3. Pirate Attack! 🏴‍☠️ - Slippery Slope

Slippery Slope, a true crime podcast about Mount Io and the Missing water Slide with Dave O'Neill and Brad Oaks.

Hello, it's Dave O'Neill and Bradford os and.

It's episode three of our podcast, Slippery Slope. Now let's get you one up to speak. They're just tuned in Mount Eyes. Are wanted the water slide. They got it made in Turkey and at the end of the last episode, what happened Bradford.

Well, the slide didn't turn up.

No.

No, it's a pretty big thing to go missing, isn't it.

Yes, So it's on a ship. It's on its way through the Sewer's Canal and there's some kind of pirate incident.

Just for geography, Yes, it's Sewers Canal. Then it becomes the Red Sea and then I believe it goes into the Gulf of Oman, Yeah, and then into the Indian Ocean and on.

The other side it's the Mediterranean.

And Mediterranean exactly.

If you're coming from Turkey, you're coming through the Red Sea into the Sewers Canal into the Mediterraneans.

Correct, it's a shortcut. It's a shortcut so that you have to go all the way around down past All Africa. I think it's quite a devilish as well to.

Go past and South Africa's on the bottom, and then you've got to go up and it's another week or two weeks or something. Yeah, well, let's get a bit more information from Mark Miller, the project manager.

Turkey's I suppose that's where the one of the main manufacturers for the water slides are and cost of fishient time efficient's questionable, but definitely cost efficient. So originally it was a sixteen week procurement lead time which turned into I think just over twenty four weeks up.

What were the delays? There were rumors of pirate.

The pirate rumors are pretty much true. There was. There was a bit of an issue the Sew's Canal where one of the continents got herld up and pirates seemed to take a bit of a lake into the slides and off off that went.

Where did it go? Maybe?

Yeah, the pirates love slides. Maybe they've got their own little water parks somewhere. Pirates of the Caribbean, you know, they love it.

So what did it go missing? Or did you find it?

Or they went missing?

So they then to re manufacture and we send out more doc in hence the heavy delay to the project.

The original water slide actually went.

Missing parts, parts of it in parts.

Was this in the Sewer's Canal after the Sewers Canals?

I believe it's in the siouxse Canal.

Well, that's interesting he believes it happened in the Sewers Canal. But what is the history of the Sewers Canal.

I think the French started to build it.

I remember seeing photos of it being dug out by shovels.

In seventeen ninety eight, Napoleon tried to find the remnants of an ancient waterway. Oh, which just started this conversation about this was canw A bit like the trains of an Olburne Airport gets talked about a lot.

Yeah, people get their photo taken, but nothing much happens.

I remember when it was built because of the Crown. I saw it in the Crown. NASA controlled it.

It opened in under French control in eighteen sixty nine, right, I think people kind of squabble over it for years, but then NASA, the Egyptian president.

Well, I can read this here.

In nineteen fifty one, Egypt repudiated the nineteen thirty six Treaty with Great Britain. Britain had to remove their troops nineteen fifty six. NASA responded by nationalizing the canal on twenty sixth July nineteen fifty six.

There was a bit of a hooha about that because that's in the crown, so NASA president of Egypt. Yeah, he was one that controlled it.

In the end, it became an enormous source of revenue for them because how much does.

It go through? I think it's six hundred grand, isn't it for a ship? Six hundred grand?

Yeah, that's there's your city link, as you're told.

But importantly it's a US dollars as a great source of US dollars. Everybody has to pay and use of dollars, which leads me to think that it's gold mine and for Egypt.

Yeah, and it's not that white. I know, it's not that wide, so it would be easy to attack in it, but it'd be hard to get out anyway. We need a bit more information about the actual attack, like what happened was eating stolen. Let's go to Daniel from Simplex, who was involved in making the slide and delivering the slide.

It goes into production and yeah, it all comes in forty four containers with the steel work and all the bolts like a package sort of kit, and with drawings. It don't make sense. And then you try and put it all together over here.

Now, what happened with the Mountay as a water slide.

It's a little bit hard to get an extension of time when you approach the council and say pirates were.

Involved, right, so pirates were involved.

Pirates were involved. I think the pirates actually boarded the ship. I don't know if it was Jack Sparrow or not. That's unconfirmed.

Okay, so pirates were definitely involved. I don't really understand how they got actually got the stuff, because when we think of containers on a ship, they're closed off, you know, the big classic metal containers that we see on trucks, on trains, et cetera. But apparently these were something called I think open top containers. Well, let Daniel explain.

