The new pandemic, you know what it is? Gut problems of all kinds. I remember having what I call like a nervous belly. Suddenly I wouldn't feel so good. We're at a school assembly. Something would happen. My gut got a little funny. And it really hit a critical max throughout my 20s. For those of you who don't know, your gut is the factory for your neurotransmitters. 90% of your serotonin, you need it from your gut. 50% of that dopamine, that feel-good, that motivation model made in your gut.
400 times more melatonin is made in your gut than in your brain. My gut, the factory, was on fire from having panic attacks having to go to the grocery store. And it was absolute rock bottom. So nobody had a solution for me. I did the Google search and figured what could it be? I only ever got as far as the IBS diagnosis. So irritable bowel syndrome. And it hit rock bottom when I started planning my own suicide. That was it. And I mean I did the math. I had the bottles.
I knew exactly what was what. And it was then that I turned to somebody else for help. And I started learning. I went back to school, became a nutritionist. I had microbes. And there's three reasons human beings get sick. But these things collectively contributed to an overgrowth of fungus. So I had a lot of candida. I had overgrowth of any bacteria you could name. I had parasites that I could physically see, worms 18 inches long coming out when I cleaned them out.
I had flutes that were the size of a dime, different types of parasites. So my body was full of toxins, microbes, and deficiencies. But there's a method to the madness. And once I understood that, then I began to repair and heal.
Do you always tell many doctors don't know a thing about the gut and really how to fix it? Your victory, God gave you, allowed you to learn what you need to know for such a time as this.
And now here we are. I'm fully convinced every bowel disease is reversible.
The new pandemic, you know what it is? Gut problems of all kinds, IBD, irritable bowel disease, IBS, irritable bowel syndrome, Crohn's, colitis, or I don't know what's wrong. I just can't seem to get rid of these symptoms of bloating, et cetera. Well, my next guest is going to bring answers to everything that I just said. Okay, Josh Deach, nice to have you here on this incredibly important topic today.
Pleasure to be here. Deach is close enough, by the way. Oh, how do you say it? I mean, you canch was closer. Dech. Deck? But that's okay. You know what? I mispronounce it sometimes too. Deck. I'd never, I'm a dyslexic.
I say things the way I see them. I like that. Deach is good.
I might actually change my name now.
Yeah, Deech. I like Deech. You know what is funny? Because it was pronounced to me Deech. So that's the way. So I can't even bring my dyslexia.
You're totally fine.
But um yeah, so look, I this is a really important topic and uh one that pain to purpose. Uh, you ended up an expert in. And I always say that those are the best experts in the world, the ones that have been through it themselves, had to find answers. That was me. That's why I sit here today. So bring us back, man. Let's let's talk about your story. When did you start getting symptoms? And that that may even be before you got the diagnosis.
Long before. And it's funny, pain to purpose is one of those things, like you say, it makes the best experts because your lived experience, you dive so deep into one particular niche to understand this one thing and all of its parts, versus going to your GP, who kind of just learned about it in school and has a toolkit, which is drugs and surgery. My gut issues, man, they started probably as early as third or fourth grade. I remember having what I call like a nervous belly, right?
Suddenly I wouldn't feel so good. We're at a school assembly, something would happen. My gut got a little funny. And it really hit a critical max throughout my 20s.
And by the way, you're probably told, uh, it's just stress.
Oh, it's just genetic. Yeah.
They hit me with that. Yeah, it's just genetic. You're unlucky and it's stress. Avoid stress because your femur is such. Yeah.
Okay. Yeah. Well, my mom had bowel issues.
And I remember genetic.
Always my dad had it. So it must be genetic. Must be. I remember back when I was probably 11, 12 years old. She's always had gut issues. She's always really gassy and always had issues that way. But we went to McDonald's after a baseball game, and that was like the nail in the coffin. She ended up going upstairs, laying on her left-hand side, waiting for the gas to pass, like she normally would, wouldn't pass. I remember going up to check on her.
My stepdad was actually sitting in the room with her. It was well lit hallway in a dark room. I just remember seeing, I remember seeing shadows. And I remember them kind of whispering. He's like, We need to go to the hospital. I said, kind of peeked in. Is everything okay? Yeah, yeah, we're fine. And she refused. About 30 minutes later, they got out of the car and they drove down to the hospital. A couple hours later, my stepdad gives me a call and he says, Everything's okay.
I just want you guys to know that she's going to be fine. But they had to rush your mom in for emergency surgery. Turns out she perforated her bowel. So she had a little hole from years and years of wear and tear that eroded the tissue till a hole formed and it started leaking toxic gas and stool contents. She went septic. And she was in the hospital for about two weeks. They took out two feet of colon. They ended up removing over time her gallbladder, two feet of bowels over two surgeries.
They put in mesh colostomy bags that works. My dad had gut issues. And by the time I hit my late teens, IBS was just the norm. I asked my doctor about diet, said nothing. And I'll tell you, at the critical critical, isn't it wild?
Yeah.
Like eat whatever you want, food doesn't matter. I hit a critical mass when I was probably 23, 25. I was at a point where I was 10, 15 bowel movements a day. I had blood and mucus in my stool, fluctuating between constipation, diarrhea. And for those of you who don't know, your gut is the factory for your neurotransmitters. 90% of your serum is how your brain works, yeah. You need it from your gut.
Second brain.
50% of that dopamine, that feel-good, that that motivation molecule is made in your gut. 400 times more melatonin is made in your gut than in your brain. And my gut, the factory was on fire. And my doctor said, Well, you got ADHD, here's some vivance. I said, Well, you've got diarrhea, here's some immodium. And it got to the point where I was having anxiety and panic attacks. Like I was a paramedic. Comcool collected in a crisis. So I'm having panic attacks having to go to the grocery store.
And it was absolute rock bottom when I planned.
This brain was disrupted. This brain wasn't getting the neurotransmitters it needed to feel normal.
No. And they kind of just ignored it and it hit rock bottom when I started planning my own suicide. That was it. And I mean, I did the math. I had the bottles. I knew exactly what was what. And it was then that I turned to somebody else for help and I started learning. And everything was uphill from there. And now here we are. I'm I'm fully convinced every bowel disease is reversible.
So yeah, I'm with you. So we're gonna get to those solutions. Um so did you at one I mean you must have as a child thought it's just genetics, I'm doomed, right? I mean, at one point.
I guess I didn't think anything of it. You know, just like you've been told your doctor says it's normal or it's just genetic, and because it's so common, they call it normal, not realizing it's not optimal for a human body. It's just what they see all the time. So nobody had a solution for me. It was crazy.
So you were given the diagnosis eventually of um of what? I mean, irritable bowel uh disease is kind of broad, but then you got more specific.
So I had I I use the term self-diagnosed. I did the Google search and figured what could it be. I only ever got as far as the IBS diagnosis. Okay. So irritable bowel syndrome. And by the time I started having blood and mucus and the urgency and frequency, and I had acne from my gut. It was all it was up my back, neck, chest, down my forearms on my wrists. It was everywhere. So what'd they do? Here's some accutane. It didn't go to the root cause. Which crushes the liver.
Crushes the liver, which was already congested. Okay. It was a train wreck. So I never went past that. Cause I already realized at this point my doctors aren't going to help me. So if I had to go back looking at it now, knowing what I know, easily would have been colitis, if not ulcerative colitis, but I never got the formal diagnosis of the colonoscopies. I just frankly didn't bother. Yeah.
Yeah. So I mean, here you are now, your 20s. Um Thank you.
Do I look that good? No, no, no, no.
I mean when you're finding all this out. Like because you started when you were younger, but now you're in your twenties. It did sound like I was saying it was 20, but that's not what I meant. Sorry. Stop, stop. Sorry. Um but okay. So here you are in your 20s now with this you know, gut problem. And now you've kind of did the regular treatments. They've given you all the drugs.
Yep. They gave me a modium, they gave me bivamps for the ADHD, stuff for the acne, whatever they could throw at me at the kitchen.
If you did that, now you're entering into okay, let's get to the cause of this. Tell me about that.
So I started doing some diving. I got mentorship, I went back to school. I left paramedics and I was in personal training. I went back to school, became a nutritionist. And as much as I learned through that process, learning to heal myself, it wasn't all the answers. There was no textbook that really had it. It's information I had to dig up and find all by myself.
Yeah. Well, that was me, right? I mean, everything I've taught doctors for 20 years, I found. Yeah. You know, I always say God led it to me for such a time as this, because so many people are massively neurotoxic. And so much of the downstream problem is the gut, you know, of what we deal with. Okay. So you found some answers. You become a nutritionist. I mean, that that's what you do. Um pain to purpose for sure. But what what did you find? What was like some of the first breakthroughs?
What did you matter of fact? I want to know what you tried that didn't work, and I want to know what you tried and did work because people are going, you know, it's because I tried a lot of things that didn't work, man. I mean, I tried some crazy stuff too. I bet you did.
I mean, I bet you did everything outside of going to the Himalayas and seeing a shaman. Um, let me save you a lot of money on supplements out of the gate. My doctors, they gave me, like I said, every pharmaceutical. So I went by myself. I tried every probiotic, I tried every supplement, I jumped on anything I could find online. Yeah. Even when I was in the bodybuilding world, I tried I tried every supplement. I tried one came up called ectosterone.
It was like this bug powdered protein they said was good for you for building muscles and extra synthesis. It's all crap.
Yeah.
Nothing helped. What I had to go back and understand is that I could go through this process. I identified I had microbes, and there's three reasons human beings get sick. Ever. And being hit by a bus doesn't count. That's trauma, right? And so we're talking about three reasons we get sick: toxins, microbes, and deficiencies.
I agree. Yeah.
And I've distilled this down over God knows how much time. I know you've got your five, it's not particularly five R's, but your five steps, your super toxins you talk about, and cellular health. It's all of that. Toxins are simple. It's going to be some kind of environmental toxin, alcohol, excess stress, chronically high blood sugar. These are all toxins, food dyes, emalsifies. It's all toxic.
EMFs or uh chemical toxicity.
