Draft Show: Fool's Gold?

Is the Dallascowboys dot Com Draft Show, your war room for insider news and draft analysis from deep within the confines of Cowboys headquarters at the Star Infrasco.

And now your host, Kyle Yeomans.

Today is Tuesday, April first, twenty twenty five. We are officially in Draft month, just twenty three days away from the NFL Draft. Welcome into the Draft Show, presented by Miller Light, the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys. It is Miller time. Starting to get exciting around these parts. Thirty visits starting this week. We've got a lot of information flying around at the owner's beatings, a whole lot of information still compiling into the board as we speak.

And no, that is not an April fool's joke.

We've got Zach Olchuck, Brian brought us Vox Lombardi, Bobby Belt with Chris Beam and the backladder with us.

Everybody. This is an exciting time, gentlemen. Brian, I know.

There's a lot of talk about rules and explanation of the rules and all that stuff, but it's still a lot of draft talk.

At the same time, The biggest thing I heard was that the head coach today told us that he wasn't interested in getting his coaches involved in scouting, which I thought was cool.

I liked it.

I guess I kind of made that up in a way. You know, he said no. He was even talking about how his guys, you know, he listen to these guys, the scouts. It's their job, it's their responsibilities and stuff. That was something I know that we had talked about on a couple of different platforms about this that would the first year, would Brian Schottenheimer say, Hey, I'm going

Then Shody talking about buildings from the outside end. Right.

Uh so he did mention edge rushers, but wide receiver corner seems like that's gonna be very much in play there at pick number twelve.

Yeah, just to be missy, right, because I like, you know, good, good.

Miss it is a toxic Tuesday.

Do you think that's like a Schoenheimer thing that I'm just gonna let the scouts do this right or he's been to build it so long he's going, Man, that coach at this pick up, this coach, Damn boy, the scouts would be fine, but this coach says non sense right here, I'm gonna let them fly because I've been around.

It's a it's a largely new coaching staff and a lot of these guys he talked about that like when he got during the hiring process, he didn't know a lot of them very well. He had like taken recommendations and things like that. So I don't know that he's got a great handle on what kind of evaluators they all are at this point. I mean some of them he would know old guys.

I'm talking about the oh oh yeah, like he's seen coaches mess the draft up, so he's gonna go, man, you know what, I'm just gonna keep my hands off this and let Will in the guys.

That's I think it may be a little bit more of respect element for the scouting department, for the guys that they have found before. I mean, Tyler Smith was a pick that no one had their eyes on, at least going into the final weeks of the draft.

He ended up being an All Pro.

I mean, there's there's a lot of different elements, and that's just one example. But I think it's more so Schottenheimer's been around the building. He's seen the job that Will McLay and his staff put on the table year after year after year, and so he says, it's not on me to mess that up and try and shake things up along them.

I like it. Whatever whatever we however we painted, whatever we painted. As a scout sitting there, you have to feel like, Okay, this is on us, guys. I mean, you know, he's gonna tell us the coaches are going to say, to Bobby's point, there's a lot of coaches that haven't been in the national football You got some college guys, you know, they could tell you, like, hey, you know, when I was at Kansas State, you guys kind of saw the players we played with the offensive line,

It's really a coach's coach scout scout mentality.

Never called a third down defense in my life, never called a third down defense. So I don't think you know, and when they and I think there's a place for coaches, I think there are some really good coach evaluators. I want to say this, I would have liked to have worked with Jason Garrett. As much problems as I had with Jason Garrett, as some of the coaching things he did, I would have liked to work with him in the scouting department. I worked with his dad for a long time.

And you've got twenty three days to kind of put your board together and finish out the way you think on this draft class. And when you've got a new coaching staff, you've got a coach that's been around for at least a little bit here in Schottenheimer, and then you've got a scouting department that's done this the same way.

For a number of years too.

It's easier to have overthink and it's easier to have some miscommunication back and forth between those two sides. If there is a full on involvement. Now everyone's going to have an involvement. It's just a different level of that across the board between the coaches and the scouts. But I thought the overthink side of things was interesting, And Bobby, you brought up the NFL dot com article from Bucky Brooks this past week. You can go check it out.

So I think when I think of overthink as just a obviously could meet different things to different people. But whenever I hear anybody talk about that during the draft process, what they're talking about there is you know, something we've touched on recently, fatigue, like name fatigue. Somebody who's been around a long time, and you maybe get a little

Yeah, to your point of me, like Ted McMillan, right with the forty time with him, it looks plenty fast when you watch him play, Like, to me, that's not a prospect that you should overthink. I think Ted McMillan's the best wide receiver in this draft class, and I wouldn't move him there based on, oh, he didn't run an X amount of forty times. So I do think

Is he a guard? Bobby?

I heard you make the comment about Rashaun Slater. They had that same conversation about with the arm length, the gold Campbell's tape is pretty darn good. Now when he plays against one guy from South Carolina that I throw out is a not overthinking player, Kyle Canard.

Kyle Canard's a dude that is just absolutely productive.

And I think Kyle Canard is one of these guys that's being slept on as an edge rusher and he's gonna end up being like a Byron Young, a Kobe Turner, one of these guys that a key on White that ends up sliding maybe to the day two, second third round, ends up being one of the better pass rushers in this draft class.

You say, what Ted McMillan and not overthinking tet Before we get away from that well too much, there was a video that did pop up this past weekend on social media where he was talking about how he did not like watching football and he did not like watching film. Does something like that play a factor in to overthink because again, it's a factor, like Bobby said, that's outside of film, but it does have to do with the film, right.

Does that play a factor at all in the way that you look at McMillan and the way that he moves forward.

