You are listening to the Dan Patrick Show on Fox Sports Radio.
Still have openings with the Cowboys, Jags, Jets, Raiders, and the Saints, and you start to wonder, what are these teams waiting for?
Who are they waiting for?
If you're waiting for somebody who is still in the playoffs, then I can understand that. But Cliff Kingsbury, he says that he's comfortable being the offensive coordinator for the Commanders until you get a head coaching offer, and then maybe you're not as comfortable there. It's nice to have Jayden Daniels there, but Cliff Kingsbury would probably like another shot. I think he's only forty five, but like another shot
at being a head coach. It didn't go well the first time around with Arizona, but he has since been a kind of a reclamation project here. You know, the same with Kellen Moore. Kellen Moore got kicked to the curb by the Cowboys, went to the Chargers, and now he's with the Eagles, and I guess he might be the leading candidate for the Cowboy right now. But how old is Cliff Kingsbury thirty six? No, Kellen Moore thirty six? Easter. Yeah, Cliff Kingsbury I think is in his forties there. But
you have openings here, Cowboys, Jags, Jets, Raiders, Saints. Aaron Glenn reportedly will get an offer from the Jets. Mike McCarthy. Maybe he has his choice here. Maybe that that's holding up the Jags and the Saints. The Raiders' situation. The Raiders, by all accounts, wanted Ben Johnson, thought they were going to get Ben Johnson. Tom Brady spent an hour talking to Ben Johnson last week. And you know, when they fired Antonio Peers, I wasn't surprised. I said, all along,
Tom Brady's going to come in. He's going to be running the show. They fired him, and then they waited a couple of days and they fired their GM, Tom Telesco. And Telesco was only there for a year, And I thought, okay, you fired your coach. But then when you fire your GM, it feels like the coach you want to bring in wants to bring in his own GM, or at least have a collaborative effort here of let's decide this together
of who is going to be the general manager? Did Tom Brady think that Ben Johnson was going to come to the Raiders, but he wanted to pick his own GM, or at least help with that selection process. And if you're going to have somebody who's lined up just the way Kyle Shanahan and John lynchar with San Francisco, with your coach and your GM, that makes a lot of sense. Well, Bear's got him, and I think that's the big surprise.
I think Tom Brady thought, Hey, I'm going to spend time with him, and if he wants to bring in his own GM, then I'm going to let Tom to LESCo go after one year. I don't know if they would have made these decisions if they didn't think they were if they thought they weren't going to get Ben Johnson, would they have kept Antonio Pierce and Tom to LESCo
at least another year. Maybe they got a bigger picture here, Maybe there's somebody else that they're waiting for, But it felt like they thought they were getting Ben Johnson, and Ben Johnson said no to Tom Brady. He'll be introduced as the Bears head coach today. Everything's great, right now, everything's great. They got their coach, offensive minded guy. You took him away from the Lions, Caleb Williams. Yes, he's gonna be Jaden Daniels, He's gonna be c J. Stra, He's gonna be somebody.
You're ready to go.
Oh, if only the season started tomorrow, we'd be ready to go. Paulie's Bears. They've done it all. They've won the off season. Again, congratulation. Nobody wins the off season like the Bears do. They won the off season. There's no trophies that they hand out for winning the off season, but if they did, the Bears trophy case would be packed.
Are we handing that trophy out today?
We can. If you want off.
Season award winner for a week, you.
Know what, let me wait a week or so. Let me see what the Cowboys do.
If the Cowboy get Dion, then they're probably going to win the off season.
I'm still amazed though that.
You know, Jerry Jones falls in love, and he fell in love with Jason Garrett.
Jason Witten.
I think he's in love with Dion and he's going to have to bring somebody in to be able to coach his team. Jason Witten is not ready to do this. I think he's been a high school coach and of course he was a great player. Uh do you bring back Kellen Moore who you had? Do you have any chance at getting Don? That seems to have simmered down a little bit doesn't mean it won't happen because with Jerry, he might say, oh, damn it, all right, I'm gonna bring in Dion, and then you bring in Deon Sanders.
Then everybody's going to go, wow, that's a genius move. But in the meantime, like, unless it's Don, I think we're gonna go hmm okay, right now. We did that with dan Quinn with Washington, but Washington doesn't have the worldwide a pee all of the Cowboys. When the Cowboys make a decision and everybody takes note, Washington was like.
Oh who they Okay.
Dan Quinn, Oh good luck? Team won four games. Now all of a sudden, we're looking at dan Quinn like he's lombardy. Like man, the Cowboys they missed on him. Okay, probably a few other teams decided that they didn't want dan Quinn to come in and be their head coach. But he's done a wonderful job there. Now, you know, we always look at what's the result, the end result. We go, How could you pass on him? He was right there? Well, they did and other teams did as well.
That dan Quinn probably thrilled that he's in Washington and that they're in the NFC title game. This line started out at four and a half. Now it's up to six, which is that's a pretty big jump for me when I'm looking at all, right, four and a half maybe five, now up to six. The Eagles are favored, and I think with Buffalo that stayed about the same. That the Bills are one and a half point underdogs there, Yeah, PAULI, A two.
Point jump in a line midweek is surprising, uncommon. Does somebody know something about Jalen hurts health status?
Well, no, because that would be assuming that he's healthy, because if he was hurt, it wouldn't be it wouldn't jump like that. Right, So four and a half to six means Jalen Hurts is probably going to play. But I don't know health wise, and they don't have to reveal that. But I'm guessing that Jalen Hurts will play. Their offense isn't great. It's weird. They get these splash plays. No Sae Kwon Barkley, you know, they kind of bottled
him up. He did have three unbelievable runs. Jalen Hurts they kind of bottled him up, and they had one big play. And granted, that's all you need sometimes, but I think when we look at offense, they didn't dominate the Rams, and I think the impression is that they did, but they held on for dear life. And as I said yesterday, I thought the Rams were going to win that game. I thought that they in that final final drive, they were going to win and kick the extra point.
