Black Women Own Guns Too and Finding New Lanes for Women Comics | Guest Spotlight

You're listening to Comedy Central. Welcome back to the Daily Show.

My guest tonight is a best selling author, publisher, and a professor whose new ebook is called Stand Your Ground, a Black feminist reckoning with America's gun problem. Please welcome Rock Sane Gay.

Wow. All right, what made you want to write this piece about guns? A lot of different things.

But my brother was a big gun owner, very enthusiastic about guns, which was weird because nobody in my family cares about guns. And we were like, oh, where did this come from? Yeah, and he kept trying to get my other brother and I to buy a gun, and we were like, uh no, we're good. And finally he broke us all down, and so I got my first gun.

Other than the.

Obvious, Well, why are black women buying guns?

Black women, I think, are buying guns simply because we often recognize that if we don't protect ourselves, no one else will.

A lot of.

Times it's that we don't trust that the police will come to our homes and protect us. And in fact, Sonya Massey's murder recently bears that out among many others. And so I think it's not a form of empowerment, which I think is overused and cheesy, but it is a form of protection and recognizing that sometimes you have to take your own defense in your own hands.

There's something beautiful about a bunch of white male forefathers two hundred and sixty years ago not envisioning black and brown people at the shooting range?

Know, was it beautiful?

Was that?

I mean, I think that there's a lot to be said about the founders and their lack of vision. I mean people always talk about no, I mean, how.

Much vision they have.

You mentioned it in the essay that the Second Amendment wasn't written for black people.

It wasn't written for black people, it wasn't written for women. They saw us as only three fifths of a person. So I guess we could only use three fifths of a musket. But now you know, if the Second Amendment applies to white men, it applies to all of us.

And I you know, do you?

I mean, what's fun about this essay is it's not you writing about people that own guns.

You bought a gun, I did.

Back to your first gun, the Barretta was a little too big. Then you bought a different gues.

So big, kind of like the pull vaulter, What can you do?

What's it like buying a gun?

I know that you know half the country's going to hear that question and laugh and go like do you not? But there's a lot of people that don't. I have no idea even know how to buy a gun.

What was it like buying a gun for you?

Well, I live in California most of the time, and so it's a kind of a pain.

But it should be like it should be to buy a gun. To buy a gun, it's also process.

You have to take a little test, which is fine. It's like the driver's exam. You study the booklet in.

Your car beforehand, and.

You fill out an application, you get a background check, and then ten days after you do all of that, you can pick up the gun, which I think is great. Take us some time, really think through like do I really need this or am I angry?

I mean, a gun destroys things.

It does, it takes people's lives, It causes grievous injuries. You know, we talk a lot about the people who die from gun violence, but there are people whose lives are irrevocable, irrevocably changed because of really bad injury, the loss of limbs, the loss of organs, and so you really have to think very carefully about why you would welcome a weapon like this into your home. But we don't have children. If we had children, it would be a complete nonstarter.

Well, how did you, And maybe I'm asking selfishly, how did you? Or was it hard to convince your wife to have a gun in the house?

No surprising, but but that's another consideration.

Consideration. If she said no, the answer would be no. But she's a lifelong New Yorker, so she's.

Not afraid of a good fight. And she's like, why I need a gun when I'm in New York, I'll do all. She doesn't need a gun at all.

She doesn't even need her fists. She has a very capable mouth.

What what what? I'm just going to leave that there. What has.

What did you learn that maybe you weren't expecting about America's gun epidemic this process?

I learned so much and I think everyone, I mean, we read the statistics every single time there is a horrific crime, and nothing ever changes.

But there are more guns than.

People in this country nuts, which cannot possibly be the case, but yet it is. And only about thirty five percent of Americans own guns, which is to say that the people who own guns really really love their guns, and they own a whole lot of them. And that really surprised me, because when you listen to the NRA and other lobbyists talk about gun ownership, they really make it seem like everyone's kind of like walking around with a gun in their purse or in the back of their genes.

One thing that really resonated with me in the essay was when you went to the shooting range and you almost you were mentioning the shooting instructor Raoul. I'm not how obsessed he was with safety, Yes, and I loved hearing that.

Oh yeah, and I think so hardcore.

But I mean, this is this side of gun ownership, isn't always told a lot of responsible gun owners are obsessed with safety.

Share a little bit of that experience with you.

For sure. When you hear about gun violence in general, it's irresponsible gun owners. It's people who don't know how to handle it properly. But before we even went to the range, we took some classes because we're nerds, and we sat in an actual classroom and he was like, here are the four rules of gun safety.

Write it down, which I did.