Well, you gotta find out does he is it? I just don't like watching football, or do you not love football? And I do think that that's an old video apparently that has surfaced that a couple of years, several years ago, so his mindset might have changed completely. And he didn't say I don't necessarily hate watching film. He just does it with the wide receiver group. He's not going to go seek it out necessarily by himself. So you talk about a guy that everything that I've been able to hear,

See Michael Parsons, Yeah, See Michael Mary Cooper, Yeah, see guys that you know. And this is a situation where if Ted McMillan didn't like football and you're watching his tape, you could tell that, yeah, you could tell. But but when you watch him, and right now we've got the highlights up of him just doing everything he can to get an extra yard or two, or to make a catch, or to sacrifice this body. You know, if you don't

You lose that edge when you don't.

But you know, if if I had to ask you, guys right now, power rank how these linebackers have played here with the Dallas Cowboys, Michael Parsons, Sean Lee, and Leyton vander USh, what order would you put those guys in?

Yeah, Michael would be at the top.

The other two guys watch film extensively, Yeah, all the time.

Yep.

But you just guys just told me that Michael Parsons was the best player. You know, so there are guys that play this game. I mean, if he didn't love the game and he came out and said, man, I'm just playing this so I can open my ice cream shop or become a doctor, you know, pay met for medical school, that's a concern. But you watch his tape. Don't overthink this, don't overthink this.

With this he doesn't look like like and I mean, obviously you don't want to totally interpret effort or other things based off the tape all the time, Like you don't want to say, oh, that person's lazy and a Baylor receivers used to run into that all the time, that's lazy when it.

Was scheme part of what the game was.

But I don't think when you watch tech Ncmillan play, like when you see him freelance and work back to the volunarer, different thing, that doesn't strike me as somebody who doesn't enjoy the game and enjoy what goes into it. And so to me, I think that he does. Does he show up like he looks like he studies all the time. That doesn't necessarily pop, But I mean he looks like a guy who is has a few for the game, enjoys it, enjoys playing it. Plenty of people

Yeah, like he do, Hey, come.

Go ask movie and twelve overall Pick City.

Lamba has something to do with that. Right. If you're a role player with no leadership in this locker room, then we may have something to talk about then. But there's gonna be like if it is McMillan and he's here, there's gonna be a clear peck in order that he's gonna have to answer to as a young dude, and we're gonna have to go from there. Michael Parsons, who kind of just rolls off the couch as a guy,

I think, and this is this is this young man, this is unfortunate. I'm gonna bring this up. I don't think Diggs is that type of guy. I don't think Diggs is a guy that's what we consider a guy that's just gonna grind out on film and all that. And he's a natural player. You watch him play, you can watch him be in position, you know, you can watch it. There's a lot of natural ability. But they're

You know.

There's some guys like huh, I can't believe you don't like film, And there's others like man that dude's got a lot of natural ability, you know, And so yeah, they're there are players in this league. And I brought up Diggs because I think Diggs is one of those guys that plays on a lot of feel you know.

I mean, but you could study.

But I'm I don't think he's one of those guys that's just kind of knocking it out every single day like that.

Like what, I prefer somebody who does it that way. Yeah, I would prefer something like John Lee everywhere. Un Sure some people can can probably get away with less work than others. And you know what I mean, there were probably.

I think Hunters that way in this draft. I think Hunter's I think Hunter is a player that plays with tremendous feet.

He's a field player.

I don't know that he's not putting the work though, to watch tape, I think he's probably he's a super high IQ.

Yeah, I think he's super smart.

But when you watch him run routes and you watch him cover that, that is not a great route right there. No, I mean that is not a guy that's that is that is a guy who is has been touched by God. Yes, and you know mom and dad and and he is that type of a player. I think if I think this, and we had this discussion on one O five three the Fan yesterday on the g Bag Nation, I think if Hunter played one position, he would be great. Playing two positions, you might not get his absolute greatness out

Is that is that where the lack of polish comes from? Because he's not a super polished corner either.

That's what I'm saying.

But how much I mean, you won you wonder how much does he really study? You know, you wonder and I'm not saying he's he's just completely doesn't do it. But I see a player when you watch him, when you watch him play the routes and stuff like that, they're not real. I mean a lot of it is kind of feel drive. I'm gonna turn it here, I'm gonna burst here, I'm gonna use my hands here. I mean there's things that he could do film wise to probably set guys up. I think he does it just by how.

He plays, and I think he like because again, he is a I love the kid. He's a full time player on both sides. With him being a full time player on both sides, maybe he's not. God is like, I don't know that I have much time to like sit here and like start studying down on my technique and mechanics as a corner, because I gotta go do some practice exactly see, so that can can split you up.

Agreed, but like I said, that's that's what I'm saying. He doesn't have the time to.

Because I don't know that there's a more naturally instinctive player at either people. And he's playing than an.

All field, all freelances well. And he's a damn good athlete too. He's one of the best we've ever seen. Yeah, the athletic ability helps him hide a.

Lot of THEA you can be a really hard worker and have no instincts, and and that can I mean that was I think that's for a long time what people felt like happened to Charles Tapper here. Outside of just the injuries, I think a lot of people felt like that guy worked, he was a good person, he had all the trades. He just had no instincts, And I think that was a big.

For that position.

It's hard to be that you can't play his position and not have instincts.

So would you rather have the instincts as opposed to a film junkie as we were talking about a moment ago, I mean, you would.

Like to have this, Yeah, he would love to have.

I can't teach instincts. Yeah, you have the feel or you have instincts. You don't I can teach you how to watch tape.

Yeah, film do it is awesome though, Man, I was just thinking about Leaf would have passed him because the boy I missed Lee, He's you know what I'm saying. Yeah, if he was healthy, Yeah for sure.