They were going to beat Philadelphia and they would be hosting the Commanders this weekend. That's why when you look at nan, I do think the Eagles are still the best team in football, but I haven't seen them kind of put everything together. They have these players who make the Jalen Carter makes a big player, two, Saquan a big player too, Jalen hurds one or two big plays, and maybe that's all you need to win a Super Bowl. It's sort of like what the the A Chiefs are doing.
Patrick Mahomes doesn't do anything that is consistently magical, but he always has one or two of those plays. Jason Kelcey one or two of those plays, Chris Jones, one or two of those plays. Maybe that's the recipe. And I was thinking about this with Patrick Mahomes. You want to talk about a selfless superstar, because with Mahomes, it was all about he was going to throw the ball they were going to get. You know, he's throwing forty
touchdown passes. That's high powered, exclusive offense. You don't hear him talking about you know, it'd be nice if we got some receivers here for me or you know, you're getting possession guys. I'm want to throw some touchdowns here. His numbers are down. He's selfless, and that's remarkable that you get to that point, that point in your career and it's not about his numbers, because his numbers aren't great,
but it's about we won. How did we win? And they are on a tight rope every single week, it feels like, but it's about you know, Kelsey is not nudging his coach on the sideline about getting me touches. Patrick Mahomes is selfless and Brady was selfless too, And I think you have to be because if you're all about, hey, what about my numbers? And these guys have gotten to a point where it's about winning. Yeah, what if.
Behind the scenes, Patrick Mahomes is like, none of the receivers matter because I'm important. Well, you guys don't matter. I'm the one that makes this happen. So you could put out herd of cattle out there and I'm gonna complete passes. But he's actually that much of a diva.
But oh I don't.
I'm the only one here that matters. The rest of you are irrelevant.
But he's not putting up great numbers.
So yes, he might say, hey, I don't care who you put look at Brady interchangeable parts, and Brady probably said, it doesn't matter who you're putting out there, I'll make this work. But I think Mahomes and Brady are and we're selfless, and I think that helped them because how many times did you see Bill Belichick go, We're just going to run the football, And this is Brady going, all right, hey, we're going to run for two hundred yards against the Colts. Okay, And I think the same
thing with Mahomes. I think you got to get to a point where you go, I want to win.
That's all.
That's that's all. That matters here is that I win yes time.
If you know you're going to or you feel very comfortable that you're going to trade stats for rings. It's very easy to do that when you're on a great team and you're collected rings. That could change if all of a sudden you're a team that's not getting to the super Bowl winning rings. As far as hey, wait a second, I don't have the right tools around me to get.
The Well justin Herbert and I had lower stats this year they made the playoffs. But I think you have to get to that point where, hey, these numbers are great. They're regular season numbers, the numbers that matter a postseason. This first hour brought to you by Hottest Rookie's Biggest Superstars, the all time great. It's the only place to collect them all. Panini Trading Cards, Official trading cards for the Dan Patrick Show. For instant classics, autograph cards, memorabilia cards,
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See what's poll question today?
Well we haven't really hit on this much yet, but Hall of Fame voting should be public or private.
We're going to talk about this coming up in a little bit here. I've said that when I voted, I wanted it to be public. I was proud to vote. And if you're going to take on that honor, and it is an honor, then you should explain why you voted for or didn't vote for somebody. It's just you're doing your homework, or maybe you're not doing your homework.
But I.
Have no problem, and they fought for this. This was a couple of years ago. I think twenty sixteen. The Baseball Writers supported a measure to make every Hall of Fame ballot public, but the Board of Directors shut that down. I like it when I hear a columnists say, or a writer or broadcasters say, this is why I voted for this guy, or I didn't vote for this guy. I mean, not everybody's a Hall of Famer. You might not think Billy Wagner is a Hall of Famer.
I do.
I did CC Sabathia. You know he's a dinosaur. Guys are going to log those innings and have three thousand strikeout. It's over two hundred and fifty wins. It's just not going to happen anymore each euro no brainer. But then apparently was it a brainer? Because somebody decided not to vote for each Euro.
Yes, ton is.
Coming forward make you a stand up guy or a woman depending on who we're talking about, or is it a look at me, look at me thing?
People could take that one of two ways.
What do you think it is?
I think it might.
Be more looking for attention, just like when a columnist has some kind of crazy take that's never going to happen or not true, just to stand out when everyone's saying how much they love one thing, you got to be the one that hates on the coach hire or whatever for attention.
So I think for me it might be more attention than you know. I want to. I feel a need to explain myself to everyone that might be upset with.
Well, if you want attention, then why is it surprised? Okay, so if he wants attention or she wants attention, then they should come come forward. Tell us why you didn't vote for each aro. You know, you get caught up in the baseball pierce. Now the voting doesn't come out for the Pro Football Hall of Fame. I don't know how many votes somebody gets or how many votes somebody doesn't get. We you know, so we can single out baseball, but baseball is about percentages. We get to see the percentages.
So we follow along with this. You know, it's baseball stock market. I'm seeing guys who rise and guys who fall, and guys from nowhere all of a sudden, you know, get into the conversation, or guys who get to a certain level and that's all they're going to get, you know, like a Rod or Manny Ramirez or Bonds or Clemens. But I like following along with that because I like to understand these trends, like why is somebody all Billy Wagner is a Hall of Famer in his last year
of eligibility. Why was he a Hall of Famer? That's what I'm always curious about. He didn't play anymore baseball. Last I looked, he didn't play anymore baseball. PAULI check, did Billy Wagner play any more baseball?
