a second round defensive tackle because he has the physical traits to be a really really good player. To me on tape,

he's never put it together. I watched, I believe it was Cross. I believe I watched the Mississippi State game and Marvin Leale never ever, on any snap, made Charles Cross uncomfortable in any way, shape or form. Is he a quick guy that can play defensive tackle, yes. Will he flash the ability to make plays in the backfield, yes? Does he flash the ability to be a power player at the line of scrimmage? Yes? Does he do any

of those things consistently? No? So de Marvin Leal to me is a that's probably about right late first round pick where somebody's taken a swing on what they think he can be. I want to be able to trust my first round pick that I've seen him do it. Who's your top interior defensive lineman then Jordan Davis. But he's a two down player. Yeah, so that's hard and that's I mean, that's going to be a guy that people keep going back to just because he's so unique.

Jordan Davis out of Georgia. I'm very confident we're talking about you see. That's what I'm saying though. To me, you look at these teams and we talk about you got to defend the run, You got to defend the run. It's not the case anymore. You know, teams throw the football, you know. I mean, you're sitting here talking about the forty nine ers. They will have to defend the run. They rushed the passer. Yeah, forty nine ers. The forty nine ers in the game against you had they lost

their best player and still put you in peril. They got better after they lost their best player. Honestly, come on, man, So it doesn't matter. Get ends, get tackles addressed. The defensive line, You're you're going to be in some trouble here. So you're just saying the front in general. I'm seeing the front, yeah, because you don't know what's going to happen. Like I say, if teams are going to throw the ball, what's the one thing that this team did a good

job of rushing the passer? Yeah, you know that was the one thing. You know why they rushed the passers so well because they got leads. Now, maybe it is about helping the guard and the tackles and the stuff. Like if you want to talk about the commonalities of the team's left right now, and this probably is going to help somebody like de Marvin lee l who's a two hundred and eighty nine pound defensive tackle. Uh gosh, when I think about what they having common. Eric Armstead

is a penetrating monster on the interior. Aaron Donald is maybe the best player in football. Chris Jones is one of the best pass rushers in football from the interior. If you find you somebody on the interior they can pass rush. That seems to work out well. And what's the most disruptive type of pressure to a quarterback the mire. But just in general, and again, I mean we'll get I'm just being different from the answering game. I mean, if you want to think about I mean, but I

think I appreciate, I think this is worthwhile. But just from the preliminary research that I've done, you know, like going back, a couple of drafts like Derek Brown and javon Kin Law aren't in this draft class or am I wrong? I don't know they are. They're not. Yeah, you're not. Jeffrey Simmons isn't in this draft class. Guy, I don't think they are. Well, then you know what you could do? Okay, Then what I should have said then, is any player on defense linebacker. Listen, there's a couple

of safeties in this draft. I don't know the safeties you've looked at, but there's a you know, there's a couple of quarterback you can't let him pick the whole Give me, give me Kyle hamis argument, which, yeah, that's a great point. Thank you to pick wide receiver. That's that's where you go. Though, I'm I'm not like making fun I'm curious. No, if he didn't get to take every defensive position. Um, if you're talking about Ryan, I

wasn't trying to take every defensive position. I said defensive line. If if he's sticking with defensive just say defensive tackle. For the sake of giving you some choices, give me the exact framing of the question. Again, what do you think is this team's biggest need? And we're just gonna say, assuming you know, just take offensive line. Can't say defensive tackle. This doesn't mean that I want to pick it at twenty four. But if you want to know this team's

biggest need, it's safety. This team, this team, like right now in the safety room, it's Donovan Wilson on a stool spinning circles. Well, that's who's in the room. That is myself looking around versus up Kase. He's up up, And I mean, that's the tricky part about starting this show. And Jay, one of those guys will be back right, depends on if your defensive code you listened to Stephen Jones on our show. I don't remember what he said. They'll keep their own guys. They just don't saybody else's

