Z is the Dallascowboys dot Com Draft Show, your war room for insder news and draft analysis from deep within the confines of Cowboys Headquarters at the Star Infrasco.
Today is a leap day, Thursday, February twenty ninth, twenty twenty four, and we are officially fifty six days away from the NFL Draft in Detroit, Michigan. Welcome into the Draft Show, presented by Miller Lte a taste you can depend on. We've got the NFL Combine to break down media availability kicking off yesterday, and plenty of news and notes to get to here over the next hour as we continue to lead you into NFL Draft process twenty
twenty four. Today, we've got Aisha Morrison, Bobby Belton then live from Indianapolis. Here in a couple of moments, We've got Nick Harris out there from Radio Row. I'm Kyle Yeomens, Chris Beaman the back, and Bobby. This is always a fun time of year because this is really where the information starts to gather. You've got all of the scouting, all of the film, and all of the gathering of information initially. Now you get to share that information.
Yeah, this is the super Bowl of the off season. Yeah, not just because of what it is for the draft, but naturally you get all these powerful decision makers out there. Gives them a chance to, hey, let's check in before free agency, let's talk about trades, let's do some different things. So to me, this is the pinnacle of the NFL offseason,
even though it hasn't officially gotten underway yet. This week right here, and what you get to learn about the players, whether it be in the meetings, on the whiteboard, when you see their testing, it's just a it's a great week where I think everything sort of starts to come into form for the NFL off season.
It's crazy how quickly it got here. Please, I felt like yesterday we were watching the Chiefs play the forty nine Ers in Las Vegas, and all of a sudden, here we are.
No.
Absolutely, it does go back quick and before we know it, it'll be I mean, right after combine it's free agency. So to your point, Bobby, it does start to get real. It starts you start to really feel like what happens in this next few months it does impact next season. So in regards to the combine, it's it's about that time for these guys too. This is what I said
on our show. It's one of the few times in the NFL that you will get to display what you can do as an individual, and so I think it's important for these guys to come out and perform.
That is interesting because it is a team game. That always is a team game, but the NFL Draft is very individualistic, and so is the combine. The one time where you are the microscope and under the microscope, so scrutinized all the way across the league, both from a draft standpoint and scout standpoint, but also from a media standpoint as well.
Absolutely, these interviews are super important as well. I mean sometimes that I learned that last year being down there with y'all. It's just you hear little whispers about interviews or hear little conversations, and it's like, okay, cool, Okay, this guy gets it, this guy doesn't get and stuff starts to make sense. And it's easier for us too, especially because we can start really putting our boards together because those medicals and things kind of add clarity as well.
Yeah, this is I mean, this right here is just from the perspective of like I remember years ago when the same years ago. Now it seems like it just got in the league. But years ago when TJ. Watt was at the combine, Yeah, and you saw the type of athlete he was in his testing, and it's like, oh, okay, that didn't that didn't necessarily show up with what Wisconsin asked him to do. They asked him to do a
lot of push pull stuff. You didn't necessarily get to see those athletic trades and you had no idea Max Crosby, another edge rusher who had the same sort of thing, goes out there performs big. You start to hear some of the buzz about like who do teams like who are they impressed by? And not even just at the top of the draft, you just start to hear about their draft crushes on Day three or like, oh, man, this third round guy, you know, maybe he's lacking this
in terms of his test or whatever else. But man, when we sat down with him for those twenty minutes in a formal ene interview, you see the type of you know, football character he has and the demeanor he has, and you know then this is also the time of
year where drama can come out of it. A couple of weeks from now, you start hearing about medicals, maybe you hear about tests at the combine that didn't go well, and so this is a absolutely critical week to every team's you know, team building philosophy.
Oh, it's so much fun and you've got some great connections just based off of what you've heard through the first couple of days of the combine. What's the first thing that stuck out to you?
You know, I think that and the first thing I want to say, because you know, we're gonna have Nick on here in a second, he's gonna talk about all the different formal and informal interviews. One of the things that's always stuck out to me that I've heard from people around the league is that they'll say, like, hey, you need to really understand how sincere that split between
formal and informal is, Like that's it. That's a serious dividing line, because one of them is you're sitting in a suite or a conference room with five decision makers from the team or whatever else and getting whiteboard work, and an informal can be as much as somebody going down to somebody after workout and going like, hey, we went to the same high school. That's pretty cool. Do you know what? Yeah, like, do you do you know this fast food joint there?
All right?
Great talking to you. That can be an informal like counted that way. So I think the it's absolutely important to keep track of the type of formal interviews that
they're having. And so I think the big thing coming out of this so far to me is that there's an understanding just from what Stephen Jones is saying when you look at some of these formals that they've had already and just some of the buzz coming out of there, it's that the Cowboys, I think, recognize that, hey, middle of the defense, we want to be better, like you know, on all three levels, the interior of the defensive line, linebackers on the second level, the safeties in the secondary,
we want to be better there. And so I think that that's one of the things that you start to hear the buzzwords around this time of year. You know, Steve and I think said three times the other day,
had used the phrase holistic. So like you start hearing like an idea of like, oh, okay, this is how they're processing the off season, this is how they're approaching it, and that's one of the things that you're consistently hearing chattered about I think right now is just they want to be better in the middle of the defense.
Oh yeah, I mean that's what I took from it as well, looking at a lot of the guys that they were able to speak to. Thank you for even bringing up the formal and informal saying. I think it is important to remind people because even me, I'm still fresh to some of the conversation and what some of the meanings are.
So I thought that was important that you guys clarified that.
Thank you, bod Yeah, because formals, like you said, you're in a room full of scouts of the front office, and you even can FaceTime Mike McCarthy who's back here in Dallas, Mike Zimmer, who's back here in Dallas. You'll have those conversations and then early in the week, especially whenever these position groups, because you go day by day with position groups. That's why we've heard a lot of the defense and seen a lot of those names early
because the first position groups have been deficient. Right. But they'll put together these mixers where you get some cocktail tables, not cocktails. But you've got different tables through an open room in the convention center, and you send these position groups in there, and each table has the Cowboys or the Raiders or the Commanders, and it's it's exactly what it is. It's speed.
Ba's how it looks. That's what it looks like sometimes.
