Draft Show: LIVE @ The 2017 NFL Combine - Day 3

Stay three of our shows that we've done here from Indianapolis. Actually, boys, we get some guys working out today. Yeah, excited about that offensive lineman and running backs we're involved. We'll get to that. I want to talk about that as we go along and kind of talk about some of the highlights that we saw, maybe some of the low lights, maybe some of the questions we had. Maybe now we have more questions than we did before when we started

this journey. But I want to get into that. I also want to get in an opportunity to talk to you, how talk through you to you about how the show is going to run today. I want to get into this combine, Like I said, I also want to do some Twitter on the twenty and Twitter on the twenty is a great way for you out there to interact with us here on the Draft Show. It's at the

Draft Show. You should follow us along on Twitter. Ken Garrison, as always says, does a great job of running the Twitter account, letting you know you're probably watching us right now, maybe on the periscope, on that the Twitter, and we appreciate that, all the apps that we use, we appreciate that. But you know, we don't have the ability to take calls. Promise to do that. We get back to the Star. But today we are going to play a little Twitter on twenty and so I need your questions and David

Hellman will handle that part of it. And with all that being said, I will get this show started. Uh Dane offensive Lineman today And you know, it appeared to me watching these young men work out that the guys who we've seen as the top guys tend to tended to have the better of the workouts if you look at the way the numbers, you know, and the guys that you know with the with the the Garrett bowls, you know, guys like that, Uh, Forced Lamp Dawkins. I thought, yeah,

you know, f Line, I thought Phoeney. You know, there were some guys that we've talked about as the top prospects and and we've we've said this though, maybe that offensive line group. You know, Cam Robinson another guy, you know, and I I thought Cam Robinson, you know, I didn't think he was gonna do as well athletically, but today he sure proved me wrong in that way. But it just appeared that the guys that we've seen the best on tape tended to have the best workouts today. And

that's what the combine is all about. The combine is a cross checking exercise to make sure that the numbers match up with what you saw on tape. And I think you're right. I think Garrett Bowles, who is a fantastic athlete, you see them on tape, and he showed it here. He finished top five in every single category.

Every you know, you don't see Lyman run forty yard dashes on the field, but when you see what he did in the three cone, the vertical, the short shuttle, that translates and for different reasons, you know, the vertical jump shows lower body explosion. Three cone shows the flexibility, change of direction, and so for a player like Bowls, I think he confirmed what we saw on tape and same thing with a lot of these guys. Dion Dawkins another guy for US lamp. So I don't think there

was a huge, uh, you know difference. And the running backs might be a little different. We'll talk about about that in a minute. But I think for the linemen, I think what happened here today at the combine matched up with what we saw on tape. Yeah, if you talk about Bowls and you know he's he's a guy that where you're trying to figure out I had questions about his strength when you watch the Utah tape. I wanted to see him bench press. That's really the only

thing he didn't do. David the numbers safe, you know for him, twenty eight on the vertical jump, nine to seven on the broad, seven two nine on the three cone drill. That tells us a lot about you know, Dame is always saying, hey, if you could get a guy under seven, right, that was kind of the benchmark. Though, here's a guy, but but you know, you look at a guy and he was real close at seven point two nine, you know, and that's a heck of a number right there. So he put up the same vertical

as Leonard, Yeah, he sure did. And we'll get into that as well. But and then we're five five in the twenty shuttle, So and that's you know that that tells you a lot about him. You also, you know, you were mentioning Dion Dawkins and here's another guy, he's a There's some guys in this draft again, David, that they're projecting, they're tackles that are playing guards. It just seems like to me that there's more of a projection, and correct me if I'm wrong. Guys, more people are saying, oh,

he's a tackle, should be playing guard. He's aid. You know that that seems to be the feeling in this combine or the feeling with this class, right. Don't you feel like that's kind of been a trend though. I mean, we can obviously point to Zach Martin Sheriff as another guy like that. Uh Lyle Collins two Cowboys. Actually, I mean it's see and I don't know if that's the way that college football teams are playing right now, if it's a scheme thing, or if it's just luck basically

I don't know. But you know, over the Latin as long as we've been doing this show, it seems like every year there's a tackle prospect or three that people like better as a guard. Well, somebody's gonna have to play tackle in this group. Yeah, you know. And I and I kept hearing, haven't we've been, I mean, we've been saying, well, Cam Robinson, I mean, is this is this not, for lack of a better word, of crappy tackle class? No, I do, but the best of them,

all out of all of them. We didn't see today ram Check because he's still recovering from his hip injury, right, and he's and yeah, ram Check, and he's what talking about five months? Five months? And he you know, it's it's an injury that he had surgery about eight eight weeks ago, right about two months. He's still with a hip, right, And so we probably don't see him work out prior to the draft. So, uh, you're nervous about doing that making that pick. I hate I hate picking guys who

and again we've talked about it already. I don't like picking guys who can't, who aren't healthy when they're picked. I have a problem with linemen that aren't healthy to begin with. You know, it just seems like to me, but you know, ram check, he's he's might be depending on who you like. You know, I see what I Robinson I talked about. You know, you know six six, You know you look at the measurables with Cam Robinson, you know, six six three twenty two pounds and he

comes blowing down there at a five one five? You know, is he is he growing on you? It's an lsu man. I have to say an Alabama player is growing on But I'm thinking I watched the tape of that guy with you, and you were not impressed. I was not impressed because I didn't see the athletic ability. But he's showing you he's got it right here. Well he did,

That's what I'm saying. That's where that's the biggest problem I had is and Dane always likes to talk about this, if you see athletic ability, to go back and watch the tape and again the tape. I don't think the tape lies about that. No, But I didn't see a great athlete there. But today I saw I saw a guy for that size be a great big difference. I think with Lineman is with Lineman, there's always contact and so you have to have that contact balance, and that's

where I think Cam Robinson really fall short. Uh you know, he's he's lunging all the time. More of a technique issue, but the contact balance, that's where I really worry about Robinson and being able to hold up and how that'll trade right. So you know, against air, he's looked pretty good today, but when you throw on the tape and he's asked to you know, Mano Imano, and you know, the technique falls apart the contact balances and issues. So you know, I think it's and I'm not trying to

trash the guy. I think you know, he had a solid workout and that's what you want to see. Uh. But you know, especially for him, the tape will matter much more than any result he put tea. You expect him to be as athletic as he was today. I mean yeah, because I'm think he's a bad athlete. I just think he has balance problems. Yeah, you know, and that's see if you have a balanced problems, to me, I feel like you're not really you know, because there's

there's some guys that were that were flailing around it. Right, You can be quick footed, you know you can. But if you have balance issues and you don't have the technique to help out to mask those issues, and then you're in trouble. And that's with Cam Robinson. Uh. You know, you don't want to see him lunging. You don't want to see him falling off balance. It's onto the ground.