Just wait till 6G comes out. Ooh, buddy. That's another conversation. But that's toxins. Microbes are going to be your viruses, bacteria, parasites, fungi. And then, of course, your deficiencies, exercise, sunlight, vitamins, minerals, amino acids, rest, sleep, relationships, right? All those things make us sick in some combination. I found my body over time, due to a whole chain of events from chronic stress to poor diet to counting macros and not chemicals. I was counting my calories instead.
But these things collectively contributed to an overgrowth of fungus. So I had a lot of candida. It was up and down everywhere. I had overgrowths of any bacteria you could name, my GI map. So my stool sample measuring my microbiome was just off the charts. I had parasites that I could physically see, worms 18 inches long coming out when I cleaned them out. I had flukes that were the size of a dime, different types of parasites. So my body was full of toxins, microbes, and deficiencies.
And by the way, usually the toxins allow the microbes to exist in and around them because they lower your force field, your immunity. And now these things start, it happened to me. I had parasites, I had candida, I would beat it back, it would come back, beat it back, come back. I I had to lower my toxic load to a point. Then I could get over, go over it. Yeah.
Well, the toxic load lowers your deficient, it lowers your defenses. But the problem is your body, it's burning through your resources, leaving you more deficient. Right? So it's it's burning through everything to try to clean you up, but you never replenish it. And we just kill, kill, kill, kill. Wonder why we get sick.
Yeah.
But there's a method to the madness. And once I understood that, then I begin to repair and heal.
Tell us about the method. What did you learn?
Oh my goodness. Well, this method, Daniel. It's nothing that it's nothing you're not already doing. And I think this is what's so important. Every time we hear something new, we're looking for something sexy.
Oh yeah, it's true. Yeah.
It doesn't exist. It's very simple. I go through a D5R process every time. I used to use the five R's, but hear me out. First step is drainage. You have we'll call seven main exit pathways inside of your body. You could argue nine when you talk about cellular and brain and neuro, but seven main exit doors, how things get out.
I call them downstream pathways.
Oh, downstream pathways. I exit pathways, because when things are going out, we don't want them downstream. We want them out. Your main pathways, you're talking about your liver, your gallbladder, and bioducts, right? Skin, sinuses, lymphatics, you got your bowels and your kidneys, bladder. That's how things leave. All of mine work in the too, by the way. Lungs. You can off-gas. Yeah. You could argue again cellular and even brain with the blood-brain pair.
Exactly. I uh cellular to me is like that's that's where it all starts, right there. And then we move it out.
But it's like trying to rebuild a house, but there's holes in every brick. So cellular is the foundation of everything.
Yeah, exactly. That's step one.
Absolutely. And if you can open these drainage pathways to get these things out of your body, that's how you start cleansing the load. Otherwise, what happens? I describe it like having this glass full of water. Yeah, I do the same description. Do you? Yeah. Oh, if you're gonna get so you guys might have heard this one already then. If I stop now, it'll just be awkward. And so it's like you got a penny in the bottom and my cup is full. And I got to reach in there to pull the penny out.
But if my cup's already full, what happens? You spill. Everything gets wet.
Absolutely.
And it's a bigger mess. Yeah. You got to empty your glass first before trying to get in there into a mix.
I give me your glass. Oh, please. Okay, so then I do this one. This is adds to it, right? So you can see this one's much fuller than this one. We'll say this person's more toxic, right? Look at this person. Little bit. I'm just drinking more water than him. However, for the analogy's sake, this one, you don't have to stress that much. Oh, and look, water comes out, damage symptoms, right? This one I can stress. Look how much I can stress this. You want to be here, not here.
Wouldn't you believe it?
I've used the exact same analogy. And now you spilled a little water. I'm going to die. Sorry.
Yeah. Clean up.
I'm kidding.
But uh yeah, so he's emptying his bucket. So that's good.
You have to empty the bucket.
Yeah, right. I mean, exactly. You have to keep these pathways open. And uh when you do, the body heals, right? I mean, you give it what it needs, right? And um, and then obviously we're getting rid of the toxins. Deficiencies, just to close that door. What are the big deficiencies that you're seeing today? I mean, you're a nutritionist, this is what you do day in, day out. What are the big ones?
You know what? I'm surprised I don't see, and someone's gonna come at me for this one. I'm surprised I don't see more vitamin mineral deficiencies. And I think that's largely because the people I see who are coming into my practice dealing with either severe IBS or Crohn's colitis have already been battling this for so long. A, they're gonna be deficient in some basics due to absorption, but they've tried so much already. They're taking so many vitamins and supplements and minerals.
So they've got a lot of those levels, at least when they're being tested, circulating through their urine or through their blood already. So they may not show deficient, but on a cellular level, we're very deficient.
Yeah.
So I'm seeing a lot of basic stuff, but more so in balances, you know, zinc and copper being out of balance, sodium, magnesium, calcium, potassium, they're all out of whack. And I'm seeing a lot of people deficient, and believe it or not, I would argue like fats, very simple fats, cholesterol, things we need.
Oh, I agree with that. Yeah.
When your liver's all congested with these toxins and microbes, you're not you're not getting what you need. You're not emulsifying what you need, you're not breaking down, digesting, and absorbing properly. So you're going to be deficient in everything, which I don't say that it's scary, that's a crap answer. But the idea is it's a replenishment of all the microbes.
I simply give them some salt, some trace minerals, sometimes magnesium and a multivitamin at some point during a protocol, and that's typically enough. I just is it's such a vital part because you need these nutrients, they're building blocks and tools. And construction workers can't build a home without tools. Simply can't be done. But I think there's a lot of other things we need to worry about first, like getting the hurricane to stop. You know what I mean?
So you guys can get to the house in the first place.
Absolutely. I I lipid therapy. I I call it, I always say stabilize with cholesterol and saturated fat first. Cholesterol is needed for the brain, and every cell membrane, saturated fat and cholesterol stabilizes it. And you know, I I learned it dealing with the autistic children, and they would stabilize with those fats better than any fat before you would start even with some of the um other omega-3, omega-6. But the cholesterol is so important and so many people lack it.
But then you have your fat-soluble vitamins that people lack today, right? It's like, but I agree with you though, it's it's more about what you're taking away than oftentimes what you need to give. You know, the body um, you know, can make up those deficiencies pretty easy.
Isn't it remarkably designed? Yeah. Our bodies are made to heal. And coming back to toxins, microbes, deficiencies, if you can either replenish your deficiencies and you can remove the toxins of the microbes or rebalance whatever is causing you so much harm, and you simply give your body the tools and resources to heal, it will do that.
Yeah.
And you know, you kind of led this conversation saying pain to purpose. We talked about how you study just one thing over and over and over again, and that's how you find your way through it. It's it's funny to me because as a nutritionist, I'm I'm really Daniel, I'm not qualified to be here. You know what I mean? Like I'm not. I don't have paper, I don't have credentials. I was a paramedic. Yes, that was medical training. Completely irrelevant to this.
I got the biology, filled in the gaps, went to a nutrition school, became a nutritionist, learned some stuff completely full of gaps. I had to learn this all on my own. And so on paper, I'm not qualified to be here. But I think the irony is for a listener, sometimes we can disqualify people on paper because we don't have the paper.
Yeah. Yeah, the letters mean nothing to me. I I lectured one time, it was in Zimbabwe, and uh the second most powerful man in all of Zimbabwe was this guy named Gatsky. Um, and he came down. I was finishing the lecture, and it was at a big leadership conference, and he came at a brisk pace right down, like barreling towards down to the stage. And I thought, I had a translator, so I'm thinking, surely there was something missing in translators. I was like, I said something bad.
And he came, so I started moving off the stage and he met me and he said, Dr. Pompa, and I'm thinking, oh my gosh, what did I say? He said, I just want to tell you, your authority doesn't ever come from your school, your education. In fact, you're a doctor, your authority comes from the victory God gave you. And he walked off. And I was like, that was really weird. I like, what did he mean by that? I did I say I still was hooked on that I said something that was.
Emotional roller coaster for sure. Yeah, whatever. And I'm thinking, okay, anyways, it was years later I realized it's like your authority, the reason you're sitting here, the letters behind the name mean nothing. Do you realize how many doctors don't know a thing about the gut and really how to fix it? Your victory God gave you allowed you to learn what you need to know for such a time as this. Yeah, because right now we have more gut problems than anything, and people need to know.
63% of Americans.
Yeah, that's right. Exactly.
That's crazy. Yeah. And the stats on that, 63% of Americans complain of some kind of gut issue once a week, right? Gas blow, constipation, diarrhea, whatever it is. And then we've seen an increase of bowel diseases, like diagnosable diseases like Crohn's colitis, and not just because of awareness and technology, because of the increase in everything we're dealing with, the toxins, microbes, deficiencies. We've seen that increase 3,000% in 75 years.
And I'm not saying don't go to your doctor, go to your doctor, that's my medical disclaimer. This is all for information and educational purposes only, not medical advice. Um, but I've had gastroenterologists, you're a GI specialist, tell their patients the microbiome is a myth. Can you believe 12 to 16 years in school plus experience in practice? You're telling your patients, eat whatever you want, food doesn't matter, and the microbiome is a myth.
Yeah, interesting.
It blows me away. Yeah. And so for such a time as this, these are the people.
My my last guess, um, if you're watching this, you won't know that that's my last guess. But my last guess just ran into a home. Uh her doctor told her that pooping once a month was normal.
Okay.
He was serious. He said it was normal. So she went about her life as if that was normal.
Oh.
Yeah. So that's I've heard that.
I've had because again, here's the thing. We're we're splitting the difference, saying, oh, it's normal because it's happening. It's not optimal.
Yeah.
It's like looking at blood work, and your doctor looks at this, goes, well, you're a normal range. Happened to me when I was sick. My testosterone was nine. Now I forget the units they measure in Canada versus versus the US. The range they had was nine to twenty nine. And that was normal. That went from 18 to 65 years old. When I tested about two years prior, before I got really sick, it was 31. So I was above the quote normal range for whatever age demographic. I came back in, I was nine.