I got nothing?
Okay, But you.
Get to this point and it's, you know, the writers of the gatekeepers here. So if you're going to have a powerful position, then I'd like to know where you stand on somebody. And I think that when I voted for the NBA, I had no problem my voting, and I made it public. And did I get roughed up in Salt Lake when I didn't vote for Carl Malone or in Phoenix when I didn't vote for Barkley. Yes, but it goes along with the territory. I had no problem with that, Yes, yes, Marvin.
And when it comes to MLB Hall of Fame voting, guys like Carlos Beltran who got like seventy percent of the vote, I'm sure it's got to be one of those or you're kidding.
No, No, he's going to get in next year.
Almost like Billy Wagner, like you're close this year, but the next year.
Okay, yeah, Yeah, Carlos Beltran will get in next year. I think Andrew Jones should you know, he should get in.
Now.
He was close as well. And I don't think the voting as far as candidates next year, I don't think it's a great list. But and sometimes it's timing.
Yes, ton See, that's a problem too, that you're going to get it too.
Cooperstown are not based on how weak or strong the year is of who's up on a given year.
You should not be included in who you vote for.
Yeah, you're all fired up with your Houston Astros gear on.
I've always been about Billy wagon I just haven't spoken about it a lot.
On there.
I kept that one to myself. Nobody's business.
Yes, Paul Chritsy looks like relaxed fit Billy Wagner right now in that outfit.
I don't gonna use fit, but I have relaxed. Yeah you are.
I'm comfortable with my two exl jersey. I'm good.
Yeah, you got your Billy Wagoner. That that jersey.
That uniform of the Astros boring is boring, boring killer.
Bees though, Yeah, it doesn't change the look of the.
Jersey to thank you to.
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He is a former All Conference tight end in high school, former Milwaukee Brewer. Great and now I'm a Hall of Famer C C. Sabbat you congratulations, thank you, thank you. What kind of tight end were you like?
You know what? What who did you pattern your game after? In high school?
I was not a blocking tight end.
I was more of a I need I need at least three balls throwing my way a half before I can, you know, start blocking.
My mottol was no rock, no block, No rock, no block.
Did you think about playing in college?
I did. I really wanted to. I really wanted to play football. That was that was my first love. I really enjoyed playing football. But I but I know, like my body type, since I would have got to college, they able to turn me into office a tackle right away, so.
I mean, hopefully hopefully it would have paid off.
But yeah, I mean I would have loved to have been been able to have a chance to go to college to play football.
How many pairs of pants do you have for your playing days? I love, I'd love to get a pair of those those pants man.
You know, but I honestly, I probably have a couple of pairs. They put it, they put They put a few on my locker when I go back for spring training now just for just for fun, I can get both legs and one and one and one leg.
Now, But what made you go to those large, you know, baggy pants?
You know what?
It was just me wanting to like represent myself. You know, it was the hat being tilted sideways. When I first came up, the pants had to be super tight like that, you know, everybody were the uniform super small and super tight, and they had to elastic at the bottom. And once I got a little older and a little established in the league, I was like, I want to kind of represent how I want to look on the field. And it was the back with the big jerseys and everybody's
wearing to throwback, So I adopted the big pants. I'm tilted my hat to the side or where the big My jersey was always my sleeves are always a lot longer than everybody else's, and it was just kind of my style. And uh, it's a funny story about that. One time Russell Bringion when I was in Cleveland, wore my pants in Kansas City and George Brett came down and like lit him up.
Totally looked like a clown, all this stuff he was.
Referent to making the big game look bad and all these different things. It was.
It was hilarious. But yeah, I have a few pairs. I can send you something.
What about the hat though, When you wore the hat to the side, what kind of reaction did you get.
Early in my career, not a good reaction obviously, as you know how the big leagues are with the unwritten rules, and you know, it was just being a young guy.
I was.
I was twenty years old in that clubhouse when I first came up, so I was the youngest guy. The next oldest guy on that team was you know, twenty six, twenty seven, so it was even hard to you know, for guys to relate to me. So yeah, I mean
it was just my thing. It was you know, me wearing my hat way to the side and going to grab the ball with my hand from the third basement after every out was just kind of what two of those things that I wanted to be mine and I was able to carry that for you know, through my career for nineteen years.
Okay, but just tilting your hat to the sign, was that something that your boy did, like guys you hung around with, Well, no.
You know what, So when I when I was in high school, my high school coach, he would get on me about the way I wore my hat because scouts would show up at the field so early, so they would watch I would always have my hat on backwards or you know, propped up on my head, and you know, just walking to the park. So he would always get on me about, you know, the way I looked, the way I you know, represented myself walking, you know, with scouts walking around. So after I got drafted, and you know,
I felt like I was established. I was like, I'm wearing my hat however I want to however I want to wear it.
Looks like Ken Griffey Junior when he had his hat backwards. All the baseball purists like, you're disrespecting the game.
Yeah, no, I mean it's just a thing that you know, And you know, other guys started adopting. You know, Fernando Rodney came up, he was wearing his hat to the side. Dontrelle Willis came up. We're from that saying, you know area, We've been knowing each other forever. He's wearing his hat to the side. So it became a thing, and and uh, you know, I'm glad I stuck with it.
Honestly, he's you see, Sabbathia, freshly minted Hall of Famer.
Where were you when you got the call?
I was here. I was home. You know.