There's a lot of things on tape that were you being a natural athlete, being quick footed wasn't necessarily one of them for me at least, right, Yeah, your favorite offensive lineman in this draft? Would it be Forest Lamp? I have Ramcheck rated higher and okay, okay, the guys that worked today, I'm right, the guys that worked today, Yes, Lamp. To me, that's the guy. I think he's a first round player. I've used the Zach Martin comparison quite a bit.

I think that makes sense. Even NFL Network they compared him to Zach Martin. I think it makes too much sense. Uh this not only you know, the left tackle, moving inside the guard, but the skill set what he does best. Think the strengths matchup a guy that you could potentially kick out to tackle if you needed him to but just with his skill set, it's just better suited inside a guard. He had a pretty fine day to day. I thought he did well. Uh you know, it was athletic,

moved around well, so the body control. So I think Forrest lamp cemented himself as definitely a guy that's going to be in the round discussion. Probably the first guard drafted, Probably the first guard drafted. You know, I go back to this and I keep I'm looking for a tackle. Yeah, I mean I feel like I'm hammering. I'm I'm sorry, I'm just being this point. I'm looking for a tackle. Though. It just seems like there's better guards in this draft.

And if you're a team, and we saw plenty of teams David last year that struggled with offensive line play, yeah, you know, look at a playoff team, even like the Seattle Seahawks. How about a playoff team in the New York Giants and the New York Giants. Yeah, well, the Seahawks are the big one for sure. I mean they're famous for not having exact for not having a line. I mean, you could you could you know they're they're in. I think there's some teams that might be in a

little bit or hurt. You know, if they're looking for offensive tackle help, but the guard help is clearly there selfishly, that's I mean, well, you applaud the Cowboys plan, well, now what they have in place, not only their plan, but I applaud their good luck that you know, of all the positions that they need to work on, they should have a deep pool for most of them, whereas you know, and if they needed a tackle, and you get I mean sure they need in a way they

maybe they do need to tackle. You don't know what the deal is with Chaz Green dubbed freezing getting old, blah blah blah. But in terms of like an immediate needs, you know, I wouldn't peg them up there as a team that's sweating the fact that there aren't a lot of tackles to choose. From the numbers for four Slamp they got him at six o three five, so almost six four three hundred and nine pounds. He's got the thirty two and a quarter arms was measured, and then

ten and five eights on the hands. The official forty for him was five flat thirty four with the bench That that itself surprised me a little bit. I didn't expect him to do thirty four reps. No, No, I mean I think he played strong, but I didn't expect thirty four that you know, going that way. But that was impressive. Twenty seven and a half on the vertical, nine three on the broad jump, seven five five on the three cone, and four six two in the twenty shuttle.

So those were the numbers for mister Lamp today. I think danger right, I he's he he's the first guard off the board. Yeah, we'll see about ram Check if he's the first tackle or will somebody like you know Robinson better And let's say, okay, can we can we compare now a little bit? I'm just thinking back. Okay, you know Schurf was a top ten pick at guard. Martin went what sixteen? Martin went sixteen? Yes, and then you know Brandon Flowers went nine. I know he's a tackle,

but I'm just thinking of lineman nine. I mean, where's the first offensive lineman going off the board in this class? And give me a range. I mean, if it's we're talking Lamp and then ram sick probably, So it's tough because I think ram Check's the top twenty player. It just comes down to comfort with the injury. You know, if you're comfortable with him not being able to see him work out prior to the draft, he's a top

twenty pick all day. But that's a big if we cannot We cannot be going into a draft where an offensive lineman will not be drafted in the first round. No, no, no, there will definitely be. There's just too much of a need. That's what exactly across the league, you know. So I definitely think we'll see lamp but the best one is hurt. Does that that's scary? Okay, I'm gonna be self centered again and say, does that favor the Cowboys because you're

talking about teams reaching for offensive lineman? You know, you're drafting guys that maybe don't belong there, right leaving more Cowboys. The Cowboys have had some good fortune with that. I think with guys that, you know, the Flowers, you know that was a reach. You loved that pick Flowers in terms of you love it because I loved it. If you're Giants didn't, yeah, I loved it. That the fact I'm all I'm all for the Giants continue to draft guys.

I mean, hey, hey, they beat the Cowboys twice I get it, you know, but no, but I think I mean, you're sitting here, you're telling me that's San Francisco. Howly would San how early would San Francisco take a take an offensive line. They're picking two, so hopefully not with their first pick. Yeah, that's I'm saying. There's not a guy that you would say. Sometimes we've seen offensive line and go way up the pot. Well, Eric Fisher, Luke

Jokele John Jake Long back in the day. I mean, it's a tackle is one of the most important positions in football. So it's crazy to me to think that we're talking and yeah, I think you're right, Dane, that somebody will get drafted, but we're not talking about a lot. And I mean, what do you think the average is over the last few years? Four problem four in the first Yeah, at least four in the first round, if

not more, and now maybe one. That's crazy to me. Yeah, it is crazy because we've seen a tradition in the past though, where there has been offensive lineman. Okay, let's get onto these running backs. There we go, and uh, you know, and and I'll and I'll open I always like to throw the broad into question at you Dane. You know what we talked about. We came into the day thinking about four net is he two head? Is it the waterway? What is it? What is it? With

four nette? He vertical jumps twenty eight and a half. Everybody then goes, oh my gosh, sky is falling. Then he goes out and runs four five one in his forty yard dash, actually goes four to five one, four five two. Concerned there did everybody? Did? He just shut everybody up running that speed, running that time at at four five one. I think if he ran like in the four at low four fives, mid four fours, you think he goes faster and baton rouge, don't you? Oh?