My doctor goes, Well, yeah, it's a bit lower, but I'm not too worried about it until it dips under the mark. I'm like, nine is the mark, man. Yeah. Like it was unbelievable. But then my liver was congested, my gut was messed, like everything. My body just wasn't producing. And they called it normal.
Yeah.
I've had clients come to me pooping every two weeks or 15 times a day. Well, here's some drugs to balance you out. It's normal. Once every two weeks is normal. It's crazy.
But and then here's the thing, too, that enter into our world, right? And the alternative world, then people were relying on High dose magnesium, Senna T, I call them poopers. It's like and again, there's there's a time and a place for that. I'm not not saying there isn't, but uh how many of them are really getting to the real cause of why they're constipated? Typically it's constipation diarrhea. So, you know, that's the bigger conversation.
So that said, uh today, if you would say the number one, maybe number two things that you feel are driving this epidemic of IBD, IBS, what is it?
No pun intended, but that's a crap question.
Um yeah, based on what we just said.
Yeah, it really is it's so loaded. So here's what I can say. On the the bottom of the funnel, I'm seeing a lot of dysbiosis. But keep in mind, this just means imbalanced gut bacteria. Dysbiosis is a downstream issue. You have the self-regulating ecosystem inside of your gut, it balances itself. So if it is dysregulated and you try to fix it, it's gonna come right back to dysregulation. So you have to go upstream. What's upstream? We do have generational dysbiosis.
And this is work shown from Justin and Erica Sonnenberg, I believe they're Stanford. And they've shown it in mice, because they can, obviously, in humans would take forever. But the concept is let's say great-great-grandmother back in the 1800s, pre-industrial revolution, had a thousand microbes, just for round numbers. And then we introduced the industrial revolution. We're getting more lead and mercury in the water, more machine pollutants and gasoline and all this stuff.
So, you know, great grandma comes in now and she gets 800 microbes. That's all that's left over to give her or inherit these things. And then you jump ahead now, and then early 1900s you got penicillin. So grandma gets 600 microbes. And then we have pesticides in the 1950s, 60s, 70s, fast food. And guess what? Mom gets 400 microbes.
I never thought about it this way.
Hands it down to you, you get 200. You give them to your kids, they got squat. And just like any kind of C-section.
Oh, you just worse yet, you're now put on antibiotics because you have no immunity, which wipes out everything.
I'll double down on that one. And I raise you, worse yet, you got 70% of U.S. homes with a mold issue. Now you got chronic tonsil issues, sinus infections, ear infection, more antibiotics.
Yeah, more antibiotics.
And then you're eating toaster shooters for breakfast. And this this is a state of inherited dysbiosis, which is compounded by a toxic environment in a world that is frankly no longer compatible with our biology. We wonder why we're all so bloody sick. And so here we are. This is what's starting the downstream. But now, just like toxins in your system, your defenses are low. On the top of funnel, I'm seeing a ton of is chronic um candida or fungal infections of some kind.
I'm seeing a lot of parasitic infections and a lot of mold. Now, these are the top of funnel, these are the easy things to deal with, right? You remove them, you're good. The tough part about reversing bowel disease and truly not just remission, I can't legally say I cure. I that's still, I get flame for that all the time. I believe they are curable.
But to get your body past just a volatile state of remission where you might flare any time to get back to a state of resilience, that takes time because now you have to repair your defenses and repair the damage, rebalance your immune system. And that takes years of seeding and planting and harvesting.
You know, you brought up mold. And the reason why I teach a lot about mold, people are in mold exposure spending a lot of money on a lot of therapies that may even be great. However, if you're in a moldy environment, I don't care what you do, you're not going to fix your gut or get well for that matter. I I could say fix your sleep of your anxiety, your hormone imbalance, blah blah go down a long list, lose weight, whatever it is. Um, because that moldy home is such a nasty biotoxin.
How many people are you seeing with that being the case that they're in a moldy home?
80%.
Considering 70-some percent of homes in the U.S. are moldy, um, that's not a surprise. Do you know any of Richie Schumacher's work? Yeah. Okay. Um do you believe it's just a, you know, you got unfortunate, you're 25% of the population that has a gene, or do you think it's uh something more than that?
We are seeing, and this is through colleagues of mine, we're very heavy into the research. People don't know how much it takes to get stuff published. So I've got it on paper on like a spreadsheet. Um, but we do know those who have an HLA gene SNP, you're gonna be susceptible to holding on to biotoxins, likely. The reason we see, and maybe we should broaden this beyond just mold. Let's go even all diseases. I can specifically talk to the niche of bowel disease.
We have genes that are responsible on the mucosal level for that immune system, how much it does or doesn't react. We have genes that are responsible for balancing out or reacting to the microbes that may or may not infect you. We have genes responsible for balancing your microbiome. You have genes responsible for your blood, every cytokine responses, they're all there. The thing is, your genes really turn up and down like a volume knob.
Yep.
And epigenetics. Epigenetics. And we're told by our doctor, back to it. It's just genetic. Yeah. That's an on-off. You have or you don't.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.: But today we're doing the same thing with SNPs, I fear. It's like, oh, you have the MTHFR SNP, the C O M T T, yeah, C O M P G. You know, it's like they're just giving these names to the SNPs. It's another diagnosis. It's not so simple. It it's these things still can be turned up and down, and there's pathways around these things epigenetically. So no doubt genes play a role, turning being turned on and off, et cetera. Um, but it is more complicated.
I think the stressors really still rule in this. So my what I've seen as you have we did some testing because I teach doctors, and we were doing the HLA genotype testing um in groups, and we were able to look at four people in a home and test them. Because fortunately, then we had uh insurance was paying for it, Blue Cross Blue Shield was paying for the HLA gene. So we were able to test everyone in the house, whether they were sick or not with the right diagnosis.
And then um we were able to look and map all these families. And oddly, the people with the susceptible gene weren't necessarily sick, a large percentage of the time. So it led me to realize it's more than that. It's more than that. Typically, what we found was the people that had the more filled bucket are the ones that got sickest from the mold, meaning they already had other stressors, emotional, physical, chemical. And they're the ones that mold just sent to the moon.
I like to say faith-based medicine and ideology, and I don't use medicine as a platform to evangelize. I think that's that'd be nonsensical. But the reason I am where I am in my studies and the research, and I believe the results we're getting is I said, God didn't make your body to make mistakes. Like your body was designed perfectly. So, what is the imperfect thing happening to cause a perfect design to respond imperfectly? That's right. These genes, you don't just have the disease.
Yeah. Like you said, what is the thing, the stress of the environment causing you to amplify your response on a genetic level, right? It's not the haplotype that's the problem, right? It's not the SNP, it's something else.
Well, even still, like you we've we've what we thought we knew five years ago, where today we're like, oh my gosh, wait a well, five years from now we're gonna say the same thing. Meaning we've realized so many around so many ways around these methylation genes, but you know, and all these other new SNPs and pathways that affect that pathway. It's complicated and we know crap. That's my feeling. So I yeah, I like I think it's fun, I think it's cool, let's look at our SNPs and all.
But like, let's, you know, let's avoid thinking that we know everything and you know, about these pathways because uh we're gonna realize five years from now we don't know so much.
The more we learn, the less we know, which is powerful. But I'm I'm even gonna throw one out full left field here. I am on the track. I'm this close to being 100% certain that I don't actually believe autoimmune disease exists. Now, this is a left field thing. There's immunologists who are gonna flame me for this one. And if this episode gets enough viewers, someone's gonna hate me for it and I'm gonna hate male, and that's fine. Hear me out.
There are so many auto, like we'll call auto antibodies. There's two kinds of antibodies really that we're talking about. Number one is your antibodies, they're your defenses your body makes against a specific type of intruder, and then your auto antibodies attack self. To put it into visual, if you had a castle back in medieval times and you see some soldiers and troops walking up, and what do you do? Well, I'm gonna create a specific soldier, an archer. That's gonna get them and attack them.
That's perfect. That's an antibody. The problem is when that archer turns around and shoots the king, that is an auto-antibody attacking of self. The more and more research we see, the more we're seeing that these antibodies that appear auto, it's really it's it's sort of death by association, where we see it in Lyme disease.
There are certain antibodies that may be bound or fragments that are bound to your DNA, and your body's attacking the fragment attached to your DNA, but it's not attacking the DNA.
Yeah, there's been this argument for many years. Even Hashimoto's um, so much of it can be, and using one toxic can it mercury could be attached to the receptor. It sees that and attacks that, and now it's attacking the tissue. But if mercury wasn't there, it wouldn't attack the tissue. Totally. It's that molecular mimicry, right? Yeah, exactly.
And I've I've looked this up and I've I pulled it through. There's I pulled out and created a chart of the 10 most common types, my specialty being Crohn's colitis, the most common bowel diseases or uh antibodies we see in bowel disease. And I looked at them again. I said, that's not auto. In fact, the research is now proving. They said, okay, well, OMPC, right? Out of membrane pore and C, it's attacking these E. coli bacteria.
Well, it's actually attacking the membrane and alike for a toxic microbe that looked like your own microbe. We had these other, these P. anchor antibodies, this perinuclear anti-neutrophil, cytoplasmic antibody, big long word. Basically, it's attacking one of your white blood cells. And I looked at that again and said, well, is it attacking something? Because if you get these white blood cells, it'll consume through phagocytosis, they eat.
And if it's something that's trying to digest inside, is that antibody attacking what's in the belly that your body couldn't break down? And the more we do this, the more we stretch it out, it might sound a little absurd, but the research is coming out more and more to say, well, we thought this was an auto attacking the king. Turns out it's attacking the guy holding the king hostage, and the king just got nicked in the process.
If I've got a gangrenous finger, is cutting that finger off saving the body, or is it attacking self? And if we can really understand that, we get we we we no longer have to be landlocked into these diagnoses saying that, well, you have this autoimmune condition, therefore there's nothing you can do. Once you understand it's by association, then it starts to get better. And if we even stretch this to molecular mimicry and jump in any time, and Daniel, you guys got some thoughts brewing there.
I can see it. Oh, yeah. But even we look at molecular mimicry, just like you said. Well, there's mercury and it's bound and it looks like it's attacking your own thyroid tissue, but it may not be. I believe if we start to reduce the toxins, the microbes, the deficiencies, and we start to repair these gaps, it's like looking through a blur like a dirty window. You saw that guy rob your house last week.
