Draft Show: 30 Visits Start; More Pro Days

says Dane Brugler, CBS Sports. David Hellman, Dallas Cowboys dot Com. K Garrison, Executive Producing, We welcome to you again to the show that helps you. We're going to investigate and educate all things NFL Draft. If you join us for the first time and you're kind of getting ready to get your draft fixed, we we're happy to have you here.

We hope that the folks that have been with us the whole time have been enjoyed the coverage and we always appreciate the comments and the interactions that we have with you. I'm gonna get into what we're gonna do today on the show, talk a little bit about I want to go and talk a little bit about some draft news. We've got a couple of workouts. I want to get your opinion on a particular player that worked out today, Dane's. I also want to get into some

draft room discussions. This time of year, it's gonna you know, the Cowboys we work here at the at the Star, Will McClay, Chris Hall, Jerry Jones, Stephen Jones, Jason Garrett, everybody getting ready to start these draft meetings. We start to turn the calendar to April, it starts to get serious. I told you there's twenty eight days, so we're getting close. But we're gonna get into a little some draft room

discussions that need to be had. We're gonna also get a little bit of a staple we have here, Twitter on the twenty. That's our way of interacting with the fans. We appreciate any questions you have. Send him to at the Draft show. That's what you should always be doing. Following at the Draft show, Kink Garrison runs the account, gives you a lot of information. We also do it on periscope. There's another way to watch us, and we

appreciate you doing that. But Twitter on the twenty as always, and then we have another edition of Tell Me More. I really do like tell Me More because it's not just dealing with the top guys in the draft. It's dealing with guys. It might be priority free agents, might be guys six seventh round picks. Yeah, the goal is to not talk about top guys. Yeah, and I think that's a really I think that helps a lot of fans.

If we can find ways to again educate fans on the players in this draft, just not the top players, but but all players in this draft, I think we do a great thing. Dane's gonna tell us a bit about the Beast is coming out here very soon. He's just got that done, so we'll get into that a little bit and visit as well. So everybody doing well. Ready to go, Dane. We're under a month now. Yeah, how about that? That's hard to believe that. I mean this you mentioned last week, Dave. How just it seems

this process is going a lot quicker this year. Yeah, you know, it's just from the Senior Bowl of the Combine to uh, you know here we are now almost finished with Pro days, right, We're getting to get to April. You're right, you're done with the Pro day it's the last stretch, and there'll be plenty of news this month. You know, we'll have the medical rechecks in a few weeks April thirteenth and fourteen. Right, the private workouts, well, plenty to talk about, but hard to believe. We're under

a month now. And uh so it's today, a couple couple of pro days and at Texas and am yeah, down in College station. You know what time? You know what part of the process is coming now is the like I'm hearing, yeah, like scouts are telling me, this is the lies. This is where lying seasons start. A

lot of concerns about inter here whatever. This is actually the slander part of this is this is where and in your in your mock drafts right now are kind of just you're just hanging on because you're getting ready to have that last one that's gonna be the one, whether they're gonna a right, and see where you're at. You mentioned pro days Today we had Texas A and m workout. Miles Garrett worked out. Yeah. I don't know why. Yeah,

I was gonna ask you. Yeah. Unofficially, Miles Garrett runs a four six one forty, but he works out for he works out for the scouts stare down at in College Station. Why again is Miles Garrett working out? He's a competitor, you know, he was asked before the Bowl game, you know, when it was inconsistent about that. Yeah, it was the hot topic. You know, Christian McCaffrey is sitting out, Befohett was sitting out. He was asked about it, and you know, he said there was no question in his

mind he was gonna play. So he's a competitor. You know, I don't he played half the season on one leg. You know, he maybe answering those questions a little bit right that. People talking about the Alabama game how he wasn't that impressive against Camp Robinson. Well, he was playing on one leg. He shouldn't have been playing, but he wanted to. He wasn't going to miss that game. So the guy's competitor, and I give him credit for wanting to go out and he lit up the combine pretty

sure it did you even better? Yeah, with the with the Pro day and with all thirty two teams in College Station this morning, I get it. It's not like Miles Garrett was the it was the only guy there. They've got other players. They have plenty of players there, and so that's why thirty two teams were in attendance. But if I'm Miles Garrett, if I was his agent, i would tell him you're not working out. You're gonna pack my hand and the enjoy the conversation meat with teams,

talk to them. But there is absolutely nothing you can do on a pro day that is going to change a team's opinion of you. Yeah. So, and credit to him for playing, grinding and out playing hurt. Yeah, you know, good teammates stuff. He's not on a team right now. He doesn't have teammates to be there for. He needs to be looking out for himself. Yeah, there's no doubt about nothing good that can happen to him. Sidney Jones, Fabe Moreau too. That's all you need to say. An

example the fact, and we're gonna get to that. Things have happened, and he still wants to work out, as baffling to Yeah, we'll get we'll gonna get to this what we're talking about here by other pro days Texas and him. Today we had Florida and Florida State. That was unusual. Florida and Florida State on Tuesday it's past Tuesday. I hope you can follow along dascowboys dot com. We have a David sets up, we have the major pro Days. We have a guy they're covering the pro days getting

some information. So if you haven't, if you want to get get back on and learn about pro days, make sure you go to dallascowboys dot com and check that out. We've got them all tapped up for you. There. You mentioned Tennessee. Big Pro Day Friday. Be interesting to see for Barnett's sake. We all kind of think that Barnett's going to be a top fifteen type of player. Yeah, and he at the combine Kamara as well, not top fifteen,

Big big day for him as well. Right, and they've got a few other guys, Josh Malone, right, you know, we'll see what Josh Dobbs does. I think there are some teams out there that really like Josh Dobbs. I don't see it, but I get it with uh, you know, the person that he is. You know, he'll fit some some of the profiles that teams are looking for at the quarterback position. But with Barnett, he was very sick

at the combine, right, and that effected his results. Uh, you know, talk about Garrett being a competitor, Barnet's competitor. He wasn't going to sit out the combine, even though he wasn't out one hundred percent. So eager to see the numbers, the agility testing, see how he does at Tennessee's pro Day. I see if he can boost some of those numbers and show better than what we saw at Indianapolis. I'm gonna get into his now some draft

room discussions, because that's what's going on now. Yeah, you know, that's exactly what's going on right now. Me and this and this is this is where, and I'll throw some I'll throw some out there. Just I mean, it's about you know, we talked about Tabor from Florida. A lot made about that forty yard dash time at the combine. He was a four six one guy Florida Pro Day. Thought he was going to run better, gets into four sevens, four seven three, four seven five, Nothing really great about that.

