Hey, there. So glad you hopped on the Collide podcast. This is Willow Weston, and I love learning with you and growing and letting Jesus run into our lives together. Man, our lives are messy, and they're joyous and they're beautiful, and they're broken, and they're hard, and they're good, and they're all the things, and we need each other. And so today, I love that I could have a conversation with Jenny Labrie. She's a writer, a speaker, a coach, and a podcast host.
Lots of the things, but she has a real heart to help women re dream again, to really enter into the sacred space with God, to break out of the daily grind and listen to what he has for them so that they don't just survive, but they actually thrive. So my hope in handing you this interview today is in all the ways that you feel like you are just rocking that survival life, that this gives you some encouragement. So check it out, Jenny. I love that we get to have this conversation today.
You're coming in from Chicago. You have three kids, and I love that you say your hometown's in the Chicago burbs and that we can find you and your kids sipping root beer on your front porch on a good day. So is today, like, a good weather day there, or what you got going? We got some clouds today, but the sun has peaked through a little bit. And actually, last night, we had some. Some rain, and I got to see a rainbow for the first time in months. It was beautiful and so worth it.
I love that you love that, because I'm in the Pacific Northwest, and someone just actually told me, and I don't know if it's true, but I live in a town called Bellingham, Washington, and someone said there's a list of the top 100 rainiest places in the nation, and Bellingham was number one. Oh, goodness. Yeah. The rainbows just mean the rain is coming to an end for a few minutes, which is awesome. That's hilarious. Well, I love that you guys drink root beer. That's cute. I love it.
It's one of my favorites. That, and I didn't put this one on there, but I love pickles, too, and that's not a great combo, but that's my eclectic taste for you. Yeah. Pickles. My mom's favorite snack when I was growing up was pickles and mayonnaise and peanut butter sandwiches. Wow. And I never have tried it. I'm frightened by the idea. It is unconventional, for sure. Yes. Yes. Well, you do so many things. You're a Writer, a speaker, a coach. You co found an LLC called Grounded Learning.
There's so many things that you're up to. I want to just talk about this passion you have for women who feel stuck in the daily grind. Why is that a passion of yours? Oh, goodness. I could go way back to. Well, my roots are in education. I actually spent 13 years in a Spanish high school classroom. Before that, I was traveling abroad and learning a language. And so personal growth has always been a part of just who I am and why I love working with that age group.
But what really turned me into where I find myself in this part of the journey is when I started coaching. And it was in the industry of education and coaching our educators and our teachers, and they are by and large one of the most hardworking, but also burned out professionals. And I work with them on the daily.
And so just seeing the challenges that have arisen, especially at the hands of COVID you know, it's been five years, and I was in the heart of professional learning, growth and coaching when all of that was going down. And so that's where I find myself shifting in the needs of not just professional growth, but personal growth. And I think there's been a real point of attention on what does that mean? What does that mean? And how do I do that and how do I grow? How do I upskill?
What are all these terms and why? And so that's really where I got my roots and started, but have been leaning into the whispers and the nudges from God to think beyond the public education space. When you think about women who are stuck in the daily grind, what can that look like? Because, I mean, obviously the daily grind means we're all still alive. Like, we're here, we're doing the thing. That's not something we necessarily are looking to escape right away, most of us.
But what is being stuck in it look like versus unstuck? Well, you know, if that's the million dollar question, and I'm still in a journey of trying to find that. I've been toying around with, you know, podcaster and coach and speaker and all of these terms, but really what it boils down to is the essence of being a word wielder and a dream defender. And I find more now than ever, it's hard for people to. To find what dreaming looks like. And how do we dare to have the courage to dream again.
And being stuck in that really, that pattern, it's hard to want to dream for fun, to dream for growth, to dream for longings. Unfulfilled and so that unstuck. How do we get unstuck? And I really think that there is something in our longings and in our dreaming. But a lot of times that's scary or we don't. We think it's frivolous or we don't know how to do it.
And so what the stuck looks like is in these loops, in these patterns of consistent mundane moments that are maybe beckoning us into more and we don't really know what to do with them. I want to talk more with you about dreams. You talk a lot about dormant dreams. How would a woman know if she has a dormant dream? Oh, how would you know you have a dormant dream? There's usually some. There's something there tapping on your heart. There's something there that keeps.
