Draft Show: Combine Recap

into the Draft Show presented by Miller White. We are back at the Star in Frisco and the s WBC studios with the entire crew. Bobby Belt, Zach Walchuck, Brian brought us Aisha Boris, and I'm Kyle Yeoman's everybody, how are we doing? Doing great? Being great? I really enjoyed you guys. Uh Zack and I were on local we were having to do baseball coverage this past week. You guys did a heck of a job from the combine. Thank you, really really good job Dallas Cowboys dot Com.

Bobby covering it for a one oh five three of the fan uh super Information super Interviews, you guys did uh you know with Will McClay. I was listening to that one the other day. If he can't go back and listen to that. It gives you, you, guys, ask some great questions, gave you some great insight of really how they're looking at these players coming up. I think it was really really well done on your guys part. Had some big time. Fomo was listening to it all

the way back the fight. Yeah, you got question. Really did well and I had Fomo and spring training. You know, I'm a base pay I know you are. We if we could have been in both places at the same time, we would have found a way to do it. We'll get teleportation down at something himself, because you're not a na of them. My body still recovered from Dunalton. If we could beat two places at once, well fair never fair enough. I'm right back in the basketball mode too,

So yeah, it works out. Bobby, how was your combine? It was great. It was way too brief. I learned, don't drop in on Friday, because then everybody that you want to hang out with and see is is telling you I've been going way too hard four nights in a row and I don't feel like going a fifth. Then you go, okay, I guess we'll get coffee in the morning or something. So but it was it was. It was a good trip. I just need to get there earlier next year, Brian. We need to lobby to

get you there. Next year, we're gonna pound the table. Let's say baseball. Like thirty years of my life was spent at that place, some guys. I'm glad you guys got you. I got lost in the skywalk like three different times. I was trying to get to the Omni. At one point I was like, this is supposed to connect, and it didn't. It didn't. It's okay. Brian and I couldn't find his car when we got back from the airport either. We walked around like a No. I didn't

get Toad. Yeah, that was something I talked about on the air. I thought I was gonna get Toad from DFW because I parked in one hour parking for a whole weekend. What, Yeah, didn't happen. It wasn't. It wasn't clear that I wasn't supposed to be there. I don't know. I didn't get towed, But you didn't get toad. You're fine, No, it's here. It didn't get stole. I parked in one hour parking now here at the Star and we're gonna be here an hour twenty. We'll say that I'll get

you out. We'll make sure it's good. But yes, I agree. Next year the goal is to get everybody. The combine sounds Goodbody was there? Aisha killed it. We had Patrick Walker there as well, Alex Lily who ran everything and set up the draft show. Everybody was phenomenal. Late, stayed a whole day, stayed late, crushed it just to talk to Jerry Jones. He did that for everybody. So just when you look at us and what we're doing, look at Alex Lily too, all right and Chris Beam in

the back. So let's talk about the combine. Who who raised up your draft boards? Who started to shoot upward for your draft boards based off of what you saw at the combine? Aisha, why I gotta go first? Could you look down? And I made it very odd because you got a lot of notes over there, lady. I was reading, and I was reading. I think I'm a little higher on Roderick Jones than I was initially. Okay, I think a lot of people thought at Ohio State.

I think a lot of people were already high on him, but I still want to see how he how he tested, how he looked, and he pretty excuse me, George, Yeah, I'm thinking to Jones. I was thinking, Dawan Jones, my bad. Oh different Jones. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I was I mean, four nine forty. He actually is taller than what people expected. They thought he was gonna come in at six four. He's six five. Um, the length is there, and I just feel like he tested what I just some of

these guys, I mean, especially the offensive lineman. I think that teams are trying to decide do I value technique or do I just value power? And my guys bigger than you, And he's one of those guys that has a little bit of both to me and a good amount of both. So he has some versatility from what I'm looking at. Yeah, he talk, Oh I got him in that. Yeah, I've got him absolutely. I think he's right in the mix. When you start to talk about

what he potentially could bring a team. You watch that tape, man, I mean, he gets off the ball, he gets into people, he gets up the field. He you know, he's mobile, the agility, all those things that you want. I think I just nailed him about. There were some probably a little bit of questions about some of his technique, but then the more you watch him, the more you study him, you see that, like, listen, this guy is. He's a young guy that's got just really so much upside to

his game because how long and how powerful he is. Yeah, I'm a big fan of his. He's a mean maler. Yeah, I think you're on something there. I was just shocked at how athletic Darnel Washington ended up being like that dude, holy lye cow. I mean I had him eleven offensive lineman. Yeah, okay, So I tweeted that. I tweeted that I thought this could be Jason Peters because Jason Peters did the same thing that Arkansas. I was a tied end and then converted offensive tackle and had a Hall of Fame career

as an offensive tackle. But then you watched like to your point and you're looking at me where all of a sudden, No, I just believe I thought it was a joke. No, no, no, no, when you watched the tables best attribute as the block, No, no, no joke. Here. There are people scouts across the league who will tell you they some of them think tackle is his future. Wow. I tweeted that just thinking of because back in my day, way back in my day, Jason with Jason Peters thought

the same thing. I'm thinking, this guy's a good time George has got great tight ends. Let's not man. They mean they it's incredible. You might have a top ten pick next next year for sure. But see, that's what I'm saying about this guy when you watch him hit the sled and to your point about power and drive, and but then he goes out and he makes these one handed catches and stuff like that, and you're like going, Okay, maybe he's not a tackle, you know, maybe he is

a tighty. But man, I mean that's when I thought, put thirty pounds on this guy. Put twenty five pounds on this guy and let him go be an offensive I think he I think he's got a shot of being a really, really good well because he does. He looks like he's a third offensive tackle on the field. I mean, he is a difference maker in the run game, and he kind of lumbered around like he moves well for his size at six foot seven. There's no doubt