You were kind of hopeful that that, Yeah, you were hopeful that he would be better, that the forty time would be better. But it's not well, it's you didn't think he could do worse. You know, I didn't think you could do worse. That was the conversation, like, oh, he ran a four to six two at the Conwell, you know he'll he'll run it again at the pro day, and you know he can't do any worse than that. Well, not only does he do worse, but he does significantly worse.

That's bad for a linebacker. Let me ask you this though, as a scout, you're jumping up on the table for him. If you're put put you know, you're Will McClay or Jerry Jones. Ask you a question. You're the you're the Southeast scout, You're you're Mitchella point for the Cowboys. You're gonna jump up on that table for Tabor. Very very difficult discussion, and I think it needs to be a discussion because so you're not gonna go strong on this one.

I'm not standing on the table. No, But this is a player who showed well on tape, who has down passes right, but he's also aided by a defense that has plenty of other pros on it at safety with Marcus May the other three technique exactly putting pressure up front. Davis alone E there are plenty of other NFL players on this defense. Uh, and that helped, you know, that helped Tabor. You know, if you wanted to jump passes, he didn't have to protect against his lack of speed downfield. Well,

you sound torn about this. I am. This is it's difficult because I like the tape, but there is not a position in the NFL that's more dependent on speed than corner. A wide receiver, running back, linebacker, safety. You can do with average speed. You can mask average speed with you know, strengths and other spots, and at corner you can do you can mask average speed. But four six, four seven that's not average speed for a corner. That's below average. And so how do you how do you

factor this in when the tape is as well? It's good, it is, but this Taber is a player who isn't technically sound. He relies on just pure instinct on his you know, he has a knack for you know, jumping passes and making plays on the ball, but he doesn't do it with any rhyme or reason. He just he kind of goes out and plays football. He's got a

great feel for it, right, and he does. Yeah, but he's also going in against the NFL and NFL receivers who are savvy and they understand how to set him up and or you know, do you really trust him in that capacity? I don't know. I really struggle with this player and putting a value on where I'd be comfortable drafting him and putting him on the board. This this cornerback spot, Dave, I'm gonna ask you this, this

cornerback spot where Dallas maybe felt pretty comfortable at twenty eight. Yeah, it's kind of turned into a disaster, hadn't it was Cindy Jones. Disaster feels harsh, But yeah, I mean when you tabor, I mean, no, if you're sitting there looking at it, if you're if you're if you're wanting you know, they're gonna throw numbers it ready, you can go numbers at this thing. You can go find us in January

or February. Like, there's about eight guys there that and you know some of them are going to be there at twenty eight and that number is kind of dwindling. Well, the position that you want a guy at, say at twenty eight, you're you're everybody's comfortable to taking City Jones? All right? Was was was? I'm more comfortable to taking Moreau. You know at twenty eight. At twenty eight, you'd still take him there, I would, I would, Yeah, I have

him over Taber. I think you'll be ready for the season. I think that peck thing, I think that you're not gonna happen. I maintain my position from earlier. You don't like hurt players, No, no, no, no, that's not what I was gonna A peck doesn't scare me as much as an achilles or the shoulder. Yeah. Well, and McKinley is another story. But I still understand how shoulder and McKinley scares you, but there's it doesn't know, it doesn't scare me. And you guys have done a good job

into talking me into McKinley. It doesn't scare me. I just rather have him on the field. But I'd be fine drafting him because I know when he's healed from that, he should be fine. Like, I don't worry about it long term. I would just rather he missed almost all last year with a foot injury. Now you're talking me back out of it. I'm just saying, what is it? State in facts, I want healthy players, and two your you didn't ask me, but I speak up. His podcast

is called Trust the Tape. Yeah, there's something to be said for the amount of talent on the Florida defense. This goes back to my Taco Charlton thing too. If I was taking this guy at four, that would be a nightmare. But when you consider that twenty eight as a second round pick anyway, which it is, I'll take him. I'll take He's got multiple years of proving that he can hold his own against quality receivers from the SEC. He's a scout from Louisiana. Makes a little sense a

second round pick a long track. I take him. I'm not I'm not. I'm not backing up. I would do it. I'm not backing up. I'm looking at that tape. It's the same thing with a Connecticut kid. You know, I believe the tape. I believe that tape on that Connecticut kid, I really do. He worked out like a Champ six four, running like he does now. I will say like that though, I will say this, and we've talked about this before, you know, Tabor being a bad interview maybe like maybe

not just fair. It's right kind of guy, we'll see. That scares me more than his four seven. To be honest with you, you think the Cowboys bring him in? Yeah? Probably, you think he's one of they're gonna throw numbers at it. They don't have a defensive backfield, so he's the prime candidate to bring in because you want to do your due diligence on a player like this. Yeah, you know, there's there's plenty of questions. So you bring him in and you sit them down, put them on the board.

You know, you find out more about the person. Uh just you know this, this cocky, brash attitude. Is it more of a persona that he's taken on, you know it just because that's what you have to be as a corner or is that truly just his personality? And that's sounds like Bosa last year. I remember last year when they brought in like every conceivable quarterback might be able to draft. I think they're going to do the same thing with corner. Gotcha? How about this draft room talk?