It's wearing the same jacket as that guy, but the window's so dirty you can't tell the difference. So you try to just attack them both. If you can clear the window, you can see the difference.
Yeah, exactly. Right. Yeah, no, I think there's an argument for that, uh, you know, and that that needs to be expanded. My thought went to part of autoimmune. We know this microbiome conversation is that some people, mostly probably from upstream toxins and pathogens in the gut, destroy enough of certain bacteria, like Bacteroides fragilis is one, that you need to make. We made the comment of earlier, you need certain bacteria through a Shikame pathway to make certain neurotransmitters, right?
Well, we need certain bacteria to make certain cells, immune cells called T-regulatory cells. What do those do? Tell our immune system back off. It's cool. You know, you don't have to attack. Yeah. So how much autoimmune, let's just say hyperimmunity, allergies, asthma, right? You know, hyperimmunity even, we won't have to stop at autoimmunity, is partly because of that too, where it's just you don't you're not making enough of a certain cell that backs the immune system down.
You get an overproduction, right?
Immune-mediated responses. Yeah. That's what it is. It's a hyperreaction.
Yeah, hyperreaction. Because you don't have enough cells because you don't have enough bacteria. Still, the argument is we're focused here instead of on the upstream toxin or pathogen that is creating the problem.
How do we silence the scream rather than take care of the thing making it scream?
That's right.
It's it's nonsense.
So either way, it's an argument for we're focused on the wrong thing.
We're still downstream. It's just like the microbiome, all the same concept. Yeah. Right? You come in. Well, here's it, here's the issue that we're identifying. Rather than identifying what caused it and starting there, we go back and try to fix a thing and wonder why we keep relapsing. Oh, you were just in remission. I told you, mm-mm, you missed a step and your body relapsed again. That's all there is to it.
Yeah. You know, it's funny too, because um uh a gal who works with me, um, she fixed her Hashimoto, she even fixed her rheumatoid, right? And uh her body fixed it. She has the most incredible immune system. Like, I mean, she never gets sick. I mean, it's like COVID didn't even get it. Uh you know, so my point is keep her away from the US military.
Meaning, to your point, is their immune system is so on guard, their immune system is so upregulated that, you know, perhaps, theory, they are quicker to get to an autoimmune state, you know, because their body sees something and attacks it very quickly. And um, could it be partly that they have an incredible immune system and it took, you know, a certain toxin to create this mimicry, you know, all these things that we're saying.
I break it down into four steps. And again, this is for bowel diseases, but it really does apply across the board for any autoimmune type reaction. The first is your acute stressor. So picture you having one bad day. You shake it off, you get stuck in traffic, uh, you shake it off, you go home, you eat dinner, you go to bed, you're fine. No big deal.
The second stage, it's been a stressful year or two, and you're starting to get sick, your belly's getting upset, you know, you're losing, you're losing sleep, your relationships are a bit strained. That's like a second type of stretch. That's your stage two. Your stage three, you finally snap and you punch the mailman and kick the cat. That's your stage three. That's a hyper overactive response.
I call that you're not adapting to the stress at all. Not even at all.
It is getting you down. And then the fourth stage is you're just like collapse and rock in a corner, put yourself to sleep. That's what your immune system does.
Yeah, now you've absolute failure has come in from be not from not adapting. Now you've hit absolute overload.
It's your immune system on the same thing. Mirror this. You have one stressful day that's an acute food poisoning, kick it, you bounce back, you're good. But chronic, chronic, chronic stressors. Now it's labeled a chronic inflammatory condition after a year or more with medical intervention, ongoing symptoms, your doctors say, Yep, it's chronic. Or they take the condition and bucket it and say it's chronic after three months.
The third stage is now this hyperreaction where you overreact and punch the mailman. This is your immune-mediated response. Most people in Crohn's colitis, you're in an immune-mediated response. This is where you're having hyperreactions, ulcers, strictures, fistulas, mucus is being overproduced, you're bleeding, you get architectural changes where the physical tissues of your bowel begin to scar and form differently. That's a third stage.
The fourth stage, and this is a whole tricky one, this is that deficiency, that collapse where it buckles. And now we're talking SERS or chronic inflammatory response. You could even argue things like MCAS or your mast cell activation syndrome, immune deficiencies, or if it truly does exist, this is where I would class autoimmunity, where your immune system's gone haywire.
And once we can understand that you have these four stages, you can look at it and go, wait a minute, what if I'm only in stage two or three? What if it's been six months, I've had bowel disease, you go to your doctor, they check the symptoms, say, yep, it's chronic. Well, it's only been six months. By definition, it's not chronic. You just lump me in because everybody else is. So you're not treating it and looking for a root cause like a sickness.
And it's no different, Daniel, than I step on a nail. I come into you, you're my GP, I go to the office, say, Dr. Pompa, I've got a nail stuck in my foot. You're like, oh Josh, that is called nail in footyitis. There's nothing we can do, it's genetic.
Sounds complicated.
It's really tough. So here's some numbing cream. Use it for the rest of your life.
Most people would go, okay.
Right? But in the case of a nail, you can go, that's stupid, pull it out. But most people go, okay, I'm sick. It just happened. There's no reason. It's genetic, it's colitis, it's Crohn's, it's irritable bowel, it's whatever itis you want to call it. There's no explanation for it. Take the drugs for the rest of my life, my body's giving up on me. New, look for the nail. And we're not doing that. Yeah. Your doctor doesn't know how to do that.
No, that's and they're not trained to do it. Number one, the system's not even set up to do it, in all fairness. It's set up to deal with an emergency very well. However, they're not set up for anything chronic related without here's the here's the drug for the symptoms.
Isn't that the issue though? We take these these chronic conditions because they're just there forever. We take acute treatments and apply them chronically. That's no way to treat people. Yeah. It's just this is why people get sick. They develop more diseases. The body wears and tears and breaks down like a rusty machine until a part falls off.
It leads to the medical treadmill, leads to another drug, a new drug, and then the symptoms from that drug, you end up with drugs for the symptoms of the drug that you're on. And then the next drug because they're treating things like they would acute over and over.
The system is a wreck until you have the you have to advocate for yourself. I'm not saying do what I've done for 10 years and study it yourself, but I'm saying find someone who cares. But I'm telling you, your doctor, I have to legally tell you to go see them. I don't like it though.
No, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. No. All right, right. But you need a guy like this who this is your focus. Do probiotics work? Um, people are taking a lot of probiotics. Just seem like probiotics are very in vogue right now.
I actually, as a gut specialist, I use very little probiotics. I use them very selectively or specifically to elicit a response or to do a thing. But again, probiotics are water on a fire, but you've not turned off the gas leak. You have this dysbiosis, this imbalanced microbiome, and you don't take these probiotics and you relapse again. So you're dependent. You got herbs and probiotics.
Now you've just got plant-based medication because you're managing your symptoms with more supplements instead of drugs rather than getting to the root. Yes, we can use probiotics, but for me, that's that's typically down the line. Unless I'm eliciting a response now, deliberately or intentionally at something during my protocol. But I don't just throw them willy-nilly. They can often make it worse.
One of the things I've taught for many years is diet variation and forcing people to change their diet. I mean, even massively, keto, high carb, plant-based, you know, carnivore, these massive diet changes force more diversity in the microbiome, and it works. Uh, you know, so people are like, oh, do you give a lot of probiotics? Well, not really. I can diet change. Where and we put people in feast famine, where they feast famine forces the microbiome to change.
And that change, you start to build up a diversity.
Hermesis. It's hermesis. Exactly. That's it.
I stress the gut. And again, everyone, you can't stress everyone the same because their tolerance to the stress, they have to adapt for it to work. If they don't adapt, you'll make them worse. Right. But you have to adapt anyways.
But your food, though, we're talking probiotics. Food's the best place to get them, right? The probiotics that we typically get in our food in our supplements aren't going to culture. A lot of them either dead or die in your gut. They don't make it down. So you're getting the byproducts, these postbiotics they've made, as the benefit. And they act as signaling molecules. They do all kinds of good stuff. So you can feel good temporarily, but dependent.
Just for a context, let's say you buy a bottle for $50 of probiotics. You got 60 pills and they're $5 billion a piece. I'm not going to do the math really quick, but it's not that much. No. I was at a little, we we actually went for dinner. My wife and I went for breakfast this morning, and we found they had a little farm shop in there. And they had, what is it called? Was it Redmond's? Redmond's good spot. Redmonds. Shout out to Redmond's. Great little shot. She did seed oil free.
I just show up. My wife finds all the good spots. Yeah, Redmond's is good. Yeah. And they had these little yogurt shots, these kefir shots, kefir. This little shot was a hundred trillion microbes that was fermented. And those are probiotics that will get into your gut and they're more likely to culture because they're food-based. Compare a hundred trillion. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You'd need 50 bottles of probiotics to come near that. And so food is the best place to get it, anyways.
So this is again, that's why I don't use probiotics unless I'm using it as if I would a medication.
Explain to the people the difference of a prebiotic and a postbiotic.
I'm so glad you asked. All right. Here's the analogy I use. Close your eyes unless you're driving. That's not okay. So picture a fish in a fishbowl. The probiotic is a living organism. That's the fish swimming around. Prebiotics are fish food. That's what the fish is going to eat to create the postbiotic or the fish poop. Your probiotics eat the food you give them. They eat fibers, they eat all kinds of stuff, they ferment it and turn it out into things like short chain fatty acids.
They poop it out. The problem is if you have overgrowth, these dysbiosis states, you got a lot of bad fish poop and a lot of bad stuff. The ecosystem can't keep up. And so you want to feed when you come, oh, I want prebiotics. I heard they're great. What are you feeding? If you get prebiotics in, you're gassy and farty and smelly and bloaty, you're not feeling good, you fed the wrong fish. They pooped out the wrong stuff.
Oh, I don't know. And so I don't like, right?