That's what I'm saying. Oh, I mean, they're not going to be big spenders, but like Mallie Cooker, you know, I have to spend a ton of money to get Malie Cooker back here. Good or bad. Mollie Cooker, I thought he was pretty good this year and thought he got better too. He wasn't. I'm glad. I'm glad I was. I agree with you, guys. I just asked the question in a way I didn't think. I mean, I didn't

think Kay Bay else would say, is any good? I think most people would probably say And that sounds weird because nobody took his job, But I think most people would probably prioritize Hooker over Casey. I would. I think most people started playing him more after the DUI think well, and also, Casey doesn't want to step up and hitting anybody either. Let's throw his body around a little bit. I saw him kind of get run over a couple of times times. He's a smaller guy. I mean, he's

a corner playing safety. He was teammate he would take anybody. Go get a real safety. Go get Dax Hill from from Michigan. I mean, yeah, guy could play in the slot. Some of the some on Brisker from Penn State. There's there's somebody there some Twitter, but he but here. They would have to do that for me to believe it would happen. That's why it goes all the way back

to that. That's a deep rooted thing. That's why he question the phrase, you of the question because if it's biggest need to me, the real answer with every position available is safety. But is it likely they're going to address that with a high pick in the draft. Probably not. That's their biggest need today. So Kyle Hamilton at Notre Dame is the unquestioned safety boss of this guy. Yeah, he's he's gone way No, that's no. I was gonna

say he's he's out of here. Yeah, So in our arrange, if he was there over linder bomb, would you take linder Bomb? Still? I did say it doesn't matter, but that's because I assumed happy. Sure, But when you just want to throw it out there, I will also take Aiden Hutchinson if he makes it to twenty four. Who's our Who's our Penn State guy brisks Jakwan Brisker, Brisker, Brisker, I'm sorry, like like the like brisk tea or actually brisket with an R. You watch Catalan yet from Arkansas?

Is he coming out? He's not. I'm not coming out and it's okay. But then that's one of the ones that I had him in high school. Catalan's a good player from Arkansas, by the way. Player. I had him over Brisker by the way. That's why I asked he's probably done him and he didn't come out. He'd probably be like Dye provided the list to me and I'm like, yeah, I know. I had him in the second I had

Brisker in the second round too. Oh. That's all I've been doing for the last week is going through different people's like top one fifty and mean, like, okay, what's what's this guy's story? How do you pronounce this guy's name? Yeah? So, but say like and again, I guess it's hard to project, but like, I assume one of those guys will be back in the building, preferably both. I don't know, what do you think jay Ron Curse will be worth it? In two months? He played really well, there's two guys

who have now remade themselves. Yeah, him, curse gonna have a market. Yep, he now proved he can cover. We didn't believe he can cover coming out of clims, and we thought he was a bum. And I thought he didn't try hard and didn't like football. Come he loves football and he can cover. We were wrong about him. The guy you're tied in also is gonna make money. Oh yeah, yeah, he's gonna make money. Somebody on I didn't. I did not propose that on Twitter and on the

twenty for that very reason. Widermeyer, somebody named Drip Wheeler said it's like a stock car driver. That's because that would be Rip Wheeler in days of thunder. I believe that Rusty Wheeler. Rather it's Rusty wheel How big, how big of a need? Do you see a tight end? You know, Dalton Schultz fourth rounds, fine, sprinkle whatever you think me a big I've seen one. I've seen one. Whidermeyer is the only one I've watched. And he I

tell you what he's he's a really good player. But I mean, you're you know, you're probably not gonna pick a tight end in the first round bringing Gronk. I want a blocking tight end if I'm gonna go draft the guy and is there a blocking both is sure? You know what I mean? Jake Ferguson from Wisconsin, Okay, watch make sense us guys. Traditional disappoint me those Wisconsin guys every time they talk about blocking tight end. I'm like, oh, look at this guy. It's a big tackle out there,

and guy gets in the league. He can't block. It's a pillow fight play offensive lineman at tight end. Don't worry about all that. It worked well last year. Should have thrown it to Steel on that one play he presented his numbers. He was in the middle of the field, he was open, he caught a touchdown pass. Yeah, but in the playoff game he and they went double fullback and both of them are open, but eight yards downfield.

