Draft Show: Drafting Dez's Replacement

David Hellman and I will carry on with you this uh this morning and make do right, make do. We've got a couple of things that we can talk about today, mainly with what's going on with the wide receiver position. We've hinted that there was a possibility that the stay would come when they were released, as Brian and now you as that transfers into another area of reality. Now it's reality now, and you know all the things that we've talked about in round tables and speculations and things

like that, it's it is reality. And so David, I want to get into these wide receivers this morning, and everybody else, Yeah, and and and I want to get in. I think we've talked about wide receivers plenty on this on this program. That's can I just I mean and I get I mean, trust me, I get it. Um, you know you're talking about one of the best receivers in franchise history. Sure, we're leading the touchdown leader, uh you know, face of the franchise for the last eight

or so years. But I feel a little bit surprised at what seems like the number of people who were caught off guard by this. Um. It shouldn't have I know. And that's that's my point. Is I feel like, and no, UM, I'm not trying to say I told you so, because I think most of us there was always an air

of uncertainty. It was all way as well. I don't know for sure, but this timeline David, Yeah, yeah, timeline, the way the fact that they didn't talk to Dez Bryant absolutely since the end of the seat, I guess I can talking to Dez Bryant. He was like, they haven't, They've been spoken to me. My point is, like Hindsight's twenty twenty, I definitely wasn't and you, to be fair, you went a lot firmer than I did. I went like, he's gone, you went very firm. Yeah, And I wasn't

quite ready to do that, but I wasn't surprised. And I would hope that nobody that listens to this show was either which you know people, I would hope that it's people who don't really follow this thing as closely as we do. Sure they're like, well, what does that change at wide receiver? What they got to pick at

nineteen that like, no, they don't very reactionary fan base. Well, I think that's just people in general, like nothing has changed, because if you're doing this the right way, you've been bracing for this possibility since February. We've talked about this on the Draft Show. The fact that that of guys they brought in for thirty visits, you know, two potential first round guys with Ridley and Moore. Yep, they've visited Washington. We talked about they looked at every receiver worth looking at.

They had private workouts with with Sutton, They've had workouts with Kirk, They've done everything in there. They went down to Baton Rouge to work out Shark. You know, they've tried to figure out this you should have seen, really the old proverbrial, the writing on the wall, writing was on the wall. You know, they add two receivers and now they look at the draft. I want to ask you, David Hellman, Yeah, does this mean, though you absolutely have

to draft a wide receiver at nineteen. No, I don't think so either, not even I'm glad you said that, And that's I mean, it's if you listen to this show. It's well documented how much I like DJ Moore, But it's looney tunes to say that you got a draft a receiver at nineteen just because Dez is gone. I don't buy it. And that's not the way that they've operated in the draft any in the last five years. I think I've been saying this since Friday when the news came down. I think it's a damn near lock

that they're gonna draft, gonna take one. They're gonna They're definitely gonna draft one, and I would be very comfortable betting that it'll be on Day one or Day two, pick nineteen, pick fifty, pick eighty one, or maybe a trade's involved. Yet I feel even better. On Thursday, I came in here and I said, I think you're in a situation where if you don't draft a receiver at nineteen, you might have to trade up to get the guy

you want. Yeah, so I wouldn't be shocked if they picked a wide receiver at thirty nine or forty, you know what I mean. So they're saying move the fifty up. Yeah, I could see that. I think, I mean, you gotta get a wide receiver, not just because the group could use the extra talent, but I think we've talked about it a few times. The long term future of this entire group is not very clear. You got guys in

contract years, you got guys playing on short deals. Switzer and Noah Brown are the only guys with more than two years left on the our current contract and their Day three draft picks. So that doesn't mean a whole lot. So put yourself as a fly on the wall, or as you're sitting in the in the war room right now, as they're working through these receivers, who do you think they have on the top of their board? Who would

you say? Who would you project would be? Okay, this is the type of guy that I could see them going to get with with what they've added, what they have like you said, what would be the type of guy that they would go and get of the of the top. And it doesn't have to be Ridley and more and Sudden or any of those guys. Really, but I'm really glad you said that because it's something with

Dez Bryant gone. I think it's something you've got to talk about in more detailed terms than just they need a wide receiver, right, So what we're looking at these guys and it's I think it's all gonna hinge on what they think these guys can do, right because you let you just let go of the prototypical X receiver, right. Yes. And then the thing that Dane has been telling us for three months is that Calvin Ridley is probably a really high end Z. Yeah, he's not an X. Uh.

You've got Alan Hearns who can do a little bit of all three. But with Dez out of the picture, you would assume he's gonna play X. So it's so it's what do you want? And it goes back to the debate about Courtland Sutton, like, yeah, he's an X, he's got a lot of upside, but he's raw. Would you would you rather draft an X with upside, would you rather draft a really polished Z. Where does DJ Moore fit in that equation? What do you want him to do? I think dj Moore could play both. I

think so. I think he could too. But what do they think? Yeah, that's what I'm trying to like, I'm trying to get your idea what you would think? You you really painted the picture? Well what all it is? It's and I think you know, but what are they hurting more at? They hurt him more at this? People might think they're hurting it both X and Z. I think I And to be clear, I don't think this is some kind of doomsday scenario. Um, this is not the most talented receiver corps. I saw, you know, after

they released Dez. Somebody on Twitter was like, uh, you think any defensive coordinators are losing sleep about this group? And it was you know the current Cowboys receivers And it's no, They're not going to be at the top of any Bleacher Report lists of the best receiver groups. But on a team that is designed to run the ball, there you go. Uh you know, do you need you need a one? Do you need a one receiver? This is probably what the Cowboys receiver corps is supposed to

look like in the Ezekiel Elliott era. You know, like, if you're spending forty million dollars on your offensive line and eight million dollars a year on your running back, absolutely probably what your receiver corps get a fourth round quarterback play. Yeah. Um, I don't think this receiver corps is in as diers like I think you can win games with the six guys that are that are here

right now. I mean people love to point out that when Dez was hurt in twenty sixteen for three weeks, they didn't miss a beat, right, Um, So I don't think it's a dire situation. But like I said, I think you would like to upgrade, get younger, give yourself some long term stability in the sense that whoever you draft is gonna be guaranteed to be here for four or five years. But it's all about what they want.

