Draft Show: Final Senior Bowl Thoughts

just eighty one days away. April twenty ninth is when things kick off in Cleveland, Ohio, and it's starting to get to be crunch time because well the Senior Bowl is in the rear view mirror. The heat is starting to get turned up on these front offices, and the same thing goes for the Draft Show. Jeff Kavanaugh, We've got Kevin kat Turner, Dane Brugler from the Athletic. I'm Kyle Yelman's just trying to drive the bus as always

here on this show. And gentlemen, the like I said, Senior Bowl in the rear view mirror, we talked about it a little bit on Tuesday with Bucky Brooks. Brian brought us and David Hellman and had a great conversation about kind of the Cowboys feel with it. I kind of want to get in to some of the prospects today. We're gonna talk a lot about the quarterback position. We're

gonna talk about the corners as well. In that secondary we can the Cowboys find their type of corner, and by type of corner, Jeff Kavanaugh has a different idea of what type of corner he potentially wants to see as a Dallas Cowboy. But Dane start us off by kind of giving us your final general thoughts in terms of the Senior Bowl. What you took from the week down in Mobile. It was definitely weird. It was definitely different, and you know, that's different than what we're used to.

But at the same time, I'm very thankful that we had it. You know, all the credit the Jim Nage and his staff for we're being able to pull it off um and a safe environment and gave the team's opportunity to look at these guys even more, and it also gave a lot of these players the opportunity to help themselves and we are we touched on it, you know, last week a little bit just you know, some of

the risers guys that helped themselves. But some of these players, you know, we we're gonna look at them totally different now compared to uh, you know, a week ago because of what they were able to do. Quinn Miners from Wisconsin, Whitewater being you know, one of the biggest risers, a guy like Richie Grant who I had a third round grade on him, loved them coming into the week after seeing him live and up close like that, he's going in the top fifty. That's you know, you gained a

different bandage point. I think seeing these guys live, at least for me, and that's you know, my process and the way I look at these guys. Um, you know, but a lot of other players helped themselves. D Escridge from Western Michigan. Um, you know, it's just it's a loaded group of slot receivers in that second to fourth round range. How were these guys guys gonna really shake out in terms of how they're gonna be stacked? And

you know, Dskridge and Marie Rogers and Shy Smith. The guys that were down there, Kaye Johnson, they were able to make, you know, kind of a statement like why they should be a little bit higher. So just a really productive week and I think we have a better feel for these players now than we did before the

Senior Bowl. Katie. Yeah, I would say my thoughts, and I don't want to be a jerk, but if I was a cornerback, I would not go to the Senior Bowl ever again because all the wide receivers are really good. And I'm kind of kidding, I'm sort of kidding a little bit, but it was amazing how you know, you go into the week with an eye on cornerbacks and you just get distracted by all of the wide receiver talent. And I'm in this world right now. I don't know

how you guys look on your boards. And I know on the Thursday incarnation of the Draft Show, we haven't done a lot of wide receiver talk yet, partially because the Cowboys are kind of set there. But I'm sitting there going, Okay, am I really gonna have fifteen? Am I really gonna have twenty wide receivers in the top three rounds? Like there's a lot of separation on the

draft board. I'm gonna have to figure out because I've as I continue to work through the wide receivers, I'm going, okay, well, there's enough about him that I like that I would consider him a top one hundred pick. And I end up going, oh my god. And then meanwhile I can wait, going okay, well, what cornerbacks really impressed me? Keith Taylor was great in the game on Saturday. Keith Taylor, the cornerback from Washington. I'm not sure I loved his tape.

In fact, I can tell you that I didn't really like his tape. But he was moving a little better at the Senior Bowl, and you're asking yourself, Okay, how do you balance that out? Did he just improve? Like what happened? So I'm more confused at quarterback maybe than ever based on the guys who were at the Senior Bowl. But man, that wide receiver position, I'm in love. I would never sign a wide receiver again. I think I'll

just continue to draft him. They're incredible. That's a good point point because I thought throughout the week it was impressive for some of those corners that ended up playing decently well. I mean, you mentioned Keith Taylor. I thought he had a poor week to practice, and I'm right there with you, Katsie. I don't like his tape that much. I mean I had like a late third round grade on him in terms of his tape. But he played really well in the Senior Bowl. I mean there were

guys like, oh man, I'm blanking on their names. Oh, Trey Norwood and Trey Brown, both out of Oklahoma. I thought they had decent weeks of practice, and then I don't think they played very well. So overall, I think you're looking at the cornerback position as something that is kind of wishy. Watch you when you go up against those receivers that are as talented as the wide receiver group was down in Mobile. Now, Jeff, what were your

kind of thoughts on the week. Did you agree in the fact that some of these corners just didn't show out the way that you thought they would well. I think I would think that NFL teams no going into this that it's really hard because in the real world, it's not all that often that you're legitimately going to be you guy all by yourself, and he can run a drag all the way across the field five yards and it's like, oh, good luck. So I think NFL teams know that it's advantage wide receiver in the one

on one drills. But I think guys like um melifon Wu from Syracuse, Aaron Robinson, Central Florida, I think there were dbs that that helped themselves throughout the Senior Bowl practices. So I wouldn't I wouldn't be terrified to go there if I was a dB, I would just know that you're gonna go there and it's gonna be what you're used to in practice settings. One on one is hard and you gotta you gotta really believe in yourself and

go ball out. But there's there's there's opportunities to make plays. And I thought some of those guys, did Dan, do you agree? Yeah? I thought Trey Brown was one of those guys who he's five ft ten on a good day, but his competitiveness that he played with was awesome to watch during practice. Really impressed with what he did. Yeah, I mean, I agree with Jeff, and it's I think that it's you're as a corner, You're expected that you're probably gonna have a tough time, You're gonna get beat.