about it. I didn't think like he was unathletic four short shuttle, but he ended up having the best short shut and then he ran what was it a four six four forty Yeah, like holy cow that I didn't think he would put up anywhere near those kind of numbers. And now I think maybe I need to relook at where do I have my tight end rankings. He really

understands the leverage. Yeah, I feel like even even watching him do the sled drills like you see the things that are on film translate as far as him understanding leverage, getting getting under his past absolutely and understanding his strength using his bass. So I guess ill I cannot believe, y'all. I mean, I do understand it. But I just thought people were saying, like, oh, he could be because he's

such a good blocking tight end. Yeah he can be an extra lineman, but child for real, like this man, Yeah, they didn't met that. I just I just I just started thinking about Jason Peters. That's so I thought of and I and I and Jason Peters is had a Hall of Fame career tackle It was it was a was a tight end at Arkansas. Do you think so? Do you think that be an immediate switch would that

be a rookie seasons go on. I'm just like I say, it's you know, weird things you start to think of, like it's the whole thing when you look at John Michael Smith's from Minnesota and you're thinking and you're thinking like, well he could play guard, and then you think about our kid that from North Dakota State, the kid up there though mount Yeah, yeah, I think it's I think I think it's Malk. I had a North Dakota State Bison fan reached out to me and said I was

pronouncing it wrong. So who knows did he say used guys whenever you said when he didn't say it's what you said, he said it's Malk. So maybe we should fact Okay, well, let's okay, I'm gonna fact check it right, fact check that. See. But anyway, there's a guy that you know, you all of a sudden, he's a tackle and I'm looking at him as a center, you know, I mean, there's a guy. Sometimes you watch these guys and you're thinking some of these corners, you think, well,

this guyuld be a better safety. I did it with Stevenson from Miami. Same thing. You know, you see you see a corner playing. But you're thinking, man, I think he could play safety, or I think this this tackle could play center. You know, It's just it's just the weird game that scouts play and it's not something that

you know right now. I mean I would be I would be really interested to see if we start to hear some buzz once we get closer to the draft, what Bobby's talking about our scouts saying, Man, this kid Washington, you could play him at you know, you could play him at tackle. He would be a good tackle. We start to hear maybe some more people are talking about that position switch. All right, here we go. I've got a I've got a pronunciation here ready, Cody mouk? It

is mauk. How about that? Thank goodness, I got nervous. Am I about to get dunked on? Here? What's going on? No? Good job? Well done, dude. All right, so i'd players We've mentioned Cody Mount. Now I'm gonna have to say that a couple times to get it in the brain. Darnell Washington, did any of these quarterbacks surprise you a little bit? And what they're able to do? I mention one growled out of Ohio State. Can I mention one

guy real quick. For myself, sure, DJ Turner of the cornerback from Michigan, when I saw him run in all this, Okay, Now, to me, that's guy's kind of a nickel corner. I mean, he's a nickel slot player to me. And I, you know, I think that's one of those things where now you've got to kind of go back and say, well, do you think he could play on the outside? You know, do you think he could? You know, he's he's five eleven,

he's one hundred and seventy eight pounds. You know. That's the problem I'm having And I don't know if you guys are having this problem too. I'm looking at all these slight guys. You know, our guy, guy miss to be stay Pops Forbes one sixty six, you know, and the guy could play his ass off, and you're like, going,

but he's won sixty six, you know. And then I used to know you talk to him and he's like, no, I played at one seventy five or one seventy three or whatever like that, and you're just but he's still you measuring. You see him at one sixty six, and you're like, but this is a damn good player, really good Turner's the same way to me, you know, I see one hundred and seventy eight pound guy and I'm liking.

I mean, I was watching the Michigan State game and I'm thinking he got bullied on the outside a little bit. But I think like he helped himself with because to play that inside position, you're gonna need to have quickness, You're gonna need to have speed, You're gonna need to have all those things. I think maybe some people kind of had him down a little bit, but I could see him being a guy that will rise up on some boards because of his speed. Where do you think

he's he a Day two guy? He's absolutely a Day two guy. Absolutely a Day two guys. So so I'm sorry to interrupt you about your quarterback. You're good. Well. Corner has been a huge topic of conversation. I'm sure that's going to continue because the Cowboys had notable interest in looking at some of the top corners during the week in Indianapolis, Guys like Devin Witherspoon out of Illinois, Deontay Banks out of Maryland, Christian Gonzalez out of Oregon.

There are multiple names in that cornerback category in a deep quarterback or a cornerback class. So now I kind of want to switch here. We'll talk about you're gonna have to dig in on banks. By the way, why is that You're gonna have to dig in. Yeah, yeah, you're gonna have to dig in. Some of the interview stuff and things wasn't great. Yeah, I think that, And

I'm not saying not great. I'm saying that there's things that these teams test on, you know, where they put you on the board or they ask you questions and stuff like that, and you know, there was some questions. There's some questions. This kid is a hell of a player. Man,

you throw the tape on you watch him move. I was watching him do that Al Davis flip your hip drill where they they they back, they pedal, they open, they open, they they just I mean, you're just like, and this guy's so thick and then he's bursting out of that, you know, and you're like, oh God, dang, I love to have this guy on my team. But

you're gonna have to dig in on this guy. You know, you're gonna have teams or I mean, I could see this being a guy that does a lot of thirty visits a lot of people that you know, talk to him, put him on the board, see what he really knows. See if he can you know, if he can adjust to to what you're trying to do scheme wise. But man, he is a hell of a football player athriticism wise. I mean, he's next level and he ran well too, tested well, did everything right. Everybody's seen him, right, does

everybody watching Deontay Banksy? Does it look simple to him? Is it made simple for him from a defensive scheme standpoint when you're watching some of the film to the point where if he does have to come up and do something different and have kind of a multiple look at the at the NFL level, do you think it's gonna Well, that's the whole thing though about Yeah, that's