Whether it's an audible word, whether that's a feeling within your gut, whether that is a whisper from the Lord, whether that is something reoccurring that you're noticing over and over and over again. There's usually some kind of underlying more. And that's hard to sometimes uncover by yourself. And that's where coaching has come to play, where I've learned and been coached myself a whole bunch through trying to find what that looks like. Not doing that alone.
I so resonate with that because I think back and this is a long time ago because my kids are like 19 and 22 now. But when they were little, when I got pregnant with my first I. I left my ministry job to be a stay at home mom. And that was a choice I wanted to make. And I'm super glad for our family. It was a great choice. Loved it. But I missed. There was a part of me by about like year six where. And I did it for eight years.
My husband looked at me and he's like, it feels like there's a part of you that's dying inside. Like he saw in me this dormant dream that I had to be a messenger, preach to speak to write to do. All the things that I had been doing that I set aside and I chose to set aside to invest in my kiddos. But there was a piece of me that. It was almost like I couldn't be content by just putting those gifts in a closet and closing the door and letting them just kind of like get stale in there.
And I'm sure there was a piece where the Lord was okay with me setting those aside for a time. But after a while it started to sort of eat at me. Yeah. And I think that's what Happens. That thing you're talking about where there's like a nagging feeling, there's something there where you feel like I'm not fully, I'm not fully doing what I'm made or called to do. Have you had a moment like that in your own life? Oh, absolutely.
And in touching, in that dormancy piece that you're talking about, like right when you are, whether you're sleepwalking or you're not sleeping well, there's this like in between, between you're conscious, semi conscious, and you're kind of asleep and that the Holy Spirit wants to awaken something in you. And sometimes it's like, how do I find that? How do I get there? Right. For me, that has been for me the sacred commute.
I would say that I was living Jesus adjacent rather than a Jesus immersed lifestyle. And that was because I was running from task to task. And sometimes we say dormant, like maybe we're sleeping, but really sometimes we're just numbing or we're just so overstimulated and we're so busy that it's really hard to hear that still quiet voice of the Lord. And in my sacred commute, time that took years of me like actually noticing patterns of like I'm not just commuting.
Maybe there's something more to this liminal space that I'm having. But it took a lot of self awareness and time to get myself there. And at times I don't even know if I really recognized that it was the Lord saying, there's more, Jenny, or whispering, there's more. And so that really took its toll on me in the. I used to drive two hours a day making all my rounds. And so that was where I had time. That's where I had time other than everything else that was distracting me and numbing me.
Right before we talk about this idea that you brought up about the sacred commute, I want to talk to you a little bit more about this phrase you used to Jesus adjacent. Define for people who are listening who don't necessarily know what that term means. What's Jesus adjacent and what are we invited to be sure. I think it's just a term I've been playing around with. Like I said a word wielder. I like to play with words.
And really that term has come to describe where my upbringing was Christian and I was actually raised Methodist first and then I marri into a Lutheran denomination. And you know, there's a background of Christianity in my story, but I went decades with hearing and knowing Jesus. But not really having a relationship with him. So he was like kind of adjacent. He was like on the side.
And it wasn't until I was beckoned into something more with him, into that relationship where I understood what it meant. And it wasn't as scary or overwhelming or light or it wasn't as scary or overwhelming as what maybe you would think being immersed in something is. And who better or what better to be immersed in than Jesus, right? It's funny, as you're talking, I'm thinking about Jesus in the New Testament, in the Gospels. And you see him and he shows up to places we talk about.
Jesus collides. Like he runs into the places we are, whether it was at the synagogue or the market or alongside a lake or at a wedding. And he shows up there and it's very interesting because he often had this invitation that he asked so many of us, which is come and follow me.
I mean, I don't know if that's Jesus adjacent, but I would think it's more of an immersive experience of like, hey, I'm actually going to ask you to leave your boat, leave your people, leave your dad, leave your 401k, leave your career, like, leave the whole thing. It's flipping scary. And I'm going to ask you to go with me where I go and do what I do and be up to what I'm up to. That's a full fledged immersion.