You don't know what you're throwing in in the pond. Right. Look at what happened to Florida. Put gators in, look at them now. Yeah. So you've got to be very careful. And this is why probiotics are selective. Prebiotics may or may not be a good idea. Postbiotics, almost always a good idea because you know what you're putting in. It's the end product you want anyway if your ecosystem was healthy enough to get it.
Like uh short chain fatty acid, butyrate, buty. Acid. Yeah. A phenomenal stuff because their bacteria makes those. Describe to people what SIBO is, because many people that have bloating think they're food intolerant oftentimes have SIBO. And to your point about prebiotics, they're eating healthy things, garlic, onions, things like that. And they're going, What the heck is wrong with me? I get bloated like crazy.
SIBO stands for small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. And there's different types of SIBO. You'll hear IMO or intestinal methanogen. There's really, we'll call it four types of SIBO, but three main. The first is hydrogen. So you have hydrogen-producing bacteria overgrown. Then you have your hydrogen sulfide, which is a toxic gas. Then you have your methane.
Meaning these bacteria produce too much of that or a lot of that.
Well, you have too much of the bacteria that produce it, so it becomes negative. Like candida is not a bad guy. It's when it's overgrown it becomes bad. And these overgrowths of these bad guys producing excessive byproducts become bad for you. And so your hydrogen, hydrogen sulfide, and methane are your SIBOs. The fourth kind is mixed where it's convolution of all the above. But SIBO can come from a lot of places.
There is what's now being called autoimmune SIBO, again, that autoimmune word where it typically comes from food poisoning, or there's a toxin that comes in that looks like it's an enzyme your body's producing.
And that attacks the migrating motor complex so you don't move food through fast enough and it ferments.
The assembly line gets screwed up. Yeah. Garbage gets stuck and it just stinks inside the truck instead of getting the landfill. And SIBO is largely, I see a lot of it caused by parasites because it'll actually interrupt the valves. We see a lot of inflammation. Most inflammation, if you've seen Crohn's in your practice, Daniel, you'll know the terminal ilium, the end of the small intestine, is where we see most inflammation. Probably 70 plus percent of Crohn's patients have it there.
Well, what sits right there? Well, you have your ileocecal valve. So your ilium, and that's the end of the small intestine, meets the cecum, the large intestine, where about 80% of your microbiome, if not more, lives in that cecum. Right there. That's that ecosystem. Well, when you have these fecal microbes backflowing because that valve isn't closing, you get fecal microbes now entering the small bowel. Well, these fecal microbes, they do all kinds of stuff like fermentation.
That shouldn't happen in your small intestine. The cell wall in your small intestine is one cell thick. It's a thinner mucous membrane, it's made to transit and transport molecules and stuff from your guts into your blood and into your lymphatic system where things can move around those immune cells. That double wall in that thicker membrane layer happens in a large intestine.
Well, if you're taking what should be fermenting in a double thick wall large intestine, but you're taking those microbes into the small, the fermenting there, now you've got all kinds of nasty stuff being produced and your body gets very, very sick. You get ammonia being produced, you name it. And so SIBO is small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, which has different types of microbes, but different root causes. If you can identify them, we're in the money, but it's not a small issue.
There was there were some larger studies done that showed anywhere from 25 to 37%, give or take, of those with Crohn's colitis had SIBO. But there were smaller studies that were done, rural studies in rural clinics, that found upwards of 67% of those with Crohn's colitis had SIBO. So again, is it chicken or egg?
I would often argue that whatever infection you had altered the migrating motor complex, led up to your hyperactive immune responses, led to fermentation, led to bad guys, which led to an inflammatory response and immune response so severe. Now you go look, we're hyperreactive. Now it's Crohn's colitis.
And by the way, that's why people take certain antibiotics, xyfaxamin, there's they take sometimes neomyosin for SIBO. They kill these bacteria that shouldn't be in the small intestine because those antibiotics, like xyfaxamin, stay in the small intestine only, right? But only to get relapsed because they didn't, they killed the guys, but they didn't get to the dang cause of why they had it in the first place. And I think the problem with SIBO is what you said. It's multifaceted cause, right?
It could be people that end up with low stomach acid for this reason or that, medications, whatever, high strains, right? And then it allowed it. It could be that iliocecal valve stayed open for infection, different reasons, who knows? But now bacteria are backing up into there. I mean, there's so many, I saw people with cavitations, infections here, where canals. Yeah. I mean, all these different causes. And people in moldy homes end up with SIBO.
So again, it's a name for this bloating that occurs, this fermentation of the small intestine. But the problem is the causes. Trevor Burrus, Jr.: It's an umbrella diagnosis.
Yeah. This is my issue I take with diagnosis. It's cookbook medicine. Your doctor goes in, they say, here are your symptoms. Check, check, check, check. You meet this box. Here's the name I'm going to give it now. SIBO. SIBO. Well, yeah.
But let's be clear. You're not going to get a SIBO diagnosis in a doctor. Yeah. Rarely.
Yeah. But then they give you the drug. So we check the symptoms, check the box, give the name, give the drug, send you home. At no point, the last 45 minutes of our conversation was it at all considered in your doctor? What was the root? Where did it come from? What's your environment? What's your stress? What led to this? When I'm talking to somebody coming in, I go back, like we led with this conversation to birth, where you breast your bottle thing. Did you have ear infections growing up?
Anybody in your home? Was it early mold infection? What was the chain of events that led to the wear and tear?
Once again, the the person I just uh interviewed before the show, I I can say her name, uh Nasha uh Winters. She, cancer expert, Dr. Nasha, um, her mother was under a lot of stress w during the birth, right? Um she was smoking during her uh pregnancy, and then she ends up um on, she wasn't breastfed. She was bottle fed with soy-based uh formula. And she's like, well, that's where it all started, right? It's like, you know, and then all these things.
But the point is, is her sources started in utero, you know, and then she ended up with a cancer diagnosis. Uh, you know, SIBO is one of those crazy things that even our world of alternative is missing it, right? Meaning they're going, oh, you have SIBO, and then they give you a bunch of killers. It's oregano, it's this, it's that. And there's a time for that, as we know, right?
But the point is, is it they better be evaluating all these things that we just mentioned as causative factors, because if you don't deal with that, you're gonna be uh staying on these killers, wiping out these small intestinal bacteria, dealing with symptoms like burping, heartburn, bloating, constipation, diarrhea, who knows? Isn't what's the what's the stat? Irritable bowel disease. Um, 70 or 80 percent have SIBO.
Yeah, I mean, it depends on the stats you look at. Larger studies will show 25 to 37 percent, smaller rural studies will show 60 to 67 percent. But we know either way, it's relevant and it's relevant. I think those are the two words I'm looking for. Um but it's happening a lot.
Yeah.
And so whether or not statistically it's it's it's statistically significant above 1% as far as I'm concerned, it should be investigated. But it's statistically significant enough that we have to go that downstream.
Yeah.
Where did it come from and why?
Yeah.
And you're not, and then you're on like you said, you're on these killers over and over again. Even if you're going natural, whoop D.
Yeah.
But killing off these microbes, I describe it like popping a balloon full of confetti, right? You pop it, the confetti goes everywhere, your body has to clean it up. Back to drainage, liver, gallbladder, bile are the two that are most commonly congested with bowel disease. But they pick these things up, and if you can't get them out, you recirculate. And so you end up with called herxing or herxheimer reaction, you get even sicker.
So you're on these killers over and over, and that's if you're natural. But if you're going to antibiotics, a little known fact one dose of antibiotics can take six to 12 months to recover from for your microbiome, but it damages your gut lining and mucosal membrane, it damages mitochondrial function. Like you are messing up a lot of stuff. And then you come back five years later with a fungal issue, and you're like, I wonder why.
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Um, and that we see that all the time. People are throwing ZPACs and things like just randomly. I hear it. Like, oh yeah, I'm sick. Yeah, we I went to my doctor. Oh, why'd you go to your doctor? You just you have, you know, you have a cold. Why'd you go to your doctor? I mean, it's antibiotics for the time. I try to be nicer than I'm saying right now. I try to be more clever, you know, because I really want to help them and not chastise them.
But the fact is, is in the what and then my next question is, is well, what did they do? Because I'm like, oh my God, like why they're treating something that resolves naturally. Oh, but it's always the same. Well, but I tried everything. This one wouldn't go away. Well, it's because you do this every time. That's why you have no immunity. And they end up on a Z-PAC. And then you're gonna now next time this is gonna happen, it's gonna be the same story.
You're gonna need another ZPAC, you're gonna need something because you always do this now, because you've been doing this since your time you were a kid. Sound familiar. Yeah, anyway, terrible.
I don't know who got that saying, but doing the same thing over and over and get the same different result is the definition of insane.
Yeah, that's a that's they say Albert Einstein it wasn't. I don't know. No, I don't know. Basketball player, I'm sure.
Why did you say that? Why basketball player?
It's the first snip came to my brain. I don't know. My brain's doing anything it's doing right now.
I was like trying to put that together for a moment. What's the best okay? So people are kind of- I know what people are thinking out there right now. Why basketball player? No, I'm thinking that too. Now they're thinking, well, how do I know if I have SIBO besides the symptoms? Is there a test that you like for SIBO?
I mean, you can breath test and get expensive. You go to your doctor, sometimes, depends on who you say, it'll cost you two to four hundred bucks for a test. You can get the lactulose breath test. They do the three-tube or single tube, whatever it is, if it's covered by insurance, get it done. It can't hurt. But there's sort of this borderline where just like irritable bowel, you got a little bit of gas or blow, it's quote normal until it crosses the threshold. Now it's called irritable bowel.
You might have early onset SIBO without knowing it's quite definitionally SIBO. So early intervention, right? Let's go back to the doctor. Instead of a nail in a foot, I'm walking around, I got a shoe on, but I got no socks. My heels getting red and it's rubbing and it's it's it's it's it starts to hurt. I go to my doctor, what do I do? They're like, well, it's fine now. Come back if it blisters, then we'll take care of it.
Yeah, yeah.
It's this reactive approach. You wait for things to fall apart. Yeah. So if you're experiencing simple test, have some prebiotics, for example. Have a little bit of fruit or sugars or carbs or something. And in anywhere from one to three hours, you're bloated, you're burpy.