If Travis Hunter covered Travis Hunter for a full game, gets the better of him.

I Travis Hunder the receiver. Wow, Travis Hunter the receiver. I think Travis Hunter could be an All Pro receiver in this league. So you think he could be a better receiver than a corner.

I put him on my board as a receiver.

I mean the more I watched him play, and it all goes back to studying Shador Sanders. It all goes back to that and watching him play, and I there are times when shardor Sanders is in complete trouble and that guy bails him out. And so to me, if and I I know, watch and I haven't talked about this on our show, but I the more and we did these quarterbacks late and I started the more I watched. The more I watch, the more I watch him like that guy right there could be an All Pro wide receiver.

Would you say that the cornerback Travis is better now, but the wide receiver Travis has more room to gro.

I think I think I think it's the opposite. I think that wide receiver's better now.

The corner's got I think I think the the traits for him as a receiver are I think ridiculous for him to be an elite run.

I think he could do more damage to you as an opponent, sure playing wide receiver than he can't corner.

That's the nature of the position, though right there a certain ex Yeah you could not. He could.

He could do damage by not throwing his direction.

Yeah that could be. That could be.

But you watch him play down after down after down, Like I say, watch, and I got on these quarterbacks late. I feel like I got on him late. I'm sorry.

Watch.

I know I wouldn't watch.

You weren't gonna watch. And I respected that because I've been in your shoes. I've been in that guysh I do not want to watch these guys can. But the more you watch Door Sanders throw the football, you realize how special that number twelve is.

So Bobby, just to feel around the league, does anybody kind of agree with that sentiment about the wide receiver? Because I had him on my board.

I think a lot of people, I think a lot of teams.

I think I think there are more people that have him as a receiver than like to think he would be a better receiver. So it's split. I think there are some people who believe he's a better receiver. He's more valuable at corner, so we wouldn't playhim at corner. He's a better corner than he is a receiver. He's pretty split. We're gonna play him, But I think it's

I know the Patriots are good play at wide receiver. They're not gonna playm.

At Cleveland's talked about playing them at receiver.

But I fear as the Giants pick him at three, if you're a Cowboy fan, you.

Should fear that now you've got a hunter and neighbors that could be very scary yeah, then you'll see.

Yeah, then they picked mill Road and drop the second and away we go right, stop the run and the receiver.

That's be great. They couldn't complete a pass that would be helpful old school football.

Yeah.

Does this whole work hard thing matter more for the later round guys than the super talented dudes, Like if I got a second round guy he doesn't work hard, he's more likely to be a buzzed like a super talented you know, Travis hunt to type.

I think that goes back to what Zach was talking about.

You can't teach instincts, and a lot of times, if you have instincts, you're gonna go early in the draft, right, Yeah, because if you're not, you're getting knocked for certain elements, pros and cons of your game. And that's when you slide to the second, the third, the fourth round, and then get into Day three. I think if you have those instincts, and you have that and you can pair it with the tape and the relentless studying, then all

I think guys like Perish from Kansas State. I think Huzzy from North Carolinaup. I think who else had got that Mohammed.

If you're undersized, you're already kind of working with something a limiting go. Yeah, you better be studying.

You better be kind of figuring out how to do things because you you're talented for your position, you're kind of a specialist in some ways. But you better know who you're playing against now.

Because you're gonna have to, you know, make the team on special teams. Right, You're gonna have to put in the extra effort. You're gonna have to be able to make sure, hey, I can tackle, I'm coming in here. When you're one of these premier athletes, there's a reason you're probably being picked in the first round. Now, when it comes to being good versus great, the guys that might want to put in the extra time, they're gonna put in the film work, They're gonna stay after and work the jugs

That's where Nate Newton has talked about before. Where he found Margins was he he saw Troy Aikman work and he went, I don't want to let him down. And he's like, that was the biggest motivating factor he ever had to work was Aikman and the way that he worked. Yeah, and the way that then he was like, I can't let this guy down. I can't let this guy's work

I was just thinking about Terror Steele, right, Like he came from this offense where they throw the ball fifty times.

Yep.

But the coach said, oh, he work hard, you work hard, and now he can run black his as he's a run blocking offensive lineman. Now you know, I'm saying, brock Hoff and we as much as I rolled my eyes about up whole brock works hard. Oh, brock works.

But I think you just answered your own question because those are undrafted free agent guys, right, That's what I'm saying, that they got to work.

To get to where they're going.

Yeah, but we don't hear him saying about Tyler Smith. And this ain't me saying Tyler Smith don't work hard. Tyler Smith guy like God gifts. He just rolled out the big whoopen focus is probably a little different and.

He may work just as hard. He probably worked just right.

Type of stuff is gonna not that's gonna come second to you destroying guys at the line of scrimmage and absolutely blocking half of the defense half the time.

But that is also the difference between Tyler Smith being a second team All Pro and still waiting for Tyler Smith to click. It is because Tyler Smith works. And that's one of the things that the Cowboys worked on in the process was they went, all right, we know he's a good student, we know that he takes to coach, and he's young. This will come into place. Whereas if they didn't have that or he was into worker, you'd probably be dealing with a lot more frustrating places from

Can I throw one more guy and that that. Don't overthink my over just go and drafted one technique at twelve. Is that what you exactly?

Yeah, go ahead, Brian, get Dereck Harmon.

Don't overthink Baron, Baron, don't over don't overthink Texas Corner.

I like that.

Jean Lewison take it. He's been he's been a little guy here for eight years old.

Don't overthink that play. Please, don't over think that.

Any other names that you guys have out there that you don't want to overthink.