We we had a bunch of people over and Baseball Hall of Fame is you know, it's it's a tricky thing. You don't know if you're gonna get that call or not. So we had a big party last night, and it could have been, you know, a big party where it could have been you know, made forget TV, or you know it made for you know, a good celebration last night. But you know, I wanted everybody around whether I got the call or not last night. It's just special being
on the ballot. I know how hard it is to get into the Baseball Hall of Fame being uh, you know, just a sports fan in general and understanding sports.
So it was a special moment for us.
Did you cry?
I haven't yet, but you know, like I see different things and I get on the verge of crying and then somebody texting me or somebody calls it. I've been so busy, you know, with with you know, planning and you know, we're driving up the Cooperstown in an hour and all these different things. I think I haven't had a chance to really sit down and process yet.
Which it mean though, to go in first ballan it.
Means, I mean, it means a lot.
I mean and like we, like I just said, you know, understanding you know, Baseball Hall and understanding just a Hall of Fame in general. I don't think ten years ago, I don't think I'll go in as a first ballot Hall of Famer. You know, I think, you know, the way the writers have looked at the game, and you know, the way the game has changed has allowed me to be a first ballot Hall of Famer, which is awesome
to me. And you know, now I look at, you know, myself and somebody like, you know, Justin Verlander, Max Scherzer, you know, Greenky. You know, we're kind of starters. You know, we're dying breed, you know. So you know, I feel like, you know, all those guys I just named to go in first ballot.
Too, and Kershaw as well.
But you're Kershaw too.
I'm sorry, yeah, but you're talking about that. You had thirty eight career complete games. Guys won't come close to that, and then pitching and have three thousand strikeouts and chwi Ldren felt like it's almost like the running back, where we got to the point where we devalued the running back. Now the running back came back, But the analytics has changed everything. And I don't know how analytics may have helped you be a first ballot Hall of Famer.
Yeah, I think, I mean, I think there'll be a lot more guys with you know, one hundred and fifty wins and three thousand strikeouts. You know, if you think, I think there'll be a lot more guys because if you look at it, the guys guys strack out two hundred and fifty two hundred and fifty guys a year now or you know, getting close to three hundred strikeouts a year just because you know, hitters don't care about striking out. So I think we'll get guys with three
thousand strikeouts. I think it'll be harder to get guys to two hundred wins. And as far as analytics for me, I mean yeah, I mean I think they helped in you know, I think they helped me get into the Hall of Fame obviously, like I said, because of you know,
the Dying Breeders starters. But while I was playing, you know, it was hard to you know, transition to you know, this this world of analytics and you know, trying to understand that it once you just throw your best pitch over and over and over again, where you know, I understand you need to set up, you know, hitters to be able to, you know, trick him with your best pitch. So you know, it was it was tough at the end of my career, you know, trying to pitch with analytics.
But you know, being outsideed out of the game and understanding analytics, I understand, you know, there's a need for it in the game.
How did you do against each roll?
Well, I mean, you know what, I honestly don't know.
I bet you each year old has a good career batting batting average against me. Somebody told me last night that he was my thousand strikeout though, so that's pretty cool. But I got a cool story. I mean, two thousand and six, I was struggling trying to figure out I needed a put out pitch. So we're trying to figure out I was trying to, you know, how to learn how to throw a cutter. Carl Willis and I went down to the bullpen in Oakland and he showed me
a grip of how he threw his cutter. And I came out of that bullpen with like an eighty two eighty three mile an hour slider that I started throwing, and I was like, oh, this thing is nasty. I can't wait till my next start. We go from Unkland Seattle. Next time I get into a game, I take it out there. And the first time I throw it in the game, each roll hit it off the window. In
my mind, I'm like, oh no, it's just easy. Like it's good because I'm getting output and I'm getting strikes with and I'm like, no, it's good.
He comes up the next time he hits it out again.
Who is the guy though? That you could never figure out?
Uh?
Man, it was a bunch, but I think Evan Longoria was a guy that I'll be staying on the Mou'll be like, man, I'm just throwing I can't.
I got nothing for you but him. Manny Ramirez, you know, uh.
Miguel Cabrera, you know, just those quiet right handed hitters that you know see the strikes on.
Well, who's going to help you with your speech?
I think everybody's gonna help me with my speech, you know, I mean anybody that knows me. You know, I hate standing up in front of people and you know, kind of public speaking. So I'm gonna pull inspiration from everybody. But I want to I want to make sure I get it right. I want to make sure, you know, I get I named the right people and and uh, you know, get people their.
Just due because it wasn't just me, you know the reason why. You know, I'm going to Cooperstown.
As a Yankee, hopefully as a Yankee.
Yes, as a Yankee.
Should the ballot be made public, the writers one one person didn't vote for each.
Roll, Uh, you know what, I don't think so, I mean, I don't. I don't.
I don't like you know, worrying about who didn't vote for who. I mean, it's you know, he's in the Hall of Fame now, so what difference does it make? You know, we spend so much time, you know, worried about the negative and you know why he didn't vote for each he old, But let's talk about the three hundred and ninety five votes he did get and you know, him going to Cooperstown because he's well deserved of it.
So you know, it's you know, it's just a you know something that you know in baseball we all all worry about. In the other sports, it doesn't matter, right, it doesn't matter what percent of the vote you get.
Once you go in, you're in. So you know, kind of is what it is.
Best player you played with in your career was who ay Rod? Wow that was quick?
Oh yeah, why give Robbie Alamar a close second?
Really?
Yeah?
So what was it about a Rod that you take him over everybody else?