And so I think I think Courtland Sutton is a name much more worth knowing now than he was a week ago. Yes, because of where he plays, because where he plays, because of what he can do, because of what he could bring to your receiver group. But if you think DJ Moore can do both and he's the guy, or Calvin Riley for that matter. Sure, I mean, don't change the way you're looking at this just because you let go of a true X receiver, you know what

I Mean's kind of where I'm at um. But I think that's however they rank these guys, that comes down to what they think they can do. I mean DJ Chark, where where does he fit in? See Dane talks about him. If you get a guy at sixty three that runs four three, yeah, but you and I have lived that one. It's it's I mean, you and I have lived that one every weekend. We've lived the highs and the lows of a guy like that, and that's it's kind of the But that might be your have to trade up guy.

That's that's your scenario where you're saying trade up for a guy. This is what I think is going to happen. I think if the pick is not DJ Moore or Calvin Ridley at nineteen or even maybe you have to trade up to fifteen to get Ridley's Sure if it's not one of those two guys, if they want one of their highly prized receivers, that I think I'd be surprised if they wait till fifty to get him. Yeah, I really do, because I think Courtland Sutton's gone by

pick forty probably. I think DJ Chark you're probably talking about him going pick you know, definitely by pick fifty. Yeah, so that's kind of where I am is, like, all right, if you want one of these five or six dudes that we keep talking about, that's what I think is

going to have to happen. Or you know, you could look at it the other way and say, maybe they don't view receiver as a dire need, Like maybe just what you just explained, because they're there run first team, you just wait until you wait until fifty and go with what you got, or you go in another direction if you don't like it, I don't disagree with you. And then I really like what you said about this

is a run first team. And so now, okay, this doesn't make what has to have tens of millions of dollars tied up in your receivers with the way this thing is constructed right now, I mean that's just true. So yeah, so I don't know, I but pick nineteen and pick fifty or somewhere in between. I feel like I feel more important. Okay, so we're gonna keep the board open though, right, you have to. That's the whole Like,

that's what aggravates me. And I'm not calling out the various listeners of this podcast because I think y'all know better, But to like to act like something that happened on April twelfth is gonna drastically change what you've been working on for months. No way. They've been working on getting a receiver here for the last several weeks. Didn't we get super excited in February when all these receivers kept saying like, yeah, I met with the Cowboys. Yeah, sure

we did this. We did that. They had some guys on thirty visits. Like, just because Dez was taking up a roster spot in March doesn't mean that the Cowboys were, Oh, they were working hard on Why we're say they were hunting them at the combine. We talked about that when we were there. This is not a surprising development or something that they weren't ready for. And so it shouldn't change anything about the way you want to do this. It shouldn't mean that wide receiver is necessary at nineteen.

It shouldn't mean it's necessary at fifty you're doing it wrong if that's the case. I mean, like Alan Hearns is here, so that you don't have to do something drastic in the draft, that's the whole point. Yeah, so I agree with you on that. Do you like the the Would you rather trade up for a guy in the second or go ahead and hit the pick at nineteen? Uh?

Talking fucking receiver, talking receiver. I mean, I'd rather draft DJ more, But it depends on who's there though, And so you would rather draft DJ more than than Evans or Vanderis or one of those guys, right, no one would you know about this? That's defense, that's no and that like me personally, Okay, Landry, Dave Hellman, Okay, now we're here, here we go. I want DJ more the most, right, But I think he makes the least amount of sense of those options. Yeah, we went through all those guys

the other day. If if Harold Landry's there, he should be the pick in my opinion. But Landry Miller Leonard remember that scenario again? Yeah, absolutely, that was That'll have that And that's a nice little haul. I'm totally down with. I mean, I kind of like going back to that, the Landry Miller Leonard when I don't know how much they like Miller. No, and that's what I that's what

I kind of worry about. Maybe maybe maybe we like Miller and I And again this is not me saying I mean, I'm not I haven't talked to anybody about Miller. Anthony Miller has been conveniently as far as I know, he's not really part of that. You know, I haven't heard he didn't come here. No, he didn't. I haven't

heard about anybody going to Memphis. Yeah. Um, so that's something you got to keep an eye in the scenarios of the eight scenarios I gave you Thursday with like Ridley Jewel Bates, that was scenario one that includes a wide receiver, more DJ Moore, Shepherd and more, the safety from Southern miss That was scenario two. Yeah. And then there's a scenario I have with with Saint Brown. But that's with Vanderish Harrison and Saint Brown. Yeah, and I

liked that one a lot. Maybe Saint Brown might go earlier than eighty one, and I think Harrison might go earlier than fifty. It's possible, Yeah, it's possible. Okay, and then we talked about the Landry Miller. That's another scenario, Landry Miller, Leonard. If Landry's there, I would pick him otherwise. Now you're talking wide receiver, let's say DJ Moore, DJ Moore, Verse, Rashaun Evans or Clayton Vanderesh. Now I mean she's and