Jalen Walker, like in terms of just I know you can't figure out what to do with him necessarily. A lot of I know exactly what, Yeah, you know, but there's people who feel like he's tweener or whatever, like you know, position list. Figure you'll figure something out. He's a good player, You'll figure something out. So don't let that paralyze that worry you.

Though, when when guys remember the guy Simmons that was that clem has bounced around a little bit.

Does it were you that a guy like that? Though?

I mean, I'm just talking about we don't know what position.

Shack of all trades means.

We're not a linebacker in safety and then they don't play him either.

One in these Yeah, Jabrill Peppers ran into that for for a long time. But I mean that you for all those that you have, you also then have like Shaq Thompson who turns into a good football player. And so to me, I think Walker is just one of those where he's going to be a good football player. And I think that you shouldn't overthink him too much, don't prioritize him over a Travis Hunter or somebody else.

He reminds me of the rest of us.

Well, I mean we're on the phone, we're talking about player comps. The guy he reminds me of. Honestly, when I went back and looked at my notes and everything else. It's Cooper Cup. That's who he reminds me of. And I think he's got better speed than Cooper Cup. But the type of player he is, the way he tracks the ball down the field, the way that he works in zone, the way that he is, you know, slot specific, the type of build that he has, that is who

Is he a first round player in any other draft?

No?

I mean I have him top of the second.

I don't even have okay, because I know you you had you have first, right first for them the first, but you have Golden above him, right, Okay, But in any other draft, I take Bobby out of this because he's actually going We'll see if he's right last year's class, now, last year's class, any class, any last three classes.

Probably not no, probably not right? No?

No, okay, would you No? I'm just saying, I think to me, because he is the last guy. I mean, if I've got fifteen players, and he's likely either fourteen or fifteen when I stacked.

But heck, we had Alad McConaughey going around two last year, and that dude, Oh no, I mean so he I think, no matter.

What people would have been a really good player. But yeah, a couple of years ago, no doubt fifth that.

The other one that I threw out there is Donovan Jackson out of Ohio State, and we've talked about a lot of guards. Donovan Jackson to me, I ended up putting him as my last fifteenth first round grade. I just think he's a stuff. I think he's gonna end up being a really take Booker over Booker. Yeah, I just I just think he's a ten year player that's going to be really, really good. He's got better feet than Booker does. He can also move people off the

Pro no matter what's standing up on the table right there. No, I like it.

He can stand out to light. But he said the right thing. He's not as powerful as but not powerful. Okay, cool, I'll con see that anything.

I think his game overall, I like a little more. You like who you like.

That's cool, look a better, but you like who you like. I love Donovan too, though Donovan is a dude, and I love that football thing where you go, I'll play left tackle the car he.

Just stood left tackle.

Booker can't play left tackle. But if I'm drafting the guard, that don't matter to me, because you do that same thing with with the Banks. You'll go, oh, Banks is a guard, and then you'll go, but I got tackle tackle. But you will say, let men, may I finishing something something I didn't know because you were on the internet. You say, well, I'll put Banks at guard, and then I'll ask you, well, is Banks are better guard than Booker? And you will bring up Banks playing tackle, just like

I hate position flexibility.

You know that.

Oh well you well, we shouldn't be talking about uh uh Banks playing guard or.

And you're sticking.

You must just change your mind on that because you've be saying Banks at guard for a while.

No, I absolutely changed my mind on that.

Why you act like you? Why you act like you have no clue what I'm talking about? You had him at goal?

I absolutely no, No, I just flip flopped down.

So the consideration of him, I sure, I personally I don't. I'm worried about and play in either spot.

To be honest with you, I take that too. Lay film when is good exactly? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree.

All right, we got to take our first break when we come back. We got some Twitter on the twenty. Maybe one of these guys has Banks.

At a tackle or at a guard.

We'll see what they think overall, but send it your questions Twitter on the twenty.

More of the draft shows.

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Show Cowboys fans get ready for Draft Weekend, presented by Miller Lyte at The Star in Frisco. The action kicks off on Thursday, April twenty fourth with the Ultimate Draft Party continues on Friday with the Draft Hangout and wraps up on Saturday with the Draft Day five K presented by Baylor Scott in White Health, three days of football fun and fan experiences you won't want to miss. Visit Dallas Cowboys dot com slash Draft for details. Full weekend full of fun here at the Star and Frisk Go.

It is a great weekend you got to think about. So Saturday is when we got to get the breakfast tacos.

Yeah, at the breakfast tacos. Well, I'll take care of that.

I feel like it needs to be a rookie thing.

Now we're a rookie veteran.

Tom the Tommy and Hazen. Don't bother me, y'all.

Tommy's driving fifty miles away. I'm not drinking. I'm not eating cold breakfast burritos from Tommy.

So we could get him over here.

That's so far.

Oh, you're right, Yeah, him and Nick a far.

We'll they live in like Princeton. I'll tell you what this jersey about the third day. What I really like about the third day because I think that it's really kind of where you can dig in on some guys. It's something that's we're tuning in that hour before the

That might be the most informational hour of radio.

You could ask, Oh no, I mean, it really is a lot of fun, like getting to talk with Chris Vaughan Ross Whinch, like all the scouts are they're awesome, and then the position coaches like Londa Wells comes.

In just ripping with swag. We're the cowboy hat.

And then it's awesome when you get the position coach and they've drafted somebody in that position group and you kind of get a feel for like what is the vision, what's playing?

Well a lot of times you get the story too, why they were the track, why you end up doing that.

But it's a pleasure.

It really really super informative and and I mean I think we're like three years in a row running where we've made like a documentary from those clips, Like not us making the documentary, but like those clips have been used in some documents.

That's awesome across the board because it's it is.

It's an informational uh vast majority of that hour and it's a lot of fun.