the whole thing about these corners. Man, when they put you out there, you can't bust now because if you bust then all of a sudden, it's a huge play. You know, And and you know he played well at Maryland and you're you know, you're you know, I don't I'm not gonna sit and act like I know what you know, what what defense? What they're Yeah, I'm not gonna sit there and ask like what they're asking their guys to do. I'm just talking about the ability to

cover and stuff like that. But then you know, you start to hear those those whispers and stuff like that about well you need to you know, and they say they'd say dig in, dig in on him, you know, find ask other people, hey, how did this work for him? Did you get a chance to talk to him about this that the other So there's a lot more. The disadvantage we have here is we don't get to talk to now you you talk to players. You got you know,

at the Combine you got to talk to players. I didn't get to talk to players, and I know back then either, So there's things you can learn. So when you talk to teams about these players now you have

to figure out like, oh, okay, this is what's going on. Well, in regard to Deyance Banks, I I well, I was talking to some people there and I remember I came across a pretty dope decordinator and I mentioned like, hey, some of these guys are undersized, some of these guys do need have a learning curve and stuff, and he literally said, well, what's our job like that's our job, And so I think it depends on who you're talking to how immediately they want to plug in this player

also too, like because I think we've seen the last couple of years cornerback specifically, I feel like the position is on an uptick. I feel like we have a couple quite a few rookies coming in and making a difference immediately. Do you want that or do you want a guy that you maybe have to develop a little bit.

Because to your point about Deyonce, it's like some people gonna look at him and be like, he's so natural and he's so good if I have to teach him or how to simplify things for him as he grows to learn the position in oh well, But then some people are like, no, I need a cornerback too right now that can understand and everything right now and plug them in right now. And I think that that's the fact that that that that is always the coaching perspective.

I feel like it's like, you know, what's their job, It's to get it out of him. So it's that delicate balance of I can get it out of him, I'm supposed to coach him up. That's my job. Versus what could be dangerous sometimes, which is oh I can fix him. Yeah yeah, give me that clay and let me and that has burned. That's that's burned. This this building occasionally is the I can fix them and it doesn't always work out, and so um, you just you

need to be sure. Tyler Smith was a guy last year who they felt like they could they could fix his issues, and they were right because he had the work ethic. But that's why you have these Areas Scouts and these National Scouts and the whole staff to work on these things and understand, all right, this is the kid's work ethic, this is his drive, This is how easily I think he takes to coaching, this is how smart I think he is, and and it all comes together. Yeah,

you need all of it. Well, there's one other corner, and I don't know that he necessarily needed help, but Christian Gonzalez, local kid out of the colony. Oh man, and the drills you mentioned you, David, Yeah, the pedal And you get a lot when you're talking about those guys in the way they flipped and you're like, oh my gosh, he's just the way they breaks and the way he moves, so you don't hate him anymore, Brian, you hate him? You didn't never, no, no, no no.

Every time I've gotten to watch him, sometimes you get overlap. Right. You'll watch another player and they're playing against Oregon and it's like, oh gosh, there's Christian Gonzalez making another player destroyed that guy. Oh my goodness, there's Christian Gonzalez, and you start to like the player even more. And that's happened to me during this process with Christian Gonzalez, Porter Gonzalez Witherspoon top three for me, that's all in that order.

That's all I got it. I thought Porter was gonna run better, all right? Did that knock him down a little bit? No? Not no, I just I thought he would run better. I had heard him because I'll go to I'll go to State State College at I'll tell you. I thought it was really disappointing. Testing wise, was Jordan Addison. Jordon Addison Just look at this. Jordan Adison came in. He's wearing one hundred and seventy three pounds. Darnel Washington

weighs two sixty four. Darnel Washington's ten yards split was one five seven. Jordan Adison's was one five six. Darnel Washington's vertical was thirty one. Jordan Adisons was thirty four. They both had a broad jump of ten two. It was awful athletic testing for a guy who's as slight as he is. Yeah, he's got he He didn't run the shuttle, he didn't run the three cone, and so Addison. I thought his testing was terrible, especially for a guy who weighs one seven. I'll be happy to go out

to LA and get that time for you. I'll do love LA every time a year. I'd be happy to go. Are you fly into all these is American airlines? We're gonna drop mama. Yeah. Absolutely. Let me ask you this so real quick before we hit this break, before we hit this break. Uh, the dude, with this testing stuff, have we learned our lesson on this? Have we learned our lesson about testing? I don't think our lesson is seven. That's I'm sane. When you watch these kids play on tape,

you know, I think it's part of the puzzle. But man, just if you said you can have the workout of the tape, give me the tape. Sure, give me the tape every single time but yes, but when there is if you just completely ignore the athletic testing, you also get Tease Taver from Florida. That's that's a good plan. I think that you gotta take all the information and

put it together and come to a decision. And I think I think it's taped mostly, and so when Addison's testing so just aggressively seems to depart from what you see on tape, I think it's at least going, Okay, what happened here? Or why is this the case? Charles Harris a number of years ago when he was coming out of Missouri, he tested poorly. Yeah, now that was he said it was over fatigue and too much working

and had heavy legs. Better, his Friday was better. But then Charles Harris didn't do great at the next level. There's not a whole lot of you know, really poorly testing great tape guys that then carry over. Some of them do. But but Orlando brown there there's the Orlando Browns one of them who did um. But he was awful, especially when you're talking about you're talking about when you're talking about positions like corner and receiver. It was a great tackle now, but he testing was bad. No, he

was awful. I think his vertical was like twelve inches. Yeah. No, But the when you look at receiver and corner in those positions, it's that's where when it's bad testing and making them go okay, which, by the way, good testing. Your guy at Perry ran better than you know. We're here in buzzy. Yeah. At Perry definitely impressed more for seven. Not a bad player. Shout out to Jackson Smith and Jigba wide receiver one. Why do you do this, Ohio State?