everyone and most of everyone included a wide receiver. Fernandez, Gallop, Avery, Dane doesn't like Avery, he'll be wrong about him. U slander the guy. Now he knows, he knows, he knows. I mean he knows how much like Gabriethy. Gabriel's gonna be fine. And then I had Hamilton's you know Hamilton, he had Hamilton is one of his best route runners. The kid from Penn State Day, Shawn Hamilton, Yeah, balled

out at the Senior Bowl. Had one of them. And that that was the veya Golden Again, we're probably putting golden in there when the Cowboys don't really like Golden. To go back to my point, you know, there's gonna be so much focus on wide receiver for this team. Now's like, oh, it's got to be at nineteen, it's got to be at fifty Dayshawn Hamilton I mean that maybe he's not there at eighty one, but you could certainly get him at fifty. You could certainly trade up

from eighty one. Like they're gonna have options deep into the draft, and I think they with Deonta Thompson and Alan Hearns. I think I'm not trying to sell anybody that these guys are all pros, but they've done a good enough job of covering the cracks in that group that if it doesn't work for him early, I think they're gonna be fine with it. I don't think this is this creates a situation of desperation by any stretch.

And if I would be surprised if they don't have a receiver by Saturday, but I wouldn't be surprised if they don't get their guy till Friday night. I mean round three something, you know, late on Friday, something like that. That That wouldn't surprise me. And you add that to what you already have, it's not terrible. You think, Okay, now the comparison's going to be if they take one of these wide receivers at nineteen and then what defensive player goes Yeah, you know that that'll be okay? Should

they have waited, should they? I honestly I would rather have DJ more on this team. See if the choice is between a receiver and one of the linebackers, I think I would take the linebacker because I think you're gonna have a harder time winning games with what you got at linebacker right now than wide receiver. Does this go to their theory that they did last year with Okay, we took Taco because that's the position that there wasn't that they got through the draft. It wasn't as deep

at the defensive end spot. You got to keep that in mind. And I'd certainly feel better about my options on Day two and Day three at receiver and I do a linebacker, right, I mean absolutely. How many linebackers do you really feel great about after the first round? And I know, I mean, okay, you love Josie Jewel, Yeah I don't. I don't know how much they loves it. Again,

I did my Top fifty this weekend. Yeah, I saw it, and I did on my top fifty and like players forty seven, forty eight, forty and fifty year all like my guys that I don't care. Yeah, it's it's my top fifty. You gotta do what I do it. Damn one got shat Griffin and yeah I got chat Griffin in my top fifty. Okay, but that's because I want shat Griffin in my top fifty. I'm not gonna let somebody tell me that the guy can't play. Okay, I

get it. But the thing about it is, though I kind of it was, it was, it was tough to kind of fear, but I felt like that through my top fifty, David I had more wide receivers and I did than I did like defensive ends guys like that. We just did this like linebackers for that matter, I can go all day with I mean, okay, DJ Moore, Calvin Ridley, Courtland Sutton, James Washington, Christian Kirk, DJ Shark, Uh, Anthony Miller, Yeah, jam On More, Um, Equanimius, Saint Brown,

say Gallup, Michael Gallop, like the list goes on. In Pettis, Dante Pettis, Yeah, there's about Obbs Fountain. I mean, yeah, I would, especially knowing that you know, Herns Hearns and Terrence Williams can start for it, like you don't need this guy to carry that. And that was the whole reason I didn't think it was a good idea to let go of Dez in the first place. Is I don't want to put that on a rookie, but you have veterans who can step in and do that until

he's more acclimated. I'm the guy to tell you that Hearns has some similar trades to Dez. As far as the Ralph, there's we had Pete Prisco I did Radio one oh five three. Yes, say, Pete lives in Jacksonville. You know, covers the Jags, knows the Jags. He was talking about Hearns. He's saying, hey, listen, he's very similar Dez Bryant in the way he runs. You know, Dez is not the fastest guy, and Alan Hearns is a

little bit of the same type of guy. So, yeah, they're gonna have to figure out some things outside I have. I have a good feeling about Alan Hearns. Um I don't. I'm with you on that. Yeah, I'm with not that I wanted to get rid of because I felt like they should have tried to do something with Dez Bryant. Agreed they never did though, you know, but to the original point, there's about ten receivers that I think could

develop into really good players. Although and some of them you can get as late as the third round linebacker, I don't feel quite as good. Okay, how about this one. I gave you scenarios six Evans Shark and sent it from the from South ful Okasa defensive tackle, the one technique. They've got some three technique traits. Yeah, Evans the linebacker. There's your trade up, probably for Shark right there, right,