How about two safeties going in the top five? Yeah? Yeah, I mean so much? No, I well, no, I gotta throw another one at you. How about how about Mahomes in the offensive scheme? I guy's visiting eighteen teams it sounds like, yeah, he's he's gonna he's gonna go in a free trip somewhere in the United States because of frequent flyer miles. Go see, let's go see the country. We kill that scheme. Yeah, it doesn't produce very many good pros. It hasn't produced an eight teen teams wanting

to work this guy out. He's got his pro DA coming up to by the way, in Lubbock. He's the most physically gifted of any quarterback in this class. Yeah that's fair. You had him in your top fifty to start that. I give you credit. Yeah, I did you credit. You saw the player and he's still there. You know, he's right there in the mid second round. By this bothers, you've done it these draft room discussions. No, I just I get both. I guess I see both sides. Okay,

start with the safety conversation. Yeah, I was just throwing stuff out there, just kind of looking around. But okay, this like with MALIEK. Cooker and uh and Adams out of LSU, if they're drafted top five, they'll instantly be one of the highest paid players at their position. And you know this is this is with the new CBA in the and you know, the slotting. It just we

don't see safeties go that high very often. The safeties that do go that high, or the Sean Taylor's of the world, and neither of these guys you want to put in that conversation because that's putting a lot on both of them. I love Sean Taylor. Yeah, it's it's it's hard to put these two guys in that conversation. But they're both playmakers, and they're both two of the top five players in this draft, and so does the value match up? Uh? You know, do you would you

rather take those two safeties or take two those wide receivers. Oh, I'm taking the two safeties in the top five. Yeah, the safeties all day. Yeah for what it's just for the record, you could take out the names MALIEK. Cooker and Jamal Adams and put in Ezekiel Elliott and we're having the same conversation right last year. Oh, I was gonna get to that four Nette or cook That's gonna be a draft room discussion right there. McCaffrey. McCaffrey, I'm not I'm just saying that I haven't seen I haven't

seen I haven't seen McCaffrey in the top ten. I've seen people talking about cooking four Nette. Yeah, I think I think McCaffrey has a better shot to go ahead of Cook, who just with the with the way McCaffrey has, what he's done over the last few months, compared to Cook. You also factor in Cook's off field past, his injury history. I think McCaffrey has a better chance of coming off

the board before before Cook. We're worried about anything. When you turn in Christian McCaffrey's you know exactly the type of player you're getting. You know exactly person you're getting. Um. So, yeah, that's not the case with some of these other guys. But with safety, I'm okay, back to the safety conversation, I'm not worried about either of these two guys. People can talk about how you don't take a safety top five unless they're truly elite or you know, they're guys

Day one. What elite elite guys here? I think they have potential to be. I both have questions Like Jamal Adams, he you should hear people talk about him, you know, like Scouts and people around the LSU leader they glow talking about his intangible as the leader that he is, the person that he is, he I don't think. I think he's a very very solid player. I'm not convinced as he's gonna go to multiple Pro Bowls. I mean,

I think he has that potential. I think he'll compete for that type of distinction, but I'm not convinced that's the type of playmaker he is. Where with Millie Cooker, we haven't seen him work out because the injuries one year. Wonder you know, the ball skills, his coverage range and the deep half of the field can be elite, but there are some questions there. We really tackle and he will. He's like a kind of a cut down tackler. Sometimes

that's fair to say. Yeah, yeah, so there are questions with these guys, but they would not scare me from taking either top five. See that's the thing about it is, I'm let me get into another one. How about this? How about these tight ends? You can take a tight end, You're gonna draft a big wide receiver. What are you doing there talking about in the NFL? Yeah, I'm just saying that if you look at the if you look at the you know, what are you doing with these

tight ends, they all run fast. The evolution of the position. That's what the tight end position is in the NFL. Now, yeah, but how valuable is it if you hit on them? Though? Like how valuable are though? Sure you better have you better have Hooker or Adams icover them. Right. Then? That's why safeties are more important than today's NFL because of

these tight ends that are coming through. I mean, every you would like the prototypical wide tight end, you know, inline guy, but these guys are f's, you know, they're they're the joker, the move tight ends who kind of flux all over the offensive formation. And you know they're not guys you want blocking, you know, snap and snap out, but they can be mismatches as as pass etchers and really help you out in the red zone, stretch the field.

So you know, Najoku and Howard and Shaheen, I mean, Shaheen at least has a chance to play in line. He does. That's to me. See, these are the kinds of questions these guys are gonna ask, well, and that's what And to give people kind of context, there shouldn't be much debate on draft weekend about these guys. No, that's what's happening right now, Yeah, yours are happening right

You were fighting for Tabor right now. If you believe in Tabor, if you're Dane Brugler and that's your school, and you've seen him play and you've got up close to him and watched him practice, this is the time you better stand up, because if you don't stand up, you're not helping your team. Yeah, you don't. You don't want to get bullied in this thing. This is where you don't get bullied. And this is where any scout

that has watched him is in this room. Yeah. Probably you know, the defensive coaches, the cornerback coach, the defensive coordinate, I'm there in this room, the general manager, head coach, they're in this room. So this is Yeah, this is your chance to tell everyone in that room what you think of the player, how he fits the particular scheme of the team that you're drafting for, and give him a greade, put him on the board. That sounds so frustrating.

It's like you spend ten months of your life getting this guy down, and like the coach comes in and he's like, yeah, tips look kind of always talking fifteen minutes at the camp. Yeah, I don't like I this. This always reminds me of that story when I say, you know what, I never called third down defense. I never went down the field and called a third down defense. I could try and find you somebody to play third down defense. But be careful because I'm never gonna go

into that. I'm never gonna go down to the coaching box and say, hey, I'm sorry, Rod, I'm gonna make this call here. Let's go Simon Nickel out there. Let's go send this to a coach. Yeah do that, and yeah, do that and see what happens. I said, I said that to a coach one time. Who'd you fight? Who are you fighting for? Oh? I always fought Parcels. I got fired because of Parcels. But over what player? Like

Charles Woodson Awesome, he thought he was a malcontent. Al Davis had poisoned him to where he thought he was a malcontent. He goes, I can't coach guy. Mal contents brought us. I can't coach those guys. I'm too old to do that. Coach, he's a leader, he's been banged. Oh, he's always hurt. He had a toe problem. I got fired because of Charles Woodson, he's one of the greatest dbs ever. Yeah, he went to Green Bay. They still have a report. I'm sure. I wish they had it

out on that. When you take the tour here at the Star, I wish they had my report on Charles Woodson up there. What if we had reports on the guy like you know here for those that don't know they have reports. Yeah, Mike, come take a tour of this place. DeMarcus ware. But what if they had the ones you know that page just whiffed him on. Oh sure, and we did that too, but I mean parcels, and

I fought that was one of mine. I thought, Okay, thanks, thanks guys for your thought of a draft room discussions. There'll be a lot of them and will be there to cover them as well. We're coming back. We're gonna do a little Twitter on the twenty stay two. With unlimited Data from AT and T, you can stream your