The steel work comes with no lids. They're open top containers. All the steel works they loaded in from the top. When it turns up the site, you unloaded with a crane or a front and rip it out from the top at all fiberglasses in what we call high kids, which are a little bit higher than normal containers, and they pack all the fiberglass pieces in sections like that. It's actually quite a skillful process to pack a forty

Right So, now understand that the containers are open, you can actually get in there and have a look and get stuff out. Interesting that both the guys have mentioned Jack Sparrow a.

Bit of sadness for me.

There's so many other pirates, I know, you know, why would Jack Sparrow be.

Captain Kid. You've got black Beard captain more than you've got Captain Pugwash captain. I don't know if his I don't think he was. I think it was. I think it was Jack Sparrow.

He's everyone mentions Jack Sparrow, Captain Hook, Captain Hook from just you know, and don't reckon that story was just made up as they went along.

How he lose his hand on crocodile? Come on, mate, Yes, he's got the ball.

Well, because we all think of pirates are something cute, a parrot on their shoulder, a wooden leg, But of course these are like Somali pirates.

I have a pirate joke. Well, everybody knows the joke. What's the pirate's favorite leader? Well, no, in fact, it's the seas all.

Right, But have you seen that Tom Hanks movie Mister Roberts where he's it's it's just it's like he's on a big cargo ship and Somali pirates board and capture the vessel. So it's those kinds of pirates. Yeah, I believe it's not the cute pirates.

Not a few pirates, and it's not the people who back in the nineties were.

Just copying videos. They were pirates.

Oh yes, video pirates.

The number one conserned the FBI at one stage.

Yeah, it's a crime.

Well, you know, Fast and Furious was about copying DVDs. The first movie was about DVD theft.

I had no idea. Yeah, I've never seen any of them.

Are there any other mentions of Jack Sparrow from anyone on this podcast. Let's go to Cogo, the deputy mayor of Mount iSER.

Yeah, someone probably in Somalia has got half a slide, so I don't know what they're doing with it. And when they said pirates, I'm like, oh, Jack Sparrow, So Jack Sparrot's the only pirate I'd like to meet.

There we go another. Jack Sparrow mentioned you've got to imagine though, so the pirates of the board of the ship, they've got part of the water slide or something's happening. But what's happening in Mount iSER. I mean, that's a long way from the Sewers Canal, isn't it.

It's a long way from any water. It really does.

Yeah, exactly. Here's Danny l the former mayor.

So when they said to me that the ship had been taken over by pirates, and to me, it was like the dogs ate my homework. You know, they haven't ordered it. They're delaying and on purpose, and they're just trying to get it after the elections. So it's not something I could point and say to see, look what I've.

Done, you know, Yeah, Daniel the former me, well, I suppose with local politics, people could be thinking this is just something's made up, pirates in the Sewers Canal.

You're like, what it sounds like something Buiolchie Peterson would have said in the seventies or eighties.

You know, well, you know.

Pirates, Jack, get out, bloody Jacks Barro or Bob Catter would say, So let's cross the Shae Donovan, she actually runs the aquatic center of the pull Man is where the water slide is meant to be, So she's waiting for the water slide.

This is what she had to say when she heard about the pirates.

So I wasn't too sure what was going on because Mark, the project manager, is a bit of a joker and if there's something delayed in a contractor might be a day late delivering something, he'll make a bit of a joke about it. So I didn't really believe what he was telling us. I thought it was just some gimmick

Shay, who runs a pool in man eyes hats off to her. She didn't mention Jack Sparrow When talking about pirates, she's been the first not to mention Jack Sparrow. So okay, there seems to be disagreement about where the attack actually happened. Let's got to Mark Miller, the project manager.

I believe it's in the Sioux's Canal, and then the rest of it got diversed. So then the diversion that didn't have to go run.

The coast of Africa.

Then, but the pirates attacked in the Siouxs Canal.

Then of course that takes a lot longer to go around the bottom of Africa.

Of course, of course, And he's the twenty four week delay.

No, I wasn't in the canal. Yeah, it was in the ocean bits around there. Have you ever seen that Tom Hanks movie where he's at the end he's going like oh yeah, Like yeah, I'm pretty sure it was those type of guys.

No, I don't really know.

We've had a bit of pirate activity, but none that have ever boarded the actual ship. Last year especially, there was constant pirate doos and like I said, that's hard to get it over along with the client pirates again, sorry you water slide I can installed in time.