And I mean, look at it from this perspective. One of the things we're hearing about. I know Stephen talked about he I don't think we we have issues with the culture. I think the culture is strong here, but I think they definitely want they want some more toughness. I think they want some more cerebral football players this spring that they're looking at acquiring. And this is a great opportunity in those twenty minute sit downs to sit there and go what kind of football character does this
guy have? How does he respond to this? What kind of answers has he given me? Like you get a sense of the edge that they have, the competitiveness and things like that. And so it's an absolutely great week. It didn't work out well for the Eagles a couple of years ago, but again a couple of years ago, we're talking eight now. But like Carson Wentz. Carson Wentz.
In large part the reason they went up and got Carson Wentz was from the formal that they had at the Combine where they were really impressed with him on the whiteboard and some of the stuff he said, and they went, Okay, we feel good about this, let's trade up to two. We're gonna go get him. So this is a big week for these meetings are very critical, I think to them forming a lot of their opinions about guys.
And I'm not gonna lie. It's a little weird not being out in Indianapolis this week, but we do have boots on the ground. We do have representation from the draft show. Nick Harris is down in the media center. Nick looking great, by the way, you don't look tired at all. You look like you've had a week full of reporting. You look like you've had a week full of information. What's been the biggest standout piece of info you've heard so far?
Yeah, it's just another day, another dollar. But yeah, it's been really fun out here in Indianapolis. My first time you got the combine. I think probably a couple of the biggest nuggets that I've been able to take away from these first couple of days of media availabilities. We could start with yesterday defensive tackles to five formal interviews at the Cowboys are participating in over the course of this week to Andre Swi out of Texas, McKinley Jackson out of Texas, A and m just a couple of
the names that are standing out from that group. But then also today they're looking at a couple of high round corners. Formal interview with Nate Wiggins out of Clemson and I wake Forest is Kayln Carson a formal interview with him, Georgia Corner Kamari Lasseter. You know, I've talked about him as potentially being a fun Jordan Lewis replacement if they are able to if they're not able to bring Jordan Lewis back onto the team next season, So they're looking at some of those day one, day two
type corners. I think that's a position that, you know, at least for me, I'm starting to take more seriously as we look at draft needs coming out of free agency.
It seems like that might be a sneaky need.
Though, Yeah, Nick, do you when you see them meeting having formal interviews like that, do you think that's indicative of any potential vulnerability of like, hey, Stefan Gilmore is a free agent, and you know, we got to make sure that things work right for us here to ted.
Do you think that they look at that as like, hey, we got to make sure our bases are covered and have an understanding of who's potentially available at the top of the draft in case we're we're sitting there needing a third corner.
Yeah, that's certainly insurance as well.
I mean, if they aren't able to bring back either Stefan Gilmore or Jordan Lewis and they need a guy that can step in and start on day one, then a guy like Nate Wiggins or potentially Kamari Laster could fit that mold. They would just need to bring him in camp and be able to work him up and get him ready for those type of moments. But you know, you're only guaranteed bringing back Trayvon Diggs and de Ron Bland, so it wouldn't make to plan for any scenario.
What's been the outside of the defensive early media buzz, have you heard anything on the offensive side of the football. Do you feel like, I know those position groups will come later in the week. But what have you started to hear from your conversations out there.
Yeah, tight Ends coach Lunda Wells is out here meeting with a ton of these titands informally. You know, I don't feel like there's an approach to even drafted in this draft cycle. But he's still having those conversations and he'll actually be working out with him during the combine
as well. But receivers, I think that's probably the biggest thing I'm looking at as well as I think once we have conversations with those guys that'll be tomorrow, I think we'll have a lot more clarity about the type of running back they will be looking for here in
this draft cycle. For me, I would expect them to go out in a free agency to try to find that scatback, type of small back that can be a dynamic weapon in the receiving game and also be able to get some things done maybe on second down and type of like a counter or draw situation. But then have that bruising running back to draft out of this draft class. You know, that's something they didn't have last year.
They needed those short yardage type of runs. They tried it with Hunter Lppy on a couple of occasions, and while it did work that Miami fumble definitely did leave the leave me in the press box wiping my tears a little bit. But I think if they can go out and get a guy like Braylan Allen or a Ray Davis, we've talked about, goodness, I'm blanking on the guy from Tennessee, Jalen Zach Walchuck's guy. Yeah, right, and
I think will get a big guy like that. I think it would be I think it would be big time.
Nick.
I'm not giving you pushback, but I'm also I am curious. So you mentioned that the tight end position is somewhere that you don't think that they with draft.
Why is that? What?
To this point, the room is the room, Okay.
The room is developed.
I mean you have you have Jake Ferguson starting, You got a couple of established backups. They spent a second round pick on Luke schoon Maker last year, Peyton Henderstott's coming in, and then John Stevens Junior's coming off of injury.
They're gonna have to figure out how to work him in.
Sean McEwan is a free agent, so they have a decision to make with him, but I don't really feel like there's a need for that position whenever you look at the number of draft picks that the Cowboys have this year in comparison to their needs as well.
Ok you know, Nick, when we talk about some of the stuff you're seeing on the offense side, you mentioned the receivers and the running backs. Steven are obvious to talk this week, and one of the big headlines coming out of there was the Tyler Smith comments, like is he starting to give an indication potentially that you know, maybe
the interior is Tyler Smith's future? Are you going to have extra attention on Okay, let me see formally if there's a greater focus maybe on some of these tackle specific players rather than guys who have that flexibility playing side. Are you looking to see if there's any any indication like that given what they said about Tyler Smith.
Yes, absolutely, We'll be able to talk to offensive linemen on Saturday, but I think there will be a bigger focus whenever you look at the tackle position as opposed to interior, because you saw what Tyler Smith was able to do right there at left guard last season. I mean, he played like he could be a perennial All Pro as long as he stays healthy throughout the course of
his career. In my opinion, I think he was the best guard in the NFC East this past season, and just being able to carry that in year two and be able to still grow and project be even better over the course of the next few seasons. I understand why Steven Jones made that con made that comment. I think there's an opportunity for him to really shine over the course of the next few years. Let him hone in right there in the interior. Bring in a first
round tackle, especially given this tackle class. If you want to go grab one in round one, this is a perfect opportunity to go do that with the guy that could start either in replacement of Tyron Smith or be waiting in case he goes down.