Let you know, because your wide receiver rankings are pretty poor. Uh, and then you know when it comes to Jordan Addison, though, I gotta say at Perry played at wake Forest. He did play. He did play at wake Forest and Jackson Smith and Jigba rock Wall Zone Ohio State, and he's just STI okay, he's wide receiver one. But Addison, you watch gen right, Nishan's brother, and he bullied him all

day that Oregon State USC game. That's the one thing that's got me nervous about Addison because there's tape like Stanford crushes it, right, he was crushing it against Utah until he got hurt. So there's a lot of things to like about Jordan Addison. I'm with you, but when he plays against these more physical, big press corners, they really did give him problems. Yeah, I think it's interesting because you talk about the tape, you talk about the workouts.

Even Dan Brugler talked about it in Indianapolis. But you have to marry the two of them. You don't have to marry him fifty fifty. You have to marry him eighty twenty. The good teams find the right balance, and for the most part, the team across the Way it has found a good balance of how to weigh the workouts, which is pretty heavy. They do. They do care about the workouts and then marry that with the tape and

be able to have the one two punch. And I think all these players that were mentioning here, you have to keep that as an extra bullet point and not the whole story. I think this team across the Way here has figured out that to take the second best player on the board. If you have to feel like all of sense, like, oh do I take the fifth or sixth best corner or take the second best guard, I think they figured out to take the second best

guard and then work the draft from there. That's why I don't think that they're you know, they got to appointment where like to me, when they're bored, when they're the way their board falls, they're like, take that guy, take that guy, and then they work from there, instead of saying, well, okay, the second best guards on the board, which we could use, but by the way, we got to have this defenseive end. Oh he's the sixth best

defensive end. Because they're picking at twenty six or twenty seven down in the bottom, you know, they figured out, let's just start the draft taking the best player and then we'll work from there. I think it's a great plan that they have. I really do. That makes a

lot of sense because then you're not pigeonholing yourself. You're not and you're getting you're starting your draft off the right way, and you're not chasing it by oh wow, we you know you look up there, man, we got this guy graded so well, but we're gonna take the sixth best defensive end. You know, I don't think that does you any good. Now, that's a really good point. You've seen that the last couple of years. All right, when we come back, it's starting for a little Twitter.

On the twenty, We're gonna answer some questions on the Draft Show straight from Twitter. If you want to continue to ask your questions, go ahead and do it because I'm gonna send them to Brian for tomorrow as well when we come back you're on the Draft Show. Hey Cowboys fans, if you're looking for a full time or part time job, check out Liberty Tax, proud partner of the Dallas Cowboys. If you've got tax experience and want to help your community with their finances, you're the perfect candidate.

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light Beer. It's Miller Time. Celebrate Responsibility twenty twenty one, Miller Brewing Company for Words, Texas. This is the Dallas Cowboys dot Com Draft Show. Back here on the Draft Show presented by Miller Lighte, the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys. It's Miller time and it's draft time. Here from the Star in Frisco, Bobby Belt, Zach Wilchuck Brian

brought us Ayisha Morrison, Chris Beam in the back. Who's about to hit the sounder for some twitter on the twenty Yeah, we don't have to make the noises this time around. You like it? Let me alone? We had to. We had to get creative in Indie, so made work. Speaking of indeed, speaking of those shows Indie, by the way, I just letting did you? Oh okay, I didn't know

that the other years. I love it is out. I love it all right, Brandon asked, based off of one of the conversations we have with Will McClay and Endy he talked about biases. Yeah, when watching film surrounding by a certain position, he didn't like the fact that he wore a towel, or that players wear towels. Wear a towel, you're out. That's the bias. He's had to kind of

suppress some of that throughout his career. What are some of your biases, Brian Brandon asked you specifically, But I want to hear from the group because we all watched the table. We all have the fun with it. Brian will let you start. If you're a bias, If you're a clapper after every play, if you're clapping, you're a bad player. I'm just saying that because clappers are usually giving up place. They're always like, oh damn, you know.

They're like that. You know, And I can tell you every time it's done, it's like it's a big play, it's a it's a thirty yard pass, and then you got the guy tackle or he runs by as somebody else's tackling, and he seemed clapping. That's something Bobby reminded me. One one more two is my my weak offensive tackles And I've been burned by the weak offensive tackle. I mean, week when I talk about strength wise because there's been some guys like Nate sold Are, David Baktri, Terrence Steele,

the guys that aren't very strong at tackle physically. Tah, what's my guy with the raiderton, Milton Miller another one. You know I've been You weren't the only one biased against Colton Miller. That was a lot of people. Yeah, but that's what I'm saying though the week. The clapper and the weak offensive tackle are the biases that I have. So it sounds like, at least in the Will McClay mindset, he's trying to suppress his biases to get the player right.

It sounds like you're willing to do that for the strong offensive tackles. Are they're not so strong offen Yeah? Yeah, clappers out, that's a deal I need. I need to I need to rethink the weak offensive tackle one. But the clapper that that is my trying true right there. Our next homework assignment as a group is to find a clapper in this draft. Watch there's you. We'll be watching, You'll be watching tape and you'll go and it happens the later you get in the draft and start making

when you when you start getting at fifth, sixth, seventh round. Guy, A lot of clapping going on basketball court because I wasn't a very good basketball player. There go go Zach. Do you have any biases? No, I don't have any bond now. The one bias that I have, maybe that you could say, is I hate the pile jumpers, the guys that I mean. Maybe you're around the football. You know, you read the play, okay, and then next thing you know, it's like I didn't actually make the play, but I

want to be seen. Maybe I can get credit for half a tackle, and I'm just gonna I'm gonna throw my body in there. I'm gonna jump in. Hey, I'm part of this thing. I'm gang tackling with you boys. I'm in here. But realistically, you didn't make the bleep in play. So when Brian just gave his examples, do you have any examples of what description? I'm just asking that you know, you've got anybody know, anybody that used to play here. You know who's a good example that

