Broadway Stars Discuss Their Journeys to the Tony Awards

You're listening to Comedy Central now, Arianna de Bose, welcome to.

The Data Show.

Thank you.

I don't think I was supposed to put my hands.

No, we're we're talking. What are you talking about?

Yeah, but welcome to It's really good to have you here, especially now. Like you know, some people, if their Broadway efficionados have seen you. You know you've you've been just I think you've been grinding at this thing in Broadway with ten years right where you've done everything, every.

Different type of production.

You're a consummate performer, singer, dancer, actress, everything all in one. But it feels like this is your moment, like you know where the overnight success comes together after ten years. It feels like that's that moment. Doesn't feel the same way for you.

I hesitate to say it, but yes, why do you hesitate? Because I'm really enjoying it, like I'm having fun. I don't want it. I want it to go away. You know, moments, they're moments, they're like they're fleeting ephaneral No.

No, no, no, no at all, Like COVID is a moment, but look how long it's going.

For you know what? You're not wrong?

Yes, so I'm just whatever it is, however anyone interprets it. I'm just enjoying whatever this is while it lasts, because it's been really fun. It's not every day you get to make a movie with Steven Spielberg and what you're asked to execute, it's actually.

Something you do.

I was like, Oh, I have to do other kinds of homework, but the bones of what this job is I got that.

I love that great. I love that, and I mean, you know, it's also unique to be in a position where you're having fun, the audience is having fun watching you have fun, and then the critics are having fun as well. Like that's the perfect combination of what you'd like in arts, you know. Because Screen Actors Guild nomination, right, Golden Globe winner, congratulations, thank you, right, thank you very Like it just feels like you're in this world.

NAACP Award as well. I should mention it. Yes, yeah, that's also another nomination.

I was really honored by by. I'm honored by it all. I'm very grateful for the opportunities to be seen, especially for artists of color, Like it feels like we're all starting to have a different kind of moment right now, and most of our work is not only being seen but considered invalued in different ways. That's really the heart of why I'm so excited.

I think it's an honor for anyone who gets to talk to you because of what you're doing in all of the mediums you're doing it in.

Like Triple threat gets throwing around a lot.

You know, people are like, oh, Triple you're a singer, you're a dancer, but you really are that, you know.

SNL was one of the best examples.

Congrats by the way, Yeah, thank you, I thank you.

I had a lot of fun on that show.

You look like you did.

You did so well that Like I've seen people crush it on SNL. I have seen very few people crushed to the point where people watching or like where's her SNL?

No, that would be fun, people like when is Irana doing her own thing? Well?

That cool.

I'm actually not so shy about the fact that I really want to bring the like Variety showback, like I really want to do it. So if anybody wants to hit me up on that cool cool.

It seems like to me you are soon becoming the puzzle piece that everyone is going to have to figure out how to fit around.

That's cool. I've never been I've never had that.

No, I've ever had that.

I genuinely feel like that is what you're very quickly becoming.

I mean, West Side Story is.

Few films get remade with as much pressure as this one has had. You are playing a role that is arguably one of the most important roles in not just film history, but then like in the history of so many Latina actresses, where they go like this was this was it? You know, this was the Rita Marino moment that changed film for a lot of people.

It had an influence in your life, Yes.

It did.

And I saw it when I was gosh, I guess about like six or seven, you know, and I didn't understand who she was, but I understood she's sort of looked like me, and I wanted to dance just like her. And then not until my adulthood did I really understand the full spectrum of what West Side Story did for her and what she came to mean to our community. But then also the struggles that she faced after winning

I like that.

And if Stephen can do it one of the greatest directors of all time, because he is, then I think everybody else can.

He's one of the greatest directors of all time. But you said you said no to him when he asked you two lines.

Well, the audition, I did, but that was simply because I had found out about this audition very very last minute. I was on Broadway at the time. I was playing down a summer, which was a very challenging role. For me, and leading a company takes a.

Lot out of you.

And I don't make a habit of going into a room with any one in it and being unprepared.

Do you no?

Like no?

But if I likes that's the difference.

If I walked into a room and Steven Spielberg was in the st Let's say I walked into the elevator in this building, and then it was Steven Spielberg, and then he.

Said, Trevor, I need you to read these lines. I just start reading the lines. I start reading them. I wouldn't be like, no, Steven Spielberg, I have and prepare.