So we've already hit a little bit of how important these interviews are, how important the information sharing is. But of course drills are a big part of this as well, and you finally get some of the numbers and some of the tactical evidence for a lot of these players. Which are you more excited about. Are you looking forward to the forty yard dash or the rest of the drills for each of these positions as you're going on.
Yeah, I guess it just kind of depends on what position we're talking about, right, because if we're talking about offensive line, a defensive lineman. While I do want to see those big boys run and get up there, I'm not necessarily looking at their forty necessarily. I'm maybe looking at the French press or you know, some other power elements.
But you look at these dbs, these skill.
Guys, receivers, running backs, would love to see how they run, but also those catching drills as well. Those are big parts of what this combine is and what it can bring. Got a good group of quarterbacks that will be throwing, even though Caleb Williams will not, so there's still a really good opportunity for these guys these offensive weapons.
Yet I'm curious, Nick, and obviously not Cowboys specific we're talking about top of the draft, but just some of the chatter you've heard around there, some of the media availability. Has there been any discussion or any thought about this idea of Kayleb Williams saying I'm coming in or I'm not throwing. I'm not coming into the NFL with an agent. I already feel like I've answered enough of these questions.
Have you heard any chatter about that or just in general some of the stuff about what the Bears are thinking at the top of the draft.
Yeah, as it sounds right now, it doesn't really feel like the Bears have a final decision. They will have to come to a final decision before that March eleventh, March thirteenth range, before free agency comes. That's what the chatter has been around here that they want to have a decision before then so they know the direction of the team before you know, they really dive into free agency. But if I'm a betting man, I think they keep the number one pick and they roll with Kayleb Williams.
But I think it would be an interesting future for them for sure.
Do you feel like that's the first domino that needs to fall for other draft trades to start happening, because it feels like even though they have that top pick in the draft, and of course they're picking a little bit later in the top ten as well, but you have to know what the Bears are thinking before the rest of the teams can be certain in pulling the trigger and deals that we're looking at.
I'm sorry to say that one more time, Kyle, I lost you there in the middle.
Do you feel like that's the first domino that needs to fall from a trade perspective.
Yeah, I would say so.
I mean, that's that's the easy, easy pick that that would be traded first. That would kind of just set off the open market. As far as being able to move around, I think there's gonna be a lot of moving in that top ten. But everyone wants to know what's going on with the Bears for sure.
All right, what does your schedule look like as you continue on for Combine coverage and then we'll get you back for next week. But what do you got going on the docket today?
Yeah?
Here, in about five minutes, I'll be meeting with Will McLay. We'll have an interview up on Dallas Cowboys dot Com here soon, just kind of talking about Combine, draft strategy, things of that nature. And then tomorrow it's quarterbacks, receivers and running backs that we'll be able to talk to you during media availabilities, and then tomorrow getting Jerry Jones and getting his his take on the offseason and the draft as well.
What's one question, Bobby that he needs to ask Will McClay.
Oh my gosh, that's a good question. How much are as we talk about the offensive line? How much is position flexibility still something that they're really gauging versus how much do they want when we look at the interior offensive line? Guys who that is their specialty?
Yeah, I got you, Bobby, I'll throw that in for thank you.
I want you to ask what does the all in approach mean to Will McLay too. I think that's been a buzz topic, that's been a buzzword throughout and I think he'd have a great answer for that. So if you can fit that one in for me as well too, Nick, we really appreciate it. You could keep up to date with Nick by the way, if you haven't already, Nick Harris DC on Twitter, you've done phenomenal work all week long. Keep it rolling. It certainly makes us feel like we're
more connected and involved back here inside the stars. You're out there doing great work and we'll see you here in a couple of days.
Thanks fellas, willis here. I got a run.
Okay, go go go sounds good there, he goes, Nick Harris out in Indianapolis. Great stuff as always.
He's been running all day. He really has ran on the set, ran off set. I mean, just you know, it's the week man.
That's how you were when I was signing you out there last year. I mean listening.
If you don't know, Bobby got one of the meanest power walks.
I've ever seen.
Yeah, for real, it's for Rochio.
Be doing it very Yeah, it's a very deliberate. Let me see the manager. Yeah, yeah, that's what it is.
I love it, I really do. All right, let's take our first break when we come back. We've got Twitter on the twenty with plenty of NFL combine and draft questions. We'll hit those when we come back right after this with more of the draft show.
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Back here on the Draft Show. Fifty six days away from the NFL Draft, NFL combine going on in Indianapolis and plenty of news and notes to share, but we continue into that news and notes with some I heard it it was back there. Yeah, I pushed it was Twitter.
On Twitter on the twenty there. All right.
First question comes from Maxwell on the Beamer's doing a lot.
That was actually my fault that that was missed after I just threw a name at during the break, So that's actually my fault.
If Beam is able to cut the b roll, well, we'll talk about it in the third segment, but we're pulling a player up here as we speak. All right, Maxwell asked, He said, I remember last year specifically saying that the Cowboys liked Mozzie Smith early in last year's draft process. Are there any guys right now that you know the Cowboys like this time around?
That is a great question because I think just from so the formals are going to be a great indication of that. But I think in terms of if you look at formals matching up with tape need and some of the rumblings you hear about how they've I do think that Edge Cooper from Texas A and M is a guy that they like. Yeah, And I think that that's somebody who absolutely if in the second round they're pick as sitting there and he's on the board, I mean they're not going to take a linebacker in the
first round, I wouldn't think. I don't think there's one up there, But assuming that has not been dealt with yet, I think that Edge Cooper would be high on the list of guys that they would be intrigued by in the second round. But that's somebody that I know. There are fans of his around here, and so that's one that I think stands out.
Yeah, I think Darius Mussau UCLA linebacker. I think some of the things he did at the Shrine Bowl, and because there were so many of the Cowboys folks down here, it's multiple as getting on this kid. I do think that he's one of those guys that if he's there, then it's kind of feels like he's He's somebody they would be looking at.
To bring in.
That was the first name I thought of.
Whenever I saw that question, is I'm stealing?
No? That was great. No, I mean that just doubles down really what we've been hearing. I think the early name for me might be Tyler Geyton out of Oklahoma.
