Jon Stewart Talks Presidential Deception with Fmr. Bush Press Secretary | TDS Time Machine

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This is the Daily Show with James Too. Everybody, Welcome to the Daily Show. My name is Jack Dort. What a show for you tonight, man?

Man.

I am rapped up tonight, and not just because I had Starbucks the old fashioned way.

It's a story I'll tell you about some other time.

I got a big show tonight. I'm excited because we have a Daily Show exclosive former White House Presidentretary Scott MacLellan in what is being billed by us as his only appearance on television.

With a Daily show exclusive. All right, I got nothing. Of course.

Skon Colon has just written a book called What Happened, an insider account of spin and propaganda that will mildly confirm the things about this administration that angered and frightened you over the first couple of years of their reign, and then over time you have come to accept as the new normal. I didn't read the book, of course, because it's harvest season, but.

I listened to the hell out of it on my John Deere.

That's a tractor for you elites. Pretty remarkable audiobook check out this passage.

Being evasive is not the same as lying in Bush's mind.

You know, look, I'm not an audiobook producer anymore, but I do live by one simple rule. When you got something important to say, how you say it is nine tenths of the law.

You got his zaz it up.

You got McClellan reading his.

Own book, you got a blockbuster script was straight to video talent, no offense.

Let me show you something Schneider.

Hi, everybody, Fred Schneider, the Beef fifty Dudes's on clarbul fun claque.

Nice to see her. Hold on. How you doing, Fred, I'm fine?

Thanks, Thanks for having Fred.

The Scott McClellan book is an incredibly important book, and it's a bit of a dry read on the audio version. I was hoping you could put a code of Schneider on this one, could you.

Yeah, Music being a base, it's not the same as lion and pushes mine cutting friends.

Now, that is a page turner. That is something people get excited about. You stick around a little bit.

Okay, all right, do you want to do another one?

I'd love another one. I'd love a quick one. Okay, all right, here we go.

Okay, this is from page to seventeen. Okay, all right, music. As I entered the yobel Aria, I ran into Scared or Living.

Yes, thank you very much. Exciting to be fifty coodes. That's an audio book. That's what I'm talking about. All right, So here we go here, folks. Anyway, I hope you.

All had a nice weekend. I had tickets this weekend to go see.

The Democratic Party Rules and Bylaws Committee playing at the Marriott in DC.

Boo, y'all, but.

Obviously I couldn't go. Had a family obligation.

Uh man.

When I was single right out of college, I don't think I missed one by Law Committee rule.

Meeting session.

I got a bootleg from nineteen eighty sickest meeting. It was one where Carter supporters recommended the committee adopted Rule F three c bonding delegates to the pledge candidate on the first ballot.

If you remember it, you weren't there, mother. I didn't think I was gonna be able to get that out.

But anyway, at this meeting, this time, the Michigan and Florida delegations petitioned to have their votes reinstated after having them stripped because they violated party rules by moving up there primaries.

The argument to do so was pretty passionate.

Let me go to a po one that the charter delegates shall be delegates E and C members, and the other charter delegates shall be delegates. Shall There's no conditional use of the word. The question is shall provide or shall permit? Shall provide? To me, is mandatory? Shall permit?

His discretionary?

Yep, you've ever gotten really high and thought about what shall really? Actually the meeting wasn't just about procedural arguments and redefining words. This meeting was about the good people who'd been disenfranchised in Michigan and Florida.

Tabata Burgos, who cast her very first vote in Orlando.

Megan Foster, a mother of five from Tampa.

Shall Jennons from Barrington Beach, Florida. She's eighty two years old.

About Mary Mooney, She's from North Florida.

Edith Rozen from Boca Ratone, who, at ninety four years old, waited in line to cast her vote.

Matouselah Jones, one hundred and eighty six years old, traveled from her home to the voting booth via pogo stick Yoda Schwartz from Saint Petersburg, seven hundred and eighty years old, had herself criogenically frozen, to be defrosted only in the case of such an historic election.

Oh And, in an astonishing coincidence, In an astonishing coincidence, the very principal decision.

Of how to seat the delegations broke down precisely along candidate lines. Barack Obama's people read their firm belief in the prior rule of law. Hillary Clinton's people registered their firm belief the power of one man, one vote, causing some hilarious mix ups. Take Clinton advisor Harold the aptly named Ikeys, who last year, as a member of this committee, very same committee voted to strip the Florida and Michigan delegations back when his candidate didn't need them.

I am stunned that we have the gall and the hutzpah to substitute our judgment for six hundred thousand voters. Was the process flawed? You bet your asset was flawed.

Do I think I'm cool for saying ass better believe that. Ultimately the committee agreed to see both states delegations, but with their half vote, not their whole vote. Florida split one O five for Clinton, sixty seven for Obama, a

The Democrats are throwing the election away for what an inadequate what maw who would.

Not have been running had it not been a white woman?

Okay, see it passed over, Grandma.