Of course they always do. But the trouble is, how do you measure the poor vertical with the solid forty yard dash time? You know you can't. You don't. I'm a big believer, and you don't ignore it. Numbers. Okay, if a player turns in at twenty and a half inch vert you know the fact that he's just never been a good jumper isn't really good enough? You know, you know, the vertical and the vertical jump in the broad jumper, not just about how high or far you

can jump. It's about lower body explosion, explosion, and so you know, and you watch the tape for and that's an explosive player. He I mean, he's not an elite explosive player, but he's kind of like Zeke where you know, he has that sneaky explosion to him and he'll run over you. But it didn't match up here with the numbers. So the question is why, why is this a player who looks explosive on tape but posted a vertical or a vertical jump that four or five offensive alignement invested?

Sure you know who are carrying, you know, eighty ninety pounds more, and so it's it's I think the forty yard dash definitely help bring a four or five one that helps you kind of overlook the number. But I don't think you can just ignore that twenty eight and a half. I'll tell you what, if he'd ran four to six, four to six, I would have been right there with you. But I think that I think there's plenty of tape, And you're the big trusted tape guy, and I agree with you on this. There's plenty of

tape where he's playing with explosive. I'm not saying change a grade, yeah, but but I'm also saying concern. Yeah, but you don't ignore the number either. I think you do a little bit more research, you figure, Okay, is you overweight? Uh? You know, I think that's his biggest problem exactly. I think he's gonna go to the pro day be two hundred and thirty three pounds two or thirty five pounds, and he's gonna jump if you can get into thirty thirty, thirty and a half thirty one.

I mean, Zeke had a thirty two and a half inch vert so you know, if he comes within a couple inches of that, um, you know, I think he'll be just fine. So I think that might be more of a case more of the reason just being a little bit overweight. But no, no one is changing there, or at least no one should change their grade on Leonard Fournette based on that vertical leap. You just kind of have to take it into context with everything else.

If you're a Leonard Fournette and you're you know, you're one A or one B running back in the draft, and you had all this time to prepare, I almost have to think it was a conscious decision to come here at two forty, you know, like, it's not like he did that on accident, or I would hope not. I hope he didn't do that on accident, which just makes me wonder. I wasn't sure at two forty if he was really working out and then and then the vertical And we've discussed him yesterday about this love for

foot ball. I guess I guess I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. I was trying. Yeah, he's been working out, but he seemed surprised at his vertical lead it was so low. Yeah, because it wasn't until after the low number there that he decided not to do the broad jump. I agree. I think he was worried for back to back problems there. So has he not been practicing the vertical jump and the broad you know, it's I think there's some questions there if it definitely

bears asking. I mean, that's and honestly, I think and I was going to say, the other thing is it's working against him because he's such a freak that you expect freakish numbers. I mean, four five one is a great time for a two hundred and forty pound running back. But I think I was, and people were a little bit disappointed that he couldn't crack into the four fours because you have that expectation. He was. He was talking to clubs last night as I'm going to run in

the four four. Yeah, I mean that was his and I think the vertical jump shocked him, which I really do. I think it mentally messed him up. I hope that with everything that's on the line for him and any and this isn't just Leonard Fournette, any prospect, Like, I hope he didn't come here just thinking like all I gotta do is show up, you know, like the time for that is past, Like this is the NFL now right now. Yeah, I want to get back into these

running backs. We're gonna take our first break, gonna do some twitter on the twenty, and I want to revisit some of these running backs and some of the things that had happened there. I think there's it's a very very interesting group. It's a very very deep group, and I want to kind of dive in, not just so much at the top guys, but we're going to dive through the middle of this draft and figure out some of these guys as well, so you're watching the Draft

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Kit Garrison, Executive producer, David. We always have to talk about Caliber Collision, of course, good sponsor for ours produc heres. We also have to talk about our favorite underwear brand. Yep, Tommy John, Yep, great underwear, great socks. Not a great surgery. You don't want that, No, don't want the If you have to have the surgery, you can wear the socks

in the underwear. Yeah, T shirt, underwear. It's all good for if you're in the hospital with Tommy John surgery, you why not wear Tommy John underweard can't stress it enough. It's like wearing nothing at all. Absolutely way, I like that.

That's that's a new tagline from you. Right, they ain't bad. Yeah, I don't have to worry about that bunching and all that kind of stuff, right, Dave, No, never never worry about Okay, thank you so much for a Caliber Collision and Tommy John for bringing us here to the combine. We're gonna do one of my favorite segments because it gets it allows us to interact with the fans out there. It is known as but on twenty So David Hellman

take it away. This is a good timing for a question from her, because I remember last year we mentioned this guy in the same breath as for Nette and Cook all the time, and then he fell off a cliff, and I want to know about him. Samaj p Ryan, Oklahoma running back. Seems like he's making a good impression here at the combine. Turn some heads with his bench press, which you expected, you know, with the Uh he's a built dude. Uh, so you kind of expected that upper

body strength. Uh put up what thirty reps? Reps? Yes, so not many running backs go over the thirty mark. Some ejap Ryan was want of them to do that. You know, the forty yard dish not as impressive for six five, but that's not his game. He's not a speedy type of back m but you know, it's not something. So I don't think the four six five should change anyone's opinion of p Ryan. U to me, I see a second day player, a guy that should be considered

in the top one hundred picks. Uh, the vision, the power, very tough inside runner. H I don't know. I see a player who is I would consider in the in the third round. What about you? Did you see that player? Yeah? I was. I actually went a little bit later than that. I thought he was more of a fourth round type

of a player that's actually perfect. Because Herb was wondering if yeah, I just feel like though that Dane tried about this guy and you, I think he's more of a powerful runner than he is, like you said the allusion SIVs speedy guy. I think he works really really hard to finish his runs. I mean you will see him try and fight and to get every yard he can. I thought I thought he caught the ball well in the drills today. Though they threw some balls to him,

the flat stuff he was able to do. I don't think you want him running a lot of stuff down the field. I think that's more Mixon's game getting down the field. But this guy, if you throw it to him in the flat, he could turn get up the field.