Versus, hey, come back to me next week at this market, Come back to me next week at the synagogue. Come back to me next week when there's a different wedding. I'm just picturing as you're talking. There's a different mentality between I'm going to come back and run into Jesus in this one place that I know he sometimes shows up versus I'm going to immerse my entire life and follow him. And so it sounds like that's when your dream started to come alive, when you started to get immersed in Jesus.
What did that look like for you? You had this commute. Talk to us about the sacred commute and how this God who collides showed up in the middle of that. Yeah, the sacred commute is something that I was going through as most things. Anytime we go through the valley, when we're in a valley or we're in the wilderness, we're struggling. And this happened to be commuting to my job during the heart of the pandemic and really considering my mortality.
And like, man, I'm showing up for something and I've Got to really think about who I am and what I'm about and why I'm doing what I'm doing. And. And so when I was in the midst of that, I started, although it was terrifying at the time, I started journaling a whole bunch more. I really. Part of my writing story was a lot in my childhood and early years. And I've always written a lot academically because of my job.
But I put away whether it was creative writing or journaling, and I ended up taking that out again at another beckoning or nudging of the Lord. And I started to notice patterns when I was journaling more. What are these patterns? Because it typically happened after I got home from the drive. And that's where I started finding and seeing the patterns of the shifts he was doing within me or practices that just seemed like they were coming from. Like, where were they coming from?
And the commute turned into an acronym. And each of those letters meaning something more than just commuting in a car. But really, what does that look like when you're on a loop and you know, we have this, we hear about the journey of life, right? Life is a journey, not a destination. And when I hear that, I ask the question, if it's a journey, how do I journey? Well, and you know what? The modern journey doesn't really look like an epic quest.
It actually looks more like a mundane loop back and forth. Whether that is in your car or it's from your bedroom to the kitchen in the morning and back, whether that is running errands. And if we are always darting between these tasks, how do we actually meet with Jesus? How do we actually develop a relationship with him? Because it's really hard. Especially, you know, I'm a full time working mom, commuting two hours a day with three kids. How do I actually immerse myself in Jesus?
And so the commute practices started to be things that I could do on the go or in the grind. And that he started shifting things within me because it was something that I was able to do in this modern type of journeying through life. And that's the essence of what those are. I love that. Do you share the acronym or is this super secret? No, absolutely not. It's like, how deep do you want to go into it? I want to hear what that I can't hear. It's an acronym and not know what it stands for.
You gotta give it to us. We got it. And you know what? Each of those letters of the acronym has something so universal. And then there are practices that go with each three practices to each of those letters. If you really want to get into it, I'll go through the acronym and then you tell me when we move on to the next thing. But the acronym itself is that C is calm. How do we find calm in the storm? How do we find it while we're on the go and grinding through the life that we're living?
There's a way to do that. He shows us how to do that. Even in this modern landscape we find ourselves. And then there's O. O is others. And this is one that I was not good at. This is one. I am an introvert at heart. This is one where I would rather, in this individualistic society we have grown, been raised in, I'd rather just figure it out and be on my own. But really, how do we bring others into, whether it's our mess or whether it is on the go? How do we do that?
And there are two M's. There's the music angle, right? And that music angle. The benefits of worship and praise. But there was so much I had to learn about music. And so that could be a part of your sacred commute. And the second M. This is my wheelhouse. This is where I feel at home, where the. Oh, I didn't. And that's media and learning, Right? Media. In terms of learning. And how do we leverage what is at our fingertips?
Now, for many years, I was an instructional technology coach for educators. And how do we leverage media, debunking it as being something that's problematic or that's causing issues within our society. And how do we actually leverage it as faithful humans in the ways that, like, the Lord has taught me so much in just five years because of what I've been able to do with leveraging media in different ways. And then finally, the last three are my favorite.
And these are the ones that, again, are just. They're so overarching, but with. With the practices tethered to them, they're pretty fun and cool. And the first one is unity. And who are we unifying ourselves with? T is truth, right? And with that truth, we know who our truth is and when we put our trust in that truth. And then finally, my favorite, and actually it's kind of a curveball, is echo.
But when you think of an echo and the ripple effect that it has, what is God doing in your life in this commute? Or what is he doing on this journey that you're doing, this modern journey? And how is he. How is he encouraging you to echo that transformation into your life and into the lives of others. If you're feeling disconnected from your faith and longing to experience God's presence in fresh and meaningful ways, ways we have just the thing for you.