I don't know why Dad didn't trust him. As long as we're going back to that, and so you've all answered the question, we've still got some time to kill Lyle Collins guard depends if if is that a thing? If Philbin stays around for Phil you know what, to be honest with you, instead of going back to Connor Williams, they should have went ahead. If they really did believe that Steele was one of their best linemen, they should have put Steel at right tackle and put Collins at guard.

If they if they're going to keep going back to Connor, Williams might have been the bad play here. They might have been able to see what it looks like with Steel because they love Steele. They love the fact he comes in, he tries hard, he you know, he works everything. He's a coach's pet kind of a guy, you know, really cares about the game. They love everything about him. Nobody says anything bad about him. They think he's their best, one of their best players, one of the best offensive lineman.

So if that's the case, take Lyle Collins. They should have done that at least to see what it looked like, because that's what this team might be in twenty twenty two. I wonder how much of that might be politics, the politics of football. Let me tell you what. The offensive line coach is best friends with the head coach, so that carries a big stick. It's like having bones fossil in your building, you know, Mike, I think we need

to I'm not sure. Whatever, Yeah, sure, special team. I'll tell you what, you know what he you know, he survived the kicker situation. You know, it didn't kill you at the end, and he found a Pro Bowl punter. I mean, give him at it for that. They were. They were a top eight special teamed unit this year too. Look at the Packers they went home because of their

special teams. You know, it's something to that. But if you're a coach on staff and you carry a big stick with the head coach, the Joe Philbins those guys, there's always going to be a place for the guys that he wants his pet cats to play. Who's the next guy you're gonna watch? Man? I mean, we've just there's I've been very fortunate because I was just trying to do two or three at night, and now I'm passed.

I started with Dane Brugler's top fifty and so now he had me watching a center last night from a well actually guard from Memphis that you know, it's really not It was like a fourth round player, and I was just kind of, yeah, it's star, it's January. You want to watch the heavy hitters. And Jane, this guy was two hundred and eighty five pounds. He's a good player, but I mean on the list, I'm just taking the list and kind of like you said, take people's list.

I trust Dane a lot, but you know, that guy's like a fourth round player. I'm hopeful that I need. I need to get some of these linebackers done. I need to get some of the outside linebackers done. That's kind of the direction I'm going. Sneaky area of need. What about you, sneaky area of need? Yeah, um, i'd probably say linebackers too. That's where I'm at right now. I've kind of watched the heavy hitters on the offensive side of the ball, and I'm kind of going through

the defense. I started with safety in corner and now I'm kind of at the linebacker spot, which is a little anti conducive to what to what Brian was talking about in terms of the defensive line. I still haven't watched a ton of those guys. I've watched like the Leale, I have overdone the edges. I there's no there's no

overdoing again. Like we're gonna be back and yeah, I mean, we're running out of time here, but we'll be back Thursday and then two days a week until freaking May so you got you can't overdo It's no, no, I'm just saying this. I'm looking at my board right now. You know I've got I mean, like I say, Thibodeaux, Hutchison, Carloftis Walker a JOBU you know, I mean those that's five edges are you have in the first round right there?

And then not to mention Jermaine Johnson, Cam Thomas, by the way, you need to watch Cam Thomas from San Diego State. It's a good player, all right. Well before that next week, yeah, I was about to say, yeah, I got some homework for all of y'all. We'll be back Thursday, and it'll be the last time we do a show before the league descends on mobile. I believe for the Senior Bowl. We're gonna talk about that. I want to hear about your pet cats on the Senior

Bowl roster. We will do that Thursday. Thank you all so much for joining us. It's exciting, maybe maybe still slightly disappointing, but exciting to be back on this journey once again. Thanks for joining Cheff with the power pose appreciate that. We will talk to y'all Thursday. This has been a production of Dallas cowboys dot com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. M hmm.