And it was really heartening to see that there is a responsible way to go about this, that you don't have to be casual, you don't have to be careless, and you can protect not only yourselves but the people in your household and also your community by being responsible and also you know, locking up your guns.

Do you feel safer wanting a gun?

No, not really, but that's because I know what happens to eagal gun ownership for black people when the police are involved. So well, not necessarily, but I do feel like I get a lot of death threats.

That's what precipitated.

Yeah, that's what I want. I mean, what you know, I have friends that say they own guns for defense of their home, and I kind of laugh because you live on ten acres, you don't even have a neighbor. But when you were describing in the book that you get true death threats and people threatening your wife, that's different.

Now it's different, and it starts to get closer and closer to home. And as the threats became more and more specific, particularly during COVID, I just thought, man, am I going to sit around and wait for something to happen or not?

But the thing that makes me feel.

Most safe is we also got a dog during COVID, and he weighs nine pounds.

Yeah, and thinks he weighs ninety.

And he lets us know when someone's even thinking about the house. And so that's actually what makes me feel safe. Like, I don't know if I can stop something, but Max, our dog, Maximus Toretto Blueberry, he's absolutely going.

To let us know.

I mean, in some states there's more regulations about dog adoption than getting a gun.

Yes, right, And in some states women have more rights as gun owners than they do as women or people with uteruses.

You know, you wrote that black gun ownership is definitely a political act. White gun ownership is generally taken as an inalienable right.

Explain that to me. Absolutely.

We tend to look at the Bill of Rights almost of the Ten Commandments.

I mean, you know they're getting close from cloths.

Yeah, and you know we treat those Bill of Rights as inalienable. But the further you get from a white, heterosexual, cisgender man, the more you have to fight for those rights, and the more you are considered sort of an anomaly when you choose to avail yourself of those rights. And I'm not the kind of person who's going to wrap myself in the Second Amendment. I think that no one should be able to own a gun, and if they want to come.

Take it, like, feel free.

But that said, as long as the right is there, I think there are many black gun owners who say why not. And some people are shooting enthusiasts. Some people are concerned with self defense and home protection, and there's.

Room for all of that. We contain multitudes.

I love in your essay you reminded all of us that the Second Amendment is twenty seven words.

It is.

It is shocking given how often people talk about it.

I mean it's kind of like, hey, guys, we need a little more clarity.

You would think, would we feel like a little more specific. But also in seventeen eighty seven, when they were writing those twenty seven words, it must get took a long time to load, and it only shot one bullet at a time. I don't think that the founding fathers could have begun to imagine what that gun would become. And the fact that we decided collectively that we were okay with not regulating weapons of mass destruction is something that astonishes me every single day.

Let's talk about stand your ground, and you know, you dive into it in the essay. It feels kind of actually when you start to think, oh, we actually put a law on the books that you're allowed to kill somebody. Should it you know, should it be more inclusive? Should it be taken off the books? I mean, what is a thought you have on standard ground?

I think it should be more specific, and I think that if it applies to one person, it should apply to everyone. Like George Zimmerman used stan your ground as his excuse for killing Trayvon Martin, but Marissa Alexander also used stan your ground. She was a legal gun owner who shot in the air away from her former partner who was menacing her, against whom she had a restraining order, and she spent five years in jail and house under.

House arrest because of that.

And so when black people try to stand their ground in general, it is used against them, and so that's really what we have to change. But I also don't think we should be given carte blanche to take other people's lives.

You think you painted well. You shared a lot of examples that I was unfamiliar with, and it's a great read.

Kamala Harris, how are you feeling?

I'm feeling great as a as as.

A black woman, as a feminist, as a gun owner.

I don't know if that pertains. It actually doesn't pertain.

However, I think that I wasn't really advocating for Biden to step down, but I was excited when he did. I think that Vice President Harris is going to be a very interesting president.

I think we have an opportunity.

For so long we've been told we have to wait till twenty twenty four, four, twenty thirty two to twenty forty. Who knows for real political change. And even in the run up to Harris becoming the nominee, people were saying that she's not a viable candidate, what about Gavin Newsome, right about Gretchen Whitmer, And so I think it is a real interesting moment to consider who is Kamala Harris and what kind of president would she be? And we

For a president. And look at the alternative. Thank you for talking with us.

Safety.

The original ebook and audio book Stranger Drab is available only.

On evand Roxanne Gay.

My guest tonight is a stand up comedian whose Netflix special is called We Ride at Dawn.

Please welcome, Hannah Burner. I mean, look at this is amazing. This is your so daily show.

I tried to match the energy.

Yeah, that's great, that's great. Congrats on your special. It's doing great. It's very funny. I feel like bachelorettes. It's unfair to compare them to cults, because cults give you the sweet escape of death.