plays on the Giants? Uh, like a fifty four jail number. Hey, don't talk about Bob Lilly that way. He was the pile Mike Morris from Michigan. Oh, Mike Morris from Michigan. It's the dude that you want off the bus to lead the team off the squad, Like, damn, that guy looks he's not good. He's going to Las Vegas. He is not good. He's like, I'm not gonna do anything. I'm not productive. But every once in a while, like I'll jump in there. Hey, look at me. I was

part of this. Mike Morris is one of those guys from me. Wow, looks the part. Did you have an example, Bobby of the pile jump. Sure, no, it wasn't my standard. It's is I was asking, do you have any bias? You love a good pile jumps? So if so, Brian gave the one. Petty gave the petty bias and then the actual scouting bias. So I'll give both. Uh. The receiver that's towering over everybody is because I've been burned too many times by big, stiff receivers treadwell and guys

like that that. I was like, oh, they're gonna be chase if I see if I see the receiver that he's just clearly above everybody else, Like in high I'm like, oh, this isn't gonna play out well, and so I'm against that. That's a physicality one the body language one. Any quarterback that I ever see do that just kind of the shrug and throw their hands up, just like, oh my gosh, what do we gotta do here? Whenever I see that, I'm like ear soft, but like, and it's a bias.

It's it's not necessarily always no, but I mean it's as stroud. I didn't feel like was was the big heavy throw the arms. I'm the guy that you think Josh Allen has died saw Josh Allen Wyomian even though I like Josh Allen um and I mean, gosh, some of the greats of Peyton Manning did it all the time. But when I see it at the college level, I'm always like, that feels like a dude who's just trying to shift the responsibility away from himself visibly to the show.

But he like was not me. I don't know what happened there. Yeah, one dang um. So one of my real like on film biases, especially on the defensive side of the ball, is motor because what else do you have to do at least be active. It's it's one of the few things. It's like, even if they're not in the play, at least look like you're trying to be involved in the play. I know it's not fair whatever,

but it is a bias to me. And then also too, this is this is probably unfair because I think Blake Blake Freeland from b YU have real bad Why are you always smiling? Listen that grin off your face? Nah, I saw positions. I don't want you smiling. You ain't supposed to be nice. No, it's probably nice. They're not lacking, nasty, not wrong. There's some there's some people that I'd be like,

stop cheessing at him. I mean, you just want to get rid of all by players if that, because they all are smiling at all times, even at the combine like he was just I mean, he was killing it. But his game doesn't mimic that either. Yeah, So that's like, if you're gonna be cheessing at people and stuff, at least be a little disrespectful in your play. These are all really good, like all all sports. I'm sorry, great question the motor, but who's a big smiler who breaks

that in the league? And I'm trying to think of who's a big smile guy. I guess when when he was in the league was Andrew Luck. That was the first one where he's like, oh nice play dude, like slap him on the butt, Like, oh thanks, dude, you just hit me real hard. So yeah, Luck is WI breaks that. Philip is the same way. Philip Rivers was like that. He was talking mess but he was smiled, but he was talking. He would get dirty though, like

he'd getting nasty of people, kind of counteracted. Andrew Luck didn't really do that. Is that father in him? You got an example? No, No, I was looking at Freeland in his notes, but I didn't have anything about smiling in there. He go back watch the player, lack of power. He brought up the tackless Freelands making the Hall of Fame because both of you have bias. Yeah, there's no question.

Congratulations Freeland a great career. Listen, all right, Matt asked, did the combine make katy cowboys targets more likely or less likely? If so, who was who would fit in each of those categories? Bobby, I'll start with you. If there's anybody on the mine, did they may anybody anybody off the board or anybody's squarely on the board for Smith. There will be people off the board because of medicals. But the way they tested Nolan Smith, you know, if you had him, I think it. I thought it was

going to be close. Well here here, I guess there's the question. Are you're talking about tested their way out of Dallas's range or changed the Cowboys perspective potentially on them? Oh I took it as the I think the question was asked by Matt for what Bobby's saying. But I but I'm not against talking about what Brian saying either. Because Nolan Smith tested out of reach for Dallas. I

think because of the way that he did. Think what he did in Indianapolis running a four three ninety fastest by a defensive linean out of the entire group and one of the fastest Smith and Jig but might have too. I was gonna go with Jackson. Jackson, I think that that's the guy. I was surprised to even see him kind of being mocked around the Cowboys range. I think he's a guy that should be a topic you feel like. I feel like the guy the receiver that you might

be looking at. If a first round receiver on my board might be Johnston from TCU. Okay, that might be the guy. I think Jaddison's going to be gone. Yeah, that's kind of where I'm at. If you talk about a guy awesome, I think Smith and Jibber goes up. I think Johnston probably comes down. That's that's kind of where Jalen Hyatt might have raised his stock too. He was phenomenal, ran slower than a lot of people boots

on grow. A lot of people were like expecting him to run fast really and that he was supposed to be low for three and granted, game tape shows something else like that's fine, whatever, he's a long strider tracking that. But he also too had a couple of drops and drills that people were just like, what's going on and yeah,

high it out of Tennessee. Maybe he's there at twenty six, So to me, real quick torrents with weight loss down to three thirty might might be something that pushes him, you know, if if people really they dig in on him. I know a lot of people had him mocked at Dallas at twenty six, but someone might say, well give me. People are saying Skeronsky from Northwestern's of Guard, he's gone. You don't worry about him. But Torrence, he might be

a guy that everybody had mocked to the Cowboys. That might be one that goes two three picks before you. It's kind of like Kenyon Green last year. Yeah, and n same kind of thing. Had an early thought and then he goes at fifteen. Sure when you thought he would fall to twenty four, one of the top guys at a position. You're going to see those guys go early, and then those wide receivers too. Bobby mentioned sir, I'm sorry, no, no no, no, goad bad. But Bobby mentioned Rashi Rice

like his forty his split time being better. I'm sorry, I probably should have got the exact number of but his split time being better than what people expected. He showed some explosiveness off of the line like that. I think is going to help him because we worry about the separation and stuff. So but you say, would you being this explosive off the line, we can refine your route running a little bit more than he might be

a problem. Also to being in the DFW area. I feel like he might have upticked a little bit of people looking at him. Give now. He tested one four nine ten split on a four five one forty, So he's got that exploit. His vertical was good. Dig in. I was trying. I was having trouble thinking about it. I was like, was there anybody who athletic testing wise? I think just that maybe would have been of interest to them, that maybe the testing didn't hit the right

parameters and I wasn't thinking of. And then Sanders Kashaw Boutet, ok they do like explode, They like more explosive type receivers. The ten year it split there was one five eight. The vertical is twenty nine inches. I mean that's not nine inch vertical on Boutet. I think would be tough for them to go. So if you're talking about somebody who got their way out of their attention, probably Boute Yeah.