Because you keep seeing a lots here.
I think there's something to that. I think they really like Tyler, and I think they like the fact that he brings youth and a little bit of experience too, because he's played in a significant amount of games. He's played significant snaps, at least from a collegiate standpoint for a guy that's his age going into the NFL.
They like monster sized Tyler offensive lineman from Oklahoma. I like that's kind of their niche.
I will say that hate him paired with Tyler.
I definitely thought about it too. I thought about it too.
I'm just like Tulsa, Oh you we got Tyler Smith at home?
Liked he literally just added a twin another one, like I mean, honestly, if you look at something like the stuff in his scouting report too, it looks kind of like Tyler Smith.
They're still raw as some issues with footwork and technique gets strong as hell.
That's literally what I wrote down.
I said, we got Tylers Smith at home. You like your mom would be like, we got McDonald's at home anyway.
See, but the McDonald's at home is never really as good, not really as good unless it's cooked up and it's ready to go. But usually when you're saying we've got McDonald's at home, that means you're eating something up in the mic.
Oh yeah, that's fair.
I wouldn't say Tyler Smith heating.
Well, you're heating up Tyler got.
He is where you're getting them to that point? Yes, I like it, Yes, I like it. Uh. Mister Valles on Twitter says, match a player and a team that you've seen so far that would make you say, man, this player is going to be a problem. So best fits between a prospect and a team from the early going in the draft?
Oh yeah, I mean from the early rounds.
What you said, Yeah, any round kind of where you're you're headed.
I mean, so it's not been frequent, but I mean people who wonder about, like would Washington come up to like one if Chicago's willing to flip and get out of there. I mean that's natural. That's a natural fit there because you've got Cliff Kings there as the offensive coordinator already worked with you know, Caleb Williams. It's right, I think for his skill set there, he's from Washington,
d C. Like, I mean a lot of things. I think check box is there, but you know it's I don't know that that's one that has has stood out to me, just the idea of that pairing would be really good. I mean, I think, honestly, when you've seen some of the the pairings that you've gotten with Dallas, like the Tyler Geiiton one or Mems just some of these you know, freaky, big athletic guys. It just and the success that they've had with those types of players, going back to even Tyron Smith all the way up.
I think that those are are ones that I look at and say, those are good fits. But I mean, those are some of the ones that stand out to me.
So I I mean, I think I have one. But at the same time, I'm not one d sure with Jeremi Trotter he uh where does he have ties too? I'm amos, don't know.
I feel like a screenshadow if you talk Todrew's dad.
Yeah, no, I'm saying, like whatever, Philly, Philly, Yeah.
Because his dad played in Philly, brought us, drafted him there Philly.
I've just been seeing a little buzz about that. But then also too, he's we've seen it, You've seen it, I all seen.
It, but I always seen it. They need help it linebacker.
So and I do think that he's a gentleman that could fall to them, and it maybe could work. I mentioned even earlier in the draft jahem bel fsu tight end slash basically running back.
Holy crap, please keep him away from san fran I beg of the I definitely think he.
Could be somebody that they see because he has that I can do things in the backfield, but I can also do things because I'm athletic and stuff like that in the intermediate middle part of the field. You know, that's their money. So he has some versatility to his game. Maybe that's some connection there.
I do think also now that you know you've got Mike McDonald in Seattle and some of the history he has with what he's done with defensive linemen of I think similar are types. I think that when you've seen, you know, Byron Murphy mocked to Seattle in a couple
different instances, I think that that's a good fit. And I think that's kind of, you know, one of not just from a perspective of what they need and what would help them, but just from the idea of like what Mike McDonald has been able to do with guys like that. I think that Byron Murphy in his hands would be great.
And this is a fit that could very well happen. But how about Drake May quarterback North Carolina going to Washington in that early.
Spot to replace Sam Hallijn now who was his predecessor at North Carolina.
I mean, what kind of impact would that be? I mean is that that's an interesting dynamic overall, and of course dan Quinn out there in Washington they need a quarterback.
Yeah, I mean Drake May there is a great fit. I think. You know, they've had the and I think specifically Cliff working with a guy like Drake May would be huge. Now you know, there's some that have I know, Jayden Daniels could go number two instead of Drake May, and people say, look, he had success with Kyler, He's had success with a mobile quarterback. He knows how to use them, knows how to get the most out of them. I think obviously it's different skill set. You're talking about
different size profiles and different passers. But no, I think that Drake May is a is a really good fit for Washington and specifically if Cliff were able to work with him. And you know, there's still some questions about for me when watching May is just like what he's seeing at times and the decisions that he makes, and I think just Cliff being such a you know, high IQ offensive football mind him working with him, I think would be massive.
Usually during the week of the Combine is whenever I submit my first block of positions for the draft magazine coming up, because I want to get the combine reads before I really submit him for review. So quarterback is the first position. I normally just get it out of the way early. I have a really high grade on Drake May so that was one of the knocks is I wrote struggle the times working and making the complicated reads.
We get himself in trouble by forcing passes and taking too long to navigate through progressions, and because of that, at times his footwork lapses whenever his timing is thrown off, but whenever he's got given.
Time to throw, he sees it he can do it.
Goodness gracious, he's prototypical quarterback. He can be a franchise guy. He's got to get better at reading a defense is ultimately where it's at, which is you can teach that it's normal.
I mean it.
I'm not going to sit up here and make it seem like it's an excuse. But I guess this is again that's why we talk about the formals and things like that, like at what level is it? Because I do think that's a part of you know, come into the league as a quarterback is like it does take time to understand these things. I mean we didn't see Dak take that like next step, next step to.
What year four?
You're maybe five, So I just think as normal. But the arm talent to me stood out is that, like you said, if he sees it, he can place it, and he's powerful. It's not a lot, it's not super floated. If he's decisive, when he's decisive, and to your point when you mentioned the mechanics and all those things.
So I like, I like him.
I think he's one of the better quarterbacks in this draft.
Because they they he not throwing it.