I mean, I'm well versed in a lot of cults, their sister wives. Sometimes it's just running around naked. It depends on the cult, Michael. Some are better than others, and I would fall for one. I am one of those people fall for a cult.

It's always a very compelling person. It seems to be good at sales. I mean, so naturally you're comedian. But was this drawn from some bachelorette experience. There had to be some people that mad about this joke.

I hate to call myself out, but it was my bachelorte. The audience made me feel really bad about that. No, but I kind of felt this weird sense of power, like everyone was like, look, making sure I was okay, and I was like, with the in the wrong hands, this could go real wrong.

So I think I was able to be good.

But it's just look, there's already a wage gap and we're paying all this money for bachelorette. Honestly, I feel like the man came up with the bacherette idea.

Okay, I remember when people were like Michael, are you doing a bachelor party? And I'm like, I'm a stand up comic who's on the road.

Everything, it's all a bachelor party. It's all about you. You hit the road, you are stand up comic. You've got a lot going on.

But let's talk about being a woman in comedy because it seems like a tough path.

Do you want to become one?

I've become a woman in comedy.

In a serious sense. You gotta have some thick skin to do this.

Yes, yeah, I do think that people wonder why there's not more women in comedy, But starting off and seeing that you have to go to these bars late at night so many hilarious women are like, maybe there's other things I could do because this is kind of annoying. I do think that like having TikTok and having other avenues has helped me kind of be able to work on my material a lot without having to deal with drunk people in bars too much.

Or what about just the dudes in the green room judging all the time. And I say that as one of those dudes, but there is a male you.

Want to tell them what happened?

What did what happened? What happened.

Well, you brought your dog Walter to the green room once shit, and I was trying to have like a safe, calm energy before my show, and Walter just growled at me. And I'm already dealing with all the comics. Give me weird energy. This dog doesn't like me. Yeah, and I thought dogs could read good character.

Yeah, well maybe he can.

So Walter is a dick, my dog, and you should follow Daily Show Dogs.

There's a lot of pictures of him on there.

But you know, if you had him for the weekend, he would he would snuggle up with you. I appreciate although I noticed on your special and the end, the very end, I watched it all the way through to the end.

You thank some people, one of which is your cat.

Yes, Butters, Butter, Butter saved my life.

Tell me how? Tell me how my therapy.

Cat, which is perfect because it says it says on here, how did your cat save your life?

It doesn't say that. I've never heard that before. How did that happen? You know?

I'm on the board of Childless Cat Ladies And.

Am I trying to run for something right now? What am I doing?

No?

But I do feel like there's moments where a cat just being there for you, not judging you for all of your mistakes and regrets. She just loves you for you. And that was important in some hard times in my life. Yeah, because you know, comedy is a coping mechanism. I think having a really cute animal is also a coping mechanism.

This whole business is people saying no to you. But when I come home, my dog says yes to me. And that that sounds like very sexual.

What I just said, I don't didn't mean it to sound away.

Your special is not.

It's keep going, Keep going, Michael, keep going.

Don't talk about your dog after bad self.

All comics should have a pet that loves them no matter what, because the audience doesn't.

Always love you. No, it's true your special.

I'm a man and you say, you say at some point in your special like there's not there's not a lot of men here.

You point you single out a guy.

Yeah yeah, And I'm like, oh, I'm sure he loved that, but was ill as a man?

Was I allowed to consume and work? I love that.

I feel like it's kind of like you know what the reality TV shows, the guys who are like, I'm not into this stuff. Yeah, but then like half an hour in you see him in the kitchen, just like, why did she say that to her?

Why did she say that to So?

I feel like this is a great special to watch with your guy, and I feel like it's kind of the female locker room, like they hear things or or girls are like, see, I'm not the only one.

Yeah, who like during.

A can I say queef? Anyway? I feel like I like kind of just speaking out as a child community and making guys kind of understand us a little more, and like, we like this comedy from a male perspective, and I think it's great to have the female perspective too.

I agree, And it's.

Yeah, the The Daily Show has been on air for twenty nine years, no one has ever said quef behind this dops.

I was trying not to and it just came out. But which.

That's in contradiction to a you said in the special, because in the special you said, I've never queened by myself.

You skinny dick queathed me.

Yes, yes, I don't know if I use the term skinny dick. You just said that, Oh shit, I said you. But I do think a lot of girls have been gaslet to believe like they have a problem. I fake beef and it's like he queafed you. And I got a lot of messages. I got a lot of messages from women being like it happened tonight, and I felt no shame. And if that's what I bring to the world, that's what I brought.

I mean, that's like a I mean, this audience apparently does a lot of queafing crowd. Speaking of queefs, I was gonna say that we've played tennis together. We have, but that doesn't have to do with kleeving. But grunting is a sound that our bodies make different location.