All right, sign out for some Twitter on the Twitter now, I got a.

Question, Oh my gosh, you can't take over water. On the twenty me and Woodchuck was talking as I'm taking over Twitter.

On becoming and was just talking Derek Eagleton watching this right now, I hope back.

Listen, Well, we're all watching film and evaluating players, right and me and Brod has mentioned this for one week and we just didn't bring it back up.

Uh huh.

When a players played football for like five or six years and they only got one good year or like, damn, you been playing football and you still can't contain, You still can't do X y Z. They still get you on.

That, all these COVID guys.

How do you account for that when you're breaking down these guys, perfect example, Kara prinslely oh mam and yelling he almost got it, boy, he been he been playing football for a minute. Yeah, played in Florida and came on the old miss and they still take him off the field on rundowns and he's a great pass rusher, but they still don't trust him to do the fundamental football stuff. Right, But you've been playing for so long. What have you been doing some of those years?

Right?

So maybe just in the back of my mind we just talked about overthinking, maybe that accounts for something when I'm moving up and down on board.

No, it does, and I think the COVID years added an extra element into that, right, A lot of these guys and this is probably the end of thank god, but it adds an extra thing to where you've been in the in the college ranks for how long. I mean there are some guys. I mean you mentioned de Royo. I mean that's a player for me. It's like Darri Porter, the corner from Iowa State, Like, that's you guy. Now he converted from wide receiver to corner and he's the guy that I'm seeing is like a day two pick.

Yeah, yeah, but a lot of that's really what he was.

A lot of times we're quick to dismiss and Brian brings it up every once in a while, but we're quick to dismiss the transfer portal and how these guys bounce from one school next because it's just the norm now, right.

I think the same thing.

Can be said for these extra years of eligibility and along the way.

You just got to have to keep it in the back of your head when you're evaluating these.

Would you consider that? And I know you and I've had this discussion about Shuck. So the quarterback, why is he still doing that?

Now?

Says he's doing you know.

Yeah, seven years, a couple of broken collar bones, broken femur along the way, you know. I mean, is it is that seven years good for him? Are bad for him?

I think ultimately is gonna be bad form I think it's going to impact him negatively. But I think some team is gonna look at traits and they're gonna look at the idea that we don't know what the hell we're doing with quarterback in the first place. And he does at gamble on him. But but you know, but with his traits though, some team would be like, oh, that's a second those a second round.

He's the prototype.

Yeah yeah, yeah, but he thought the box to the other team for no reason. Yeah, and that'll be the reason why he'll probably be the Day three guy. So is its me something?

All right?

Day three?

It's eleven thirty six. We're gonna get to twitter on the sorry fotch on the twenty all right, everybody twenty Cowboys buzz on Twitter?

Once?

Another name one player we could see at twelve that's not considered a top position of need, keeping that.

Player or best player?

What everybody wants to draft a tight end.

As a conversation, whys quarterback out of Colorado?

Quarterback's not a position in need? R it is? You got Dak Prescott. I think you did today.

I think every other position you could say is of need. But if Shador Sanders is there at twelve. I think you've got to have that conversation, and I would take it.

What's player?

Whoa whoa?

Whoa?

Whoa?

What what was that last part?

I would I would take him, Sorry, Bobby, I would take him.

I think, yeah, what's the quarterback Cowboys?

This is this, uh, this specific question. We're talking about a player that could be there one one we think they realistically could take because they're not taking.

It or I don't think it's well but either jerial stance.

So we're so we're talking about players we think they could realistically take who are not considered a position. Correct, Yes, Tyler Warren, That's.

What I just said.

Yeah, that's that's tight end.

I mean I get more, I get more likely Fergie's not any good and you know, Bergie struggled with some He's a good player, he's a good player.

But that's what I'm saying, struggled last year, my guy.

I kind of feel like back to quick, I feel like Mason Taylor. If you need to take a tight end, look take him Mason Taylor.

But definitely take Mason.

Yeah, but I think I.

Think to be the you know what, Bobby, huh, forty four of them's got a great family.

Jason Taylor does a lot of stuff in the community, Thomas see you, and this doesn't work from five thirty to two.

But no, I I think I can say I everybody's about drafting Warren at twelve, and I you know, I like Warnt, but man, there's just and it answers the question because yeah, you would, that's a position that he would probably take, But you don't need I don't.

Think here's the problem. What don't they need right now?

Yeah?

I think you could argue like every spot, except they do have a quarterback on their contract.

That's why I just went through out your door.

So I have a quarterback and they have.

They might tell you that, they might tell you they don't need a safety, but even though they're bringing even they're bringing one in.

But is there a safety available at twelve that you would take? I mean, would you go up the twelve? No, I'm just saying just saying a position. Sure it is this saying a position.

But the Cowboys needing everything is the reason why I wouldn't draft Warn. I think tight end is just so luxury. You know what I'm saying. I can't pass on a great edge or a wide receiver or a corner for a tight end, is it. I mostly feel like quarterbacks elevate tight ends anyway, you know, like your tight end is kind of sort of what your quarterback is. Sometimes, you know, Bottles can elevate the raiders or whatever. He's special. For the most part, a nonsense tight end can be

And remember the connection that Ferguson and Dak had had when they were both healthy for an entire season.

I agree.

I think Tyler Warren's the first round player. I think he's a great prospect at twelve. I think there are other needs, I really do, And that's kind of where I'm at now.

I want to circle about three technique that's all day, every day.

Yeah, I think that's a need though, wouldn't it be well, I guess you have and Thomas right, Yeah, that would fit, that would fit.

That yeah, I just I wouldn't take one. What I'm saying, yeah, I.