So if you do make a play, teams, you're gonna remember that. And so I think you take your chances and you go there and compete. And you know, we saw it, you know this year where the guy like like like I said, with Trey Brown, I thought helped himself as a he projects probably as more of a nickel, but a guy that coming out of Senior Bowl week, teams maybe have a little bit better opinion of what did you think of MVP or offensive MVP of the

Senior Bowl Kellen Mond. And I know a lot of fans around here want to hear about Kellen Mond because they just grew up Aggie fans. I mean there's a lot of Texas and Maggie's around this state. And I know with Kellen Mond, there's been kind of wishy washy whenever it comes to his thought process, the whenever it comes to his draft rating. I mean, the inconsistency is on the field and off the field with him in terms of the grading of him and the scouting of him. Dan,

what did you think about him throughout the week? And ultimately Coleman in that MVP outing during the game. But I kind of want to just hear about what he did at the Senior Bowl. I think it mirrored what we saw on tape for his career at A and M. And the thing that just bothers me the most with hitting with Mind is I could show you a clip from or a game from his sophomore year and then show you a game from a senior year and it looks like it was, you know, the same same guy. Yeah,

I just I think the same level of inconsistency. He's clearly talented. Clearly he's got, you know, a good arm, he can move around a little bit, He'll make some really impressive throws. His highlights are as impressive as anybody's. But when you talk about the full scope, the body of work, I just see the same player that we saw as a sophomore that we're seeing as a senior. And we saw during practice up and down with his decision making, up and down with his placement down the field.

So it's easy to look at his highlight tape and say, Okay, yeah, this guy can play. But when you look at the full body of work, it's just it's just a back and so I find it really hard to get excited about any of these senior quarterbacks. Uh, there's not a there's not a single senior quarterback that I'm really overly excited about. And you know, Man's kind of in that mix with with Jamie Newman and you know the rest of that group that probably gonna go somewhere on day three.

It's just, uh, you know, hard to guess exactly where. It's just gonna come down to teams and their preference and exactly what they're looking for. You're still not very excited about mac Jones either. Well, I don't consider he's not a senior, so you know, he's all the underclassmen I can I can get there, even Davis mills from Stanford. I there's something there. And I you know, I think that there's a little bit of optimism for a Davis

mills Um. You know, I think he's got a good chance to be drafted ahead of Kyle trask Um and because he's got starter potential. So and mac Jones, he I thought he helped himself by being there. I think the obvious connection now is going to be with the Panthers. Matt Rule couldn't help but rave about mac Jones, the way he handled himself during practice behind the scenes, his leadership,

the way guys follow him. It's going to be interesting to see how that might play out on draft day with the Panthers having a lot more intimate knowledge of mac Jones and how he's wired compared to some of these other teams that are looking at quarterbacks in the draft.

So's it's a really interesting group of quarterbacks this year where the first six drafted might all be underclassmen than the other you know, three or four drafted could be seniors, Jeff, whenever it comes to the quarterback position, I mean, we're talking about these senior quarterbacks, but I mean it's a it's a very heavy field. Whenever you look at Trevor Lawrence, Justine, Zach Wilson, Trey Lance, all of which that will probably

go inside the top ten. And now there's been rumblings around Dak Prescott and of course we're coming down to the wire. I mean, the transition tag period starts in nineteen days and it ends a couple weeks after that or three weeks after that, So ultimately your clock is running out on Dak Prescott if you're the Cowboys right now.

And Brian broad Us has said this previously on the Tuesday show that once that time starts clicking and it starts taking a little bit further down, and you have to franchise Dak Prescott, you're gonna have to start talking about one of these quarterbacks. But which quarterback would you want to talk about? If you were the Dallas Cowboys. Oh, I would like to quote the great Kevin Turner if I could, let you know. He's pretty good at this stuff.

I hate, I hate quarterbacks. So if you are the Cowboys, what you should do is sign your top eight quarterback in the NFL. You should have done that two years ago, one year ago, and then you should do it again. Now. Now if because you are the Cowboys front office, you've screwed this up so royally that now it's gonna be really, really hard because Dak's like, well, I'm on the doorstep to free agency, so you're gonna have to blow me away. And Jerry's still like, hey, you signed what we offer

you and that's it. And yeah, you may have to look at a guy because you have a top ten pick. And I think realistically you're gonna be talking about either Justin Fields, Trey Lance, or Mac Jones because just going off of what we hear and what we're seeing. I would imagine that Zach Wilson and Trevor Lawrence are gone, and then it's kind of the wild card what is the order and how quickly do they all go? Because I could totally see a scenario where five quarterbacks are

gone when the Cowboys pick. I could see that, yeah, But I think we also have to acknowledge it's possible that two quarterbacks are gone when the Cowboys pick. It's the weirdest top of a draft that I've seen in the seven years that I've been doing this, because I don't know if you're like, if you're not sold, there's teams in the top five or in the top eight that there's at least four or five of them that

I think should take quarterbacks. But if you don't believe in the guys that are available this year, then you're not going to because all of these teams have other options they could roll with. So if you're the Cowboys and it's Hey, which guy are you keeping an eye on? I guess the most likely answer would probably be Trey Lance North Dakota State, And that would be wild to me.

If the Cowboys were like, Hey, we're gonna move on from a top eight quarterback in the league because this guy's got a big harmonies athletic and maybe you could be good one day. So Cowboys, sign your quarterback. Come on the magical mystery ride with me real quick. I'm coming to you now as half myself, Kevin Turner and

half the Dallas Cowboys. And the fact that we're even talking about this already tells you that the Cowboys are pretty comfortable being lucy goosey at the quarterback position, because otherwise the deal would have already been done, like it just would have been done. And I don't want to hear the stuff about Dak's side and what they're demanding. There's a market value. The deal could have been done and should have been done, all right, And that's the

end of that. That being said, after taking a full dive, I carved out some special time to really go through all few of the games that we have of North Dakotas day. My quarterback too this year is Trey Lance, and I am so comfortable with that. I'm kind of I'm kind of in love with the guy again. I'm willing to be loosey goosey at the quarterback position, I guess right, because I mean, I think Dak should be

your quarterback. But if we're gonna get to this point, this hypothetical area that we're talking about, which would even have us talking about a quarterback, that I'm doing whatever it takes to get Trey Lance on my team. If I'm the Dallas Cowboys, he would have an ideal one year to sit while Dak is on the tag and then we are ready to go. I think his ball placement and armed talent is just as good as as