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or Deslon Tyler, we can help you in Texas. Call two one four nine four one eighty two one. Fin is the Dallas Cowboys dot Com draftys Back here in the SWBC Mortgage Studios, Brian brought us Dame Brugler, David Hellman, Ken Garrison executive producer. Uh want to uh before we get a little twitter on the twenty Real Quick Gain got the Beast coming out, should be ready for purchase tomorrow. Yeah, so Real Quick kind of give us an idea where we can get that from you it's on Twitter. That's

the best way to do it. I'll post the link hopefully tomorrow morning, Friday morning. Uh, get it up on my Twitter. Just go use that link to uh go to the site. And it's an automatic pdf download, so as soon as you put in your information, uh, you should receive the pdf and your email almost immediately. Uh. Profiles for almost four hundred and fifty guys ranked over a thousand players, go. Uh it's it's really is a beast. It'll live up to what you expect. And then and

the Cowboys. We're also working on Star Magazine, our draft edition as well. I've been putting together our notes for that. Wenna have a lot of a lot of a lot of the drafts and draft analysis. We're gonna have stories, mock drafts, all that. So make sure we will get that information to you as quickly as we can. Okay, thanks Ed, Kay Hill. We've got now Twitter on the Twitter lead. We're gonna jump right into it. Real meat and Potato's question not surprising from friend of the show Joey.

You see him on Cowboys Twitter all the time. There you go, quality follow. He wants to know about a guy that you've been talking about Brian t J Watt. T J Watt, he wants to know, have the Cowboys figured out or has anybody for that matter figured out more of a linebacker or a right end. A lot of people comparing him to guys like Anthony Barr and even Randy Gregory before I really liked Anthony Barr's a lot. I don't think I have him in that same category.

But I think that the Cowboys and talking to some folks, they're gonna pay him at defensive end is where they're going to play him. They see him as a right defensive end. And you know when you when you watch him play. And a matter of fact, I was when we were I was looking at some tape watching a quarterback from the Big ten, and he happened to make He's a guy that can win on the edge. You know, he doesn't have he doesn't have the ability like of Abosa. Bosa was a top guy. But you talk about a

relentless type of player. He fits into what they want to do. He's gonna be a Rod Marinelli kind of guy. He's gonna be able to win right off the line. He's gonna play with his hands, he's gonna Chase. He's gonna tackle. He's gonna be a really steady players. I would say three downs because what you're gonna do is he's gonna he could play the run. He could. You can use him. You could move him out a little wider and have him rush the passer. He's got pass

rush moves, He's got skill, he's got ability. I don't know if he's the most explosive player. There is first step quickness, so I think there's some other guys in this draft did have more first step quickness. But when you're getting down at twenty eight, eight, you know, I personally would rather have Reddick is who I would rather have. I don't think Reddick will be there when they pick

at twenty eight. That would be the guy. If you gave me the guy who is the outside linebacker potential, you know, hand on the ground type of guy, I would go with Reddick myself. But he's a first round pick. Yeah, let me ask you this. If his last name was Jones, T J. Jones, I'd go with that. I just first Nick. Yeah, I look at you, you look at the But I

don't personally have him in the first round. Okay, I don't have him in the first I think when you said it earlier, though you're talking about maybe you have twenty guys that I'm a broken record, but twenty eight, it's not a first round pick anyway. Yeah, that's right. But to me, I would personally I have Reddick in

the first round. I don't have what in the first round, but I could understand why the Cowboys will do what they're gonna do if they if they are looking at if you don't feel comfortable with Tack McKinley's shoulder, and you don't think that Reddick is going to be there at twenty eight, this is not a bad Damn or Harris. Those are the types of guys I personally feel like that that maybe Harris would be a better rusher at twenty eight. Then what I think? What is a better

overall player? Yeah, okay, you mentioned Reddick, but they Reddick and what play two different positions? Right for you? Or no? No? No, no, I would keep him both. I would keep I would I would I think they keeping Reddick as an edge rush Yeah, I'm keeping at Reddick as an edge rusher. Yeah, tell him. You think he's crazy, Dan, I think you're crazy. Boom. I don't. Well, I mean Reddick, I think he's two

hundred size to be a consistent edge rusher. Right. To me, he's a stand up blindbacker and then you can you know, you don't want to completely take him away as a pass rusher. You want to put him down with his hand on the ground, maybe in nickel situations. I want him attacking. I just don't think he's a blur. When you watch him play, he's a blur. Yeah, I mean,

he attacks, he plays, he plays. In my opinion, this is going to sound very clachic to say he does play bigger than his size because his ability to avoid, in his ability to run and to chase when you can. It's like watching our kid from from Ohio play linebacker Brown, Clara Brown, Blara Brown. When you watch Blara Brown, you've seen Blair Brown play. He's you can beat blockers to the point and make tackles before they block in that in that a good player. Yeah, I just I mean

Reddick's two hundred and thirty five pounds. I just I don't know. I don't. To me, I don't see a guys can be even hold up at the point of attack consistently. I want him as a stand up guy. Uh more of a linebacker. Again, I don't he is a pass rusher. He can do that, and I don't want to completely take him out of that round a rotational system. Yeah, you don't think he could do Havoc recabit for the Seahawks. I that's okay, that's well, that's

a great example. But they have Atlanta. Yeah, so I mean that that kind of scheme where they played with a rotational group of guys. But I played a rotation here. When we're talking about a first round player, I want a three down player. Well yeah, okay, a pass rusher or a guy like is up on this table. So no, a pass rusher, a legitimate not that Wat's not a legitimate pass rusher. What's a good all around player? What do I want? Somebody that's going to create problems scheme wise?

Can what create enough problems scheme wise for a defense? Are you worried about? What? Are you you kind of looking at your when you're an offensive coordinator? You want and we gotta get. We gotta make sure we take what out of this game. I don't see. I don't think they'd be saying that about Reddick as a strictly as a pass rusher. Now, I think Reddeck's a better player than what But I but I don't think Reddick's uh three down pass rusher either. I mean I don't.