That makes a lot of mems from Oklahoma come back into play for them because of the testing, because the testing, but the size, the height, I mean, he was a guy. I mean, you're gonna have to figure out all these flowers from you know, flowers boss in college downs North Carolina, Mems Oklahoma. Tell me when you guys figure these receivers out, these slight receivers, just please let me know and I'll

I'll trust you question. The question with mems is do they just again it's not about size to them so much as do they think he can can do other things, live outside or does he have to be in the slot. If they think he can do more than inside the slot, than yeah, I think he's he's and I would I'd guess they think he could play outside some and so I don't think he'd be off the boar for them. He ran faster than I know. There were people keenly aware of his training that thought he was going to

run four four nine five. For him here at four

three eight, that's awesome, and so there there was. He was a surprise I think in terms of and even still for people who were more optimists about him, I think they thought low four four so fro him to come at four three eight I think was huge him well, and he's a guy when when you hear Mike McCarthy talk about what they want its offense to do, you know, quick reads, where we're gonna get the ball out quick, just get him in space, put the ball in his hands.

And Marvin Mims is a guy that can go and get you that yack after the catch. And I think Marvin would fit this offense very very well. He could be a contested catch guy too. He is. He's got great body control, goes up high points to football. He makes some dazzling plays when you watch him in Oklahoma. I will say on Hyatt, even though he didn't run as fast as people thought, it may have been a

bad training day or something like that. I don't know, um, but I was down there Friday night watching him work out get ready for the Saturday run. That's the first guy that I've watched run and trained that he literally looked blurry when he would run. He is, so I think I was stunned. It was just I think because when I watched him run that back end of his his run, it just he literally looks like a blur

when he runs. It's insane. The only guys I have above Hyatt or Flowers, Johnston, Addison and Smith and Jigba, and not in that order. It's actually reversed Smith and Jigba first a good eye. I'm right there with you, boy. I think Johnston came in much lighter than were expecting. Is that because what did he come in at? He was at one in at two o eight. Okay, he was at one at least on the website print when Johnson was two fifteen. Oh what am I looking at? Then?

I don't know here, I know where my numbers are wrong. Quinn Quentinn Johnston, I know I've got his ear before. People thought he was going to be around two fifteen, and it's just he's he came he came in at two o eight um, and I don't know. It'll be interesting to see where he weighs at at the end of the month when they have pro day for TC. I'll be interested to see what his weights out then.

But there's I was talking to one person in Indy this week and they were talking about Quentin Johnston's play string and uh they went like this, and then they hold up there and I was like, what is that and they're like that's his arm. Yeah, like he just doesn't have any bolt. Oh interesting, real real quick. They want to get one more question in here before we

get going, Kyle asked, and no, it's not me. Kyle Whitchman asked, would you draft Andrew Voorhees out of USC guy offensive, I'm in towards ACL in the middle of the testing, in the middle of the workout, would you draft him and where would you draft him? As the question if you're the Cowboys. He's a guy that was a thought to be maybe a top one hundred pick interior offensive lineman, somebody that could maybe be a project

moving forward. But he's coming off of now a torn acl Do you think he would fit in that that sort of conversation, You get those compensatory picks, and they did it with Bruce Carter right, sure did. Yeah, this team has a history of taking players and trying to

kind of stash him and try and get him ready. Um, you know, I think it's always a possibility with that, especially like I say, with the compensatory picks, you know, to maybe say, okay, well, hey this is a guy that we we you know, I personally, if we're gonna stash somebody, I would do it with the Tennessee quarterbacks who I would do it. And Hooker that's who I

would stash. I like that idea. Yeah, you know, to me, if you know, if you're gonna if but I was talking with Dane Burglar driving over this morning, and you know, there's there's something and Zach and I real quick, Zach and I did a segment yesterday on the on the syndrome with older quarterbacks, the brock Purty syndrome, right where teams are looking at give me the quarterbacks that have played a ton of snaps. Give me the quarterbacks that

might be a little older. All these quarterbacks might be a little older because of what we did in the pandemic and the NCAA giving everybody another year, and guy's taking advantage of that. You know, Hendon Hooker is gonna be what twenty seven years old by the time you get him playing. But why do I feel like that's okay? You know, I'm okay with that. But I if you're gonna, if you're gonna let me take a guy and stash him and try and get him healthy. I think I'm

looking at that quarterback from Tennessee. It's such a calmness to his game that, Yeah, I'm a big fan of Hendon Hooker, but he's played a ton of snaps. Injury again, get hurt in the South Carolina game late in the year, and it you know, he's They say he might be ready for training camp, and are for the training camp or parts of it. But you know these guys Britt Brown in them. They take these guys and put them

back together in a nice way. And I would I would gamble more on him than I would maybe that offensive lineman if it was me. Yeah, And to your point, I mean, we saw this past year how many backup quarterbacks had to play this year, about sixty two. I think it wants to have a guy that has had time and is almost ready to come in and be an immediate you know, like filler in that position. I guess that does make sense there. Yeah, all right, let's take our second break. When we come back, we're gonna

talk tight ends. There's a lot of tight end talk in draft Twitter right now, Cowboys Twitter right now, Is it okay to take a look at some of these tight ends at pick number twenty six. We'll answer that question and a whole lot more. You're looking at me for you right after this on the Draft Show. I'm Dak Prescott, quarterback of the Dallas Cowboys. Blockchain dot com is one of the most trusted ways to buy, sell,