Zach Wilson's better than Zach Wilson personally. I think the way that he has he feels pressure in the pocket, like anyone can play when the pocket's clean, right, but when he can fill it in the pocket, And that's something that I didn't always see with Justin Fields. A little escapability. Yeah, I can kind of kind of move around. I didn't always feel it. Trey Lance feels it. And for a nineteen year old to have that season he had, he looked pretty advanced. He didn't look like a nineteen

year old. And I understand Division two, I get all that stuff, But if we're if we're rolling dice anyway at the position. That's my guy, because there's a whole other dynamic. He adds. Watch the James Madison game from twenty nineteen, which he only throws the ball like fifteen times that game. He runs the ball thirty times in that game. Is the new GM that game an entire other to the game? Yeah, twenty nineteen, he would be in that game, right, Trey versus the news, that's that's

that's fascinating. Uh, is your guy? No, it's very boord. I mean, you talk about a guy, and I like Trey Lance, but I mean we have to recognize just how unprecedented of an evaluation this is. The guy has seventeen career starts, all versus FCS competition. Uh. You look at his college resume and the stats just on paper look great eight but you know many times he trailed in the second half of a game in his career once. Like,

there's so much about him we don't know. There are so many one read and then run type of plays on his film where he's not making full read or full field reads. He's not going through progressions things like that. You know last year, this this great season that he had which was statistically great sixteen to those season national title fcs. He averaged in his career eighteen point six pass attempts per game. Meanwhile the running game, they averaged

forty five rush attempts per game. At the North Dakota State, they leaned on that rush, that run game. That's that's what their offense is based off of, and then they would, you know, uh, pass off of that. So I love the traits. I think that the poise that he shows is really impressive. You know, the competitive nature that he has. I like, but there's just there's so much about him

as a quarterback that we don't know. And maybe he'll get there, but I mean we have to recognize just how big of a risk that it is, not not just you know, moving on from dak and going to a new quarterback, but moving on to a new quarterback that is so we just there's so many unknown variables right now. I mean, for me, I'm a Zach Wilson guy. I wrote about it back in October. I took a lot of heat when I said he's, you know, right there in the mix to be quarterback too, behind Trevor

Lawrence UM. But I think more people are catching on that Zach Wilson is he's legit and I think, you know, when I quarterback, it's such a hard position to evaluate, and you know, I've had plenty of misses doing this, so you know, don't. I am not like the final voice on on these quarterback prospects. But something that I really look for is the ability to make the great spontaneous decision. That's a that's an old Bill Walsh thing. You want guys that can make that spontaneous decision and

create and to me, that's Zach Wilson. His ability, his feel for throwing off platform, his field, for ball placement down the field, He's naturally accurate. He's got a whip of an arm. I wish you were a little bit bigger. There's some durability concerns there, uh, you know, just that narrow, narrow frame. But you know, and sometimes he'll play an overdrive, he'll you know, bail the pocket before he needs to. Mechanics get a little wild that that that's part of

his game. But he has a natural ball placement to him down the field. I think there's a lot you can do with Zach Wilson. I think he's the clear number two quarterback in this draft, but it's it's just a really intriguing group of pastors because they're all really really talented, and you know, they could all end up being starters in this league. Just to play Devil's advocate here, Dane, and you were talking about with Trey Lance and his competition and the unknowns, and there certainly are a ton

of unknowns coming from an FCS level regardless. But with Zach Wilson, are there not still a ton of unknowns? Because he had one good season? I mean, yeah, yeah, the decent year twenty nineteen, but I mean his completion percentage went from sixty two to seventy three in one year and then all of a sudden, he's a top two quarterback in this draft, behind Trevor Lawrence. But he also played kind of lesser competition than the guys like a Justin Fields and a Trevor Lawrence and a Kyle

Trask and a Mac Jones. Because you look at by US competition, Troy Navy Louisiana Attack UTSA, Texas State, North Alabama Coastal Carolina was their toughest game. I think overall, there's still a lot of question marks around Zach Wilson. White is Zach Wilson more of a lock than a maybe a Trey Lance. Well, I just think we know more about Wilson, and I mean, you're absolutely right in terms of the level of competition, But I also think there's a pretty big gap from you know, talking about

Troy compared to the Missouri Valley Conference. Yes, yes, level, And you know that's just the facts. Nothing against that level of camp. It's just there's there's a different competition level in terms of talent. So, you know, Zach Wilson and I think, you know, he also benefited from a strong run game. A strong run game, reliable targets to throw to a good offensive line. So yeah, absolutely, I don't. I don't think Zach Wilson's a sure thing by any means.

I just I'm a more believer, more of a believer in his talent um. I think we've seen more, we know more about him compared to uh, Trey Lance. And then you know, let's just throw Justin Fields into the mix, you know, so we can you know, talk about him as well. I think that there's a lot to like about him from a physical perspective. Uh, you know, he's I think he's a naturally accurate guy. We saw that

in the Clemson game. When when he's in rhythm and everything is going right, the play design is where it needs to be. He looks outstanding. But when that first read's taken away, or you know, the defense does something with their coverages or their blitz that he hasn't accounted for, that's where the play breaks down. And that's where he needs to have a better plan B, C, and D and play with more urgency if he's going to make

it at the next level. But I think the intangibles, the athleticism, the accuracy, it's all there for fields to make it. It's just he needs to get over that hump when it comes down to making that spontaneous decision. Like I mentioned, was Zach Wilson. Hey, hey, Jeff, can I run something by you real quick? Because another thing I want to throw in about really just the position in general. And I do think the Cowboys will get a deal done with Chach. I think they will do

it reluctantly. But if they don't, that tells you that they didn't value their investment. Okay, since I can do let a top eight quarterback in the league walk, well, then I've got no problem. Let my quarterback run twenty times a game if he needs to. And Trey Lance is a guy who I think could probably do that for you. I guess I'm done looking for the perfect passer. Now,