I would just read you said you said no.

I said no because I wanted. I was like, this is I'm not prepared to show you a viable interpretation of this character. And I would rather do that than I'd rather give you something that's usable than give you something that's like, oh my god, thank you so much for coming in and next, like I wanted. If I was going to do it, it already took a lot of guts for me to walk into the room because I didn't actually believe that i'd ever be considered for

In a way.

I feel like you saying no to doing it incorrectly and wanting to do it your way and the best way possible. Is part of your character, like, that's that's who it is in West Side.

Story, it is that is who she is at her heart, And I think a lot of my character is like there are different bits of me within them, and that is the part of me that is Anita.

So before I let you go, I'd love to talk about one of the most just like amazing moments in film, and that is when a character who has created a moment in history comes back to the film. Obviously, I'm speaking about Rio Marino, who comes back in West Side Story playing a different role, but comes back as an executive producer, and then you're in a scene with her.

I wonder if that if that was a lot of pressure for you.

Was there any moment that you shared with her where you were like, Okay, this is my thing that I've sort of inherited.

From her, and I have the opportunity to turn it into what I want.

We spoke briefly at the beginning of the process, but she was very supportive. Thank God, she made me feel very comfortable and just encouraged me to bring everything that made me unique to the character and just gave me permission in her own energetic way to fly. And now the scene you're talking about is it's deep, heavy subject matter, and so I sort of shifted into just focusing on

Well, you know what you did it you looked more than comfortable. I mean, you're just sailing. And congratulations on the award, Congratulations on the nominations and everything that you're going to achieve.

Man, thank you for joining me on the show.

Thanks for having me, James caught in finally, finally, so happy to be here.

So I am beyond excited to have you here because like you have come in and genuinely changed in many ways the people perceive not just late night but television because I remember when you started on the.

Show, everyone was like, Oh, who's this guy?

He's starting at like twelve thirty seven at night, and what's this thing going to be? And overnight you took what was once considered a fringe time slot and turned it in to the biggest explosion thanks to your ideas, including carpool karaoke.

Have like like.

Has has that changed the way you see the medium as a whole?

I don't think so.

I think we always thought that's what we were we were going to do. When we were we were going to try to you know, we didn't know that we would it would happen. We had no idea that it would or could happen as quickly as it did. But our I mean essentially, my ego won't allow me to recognize that I'm making a show.

That airs at twelve thirty seven at night. Right.

If I think about that too long, I'll just really get depressed.

So we were like, well.

There's nothing we can do about that, so we can hang on. Wait the internet will use that, and so we only really think abo our show as not really being in a time stot. We think of it as well, it launches at that time and people can find it whenever they want to, whether that's years down the line days or the next morning on their journey to work, lunch break, whenever. It's the kind of wonderful thing about making shows like this right now, in this particular time.

Definitely, And here's the thing, it's not just about time. I think it's also about place. You know, your show was one of the first that really blew up on an international level the same way. Everywhere you went people were talking about Copple Karaoke to had the sense of what you know, a rap battle was, and the whole vibe had changed when you when you were making Copple Karaoke to a lot of people don't know this. You guys struggle to get people on that show.

Oh we couldn't get anybody. Yeah, we couldn't get.

Now everyone was like James, when am I coming on your show?

Kind of lovely? But we couldn't.

I mean, honestly, we I really, I really always believed in the idea. I always thought, oh, okay, this is a I think this is a good idea.

Yes, but there's it's quite an interesting game. Actually, you can play with the audience.

If everybody in the audience, if everybody, now just in your own mind, don't stay out loud, just and you do it, Travor, just think of a think of a recording artist, a living recording artist. Has everybody got one? They said, no, it's not a lie. It's true, absolutely truth.

But it's kind of it's crazy.

It really is amazing.

I mean it's gone from just being musicians to politicians. I mean, Michelle Obama has done it.

You know, Yeah, you've.

Been in a car.

I mean, everybody from looking look at this list, Paul McCartney, you know you you've had Tom Hanks on the show, You've had everyone.

It's become this thing that is larger than life.

The next step you don't realize you and the Pope in the popemobile. Oh man, and you just you can only sing the one songs.

I would love man do it. If he's watching and I think you.

And if he's not watching this, he'll be watching the Tony's on Sundays, so we're talk We're really good.

I would love nothing more than to do with that.