Would Nolan then at twelve probably, and now I could see them maybe taking Walterland, but I'd rather go like Derek Harrimon or Kenneth Grant, like one of the one texts.

I agree. I'm just saying that three.

But you're right, Yeah, I would just take Mason Graham playing at one text sometimes and Solomon Thomas would just cease to exist from you, or just put him at five or something you like, if you have an opportunity to check Mason, if you just get.

Them, hey, maybe you move up and go get Mason Graham. You do a lot straight up.

You're trying to drafts all of our draft capital the Draft Show.

I'm trying to throw out some hubbing the water.

Yeah, what it is. I said this on the fan actually this past weekend. But the the thought process around Jerry having a conversation when Shador is there at twelve, if he had a.

Conversation for Johnny Manziel the.

Way, if Sanders is there, absolutely will No.

I'm just saying sure, yeah, they'll talk like I mean, just like they talk. Don't think it'll happen Yeah, I'm calling.

Bobby.

You think they would have Sanders over Ward.

M oh Man, I know most of the league does.

I don't know.

In fact, I know that there's a lot of people in the league who have Dart above Sanders and have Shuck over Sanders, and so I mean there's a lot more split opinions on Shudor. I feel like I just I think that they will probably end up having Ward higher, is what I would guess. But obviously Ward's not gonna be there. He's gonna be the first quarterback off the board.

Yeah.

John wants to know if the Cowboys were guaranteed to take a wide receiver in the second round. Sitting there at forty four, who would be the best fit for this team at wide.

Receiver at forty four?

Trey Harris best fit, Trey Harris's best you should make a case for I'd go Trey Harris at ole Miss. I've got him a little higher than Besh and I think he compliments Cede Lamb well. He does a little bit of different things than what CD, but we're.

Thinking the same type.

Right, Edgig, bigger body and bes Besch would be my second option to Trey Harris. There because I've got Jalen Royal Sandwich right in between them and my stack.

But Royle is a little bit of a smaller player, see, but you can put that rot and be okay.

No roy and Royal's He reminds me a lot of Steve Smith. I mean he's a thick build, explosive and in the open field. Uh, you can do a lot with him. He can play on the outside more than some of these other smaller slot guys. But Trey harry Man, I think he'd be a great compliment to see thee Lamb.

Physically, Hairs may be more impressive, but I think Besh and his route running in his feel, I think that's going to translate to deck a little bit better. That's just you know, that's just you know how from the Dallas connection and and oh we love a good story, Bobby.

Come on, man, you got the family ties.

Even though I got Besch higher, I got a two on Besh and a three on on Hairs. I just think Besh fits a.

Little better well on Heck, Besha does have l s U wide receiver history, and we as a freshman, we know how the LSU wide receivers.

So I'm not gonna fight it. You think I think I should.

They're not looking at the big receiver opposite because of Mingo.

I hope that ain't.

Do you think they're they're looking away from it?

You mean they're they're thinking that Mingo is their ex and they're gonna find somebody similar to.

How Lamb plays. If I had the slot player.

If I had to guess, the only guys that they're really accounting for is Lamb and Turping. If I had to guess, because tur just got money. But I would be gravely upset that they see, all right, we just going to lean into Mingo as big and maybe we'll get a depth piece of.

Goal backup plan.

Anybody want to bet lunch that that's when they get up there and talk, that's going to be the case that they're going to talk about Mingo When somebody asked a question about receiver, Mingo is going to be the first name out of their mouth.

I think I would.

I would agree with you, because especially this front office, they believe Mingo can be a guy.

Uh.

They traded a fourth round pick for him. I don't think they've given up on him yet.

I'm I'm playing CD in the slot so often that I don't think you have like a you know, permanent X or Z, and so I'm not necessarily like gung ho about like I need to go get the bigger body, the guy. I would get his Jalen Dole. That's why I'd go get in the second Jalen Dole.

We argued about him last week. I'm a fan. I think he's the better of.

The time if you want to talk about again checking every box that Brian Schottenheim was talking about in terms of establishing culture here, that's the guy. But like like I think when you look at the tape now, there's obviously he's available in the second round for a reason. There's there's stuff I think with his routefficient see and some of the Polish it's not great. But I think the the traits are off the charts. I think the

So Brian Mingo may keep them from going wide receiver in day two, there's no way that keeps them from looking at a wide receiver at twelve overall.

Is no See, that's the question I'm asking, That's the quest. I mean, I I think they would take McMillan.

I think, yeah, I would hope.

I would think we Why.

Do we have that? That's what I'm saying, Why do we have? Why is this a coin?

Flip?

Wise?

Because they're multiple needs. It goes back to the conversation we just had. What don't they need at twelve?

There's never gonna try to sell.

There's never a world they should sell. Me mean, oh yeah, we look, we passed the home and look, Mengo is the best player on our board. If we put, if we put.

They told they told me to say a top of the second round.

Guy, they will say that to us. I'm just hoping that they don't look at McMillan and go, oh, well, we're gonna go with the corner that Brian doesn't like because.

We got me Johnson.

Yeah, yea, yeah, yeah, that's a realistic scenario.

I'm just saying I'd be sick.

Okay, all right, we got to take our second break. When we come back. I've got some tell me more names. I want to hear some scouting reports on some lesser known guys, lesser names.

But I got two answers in my bad one of them.

Yeah, thanks fot you man three two of them from the fans, one from vat you got right after this.

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Look at magazine, absolutely wonderful, gorgeous. Got one hundred and ten bios and scouting reports in there. I want to add a couple of scouting reports here.

If you've got some time little tell me more.

As we wrap up this episode of the Draft Show, Brian, I'll start with you on this one. I want to hear about Jamari Harris corner from Iowa.