I mean, obviously just is the talent that you know. I mean, you know, six ' three, you know, third basement shortstop at the time. You know when I when I was coming up the third basement of the time and I played with him. But it's baseball IQ. His IQ was off the charge. The way he watches the game, the way you're sitting next to him on the bench, and you know you'd be like, oh, we need to hit and run here, or oh we need to double steal,
or oh this team is going to do this. He watches the game at a different level than we all watched the game. And you know, having a chance to play with him and have him at third base, there'd be times when you know, a guy be coming up and he'd be like, hey, you know, throw a change up right here, this guy swinging first pitch, or you know this guy you know he may be taken right here.
So he would be you.
Know, just watching the game and the IQ and obviously putting the talent with that. You know, he was the best player that I that I've ever got a chance to be up close to.
Did you ever get to socialize with Jeter?
Oh? Yeah, I'm really close with Jeter. He was actually just calling me right now. I mean, oh.
Yeah, he's upset that you said a Rod over Jeter. But did you go out in New York? Like, what what was it like when Jeter was out?
Uh?
I mean it was It's always a lot of fun to go out with Jeet and hang out with Jet because he takes all the attention, so like I can just kind of like hang out and slide in and nobody's actually autographs or pictures or anything, and he just kind of ride his coatail. So uh yeah, I mean
he was He was always really cool. I mean as soon as I got here to New York, h that first bring training, me and him, Posada, you know, all the guys we got really close, and I think that was the reason why we were able to win right away.
But you didn't sit there and go, who's uh G you're dating now, Like, who's who's that? Who's a like his lineup card at Yankee stadium.
Oh no, I had nothing to do with me.
But as an innocent bystander, you have to be like, uh, it looks like, oh that is that's a favorite famous act. Jeter's definitely going to be calling you now. H hey, uh, congratulations, Uh and uh, don't be afraid. Don't be afraid to a mote you know you cry.
We're right there with you.
I appreciate it all right.
At c C Sabathia.
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio WAP.
A lot of fake laughter today, a lot of fake laughter. Don't need to do that with Tom Berducci's very serious, very serious.
He joins us on loan from l act He's got a nice smile.
You just you know, Tom and great hairy, just not He's not doesn't have the one liners that can. Rosenthal has MLB network analyst and a senior writer for Sports Illustrated. Good morning, Tom.
Good morning.
I don't know whether to compliment you on that intro or crush you, but well done.
Your reaction to the Hall of Fame vote.
Yeah, not surprising.
I actually had written my story before the announcement was made, thinking would be these three. Wagner got in a little higher than I thought, considering he was just five short last year, and each year a thing one person not voting for them.
Dan, it is not a big deal for me, And like put.
Away the pitchforks and the torches, it has no equation the worth of the player, right, Marianna Rivera is not the greatest player in baseball history.
Someone I would like to know the reason. Don't get me wrong.
Someone must have a legitimate reason, I hope for leaving him off the ballot. I'd like that person to explain himself. But I don't get upset about it. No, it's not like ho take away his voting privileges because he didn't vote the way he's quote unquote suppose to vote.
I'm not buying that.
But should the ballot be made public?
Yeah, listen, we're into business and journalism, business and transparency. When we get that ballot, we're able to check a box that says, would you like the BBWAA to make this ballot public after the announcement, And most of us always do, right, But it is a choice. It's not an obligation. I would have no problem with making it public. I actually, Dan, I would prefer that it all be public. But you cannot reveal your ballot until after the announcement
is made. Can you imagine, like the Grammy's coming out the Academy Awards, there was a running tracker of who is leading.
No, I don't want that.
I just want to hear the announcement when it's made of who won and what the vote tols were. I don't want it to influence the election, and I want to hold off the surprise.
Frankly, well, that's what it is with the Heisman. They say, don't reveal your ballot, and I always wait until after, and then I say, this is who I voted for and why I vot voted for them. But I look, I'm proud to have that opportunity, so I don't want to hide from it. I would just be curious why this voter didn't vote for each row, like what was
it that that bothered you? Or sometimes, as you know, voters will give a vote to somebody else so they can get a little bit of a boost because this other guy is already going to get into the Hall of Fame.
Yeah, I've heard of that in the past. It's tough to think that's in play this time.
Dan, this was not.
Necessarily a really deep ballot where you're fighting to keep guys on on the eight, nine, ten spots in the ballot.
Now listen, each row to me is a no brainer, right.
Three thousand hits, three hundred average, five hundred stolen bases, one of only five guys that do that, A handful of guys. But I mean, he does have the lowest adjusted ops for any count corner outfielder in the Hall of Fame. He was a singles hitter who didn't walk and didn't hit for expert bases. You want to hold that against them, I don't, but I, like you, I would like to know what it was.
You know, it's interesting.
He came up for the Japanese Baseball Hall of Fame ballot as well and only pulled about ninety three percent over there.
So I don't know.
I don't know what's going on.
Maybe bad that he left, Yeah, there you go, he didn't.
He didn't last long enough over there. I think he had a thousand hits over there. It wasn't good enough.
Moving forward, though, trying to look at starting pitchers, and you know, trying to handicap how do you quantify qualify these starting pitchers to be in the Hall of Fame. Let's get rid of the guys you know are already in with Ureser and you know you got Clayton kershaw Erlander maybe one. I don't know, Granky, I don't know if it's Greenky hold Yeah, okay, now what do you do?
Yeah, it's a.
Great question because you know, watching a guy like CC, he's got traditional numbers, thirty five hundred innings, right, three thousand punch out, two hundred and fifty wins.
That's kind of easy.
But those I don't want to say he's the last of them, but it's it's far and few between. So you're starting to now I think see a really seismic change in voting. And I think Felix Hernandez is kind of the canary and the coal mine here right.