I agree with you. Yeah. I agree with you. I I've fooled around uh with people doing the breath test, and yeah, it's not worth it. It it's it's not worth it. And it's it's a little more complicated than that too, because some bacteria are further down and you miss them, right? There's a lot of complicating factors there. It's interesting. Um, I found this hydrogen right now is a big deal, right? And some people go, I get bloated from it. I can't take it.
Because some of these bacteria, the hydrogen producers, they end up with a bacteria that feeds from the hydrogen. Is it acromensia that feed from the hydrogen or the other way around? Honestly, couldn't tell you. Yeah, I can't tell you right now, but I don't want to state it. But one one way or the other, um, they end up with a large amount of bacteria that are feeding from hydrogen because you're in your gut makes hydrogen, right?
So I always say that people that take hydrogen water, drink hydrogen water, and go, oh my gosh, I feel so much better. I'm like, oh, you lacked hydrogen because you're supposed to make it. You don't have enough of the micro. Right, exactly. Right. Because I take hydrogen water and I'm not dissing it or not, but I I don't notice anything. But that doesn't make it bad. It's just I have plenty. But the point is, is that oftentimes uh that's what's happening is they can't do hydrogen.
When they give more hydrogen, they feed this bacteria that's feeding from hydrogen. And methane's the case too. Sometimes it's methane uh foods that produce more methane they don't do well with. But if you also want to know, go on a low FODMAP diet. Those are low fermenting foods. And if you go, I feel better, I have less bloating, it's not going to solve your problem. Okay. It's not. But you'll feel better symptom-wise, it just means you have SIBO. That's it.
So, but still look upstream to say what's causing it, right? So that's the point.
You can time it, right? I mean, if you eat something within minutes, you're like, oh, I'm bloaty, I feel terrible. Let's look at the stomach. That's where your food is in the assembly line. One to three hours, five hours later, you're like, oh, I'm feeling bloaty in the state or I'm gassy. Okay. So your bacteria are feeding, they're fermenting. It's in the small bowel. Yeah. Look at the top, it's an assembly line.
What he's saying is really important because if you get bloated right upon eating, that's a different thing. That could be low stomach acid or you know, something like that enzyme issue. That could be mucous membrane, mucus membrane, uh different problems. But if it's hours later, that then it's probably SIBO.
Well, you're further along the assembly line, and now you're seeing the active usage and fermentation or digestion of these m of these fermentables, those FODMAPs. And then you're getting the byproduct. Okay, do I do I have, quote, diagnosed SIBO? No. Do you clearly have an overgrowth of something feeding on them, producing the symptom? Yes. And this is why I come back to the concept of a diagnosis. It's landlocking and frankly, stupid. Right?
Check the boxes, give the word, give the drug rather than get to the root. If you have SIBO, okay, here's here's the killer for it. But why did I get SIBO? You have these overgrowths. Do I need a doctor to tell me I have SIBO when every time I eat it fermentable, I go.
So that's the point. Yeah. Take something called inulin, right? It's a you'll know quick. Yeah, exactly. It's a prebiotic that's in it's in a lot of foods, right? It's it's healthy foods. There's nothing wrong with inulin, but it's a heck of a prebiotic that boom, SIBO people blow right up.
You'll know real fast. Yeah.
And you might not be allergic to garlic and onions. They're just high fermentable foods. Very fermentable. So yeah.
Yes, they're antimicrobial, but again, they're being fermented first.
The fiber is what they're it's fermenting.
This is the nuancing. And that's one of the reasons I don't get probiotics. Like if you give a probiotic, for example, that's a histamine liberator or it produces histamines. You got the lactic acid from some of your lactobacillus, one of the most common probiotics. You oh, I feel worse. I wonder why. What's overgrown? Yeah. What are you contributing to? It's gas on the fire. And it's just there's a lot of nuances behind it.
And one of the things I always warn people too is let's say someone finds this probiotic in their store and they take it and they go, Oh, I feel a little bit better. Okay. They may have lacked some of that bacteria, may feel better. But what they end up doing is they stay on that bacteria for their whole life, well, for years or whatever. And then they monoculture. They end up with two high levels of that, right? So it's a slippery slope. It's a slippery slope, right?
I I I've taught for years, please rotate. Change if you're going to take bacteria, rotate them, right? Um, we found even the same with uh the people that eat the same fermented food every day, like the same kombucha, same kombucha. It's like, you know, uh, they have gut problems. Take the kombucha out. Well, no, it's helped me. Well, it did, but take it away now. It's not anymore. Go to something different, you know, but take that away.
Who's this fella? He's gone viral. He I don't know why he decided to do this. I'm sure his chiropractic and physiotherapists love them. He's been working out one trap. So his trapezius muscle up on the shoulder's neck there, he's been lifting just one side. Why? Why? I don't know. It was a dumb idea.
Basketball player.
Probably a basketball player who decided he should get scoliosis. Yeah. But he's been working it out.
It's the one shot.
He's gonna shoot that thing to the bloody mouth. Going back to basketball players today. He's got this giant trap, one giant arm. And yes, it made you stronger at first. Now it's causing an imbalance. You're gonna have scoliosis the rest of your life.
There had to be a reason for this. Was it a total experiment, or do you have a reason why was he in arm wrestling?
I think it was an experiment. I mean, he's not a big dude, right? He's probably, if I had to guess looking at him before the trap side of him, 140 pounds, he's probably 170 now because one side's all built. But like it helped in the beginning. You've overdone it, and now it's actually counterproductive. But go back to probiotics, like prescriptively, saccharmyces blardy, right? Great for controlling candida, great for inflammation, the immune system and gut lining the works.
Let's use it, see how you feel, unless you have a yeast sensitivity or lactobacillus roideri. All right, Dr. William Davis has got his SIBO yogurt. He just recently came up with a book. That one was um Yeah, gut um uh not gut check. That was that was Gundry. But sorry, Dr. Davis. Uh but anyway, great book. I have it on my shelf. But he talks about SIBO quite a lot. And this one particular microbe, like Lactobacillus roidari, is a bacteriocin.
So it actually breaks down and can help destroy some of the overgrowth. So it's a prescriptive probiotic you can use. It's amazing. I'll even have female clients are very, very common when they have gut issues and have like urinary uh UTIs or any kind of gynecological issue. Because unlike these anatomical charts you see nicely laid out, all your organs are kind of squished in there. And so your intestines are touching your reproductive organs.
And so you have inflammation in your bowels due to overgrowth, SIBA, whatever it is, a lot of those inflammatory cytokines can translocate from one tissue to the next. You have now inflamed tissue or reproductive tissue, which changes your microbiome. And now you have yeast infections, you have UTIs, you have any kind of inflammatory type condition.
Well, even simply using like a women's probiotic, which contains typically Lactobacillus ramnosis and roiteri, which are vaginally native, and using those, say, on a tampon with coconut oil, and you just insert it as a suppository like you would any tampon and leave it for a couple of days, changing out regularly, those bacteria will normalize that ecosystem, bringing it back and getting rid of your UTIs, yeast infection, et cetera.
So that's a prescriptive use of antibiotics or probiotics, rather.
Absolutely.
Rather than antibiotics to kill and disrupt the system further.
So it it's all and by the way, uh pr speaking of prescriptive use of um well, it's kind of a virus, not a bacteria, but bacteria phage, yes, which they act more like viruses, really. But um uh they utilize in Russia, they utilize like like an antibiotic. They'll give you a specific phage which goes in and targets a specific bad guy like E. coli. So um Shane Morris from Systemic developed um an E. coli phase.
If someone has E. coli, it's like you give them that man, it's like in a day they just I know the one.
It's a nissile 1779 or something, whatever it's called, the E. coli nissle. It goes against the E. coli. Yeah.
Specifically.
Or pre-4 pro. It's a phage complex. They're technically prebiotics, but it's a phage complex which goes in, and pre-4 pro, it's in a lot of different blends. Um, shout out it was one I've been using a lot for my clients recently, Dr. Tobias Deep Immune, and it's got DE111. So it's a Bacillus subtilis, it's a spore-based biotic, highly studied for inflammation, balancing, etc. Again, I'm not saying use this. This isn't a prescription.
We're just talking about useful tools, but it's got a combination of some probiotics with this DE111, and it's got pre-4 pro, which is a phage. And these two can really help balance out that ecosystem in those who are at that part of the protocol. It's amazing stuff, but we're it comes back to the fact that we're not, I'm not a wizard, man. I'm not doing anything your body's not trying to do already. I'm just filling in the deficiency.
Remove the interference, fill in the deficiency. Let it do what it's designed to do. Absolutely. What do you know about uh FMT, fecal microbial transplants?
One of my favorite conversation topics.
Yep. Poop. He loves to talk about poop.
I actually have a poop hat.
So wait let me let me bring them up to speed. FMT, a fecomicrobial transplant, is taking someone else's fecal matter, clean donor. Let's let's start there. Health. And a healthy to thoroughly test it, and either taking enterically coated capsules or using an enema or both and bringing in bacteria from someone else that we haven't even discovered yet, I would argue, right? The microbiome contains way more than we even know. And you know, I I've watched it transform people, but it's poo-pooed.
Poo-pooed. But it's poo-pooed that you're gonna get something bad. But what's your experience?
Well, you can get something bad. And this is why you need to be tested thoroughly because you can die. There have been fatalities from homemade FMTs where they'll take the stool, like they literally just take a stool sample, put it in a blender with water, put it into an enema, insert, face down ass up.
Better know who stole that person, their health history.
You know what? There was actually a really interesting documentary called Designer Shit that was Saffron Casidate, and she had ulcerative colitis. And through this process, she actually tried FMT. She did seek a doctor, I believe it was out of Toronto, and they did oversee and tested. And her husband was what was considered a super donor. He was crystal clear, perfectly healthy, super microbiome, curative, arguably, for stuff.
And she went, I think it was two years, daily, sometimes twice a day, doing fecal enemas. And there was a point where she got better, then she relapsed and it was working, it wasn't. But here's the thing there was a fella who's who was interviewed in this documentary, and he used he same thing, homemade, he used his mom's. Well, she was menopausal. Guess who started getting hot flashes?