Yeah, Jamari Harris. Let me get to Jamori Harrison. He is the starting left corner for the Hawkeyes and he plays a ton of zone coverage. He's got length, He's a smooth player. There's a Twitter cheat element to his game. The reactions to his ability to read the routes and stuff like that. He could run the route at times better than the receiver and coverage. You think he's guessing, but he really really isn't.

He sees the.

Development of the play, he's on top of it, and the ball skills are outstanding. He's in position for overthrows. There's just when quarterbacks tend to be reckless with the ball. This guy is kind of in that spot. I will say this though. You know you have to be able to understand this guy plays sideways a lot and then he adjust his route ass or he adjust his coverage as the route comes off. He he only has adequate

But you know, you've you've.

Got to understand that this guy is really a zone player. He'll need some work as a man cover guy. If your scheme is really really zone heavy, this is your guy because he thrives playing this way six one, one ninety one and uh. But man, he will compete in the tackling aspect of it. And but like you say, it's it's really about being able to read and react, and that's what he does pretty well in his own coverage.

And he's also one of these older guys. He's gonna be twenty five in September. N he's a six year guy. Yeah, he started twenty seven games. But you're right, Like the double moves that can get him and you can pick on him underneath. Now he'll come up and tackle. But when he's playing off, that's what you'll see a lot of teams. They're just gonna get the ball out quick to him. Now he's got to come up and make the play.

It's always a little late too, Yeah, a little bit late.

But he'll try and bait quarterbacks like you're right, Like he is very instinctive looking and king on the quarterback, reading the eyes and then he'll come up there. I mean, tremendous ball skills and the arm length is there to be able to come in and strike as soon as the ball lands. So he is an intriguing day three option if you don't land a cornerback in day one or two.

He's instinctive. The awareness is really good. One hundred percent agree with everything Bright said about zone specific A guy who the top ends isn't there. The guy here reminded me of somebody here in Dallas who didn't play a time, but similar player coming out and some of the stuff we started in training camp. He reminds me a lot of Donovan Alumba when he was here. The same sort of like bigger guy, bigger build, without top end speed.

You probably just kill him.

In your eyes, he is Donovan Alumba. It's like I would have given donnov An Alumba more of a shot. I thought he was a good player, but zone specific, you're not do not. I would not throw him out there to play man coverage.

And it was the Comeback Player of the Year honoree for IOWA in twenty twenty three.

Suffered some injury in twenty twenty He.

Also got suspended two games for gambling. Did he at Iowa? Yeah, he was cutting a little.

I mean who hasn't. But hey, that's fine with me. Playing a little over under with you.

That might have been more or less like gambling gamble. He was like shooting dice zone.

No, I think it was like gambling. O.

Yeah, I guess taking the unders on IOWA offense like everybody else.

Daily Fantasy man get in all that? Why not yet, players, There's a lot of reason do not get in on it. Don't do that bad idea? All right, next one up, don't do bad idea. I forget me on the name pronunciation. I'm gonna look it up as you as you guys give it. But Jay Tuya or Toya Toya.

From is it Toya?

I thought it was Toya?

Is it Toya Toy? We'll go with Toya from UCLA interior defensive lineman. Who's got him?

I'll take it.

Yeah, massive noseman for the Bruins. He comes from a family of athletes, sure brothers, and he had a brother NFL player college players. This is a rugby family too, so if this he maybe has some little Jordan mile Lotta in his.

In his blood.

But he is from Tonga and and uh he has been a three year starter.

There's some initial quickness.

This guy six two three and forty two pounds, he could be a load to deal with inside. His first initial contact is pretty powerful and you kind of see blockers getting knocked back a little bit. And I thought the power and strenk was good. He's not a long arm guy, so he's just kind of there trying to eat up space in the way that he plays. His movement's not poor for his size, but you see him play down the line and up the field with chasing.

Uh.

He's got that nose tackle thickness to him. Will battle all kinds of blocks and he can cause problems as a pass rus or just on the penetration.

Part of it.

But if he has to start, stop then restart, he's likely going to get stuck along the line of scrimmage, and uh, I think that, you know, he has to keep moving in order to have a chance to make the play. Teams that run wide on him tend to give him more problems because he just can't get all

Is that the way an NFL team would look at him is if they're looking at him as a one tech and a guy that maybe could be a late day.

Three rotation mids, I'd absolutely look at Yeah, there's several times you watch him play. I mean in the USC game, the Washing game, I mean, he's like head up nose and you know he's he's controlled. Those guys have a hard time moving him in ways. But I could say he's kind of he's his when he could go forward, he's really good. When he gets that momentum, he's hard to stop. But as I mentioned, start, stop, then restart,

He moves pretty well for his size in the hustle and FX there.

I mean, he ends up getting rewarded on some hustle plays by circling back and making a sack or or or a tackle against the run. And he shows some good awareness against the screens, able to sniff out a screen in the Iowa game. That was pretty darn impressive.

I liked him. I liked him quite a bit as a Day three option.

So I have found his pronunciation on the UCLA's athletic website.

Heard Toya Toya Toya. There's three remember Saki, Siaka, Ika, brother Lash. Yeah they're related. Yeah, are they really? Yeah?

Okay, that's interesting. Yeah, Toya is how you say his last name? But uh, but Votch, did you have anything on Toya?

No?

I mean I haven't seen him. He was way at the bottom my list, man, my bed, I know.

You've seen Kevin what Winston, junior safety from sten State.

Tell me about him.