His numbers as we were talking about though, you know the four, six, five, like Dane was talking about thirty times with the reps, thirty three with the vertical nine eight with the broad jump right there, so that was kind of his day right there, and you know he's not a lot of people talk about him because of what Mixon was has done. But a solid player, like Dane says, though probably third fourth round consideration Xavier or Zavier. Sorry, I don't know which you wrote about this, Brian. He

wants to know how much buzz TCU tackle Aviante Collins generated. Well, you can on every year going to the combine and you have two or three players that you haven't seen that you need to see, and then somebody works out really really well at the combine and you and then all of a sudden, now you're like, okay, you know, Dane and I were actually talking to each other while collins workout was going on. It's six four two ninety five pounds official time of a four eight one thirty

four on the vertical. Got nicked up while the drills were going on, so he didn't get to do the vertical and all the other stuff that you saw there, So a little bit disappointing. If he had done that, maybe would have had the best combined workout of all the guys. I have not seen the player myself. You were kind of talking about you'd watched some t sue tape, but you did nothing really caught your eye with Collins, if I'm right. No, But what some these results do

is it's gonna make it makes us. Now go watch the ten and not only us, but thirty two teen. Right, you know they're gonna go back and say, Okay, you know, we knew he was athletic, but right, you know, is he this athletic one happens every year? Back and watch the tape and say, okay, there's something here. He's an athlete. How will that translate? Maybe we can mold him into you know, build his body, fix the technique issues, get

more consistency out of him. But you can't teach athleticism either you have it or you don't, especially for a big man. And so teams are gonna go back, study a little bit more, find out what they have. Yeah, but you had not seen the player before, had you. I've one of his games and I didn't see enough to make me get excited about doing another. You know, I that's something it happens here. Yeah, it's not like yest,

Yeah it next. Yeah, it's not like you. It's you know, you do just because he has these these numbers doesn't mean he's a good player, right, You mean he know he could flop in the tape, there's no doubt. But what it does is it causes us to go back and make sure that you know we're not missing something

because he's in press. I don't even know what we can say about this, but it seems worth addressing because our favorite guy, Ian Rappapors out on the Twitter sphere talking about three see him in the hallway a lot NFL trade. Let's play fantasy football. Mat Matthew wants to know about a three way trade. He says, no way, right L O L. I don't so ras the last time an NFL pulled I know, and I've been doing this since night. I can't remember three way if you're

not privy. Rappaport is talking about, uh, Washington sending Kirk Cousins to San Francisco and then Dallas sending Romo to Washington and a bunch of picks being involved. I don't know. It was a very cryptic tweet. It sounds ridiculous, but I also thought to be to be totally fair, and it's a completely different situation because he was a free agent. But I thought it was absolutely ridiculous to think that

DeMarco Murray would wind up in Philly too. I said that, I said that on the record, and that's what happened. So yeah, I mean, anything's possible, but that just sounds ludicrous to me, it does. I mean, well, and we'll have the opportunity to visit with Jerry Jones tomorrow. Yeah, so they'll be a good opportunity for eyes to the end, Dave Hellman will break the story that there's a three way trade. We're in the works. Jerry's gonna sit down

to me, like, so we're sending Romo. Washington's gonna hand David Miller lite and then the next thing you know, Dave is gonna break the story there's a three way trade. Sounds great, Sanci If I got to break that trade, are you kidding me? I'd buy I'd buy you all dinner at Saint Elmo tomorrow. How about that day? Three times for you in one week? Can't owe me on that? If only? But it's not gonna happen. I don't say it's not happening. I just don't see it happening either.

I really really don't not the Dave breaking the story part. Oh well, that's not gonna that's not gonna happen either, But thank you. Um, this is way more up y'all's Alley, Carlos and Carlos, I'm gonna call you out because I know for a fact that Dane mocked Carl Lawson to Dallas at some point at least, but he says, uh, Carl Lawson is not being mocked in any first round projections. Is he worth? Is he worth it at twenty eight? Why isn't he getting more buzz? Which I do agree

with that part. I feel like he's kind of the forgotten guy when you talk about late round pass rushers. When you hear about Tack, you hear about Harris, you don't hear Lawson's name is often. I think it belongs there. Uh. You know, these pass rushers are gonna go quick, uh and we're gonna see that on draft day, and so Losson he's gonna be, you know, the consolation prize for the team that does not get uh those edge rushers you just mentioned. So there's a lot to like with Losson.

I talk about how his lower body, his lower body quickness, his upper body power, he uses both of those in Unison. Now he's not the biggest guy, uh, you know, only about six one, but he uses that leverage to his advantage to ben get underneath. Uh you know, I've used that. I've talked about this before, but Larrymy Tunsel mentioned that Lawson was the toughest pass rusher he ever faced. And Larrymy Tunsel's the best tackle we've seen come out of the draft in the last few years. So there's a

lot to like there. Um, I don't think you know. To me, the easy comparisons Brandon Graham with the Eagles, Uh, just skill set wise comparison, it makes a lot of sense. Cowboy killer. Yeah, and for those reasons, I believe he is worth a first round pick, and at twenty eight, with maybe all other options wiped out, it's not a bad way to go. Yeah, and you like Davison. You mocked him to Dallas at one point, so yeah, yeah, I totally agree with Dane here. And I'm agreeing with

you way too much. It's probably making some bad show, but I'll agree with you here. I mean, I'm just looking at my notes. I saw a guy that can hold the point of attack. I saw a guy that was strong handed, I saw a guy that could get the corner. I saw a guy that can quickly disengage. I saw a guy that could kick inside if you needed to in the Nickels situation, and play him as a tackle if you want to rush. He's got the

power to get the blockers off balance. There's a lot to like about Carl Lawson here, and I think the Brandon Graham comparison is absolutely right spot on with him in this situation. Sam's got a good one, he says. No, I'm sorry, not Sam. Chris says, who do you think is better taco or McKinley? And why two different flavors of ice cream there? Yep? I mean you have one tacos more of that left end a sending pass rusher