And I'm in it for that. Honestly, you did a I'm worried about those scenarios because I like them all so much, though I assume they're not very realistic because I never feel that good about it. Yeah, I tried to put them where spots were. Okay, of More and Ridley, Yeah, give me why yes? And then why not? I'm not. I'll play with you on this one too, I'm not. I mean, I wouldn't hate either of those picks, right. Calvin Ridley's size scares me a little bit. He's a

mean see Marvin Harrison, I keep tweeting that out. He kind of looks like Marvin Harrison body type to me. He Okay, you just compared him to a Hall of Famer. I know, but body type, I didn't compare him to like the guy catching them. He catched the football. He can run routes. Bruglar has him is one of his three best route runners in the draft. He Isn't that something we need here? Yeah? Absolutely, he came in here on a thirty visit. Yeah. And I saw him in

the looks slight. I was just like, dude, you look like you're gonna get broken in half in the fl which I mean, the production speaks for itself. He balled out at the in the SEC so but so so size is a no. Yes is what he's I mean, he's the best route runner in the draft. He can create separation, he can do all that good stuff. Um. I mean, and and I'm not dame, but like I wonder, is there more flexibility than we give him credit for just playing the Z And I'm saying, does he could

he do more than that? I think he could. That's yeah, I kind of it. But it'd probably be the best to keep him on the move, like you say, so you don't break him in half. I would not dislike that pick that I just and you know, there's just something I really liked about DJ more it's his physicality more than anything, you know, with the ball, with the ball in hand, he's making he looks he looks like a running back once he gets the ball in his hands, and he's a tough guy to bring down. He makes

plays out of nothing. Um, what's the no. That's a good question. Probably, Like maybe I wonder about you know, him playing outside against NFL corners, you know, just I mean, and I know he came in at six foot at the combine, but like, he's not this super big dude. I don't know if he's gonna be able to go downfield and consistently beat the types of guys he's gonna be lining up against in the NFL. Yeah, that's probably it. Yeah, I just yeah, I'm with you on that. I mean,

there's a lot with both those guys. There's more yeses than there are nos. Yeah, you know, and maybe you could say that the no. One more might have been well, wait, he's he's a he's not short, but the perception was that he was short. And then I mean, okay, you know, for all my five alarmed people who think they have to have a receiver at nineteen and DJ Mortar again, favorite player in the draft. But you could easily make

the argument. I mean we're talking about the number one and two receiver in this draft class being there for you at nineteen. Yeah, that kind of says something about the quality of the receivers in this draft. Maybe you get more the first round. Well, I mean at the top. Yeah, I'm saying maybe you get more bang for your buck draft and a guy because the guy that you can get at fifty is probably not that much I mean, he's not that too much of a worse player than

the guy you can get at nineteen. And they heard a coach say that one time in a war room, And yeah, you told that story the other day, Stephen Jackson. I mean, all right, no, it's funny that I mean twenty Yeah, no, no, that you could say that about everything in the draft. All right, David, thank you. We're going to take our first break of the day. When we come back, we'll get to your It could be hard to find the right resource for learning about important

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also help you out right there. Make sure you have that in handy. Dane Burger still got the beast available if you want to do that as well, I think that would be it would suit you well, it would kind of help you fall along. You know with the draft, David, we're not just only about the Cowboys picks. We like to talk about everybody's picks, you know, where everything's selected. My Cincinnati Bengals, when they select somebody, I try to

talk about them. I try to talk about the Cowboys pick, and you and Dane are like, no, we're onto the Rams. We're onto the Rams. Other stuff here. I also want to thank all the folks out there on our periscope accounts as well. I really really appreciate you guys fall along. We'll do the Twitter on the twenty stuff, but I want to maybe take a couple of questions or two off the periscope. I think you guys have some good

conversations amongst each other. I always appreciate going back and kind of watching that and seeing seeing the conversation you have.

So h maybe when Dave runs out of question or two, I will figure out a way to incorporate a periscope question, So make sure you fire that my direction, So Dave, I will give it to you now a little twitter on the Twitter lead shouts out at KAO, Well, this thank you very timely question from Van and I know we just kind of touched on it, but it is it is interesting to me because now it all comes

down to preference and what you're looking for. I guess which is you know, the question is, does this roster move releasing Dez Bryant change your thinking in the sense that you're looking more at Courtland Sutton and Equanimius Saint Brown, right, and you're less interested in a guy like a Calvin Ridley or a DJ Moore. I mean, should that should that alter the way you're looking at these receivers that maybe you're looking for that big body type that you

now don't really have so much. Yeah. I think though that if you look at we've seen Alan Hearns, he's not like, he doesn't look physically like this, right. He's a big receiver, though it's not like he's a Cole Beasley or or Switzer that type of body type. I think he could play the X. I think that Jacksonville, the way they used him last year, playing in the slot, I think that was just more out of necessity for them to try and kind of create things for him.

So yeah, I looking more at an X. I don't know if they're necessarily if that's the whole idea. I think they're looking for a guy that they can compliment with Hearns right now and say okay, but and that to your point more, what if things don't work out with Hearns, then you can move in, you can move into Dj Moore to play the X. I think Ridley could play the X if he had to, but I think he's a little bit better. I would be out of Ridley and more if they took Sudden, Yeah, I

would be a little bit more. Okay. Then it's to your theory or the question of hey, they went for a big receiver. They went for the guy. You know. Let's Sutton runs four five five. He didn't run again in his pro day, right, that's about what he is. I mean, you do see some separation, but he is a big guy. So you know, if you if you're looking for that speed, I think Thompson's going to be the speed here. Yeah. I think that's the guy that's going to be the speed down the field guy. And

then the quickness with Beasley, I think. But to look at just to say okay, we're only looking at X's Now, I don't think that's I don't think that's necessarily the case because I think Kirk's still I think Kirk's in the equation there. Yeah, even though he plays slot. I mean I think you'd want him on the move as well. Where does the big homie Noah Brown factor into all that? For see? Now, this is this is where, this is

where don't sleep on him. Because we did the mail back question today, Yeah, and it was and I was thinking, lance Lenore. I was thinking, you know, just don't sleep on the receivers. The thing about I think with Noah Brown. Noah Brown and from all I've seen standing up and watching Captain's workouts, you know looking out the window, he's one of them, never misses, He's always there. I know. Ah Brown and Ryan Switzer have they figured it out.