That's That's something that I've loved about your show is that it really is an expression of all of your talents, right, So a lot of people were surprised. I remember, like the first few times Carple Carrier, he really blew up. People were like, well, James Coringak can almost sing, and it's like, no, no, he can really sing, which has shock people because there's some artists who've come in and been like I'm gonna sing with this funny guy and

Your whole life.

Yeah, I mean, I'd never really hosted.

I used to host a show back in the UK, which which you came in actually, but that was my only real time hosting anything. But really, what I'd ever do is being plays or I would I would write, you know, sitcoms and things in the UK.

I never thought that I would.

It never even enter my brain in the same way that I don't think get into yours in any ways, A daily show in America it feels too far away.

It feels too far.

It's out of reach somehow, you know. And I think we both had that feeling when because we essentially got announced basically the same time, right, and then.

It was both who the hell are these guys? Yes, yes, I remember this.

And we both had to really deal with that. Yes, But yeah, I don't.

I would love to go back and act at some point and go and do a play again every time I come here to New York, and you know, I try and go to the theater as much as I can and go tonight and I miss it.

I miss it hugely.

But at the same time, I feel in no place where I want to stop this kind of glorious journey.

That I'm on at the minute. I love it. I love that.

I don't know what I've done to sort of deserve such memories, do you know what I mean?

That's how it feels every day. Really, that's beautiful.

But the Tony is like an expression of a wall that you've adored for a long time. This is your second time hosting. Yeah, what's impressive is that you're doing the Tonys and you've done the Grammys. It feels like you have more fun at the Tonies. The Grammys are fun, but it feels like you have more fun at the Tones.

Oh what makes them special?

Well, everybody wants to be there.

That's that's the first real big difference between the Grammys and the Tony because everybody wants.

To be there, and they're thrilled that they're all doing this. No one's going I didn't win, what, you know.

So it's a very very supportive community, that entire community of Broadway. They are These are a load of people who have squeezed into twelve blocks, yes, back to back theaters, and they know each other and they're friends. And these are people who eight times a week like, look, you think you work hard, I think I work hard.

But like when you're doing a play or.

A musical eight times a week with one day off, that is absolute graft. And the reason I want to host the Tonys, and the reason I want to really try and make it the best show I can is I believe that per square meter, there is no room on earth that holds as many talented people as that room does. And it's a show where and I think you just want to celebrate these people who are so gifted, they are so talented that they put on a show

I mean it's terrifying. I've had real moments this week.

Where I thought, oh, I should have just left it the one I did with Hamilton and that was a real success.

You know, I should have just gone out there.

But I really hope we're going to do it, only going to stop at nothing to make it a celebration of a group of people that I think at the absolute minimum deserve to be celebrated on television at least one second.

I'll tell you this, I've never seen James Cordon not do something at one hundred and ten percent.

So it's going to rock Man.

We'll see the hotel. So thanks.

My guest tonight is Pula Surprise winning playwrights Michael R.

Jackson.

He's here to talk about his smash hit new musical, A Strange Loop, which is currently nominated for eleven Tony Awards.

Please welcome Michael R. Jackson.

Welcome to the show.

Mister Michael R. Jackson.

Thank you for having me.

Before we get into the show that you have created that is getting everybody buzzing, Let's talk about the name.

Let's talk about it.

How many people do you disappoint when.

You show up?

I mean, like not now obviously maybe now it's more like as a part, but like Michael R. Jackson, people just see Michael Jackson.

I don't know.

I think like I always get people to perk up a little bit when I want to hear, like my name precedes me.

You just show mister mister Jackson. And then the was the R always was always there.

I'm assuming I kind of dropped it in there. Distinction. Well, that's on Facebook. I'm the living Michael Jackson.

I like that.

It's the only other person who I think has is Michael B.

Jordan.

That's right, right, Why he interned all my children. I interned all my children when he was like a kid working there. It's really weird.

There's a connection. Look at it.

All the famous names people going on to create their own famous things, and that's exactly what you've done. A strangely congratulations eleven Tony Award nominations and.

Hive.

I had the pleasure of seeing this production and I can't even explain it to people, but you know what I love about it is it makes me seem cool when I recommend it. You know, no, no, no, because you know, in this world there's not many things you can recommend to people that'll have them leaving feeling like you're so cool because you told them to go. Everyone I tell to see this goes and sees it, and then they're like, Trevor, oh, thank you.