I don't want them with his hand on the ground. I mean again, two hundred and thirty five pounds, it doesn't have ideal length, doesn't have the point of attack power that you want ideally for me for an edge rusher. So I want him as a linebacker, and then I want him as an occasional pass rusher too, so and that's in that type of role he's a better player who's better at So you're saying that Watt is better as better as a complete player if you're not gonna

rush Reddick all the time. Yeah, if we're talking about strictly hand on the ground, defensive end, three down player, I would rather have Wat than Reddick in that type of role. But as an overall all around player, give me a Reddick. I think you can use them in different ways as a linebacker in different it sounds like you're like Reddick in a three four though, that's what it sounds like. You're saying. Well, I think player he could play anywhere in a three four four three. I

can play any of those linebacker positions. He could play middle linebacker, he could play weeks strong. They move him around. I mean, you can't you see it? That sounds fascinating. And then like for the million times, but he's not. I don't His idea about him is not incorrect. But I just feel like, though, if in this day and age, you don't have guys defensive ends playing sixty snaps down after down after down, you just don't do it. Not

in this scheme. You don't. Let's become highly specialized. I don't have a problem with what I really don't. I just I would like I would like a little bit more steam off that edge you have Harris ahead of what Yeah, yeah, okay, all right, purely as a pass for McKinley over them too, great debate. Yeah, I love a good segue, Brian, which somebody by the name of Tack McKinley to Dallas, just to give you an idea of what we're dealing with here. I think, by the way,

have a real name. Yeah no, I don't. I don't be that guy or galp if you're getting you know, we we had real names. It's Okay, it's fine, it's okay, real names. I like to deal with real people. It's a good question from anonymous. Yeah, defensive ends who aren't in play because they're not a fit, whether they're like

a three four or whatever. And the reason why I think this is important is because every year fans just kind of look at the list and they're like, well, every one of those Oregan guys who came out the last few years, get that guy. He needs a defense, and like they don't know that. It doesn't even make a lick of sense. So give me some give me something wise Arkansas. Yeah, how about Jones from North Carolina.

I think he could potentially fit as a I think he's a better five technique, but I think it potentially fit as a inside as a three Wormly see. I like Wormly as an end, straight end, Yeah, three four or four three. I think he do both. I mean, I don't think he's He's not that guy that's gonna scream off the edge and give you a pass, rush, help down and down out. But I think he's a very solid end regardless of scheme. It's Tarlton the same way. I think he has more. We're talking about Taco Charlton.

We're talking about similar to one of his teammates, Triuble Peppers. Not who he is, but what he's going to be because he's it's all about the traits. It's all about who he can be next year and two years from now and the player he's going to grow into. Taco Charlton. You, I mean, you only have really one season of starting experience. I mean he's still very very young. You expect him to get better as a pass rusher. What about Mileek McDowell. Do you think he see that's another one. I think

he's scheme specific. Do you think he Yeah, I would think I have him as an end. I have him in Charlton is ends. I don't disagree with what you're saying right there. I just thought that Wise Jones from North Carolina warmly. I thought those were guys more of those head up, base five technique defensive ends. That's why I had a little in my team's being a four three team. Yeah, so I kind of put those guys in a little category at the bottom. Awesome off to

the side. Yeah, it's like out Passengo Villanova. See that's I like that, And that's a guy that we hear a lot about We've talked a lot about him. I don't really see it for this team looking at him. I don't know, y'all tell me see, I don't. I don't require right face. No, I see like I see those Dennis block in him. Sometimes see the accountants blocking him. Yeah, you know, I see the guy. It's gonna be the

senator from Massachusetts blocking him. Yeah, you know, kind of like like Bill Bradley, the old basketball guy, you know with the d school. Yeah, he looks really stiff to me, and like not he's so tall. Yeah, he doesn't know, he doesn't know better. I mean, he really does. But the problem is you draft a guy. You're gonna have to take a guy like that high then all of a sudden, and then everybody's gonna be mad when he's inactive every week, everybody's going, oh passing, awo, why is he?

Why is he not on? I don't like, and I get your point, but like David Irving's super tall, but he's explosive. Yeah, he's got a feel for how to play. I don't. This guy has no feel for how to play. Maybe he'll get better, obviously, but I think you'd probably have to draft him at sixty if you wanted him, boy, that's really I wouldn't do it. Yeah, I think he goes somewhere in the third. I mean I think there's

a possibility to last until the late third. But if yeah, if you really want him, then yes, I would take roach Shell from Notre Dame. I would take Willis from Kansas State. You like, I like Rochelle a lot. Jordan Willis is gonna go to like ten Pro Bowls. I'm just telling y'all, right now, that's Jordan Willis is like Tease Tabor from me. I struggle with him because there's oh but you you saw the you saw the three Cone and all that. I mean, he's just a film

he could beIN. He's a good player, yeah, on film. I just there's some questions there that I not quite ready to get over. The him with the Villanova kid. Oh I'll take oh Willis. I like Willis a lot. I just when you compare him with Rivers from ys u Uh, Bowser from Kasten Bowser, that's another one we haven't. That's a guy we need to and I don't want to derail are on the twenty too much. But that's a guy that we need to talk about guys Bowser, Yeah,

we haven't very much. He's there's some early film you could watch him where he's not very good. You watch the Louisville game. You'd probably take him the first round. Well for a player, how frustrating is it to watch him and he's lined up on the edge, snap and he's dropping back? Yeah? Oh, kind of like what you're gonna do with Reddick? Huh? Well no, because he's not gonna be an edge rusher. He's gonna be a stand up linebacker. I mean, but he would, he'd be on

the edge and then they instead of rushing him. Not to mention, Bowser's a lot bigger than Reddick is but with frustration level but guy dropping Yeah, because what he can do as a pass rusher and yet they wouldn't use him that way. I don't know Bowser. I think he needs a lot of work. Instinctively, he know he's very undeveloped there. But as an athlete potential Skyhi good Russian though, So okay, Bowser, Rivers and Willis, how do

you rank those three? To me? Those are the guys in the second round that you kind of struggle with. A lot of bunches, Yeah, a lot of them. So how do you differentiate between those those three? I would probably go because see I have them all about the same. Yeah, so do I Willis? Yes, I will Rivers scares me because I'm watching Moss on the other side, who we've talked about making plays and I'm waiting for Rivers, and all of a sudden he makes one. I'm like going, oh,

that's what I'm trying to find. I don't know Willis Rivers Bowser from me? Say again, Willis Rivers Bowser. I would put Bowser over Rivers in the second round. But you agree with Willis. Willis's top of that though. Yeah, all right, Like I'm tired of the Willis slander. So I appreciate this. I'll tell you guy, you're sleeping on here, smoot from Illinois. You hate him, I know it. Don't just go ahead. You can get him in the fourth See he hates him. That's I mean, that's where do

you have? Yeah, that sounds about okay, okay, but again, and for the millionth time that they're picking ninety second overall, like that's smooth and sleeping on smooth essentially a fourth round pick. Anyway, um, real quickly, we don't like I don't y'all don't need to fight over this one, because that's been fighting today. That's been the theme of the day. I have a feeling this guy to my right is really tired right now. Bartow's stud Nikki what he was?