They figured out that this Lancellor, they figured out though this wide receiver thing could be a little bit of a mess. So they've now figured out, Okay, well, hey be here, work out, be ready, have a great training camp, make this football team be productive, keep going. You know that's where these guys. So, yeah, I'm not sleeping on Noah Brown at all. I'm always I'm reluctant to put a ton of faith into a seventh round draft pick.

Should Okay, But but after a year of being here, absolutely, he You now have an idea of like, Okay, this is what he did for me, can he do more? Sure? You throw on the Ohio State game of his last year at this time, and you'd swear he's a first round pick. There's every reason to be optimistic that Noah

Brown can develop into badass X type receiver. Absolutely, but I'm just not that's that's perhap Yeah, yeah, um, okay, I mean, as you might imagine, a lot of wide receiver questions, Bryson, my least favorite phrase in the entire world DAK friendly. Which one of these guys strikes you as a more DAK friendly receiver? He said? He said Dj Moore or Courtland Sutton. But I mean whoever you feel like, Well, we've seen I'll tell you what, Miller, you know, give me the guy with the big catch radius.

If DAK is not going to be accurate all the time, give me the guy with the big with the big catch radius. Give me the guy that's gonna snatch the ball behind him over his head. Low Miller's that type of guy. Yeah, you know, I've seen I've seen I've seen more Dj Moore catch up eight different quarterbacks, all kinds of things going on. I mean, he makes some circus catches too. Give me the guy though you need, You need the guy that could separate because he obviously

has to throw to somebody that's open. Give me the guy that could separate. Give me the guy that could finish the play with the catch. Give me the guy that's got some run after catch. Yeah, you know, the thing was sudden, big body guy catches the ball well, but not the route runner. Is he gonna struggle with routes because he hasn't done it in his career? Is it gonna be one of those things that you're gonna learn.

Is he gonna have to learn? Yeah. I'm not saying you can't get better at it, but I'm also saying, you know, hey, give me the guy that can from the jump, can get in there. Whatever he has to do, routes, he gets open, finds a way, find some space, give it up for the quarterback finish the play. And I you know, we're so used to that. I mean, for the last decade, Des Bryant, and I mean he was a very good all around receiver, but he struggled last year with some of that catch and stuff. Though, well

big time. Why he's not here, but he used he used his insane athleticism to make up for a lack of polish in other areas. I would be interested to see what this team would look like with a very polished receiver who used that to make up for non elite athletics. Yeah, I mean you see that work all over the league. Um looking down here at I'm looking down here to hit me, No, just periscope. People are like,

you need to address the coaching situation here. I think we address the coaching situation all the time on this show, which on this show, on all our shows, and I try and fire the guy every year. I mean, please, folks, don't leave the coaching thing along. Were they more? They're they're like, you know, why why the problems? You know, Yeah, it's coaching. Yeah, we try, we talk about that. People are saying, you should address the coaching situation. You know,

he's got it. There'll be a new receivers coach here, you know, there'll be some new ideas. No, they're just making comments. They don't. They're they're tired of blaming the players. Periscope comments are my favorite. Yeah, yeah, that's that's I mean, there we go. Yeah, need to separate the head coach from the team, much bigger concern, Rob. Okay, yeah, we get you. Wow, I've tried. Yeah, let's not act like

I haven't. So Rob, you can kind of walk into the draft now you've you've had your say, I've got you out there. That is a word wild conversation in the Sinuary, December and January. Sure it is. If they don't win games, then Rob, you'll get your wish on April sixteenth. If you're absolutely whining about that, I don't know what to tell you. Yeah, exactly. We'll see what happens this coming season. Okay, go ahead, I'm starting a new reptation. So you're good. They caught my eye there,

you know. And I feel like we talk about the coaching situation a lot on all our platforms. Yeah, we do. We do. It's not some of these things that like, oh, because Jerry Jones signs our Chucks, you guys can't talk. That's such bs. Yeah, it is such bs. Absolutely yep. Um Okay, So here's and I mean, okay, wide receiver, but now you're looking linebacker, wide receiver and then a lot of people and I think they're right. Offensive guard

is another thing you gotta consider. So Chad says, you know, between wide receiver and guard, where do you get the better value at nineteen? And where do you get the better value at fifty? And the guard thing, the guard thing at fifty is gonna not be as I think you would have to trade up. I just see In and Hernandez being late ones, early twos if we not and we we beat winning Hernandez into the ground in February early we did because and now we're not talking

about it at all. Yeah, is that a mistake. No, I think that. I think that they're still in play. I think a guard. They didn't visit either one. Yeah but this, but but they visited a guy like Daniels. Yeah, they visited He could be like a guard center or center guard combination guy. This team also has a relationship with Hernandez. I mean, like they do him, they do well, So they do but well and okay, well let's talk

about about that. I mean, can this team get away with not drafting a guard until day three, Well, obviously feel pretty good about Martin Marcus Martin, or or feel pretty good that they're gonna move Vile College. That's that to me. Dave is the ultimate thing. Did you see Did you see his Instagram post last night? You probably probably not what happened on a millennial like me. He just he posted a photo of himself and he's like, I can't wait to get back to work. But he

put hashtag right side. Yeah, and he's I mean, it's not up to Collins at the end of the day, but I know where he wants to be. Yeah, he's figured things out on that right side. I don't move Vile Colins now that that's what this team does. I know, they move guys around. And then like again, we go back to forty eight games of Byron Jones. Hey, Byron, by the way, We're gonna move you the corner now, you know, and maybe maybe Christi Shard has a better