Yeah, And I mean like that was a big conversation, right at least, you know, in terms of the analyst community, it was a big conversation for instance about Mahomes when he was coming out like that, they were like, you just you don't know, like you don't know what he is on the whiteboard, you don't know what he is in terms of pre and post snap reads and things like that, and so I think that that's another thing is that people may look at Drake May as a
case of like, well, we don't really know yet. There are things. There are times where the it looks like a bad read, like maybe he just got confused post snap with what he had seen. Then there are other instances where it can be something where it looks to me at times a little Stafford like where it's just almost irrational trust in his ability to get it. There's out and so sometimes it may just be he read it right and he just thought, well, I can get this there.
He's like, screw that, I'm fitting.
Yeah, like I know, I know I can put the ball on him. And so there are times where it looks like a battery and other times where it looks like to me, he's just incredibly confident in his arm talent.
Which is a good thing. At times sure could turn into a back kind.
Of temperate you gotta temperate, right, Yeah.
That's how it rolls, all right. Andrew asked this question. We talked a little bit with Nick a moment ago about defensive tackle and linebacker Bobby. You said at the middle of the draft has been an emphasis or middle of the defense has been an emphasis in the draft process so far. Andrew wants to know who is everyone's favorite defensive tackle or linebacker that the Cowboys have had
a formal visit so far. And here's the list of formal visits off of Nick's Twitter account, McKinley Jackson, Texas A and m Mason Smith LSU Chris Jenkins from Michigan. You can make the jokes now if you want to Rooque or Or from Clemson to Andre Sweat from Texas. We'll start with the dts. So there's the five formals that were reported by Nick. Paris so high.
I don't wanna I'm gonna give the caveat now. I'm gonna sound like a Homer, but it's Tavandra Swet.
Yeah there you it's hard to say anybody else.
Yeah, I mean that to me is the easy one. And I'd like, I'm not even super high on Sweat like like a lot of other people. I think Sweat's gonna rise to a point and go in the draft, probably higher than I would take him, like just for my own comfort level of my own fantasy mock draft way of taking guys, I he would be He's probably gonna go higher than I would take. But I mean, there's no denying just the type of freak that he is for his size and the ability that he shows
against the run. And you know, I think that there there's very rarely, even against big time offensive lines like what Washington has, very rarely do you see people getting
movement on him. And I think that that's absolutely critical for what we're talking about with the cow Boys is the idea of having that sturdy anchor in the middle of the defense to help with some of this run support, which is something Steven still when they talked about needs the other day, he talked about positions, but when he talked about an actual area of execution where they still start, he still pointed to the run defense has got to be better.
Yep.
I have a question because we're talking about this, because it feels like something that we need to start considering. I know, I need to start considering. Who they are paired up with matters in this, especially with DT. To me, it matters especially it depends on is the guy next to them more of a two gapper or is this person the two gapper or is another person next to them more of a speedy I don't know birsty twitchy guy, because I do think I do think he's he's fine.
I think he can do whatever.
But I'm curious of, like moving forward with how we look at DT I'm trying to look at who they're paired with, who's playing next to them, because it does dictate Dick.
The end of the future, or on their college I'm sorry.
On their college tape, how they perform.
I just a little bit of concern there because Byron Murphy was so good next to him.
I don't know if it's so much concern.
I just think it's something you have to consider, is that the other gentleman next to the other gentleman. It's the same plying we talked about it last year. Even with the Cowboys, it's like, yeah, I mean, I see osa Osa can win one on ones. But a lot of the time it's because people are doubling Micah's because
they're doing it draws attention. So I'm just I'm only asking not because of him in particular, I'm talking about in general, because when I look at even some of these other DT's, I'm over here like, well, who's your friend, who's your.
Friend next to you? Because baby, that's the reason why you get into play free like this.
So anyway, that was just a question I had. How important is that to y'all to consider who they're playing next to you.
I think it plays a factor because even in the film that you get to see, yes you will see one on ones, and both of these guys went one on one. They didn't get double teamed a ton in college. But I think it does play a factor because ultimately, the guys that you're playing around do elevate your game in a certain direction. Uh. I'm not worried about these guys, especially whenever you've got the B role that we were
just watching from Senior Bowl. When you're seeing one on ones won by Devondre Sweat, Uh, that's that's pure strength and skill.
Yeah, I guess more, less so who they're they're playing alongside. I guess what I would look at more because I think that'll show up on tape. Regardless of having to ask that question. I think when you see the tape, you'll be able to spot. Okay, like he I mean he's getting favorable matchups here? How much is he just taking advantage of a lesser tackle or whatever else? Because
there's a tension over here. Those are those sorts of things. More, what I would wonder is like, if you see someone on tape, it's like, okay, they're they're mainly playing inside, or like like if you're talking about defensive backs, for instance, you're seeing a corner that's mainly playing inside, or you know, it appears that well, I've got a lot of tape of them playing man, but there's not a lot of
them playing zone or whatever. So those are more things where I go like, Okay, are you niche and we just don't know it because we haven't been able.
To see unutilized Yeah, in certain ways. How do you feel like sweat has been utilized?
Oh?
No, I think that.
Yeah, I think they're fine.
I think they're fine. I guess I'm asking because I'm looking at even like this Cowboys roster and these dts and how things are with them, and I think we've seen that different guys perform better when they're next to certain guys or if there's another guy that's there. So I just I just think the name where your DT room matters when you're talking about bringing in like a sweat, because I think he's gonna thrive regardless.
But I just I don't know.
I don't know.
Maybe I'm tripping.
I'm curious how early not to shoot the wheels out here, but how early would you with them taking a defensive tackle potentially signal to you maybe they're not as comfortable with Mazi as they're probically said. So just first, if they went second would a depth.
Or I don't think that bothers me? Does it? Would it bother you?
No?
No, no, no, I just first round would be interesting if they went first round defensive tackle, that says we are concerned about Mazi and what he can bring in the future because going back to back like that on a specific position, because you're not going to draft a three tech in the first round and expect it to be a three tech unless I guess you can move Mazi with all the weight that he's lost to a
three tech. You can maybe do that. But if you're taking a true nose tackle, run stuff of stuffing defender for the second straight year inside the mid twenties, I think that's a problem. But if you do it in the second you're just investing in a run defense.
As someone that wants them to address that position.
More so with proven.
Talent, like in free agency, I don't know, given, because take a second, what is your DT room right now?
What is it? You don't know?