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brought us Bobby Belt, Aisha Morrison. I'm Kyle Yeoman's there was this tweet I saw yesterday just popped up and it wasn't the only tweet. There were just a couple of them surrounded. This comes from one Zach Waltchuck and the tweets said, Okay, sucks, I can't stay out that harsh Why are you even reading his tweets? Tight end one Dalton Kincaid being mocked to the Cowboys melky So Dalton Kincaid out of Utah. We've already talked about Darnell

Washington on Georgia. We've we've spoken on tight ends quite a bit on this show, mostly with the thought of it being at fifty eight, maybe second round, third round, fourth round guys, especially with Dalton Schultz departing. Now it's all of a sudden looking like it's a first round conversation too. Would that be something that the Cowboys should look into? And I know your answer, Zach, but anybody else opposed to that for the most part post to picking a tight app Yeah, no, I'm not opposed to,

not at all. Not any Look, I've also got to the point where I just we've had so many instances of our natural inclinations that we don't like about certain things that how the Cowboys will approach a draft weekend, that have over time proved us wrong, whether it be Tyler Smith or Layton vander esh or guys like that. That not that they're infallible, but I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on some things. And

even with that said, I don't have a problem. So I mean, if they think tight ends the pick, then I'll be like, Okay, this will probably be a good player. But specifically, I think you just need a dynamic weapon. So if it's a dynamic tight end or it's a dynamic receiver, I don't care. Just if you whatever you think is going to be the most explosive weapon, the

biggest mismatch you can have. And in this day and age, you talk to a lot of people and they'll tell you, like, a really dynamic tight end is one of the hardest things to cover in terms of opposing defenses. It's one of the hardest mismatches you can get. So if they spot that guy in the first, second round, whatever it is, and they think, yeah, we can take a shot on this guy and he'll be a good match for us, a good match against defenses, then absolutely go do it.

Okay that makes me feel a little bit better, bro, Yeah, I think that to me the little bit the difficulty I know, with me, there's more certainty with the tight end position than there is with the wide receiver position.

And I got on the soapbox earlier and was talking about if you guys figure out the slight wide receivers, the undersized guys, if you figured out how these guys are all gonna play or how they're going to fit in, I, you know, please let me know on this, because that's something that might be something I'm struggling with right now a little bit. But I feel like I have a

pretty good understanding of these tight ends. You know, when when you start to talk about the Notre Dame Kid Mayor, right, you know, when you talk about Mayor, when you talk about Kincaid from Utah, you know, Musgrave from Oregon State, and even you know, you know Tucker Kraft from South Dakota State. I feel like I have a feeling about these guys. And I think, to Bobby's point, is that just give me the weapon. You know the fact that the fact that that Jerry Jones sat on that bus

and told us and he started talking about Kelsey. But here they had Dalton Schultz, you know, and now it's like we're moving on from Dalton Schultz. We've got to do better and they've got you know, with Hendershot and Ferguson, they've got some really good tight ends. But if you add another one, if you add a Dalton Kincaid to the position or to the group, how much better does that make you? Does that make it better? You know?

I mean we heck, I felt like I felt like told was going to be a really I was gonna come in and be a good player for them. You know. I have a feeling whoever, if they draft whoever this wide receiver is or this tight end, this guy needs to be plug and play. There doesn't need to be any like, oh, we're thinking about how we're going to use them now if it's Dalton Kincaid or mayor when

those guys put them on the field and let them go. Yeah, because that's they've proven to me that they're more consistent as players than what I'm seeing at some of these wide receivers. And I think those are day one impact guys. And we've seen Dak Prescott likes to go to tight end and the pushback is okay, well, you've got Jake Ferguson. Do you do you not like Fergie? Well, now I do. I think Ferguson's a really good player. I was very

high on him coming out of Wisconsin. But wasn't it exciting last year when you see some twelve and thirteen personnel and the Cowboys are using multiple tight ends? To me, there might not be a better matchup nightmare in the NFL than when you have a plus tight end on your team. And if you're able to have multiple of those guys, let's go out and let's line up and let's have some fun, and you have a special tight end class. And to me, at twenty six, you might

get wiped out at receiver. We were just talking about that. You might not have an offensive lineman like an Osiris Torrance or one of these tackles fall to you. It's very possible that the best player on the board is a tight end and that player is gonna help Dak Prescott. And if it's Dalton Kincaid, who you watch it against USC, they can't guard him. They know he's getting the football, the kid out of Utah, and all he does is catch everything thrown at him. He's able to stretch the

field via the seam. And to me, I mean he's a playmaker. You know, he's got a wide catch radius. Same with may Or. They call him baby gronk out, a Notre dame. These are these are weapons that the Cowboys, even with Jason Witten, you know, an elite talent, maybe a Hall of Fame player, but these guys have a different kind of athletic profile and upside that we haven't seen for a long time. Do you think that's the

case with Mayor? Mayor that Mayor to me is the tight end of you know, yesteryear, which which I mean he's still very good now. I think he'll be successful. But to me, in terms of stretching the field and being a really difficult mismatch, I don't know that. Mayor. I think he's a contested player, and I mean contested catch guy in traffic and I like that. I like the way the drag you see him down on the goal line in the red zone and stuff like that.