I'm done looking for all that. If my team right here is not going to go ahead and go full forward the investment because they want to sign the running back in the linebacker like that, that's kind of where I kind of go. Well, apparently I don't need to worry about developing this guy into some you know, long term thing, and I don't need this guy to be

a fifteen year quarterback for me, which is ideal. Ideally you have that guy who's your quarterback for ten and fifteen years and he becomes an excellent drop back passer and all those things. Right, Well, if you're just not gonna sign the guy because you don't believe it giving him that much money, because you don't believe it giving him market value, then screw it. Treat the quarterbacks like the running backs, then Burnham, who cares? What do you think about that, Jeff? I mean, I dig the idea

of unleashing the running quarterback. I think it's fun. I love watching the Ravens play. I don't know how Amari Cooper and Ceedee Lamb would feel about it, probably because you know, I also I also like to feel to throw the ball. So you know, a quarterback who's gonna run like what does Lamar do? Probably fifteen times a game, give or take. I think it's fun for winning. I think it's a good way to be consistently good. And if you're never going to pay a quarterback, I don't

mind that approach. But I've got a team that's got some really good receivers and a really good quarterback. So but Kat, your love for Trey Lance makes me think I'm cool with him and we can we can rock with him because I believe he can throw. H. We don't have to risk our guy fifteen times a game, do we. We don't have to to do that, Okay, yeah, but I don't paint the picture that he's like Jet Yeah, we could and could. I don't want to paint the

picture that he's like not a throwing quarterback or whatever. Like, uh, and we all, I mean, I don't know. I don' want to speak for everyone, um, but I think we all kind of thought Lamar Jackson, we knew we had work to do in the passing game, but I think we all thought he might continue to take a step forward,

maybe not have that regression. You kind of go look at their wide receivers and in Baltimore like no offense, but like they brought in Dez Bryant, they were that desperate, like, yeah, they need a little more a few more weapons out there to kind of help him out a little bit. But like, I don't like, I don't think those are like I want to be careful when we talk about other players like that we're not talking about a comparison. A couple of things about Trey Lance that early jumped

out to me. And again, I'm talking about a nineteen year old, and I'm talking about a guy who ideally doesn't play again next year. Hopefully we get a preseason game and maybe he can play then, but I hopefully he gets time to sit behind someone for one year at least. And one thing that I think about with Trey Lance, some little things just like playing off of play action because they did run a lot that was very helpful for him, are throwing on the run and

things like that. You can see that and see those skills and then along with when you have you know, blitz is coming from the blind side, just when you're when you can't see it, to fill it and know it and step up out of it. Just looks very comfortable doing that. And those are the types of things that I really love. When the guy's keeping his eyes downfield, when he's in the pocket and moving around, and I understand some of the things that Dame was talking about.

You know, we're we got to make sure this guy can throw with the right amount of anticipation and things like that. How accurate is he on the five yard drag? You know, all day long, you didn't see a ton of that, and a lot of his throws are throwing it down the field quite a bit. You know, you want to see a little more accuracy and a little more consistency, and quite frankly, more tape. In general, you

want to see more tape. But I am I'm pretty smitten with my guy, Trey Lance right now, and I think based on what I've heard, and I don't know the guy, so if I could text you, I would, But I think you've got a guy who's got a pretty good football IQ and things like that. Who who's going to be uh, you know, I don't want to be Jen Jason Garrett here, but you know, kind of right, kind of guy type type of thing. You hear those things,

so I think that's good. But we heard those things about Carson Wentz too, So yeah, it's the same program. Last think I'll say about this, last think I'll say about these quarterbacks is that I think this year, more than more than ever, with these this group of quarterbacks, it's going to come down to the interviews, you know, when just to figure out where are they in their mental development? How much do they know, how much do they not know? How much are they able to learn?

How those interviews go are going to be just paramount when they throw out the tape on and they say, okay, well what are you looking at here down in distance? What's the coverages? You know? Are you setting the protections? What are you doing? Okay, this read's taken away? What is your what is your outlet? What do you what's

your thought process? Right now? Just going through all of these positive and negative plays and to get a better feel for where they are mentally, that more than that's that's the key every year that we're not really we don't have access to that information, and it's you know, it's a big missing piece of the evaluation process for those of us on the outside when evaluating quarterbacks, but more so than ever because college offenses are getting easier and easier to operate, and so I think for a

lot of these quarterbacks they're less prepared for the NFL where and so for these the interview process, it's going to be important for them to really understand the questions that are going to be asked and to be ready for Yeah, and it's going to be virtual this year because of everything that's gone on with COVID nineteen. So add an extra wrench into it is how how these virtual interviews are going to go. They did a lot of that last year as well because there were no

thirty days. It's because there was no Dallas Day. But it's gonna be much of the same this year. So hopefully the Cowboys in really everybody around the league able to evaluate the right way. And just one thing added on onto what Katie and Jeff we're talking about before.

We had to break here really quickly, but the fact that you have Kellvin Moore as your offensive coordinator, Katie, makes me think that your theory of running the football with your quarterback may be debunked just a hair because he doesn't like running the football a whole lot. You can kind of see that as a former quarterback himself. They like to throw the football, and so I think Trey Lanz can certainly do that. But you're not gonna run a thirty times a day. So I guess Jeff,

you can. You can rest easy at night thinking that Trey Lance wouldn't run at thirty times in a game every single time, but one of the quarterback. Yeah, I agree. Let's let's sign Dak and not have to worry about that. I agree. Let's go to break. When we come back here on the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show, we're gonna talk about a little bit of Twitter on the twenty. We've got some great questions coming in from you guys

on Twitter when we return right after this. There's nothing as unique as our eyes, which is why Selor pioneers ways to make lenses as unique as you. Varilux for super sharp vision, Essential Blue for protection, and Crisolve for freedom from glare, three cutting at solutions and a single unique lens, so whatever your needs insist On Selor, visit your local slor experts and find a perfect lens for you.

Seymore do Moore Selor. Since eighteen sixty five, Stetson hats are American made with pride right here in Texas, and Stetson is proud to be on the field with America's team. Want to show your Texas and team pride too, You can by purchasing your own Stetson. You can look just like how the flag guys do on field at every home game. Stetson hats the official crown of all self respecting Cowboys and your favorite football team. Get yours today shop dot Dallas Cowboys dot com or at Stetson dot com.

I'm Jay Novachek, former tight end for the Dallas Cowboys back in the day. I was a guy who always got the tough yards, and that's why I run with John Deer today. In fact, I have a John Dear three zero twenty five E tractor that can handle any yardwork I need to do, even the tough yards way out back. So if you have one acre or a thousand, John Deer has the equipment that's just right for you. Visit a John Deer dealer today. And run with us.