We'll be right. Hey. You know what, Hey, Fred, can you take us out?

Okay? Ah?

Music?

Yeah, right back, baby, right back, right back, Well, be right back, baby, what.

About I guess toy?

He served as White House Press Secretary from two thousand and three until two thousand and six.

His new book is called What Happened.

Inside the Bush White House and Washington's Culture of Deception.

Please welcome back to the program, Scott McClellan, Sir, hellyer, I'm doing great.

I don't know that I'm top Fred, but I'm doing well.

Welcome Brett is all right? He really should have read your book. Nothing against you? Your book with you reading it. It's actually a very good book and I read it over the weekend.

What happened? You're taking a lot of heat for this. You talked about fight club.

And uh, and now they've they've come out and they've hit you with he was disgruntled. What else have they said? You were out of the loop? These are all the administration officials.

Are they.

Destroying you in the way that you thought they would? Does this miss the McClellan touch? You know you were there when Richard Clark did his book. You had some some tough things to say about him.

I saw him the other night, Richard Clark, Did you really?

Yes?

And I apologized to him. I hadn't even read his book, and I was describing these motivations to him based on the talking points that we use at the.

White House on Here's because you had said Richard Clark, he.

Doesn't know anything. He was gone for a year and a half. What is it? How would you destroy you? What would you what would you use on you? As well?

I think the White House has probably been a little bit more personal than I expected. It was a little surprising how personal some of it got, But I think I would have stayed away from that. I think when people see the book and get a chance to read it, they see my sincerity in that what I'm saying in there.

My seasm is mild, and especially compared to so many other books previously that have said similar things.

I mean, they're kind of turning this into gotcha points, and there's really a larger message in here that is one that I think a lot of us really want to see happen, which is in the partisan warfare in Washington, DC, and let us move beyond it.

Here's my favorite one they've been using on you roll the tape that they got here.

This is not the Scott we knew.

It's just inconsistent with the individual that we knew is Scott McClellan, the press secretary.

Maybe this was a news guy.

The voice that comes out of this book is certainly not Scott McClellan's. Is Scott has said things that really don't want sound like Scott.

Frankly, this doesn't sound like Scott. This is amazing. Their argument here is you're not you.

That I'm finally speaking for myself, but I'm not me. If they look at the book and get a chance to read it, they'll see who I am, and that's who I am. I grew up as an idealistic guy who wanted to get involved in politics, joined the governor's staff, thinking we could change Washington like he had done in Texas, where he was a very popular bipartisan guy, and got there and things going to turn out.

Quite the way we happened. The this is not Scott.

Take me into the meeting where they brainstorm the terrible things they're going to say.

About I'm sure this is sure. Who's who's in that meeting?

Sure, I'm sure there was a discussion probably in the communications or the counselor's office who oversees communication.

Who's in that?

That'd be Ed Gillespie, the communications director?

Pay all right, he's the press.

Would they say things like, uh, his brain was eaten by bats?

That'll never work out? Body snatchers?

They think it's out of body experience. That's what they used early on too.

Really, they up on a blackboard and do they more.

Talking amongst themselves and then coming up with those points and.

Will they say, like, this will be a great point because it will make him look foolish. How explicit is the conversation?

Well, I think it's yeah, how can we discredit this? I mean, this has got a powerful message and one that you know, it's not helpful to us right now, That's not the purpose of it. The purpose of it is something bigger, like I said, which is changing the way Washington works.

Right.

But but see, I'm so interested in the way Washington actually works because good for you. No, not as a thinking, breathing sentient being the show.

Yes, But.

You know what I kind of want to figure out is because you talk a lot about how this process was applied to the Iraq war, Right, the same process that takes the what Happened book and comes up with a list of pejoratives was applied to war and policy.

That's right. It's this permanent campaign culture that I talk about and how destructive it can become, particularly when it's used in matters of leading the nation to war, where you should be talking about the actual truths of the situation on the ground, so that expectations are known going in and we understand exactly what we're getting to see what the cost are, what the consequences are, what the risk.

Are, what the costs are.

Okay, For example, Lawrence Lindsay comes out in the run up to the war and somebody asks him how.

Much is the work going to cost?

And he says, I don't know, maybe one hundred billion, maybe two hundred million dollars. And you have to run then into the President's office and say, oh my god, somebody just mentioned something that's true.

Actually, I was traveling with him that day and I had to wander before he saw the press, just in case he got asked about it. He wasn't planing taking questions, and he was pretty steemed about it because it wasn't part of the message that we were trying to get out at the moment. He was really making news that we didn't want made, and that's a big no no in the administration.

How was that You mentioned in the book that this was not willful deception?

Right? How is that not willful deception?

Well, what happens is that this becomes part of the culture in Washington.

This is the way both both parties engaging. If somebody to two hundred million dollars and you say, yeah, don't tell him that.

Just tell him it'll pay for itself.

It.

Don't want to tell him anything.

That was the thing.