If Ankas is coming back, you don't know.
Like obviously Masi is Osa, Mazzi, Chauncey Golst is probably gonna get kicked.
Back out to edge.
But because respectfully zim has can look at him as he's ding.
I just Neville Gallimore.
They incentivized almost his whole contract this whole season, so it's.
Free as a free agent.
So I ask you, what the hell is your D tackle room right now? To where taking somebody high is Like I'm super concerned.
I would be more concerned.
If they didn't touch I guess if they take a free agent, if they take if they draft a guy and they don't touch free agency with DT, I'm a little more so.
Like, Okay, what the heck is going on? I don't know, or the other way around.
I mean, ohso Diggie Zoo is not going to be a run stopping one technique exactly, and so so Osa has already got one spot. So I think that, yeah, if you're taking one in the first round, that is a run stopping defensive tackle. To me, that is such a niche, narrow position that you're addressing when you already
dressed in the first round last year. To me, it's like, you don't just draft depth in the first round, and so I would that's why your line of thinking is why it doesn't concern me if they took them the second or the third or something like that, because you know with how frequent defensive line rotations are in this day and age too, And I got to go back and look and see how much ZIM was rotating guys
in Minnesota the last couple of letters did. And so because of that aspect of it, it wouldn't concern me day two, day three if they went for depth. But if you're saying, like, hey, our biggest piece of draft capital, we're going to commit to this fairly narrow focus on the defense, and it's the same investment we made last year, that would be a little that that would make me think that their true beliefs aren't necessarily matching up with their public messaging.
Correct, Yeah, that's.
Fair, I mean, or again they might be trying to pair How we saw the commanders do to me is where they was like.
We don't care. We're going to use important picks to get in the middle.
Of our defense the way that we needed to be and it did a working out with but it don't always work out for everyone.
But I mean, yeah, I would be like what the heck?
But I would be more more like what the heck if they didn't touch it at all, and even in free agency, because you don't have the luxury to just look at what you have now and be like, we're good.
We're all right.
No.
To finish the second half of our final Twitter on the Twitter questions, what are on the Twitter yet? Twitter on the junior Colson Michigan, Tyron Hopper from Missouri and Edgeran Cooper from Texas, And in which out of those three guys those are all the formals at linebackers so far? Which one of those guys do you like the best?
So Colson, Cooper? And what was the other one?
Hopper?
Okay, so I've not watched Hopper yet, Coulson. I have Colson a little ahead of Cooper just a little bit.
I watched Hopper last night.
I flipped them last night. I mean they're right there now, yeah, right, they're touching tags already. They were touching tags before last night, and there still are to me, but I now have Cooper ahead of Coulson. But I love Colson. I think both those guys are great players, are both second round high second round grades for me.
I think is uh is edging a little longer? Yes, yes, I think that's what stands out.
Then you've got Colson who's a little bit more built.
Yes, yeah, GLSEN's got twenty pounds on Coopering like that. I just I mean the I love the way edge Cooper plays is just the thing to me.
He the.
The way he sees it and gets after it, and the way he uses that length, and the way that he's able to get off of blocks and not just you know, run around him or whatever else. I really really like him and think that he'd be a big
positive for them in their linebacker corps. How you said you wanted to you want to do address defensive tackle and free agency, I think I would definitely feel more comfortable with one of the starters they get a linebacker is from free agency, Like I want to get a veteran that I know like sees it, sees it and
reads it and reacts the right kind of way. That's what I would want to address some pre agency because it is so much of a crapshoot at times with linebackers coming out of the draft in terms of how quickly they see it, process it, and react to it.
Would you be okay pairing a rookie with a veteran and having both guys, I know, that'd be a perfect scenario for me.
Yeah, that's completely fine with me.
I agree with you completely. If you're starting a guy a linebacker, I want him to be a veteran. I want him to have been there, done that scene, everything to a certain extent. Whereas Drian Cooper he brings such an upside that you want to pair him. I mean, think about late vander esh had Sean Lee. Yeah, and Sean Lee had individuals to learn with all the way through too, So same thing with bringing in a linebacker. Who are they going to learn from?
This room needs this room needs you need of it.
They do need that, and I would feel more comfortable too if they addressed it in free agency as well. But I do want to ask you guys, if they addressed it in free agency, do they take one of these linebackers later? Then you could would I don't think they would feel the pressure or you know, to have to take a guy higher the second or you know, because there are some later round, later round guys that could come in and be pretty good linebackers for them if they pair with a veteran.
They've got a pretty extensive history of, regardless of need, taking linebackers, Like I mean, whether it be like I'm trying to look here now, there was a stretch there where I think twenty and twenty and nineteen they didn't take linebackers, But if you look before then, it was some insane run of like eighteen of twenty drafts they took a linebacker somewhere now, And it's because, I mean a lot of times you get guys who are contributing on special teams and are you know, just depth guys
at the linebacker position and do different things. And so I would guess, regardless of how they address it in
free agency, they're taking a linebacker somewhere. And they're still really really high on Tomorrow Overshown, and I think that Overshown being a guy that they really believe in paired with Nick had thrown it out there during his mock off season you get Aziz Al Shaier and Marvin Overshown, and you've got Damon Clark working in there, and however much you want to bring Marky Spell into the box. I mean, I know that was more of a dan
Quin philosophy that Mike Zimmer may not ascribe to. The way Stephen talked to the Combin the other day made it sound like Micah could be more involved playing straight linebacker, and so I believe that, you know. But I think if you're telling me Veteran and Demarvian Overshown as kind of your core at linebacker, then I feel pretty good about that relative to what you're going to do in the draft.
From twenty nine to twenty sixteen, they took a linebacker in every single draft, yep.
And then what is it the last three years they've taken one.
They've taken at least one. They had Covington in eighteen nineteen.
You know, they've taken light. They've taken five linebackers in the last three drafts.
Yeah, and they still need winebacker. Yeah, still got to find a way to get it done, all right, when we come back. It's not for some tell me more who have aisha and Bobby been watching this week and who do they have their eyes on going into the remainder of the NFL combine. We wrap up the Draft show right after this.