We are the official tractor provider of your Dallas Cowboys. Here it's nineteen o eight. Don't you think we should get electricity and stop using candles to see it night? It's just electricity lights up the room fast, It's more reliable than candles blowing out, and people seem to love it nationwide. Well, candles, DA, did you just run into the wall. I have a new candle please. Historically, switching to new technology is a no brainer. Today it's AT

and T five G fast, reliable, secure and nationwide. Switch to AT and T five G. It's not complicated. Five G requires compatible plan not being your areus he att dot com slash bog for you for details. Is the Dallas Cowboys dot com Draft Show? Back here with a second segment to hear the Dallas Cowboys dot com Draft Show. We've got Kevin KT Turner, Jeff Cavanaugh, Daan Brugler. I'm Kyle Yeomans as always here on the Draft Show every Thursday at ten am Central time. Glad you uh you

guys are along for the ride. So now we've got some time to hit up these Twitter questions and go into some Twitter. On the twenty on the Twitter, Chris Beam in the back punching the buttons and doing a fantastic job as always. Okay, we're gonna start things off with John Marshall on Twitter. He says, I want the team to fix the defensive tackle position. I want to also add to that, John, So do we all? We all want that to happen, he says, And Dan Quinn's defense.

Is Tristan Hill and Evil Gallimore more suited to a three tech or more of a pin trading one technique? And what are the top defensive tackles on the board? Who can feel each of those roles? Jeff Cavana will start with you. Oh, I think, to me, both Tristan Hill and Neville Gallimore are guys that are your rotational three techniques that you're gonna line up over the guard.

I don't think either one of them is a guy that you necessarily want having to battle double teams because I don't think either one of them is going to handle it very well. So to me, I think in this draft, if you're looking for a defensive tackle, I'm looking for the big boys, and it's a really interesting group.

Because I will agree with Dane that I think to me, Christian Barmore is the best defensive tackle prospect because I think Alabama, because I think he offers both where I think he is powerful enough to play the run and battle and hold his ground, but he also offers some

upside as a pass rusher. And then I do like Marvin Wilson despite the not good tape of twenty twenty, I still think even down his twenty twenty tape, the Florida State defensive tackle, former five star recruit, there's just something about when I see guys that have violent hands that are hard for guys to sort of maintain blocks on. I like that in a player. And then in twenty nineteen, when you just watch him when he hits people, it looks like it hurts a lot, and I like that

in my defensive tackles. So Christian Barmore, Marvin Wilson, and then I would throw in NC States. Let's tell me to say his first name, Alam McNeil. You know, he's a guy that I think when you watch him play nose tackle, knows how to extend on guys, knows how to get rid of blockers, has a nice first step. So I think he's one of those guys that is a one technique but also has a little bit of quickness that you want in a three technique. So I think that would be a really good fit for this team.

So those the first three names that jump to mind for me. I want to throw another name out there, and I'm not reaching for this guy, but if you're telling me we get to round four, maybe he's still there. I would take a shot at three hundred and forty five pound Tyler Shelvin from LSU. Didn't love his tape, don't think he's got great get off. I said his way, three hundred and forty five pounds. He's gonna eat space, he's gonna take on double teams. He has a run player.

He's not gonna add anything as a pass rusher. But if we get the feeling that Dan Quinn wants that bigger defensive tackle on the inside, I think Tyler Shelvin's a name I've kind of written down as kind of a guy who I think had a little hot, a little more upside, a little more ceiling, and maybe didn't show out as much as people might have wanted at LSU, and he did opt out, you know, twenty twenty. But

I think that's a guy. If I'm in round four and he sides out of the top one hundred, that's a guy I'm taking a look at because I do see some untapped potential there. Yeah, those are good names. I mean the two that came to mind, where McNeil and Shelvin. I think both probably are gonna go in the third round. Maybe I don't. We'll want to see if they wait maybe a little bit longer. An interesting play or Bobby Brown from A and m Um, Yeah,

he's he flashes, but he's inconsistent. Um. You know, I think he could play some of that one because he does have some power to him, and you know, I think that he has yet to play his best football. He's he's still young. He hasn't turned twenty one until I think August, so um, you know, Bobby Brown is one of those intriguing upside guys in a class that

is just a not good nose tackle group. And he played his high school ball right down the street from AT and T Stadium, from Lamar High School in Arlington, so hey, He's he's known the area. He's been around here, and they've had a lot of good defensive line talent

coming out of Arlington. Kind of keeping with this though, Dane, I've got kind of a two part question for you here, and this is from Connor Livesey are a good friend on Twitter who's been trying to ask a question for like four weeks and I keep missing his question somehouse whenever the show comes up. So I'll get to this, and I know I'm the worst. What area of McNeil's game do you guys have questions about? And why isn't he defensive tackle? Number one? That's the first part of

the question, Dan. The second one is he wants a scouting report on Syracuse defensive tackle McKinley Williams and why was his Clemson tape the best defensive line tape of twenty twenty. Well with McNeil, Uh, you know, I think there's there's plenty to like about him. Uh, you know, he played. He reminds me a lot of or you didn't get. He gave me flashbacks of watching Javon Hargrave

as a prospect. He's he's heavy handed, He's got that body type that you want to thick thighs, that thick torso that bubble that you're looking for in those tackle bottom exactly. Uh. And he plays close to the ground, so he's got some flexibility to him. Uh. He eats up blockers, he wins gaps. Uh, he can reset the line of scrimmage with his power. He just I don't I didn't see a very rangey player. Um. And I thought he was part of a pretty heavy rotation that

really allowed him to stay fresh. Something to consider as well. But you know, he's he's an easy player to like. Um, I don't know that he's going to It's tough with defensive tackles because you have to really understand what's their impact potential, you know, especially if they're not It's one thing. If they're a pass rusher, then it's a little easier to project their impact potential. If they're not a pass rusher, then that's where it gets a little bit tougher too,

to truly understand what's their value in the draft. You know, is are they a third round pick, fourth rup you know? And I think McNeil falls in that category where I don't know how much he gives you as a pass rusher, and so what is that exact value? And so that's why I think he's I think he's a day two player, but even that maybe more of a third than a two. It just you know it's gonna come down to preference,

and we have the factor in two. This is a week nose tackle group, So a guy like McNeil could get pushed up the board for a team that you know is looking for that guy if you're picking it to say the Cowboys, for example, If you're picking mid second round and you know you are looking at nose tackle and you don't feel great about the guys that are going to be their third fourth round, you might feel pressured to maybe pull the trigger a little bit earlier.