So I'm like, yeah, that's what I do.

Did you know when you finished creating this show, did you know that it was going to be the hit that it is.

Not even close like it was like not on my vision board even a little bit. So it was really exciting.

But you took twenty years to write it.

Yeah, all most Yeah, that's wild.

George R. R. Martin would be like, yeah, I know, that's like it's.

Like a I would love to know that, like where this idea came from, because I don't want to give anything away for the audience, because part of the joy of this show is that you won't really know what it's about and you'll just be in a story.

But what we can tell people is it is a.

Story of a gay black man who is in the world of theater and he's in the world of being black and in the world of being gay. But it comeing too and every gay black fat Yes, and you talk about that.

In the show.

Yeah.

One of the funniest shows I've ever seen. One of the most poignant shows I've ever seen. People crying, people laughing like that. I see why I took twenty years.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it just started off. You know, I was about twenty three years old. I'm forty one now, and I had just graduated from undergrad playwriting NYU. I didn't know what I was going to do with the BFA degree. I was living in this old lady's bungalow style house in the middle of nowhere Jamaica, Queens, which if you live in New York, that's like all the way to the end of the year or the f train and then you take a bus that's like ten

I didn't know that it was. It was true that you worked at as an usher at The Lion King.

Yeah, I worked at when The Lion King used to be at the new Ancesterdam Theater, and I worked there for five years. I did like four years of Lion King and a year of Mary Poppins, and then I did a couple of years later a seasonal sin of The Laddin. So I ran through the whole Disney pantheon.

Was there anything that was there anything that you saw where you were like, I don't ever want to see this again in the Broadway show, so I'm going to create something differently. Or was this something you show that inspired you that made you want to create the show the way you did?

What was kind of both? It was a strange loop.

Ooh, I like what you're okay?

Okay? Yeah, Like you know, you're standing in the back of the theater, you're ringing the bells, you're watching audience a night after night after night, show after show, you get a little bored. And but luckily, you know, I was there with my thoughts and just sort of thinking

Think you have taken away from this? You know, I saw so many people in the audience who were touched for different reasons. You know, if people grew up in a religious family, I saw them connecting with the show in a different way. If people you know, had had issues with their identity growing up, maybe they were bullied, maybe they struggling today, it doesn't matter what it was. You're looking for work in America, you know, you're just trying to get by, You're trying to find friends, love.

It was beautiful.

But then I wondered what you got by creating this, Like for yourself, did it change anything in your world?

I mean, I guess for me, the best part of the show has been actually talking to people after when, like when it lets out, because what I've been finding is that for some people people the show is a mirror and for other people the show is a window, and that seeing people there together experiencing the same thing but through those two different lenses has been creates a really powerful energy that sort of goes up onto the state, goes to the actors on stage, and they send it

You, you had a great I forget that was the phrase you called it.

You said it was like a it was a big gay.

Big black and queer ass American Broadway show.

I love that. Yeah, I love that.

You know, you know what I loved about that? Yeah it was.

But what you just said, I've seen some shows where, you know, if an audience is less a from New York, they really get the show. If they're not from New York, maybe they don't enjoy it as much, or if the audience is black, maybe they get it more or less. This was one of those shows where everyone was enjoying it from from a different.

There's a lot of different reference points sort of in it, because that's kind of what it's like to be a person. You're made up of all of your reference points, your history, your different memories, everything. And so the main character, Usher that's his name, he loves a lot of different things

I don't think anybody's sticking it out. I will tell you no, no, genuinely, no.

There's some difficult moments for some people.

But you know what that's I think that's what made it so amazing is it's not difficult for the sake of being difficult.

It's difficult, it's not it's not gratuitous, it's.

Not at all.

And I've seen shows where audiences go, I'm uncomfortable, but here it was people experiencing the discomfort that somebody else may be living through.

Yeah, because that's what the character and I am trying to do. It's we're trying to get the audience to feel what it's like to walk in the skin that they may not be, either that they don't feel familiar with, or that they feel familiar with but feel unseen, unheard, or misunderstood.

It's phenomenal.

It's one of the funniest most intelligent, just everything.

This is that you put.

I hope you in every single Tony Award that you're nominated for.

Congratulation. Everyone needs to go watch the show. Thank you for being here.

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