And grunting is just like laughing, which I love to do.

And we might edit a lot of that out. Yeah, but people don't know that.

But when I first started comedy, we hit tennis balls together and I remember being like, Wow, this is a guy who played tennis who's a successful comedian. Maybe there's a chance that I could, you know, do well in this business.

Look look where we are now. It's pretty cool. Yeah.

I like how you're saying we The reason Walter growled at you is you saw the trajectory of your career. He was like, stop her now, No, I mean you played at University of Wisconsin, Matass go Badgers.

I mean, what is this? What is this evoke? What does that evoke for you? I'm upset? Oh the way that's her. We didn't just pull like.

No, you know I was in it, you know, waking up at six am waits tennis.

Yeah, look at that.

I yeah, you know, I worked my butt off and I do think that there was a moment when I didn't go pro where I was like, this was all for nothing. I'm glad I wasted fifteen years of my life. Yeah, and I really now looking back, realize how tennis did prepare army for a lot of the adversity that I've dealt with with comedy, and how with comedy you're never like a real loser, unless you like tell yourself you're a loser.

Because I could, I could be like they liked it.

They were laughing with their nose like they were tennis.

It's like you lost, you suck.

So I've been much kinder to myself with comedy than I was with tennis. And I think, you know, dealing with pressure has been easier compared to like some of the things I dealt with with tennis.

Why is the junior tennis world excuse, that's a very We're just gonna talk abou junior tennis.

But this is very neat.

It is you're so true about being kinder to ourselves, and I think it's something we all can do all the time, positive self talk. And I and as junior tennis player, heard you should be positive with yourself, but it wasn't happening.

No, is this is junior tent I mean, is it traumatic? Is it good? You said it prepared you? Yeah?

Because I'll joke with my dad, I'm like, I think you were too tough on me. He's like, well you turned out okay, So I think I did good. Controversial, No, but I do think it's.

A joke about was good and get my sense of humour from him.

But I do think when we were growing up, I mean, you're a little older than me, but when we were growing up, we didn't have we weren't people weren't aware of like the mental health as much, and we knew that it was supposed to be hard and it was just whoever can push there themselves harder. And I didn't realize that you could have fun and be a winner. And I think with comedy I've learned like you can laugh, have fun and also succeed in ways. And I think it's a cheat code to decide not to be mean

I love that. That's excellent and that's great. What are your jobs? Your jobs? Fine? Joy? Drugs? Do you still follow tennis? Still follow? It's crazy.

I'm like newly back obsessed with tennis. I watch tennis all day. I'm training again, but like you're training, it's almost like therapeutic in my own way, Like I take a lot of breaks.

Yeah, that's okay. Who of the pro players out there?

Men are women?

Who are you like, can't take your eyes off of? Or who's resonating with.

Hannah Shout out to some young Americans. Emma Navarro had a great season. Yea famely talented Jesse Pegoula, Cocoa Goff, Ben Shelton.

What is it that you look for in a pro What is it that you look for?

Like?

I like fashion, and then I like I like backhand. I really want to play it as a badass backhand, right.

I like a player who's fearless. I like a player who goes for things and does things that I never had correct to do on my own.

I love that.

I want to see people, well, yeah, who seem like they have no fear, even though I know they're all scared. It's cool to see like they're not human.

I love watching Ben Shelton.

Ben Shelton all hit like one hundred and fifty minis hour second serve, and the way I used to it second serves is like this, please.

Get me, please get please please please go please go in.

Yes, I mean I think it's Tennis is such a mental battle. So I love seeing people overcome their nerves and fears, and I also kind of love to see when they are human, like when Sabalanca lost her serve. That was so human of her, and then she won a major after that. So I love seeing people deal with adversity, and I love comebacks. I love revenge. Honestly, sports is the best reality TV.

Let's talk about last thing you mentioned it revenge.

Yeah, revenge, It's just sillient.

You're okay, that's that's That's all I need to know. No, But I mean, one of the things that endears, one of the things that I really love about.

You is your work ethic.

I mean, before the show, I see you doing Man on the Street in the New York.

Afterwards you're always.

Like your Oh, you got your podcast, you got your TikTok, You're crushing it.

What is driving this? Is it some kind of revenge?

I would say that's a glamorous I would love to blame revenge, but like I'm running from my thoughts. When I'm sitting alone for an hour, I start to be like, who is going to die? And I or I just I love working. It makes me feel fulfilled. I love creating. But I also think revenge like there's always going to be people don't believe in you or people who try to take you down. And I think as a tennis player,

I love It, Hannah Burner. We ride it down the streaming our Netflix.

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