This a real name? Yes, And the reason why I'm even reading his question is because it's coming from crack off Poland, so shouts out, thank you very much for that. He wants a grade on Florida State receiver Travis Rudolph. The question of the day, and what y'all think about him? Have you watched the player? I've watched the player. How about you, Dane? I got into fifth round. I have I think a fifth six on him. There's just nothing there that's and he's a I think he's a very

advanced route runner. I did most of his damage from the slot. But he's not a great speed guy. I ran a four to six at the combine. Size doesn't jump out at you. Too many drops, So I mean we're talking about a receiver is not big, not fast, and has more drops than you want. Yeah, he's not a natural ketchup. Take good memory four hundred fifty players are good, but he's an I think he's an advanced route runner, right. You see the footwork, especially on the

slants in cutting routes. So I think he'd help you out in the slot. But he's not a game breaker. He's not gonna help you on special teams. So that I want, I need a return I want. Dane is absolutely right, and I look back in my notes, he kind of he jumps to catch the ball, which means he really doesn't trust his hands. He doesn't run away from people either too. That's another thing that Dane was talking about, the separation, the quickness, But there are some

positive things I do think. I do think he has an understanding of how to the run round. I think there's quickness and routes. I just don't think there's the separation all the time. I think getting into it, he could be quick. But yeah, I had him amongst the group of like I had those like him, Reynolds, the Texas A and m Kid had them kind of in that inn that fifth round mix is where I had Rudolph fair enough got through that without an argument, So

that's yeah, we agreed on him to go. That's impressive. Though he remembered a guy that I mean, I I knew, I knew where I had the guy. I just didn't remember why I had him. And that's it's part of being fifty three years old. That's classic Brugler. That is there. Okay, oh sorry, are we Yeah, let's take let's take one more, one more quick one. I just and this is an interesting one to me. It makes me think about the Panthers last year. Remember they drafted three cornerbacks after they

let go a Josh Norman. Right, how Chase wants to know how many cornerbacks could you realistically see them drafting. Chase thinks that they could draft as many as three. I don't see that. I know, like you know you see it. I mean, they doubled up on running back last year, but it was first and sixth round, Like when have you ever Let's let's throw something out there. We got the thirty visits. Yeah, would you be surprised

over and under ten visits for cornerbacks? Third of the visit, the third of the visits being cornerbacks strictly corners, not strictly you're going over over it. I mean it's a very I'd say it's right around there, pressing issue. Yeah, I mean I wouldn't be surprised if it's over I guess ten, you know, yeah, because you figure, Okay, these thirty visits, a third corner, maybe a third pass rush, and then the other third safety safety. Yeah, maybe a

few offensive guys that they like. So I think, yeah, it's probably right around there. Yeah, I can see. I think it's more than ten. I like what you're saying. I think it's over ten. Yeah, I mean that that's they're they're gonna have to do something. But but that's why well, and that makes that's why it seems like a lot. That's why I pick chase his question because it you haven't seen it very much. You have not seen You definitely haven't seen him do it with premium picks.

Oh In in the early two thousands, we drafted three corners. How did that work out well? Edwards, Mari Edwards was one of them. It didn't work out great well. Ross Ross had six interceptions as rookie year. Ohio State was always in trouble. I mean, Scandrick's coming up on a decade in the league and his contract is I mean, you're getting to a point where you can part ways with him if you want to, and you just signed Carroll to a deal that isn't binding by any means.

What's what's more likely in my draft? Three quarters? I mean, you know it, you can play a game with the guy. You know, You're fine for twenty seventeen. But like, this is a position that needs some thought. Well, I think Anthony Brown's development as a rookie makes them not have to draft three corners, you know two? Yeah, I think too. What's more likely they draft two corners or one tight end in this draft? What's more likely two corners? I think?

I would say one tight end is still more likely. I think you're gonna get Hannah and swam back. I think you're gonna have swam right, But I think I think Hannah and then you've got the you know, Rico gather Rico gathers. Ah, yes, all pro Rico gathers. That's great. That's why I want to make a tackle. Dane kind of laughs it. Let's put that. Let's put those eggs in our basket, all right, Thanks to everybody out there for who's my guy from Poland? Again? Bartows? I hope

I'm pronouncing yeah. Thank you very much for listening, and thanks to everybody across the pond as well. I know we got a lot of folks with the with the UK Cowboys. You know that the fan club is stulf great folks over there. We appreciate. Dan Turner was a guy who did some stuff with us too. Love you Danny. Yeah, and he I know he listens as well. Okay, coming back after the break, we're going to get into a

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show from the SWBC Mortgage studio. Is just another reminder, uh, twenty what I say, twenty eight days till the NFL Draft, twenty eight days, four weeks from righting at well not right now, but four weeks from we'll be getting right for that, and this is kind of give you a little preview. We're gonna have the wall to wall coverage of the draft here on Dallas Cowboys dot Com with the app all that stuff. We're actually gonna be working with one oh five three the Fan as well with

our draft buddies Jeff Kavanaugh and then Kevin Turner. So three nights or three days of the draft, h have all kinds of things going on, but we're very excited about that and the partnership that we have with one oh five three, But the partnership that we have with everybody that sits down Jeff and Kat the grind tape, like Dane, myself and you do us well, Dave. So not on y'all's level, but thanks, but no obviously biased,

but it's so much better than anything. You're gonna watch it. Yeah, I would work or ESPN if you're a Cowboys anybody. But if you're a Cowboys fan and you're not, you don't have our stuff on in some form or fashion during Draft weekend, you're doing it wrong. Yeah, it's just a general NFL fan. Yeah, we're gonna cover everybody. We're gonna cover every pick and yeah, and again I plan on talking about who the Falcons take, who the Buccaneers take. Yeah,