And not just the Cowboys, but several teams there are in the market for a one technique or you know, a player that can play over the center. So it's a it's a really interesting dynamic with these nose tackles. What about McKinley Williams. Have to handle McKinley Williams. Oh, yes from Syracuse. Uh, I don't know. I need to see more in him. Um, I don't think I have a great feel for him yet and where he fits in this class. But give me time on him. We'll

come back to Okay, that's fine. Yeah, I mean, it's still what is it, February fourth at this point, So that makes a lot of sense. Connor's just ahead of all of us. That's the only issue. Um Now, I don't think Connor's ahead of Dane. Oh no, he's not. He's not ahead of Dane. Don't work. Anyone's ahead of nobody's had a date. Even some of the gms in the league or not ahead of Dane. Most of the gems in the league or not ahead of Dane. Okay.

Kevin on Twitter asked this, and I'm gonna go straight to Katie with this one, and he said some would disagree. How did the Cowboys pass on Kyle Pitts if he's there at ten? And what is your opinion on Tyson Campbell with the second pick meaning forty fourth overall? I mean, you pass on him if a cornerbacks on the board, or you know, and if it's a player that you're in love with is on the board, or if Trey Lance is on the board because you've decided not to

sign back, that's how you pass on kW Pits. But I mean, like I understand the kle Pits think. I think you can get by tied in with another year of Jarwin, another year of Dalton Shoult as your backup. If they want to bring back the Bell Dozers tied in three, I'm all about it. And that's how you pass on kal Pits. I love Kyl Pits and other than there's a good chance Cowpits is not there at ten.

But I just it's asset allocation and roster building is more important than ever when you are paying your quarterback a lot, and the Cowboys are going to be paying their quarterback a lot because they're going to either tack him or sign him. And that's all important, and that's what you should do. You should pay your quarterback. Tyson Campbell is very interesting and it kind of leads to something we're gonna talk about in the third segment about

a cornerback size. I'm a little higher on Eric Stokes than Tyson Campbell, but Tyson Campbell's the better athlete. Tyson Campbell is longer. I've got him at six two five. The traits are all there, the length, the speed, you know, those are the things that are all there. There are times, and it's not always. There are times when it just doesn't look natural playing the cornerback position. You go watch Patrick certain play, it looks pretty natural. Even one of

the Eric Stokes take. To me, he looks pretty natural on the other side. But you know, Tyson Campbell's gonna get drafted higher than Eric Stokes because he's got better traits. And it's all about traits. But I think he did a good job, you know, carrying wide receivers across the field. You could see that, and he could keep up with them because he's got good recovery speed. If they do get a step or two on him, I don't know,

you know, give it with this link. I want him getting a more of a jam at the line of scrimmage. You didn't always see that when he was up and pressed technique. But to me, tons of ceiling. I got a lot of ceiling with Trevon Diggs over there as well. I like Tyson Campbell. I've got a second round grade on him. But there are just some things that you want to be you want to see shut up with him.

I think one thing with him too. When you watched him this year offenses, we're not afraid to throw at him because it's tough, because he has a lot of the traits. But I mean when you when you are drafting a corner in the first you know, fifty or sixty pick. You want a guy that can get his head turned and find the football, and he just didn't do that consistently, and that really worries me. On Campbell, so I agree with a lot of what you said. Traits are easy to like, and I you know, the

length size. Uh, you know, he is a very smooth athlete for a guy that big. But you know it's the way offensive attacked him. Uh, really do make you worry. Oh and one thing on McKinley Williams. The reason I have not seen enough of him yet he's not in his draft class. So I just want to put that out there. Oh wow, well that makes a lot of sense. Oh that's a See. Anytime Dane says give me time, it means the dude's not not even in the draft

at all. Just to just to clarify, I'm falling back to school, so it's gracious, real quick on Campbell, I'll be quick here. I have him just on my board right now. I have him as my eighth cornerback. So I mean, and that's probably second round, right, that's probably that's probably the potential to get the top sixty picks. So yeah, it's it's tough when you compare him to you know, Eric Stokes and Mela fawn Woo and Aaron Robinson Elijah Molden, Like, there's different types of corner. Now

you're cooking, Dane, I don't want to. I don't I don't want to step on If we're gonna talk about this in a little we are, but a lot of different types of corners, So we'll save it for a little bit later. Jeff, do you want me to save it or do you wanna Do you want to go to break real quick? I mean we could come right back in here. Yeah, I mean it's just a carryover

of this topic. For instance, Um Campbell and Stokes are my tenth and eleventh corners and kind of this draft and it plays into what we're gonna talk about next, the reason behind it that makes sense. We're back in a tasty treat that's sweeping air waves and taste buds. It's new doctor pepper and cream soda. Let's take a listen, Doctor Bada. Is he a new combone that's music to

my ears? Okay, doctors music to my ears and mouth, New doctor pepper and cream soda a delisious There's nothing as unique as our eyes, which is why SLOR pioneers ways to make lenses as unique as you. Varilux for super sharp vision, Essential Blue for protection, and Crisol for freedom from glare. Three cutting edge solutions in a single unique lens. So whatever your needs, insist on sealor visit your local SLOR experts and find a perfect lens for

you to seemore do more SLOR. The Cowboys Way, where sixteen Hall of Famers and five championships shows us what success looks like. Where Turkey is always the second best part of Thanksgiving Day, Where we are all defined by one single thing, the star, where we as fans know it's our job to keep the tradition going. Bank of America is proud to be the official bank of the Dallas Cowboys and to or the quest of living life. The Cowboys Way. Copyright twenty twenty Bank of America Corporation. Dear,

it's nineteen oh eight. Don't you think we should get electricity and stop using candles to see it night? It's just electricity lights up the room fast. It's more reliable than candles blowing out and people seem to love it nationwide candles, dar did you just run into the wall? I have a new candle please. Historically, switching to new technology is a no brainer. Today it's AT and T five G, fast, reliable, secure and nationwide. Switch to AT and T five G. It's not complicated. Five G requires

compatible plan may not be in your area. See att dot com slash five G for you for details. Is the Dallas Cowboys dot com Draft Show back here on the Draft Show final fifteen minutes or so. Glad you're with us. Jeff Cavanaugh, Dame Burgler, Kevin, Katie Turner. I'm Kyle Yeomans. And this is the conversation Jeff has been itching to have. Whether you're a Cowboys fan, you're a draft fan, you're an NFL fan, doesn't matter. This is a disc and we need to have. It's a sit down.