His peak actually was better than CC Sabathia's.
He just threw so many innings at nineteen twenty twenty one that he didn't last in his thirties. So now you're gonna have to look back and guys like Johann Santana Brett Saberhagen, Dave Steve, Kevin Brown, David Kohene. A lot of these guys who had really really high peaks were among the best pitchers in the game for say, seven, eight, nine, ten years, but didn't have the three thousand punchouts, three thousand innings.
There's a lot of guys.
That think they are going to come into play as we go forward here, and very few like Sabathia, that are going to come up.
Okay, But is did Kurt Shilling come along on the ballot at the wrong time because he was If Shilling is on the ballot, now, is he a Hall of Famer?
You know, if he takes down his social media account and he stays quiet. I mean really, that's why he's not in the Hall of Fame. He opened his mouth and people didn't like it. I voted for him every year. To me, he was Don Drysdale with a better postseason. Kurt Shilling was a history changer. It's easy for me
to vote for guys who changed history. CC changed history, whether it was the stretch run with Milwaukee all time legendary stuff, or he signs with the Yankees, huge deal, they win his first year there and he's the guy, the MVP of the ALCS.
Shilling changed history.
We can think about games at the top of our head that he influenced, essentially one himself. That to me as a Hall of Famer, and he was tracking that way until he ticked off a lot of journalists and said the wrong things that didn't.
Supposed to factor in.
Tom.
Yeah, I don't think it does, Dan. I think listen.
I didn't agree with what he said, but I vote on someone's playing.
But he didn't cheat the game. You got guys who cheated the game.
And with Peds, Dan, it really affects how the game has played, the competitive aspect of the game. The most basic rule of competing in sports is play fairly.
You hear it on the playground. You here at Major.
League Baseball, don't create an uneven playing field. What Shilling did as a player, I don't see any evidence that, you know what his political views social views affected.
How he played the game. So I'm with you on that. It's nothing to say that you ignore it.
You can disagree with it as I do, but doesn't mean you have to say, oh, therefore, I'm not voting through the Hall of Fame. Very interesting to see what happens now because he's off the writer's ballot. If a room full of sixteen people in a veterans committee, twelve of them think, yeah, we're gonna look past what he said and put him in the Hall of Fame.
I'll leave you with this.
With the Dodgers and the amount of money that they're spending, they're not breaking any rules there. If that's my ownership, I'm thrilled that they're they want to ensure we're going to have a great team. Is there any recourse with Baseball of doing anything about this in the future.
No, not now.
They're playing by the rules, as you said. I mean, they have a billion dollars in deferred money, but Goggenheim, the company that owns the Dodgers, has about three hundred and fifty billion dollars in deferred money. So this is pocket change for what they do and how they operate. And I think you have to look at the fact too, Dan, that their infrastructure right, their technology, they're coaching. Everything they do to create a working atmosphere for players is top of the charts.
Great.
And if you want to go to the postseason, you sign with the Dodgers. They deserve credit for creating this atmosphere similar to the Yankees in the late nineties. Right, those are the advantage that they're operating with. Is it good for the game?
I don't know.
Listen, we all love Goliath.
You're sitting here talking about the Chiefs every year and people get tired of them. But we all like to also root for David against Goliath. Right, So I think it's good for the game. But they're already our owners around the game who can't compete even closely with how the Dodgers spend money, who say we need a system
that's different. And if you're talking about a salary cap, just be prepared for not playing baseball in twenty twenty seven because every time that issue comes up and the owners want to stick to it, we have the game shut down. That's the history of labor negotiating.
Always great to talk to you. Thank you, Tom, You got Dan. Thank you Tom Berducci.
Be sure to catch the live edition of The Dan Patrick Show weekdays at nine am Eastern six am Pacific on Fox Sports Radio and the iHeartRadio app.
Joe Thomas is the only player in NFL history to play in more than ten thousand consecutive plays without interruption or injury. The NFL record ten thousand, three hundred and sixty three snaps sounds pretty impressive. I don't know what it means, but uh, you're Are you the cal Ripken of offensive linemen?
I'll allow you to call me the cal Ripken of all of the NFL if that's what you want to do, Dan, you can put the words in my mouth. I'm okay with that.
Okay, But how many times were you aware this streak when you played?
I was yees, so it was probably like year six or seven when I realized, huh, you know what, I don't think I've missed the play yet. And then our sports information director Dan Murphy kind of looked into it and was like, hey, you're right, you haven't missed any plays. And oh, by the way, I don't think anybody's done that ever since they started keeping tracking, like nineteen ninety nine or something like that.
But how many times did you go out there just to keep the streak alive?
So I never actually willingly like said, oh, I'm ready to take a break, and oh, but I got the streak on the line, I got to go back out there. But certainly towards the ends, as I was getting closer to ten thousand, which is kind of a big milestone, I thought, you know what, Hey, if you know my shoelace breaks or I lose a chin strap, do I call a timeout? Do I just like go and quick call a timeout so I can save the streak and just deal with the coach yelling at me on the sideline.
And I think to myself, you know what, after nine years of doing this, I think I deserve to waste at least one time out if I had to with something goofy, like a shoe gun tied, or like busted the chin strap or you know, something with the equipment malfunction happens.
I had a former college coach, well known college coach, and he was talking about developing running backs because we don't use them the way we once did. But maybe there's a comeback with that with Derrick Henry or Sakuon Barkley, but also developing offensive linemen. That the way the game is played in college, that we're not developing offensive linemen the way that we once did. Your thoughts on that of what you see with offensive linemen now as to you know, when you were at Wisconsin.