But right, So this seems to be a bit of disagreement. That's Daniel there from Swimplex about where the attack actually happened. What's your thinking, Bradford. You've become an expert on sewers Canal via the internet piracy.

Well also I tracked down expert.

This is what we need. We need a piracy expert.

Yeah, but you know, look, I was dubious in the first place that anything would take part in a sewers canal, just because of how much the Egyptian government would guard it.

And it's so narrow.

Least, yeah, yeah, narrow.

Yeah, And as we'll discover, there's also a definition of piracy that's going to come into play.

Really, and there's a HOOTI rebels.

Well there's HOOTI rebels.

And then so when people say Somali pirates, I looked on the map and Somalia was like about well two and a half thousand kilometers from the sewers Canal.

So that's a long way to go to work.

I mean, if you were a pirate, I mean it's like sort of being in the nightclub or being outside there's people lining up for the sewers Canal. Right, yeah, now you could it's like lining up for a nightclub. You wouldn't go into the nightclub, you'd I don't want to talk about attacking people, but if you were going to do something, surely you do it outside. Sure you do it in the bit before the Sewers Canal.

Well, it depends if they're going the way they were coming. Don't coming from Turkey. So they're coming down.

Yeah, right, so they're coming down.

I think you turn left at Israel or something like that, and then you come to the Sewers Canal and get in the canal.

Then you go into I think the Red Sea, and then like I said, I think it's the Gulf.

I'm learning that I don't know anything about geography.

And then well, because what you've got coming from Turkey's basically that's the.

End of Europe.

Yes, to me, it was dubius. Although we should cut to the expert. Yes, find out a bit about piracy.

Tamson Page is We'll let her introduce herself, but she's an academic with many qualifications in this area.

Hello.

So I'm doctor Tamson Philip A. Page. I am an associate professor at Deacon Law School. I did my m phil at A and U studying the application of piracy law in Somali counter piracy operations. And I did that while also working with the UN Office on Drugs and Crime. That about Somali piracy would have been in twenty twelve and twenty thirteen. I've also got a PhD in International security law, and I teach and research in international law and legal ethics.

That's impressive. That's impressive. Is there piracy in the sewers Canal?

The question that becomes if it's piracy or something else, because legally it actually wouldn't be piracy at a pure legal level, which is really quite interesting in that regard because of some quirks of jurisdiction.

Right, well, because of the sewers Canal.

Yeah, because the sewers Canal forms essentially they're straight for international navigation. Piracy by legal definition can only occur in international waters or the high seeds legally refer.

To it, right, And so I mean, but are there Somali pirates active in the sewers Canal?

Not? In the sewers They're active mostly through the Red Sea and the Horn of Africa, so down kind of at the point where you have the Red Sea going out into the Indian Ocean through the Gulf of Aden and all of those areas kind of with Somalia and Yemen on either side of that exit from the Red Sea.

So if they're avowed pirates of declared pirates, but then they actually committed crime in what is in international waters, what do you designate them as.

Su as canal? My understanding is Egyptian territory. So essentially they are just engaging in theft or larceny or whatever under Egyptian law. Because they're committing it in Egyptian internal waters.

It seemed unlikely because the Egyptians seem to police it so well, there wouldn't be a lot of crime going on there, you know of that overt nature.

Well, I wouldn't expect so, but it is a major waterway, as we all found out when the ever given ran aground at all. Global trade stopped for a few weeks while they dug it out. The designation of pirate versus just theft is literally one of did it happen more than twelve nautical miles from the coast of a state? If yes, it's piracy, If no, it's just armed robbery. At c right National Maritime Organation, when keeping statistics on

So it's a bit of a champagne versus sparkling wine thing, isn't it?

It is? But the reasons for it are less because the French are snotting and weird, and more because countries like Philippines and Indonesia and things like that have vast amounts of what we call archipelagic waters where they have exclusive jurisdiction and they don't want Chinese and US militaries just sending their navy patrolling through all of these waters under the guise of counter piracy operations.

Wow.

And also in the Suits Canal recently there's been they're not called pirates, are called rebels, the Hooti rebels, which they seem to have a different aim than say, the normal standard Somali pirate. Is that correct?

I mean, I'm reluctant to call them rebels because actually they control seventy five percent of the populations in Yemen, so calling them rebels seems to be a denial of the fact that they are just the government of Yemen. Functionally. These days, they're engaging in attacks on merchant shipping, they claim out of solidarity and part of actions against Israel's activities in Gaza. However, they're attacking merchant shipping, which is just either a war crime or a crime against humanity.