First thing. I want to, you know, look at when I see when I see these safeties, free safeties, I want to know ken they tackle and keviv Kevin went Kelvin Kevin Kevin Kevin Winston is a tackling fool, and I just stand up and clap every time I see him do it. But he's also a really good cover guy. You know, where there's one high too high, it's probably gonna be more of a too high kind of dude. I don't think he has the range to go from from one side of the field to the other numbers

He's an energy type of player, dude. He kind of kind of gives me like a little Earl Thomas vibes when you watch him. He's just a much bigger player than where Earl was and only one year of starting experience. But he can play all over the secondary. He he's got range, he can cover the slot, deep freeze you mentioned their vatch, can also play in the box. Consistent tackler, short area of quickness, explosiveness to make plays in space.

Uh.

The only negative really is he can be a little over aggressive, like he might He might just over pursue because he comes in like a Tasmanian devil overruns a play. But Kevin Winston Junior I was a huge fan, just was injured Week two of last season in practice, missed the whole season. So there's some injury background that you've

Yeah, got the second that's yeah.

And coming off of an injury like that, Like you said, it was a partially torn ACL. It's the season suffered again against Bowling Green. We were watching Fan and Junior the tight end, and he was going up against them for a little bit.

Yeah, we ended up getting hurt. Uh, that's a high that's a high IQ player.

By the way, I gotta watch him back, I guess because I watched him Luwaga and I did not see I did not see free at all. I think it's the best we're gonna talk about here. But that's a strong exclusive to me, that is a strong safety. Play him downhill, do not have him in coverage, is what I saw.

Yeah, great athletic build, sure tackler closing speed showed on tape as some of the notes that I've got. I didn't see a ton of vision. I didn't see that footwork and that that instinct that going downhill, kind of like what Bobby's saying.

I didn't see a ton of coverage there.

I watched him against West Virginia, and then I took the twenty twenty three tape against Rutgers in Ohio State looked at him a little bit there. I think he can play downhill better than anybody. Maybe not better than anybody that's probably too much so, but probably up with the better safeties in this draft.

I think cover tight ends. I mean his length, in his size, he could got. I saw a guy that can flip his hips and be able to run with receivers. But like I said, we'll have to see how the knee injury hurts his mobility on that especially change of direction.

A little bit questionable there.

Jake Brenning Stool we talked to him and tight end out of Clemson during our time at the senior ball.

Why did you make that?

I tell you what, man. When I was watching film on the first thing I thought was, boy, maya mccarthur lud his kid. They run some hitches and slants over there.

Boy, Yeah, they do a lot of misdirection with him.

A lot of run around the circle, run through the line of scrimmage, and get magically open some of those places. I hate those those plays you kin him open. I hate that, But most of his plays are we gonna run some hitches, We're gonna run some slams, were gonna run some hous. That's really what it is. Doesn't really have a have a deep game to him, you know. He he could be a somewhat yeat guy, like if he get a couple of steps, but they tackle him. For the most part, I didn't think he was. He

Him Ergatston.

Uh, Syracuse. Yeah, I put gasing over him.

It's a run day. Yeah, I play touching tags for me, but I have brending stool a little bit better.

I liked it more than you did. At six six two forty one. Like he's a guy that I think can run the same. I think he can give you something down the field. Uh and first six six guy, He'll go down and catch some balls that are low on him too. He'll dig something out of the dirt for you. But you're right, he's used a ton in misdirection and you do see him engage in climb to the second level. He just doesn't have a ton of power, and there's not a lot of bend there either, because.

He's such a tall guy. He's only two forty.

But I mean to be yeah, he needs to put on some power, put on some weight. But as a number two tight end, that will develop over the course of his career. He could end up developing into an impactful player.

He's a good route runner too, for a tight end. I thought he ran routes pretty well. He's a big play threat. They used him over the top quite a bit. Did anybody watched the SMU game.

Miami, Wake, Forest and Georgia.

That's a bad thing about tight ends two.

He got tossed around pretty good in Get Yeah, our end roberts yet couple of times he's.

Tough because he he looks like a receiver. He looks like a big receiver out there. He's not athletic enough to be a big receiver at the NFL level. Correct, that's the biggest thing. You play Gats in a big receiver then, I mean he's a Tweeners, so I mean probably I could see him playing big receiver. I could see. I think there's flexibility with Gats. The thing here with him,

I wrote in here that he.

Looks like a big receiver, doesn't have the athleticism or polished to transition. I think the lack of athleticism keeps defenders in his pocket pretty consistently, causes some some suffocation in man coverage. He sits down in his own he's pretty aware. He's good there are But I don't think you can just say, like, all right, that's our starting to I don't think that's going to be a guy he develops into at any point.

No, it's a good point.

And the guy that I compared him to when I was looking at the film and looking back at notes was Harrison Bryant from a couple.

Of years ago.

You remember sure six foot five, kind of undersized, slender build to him, and and Bryant to your point, Bobby never really stuck around to tight end, hadn't played very well with Cleveland still in the league. Currently, he's with the Eagles now he's this backup currently in Philadelphia, but was.

With the Raiders last year.

He's been on that to roster, but he's been a backup tight end and hasn't necessarily developed into a big play threat like they thought maybe out of the fourth round that they drafted him out of fau back in twenty twenty.

I compared him to Doreel green Beckham with tease taber speed.

That's what I okay, okay, well.

Missuri Missouri, you love you loved Doreel greenback if we all did.

I was looking at you, Bobby, and I was like, everybody's.

Entitled that's twelve years ago that day.

All right, that's gonna do it for us here on the Draft show. Hope you had some fun with us here with this next or this last hour.

When we come back on Thursday, will officially be three weeks out from the NFL Draft. It is coming up very very.

Quickly for Zach Wolchuck Bryan brought us watch from Barty Bobby Belt with Chris Beam and the back of Kyle Yeomans saying so long.

We'll see on Thursday with more of the Draft show.

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