Yeah, that's a much more wide open game in college and in high school especially, and I think because of that, the guys on the offensive line are not really taught the breadth of techniques that we were when I was in college and when I was early in the NFL, where you have to learn so many different ways of blocking. You're blocking manned concepts, you're blocking double teams and gap schemes,
you're blocking inside zone, you're blocking outside zone. And then also you have your drop back pass, you have your three step, your five step, your seven step, your play action,
your boots. So you have this huge catalog of techniques that you have to learn that They just don't do that quite as much anymore, and they don't put as much pressure on the offensive lineman, which is probably a good thing because it takes a long time to learn all these different techniques, but I think they've really dumbed it down and at the high school and college level, and so because of that, at the NFL, you see guys that they've got great technique, they're stronger, they're faster,
they're more athletic than ever, but they don't have those pro style catalog of techniques that they used to, and so when you're asking them to do a bunch of different stuff like NFL offenses do, they struggle in a lot of different ways because it just takes a lot of time and a lot of reps to develop that.
And oh, by the way, we have less preseason time, we have less contact time in the offseason and through training camp, and so you have less time to actually develop those techniques that you need the most.
What is it about a couple of these tackles that get off the ball like that, It feels like they're moving before they're supposed to be moving. Lane Johnson kind of mastered this, but are they like, is it illegal? Should it be flagged?
No?
I think the problem is for decades, we were used to seeing the ball snap and then after the ball is about almost between the center's legs, we see the offensive line move, and defensive linemen were moving at a similar slow pace. Well somewhere, I don't know, maybe middle beginning of my career, defensive lineman realized, Hey, if I can beat that offensive tackle off the snap and get ahead of him, now he's playing catch up to me.
Now he's back on his heels, and then now I can dictate whatever I want to do in my rush. At the point of contact he's off balance. I can either bowl rush him or I can push pull him. I can rip to the outside, i can move to the inside, but I've got him right where I wanted. And so offensive tackles started realizing, Hey, the secret to winning the rep is to win the snap. And that's
what we started emphasizing. And so then you started hearing guys and seeing guys anticipate when the snap was coming. And so when you listen to a snapcount, which is
really important from a quarterback. I had a lot of quarterbacks twenty quarterbacks that I apply for that were starters at Cleveland, and the first thing that I would try to train these guys up on is, all right, we need a rhythmic cadence so that I can anticipate when you're going to call for the ball and I can start the process of my brain telling my body to move, which there's a little bit of a lag time. It's not like the speed of light, but it's pretty fast.
But that little split second of lag between when your brain says go and your body goes is enough of a difference maker. That is the determination of whether you win or lose the snap and whether you win or lose the rep in a pass pro and so I would actually tell myself, like Lane Johnson and all the tackles that you're seeing doing a good job of it, I was telling my body to go before the call
from the quarterback, which made the timing absolutely perfect. So if you actually look at it, for a lot of these guys, the second the ball just starts to move before the snap even really happens, the tip of that football just starts moving. That's when they're moving. And that's
a perfect rep. And to the naked eye, it probably looks like they're jumping and they're fall starting until you slow it down on film and you see, oh no, that was actually perfect because if they don't do that, that's exactly when the defensive linemen are moving.
Okay, but give me a for instance, your quarterback line of scrimmage, when do you know that ball is going to be snapped because if he goes, say, you know, green fifty seven set hut hut.
Yeah, so if it's on one, you'll hear the snap count. It's actually like a rolling cadence. So we used to do White Dy Why he's so all those things kind of roll together. So when I would hear white Ady Whye Eddy's set, I was actually going on the set before the hut, which was actually the calling for the football. And so you had to also stay on top of your center because if he was trying to get a
head start too. Now, all of a sudden, the ball is coming before the quarterback and everybody else is ready. And so that's why it's really important that the quarterback's cadence and how he rolls into the hut and when the center is snapping the ball is all perfectly in sync and perfectly the same from one snap to the next, so that I can win and the defensive lineman is a little bit behind.
Spend eleven seasons with the Cleveland Browns, works for the NFL Network, Joe Thomas, Hall of Famer, and you're working with Colt.
Explain what twos?
Yeah, Colt Firearms. They have made the Safety Impact Award to try to encourage safe and responsible firearm ownership. And myself, Clay Matthews, guy went against a lot, probably thought I was false starting quite a bit when he was playing.
For the Packers.
Adam Vinatieri and Fletcher Cox. We're all trying to raise awareness for safe and responsible firearm ownership. We've all selected a nonprofit charity, Mine the Great Ducks Unlimited, which fights for wetland restoration and clean water, clean air throughout North America, and we're raising money for those organizations. And all people have to do is go to Safety Impact Award dot Com.
They can vote for those organizations. It's one dollar per vote, and then when you vote, if there's a safety, which you get the little pun there onwards. If there's a safety in the super Bowl, people that voted for the winning charity have a chance to win a portion of one hundred thousand dollars from Cordova. So you get an opportunity to get a free prop bet in the Super Bowl and get to cheer for a safety, which is my wife's favorite play. So I'm always cheering, happy wife, Happy life.
Give me the quarterback who would be the toughest to block for?