I know. I'm the one that's trying to talk about what it means for the Cowboys, and y'all are like, yeah, no, but the Jags are on the clock. Come on, yeah,

full back in a sixth round. Yeah, well that's and that's the whole idea, you know, and especially for you folks have been with us the whole time, you know, and other things like you say, either Dane's guide, the stuff we do on the Star magazine, the stuff we do here with our podcast with with Dane and what they do and trust to tape with him and Kavanaugh anything that. You know, you guys take this all in

and try and learn and so we appreciate that. So anyway, okay, with we'll finish up the show with a little tell me more, David. All right, let's do it, guys. Let's get right into it. Because we went along like we usually do. It's okay, tell me more about Michigan State tight end Josiah Price Combine snub. I know. Yeah, he is the type of player who the only separation he gets is what the defense gives him. Yeah, he's not a great athlete and he's not an overpowering blocker, but

he's kind of solid in both areas. I think he's a PFA, you know, a guy that maybe you pick up as a free agent and he tries to win a job in camp bite. I think the overwhelming thought on him is how smart he is. He spends more time in the film room than any other player on that Michigan State roster. Can he block not very well? I mean I think he's adequate, yea with potential to get better. But just like I mean, he's he's not going to vow you. He's not going to If this

guy could block, you would be describing Jason Garrett's wet dreams. Yea, why I said that? So we have to dump that for what you just said. Oh okay, it's fine, but we are a podcast right now. Fine I agree with But yeah, sorry about that. Ken'd mean that to happen. I will tell you this though about the guy, I think that I think Dane has him absolutely right. He is a he's what I call a half man blocker, though he's not really interested in taking his face and

putting it in the middle of the guy. He's a little bit of a shoulder half man. He kind of tries to kind of get in position wall turn that thing. For a guy that's, you know, sixty three two hundred and fifty pounds, you figured he would get a little bit more snap to him. But they do move him around. He'll play a little in line for you, but there's nothing really redeeming other facts. I saw him catch a ball in the flat that was a decent adjusting catch, But a lot of his stuff is move in line

block but not great at it. He just sounds like a guy that'll wind up here. Like maybe not as a draft he'll play twelve years for the Los Angeles Chargers. Yeah, probably that's what they do. They'll take some guy like this and he'll play twelve years. Tell me more about Oregon State corner Truston de Cou, who is a Louisiana native, the Coup. I love that name. I know you just watched him when Yeah, Brian, you know what I thought the initially I've seen him twice now, I thought the tape.

I thought the tape when I first watched him, I didn't see the tightness in him. You know, he's a tall guys, he's almost six two, and I thought that he moved better. And then I watched some later tape at him, and he really didn't. He's got some stiffness in the way he plays, and but he's got length, he's got reached. You could see him on the line be able to kind of hold a guy. But when it turns, when it turns into turn, run go, there's

some issues there there. There's I don't think he's a very quick player, and when you usually have tall corners, they're pretty leggy. There's some corners in this draft though, the Colorado kids, they're not as leggy. They're tall guys, but you could see them turn and go. He'll be a guy that's sent a mix for a lot of the teams because of his of that length. But I I just I initially liked him a lot, and then I kind of came off him like, Okay, some later

games I watched, is this really what he is? Trying to trust the tape, but of seeing a little bit of an up and down player, I don't know if I would like him better than some of the other guys that I've seen. I mean, I just think of guys like and maybe even a little shorter guy, uh you know with with elder Myrick from Minnesota, uh Tankerusly. I mean, these are guys i've that are shorter but quicker guys. I just think I would go another direction other than than the coup. Yeah. I agree. This is

a player who's overcome a lot. He's been at four different programs the last five years. Uh So, adversity wise, he's come. He's really advanced himself as a person. But I think you you hit it right. I mean, he's a tall long corner who is going to present matchup problems. Uh, you know he can. He'll be looked at by the Green Bays, the Seattle's, the teams that really uh factor in length, in height at the cornerback position. And I think for this team he'll be a guy that they

look at on day three. But I think you're right about him being a little stiff, being a little leggie, just struggling his transition. So fifth, sixth round, I think, is where you look at him. I think at that point he's he's worth it. But if he goes any earlier, I agree, there's better players i'd rather have. Yeah, I had him in the fifth round. As I look at my board here, I got a Dane Burglar special. I think it just it just feels like one because it's

silly sounding, silly. Tell me more about Kansas safety Fish Smithson. Nobody loves the name, nickname, or name more than you Smithson. And unfortunately this is like a Taco Charleton where it really his name. It's not really his name. I think ever is Anthony. That's his name, a fisherman fish. His grandma gave him that nickname when he was little, and so it kind of just stuck his sticks. Freaking course

Dane knows how he got the nickname. Uh. But that's gonna be in the Beast, by the way, will be in the Beast. Absolutely, it's important because people want to know uh Fish. He's interesting because he started as a wide receiver. Uh. Started at Navy, then he bounced around a little bit, ended up at Kansas, a little bit under sized, not the fastest, but you like how he plays in coverage. He'll attack the ball in the air. He's instinctive. Uh. He's the type of player that in

the in the later rounds. That's the guy I want to take a chance on. Yeah. The thing that the thing that I watched. I remember watching the Texas game and it was like the first play of the game, he gives up a seventy yard touchdown pass and I'm thinking, oh, please, don't let this thing go downhill from there. But Dane's got him right. He's a four or five five guy.

He's an over two hundred pounds, so he's faster than Teas Taper and yeah, and you see him, Well that's not a gombar, but he's but he's a but he could be a downhill player. He plays around the line, He's always it's like he's trying to make up for the lack of talent that they have in the secondary at Kansas. Sure, he's always trying to be He's always trying to help somebody else. And you know, I don't see a guy with like Dane says, I don't see great quickness, I don't see great speed. I see a

guy though this willing tackle. I say, he did miss that tackle. They put him in the slot and ask him to cover, and I think that kind of that's a bad thing for him to have to do. If you he's one of those guys, you're better off having him blitz where he doesn't have to play coverage or play way down where he can kind of be in that area where he doesn't have to be in a lot of space, because the deeper you play him, the

harder to his for him to make play. Something that we talked about with teas being around so many future NFL guys and how that helped him. It's opposite for him. He's around a lot of nut NFL guys in that Kansas defense, and he had a lot was put on his plate, and so I think he deserves credit for that. He led the team in tackles last two years, led team in interception, So I think there's something there later rounds.