Yeah, yeah. Exactly.
Hormones are detoxing.
That's the power of the microbiome.
It's incredible. But FMT, this fecal microbiotransplant, like you said, you take microbes. So you either take stool, which is freeze-dried and brought down, and like you said, and tear it-coated capsules. So my first question was what if it breaks down in your burp?
Yeah.
Right? That's awful. Um, so you're good. Stephen Gundry calls them crapsoles, actually. And so that's method one. The second is an enema, which is insert in the rectum, leave it be, expel when ready.
The third version, which they're doing now, and Dr. William Lee's talked about these and use them to cure cancer, even, is via colonoscopy, where they go in, you have anesthesiologists and GIs, and they go in and clean things up and pull out the stool and replace it with another microbiome you're transplanting. It can be powerful. Bold underline can. Here's the problem. If you take a healthy tree and plant it into toxic soil, what happens to the tree?
Yeah, that's right. Yeah. It dies. Yeah.
So if you're full of mold and toxins and parasitic infections, you're in an environment that makes you sick. You spend $15,000, $20,000 on these FMTs and it doesn't work. I've seen it happen. I've had people come to me, I did FMT, it didn't work. What's the environment you transplanted this ecosystem?
I've seen it happen too, right? It's like the the people who um that's why a lot of them now have evolved to really paying attention to the soil ahead of time. Um, you know, and then oftentimes they have to go in and wipe out, they have to sterilize the gut, which in itself is dangerous, right? I mean it's hard on the gut. Yeah, exactly. But then they have to go and then repopulate. So uh it takes time.
You can't just transplant and leave it. That's true.
Yep.
I had a client of mine who came in and they asked their doctor about FMT. This was two weeks ago at the time of recording here. Ask the doctor about FMT and he says, nah, that's outdated, it doesn't work. Well, in 2022 and 2023, for different reasons, it just became approved by the FDA for recurrent C. diff infections. It's not outdated. It's brand free. Yeah, exactly. Don't you gaslight me? Yeah, right.
I'll date it. You can't even just come in around. I look, I've watched, I've seen it change people's lives, right? It can be amazing. To the point, though, it has to be done correctly. It has to be done right. You have to have the right donor. So, you know, because there was some years ago, there was uh a website, thepower of the poop.com, and um the power of the poop. And it went crazy, but people were just using random family members poop, right? It's like and dangerous. Yeah, it can die.
Yeah, it's it it was not good. I mean, you could end up with uh C diff infection because their their body could handle it, your body couldn't.
Right. And because here's the thing you have to understand your ecosystem balances itself. There are good guys, right? Air quotes good guys, unquote bad guys, but they all self-regulate. And I look at it like a city. A city works. There's an economy, there's the really good guys, big high producers, short chain fatty acids, right? You got your your financial institutions that put a lot of money into the economy, and you got crackers at the gas station.
They do contribute to the economy in some way. You may not like it, but they're there.
Yeah.
But your Clostridia bacteria, right? Yes, your fungals, they all contribute to the ecosystem's balance.
Absolutely.
But if every grocery store and coffee shop saw nothing but crack, the city falls apart.
Yeah. Yeah, and I would argue, you know, what's going on in you right now is perfectly for what you need. The intelligence is that smart, right? So it may not be exactly what this person needs. Uh this is gonna be a good one. While we're on the topic of eating poop and things like that, yeah. What watch this? Have you ever drank urine?
You know what? I have considered it, but if I had done it, which I haven't yet, I wouldn't tell my wife's behind the camera. I wouldn't have told her because she'd never kiss me again. But I did talk to Jonathan Otto about Eurother.
Yeah, Jonathan Otto loves urine. He does. Oh no, he's drinking like two glasses a day, I think. It's like Troy Casey. Yeah, I think he's addicted. Yeah.
You know what though? Look at Eurolithin A. Where does it come from? Like all these, we have so many different products that actually are produced naturally in urine. There's something to it. I've not tried it. So my wife, we can still kiss, but I've not tried it, but I've seriously considered it because of all the benefits. It really is. It's it's I hate to use the word superfood. It's not like goji berries. Yeah. But the idea being there can be a lot of benefits to it.
And it's remarkable what you're it's a waste product.
Yeah, you know, look, I I I've watched people transfer. Look, for years, I would tell people women use it for a UTI, and it worked. Little Dixie cup in the morning. It worked. I'm telling you, it was like magic.
Have you ever drank urine, Daniel?
I well, that's the point I'm gonna make. So I I Jonathan Otto, we got in this conversation, right? He talked you into it, dude. Yeah. So, you know, and then it was and then he sent me this book. I think it was like, um, take your own medicine or you know, something like that sounds appropriate. If you read chapter one, you're convinced. I mean, this woman was dying. I mean, she gave up, and then she started drinking her own urine.
And in folks, there's metabolites in the urine, the things that your body needs and it knows it, and it, you know, and it's giving it back in like a homeopathic way. So there's science around it. But in many countries in the world, do this as a therapy, right? So it's not just crazy talk here. But fact is, is I said, okay, I'm gonna do it for a month. And I volunteered my wife. I volunteered my wife. How about that? So here's the true story. Here it was, right?
So my wife had done it before because she had a UTI and she did it. So she had more experience with this. Okay. So she's already. We wake up that morning and I'm like it's 6 a.m. and I'm like getting up to go to the bathroom, and she yells, Don't forget to drink your urine. I'm like, oh my God, like I do not want to start my day like that. So I like it's the last thing. It's the last thing I wanted to do. I was so mad at myself for volunteering this, and I was really mad at her.
So, anyways, I drank my urine. We did it for one month. Okay, and here I didn't notice a thing. But again, I don't know. Which is unfortunate after all that. I know, right? I committed to it, man. I committed to it. But I didn't notice anything, nor did she. But we don't have conditions. But I, you know, I don't know what I was expecting or not. But um, I just wanted to see, you know, what it would do. I have to say, you know, people say, what did it taste like? It tastes like urine.
I mean it's what you'd expect. It tastes exactly the way it smells, unfortunately. And here's the thing if you hold your nose, you don't taste anything. But I swear to God, you could go like 15 minutes holding your nose, and the moment you let it go, you taste urine. So you have to kind of do the hold your nose thing and then food. So I did this for a while, and then I swear to you, you do get used to it. And then you just end up just doing it, going, oh, screw it. I don't know, man.
Yeah, but I I've been on the fence about it for months.
Yeah, I still haven't tried it. Kind of fun anyway. I I have told people about it. I've told people just read the book. Like, because I don't want to be one to tell someone to drink their own urine. I'm not telling you to drink urine. I'm not telling them to eat poop, but I'm not telling them to drink urine. I'm just not that guy. I'm not gonna do it. However, I'd say read this, right? And uh so it's you know, really it it it helps some people out.
So it's funny you say that. I've talked to clients about the concept, and I've actually sent them the podcast with Jonathan Otto.
I'm like, let him tell you. Yeah, yeah.
Make somebody else liable for this. Yeah. There's another interesting one, chlorine dioxide.
Yeah, yeah. I tried that too. Just another one Jonathan's really hyped up on. I tried that, I noticed nothing.
Yeah. But I wonder though, because again, the therapy you take, the probiotic you take might do nothing for you, but is it relevant for your system now? Do you need it now?
That's right.
I've taken probiotics that made me feel great. Some made me feel worse, some were benign, but just like urine therapy, just like oh no, I almost like whispering, you're in therapy. Uh but just like that in chlorine dioxide, all these therapies have a place and they may or may not have a benefit for you. The question is, do you want to risk drinking your pee for 30 days to have no benefit? Yeah.
That's up to you. Yeah, right. Yeah. And it's not that you have to do it for 30 days. If you have a UTI, a couple days, man, you're done. Worked, right? So, but uh, I just wanted to give it a well, I think it was Jonathan who said, you can't just do it, because I was like, okay, I'll do it for a few days, you know. All right, a week. No, no, you know. So he convinced me for the month. So it wasn't like I came up with a month.
Troy Casey, certified health nut, he ferments his.
No, Jonathan does too. He does, so yeah. Yeah, I'm not doing that. Aged urine, they call it. Yeah. I'm not doing that. I'm just not. I draw the line. I'm like an experimenter. I love the thing. You know, I'll try some aged cheese. I'm not trying aged urine. Yeah. I'm not doing it. I'm just not going there. I'm not going there. That that to me borderlines on a whole nother disgusting thing.
Aaron Powell, I'm all for experiments. Look, Anthony Chafee talked me into carnivore, tried it, loved it. I'm very meat-based now before I wasn't.
Listen, I move in and out of carnivore periodically, but I move in and out. Like I'm not a believer that you stay in a carnivore diet. I'm not a believer you stay in ketosis. You talked about that psychiatrist. Yeah, exactly. I I'm a believer in diet variation and utilizing that.
You talked about that on my show. I had you on for a two-part special, actually.
Yeah.
Um, and we talked about dietary variation parmesas and the change in rotation, but that's just it. It's it's like exercise. You will adapt. If you do every single day, you do bench press. Um eventually you stop. It's not even stress anymore. Not even.
You gotta make sure you're adapted. Yeah.
Always. And the body was designed to thrive through stressful environments. Yeah, someone gets it.
Yeah. But you know where I'm seeing this massive violation and this principle of hormesis? Cold baths. Like people just I have been the opposing voice in this, right? Yeah. I'm not against cold baths. I get there's a benefit when used properly, but the problem is, is what's good for you is not good for me, and vice versa. And vice versa. So finally now they're saying, oh, this isn't what we think for women. Why? Because you know, women tend to not do good with cold environments, right?
It's like that news.
She was like, Told you.
Yeah, women, you know, definitely, you know, the more you have more thyroid cases, and they're definitely not going to do well with very cold. Because the whole point of why it works is you adapt. The body thinks it's gonna die, and the adaptation, you get this massive upregulation of neuropinephrine, then growth hormone, all these wonderful things, de-inflammation. If you adapt. But if you don't adapt, it's counterintuitive, it's the goes the other direction.