plan for him. Maybe it's the secondary. You'll see some things differently here with this with this group, may you know, I mean as the way they play, the concepts, how they attack people. Let's not Rob Mary Nolly can learn some things. He could definitely learn some things from Christier Shard especially. I mean, yeah, a former defensive coordinator on his staff absolutely is like a young buck. Absolutely absolutely. Um. I really like this question from Eric. It's really more

just about scouting in general than any specific player. But he wants to know how many games of tape do you need to watch to get a player? And then, yeah, compare Obviously you're trying to get as many guys as possible, you're doing it for a podcast. Compare what you do now to what you did then. Well, back then in two thousand and five, when I was lasting in a draft room, in a scattering room, you had beta tapes, sape. She just popped the tape into the and so you

had games. He's just wall of beta tapes and you went and okay, let's grab the Florida State Miami game. Boom pop it in. Nowadays, with the way with the DV sport and the way they have things cut up for us, I mean I could physically go in and watch every third down throw that Josh Allen made, right from from the first throw to the last throw. I could say, okay, I could program and say show me all his intercepts, show me show me all his interceptions,

show me all his touchdown passes. Yeah, when we want. Yeah, that's how we watch it. Oh, we're watching tape and it's just one crappy play after the next one, like, oh my god, this guy's terrible, and you realize that it's all lumped together. Yeah, then you get to the good plays and you're like, oh, this guy never does anything wrong. They had they had it now to the point where they could break plays down to like for an offensive lineman run pass. You know, they could break

it down to pass sets. They could break it down to down a distance. They could. It's so much different than when I was. But to feel good about a player, like I say, when they cut up a player here and put it in that machine, I could watch a wide receiver and it's thirteen games, right, you know it's or you know some of the case of Ridley you're playing, you got playoff games. You could even go to well, we and we have talked to scouts though that's saying

you can't undervalue that. You can't forget the value of watching a full game of tape, not at all. How many how many games usually four per per player. Yeah, when you sit down back again back in the day and then in the nineties and early two thousands, you would sit down and you would you would you would find four really good games of a guy. You always want to see him against good competition. You know, you

would skip through some. You know, you would skip through some if a team had a really good set of wide receivers and you're watching a corner, that's what you try and do. You try and watch him. I was watching today. I was watching Boseman, the center from Alabama. Yeah, and he was playing in the in the National Championship game,

and I was watching him trying block Roquant Smith. That sounds fun and you know, and he you know, if he was getting him one at it every four times, I was like, Okay, that's a pretty good day right there. But yeah, I think that usually four games, if you're just doing straight, straight tape, is what you would do.

You made me do this in the first segment, So I'm gonna return the favor Dylan wants us to compare Rashaan Evans and Leyton vander esh and say, two of the definite favorites to be the pick at number nineteen. Just what are you getting in each of them? What does one do that the other doesn't do as well. Yeah, I'm just looking at my notes for Rashaun Evans, and if he gave me a choice of one over the other,

I'm gonna take Evans. Okay, So I'm gonna take And I think that with Evans, and this is a square player, and I mean squaring the way the way he plays along the line of scrimmage. He finds his way to the ball. He plays off blocks. He sometimes he'll guess a little bit, not as much as what we saw with our guy at at the University of Texas that tends to guests at linebacker Malik Malik. But but he does have quick reactions. He can work through the cracks

and the gaps. He'll fall back inside to make tackles. He's not afraid to step up and take on blockers. He's a physical player. I think that's the biggest difference between him and Vanderish. I think this guy is I think Evans is a much more physical player. I think Vanderish, for his size, relies more on his athletic ability to get sideline to sideline to kind of avoid blocks. Danes right, you watch the Oregon game Oregon in block. But Oregan's

got one player Crosby the offensive tackle. You know everybody else's can't block. Yeah, you know that's why the coach left to go to Florida State. I mean it's a good job, but still, you know you're in a situation right now where you know Vanderish, I'm watching him and he's just running past guys. Guys aren't even be getting

second level blocks on him. So I think that's the really, really biggest the difference I like to evans I think he will give himself up to help a teammate, Like he will give himself up on a block, take on two blocks. So some one of his teammates, you know, Mica Fitzpatrick or somebody, can come up and make a tackle. He will. He will do that. So I think he's got a really good concept of that. Like Vanderesh, though he can cover some ground. I just like the physicality

of him more than I do Vanderish. That's the way I kind of say that is the one thing I love about evans Y. He just brings the thunder. Oh he just keeps. He attacks, He attacks, he attacks, and he's he's physical. He hits and like I say, Vanderesh tends to get when he is in like position to take on Blox, he will kind of his head will

go down. He will go down like his shoulders. His head goes down, and then he kind of misses, you know, he kind of a miss miss taken on the block and then it kind of affects him on the tackle. Vanderish can cover. Though. Vanderesh can cover. His athletic to cover, he can run. He is the sideline to online player. Don't compare him to Bobby Carpenter, though I know some people out there they're thinking because he's a white linebacker, he's Bobby Carpenter. He's not Bobby Carpenter. He's a much

better player, much better athlete than Bobby Carpenter. How much more time we got, I'll tell you what one more and then we will. How about I promise oft the board here? I promised to go off the board. Uh let's see here, everybody's on board with Jack SINCHI, by the way, that's something. Yeah, fire question real quick. The next question I see here on Oh boy, let's see. Yeah, vander Esh gets lost in the trash. I don't always see that, you know, I don't, But anyway. Okay, well,

we gotta go to break. I didn't get a question, FeAs a little bit. There's something I want to talk about on the other side. Okay, we're not to tease it. Then what do you got. Well, let's let's address the elephant in the room created by this des okay situation. We'll do that next. Cowboys fans know that the second best of anything simply won't cut it, and your skincare