where I think Tack obviously the better athlete. Not as big only you know, about six two and a half two hundred and fifty pounds, but he's a speedster. I can't wait to see him work out. He's on Sunday, Yeah, defensive linement on Sunday. So eager to see what he does in the forty what he does in the change of direction drills. I think he's gonna blow it up where a taco. I don't expect him to do as well. I think he'll be average. I think he'll come in,

you know, right around where he needs to be. But you know, it depends what kind of rusher do you want who makes the bigger impact for me? I take the guy with the better athleticism. But with that said, he also has some injury stuff, so all those things factored in. You know, I wouldn't be surprised if Tacos drafted first or tax drafted first. Two pretty good names there by the way, yep. But I lean McKinley. And that's if if you're gonna just boil it down to

those two, i'd lean McKinley. Yeah. McKinley measured in at six two, two hundred and fifty pounds, thirty four and three quarters arms nine and three quarters hands, great length, arm length, yeah, and then six two yeah, and Taco came in. And this is where Dane's trying to explain to you what it is. Taco comes in at six five really about six six h five five, so almost sixty six, two hundred and seventy seven pounds, So it's a different mean you're talking with twenty seven pounds difference

right there. But the thing about McKinley, I think that McKinley does a better job of getting the corner. I really do. I mean, you know, with with with Taco, you see him play disengage or you see him be engaged and not quickly get rid of somebody to get to the quarterback. I His play, in my opinion, is more of a guy that plays. Is that left in where McKinley, to me could be the right end. Put the hand on the ground, play him a little wider

and let him go to the football. And I've said this before, but when I watched Taco at Michigan, it reminds me and when I watched Justin tuck Gett, Notre Dame said a bunch, And I think that's a good player. So there's promise there. There's playing a promise. But in terms of the speedster that's gonna capture the edge, wrapped the tackle, uh, that's definitely McKinley. I think we both agree we'd rather have him. Absolutely, I'm I and y'all

are the draft experts. But I've already said this, like I can't I can't get into the right end left in just I just want a good football player, like I'm I'm I'm no, You're it's fair, but I'm just I'm drawn toward Taco Charlton because I've seen him and I just like he's a damn good football very steady, just doesn't make a lot of wild plays. His name is Fred. Would you still like him? Yes? I would, Yes, I would, But I wouldn't like Charlton. I wouldn't like

him as much if his name was Fred. I just like I said, I just I think that he makes He's a steady player that I'm looking for the way you are making my point for me, and it's like at twenty eight, I'm just basically assuming I'm I'm not gonna get a wild player. You can get a wild player in the stream. Give me the high floor guy. Give me the guy with the high floor that even if he doesn't have a great seat, like, he's just good. You know, Byron Jones? Is that Byron Jones for you?

I mean that was where that's gotta the same pick you got there? If you didn't we think Byron Jones had a high ceiling based on his athletic ability. Though yeah, I would say, did we twist jer arm On that one. I don't think. No, I'm just I don't think. I don't remember saying Byron Jones was like, there's nothing spectacular about Byron Jones other than the fact he broad jumped twelve feet. But didn't we think he could grow into a back, thought he could play two positions based on

his athletic I think we thought both. He had a high ceiling and a high floor. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, if if Chaco Charlton's got a high floor in a low ceiling, I'll take that at twenty eight, if I can just plug him in and have him be a solid player. Don't you feel like the Cowboys have a lot of Taco Charlton's on their team right now at defensive end. Yeah, but they're not gonna find I got a bag of tacos. You're not gonna find von Miller at twenty eighth. We got a bag of tacos. You're not.

You're not gonna find as many tacos as you want. You're not. I'm getting hungry. You're not gonna find Miller talking about TACCOs. Yeah. Should we do more? Please do a couple more? Um. This was a good one from Sam every you know, so many, so many questions about cornerback end in wide receivers, right, so sorry, but where do you feel the most comfortable finding a starter caliber

player in the third round? At that at those positions, like, of those three, who do you feel the best about somebody being there in the third and then the least And that's a mouthful, I'm sorry, corner or defensive or corner or corner end, receiver, corner or receiver. If you're trying to draft the guy who's going to start, where, who do you feel the best about finding in the

third round? Probably receiver. Um, you know, I think the good corners are going to be off the board by then, you know, I think because we're talking about a non top seventy five pick, right, yeah, yeah, late, Picky, I think all the you know, corners, corners a premium position, I think, more so than receiver. And I think for that reason, a lot of the corners will be gone, I think, just in level of importance to your roster.

Wide receivers the third out of those three positions, yeah, absolutely, And so I think because of that reason, because of the depth of this class, I think that wide receiver i'd feel most comfortable that there'd be a decent player at that point. There's a log jam in this draft in rounds two through four with receivers. There's no doubt about. I have no idea how possibly. I mean, they're gonna

be stacked on, stacked on, stacked receivers. It isn't be hard to differentiate, how you know, different flavors, they bring different things to the field. But to me, I would say receiver. I feel pretty confident I can still get a you know, Terence Williams, he was taking third round, right, you know, a player of that caliber could step in as a number two. Uh, you know, give me starting reps as a rookie and maybe grow into being more than you know, just a just a starter, you know,

begin an impact type of player. Yeah, I don't disagree. I think I think the guy that has the shot. I mean, to me, I love I love the cornerbacks in this draft, I really do. And I yeah, put in the third round. You think they'll be there in the third round. No, I think a better player will be I think a better player will be a wide receiver. If you can get an Amara Darbo in the third round. The third round, yeah, that's a great thing. Yeah, there's

there's no question about that. I mean there there you go down through. I love the death, like I said at corner, but I Darbo is a great example about that. Zay Jones could be Jones. Where do you have the Taylor the Yeah? I mean there there's another guy right there. Literally, I mean, how about our kid from West Virginia that we were talking about Gibson and we could talk about fifteen sixteen receivers. I think I'd said this earlier this week.