So there's always this conversation. I just had this with Lane Johnson a couple of weeks ago, about would you rather block for a quarterback that's mobile that you know if you get just flat out beat, like you just fall in your face and the guy runs past you, is able to make that guy miss and turn it, you know, chicken salad into you know or chicken you know what and the chickens out? And or would you rather have the guy like a Peyton Manning or Tom
Brady who's exactly in the right spot every time. He's not really going to avoid anybody, but he's throwing that ball on time. And for me, I always preferred the guy that was in the right spot getting rid of the football on time, because then I knew I could do my job right no matter what. And like I always wanted the onus to be on me to make sure that I did my job the right way. And I don't really care what the quarterback does, but if
he's in that spot, he's going to be protected. But some guys, they prefer the guys that can get out and move, you know, the Jayden dnils that Jalen hurts, the guys that, hey, you get beat and all of a sudden he's gonna make a great, amazing play and convert a first down and then all of a sudden, instead of the coach putting you in a headlock and giving you a nuggy on the sideline. He's patting you on the back and say, ah, it's okay, you'll get him next time, buddy.
But Mahomes is not like Jayden Daniels or Josh Allen. He's or even Jalen Hurts like. He's just unique because I always call him an opportunistic quarterback. He's an opportunist. I'm not there's no design runs, but if there is a run, I'm going to be taking advantage of that. But then we also get to this point where is he flaunting the protecting the quarterback when he's out of the pocket. If you were the NFL, would you make any tweaks to that rule next season?
Absolutely? And I have been banging this drum for a while because I do not blame Josh Allen because he does it a lot too. I don't blame Patrick Mahomes. I just think that's they're doing a good job of
you utilizing that. The way the game is officiated right now, however, the NFL absolutely has to make a change with how they officiate the roughing the passer, with how they officiate the giving yourself up to slide for quarterbacks, how they officiate guys at quarterback like Patrick Mahomes did last weekend, where they look like they're about to go out of bounds and then they stop, and then the defense hits
them and then they fly out of bounds. And I don't even necessarily blame the quarterbacks or the officials in this case. It's just how it's being officiated, because if you look at the rule, they're saying that when a quarterback starts to slide, that's where the ball should be placed down. So the moment he starts to slide, that's where he's down. And it was a way of a quarterback being able to give themself up when they're in
the open field without getting hit at all. And it was supposed to happen way before contact was ever made. But because officials were placing the ball like in the middle of when they started their slide, they were giving him these extra yardage after they had started sliding. And because of that, now you see quarterbacks doing these late slides.
They're trying to get as close to a defensive lineman as they can and then maybe look like they're going to slide and then keep going, and it puts defenders in tremendous conflict because you don't know what the intentions of the quarterback is, and the intentions should be very clear by the letter of the law and the letter of the rule from the NFL. They should be able to understand well in advance from a defensive standpoint if
that quarterback is giving themselves up or not. And the fact that it's not happening and we're getting late slides, we're getting fake slides, We're getting quarterbacks that pretend like they're going out of bounds and then they don't. It's actually become a very dangerous play. We saw that with Trevor Lawrence earlier in the season. Now his wasn't quite
as late. But because of this difficult quandary that we're putting the defenders in, whether they don't know what the quarterback is doing, and then if they don't make a play on the quarterback, they don't try to tackle them. Now they're a meme on social media for being a bozo and not trying to hit the quarterback and just standing there, and you know, you have all these issues of not knowing what's happening. And so I think for the safety of the quarterbacks, which is I think in
everybody's best interests. Of course, we want to see Patrick Mahomes and Josh Allen go at at this weekend. We don't want to see those two backups like we want to keep them healthy. But it needs to be officiated differently, and there needs to be some type of penalty, maybe like they did in the NBA with the flopping and stuff against a quarterback who's not clearly giving himself up well before he gets anywhere near making contact with a defender.
Did you ever think you were really intimidating anybody if in cold weather you went out there with short sleeves on.
No, No, it was definitely a peer pressure thing. It was an ego thing that came from a long, long time ago. But the one thing I will say to people that you know are always impressed because you always hear the annountsers the linemen are wearing sleeves, it's amazing. I actually felt that not wearing sleeves was warmer because when you wear sleeves, when you get sweaty, which inevitably you will, now that materials got water on it, sweat on it, and it's going to evaporate and make your
arms colder. And so what we would do and I'm sure they still do. It is if you wore bare arms, you put vasileene, which helps cut the wind, it helps cut any of that evaporation that's going to happen. And then don't forget.
Is that legal?
As far as I know, I've never got a flag for it, I never got fined for it, so I'm pretty sure it's legal. Defenders would do it too. But I think the thing that we need to remember too is like underneath that shoulder pad and jersey that you're wearing, you're wearing like a wetsuit, like you're wearing the warmest possible thing on planet Earth. You've got a wool patch stitched up into your helmet that covers your ears. The sidelines have these giant jet blow torches that like they're
so hot you can't even get near them. Or I've melted my shoes before, So it is plenty warm for those players. We do not have to feel sorry for those guys whatsoever on a cold day. Feel bad for the officials that don't get to go over there, maybe, or the people that are working the sidelines are the fans, certainly you don't have any of those heaters, but the players they're just fine, guys.
He's Joe Thomas, Hall of Famer and ten three hundred and sixty three consecutive snaps without injury or interruption. See, you can't, like, if you're sick around the house with your wife, like she'll be like, oh, mister, consecutive snaps streak is not going to be able to help us take out the garbage.
Yeah.
It works good with my four kids because I'm like, hey, kids, all right, you can get up, you can go to school. You're just fine, you know, Okay, I'm sorry you hurt your shoulder. You know what, I played ten and a half missed in the NFL without missing a snap. I think you guys can suck it up for one basketball.
Pou once again.
You can go to Safety Impactaward dot com for more on what Colts is doing the Safety Impact Award. Great to talk to you again, Joe, thanks for joining us.
Yeah, thanks for having me on Dan. If you guys want to go to my social media Joe Thomas seventy three, you can also find that link on my Twitter and Instagram