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You are a member of Cowboys Nation, and so is AT and T doing their part to keep you connected to America's team all season. Law AT and T is a proud member of Cowboys Nation. This is the Dallas Cowboys dot Com drapped you Cowboys on the clock. We're back here in the SWBC. Morgan Steves Brian brought us David Hellman, Dame Burglar out today. Hope we'll have him back thirst yet, I think, but we're getting close to

this NFL Draft. I also want to thank Ken Garrison for executive producing today, has always done a great job throughout the draft, and Kaden and Dave and TV for all the highlights and stuff that they have been putting up and making the content even better for us. David, tell me something about since I'm kind of saying nice things about people, tell me something nice about Tommy John underwear. Uh, it's the most comfortable pair of underwear I've ever worn. Actually,

I saved a pair. I was out of town. I picked the best time to go out of town for a wedding, but I saved a pair of Tommy John for today. I didn't take it to the wedding because I wanted to have I was like, I'm gonna be miserably tired on Monday. I got home at midnight when to bed came here, and I was like, I want to feel good about I want to feel comfortable and feel like I can take on the world when I go to work on Monday. So that's what I'm doing

right now, wearing some Tommy John. It's awesome Tommy John dot com Forward slash Cowboys. There you go, get twenty percent off your order. You some Tommy John. That's what it's all about. You said something about the elephant in the room up, that elephant residing in the Great Northwest, the elephant that wears teal and navy blue. You're yeah, whatever those damn colors are. I don't know. Um, I'll get I mean, okay, is this why you made this move?

I don't know if you're freeing up money to do this or you fear you have money to go All right, let's let's let's bring it and let's tie it into the draft. Are you willing to again? I am not John Schneider, my my long time buddy, an intern, former intern. He is not getting anything more than my fiftieth pick. That's it. I'm not going to give him any more

than fifty. And I think to get this guy done, that's a great way to set this up, because I think you're making a mistake if you think that that's what this means. You're like, oh, they cut that you were going here? Yeah, I like it, I like it. Yeah, Yeah, you're making a mistake if you think that. They're just like, yeah, this is what we're doing. We're freeing up some space. We're going after Earl. Yeah. But again, that's kind of

the MLA. This team is. You make moves, free you up to be as flexible as possible in the draft, right right, Well, you got three picks in the first two days. You got way more cap space than you used to. You know, this is just me supposing, but Seattle is probably asking for a lot right now. They do not have a second or a third round. Maybe when that clock starts ticking on Thursday or Friday, all

of a sudden, that price becomes a little more negotiable. Right, And again, I have no idea if this is going to happen. If I was a betting man, I would say no way, I really, I don't think so. If I had to guess, I would say no. But it is not like a week ago it was not possible. I don't think you can't, Like you can't give up what you'd have to give to get him and pay him and manage all those salaries. Yeah, it is possible now it is. It's totally possible now it is. Will

it happen? I doubt it. But maybe you call him on Thursday or Friday and have a little chat and see how they I talked to him Thursday morning for the day the morning the draft. You would I would I thought you said you did talk to him. No, No, I would tell me more. If I was the Cowboys, Yeah, I'd call John Snyder Thursday morning, I said, you've changed your mind on that guy. I'd call him again Friday morning, Oh sure, and say, yeah, you're not going to pick

tonight unless you want to do to do some business. Yea. So well, that's the thing about it, too, is he's got to figure out that he's got to look at the situation, say, he's probably not going to get role Thomas back, and he's dismantling that defense one piece at a time. Is what he's doing. Would you give you would not give up fifty and eighty one? Nope? What about fifty and one sixteen? Nope? Fifty and one ninety two nope? Really seriously, seriously, I would give up fifty.

I would give up fifty and one thirty seven. No reason too, Okay, no reason too. He's the one, He's the one all pro well. Would let me ask you this, would you would you give up eighty one on a one year rental? Yes? Only eighty one? Yeah, that's what I'm saying. But I would I would give up fifty and a fourth with the nah, I would not sure, I would do it. I would do it, I know what, because he's the one. You've got the leverage here. He knows he's not going to resign the guy you've got

the leverage. But it like, you know what's if you if you don't you know what, if you don't want them, if you don't want my pick, I'll go draft a player. I just scared money. Don't make money. That's the cliche I was trying to use. Yeah, I don't, I don't. I'm not sing. You know what. Let me let me be honest with you. We gave Seattle two first round picks, one time for a player they owe the Cowboys. That's

not how this works. Oh, it should be none if the football gods, Oh, Jerry Garry and Stephen Jones are the only people on either side who are still around to be part of it. I'm here. Oh I remember when he said he two ones. I almost I threw up in my mouth. You're not in the room where it happens, John Hamilton, John Mike Holmgren told me he said, Hey, I only asked for the one. I only ask for the one first one. I some I severely doubt that

this happens. But you know, okay, but but but all all spring, I've kind of rolled my eyes, like, sure, why are we talking about this? But it's I'm not rolling my eyes anymore. You're trying to get a Seattle type of a scheme in the secondary with players, you know, moving byron, join whatever you have to do. Why not go get the guy that could play free safety, that understands it to explain it to those young kids better than anybody. If you can get Seattle to play ball,