It's a heart to heart with Jeff Cavanaugh about different types of corners. And Dane said, there's a lot of different types of corners in this draft that could potentially intrigue you. I mean, we talked about elijah'm Olden out of Washington, Florida States, Asante Samuel Junior, then you've got the top guys like a Patrick Jutan and a Caitla Farley. I mean, there are all these different types of corners. But Jeff, whenever it comes to the Cowboys, why are

you so skeptical on the types that they're looking at? Well? Okay, so this is my thing with how we do the draft and how we do cornerback. I feel like everybody is looking for guys that are six two and up, and I'm just kind of going backwards and asking myself and everybody else, why why are we pretending that everybody that we're going to cover in the NFL is like sixty three? When I get a bunch of dudes in the NFL, and it's like, all right, congrats, you got

all your six two guys. Now, time to go win the super Bowl. Here's Tyreek Hill, all right, Well, my guys falling down every time tire Hill changes direction, and all right, here's the super Bowl. Go cover Stefan Diggs. All right, my six two guys falling down left and right. I just I wonder why are we so into the idea of the six two and the six three corner? And maybe part of it is just that I'm finding a bunch of corners in this class that I like that are under six foot and I'm tired of them

being height shamed, you know, by the community. So my guys who are five ten, five eleven, just like Jayre Alexander maybe the best corner in the NFL. I don't want to just immediately throw everybody who's five foot ten into well, he's a nickel guy, because there's plenty of receivers in the NFL that are five nine to five eleven that are number ones that play outside that you're

going to have to cover. So just the idea that in the draft world, I Am not going to be consistently looking for and rewarding guys for being tall, going to find the best players, and I'm gonna have guys like Asante Samuel and Elijah Molden and Robinson at UCF and Shakur Brown at Michigan State ahead of Tyson Campbell six two runs fast from Georgia because I care less about your profile. And maybe this comes back to the thing that Dane talks about where it's kind of like

the player versus the traits. You can keep your traits. I want the players. So the five ten and the five eleven guys that can cover really well, that are physical, that can play a football, I'm gonna take them over six foot two and four to three all day or day. That's my corner thing. It's a question, it's a comment, it's a commentary, it's speech, and uh and I'm done. Now, have a great day. I'll see you guys next week. I think you're I mean, you're right, Like that's how,

that's how it should be. The number one trait when you're scouting the cornerback position should always be athleticism. To me, easy more so than size. And I would argue next is your ability to the process. You know, you're mental processing. So those are the top two traits that I know personally. I look for athleticism and then mental processing. If you have those two things, yeah, you can play for me

any day. I think when we talk about length with corners, it's not too dissimilar when we talk about you know, arm arm length for offensive tackles. You know, like I think, just it helps if you're a little bit longer, if you have thirty five inch arms compared to thirty two inch arms, and as offensive tackle, those three inches can sometimes make a big difference, and so helping that kind of you know, close the gap is something that teams

will look for. But if you're not if you can't move as an offensive tackle, it's not going to matter much. And it's the same thing with the corners. If you're super long player, that's great, but if you're not a good athlete, it's not going to matter much. So the size is something that I think should be used to help break tie. So if you think Tyson Campbell and Elijah Molden are on the same level as a prospect, then Tyson Campbell should get a little bit of a

bump because he has the size advantage. But if you think that Elijah Bowl and just a flight out better player, then I certainly understand that too. No, I think I've been guilty of this before in the past, and you always try to get better at this, right, we sometimes take measurements and information that you would typically get at pro days or a combine or whatever. We sometimes tend to take those measurements and we treat him like currency almost And it really doesn't have to be that way.

You trust what your ic and things like that. But just to play Devil's advocate to what Jeff said, because I agree with most, if not everything, But Jeff said Tyree Hill in the Super Bowl, Well, what happens if our Darius Washington from TCU is your free safety and he's got to get over and get on top of Mike Evans the Super Bowl? You're gonna do? You wish it? Your guy who's gonna do it, You're gonna I want

the guy who's gonna get there. If look if if your quarterback throws a perfect ball and does the math in his head for sixty yards downfield, when the free safety gets there where the corner is and leaves it outside and high on the sideline where my five eight safety can't reach it, good on you try it again. I'd much rather have a badass, instinctual athletic dude that makes plays than a guy who's taller and faster. That's all. That's all. And you didn't have to drag you didn't

have to drag my safety into it. That's something that you chose to do, Katie. You chose violence on a Thursday with me. You didn't have to bring him into this. Nobody asked you to do that, or Darius Washington safety number one all five eight of him. Let's go offside rich Richie Grant safety number two. Like something else that's throwing into this carversation with corners, because that cornerback might be my favorite position to evaluate because it's so much fun.