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This is the Dallascowboys dot Com Draft Show. Back here on the Draft Show presented by Miller Laia taste you can depend on. We've got Aisha Morris and Bobby Belt, Chris Beam. I'm Kyle Yeomans. Let's talk about some tell me more scouting reports over players, and we haven't necessarily had a chance to talk about much on the show.
I shall let you start. Who you got?
I have a gentleman that they did of for more with. I want to tell you more about Nate Wiggins, cornerback out of Clemson.
This is a young player, very young player. He's a nugget.
Uh he's six, pronominantly plays outside.
I said, uh.
Oh, yeah, he flipped the script.
I said that he uh he.
Likes I think I like his zone technique more than I like press. I think zone allows him to read and react and he's this is a heady player. You can almost see him thinking things through before they happen. He thrives there. I said, uh, yeah, the diagnos and recognition stand out. He used the boundary. Well, the boundary is his friend. Again, that takes awareness from a player. He's fluid, but he's not super fluid, and he doesn't have a whole bunch of burst. But I think he
knows his athletic limitations. I think he knows what he's capable of and what he's not capable of. And that's why he is more so this heady guy that can you know, make plays. Again, look at me, just a nugging.
What makes you say that about how he did you just see that from film study on terms in terms of IQ in the way.
That he knows?
Yes, Yes, I think you can watch a player and their decision making and you know that they know, like I can't cut too far out here, why I can't backpeddle too much here because I don't have the recovery speed to drive on this ball.
And I think that he again that.
The lack of I think he's athletic, but he's not just like this crazy athlete. But I think he understands that. So he's in his playbook far more than everybody else, so he can read it and recognize it and be there a little bit quicker. I think the run defense can improve, and some of the tackling. As you see, he is a dido, he's not super big. I think he might thrive in the slot, to be honest, depending on how he decided to use him. When he knows, he knows. It's what I said, is when he knows,
he knows, and he goes after it. And that's why he's able to make plays on the ball and do some things like that. So yeah, he times up his finish, he times up when he decides to rotate or fight to the ball as well. I like the player definitely. Maybe people might be concerned about some of his he's just very lean. He's not he's just not super muscular. He's not gonna again, he's not gonna do a lot
in the run game support as of right now. But still from a cover's perspective, especially tap of his own schame, I think he could be a dog.
Yeah, I mean I really like it. He obviously is very lanky, very lanky. He's not quite a manual Forbes lanky and.
This is twenty pounds on Forbes.
Still yeah, I mean, yeah, Forbes weighed one hundred and forty pounds or whatever he was. But I mean this was a a this was a staff that liked Emmanuel Forbes a lot. So so I don't know that that being lanky is necessarily going to be a big problem from I'll say, it's so easy, I think to draw comparisons to guys that you see week in and week out, And while he's not got nearly the thickness that Diggs had coming out, I think there's a lot of Digs
like quality to his game. Yeah, he's a guy who he absolutely loves to gamble and trying to bait guys, and he's got similar type of length. One of the things we know about Mike Zimmer's length is going to be something that's important him at the corner position, something that's been consistent with Chris or Chard and you know, Dan Quinn and then Will mcclace's you know, scouting parameters for a long time has been corners with length and
that they want that. And I think that when you see him in the way that he uses his length and press and the way that he plays the ball. If he can fill out a little bit and maybe get a little more disciplined and not take so many risks, I think that Nate Wiggins can be. Really He's one of my two corners that I have graded in the first.
And he's he's young. He's a young player, so he's still still raw.
So you have the opportunity to coach him up how you see fit and things like that. But he has a lot of traits that I think people will will enjoy because sometimes you want a guy that's gonna gamble sometimes, And we also saw it even with Trayvon. To your point, he did improve and run defense. It wasn't always perfect pretty, but he showed a willingness as he got a little bit bigger and got later.
Into you know, his time here.
Yeah, you said you like a guy that would be willing to gamble, Well, he would be unable to gamble in certain states across the country until after training camp because he doesn't turn twenty one until.
After training told you he's a nugget.
Yeah, he's twenty years old, so he will turn twenty one on August twenty eighth.
Yeah, and so a guy who still has a ceiling to be reached, I think. But the skill set, the traits, they're they're all there to be a top tier corner to me.
And so you've got a first round grade on him, you do too, Ayisha, Maybe.
First round grade corner two, quarner two.
Who's corner one?
Terry Arnold?
It's Arnold, Terry Arnold.
Some egg gonna make him a safety?
Ain't thing.
I mean somebody might try. But I mean he's he's I think he's a really good too.
I haven't give him a full full set.
I still, you know, I gotta get all the humans and then I could stay. I got to watch.
Getting the humans is important for you.
Gotta get them.
I got three of them this week.
Yeah, yeah, see, I mean nobody knows that more than Kyle.
All right, Bobby, who you've been watching?
Okay?
So I was.
I was very interested after hearing Eric Galco really heap a lot of praise onto Isaiah Williams from Illinois. Yeah, I was really interested him, especially in a class that's as deep as it is for the receiver class. I mean I've already run through, you know, in the one hundred players I've done it's like seventeen of them are receivers at this point, and so it's a very deep and strong class. And man, I think Isaiah Williams is really interesting. He had a big week at the Shrine Bowl.
Five nine eighty four pounds, slot specific type of guy. But this is a converted quarterback. He was a quarterback his first couple of years at Illinois, made the position change over to receiver, had a thousand yard season last year for them before declaring for the draft. Can contribute in the return game. To me, I see a guy who separation comes really easily for him. Now when he doesn't have the separation. The lack of size does cause him trouble on contested catches and things like that, but
those are those are size limitations. It's not a competitiveness toughness thing. He is a competitive football player. I think the speed, the ability to stop start, the acceleration is really impressive. I think the athletic ability that he shows when he's adjusting to the ball, the body adjustments, the catches. You know, it seems that there's still room to grow as a young player at the position. Because he played
quarterback at high school. Was I believe like the Gatorade Player of the Year in Missouri is a quarterback.
Wow.
But is somebody who I think has a ton of upside and will be in Indie this week and I'm really interested to see how he tests, how he weighs in. But that's a guy who I think has a ton of upside.
They have him listed and this is not Indie's stuff, this is just Internet five four. He's little, that's a little bit.