I think it's it's a good idea. Probably not good talking about a guy in or contract this way. But yeah, we're it's all speculation. Literally. I was going to talk about it on Twitter on the twenty. Yeah, and I couldn't assign it to one guy because so many people out know. They wanted on on periscope too, They were asking about that. But to them, I say to you, yeah, I don't know. If I'm on camera right now pointing right at you. Yeah, there we go. You. Yeah, if

you're expecting it to happen, you're making a mistake. Yeah, but it is in the realm of we've talked about it now, it's plausible. Yeah, it's plausible. Absolutely, it's it's plausible. So that's how I feel. I don't give up more than I have to, Dave, because I don't feel I have to. I feel like a second round pick is more than the fair for a thirty year old safety that I'm gonna have to pay fifty for Earl. I know we've definitely we've talked about going fifty up to

go get with somebody maybe better. I know we've had this exact conversation, but I forgot your answer. Fifty for Earl or nineteen and fifty for Darwin James or Roquan whatever I like you, like Smith, Smith or James is the one I'm trading up for. You like you, you always want the younger guy. And I you know, fifty fifty for the linebacker would be good for me. Fifty for the safety would be good for me. Yeah, I'm

just trying to say. I'm just trying to say, though, if you want fans out there to be back on board with what you're trying to do in this front office, oh boy, you go make this move. I mean, not that they not that they care what we think. That I mean I was about to say, but that is on out of the way to let us know how much they don't care what we Well, no, that's a thing. Oh no, absolutely. But see that's what I'm saying though, that you could you say, hey, we had to take

Dez's money to go do this right. Like I've said all spring long, that you're a You're not a better team with Dez Bryant off the roster, Bright, but with Alan Hearns on the roster, Das off the roster, and he who must not be named he must not be named yet on the roster. I'm sure. Yeah, you're cooking with gas you might, and you'd still have nine other

picks to do this stuff with. I just worry about going up in this draft now, David, Why because I think these I think the quarterback situation is still so murky. You know, where's where's it gonna you know what, what's the price going to be? It's somebody gonna hold me up for a two and a four to get up in there. You know. Yeah, I've done this, I've done all those studies. If I want to go to San Francisco at two and a four, I want to go

to Oakley at ten two and five. There's there's there's your you know, there's your having to give up multiple picks and then and you know, I see, to me, that's worth it more so than paying a giving it for a thirty year old safety. Yeah, that's where I could stomach given to two and a four to San Francisco if I knew I was gonna get Quand Smith or Derwin James. Yeah, but I hear you, you know with with a thirty year old safety that I'm gonna have to really pay. Yeah, John take my fifty police.

I know I said it at the top of the show. I mean nothing that happened with Dez should drastically alter their their their strategy. But does this team do you think this team hasn't has so many pressing needs that they can't afford to trade up, Like between you want to find a receiver week that's obvious. You need a linebacker who can play right away, and you probably at least want a guard who can compete with the guys that are here for that starting staff. Is that well?

I wonder if this is a big smoke screen not bringing in any guards, but they put in those tackles. They brought in mcclinchey and Miller, which tells me that they would consider are moving Lyle Collins that they drafted mcclinchy. They brought in, didn't they brought in like a mid some mid round guard type guys, didn't they Washington State kid? Yeah? Madison, you're absolutely right about it, Yeah, Madison. So maybe maybe they're talking about a top guy like Hernandez or win

between Lyle, Marcus Martin, and Joe Looney. Maybe they just think that the guys that are here can do it. Not to say they don't want to draft the guy, but they don't want to spend a top fifty pick on a guy, and I can hear a lot of people screaming about that. I'm just offering there what they might be thinking. What would they scream more about? Honestly, what would be the one position that do you think they would scream about the offense of the guard? Would

they scream if they drafted mcclinchy. Somebody would, for sure, I mean I would. Why would you take it? Well, then they would probably say, we're gonna move Le Collins a guard, thank you very much. Their needs are so diverse and the options that we've presented are so far flung that I think somebody will be really happy about damn near anything that they do, and somebody will be really mad about it. I mean, I wouldn't want them to draft Mike McGlinchey because I don't want them to

move Lyle Collins. But I can make a compelling case for why Mike McGlinchey is a great pick. Yeah. Well, I mean it's easy to do. But sure, Tyrone's injury history, the fact that he could start right away, the fact that he gives you great depth. Yeah, you put him next to Zach Martin. Yeah, and hopefully you get him and him McGlinchey and Nelson Collin and then I mean, it won't make Lyle Collins happy, but you'll I mean, you move him to guard, you'll have a pretty fantastic

starting five. I'm not doubting that so but that, I mean, that's the beauty of it. It's it's so wide open that I think there will be people that will be really happy about whatever they decide to do and people that will be really mad about it. That's I mean, if they don't, if they have not drafted a guard by the end of Friday, there will be a lot of people that are really upset about that. I don't know if they will be, but yeah, just the way it goes, all right, man, that's about all the time.

Oh wow, look at that. About that, I thought we were gonna miss Dane. We did just fine without him. Well sometime, Yeah, we do miss Dane out Sterile as a fountain of knowledge, no doubt about that. Again. I want to thank David Hellman for always coming with some great content. Ken Garrison, we thank Kayden, Dave, those guys and TV. I want to thank everybody out there for fall along with us. I want to thank the folks out there on periscope as well. Folks that watched us

later on, we appreciate you stay tuned. Shannon Gross and his band of pirates are going to come in here and do a little show for you and hang out with him, maybe some carry on, some conversation, maybe some more desk talk for you, Bill Drafts, you will be back next Thursday at eleven am Central. We'll see then, keep watching the tape.