Is I mean every I think everybody agrees Davis and Williams are a cut above, and then everybody's got a different opinion about the next twelve. We need to know about Ross to Ross is you know what I mean, there's he's he could be up in the conversation again, it's about the medical there right, got one more? Um? Yeah, And I guess it's fitting because they were they did

the interviews today Ernie. And this is vague, but drafting drafting a quarterback backup quarterback Dack and and you assume that's not going to be a premium pick because the Cowboys have a young starting quarterback. But I don't I don't know, and we we talked about Chad Kelly before we came here. Obviously he's not here. But I don't know any of these guys do anything for you. I mean in the middle of the draft. Yeah, I mean not the true Bisky's in the Watsons of the world,

but somebody. I think you have to watch for the next Dak. And when I say that, I don't mean that type of player who's gonna come in and somebody somebody. Everybody missed a player that's gonna maybe fall a little bit, right, I mean Dak fell to at the end of the fourth Yeah, so we try to give me one on one, right, almost a fifth round pick, right. So I think if there's a quarterback in this draft that falls a little bit, then that could be your guy. But a guy like

Nathan Peterman, a guy like Davis Webb. I think these guys are gonna pushed up in the top one hundred and that's not where you want to draft. Um. Jared Evans from Virginia Tech. I think possibly he could be that guy. He has a little bit of promise, But again, it's all about value. If one of these quarterbacks were to fall a little bit and you get that value pick, then I think it makes sense. But if you have to reach for one of these quarterbacks, no things. Yea.

Luckily the Cowboys shouldn't have to do that. But honestly, and if a guy fell to the right spot four fourth round, maybe I don't know. I don't have a problem with rounds. Mahome's gonna end up. I was about, no, Okay, he's going first round. He has to. I wouldn't say it has toy, but I think there's a more likely chance he goes first round the second round. Right. Let me say this, it is it buzz combined buzz right now. And then when we get to where they start stacking

these boards that people go, we're we're too scared. We're too scared to do this. I believe cowards. We don't want to put the tag up there. I believe it's I believe it's I believe the buzz because it was happening before we got here. It's not like it just fell. Oh, he had him in the top fifty. I respect him for what he did because he's absolutely right. The thing I wonder is is the other NFL team it's gonna

get scared. Look at look at you have. Brian has the quarterbacks in front of him, Like, read down that list and tell me, like, how who you feel great about? Oh you don't? I mean and that a guyser? You get the Notre Dame. And this isn't This conversation is not just about Mahomes. It's the top four quarterbacks. Okay,

So what you're saying is you they're gonna drive Mome. Okay, if if we go back to the tackle conversu quarterback in this thing, if a few, if a few tackles that shouldn't be there are going in the first because of demand, then Pat Mahomes should be going on the first round. Yeah, we have no clue how these quarterbacks are gonna come off the board. How many go top ten, how many go top twenty, and then how many end up in the first round. Could all four go in

the first round? I think absolutely could. It's crazy. I've you've said this before. It minds me the two fourteen draft, we just have no clue who's going to be the first quarterback drafted. And this isn't true just now at the combine, when we're so many days out the day before the draft, I think I don't think we'll have any idea the order to come off the board, how many top ten, how many the first round. But I think you're you're laying the groundwork is that we should

not be shocked when these quarterbacks are taken. We shouldn't be shocked, No, because nobody really, even the teams might know. How many people saw, you know, Bordles going number three to Jackson Villatious and fourteen, I mean they, yeah, I

mean they. We could have another situation like that this year where there's a team in the top you know, Jets at six, who knows, you know the guy, the Browns at twelve, Arizona at thirteen, there's several teams that you know, Buffalo with Tyrod Taylor at number ten, you just never know. And then in the back half a round one, but Kansas City, I think to me, that makes a lot of sense if if a Pat Mahomes and Deshaun Watson, one of those guys fall to Casey at the end of round one, that would be a

great pick for them. You have your future starter behind Alex Smith. See that's when I had that argument where I said something about I think we were in a discussion when I said at twenty eight, what if Dallas took DeShawn Watson and everybody and we all everybody kind of looked at me, like what you see, That's what I'm saying. Good teams might figure out Dallas doesn't have a backup quarterback. Was actually and I know and I and I'm just saying it is the value of that,

but we don't know the value it would be. It would be crazy because of all the stuff. I mean, and every team has needs. But I would like, while we were talking about this, like Seattle could draft him. I love that. I think would be great. Yeah, um, as long as it's not your team, right, well, yeah, that's as soon as it becomes your team. You're like, whoa, Dan, do you feel significantly worse about this crop of guys

as opposed to the twenty fourteen guys. I just I remember feeling like, yeah, I was surprised that Bortles win as high as he did, and Manzelle was a wild card and nobody really knew what to expect. But I just remember feeling more confident in that group that like they would become a lot of people liked Car, a lot of people like I think overall, it's very similar because I I you can look at all these guys and poke holes and all every one of them, but

I think each quarterback has starter potential. So I'm I'm kind of lukewarm on this quarterback group the top four, just like I was lukewarm them on two fourteen because you saw starter traits, but you could also poke holes

in each one of their games. So and it's funny that two fourteen class of that fifth quarterback drafted is the ones getting all the buzz right now, Garoppolo, Yeah, so you know, it's just well, hey, the best two so far through their careers are the ones that fell in the second round, and Garlo, you love those second round quarterbacks, but they're Andy Dalton is the second round. I mean, you know what I'm saying. I mean, yeah, Drew Brees exactly right. Okay, thank you so much everybody

out there for Twitter on the twenty. We appreciate your questions. We'll do this one more time tomorrow. Tomorrow we'll be our last day here from Indianapolis, so we're gonna take our final break. When we come back, we'll have some more talk about this running back workout. Stay tuned or compact tractors with the six year power training Warren to him big features that help you work less so you