He's a super super productive guy. And the thing I could say, I think you could use him in both ways. I think he could play in line next to the tackle. I think you can move him and play him in flex on the outside, and I think he's gonna be fine. Give me a guy that's gonna line up in a lot of different spots. Now six to five. I mean, I'm I know, I don't have I mean, I need to pull up his his combine measurement. But I was working off six five two sixty five, you know, and

then it's four and a half to forty nine. Okay. See, so he's lost he's lost some he's lost some weight, and they ran a four to seven. Yeah to me. To me, I feel like though that when you look at him, I always think like when these kids go like for their pro days at their schools, they're probably gonna run better. But man, there's just too much. I mean, the reach, the extension, all this stuff about Mayor I think is really really positive. I'm with you. I mean,

he's a guy that moves all over. They line him up outside, they line him up inside on the slot, and he'll beat corners. So I mean, to your point, I don't think he moves as well as Musgrave out of Oregon State or Dalton Kincaid out of Utah. I think those guys are a little bit more smooth than the open field. But I'm a fan of a guy like Michael Mayor and he's a good in line blocker. Yeah, what do you think? Well, I mean I talking about the tight end position, like you look at a guy

like Paying Durham from Purdue. I remember, I actually got to talk to him and he just spoke about just the emphasis on working on his hands, working on that because he is known as like that block and gritty guy. But he understood, hey, man, I gotta add this to my repertoire. I gotta add this to my game. So it kind of lets you know it's where the game is going. But I wanted to add to the list of tight ends that I think out they tell a little bit. I think Zach Kuntz from Old Dominion really

showed some explosiveness and stuff that people didn't think. I mean his forty it was an official for four five five, I think, but he looked like he was way faster than that. And so he's also his his condred was good. I feel like he really shows some people like, nah, I'm I got some explosiveness to me, I got some other parts of my game to me, And I think that he's going to get some people's attention as well moving forward, Yeah, what do you think about somebody outside

of Kincaid and Mayor? Do you think Washington's in that category? Because right now Mayor from Notre Dame, Kincaid from Utah, those are my two guys I'm okay with being in twenty six. Those are my two guys. Outside of that, I will wait because I don't want to push it.

I kind of like Schoonmaker from Michigan would be my next guy that I mean, and and and if you're talking about if you're not getting one of the top guys Luke Schoonmaker from from Michigan is I think this guy, you know, he plays really well on his feet, fit drive. They'll run the ball behind him, you know. And that's the one thing Michigan do. They will line up and play football in a phone booth and just slam the

ball at you. And I I like the fact some of these tight ends you see they put him on the back side and they don't they just they're cut off guys, cut off guys. But they run the ball behind this guy. I think that him you could put him as a point of attack blocker. But you could even flex this guy and He's a good route runner and he could get up the field. He doesn't labor,

he's smooth, and he catches the football. So if you're not getting an opportunity at one of those top guys, the Michigan Kids, Schoonmaker for me is a guy that I would surely consider, Okay, anybody else outside of that. I mean, so you wouldn't have Musgrave as a guy he'd like at twenty six. Probably not. He would be close. Yeah, I've got Mayor above him. I've got Kincaid Mayor, and

then I actually have Musgrave, Laportza, then darnel Way. I think King Kaid and Musgrave are the two guys who are the type of modern tight end that present a lot of mismatches. And specifically with Musgrave, I think his footwork looks like a receiver to me, which is that knee intrigued though, I mean, you're gonna have to check that he was cleared. Yeah, that's good that the chatter out of Combine was that he got cleared. And so you're not wrong about the kids. It's a smooth runner, now,

that is a smooth route. He is huge in Tucker Craft. You mentioned him, Brian, Yeah, big fan. He's moldiple. I describe him as moldiple. I think he can do a little bit of everything, but he's also he's just difficult to tackle. His vision is good because of the running back background and stuff. So if you get him on your team, if you got a good coach, you can make some money with him. I think Greeding, Yeah, I think he could be a steal. It could be fun

to watch. I think either way, you're going to see a tight end drafted again by the Cowboys at some point in Bobby says, sooner than what we are used to. I just think they take a pass catch or somewhere in the top one hundred, and whether that's a receiver or tight end whoever, they have grade at higher, but it very well could be a tight end. So I would not be stunned if they take a tight end on the top hundred. Would you, guys take Johnston? If

I mentioned him? Would you take Johnston, the TCU wide receiver over a top tight end? Ooh no, why would you? When you when you sound like you're gonna get better, I need to I need to know if Johnston, Like I need to have confidence Johnson's gonna be able to get off press I have. I have Kincaid is a better player, but I would take Johnson over Mayor. I would agree with that. But yeah, i'd agree with that.

I have Johnston as as number twenty six on my board right now, and this is all going to change between now and draft day, of course, but I have twenty six is Johnston, twenty five is Kincaid, and then I've got Mayor at twenty eight. So they're all right there, jumbled together. But I would have exactly what Zack just said. I think that where does reports have follow on your board? Because he tested well? But then also Dane had a lot of good stuff to say about him. Yeah, he's

a top thirty five player on my report. I think when I watched him, I think he was really hurt by his offense. Yes, well, I'm about to say, like a lot of people were hard on him because of the drops and stuff, and I said, well, when you got it, you got it. That's why you gotta take a look start looking at Okay, we'll look at the Iowa offense right, look at how play horrible, play calling terrible, and he showed when the balls delivered to him well

and stuff at as I thought. He's one of the few guys that I felt like, Yeah, the testing helped him. It helped him adding it to the film and making sense of things. So what are you? What does he fall for, y'all? I think it's the top thirty five player. I've got, I've got I've got him, I've got Musgrave, Kincaid, Assume, Mayor, Musgrave, Mayor, Kincaid, Musgrave, Washington, Laporta. That's how I have the tight ends on my board. Yeah, I have a craft ahead of Laporta. Do you Yeah, Okay,

that's not out of the question. It's not no, not at all. It's all right, good show, everybody. We'll be back tomorrow. I will not be back tomorrow. Something about that. We're gonna have Brian in the host chair tomorrow. Ready for the fire kids. He'll be back next Wednesday. We'll have some fun. But that does it for us. Today on The Draft Show presented by Miller, light for Chris Beam in the back, Bobby Belt, Zach Wilchuck, Brian brought us in Aisha Morris and I'm Kyle Yeoman saying so long,

We'll see you tomorrow. With more of the Draft Show. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.