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Or what is he doing on this journey that you're doing, this modern journey? And how is he, how is he encouraging you to echo that transformation into your life and into the lives of others? So are these basically rhythms or habits that you're encouraging us to have every day in the daily grind, all day? Such a good question. And that's what I also and just thinking of the natural educator teacher in me is that like you want them to be useful and you don't want to box people in.
The more you box yourself in, the harder it is for you to integrate what you're trying to do or for it to be something that really works for you. And so the way the whole concept of designing that has been that you can pick and choose what works. There are some days when I'm really not going to be connecting with others. Like I really need some silence. And silence comes as one of those practices in calm.
And that was a lesson, for example, that when I thought about it, I hadn't actually sat in silence for even a three minute span in years. And all of a sudden it was like you start to learn like when you're walking in step with the Holy Spirit of like you start to sense what he's telling you when you've made those spaces more than just getting the job done and checking a box.
Well, I love that you're inviting us to think about our daily life and ways we can experience God in the midst of the crazy and the loop. You talk so much about dreams. I want to make sure we take time for that while we have time. You talk about the big and small mindset. Tell us a little bit more about how to know if we have a big mindset or a small mindset. The big, small mindset.
This is another one that especially as I notice the more and more I work at a district office for a public K12 education system, and there's so much around data science and numbers and quantity, over quality and up and to the right. And when we are focused on that, it's easy to get caught in the mix of big achievement, numbers, growth. And again, growth is important, impact is important.
But there is this quality element, and sometimes it's hard to measure some of the elements that are not as big. They might be smaller. Whether it's moments or where you invest in a conversation with somebody that seems small that actually has an impact beyond what looks like the world says is a big thing. When we think of when we're. We're wanting to help others or influence others, and we can get in that trap of like, I only helped 10 people today, but those are 10 people. Those are that.
Right. And so when we hear of these influencers that are helping thousands, it's like, does that mean that their numbers are bigger, so that's more important, or they matter more? And so that's the essence of the big, small mindset. And what can we do without underestimating the importance of the small? And honestly, when we think of the way Jesus lived his life, he leaned into those small moments, and those are the ones that made an impact on the kingdom, right?
Yeah. I mean, as you're talking, I'm thinking we definitely live in a culture in a time where I think, even when I talk to a lot of young people and they think about their dreams and hopes and the things they want to do, they start with the big. But most of the people we see who are experiencing the big, the big influence, the big impact, whatever, they started small and they were faithful to what was right in front of them.
And you see that in scripture, where, you know, Scripture says if you're faithful with little, you'll be given more. You're not given a lot. And if you can handle that, you're given a lot more. You're given a little, and you're given a little more and a little more. And so I'm curious if you have a story that could inspire us on just the way you've seen in your own life or someone else's life, the power of really investing in the small things and what can happen as a result of that.
Yeah. You know, the first thing that pops into my head is the writing journey that I'm on. And it is. And, Willow, you are a writer yourself. And so you know what it looks like sometimes to have a dream that is influenced by industry. Right. And what that could look like if you, in order to have quote, unquote, success. Right. Or even have a proposal that is accepted or even looked at. Do you have the numbers for that?
And last summer, I went to a writer's conference for the first time and working on my craft in that way and learned so much. And, you know, I don't know if I knew what my goal was going into that. And perhaps it's easy to get wrapped up in, myself included. Like, you know, what are the big goals or what are the big dreams when you go into something like that? And really, the best part of that were the two individuals that I met there that are now my best friends. And it's been 10 months. Right.
And I talk to them multiple times a day. And when you look at what society would deem that as. Is that a success that you made two friends, I would say so when you feel and you see the impact on the way you are living and what the Lord has done in that work, that's the first one that comes to mind. Of course, there could be so many that are out there. But again, when we measure our success by the numbers, it's really easy to get discouraged in our dreams. But if we see, like you mentioned, the.
The small moments, being given those and being faithful in those, you know, the sky's the limit. Yeah. It's interesting how we measure success, isn't it? It's frightening, actually. I mean, you bring up the book writing thing, and I have to say, I mean, my book is getting published this year, and that's very important adulation. Thank you. But the road there likes to tell you you're very small and you have little potential, and it can feel like you're getting beaten up every other day.