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I want to thank Caliber Collision and Tommy John for their sponsorship and helping us with all things with the Dallas Cowboys. Dave, our loyal followers found me a three way trade. I can remember things that happened in this world. I can remember remember the eighties like I remember the eighties like I remember Bob Whitfield. Today with Daniel Jeremiah said that the tackle from Florida Sharp was legally blind

in his right eye. The first thing I thought about was Bob Whitfield, a tackle from Stanford that was picked by the Atlanta Falcons in nineteen ninety two, my very first draft, and he was legally blind in his right eye. So that's the first thing I thought about. I can remember those things you can remember, but I can't remember a three A three way trade. You can tell me Packer war stories from the nineties until you're blue in the face. I can't do that as well. Yeah, Kelso

we're nothing if not accountable on the draft. We try so we're investigating educator right We're sitting here saying, oh, three team trade no NBA. In twenty ten, the Eagles, Lions and Broncos did a three team swap. The Broncos sent Tony Scheffler to Detroit, who then sent draft picks to the Philly and Philly or to Detroit, excuse me, and then uh, Detroit sent linebacker Ernie Sims to Philly, and everybody knows Ernie Sims eventually became a mediocre linebacker

for the Dallas Football Cowboys. Right. Uh so, yeah, I guess it's possible that that seems a little bit um what do I want to say? It seems a little bit low caliber compared to a Cousins Romo trade. But hey, anything there was, but that happened in two thousand and ten, So okay, there, anything's possible, Anything is possible. But I don't know. If I don't know, he asked the boss tomorrow if he's gonna pull a three team Jerry, are you gonna do a three team trade with Niners and Fins?

You know, I hear a lot of guys sent around the media center, by the way, a lot of stand ups talking about Tony Romo. Of course, you know, the guy, the guy from Denver, the Gentleman Center there with the red tie. He was. He was one of the first ones over here this morning. He's my buddy from Denver.

Who's the man he was? He went on a live he went on live TV this morning Denver talking and the first thing he brought up with Tony Romeo, there is not a more intriguing player in the NFL right now than Tony Romo because yeah, commanding the headlunch, Yeah I would. I mean, I'm biased because I cover the Cowboys, but you're talking about a multiple, multiple hundred games starter with flour pro bols. Jimmy Garoppolo has looked great, but

he's played three games. I mean, right, and you're talking about two opposite ends of this one of the better quarterbacks in the league over the last decade. Real quick, if I can well. I ran into this morning, ran to a coach with the Denver Broncos that I happen to know, and I asked him about just the commitment that the Broncos have to their quarterbacks. He said, you know, it's really funny. He is Packiston Lynch is really immature. He goes. We've got we've got to figure out how

to get him to be more mature. He says, But the thing that we that that John Away he loves Simeon. That's this guy. He loves Simeon more than anybody. So that's I mean, that's why the Broncos are having the way, the kind of direction. But they they feel like though that John Away feels like he's got a guy in Simeon. But they've got to work hard to get to get Packiston Lynch to care more about football, to be a guy.

It's not what you want to hear. A guy to come in and be like what Dak Prescott has been. Come in, first guy in, last guy out, grind the tape, be a good teammate, be accountable, be all those things. They're having that problem right now with Paxton Lynch, which is why and you know they might have to look at a quarterback. They're gonna say everything they have to say. It's good gamesmanship, it's just smart. But like, don't don't try to tell me their ears wouldn't perk up if

Tony Romo became available. No, absolutely, especially with the way we just killed all these quarterbacks in this draft. We'll get back into this running backs. We talked about four Nette talk about the day, you know, and I mentioned, you know, Dalvin Cook is another guy we all loved Dalvin Cook, but Dane Dave, give me somebody down the line.

It was there somebody down the line that that caught your eye that you're like thinking, okay, the tape and the workout match, he's a guy, maybe a second day guy, third day guy, that somebody is gonna get it, get extreme value for as a player. And and and it seems like the big buzz, the big buzz around has been about the three down player. You know who's the that was? That was the broadcast today. It was Mike if you're watching on TV as Mike may I's he's

this three down guy. He's a three down guy, he said. And we've kind of been talking about that on the Draft show a bunch, even last year, even two years ago, with the te Tevin Coleman's and guys like that. We were talking about the three down him. That's what the NFL is trying to go to. But is there's somebody like that that you saw today in the in the in the in the way that the workouts went. And

I'm not about McCaffrey because he blew this thing. Yeah, you go ahead and bring up I think he had the best day of anybody that worked out on that field. He did overall, lineman, running backs, whatever, whoever worked out today, I thought he was the best one. And the three cone is just an amazing yever, it's a phenomenal numbers. It's one of the best we've seen from him running back in quite some time. Um. And this is a guy you watched him during the drills, h the receiving drills.

He's outstanding. And I've said this before, He's going to run better routes than probably some receivers that are drafted ahead of him. Right. But to me, he just confirmed what we already knew. He's a first round player. He belongs in the first round. Um, he's one of the top twenty five players in this draft. If you can't figure out how to use them, you're just you need to reevaluate how you're calling plays. He's just that type of weapon with the ball in his hands. And you're

not gonna give him twenty five carries a game. That's just not who he is. But give him twenty five touches a game. If you're a general manager and you pick him, do you walk into your coach, well, you probably you're welcome. Yeah, find find something for this guy to do. Here's the and he's definitely a first round player, one hundred percent obviously. And our Poul said last night the Cowboy fans really didn't want him. Well, I mean,

I still I get I get where they're going. Yeah, I don't if anybody think differently, But here, okay, do you agree with me on this. Whoever drafts him just by virtue of his range on the board and then what he does. Whoever drafts him isn't gonna need him, you know what I mean. Like, he's not a guy that you're drafting to fill an immediate hole. I think you're drafting him as a compliment to what you already have.

And that scares me well because you're not saying a really good team is going to pick him, Yeah, basically a team that already had. Like, he's not You're not drafting him and be your first running back. You're not drafting him to be your first, second or third receiver probably, but he's gonna be. He's Darren Sproles. You have to draft him with a role in mind, exactly, absolutely, and I think the team that does that will be a team that can afford to pick a player like that.