Well, no guys came out and said it'll pay for itself. Well too, absolutely, so that's a lie they knew.

Well, I don't know.

Paul Wolfootz I think was one of those who said that, the Deputy Secretary of Defense, and maybe he really believed it or convinced himself. I don't know, but it was essentially off.

Nobody made a willful decision. Don't talk about the price, because that truth.

May make people think twice about it and the cost. The cost that concerned me more, of course, is the human costs, the irrevocable human cause this.

Was just the one example the irrevocable human costs everything. Isn't that the very definition of deception?

Well yeah, and the question is if we start saying, is this deliberate or is this intentional, or you look at it in a different light.

If it's just just the way everybody does.

They that's what we've got to stop. If they sat in a room and said, when we go to campaign for this war, let's not tell them how much it costs. Let's not mention it. That's a sin of omission. That's a lie.

Yeah, it's a there's no there's really no difference whether it's deliberate or intentional, or or it is or not. Well, they're both problematic in their own.

They're not both problematic.

One is homicide, the others involuntary.

Mons could be criminal for instance.

That's what I'm saying. That's my point, isn't But in the book you make it, You make it very clear.

You go out of your way to say you don't think it's intentional, and I don't. But I haven't seen any evidence that it's not intentional because everything was done with a forethought. It may not have been done with malice, so it may not be first degree murder, but it was done with a forethought.

See.

I think these are good people.

They just got caught up in this whole.

It was done with a forethought.

They sat in a room and told They sat in a room with each other and said, don't tell them any of the bad consequences that could come of this war, because we really want to do this.

I don't think it was just like that.

Tell me what wasn't like that?

Well?

I think it was more talking about what's the strongest possible case we can make. It was talking about what we.

Do we really want to do this, Well, it could cost two hundred billion dollars. Don't mention that you're in there thousands of people may die. Yeah, you might not want to bring that up. Now, what if they call me in front of Congress to testify about it?

Just say something isn't that We're gonna take commercial.

We'll be right back with God McCallin the book is called What Happened. Actually, I actually enjoyed the book.

It was Here's what I find so fascinating. And this has to do with the media's role in all this and the way that, uh, you say that they were complicit. Ari Fleischer, who was your predecessor, and Karl Rove, who, whether you believe he has good intentions or not, clearly is the strategic head of the propaganda in the street. Blush white House were hired by news organizations, literally spent their entire careers over the past few years lying to them,

And they hired them. How is that not.

Uh, I don't know from low self esteem?

Why would they do that?

Why would they continue to aid these relationship.

In d C? That's way you know, they view them as the brilliant strategist that operates under these game rules and does a great job.

So you know, we.

Value what he has to say. Is it now like when like it's like a bad movie where they get like a jewel thief and go, now you work for the cops?

You know? Is it that kind of thing, like what the hell is going on?

Yeah, it's they're complicit in creating this whole environment that exists in DC, and I think we need to re evaluate that.

But can we reevaluate it before we get candor on the situation? You talk about the that straight, right, you need that first. You talk about them veering off course. Right, from my perspective, they've been on the same course all along, from the day one that they started. When the President says, I trust the American people's judgment was both because backstage they were creating secrecy and rearranging the rules. From day one, they were creating a facade.

So here here's the difference. Just to my view, I mean, I I was there I'm very I still have a personal affection for the president, but you've got to separate your personal affection from his actions and deeds. And that's what I was able to do once I stepped out of that.

All white personally.

So all I have or actually haven't had him.

You haven't had him on yet. He hasn't been here yet.

But but what do you say about that the entire presidency was a facade of public manipulation?

I don't. I don't agree the entire presidency, but there's certainly a lot of it. We're certainly a lot of it. I think he I think he is very sincere in his beliefs, but he takes it to like and many other politicians does do, and and engages in that way.

That's the problem.

Doesn't he say, I know what's best for the country, and your job is to help me sell that to the American people without them realizing what we're really doing.

Well, he didn't say it that way to me, but he did.

He did.

He did say, your job is isn't that?

Isn't that your the gist of how Washington works? Now, It's one way.

Look at if we make the arguments on the basis of the actual argument we lose.

Let's not make it on that basis.

There is absolutely there's some of that that you can't win by being as open and forthright as you should be. And that's the big problem. And one of the things I talk about in the end about how we need to start with that and then go to some other ways when they save us this end. No, it's starting it before us. It's been going on for fifteen years. How bad this is, and you know both candidates are now talking about ending it.

Here's my last thing on your last day? Can you play the clip of his last day with the president?

And one of these days he and I are going to be rocking the chairs in Texas talking about the good old days.

Okay, I want you to show me something, all right, So here are the chairs.

I'll be the president, you can be you how close if.

This is the porch, how close are you sitting? And where's Cheney with the gun? I appreciate what you're trying to do now, and I think candor is the only way to get past this, and I hope that other people take that lead.

What happened is on the bookshelves now. Scott mccollin.

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