He is little. He's not playing outside heavy. Now, Illinois did play him outside some. They were willing to do that at the NFL level and specifically with the way I know, you know Mike McCarthy has treated smaller slot guy or smaller plays before. I think that this would be a slot specific type of player. Probably for four ish speed, Yeah, yeah, I think so, probably four Now.
It's always a little it's always a little tricky when you're eye testing it with these guys because you see that when they got those quick little feed and they show that acceleration and they show some of the agility and the quickness, it can can sometimes lull you into a bed. I mean, I think he definitely has the long speit. He reminds me a little bit guy who didn't work out at the NFL level, but as a prospect, reminds me a little Kiki KOOTI. Oh, he's coming out of Texas Tech.
Who's I don't know who Kiki is.
You don't remember that song was made.
Luffkin product. Luffkin product, Buddy, it does brun he was.
He was nasty.
I look at him.
I've never heard that name before, but no, you brought up I think if I'm not mistaken Isaiah last year in twenty two he let the FBS and FBS.
In receptions, he's I mean, he's he was somebody who I don't know if that was the look at that being Bamber got a b roll that guy that we're just talking about. That That right there is why I am responsible for the twitter on the twenty miss is because I was like, hey, do we have Isaiah Williams. And Beam was like, oh my gosh, let me cut it up. Hold on, and so Beam knocks it out. He's got graphics on there and everything. Yeah, he was.
I don't know if he led the FBS. He was eighty two receptions, seven hundred and fifteen yards as a sophomore last year was eighty two, twenty fifty five, it was five touchdowns. He's to me is like I said, it's it's going to be slots specific. But you talk about run after the catchability, joystick type player. Somebody who shows competitive toughness over the middle of the field isn't afraid to go over there. It has some size limitations. Obviously that's going to be natural for a guy that
is his size. But I think that everything you want in terms of his makeup and that toughness on the field is there.
Yeah, should have added context at some point in time. He is im poortant time during the season, and twenty two he let the fish now here.
Now Here's one thing that's going to probably make fundamental coaching on the special team side a little sick. He did muff three punts this year.
It's not great, I mean, but by the way he finished, uh, what is this sixteenth in receptions this year, so he was top twenty in the FBS in terms of receptions.
I will say we've talked about it the last couple of years.
Is what keep an eye on Illinois man Like they seem.
Like they turn out prospects Illinois. Illinois put out Kirby Joseph a couple of years ago. They've got Witherspoon, They've got some guys this year. I mean they've they've done a good job building up that program from one that was, you know, a little down for a while. But I mean I think that, you know, Brent Bilima has done a good job building that back up over there in Illinois.
That's a tough conference to win in some of the attitude too. When you look at when you watch Missouri players.
You'd be like, he do far off the change like they I feel like that about some of the Illinois players as well.
It's like, I don't know what it is about them, but they just have that chip on their shoulder that they play with and their edgy Like you said.
Is like, even though this guy is.
Small, don't be worried about him being scared to catch a ball over the middle.
He's not scared.
He's not a friend. It definitely limits him at times. There are times where you see that his physicality, Yeah, he's I mean on contested catches. When I was watching him, you definitely see that at times he has trouble finishing. But again, it's not a lack of competitive toughness. It is just physical limitations that exist. You know, there's no perfect prospect. We're not talking about a Round one guy here.
We're talking about somebody who definitely has some limitations, but is somebody who I think impressed a lot of people at Shrine Bowl and the ceiling that he still can potentially achieve is somebody who's still learning to become a more crisp and precise route runner. As a guy who played quarterback previously, I think that he's very intriguing.
I had him highlighted in my Shrine Bowl notes on my.
Roster, but I was like, hey, that's that is him?
That was still there? You thinking day three, early day three, something like.
Yeah, day three, Yeah, maybe. So there was a lot of chatter, uh. I know when I first started looking into him, it looked like a lot of the chatter was saying late day three. But it looks like there's starting to be more of a build towards like, hey, there's somebody who could sneak in the early day three. It'd be like Round four kind of guys. It's so tough to tell because of how deep the receiver class is.
Yeah, a lot of guys got to go before him, small the unfortunate.
Today, I'm gonna have to stand out the smaller guys because you know, wide receivers are giant humans in this season, like it's.
Like, well, back to normal.
Small receivers are there, they're people too, and have success with them all right. On Thursday or on Tuesday, we'll have Brian brought us back from spring training. We'll check back in with Bobby Ayisha Chris Beam in the back. But that's going to do it for us here on this edition of the Draft. Oh, Nick Harris will be back from Indianapolis. Do you have the fomo of not being out there?
I know, yes, I do.
I do too.
Mean, it was such a it's just nothing like that experience. And I was real wide at too.
I was like, yeah, this is this is what radio roade feels like.
This is what driving to Andy Tomorrow's I say, are you going you're road tripping? Yep?
Driving up there solo. I've got a fourteen hour Spotify playlist ready to go. What's on it? A bunch of stuff. It's like it's a huge cross section of you know, rap and pop and alternative rock and everything else.
The first song on there that's a good question.
I think it's the nineteen seventy five. Oh okay, yes, no, it's a band. Yeah, it's the nineteen seventy five Sincerity Scary.
Nice any Creed on there? No, there's not two live crew.
Now there's no two live crew either, Bamber, Are you not Creed? I mean I can add it on there. Creed was fine back in the day, and I met a resurgence lately, which is yeah, thanks to the world champion Texas, right darn right, you know. But like you know, I feel like if I'm going combine relate, if I was driving a spring training that would be.
Listening that you'd be Creed the whole way.
Yeah, yeah, going going out to combine. Well, you gotta change it up a little bit.
I will say that eighties music is it does something to my like late eighties music does something to my brain, and it makes me calm.
Okay, calm, Remember that makes me want to dance.
It makes me want to dance. But it just feels like you time travel in a way.
You got jokes, that's safety dance.
Just love it.
Like some of my eighties music.
Eighties music is great. There's nothing wrong with eighties music.
I keep trying not to sing so we don't get No, please.
Go for it.
No, I can't.
Okay, sounds good. We'll see you guys on Tuesday. Back with the Draft show coming up next week for Chris being Bobby Belt, for Ayisha Morrison, I'm Kyle Yomen saying so long, we will see you later from the Star in Frisco.
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