And so many people are doing three minutes, right? And even a minute is way too much for the majority of people, especially women.
Years back, a female client, and she was dealing with really severe gut issues, immune system was hyperreactive. Clearly, like her nervous system was jacked up. She's like, I heard that cold plunging can be really good for my nervous system. I said, It's a stressor though. Your cup is already full. Yeah. I don't care if it's exercise, stress, any stress.
Dude, when I when I was sick, I if I would go outside in the winter, if I didn't have my like hat on, everything, I would get a headache. Well that's why I'm gonna do it.
I said, go barefoot in the snow for 10 seconds, tell me what happens. She almost had a panic attack. That's right. She couldn't adapt to the cold.
I couldn't, I couldn't adapt to hot saunas. I mean, I would like moderate it. I still couldn't adapt when I was sick. And as I got better, I could adapt to more and more. But people are violating this premise. Exercise is the best example, right? It's like if you exercise too much, you don't adapt. If you don't exercise enough or do the same exercise, that was your point, all the time, it's not a stress anymore. You don't adapt, you don't get a benefit.
Everyone's hit training because I heard is really good. This is the thing, right? I know by by at this time of the episode, we're an hour in, you're listening, and like, damn, like everything is so bloody complicated. How on earth do I got to exercise this much, but not that much? I got a cold plunge, maybe a little bit, but not all the time. Just one toe, not the whole body. Look, at the end of the day, when you become intuitive, this is the advice. This is this is the this is it.
Yeah. You have to listen to your body.
And by the way, that's what people struggle to do, though, because of addictive personalities. And people that got sick, got better, they become very addictive to what helped them and not. But then they preach it for everybody else. You have to ask yourself later that day, how do I feel? And more importantly, the next day, and more importantly, how'd you sleep that night? Because if you know, and again, but you we it sounds so simple, but people justify it.
Well, I don't feel good because I ate or I I did this or I did that. It's a but if you have to notice this pattern of cold baths and how you feel, how did you sleep? That's why I do like the aura rings in different things because you can watch your your heart rate rise. Okay, you did a cold bath that day, you did a minute in you know, 50 degrees, whatever it is, and you see your heart rate rise and your heart rate variability drop. Well, that's a sign that you didn't adapt to that.
Go less, see how you do.
Something as simple as heart rate can track all your data. Absolutely. Your nervous system, if you come in, your waking resting heart rate is like a hundred and your exercise heart rate is one thirty, and your resting is a hundred, you go to bed and it's 90, you got a problem, dude. That's right. Like if you're not coming down, my resting heart rate when I wake up is like 43. All right, cool brag. But my nervous system is well adapted.
I can exercise intensely and get it up to 140 plus, but it bounces, comes back down very quickly. Because you're adapting. But I don't care if you're stuck in a car, relationship stress, financial stress, exercise, diet, fasting, these are all stressors. Absolutely cumulative. And you can overstay.
Detox, fasting, all stressors all apply to the premise of hormesis. And yet people violate it constantly. And everyone wants it to be the same thing. They want the detox in a box, they want the intermittent fasting schedule that works for it. Give me here's how it's three minutes in a cold bath. What temperature do I do? What how long do I stay in? That's what people want. But it violates the most basic principle of what how we get stronger faster.
It's not. I got clients coming in, and it happens all the time. There, there's in the bowel space, there's there's a kind of a subgroup of people. There's the first, which is like F you, you're in I get I get threats, I get hate, believe it or not, to my inbox. Like I've had people DM me f you, you're everything that's wrong with this world. You should be ashamed. Because I'm going against the narrative. Okay, well, you know what? That's probably why you're sick because you're miserable.
Number one. But number two, the second sect of people are kind of on the fence. Like, I've heard about this, I'm curious. Teach me more. Because I recognize what I'm doing is not working. Is there another way or something I can add? The third group is already over the fence. Like, my doctor's not helping. This is covering symptoms. Let's find a roof. And these types of people, these are the ones we can get in and actually work with and help to understand.
You can tune into your body, you can listen. But for those of you who are already on this fence, there's another group now where you're doing everything all at once and you're not getting better. Yeah. And you wonder why. You're stressing your system beyond its ability to recover.
Four groups, right? What were the four groups again?
So you got your first group, which is the FU group.
Yeah. Yeah. No matter what you say, right? Yeah. Doesn't matter.
You got the studies, you got the testimonials, like, ah, it's impossible. Because they know better. They know better. It's a no better group. And how could I know? I'm not a doctor. I get that all the time.
But even if you are, trust me, I get the haters too. So it's not. Oh, of course you do. Yeah, yeah. Then it's you're not the right doctor. Not that kind of doctor. Yeah. You're not a gastroenterologist, so what are you now? Okay.
I get if your doctor can't figure it out my doctor can't figure out how can you, right? So that's that's group one.
But then if you are a gastroenterologist and say something that they don't believe in, then you're just a quack. So okay. So either way.
Group one sucks. Group two, they're curious, effectively. Yeah, right. Kind of on the fence. Group three is already sold. But the subgroup of that three, we'll call them the extreme side, is doing everything all at once. Over cleansing, over detoxing, over fasting, over cold, over all of it.
Hormesis violators. Hormesis, that's a good one.
Yeah. Get you guys, get you a ticket for that. That's yeah. You're violating your hermesis. But that's really the four subgroups that we see. And so there's really a nice median in there. And in a society which l is so extreme in everything, I don't care if it's politics or diets, it's carnival or death, it's vegan or death. It's like it's left, it's right, it's this, it's that. Like, can we just have some freaking middle ground? And that's how we're getting better.
This this is a whole esoteric way.
I would argue let's have conversation without getting angry. Isn't this wrong with the politics today, right? Meaning people, I mean, you know, people are we're right now, I don't know when this is going to be aired, but you know, soon after Charlie Kirk's death, right? This guy, whether you loved what he said or not, irrelevant. This man was about having conversations about where we disagreed to find a further truth.
If you want to shut that down, I don't care what side you're on, you're wrong, man. You're wrong. You're wrong. Yes. Yeah.
And there's a whole thing now that we're canceling, was it Jimmy Kimmel? They're canceling him. And on one end, you got the left who's like, this is horrible free speech. And but then when that happened to Donald Trump, they're like, this is great, because he shouldn't be deserved to talk. Look. Yeah, but that was a business. You know why they shut him down?
Because he was making no money. They were looking to shut him down. That was a business guy up there going, you know, we should have he wanted to fire him, whatever, because he was $80 million in the hole every year. So they're doing it anyway. Yeah. So anyway, yeah, that was that was a complete business choice, by the way. Everyone's over here like, oh, it's like that was business focus.
So it's just timing.
And they have a right to fire him because honestly, it's like, you know.
It's your company. At the end of the day, like Charlie said, the moment we stop talking, bad things happen. And bad things are happening all over. Yeah. And and I know this is about our health, but if you realize this, the concept goes to everything, whether it's a diet, whether it's politics, whether it's policy. Absolutely. We're crazy.
I have had conversations with people about health topics, and I've come out the other side going, I'll drink urine for 30 days. That was a conversation. That was over. No, no, anyways. No, I come out the other side going, you know, I you know what? I I I might have had it wrong. Let me try this, right? And I had it wrong. So, but where well, how did I get there? Conversation.
Conversation of, you know, in in probably a conversation that was like I was standing hard on my ground only to be wrong, right? So it's good to have conversations.
So I approach it this way: seek first to understand. And I think in the context, and again, I'll speak to bowel diseases, and I would argue to everything. You have somebody on the fringe, somebody who's doing something different. It's going against the grain or quote, establish science. Like, if we sat down, I've got 450 plus cases now of Crohn's, colitis reversed, even more bowel issues, arthritis, because it's all part and parcel, reversed. People are like, that's impossible.
Rather than arguing with me about why it shouldn't work, let's sit down and talk to figure out why it does or why it could.
Yeah, exactly.
And like this is the reason healthcare and medicine is so far people show me the double blind randomized control trial.
Oh, God. Do you realize the the more I the more I've read studies, the more I understand how to read studies and I do, the more I go, ah. It's like because you can make a study say what you want. There's so few really good studies. And you know, it's it's so horrible. It's just and science has become the new religion, for goodness.
It is, and it's a financial dumping ground. There was a study recently I found there was a gastroenterologist talking about it saying meat is bad for your biome. Here's the study, here's the data. They test thousands of people. Well, guess what? All those people already had underlying issues. There was irritable bowel, there was Crohn's, there was colitis, some were more control group. They said generally the data shows you have a worsened biome when you're eating meat.
They didn't test them before and after. They said they said by self-assessment, how much meat are you eating? Yeah. And then let's check your biome.
Yeah. So you're already screwed up. But see, it's not what you think. And if you stop the study before the body makes certain adjustments hermetically, you could get a bad result versus a good result. Right. So again, Benazati. So Benizati, we did a test. I know, I saw that one. Yeah, we did it together, exactly. It's like because my bet was you're going to go into carnivore and you're going to improve your diversity. His diversity on a microbiome test was bad.
Okay. So, and of course, the advice was eat all this fiber and all these prebiotics and all this fibrous food and plant-based diet. That was the advice, right? From the company who sent them the test. The company who sent him the test, right? And so guess what he did? We did the opposite. We put him in a strict carnivore diet and re-measured 90 days. Remeasured, his microbiome was transformed. He didn't eat one stitch of a plant. He took away all fiber. He only ate meat.
Okay, so because what is science, really?
It's just an illusion.
Exactly. Yeah. So I say all that. But how do people find you, man? Because there's so many gut problems out there. Trevor Burrus, Jr.
The easiest way you can reach me. I've got so many bloody websites now. Anyway, um, you can find everything at gutsolution.ca. That's all singular, gutsolution.ca for Canada. I'm on Insta socials as Joshdeck.health. Awesome. But you can find that the podcast. We've had you on Daniel twice actually on reversible, but all that stuff. Socials, podcasts, all that. He's out there. Yeah. Gutsolution.ca.
He's out there and he does a great job, man. Pain to purpose right there. Remember, your authority comes from the victory God gave you.
For such a time as now.
Boom. Stay right there.