He's a guy you take a chance on six seven. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, you're looking for the trade, and the trade, like Dane was talking about, is the fact that you do see him. You know he's he's one of these guys that will tackle a willing tackle. I just worry about the coverage stuff that it's just the trade of being physical. That's what you're looking at. I'm ready for both of you to roll your eyes at me, and I don't care. I want you to tell me more about Minnesota quarterback

Mitch Leidner. Ye out there, it was just say quarterback or tight end. Hey, this team could use the tight end. So it was funny because he was Lightner was actually looked at as a tight end out of high school and then he threw the ball a little bit. In Minnesota is like, ah, we'll take a chance on you. The only the only school that did gave him an offer. I get it physically, I mean he's big, he's got a big arm, he's a good athlete. But once the

ball leaves his hand, it's anyone's guess where it ends up. Yeah, you know what I had a I like the fact that he had some mobility in the pocket. He's you know when yeah, like he's like when you watch him, like as a ball handler, you can kind of see and some of his best passes he throws, and Dane's right, there's not a lot of great ones, but the best passes he throws are off play action passes. I mean

off the playoff ball fake, you know. I mean, he's not a he seems like he's better when he doesn't have to think about setting up right, you know, when he when he has to get back plant and let it fly. And I didn't feel like the big arm. I saw a better touch than I then I saw a big arm because I saw the arc, you know. But he puts some balls in some positions where guys

should have made plays and didn't. You know, maybe it's a Minnesota the talent on the outside, but he threw a couple of swing passes he made the guy have to work a little bit. He's just an up and down guy. But the athletic ability the ball handler and the ability to maybe throw off play action might somebody might figure out, Hey, maybe this guy can do all that. But I I you just said, it's not don't think

about this quarterback here. Know what you just said. All the stuff you just said is stuff that Dak is really good at and stuff we credited Dak for during the draft process. I'm not saying that that Dack's a real quarterback. I don't think this. I don't think Niche is a real quarter I just don't think this player has any feel for the passing game. I think all

the productions I don't disagree. I mean, because this would saying when he when he fakes, all he has to do is look up and throw it is it's not reading it, it's it's yeah, I'm looking. I would love for this team to draft a quarterback on Day three. But the more I look at it, the more I just think this is not a great class to do that. I just don't see it. It's Peterman, a day three guy. Probably not. It probably goes sooner. Davis Webb probably goes

top fifty. Okay, A colleague, a colleague of our, colleague of Oars, A colleague Oars, Pete Prisco Pizza. Dear friend of mine, you have some great battles with Pete about running backs and stuff like that. Pete's talking to folks general Mansion. Maybe this is lying time. I said, this is lying time. Yeah, they're talking about Webb being some general managers or I guess most general or football operations guys saying that Webb could be a first round pick.

Would that be? That would be shocking? Why? Yeah, I get it. Well, But then Christian Ponder, right, I mean look at some point, ej Manuel, I mean, yeah, with with David's Webb, He's ball a good deep Paul, He's an excellent deep ball. The arms there, Yeah, physically speaking, the traits are there. But and he's a smart guy. The guy is known as a gym rat him. His dad's a long time high school football coach here in North Texas. But he's never had to read a defense

in his life. Yeah, at Texas Tech, at Cal it's all schemed for him. He's going to his initial read most of the time. But he can spray the ball all over the field. And so that's the one thing. I mean, we were watching some we were watching the Coup and the ki Kids caw and it's like, oh man, he's sewing the ball down the field and you're like, oh, this got a shot to make it. Let's let's be honest. Pat Mahomes is getting a lot of love as a

first round player. Is there really that much of a difference between Pat Mahomes and Davis Webb in terms of Oh, I love Pat Mahomes because I see I see I see the production Davis Webb. I see a lot of web Brookman, most of Jared Goss records this past year. I want to brag about that they're still still production. Oh, I know, I'm just I'm oh, I know. I'm just kidding you. Davis Webb couldn't hit anything at Senior Bowl practices, That's all I know. That's but he won the MVP

though didn't know the game. Man, Yeah, that's he wasn't that great in practice, but during the games, so he's a gamer like that? Is that what we're saying. No, I just so you're okay, I'm playing Devil's advocate here because he's not a first round pick. But I'm just but you don't think Mahomes is a first round pick? No, I think I like Mahomes in a second and like David's Webb and the fourth. But I'm just saying, playing

Devil's advocate. You know, people love pet mahomes. People that love pet mahomes, shouldn't they at least like Davis Webb, Kaiser or Davis Webb. Oh it's not close, Davis Webb. No, it's Kaiser. Say no, that's not close. I think that this only further proves my point with if Davis Webb is being talked about, even as a top fifty guy, there will not be a quarterback worth spending a draft pick on after the third round. Boy, I'll give you a guy in the seventh Alec Torgerson that I watched

that guy a little bit. Wat Yeah, I watched it a little bit. You know what happened. I watched the wrong side of the ball. I watched him playing He's uh, he's from Pen Pen And I was watching Yale and I thought, wait a minute, I'm watching Yale's quarterback. And Yale's quarterback was kind of pitching her up pretty good. I'm like, well, wait, An, I'm watching the wrong guy. Were you disappointed when he put on Pen's offense. I was a little disappointed, I had to say, I was

a little disappointed. Goodness gracious, Yeah, talking about Ivy League quarterbacks now, how about that? All right? Guys, thank you so much, Thanks everybody out there for joining us. I also want to thank Derek Eagleton Taylor Stern for always putting a our stuff out there. I want to thank at K Hill there in Orlando, Florida for creating this show so many years ago. And I want to thank everybody out there for watching, for listening, for your interaction.

When we come back to you next week, there'll be twenty one day, three weeks to the NFL Draft. I hope everybody has a great week. Take care. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.