And they're not stealing stuff, are they? They just seemed to get on boats and hold hostages and stuff.

They're not really stealing stuff. That doesn't mean Somali pirates didn't really steal much either. Somali pirates were generally taking ships hostage and holding them for ransom and then releasing them with all the cargo and crew after ransoms had been paid. But the Huthi are often doing a lot of attacks with drones and things like that and sinking motion shipping as well as hostage taking, etc. Their goal is not economic, whereas Somali pirates goal was purely economic.

So with this case that we're looking into, people are in disagree about where the actual attack happened, but they do believe that the so called pirates boarded the ship and stole stuff. But I'm pretty sure now that we talked to you and other accounts that it was in the Red Sea. So they all seem to think it was Somali pirates. Why would they take bits of a water slide? They wouldn't know what that was, surely, I.

Don't know whether they know it was. I mean that said, they'd probably be able to tell what a water slide is in Somalia just as well as anywhere else. However, it all comes down to economics. Like pirates are driven by what can we sell or in the case of hostage shaking, how can we make a profit to make ends meet in an area that has been destroyed by

So they do have that range then to travel all the way up into the Red Sea.

They have been attacked from Somali pirates up to four hundred nautical miles off into the Indian Ocean off the coast of Somalia. They have significant range, usually because they usually use ocean going fishing vessels as motherships to then

Well, and I read somewhere that they're mainly ex fishermen. Is that right because they're fishing was ruined or is that just like an over myth.

Originally there was some veracity to that because with the entire lack of government in Somalia, what you had is an inability to enforce fishing rights licensing, so a lot of foreign fishing fleets were coming in and effectively poaching Somali in the Somali Exclusive Economic Zone of what would

Right, excellent in terms of heists, if you like, I would consider that the slides are fairly exotic thing to steal as opposed to weapons and things for resale. Have you heard of any other kind of exotic heists in that region?

There was one, I can't remember the exact incident. A cargo vessel that was actually transporting a whole bunch of Russian military equipment that was being sold by Russia elsewhere got hijacked and held hostage for ransom by Somali pirates, and when the ransom finally got negotiated and paid, all of the armaments and military equipment was still on board the ship. They didn't take it because it would have been bad for business. So if they're taking a water slide.

A market for the water slide. That's fascinating.

There's no chance of finding these people, but what would happen to them if it was piracy.

When you have people caught for piracy, what you first then need to find is is there a nation state that's willing to prosecute them for piracy? Because under the Law of the Sea Convention, everyone has jurisdiction over piracy, so anyone can engage in prosecution, which does lead us to the situation where we have some pretty wild situations with piracy prosecutions. A lot of my work was on

That's so interesting, isn't it. Tams and Page, who's like an expert in this area.

And from taking universe, but based on camera.

Incredible and community building. That says to me, water slide? So was it piracy or just common theft?

Brad? I think it's got to be twelve miles out.

You know, you can be kind of sailing in and out of international waters and all of a sudden it's just last weeking.

Now it's piracy, last wening piracy.

Do they have a compass to work that out. We don't want to be pirates, would rather be thieves. And I do question, Like she said that the Somali pirates would know what a water slide is. I don't know if they would, you reckon, they'd look at it and go, we could use this for irrigation or something.

Well, look, I don't know. You can you can buy a lamp at Ikea and look at it in the box and you think, no way is that lamp? Yes, no way in the world is that lamp. You wouldn't look at it, you just I reckon. You think there's weapons.

Well, so you look at the fiberglass bits and the metal and go, what what is this now?

Well you could you know, even if you could picture it in your mind, you go, you could launch like a big rock down here.

Turning into a rock launcher. Not a rocket launcher, No rock launcher. Well that's the end of the episode. And so basically we're leaving you with stuff's being stolen. What's going to happen is Mound and Eyes are going to get their water slide. You'll find out next episode.

Than you are right, the goalpost just kept getting further and further away.

Two big trucks arrived with these containers on the back.

When I got in there, it's pitch black. You can't see anything.

Slippery Slope a true crime podcast about Mount iSER and the missing water Slide with Dave O'Neill and Bradoaks.

Slippery Slope is written and hosted by Dave O'Neill and Bradoaks. Original music created by Itinerant Productions. Cheer their website. There's some great stuff there ww dot Itinerantproduction dot com. Editing by Courtney Carthy, published by Neeli Media. Thank you for all the guests involved in the making of Slippery Slope, particularly the people of Mount Isa. For information, to check out the episode notes or at nearly dot com. Dot you, and thanks again to the people of Mountier.