It's it's it's like you're you're breaking down a dance. You have to be so technically refined, but at the same time, you have to be a top athlete. Um, you know, first and foremost, I think you need you need space athletes, guys that can hold their own in space. And then you have to judge. You know, there's just not a good athlete and a bad athlete. There are certain levels of athlete. You know, you have to you know,

there's different types of speed. There's uh, you know, transition speed, there's drive speed, there's break on the ball speed, all these different levels, so, uh, you know, the it's just a really fascinating position to evaluate. And I think the better athlete, the more you can compromise on size, because ideally you don't want a five nine corner, but if he's a top athlete, then the more you can compromise

on that. It's something that is a it's really a fascinating uh because it's it is arguably the toughest position to play, just because you're left out on an island again another top athlete and you don't know what's coming and you just have to stop them from making a play, and it's tough, but you know that's it makes it, I think, a fun position to evaluate. Well. And Jeff says something very interesting in our just really quickly here Kata, but kind of tying together what all three of you

guys were just talking about. But that was specifically whenever it came to the size and the athleticism of these corners. Whenever you look at the division that the Cowboys are in, who are they going up against in terms of wide receivers that are the better wide receivers. It's Terry McLaurin for Washington, It's Sterling Shepherd for New York, and I guess the Shan Jackson slash Jalen Rager for Philadelphia. I mean,

those are the guys. They're slot receivers that are quick, that are not very tall, that are agile, and they're gonna come right over the middle of the field. So shouldn't these smaller corners that have that athleticism that Dane's talking about that kind of allow you to take them

earlier in the draft. Be higher value to the Cowboys, Jeff, because just based off of the competition they're going for, well, I think they should be a higher value by everybody because sure, like you know, Davante Adams isn't small and Mike Evans big and Alan Robinson's not small. But I mean it's the NFL receivers look like us, it's different, not quite like us. They look like five nine, six foot six one. This guy's five eleven. Oh, here's a six three guy. This guy's six foot, he's six one

oh six four over there. It's it's all over the place. So I just I don't think you need to be like building your team with the idea that you gotta have this this height in this length. Like if um, I don't mean to pick on the guy, but if camp if Tyson Campbell, the six two guy at Georgia has a better career than Sante Samuel Junior, I'll eat the microphone. Like there's just there's a different level to

how well you understand the game, how quickly you're processing information. Uh, just this the spatial awareness that comes with playing corner when you're playing zone. So like sure, you in theory might even and maybe even outruns him in the forty right, and so now you're bigger, longer, faster. But if we run twenty football plays and we see who creates the smaller window for the quarterback in various situations, it's gonna

be a Sante Samuel Junior because he's better at it. Jeff, I'm interested in you said, I think Tyson, Campbell and Stokes were at ten and eleven ranked corners. I'm interested who are your top ten corners that you've studied so far? It is Caleb Farley one, Patrick Surtan, JC Horne Asante, Samuel Asante, Samuel Junior four, Elijah Mulden five, Melafonwu six, Robinson seven at Central Florida, Brown at did him yesterday, Brown at Michigan State eight and actually a grand Am

junior at Oregon is not Senior Bow. Then Campbell and Stokes, and I don't know how I did it. I don't know I did it Senior Bowl. But I liked his I liked the tape that I've gotten too so far. On Graham, I like it. No, I mean, the only one out of that that I don't really love is Graham. Um. But the rest I mean, I yeah, I have no really big disagreements there. I guess my only disagreement would be I really like Greg Newsom from Northwestern. He would

be I haven't seen him yet. It's cheating, So just call Campbell and Stokes eleven and twelve or whatever, move him down one because I'm assuming i'll like knew some vetter Edge Simpson gotcha. Yeah, No, it's and that's I mean, all those guys that you mentioned are top one hundred guys so or maybe top seventy five guys. So it's it's it's a really interesting group. Corners. Where are you on? Dry and Kendrick Dane from Clemson he didn't come out,

Yeah he went back Clemson. Oh break and Connor Man Yeah, Katie, I was really I wanted him. I wanted him to come out, but he ended up going back. I agreed he might have been the best athlete in the group among all these guys, just really really raw, and so I think he made but maybe the better decision by going back. He has got a chance to be a really good corner if he figures things out, because he's a wide receiver. When he showed up, he's still he's

still figuring things out. Yeah, I think another year with at college levels him. Well, I have the same almost the same order, Aaron Robinson of Central Florida. I have fourth so Farley certain Horne, Robinson, Samuel Stokes, Campbell Moulden, Melifon Wu Newsome. For me, I think that's ten I named up, and then I've kind of got on my day three radar um Tariq Castro Fields from Penn State. Although I need to check and see if he came out and he's going back. Okay, he's gone back. Kat

I gotta tell you. I know if I tell you that that extra year of eligibile it messed everything up. It's tough. Yeah, a lot of people are a lot of kids are taking advantage of that. So thanks for tuning into the draft show with three experts and Katie, Hey, make sure that it's on tape. Let's market that Jeff's gonna eat the microphone. Campel has a better career than Samuel. Can we just get that and keep it? Sure? Yeah, I'm gonna keep this microphone for that purpose. This one

right here, that's gonna terrible meal and the like. There are some there are a couple of corners that we haven't talked about that are you know, pretty good, you know, Pulsing Adibo. We got to figure out what to do with him out of Stanford. Um. Yeah, Robert Rochelle from Central Arkansas is a small school guy, but a really good athlete who could go comp one hundred. UM. I really like what we saw from Benjamin Saint Jus from Minnesota at the Senior Bowl. Uh, you know Keith Taylor,

you know, somewhere in that mix. So it's a it's a really interesting group of corners that uh, you know, there's gonna be a lot of split opinion when we talk about corners four through twelve in that range, and it's gonna be like that throughout the course of the draft process. Also, Brian Mills out of North Carolina Central, I believe is that what his school is? Yeah, North Carolina Central. That just tells you how much I know about that school. But yeah, I thought he looked really

nice at the Senior Bowl. I thought he had a good week of practice down in Mobile. So there's a lot of those corners that are gonna be kind of talked about all the way through the draft. I mean, of course, with the Cowboys needing help at corner, I wouldn't be surprised if they doubled up at that position again for the second straight year. Last year it was Trayvon Daxon Reggie Robinson. One of them didn't catch the field.

The other one has a ton of upside as a starter and maybe the number one corner on this ball club at the moment. But corner is definitely gonna have a microscope on it, and we'll continue to do that along the way here on the Draft Show. But that's gonna do it for us today, for Chris Beam and the back for Kevin kat Turner, Jeff Kavanaugh and Dame Brugler.

I'm Kyle Yeoman's We should have catched this group again Thursday next week ten am Central time, and then you can also have the other group with Brian Brodess, Bucky Brooks and David Hellman at ten am Central Time on Tuesday. But until then, so long here on the Draft Show. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.