But what okay, what about a team like the Giants who don't have that clear cut top backs? Do the Eagles really have they? But they I mean they well they rot. Darren Sprowls made, Yeah, the obvious place New England gets brought up. I didn't want to say that because it's so obvious, but right, that is the obvious place. And they've shown they've known how to know how to

use that type of talent um. But I do think a team like the Giants, a team like the Packers, you know, I mean, you can still use time Montgomery. It isn't Montgomery that guy that they already have? That guy? Better? Hey, have two of them? What's wrong? You know? I know Ron Wolfe always said even at the Packers, and it was, hey, if you feel good at a position, keep drafting him, keep drafting him. And you know, this kind of contradicts what I've said about you know, the Cowboys not drafting him.

But if you can't figure out how to use him on your offense, I'm hey, I don't think I still don't think it would be a great idea. But having seen that and having no knowing what I know, I it would not take me long to be on board with that pick. I think you can talk yourself into that. I kind of look at some other ones back to your original. Yeah, you know. Second third, I thought t J. Logan helped himself. North Carolina running back. Yeah, this is

a player who I I thought it's better. Elijah Hood, the running back from North Carolina, gets most of the pub I think TJ. Logan's better. Uh, more of a talking about complimentary back. That's t J. Logan. He's under two hundred pounds, but he's fast. Uh you know, give him. How well did he catch the ball at North Carolina? Pretty well? That's because it looked like in the drills there were a couple of times he struggled with that

and he might have. Um, I didn't see him catch the ball today, But you know he's he's kind of that scat back. Ye use him out of the backfield, you know, get him uh, you know, moving on stretches, you know, let him one cut, get him up field. He can five he dances, but he's decisive. You know, he kind of walks that fine line uh to make guys miss. So I think t J. Logan, uh, somewhere in the middle rounds would make a lot of sense. How about Kareem Hunt. Love him, He's a top senior

back this year. That yeah, see I the speed said four six two that's fine' that's I think that shows you can catch the player a lot. Oh yeah, you're not draft him because of his speed. That's people get so wrapped up in the forty And it really doesn't matter to me for for running backs especially, Yeah, you know, it's it's something where how many times is a running back truly running forty yards in a straight line? If I was spending I might I would care more if

I was spending a first round pick. But you're talking about a mid round pick. Yeah, I'm talking to a guy, right. How about a guy like Boom Williams from Kentucky. I'm not a fan. I didn't like his tape. I think he's underpowered. Um he's five seven one ninety. Yeah, I don't but the speedo you wouldn't even go back on him. But you saw the tape. You don't like I started the tape. I didn't like the tape. To me, he's a you know, a late maybe seventh round guy, maybe

a p FA. I think for me, he'll probably end up as a priority free agent, but I wouldn't be surprised of a team thought he'd be worth a six or seventh rounder. Let me ask you, this brad guy you're talking to me, we're talking about the three down backs, but I'm thinking, um, what about what about specialists? And I know you talked to don Ald Pumphrey yesterday? Yeah, what about guys like that? Again? Thinking about the Cowboys? Where's where's my lance dunbar? Can I get a guy

like that? Pumphrey was a guy today. I thought he had a my lance dunbar, But maybe my lucky white head I can kill. Made a great point yesterday about quarterbacks throwing too receivers or throwing to backs or whatever. The bullpen quarterbacks at this camp did these running backs no favor when they started running. Pumphrey did not get featured in anything today. The ball was either too short, too far, too wide, to this to that. He is flying home right now mad because of what happened to

him today. He did not get to talk about the thing or excuse me, He did not get to show the things that he's really really good at, and that's like you know, catching the football. Those kinds of things. You know, that to me was disappointing because I wanted to see I wanted to see that. I wanted to see that role of Okay, swing it to him, wheel it to him, throw it to the screen, throw the flat through, all that stuff to him. He didn't get one ball thrown well to him today. Hey, I know

we're in our final minutes. I want to touch on a few things we saw today from the receivers and the quarterbacks that came through here. Yeah. Uh, Mike Williams deciding not to run. You know, it's one of those guys who we kind of you know, if he ran a good time, could he cement himself over Corey Davis's top guy, you think, oh yeah, because he said he kind of danced around it. But he said, you know, I only have to run a forty yard dash once

in my life. I'm gonna you know, he kind of said, I'm gonna make sure it's the best I can run. And I don't fault him for that. He'll run out of the Pro Day. But if he doesn't do well there, he doesn't have another time to make it up. Don't don't you just I don't I don't fault him for it either, but just just do it. Just just compete. Yeah, because he mentioned Jerry Rays didn't have a good one. He mentioned Antonio Brown out right now. He was laying

laying the groundwork for disappointing. It's going to be right, and that's what you worry about. So, uh, is he a four six athlete? Is that just what he is? Um? What else? Today? David and JOKEU. I thought he was really impressive up there for a twenty year old player, Jake, but two was another guy in Joku. He uh, he wants to break the broad jump record and so Byron Jones, Wow, you're on, You're on notice? Are you kidding me? I

wasn't there for that part. Yea, the tight end is gonna break Byron's record and at two hundred forty six pounds, okay, at two hundred and twenty pounds in high school he was a high school national hurdler or a national jump champion. So you know, is he gonna break twelve three? Probably not,

but the fact that he thinks he can is amazing. Well, the record for a player over two hundred forty pounds is Jamie Collins, who did it I think he was eleven seven, So that's to me, that's the goal for and Joko if he can get eleven seven or better, which is just an ungodly number. That's a sill, that's a full half sandwich away like further Yeah, that's insane. So tomorrow we will have on the workouts quarterback, quarterbacks,

wide receivers, and tight end. I remember day and that used to be the tight ends with the last group to work out on a Monday. Our guy Shaheen too. Yeah, we got see and we'll document that tomorrow night. Get ready for that. Shy Okay. Well, that's all the time we have out there. Thanks to everybody. Let's say special thanks to Lorna Rose who is with us today. She's been helping us out here, better known as Mighty to you out there in the world. She's been having fun

with us at the combin. I want to combine and see all this. We've enjoyed having her here with us. I want to thank Dane Brugler, David Hellman, Keik Garrison, executive producer Derek Eagleton, and I also want to thanks Taylor Sterning for always putting all our stuff out. And I want to Thank you guys out there for joining us as well on the Draft Show. We'll be back final show from the Combine tomorrow. We'll see you in