So I totally resonate with that. It's funny, I got asked last week to show up to a local public school to meet with a girl who requested to meet with me. I don't know her. I don't know her or her family was out in the county, and apparently she had done one of the Bible studies I wrote. And so there's a mentoring program in the school, and she was talking to her mentor about being impacted by this Bible Study. And she wanted to meet the author. And the mentor's like, I know who she is.
I can set that up. So I drive out into the middle of the county. You know, the map says to go to a barn. I'm like, oh my gosh, am I going to get murdered? I don't know what this is. I get there, there's all these kids petting goats. And it was this beautiful program where there's all these mentors that invest in these kids. Every single kid in this high school gets a mentor for their entire high school experience that they meet with, I think every week, a local person, which is incredible.
And so I show up here and I'm gonna meet this girl. I have no idea what she wants to talk to me about. And Basically she's the 16 year old girl. She's like 6ft tall, super warm and bubbly and she's been through some stuff and she wants to write and she's like, I don't know how to start. And it was so cool to watch this young girl have a dream. And she actually is putting herself out there and saying, how can I start doing something?
And the answer really is like, well, let's dial this all the way back to how can you start small? And we gotta talk about what that looks like, right? Don't start with your name and lights, girlfriend. Start with how are you saying yes to opportunities to use your voice, whether it's, you know, in oral speaking or in writing. And here's an assignment that you could start with for writing. But all that to say, I think we as women have dreams.
And those dreams can even be infused in us since we're little, since we're young. Like this girl at 16 years old. What are the things that you're seeing happening to women that you're hearing about in this work you're doing that are making us feel like we don't have what it takes, or that we aren't enough, or what are the things that are holding women back from really pursuing their dreams? I interestingly find that there's a lot of. Whether it's we've heard of imposter syndrome.
That's a big one, right? The imposter syndrome. And that could look like a variety of things, but you know, our. It's so much easier to hear the negative than the positive of anything, right? And there is, there's some science out there that also says that in the morning your cortisol levels peak between the hours of 7 and 8am, which is like, right when you're starting your day. And I found this really interesting because that's where I was noticing.
I was struggling to even, like, just make it through a day, let alone dream beyond or think. Think back to, like, that inner child of, like, who do I want to be? Right? I could barely even get to any of that because I was feeling like an imposter every day. Or the cortisol levels are high and I'm feeling anxious in the day, or I'm feeling unsuccessful. I think there's just so many lies. Whether that's coming at us from the directions of whether that's work or media or.
Or friend groups or whatever, or comparison, we do it to ourselves, right? With comparing, you know, it's the thief of joy. And so I think that a lot of times there's this, like, this noise, right? This constant humming of something that is challenging us in all the wrong ways. And sometimes we're listening to it. Actually, a lot of times we're listening to it too much. And so that's what I'm seeing is the imposter syndrome anxiety, the listening to all of that. What are you finding helping?
What's helping women redream again? And know. I mean, one of your things that is a strong message that you, you know, live to preach is that you don't have to just survive, but you're made to thrive. So what. What's helping a woman to truly thrive. Willow? That one's hard because you know what? I feel like for each one of us, it looks very different. I wish I had the magic pill of what that could be.
But what I would say for me has been a lesson in stepping outside of myself, being vulnerable, listening to trusted individuals in my life, and surrounding myself with people that. That are able to take up. Allow me to take up space with them. Whether that is through, like, you know, coaching seems like a luxury, right? And in ways it can be. So where are we spending our time? And who are we surrounding ourselves with? And what are we consuming versus what are we creating? Right?
And a lot of that, what I'm seeing, even in dreaming, is like, if you can see yourself as a creator, right? Or art, like, I think sometimes we. Am I an artist? Am I creative? It took me a long time to, like, lean into that. Am I a creative? What does that look like if I'm not, like, a famous creator? Right?
But the more I leaned into those creative elements as well, the more I could see that I'm more than the tasks that I'm supposed to do during the Day I'm more than the roles that I play at work, and it gets your priorities in line, right? And being a daughter of Jesus has been really instrumental and it's taken me a long time to assume that role and welcome that role and invite. The invitation's always been there. But to say yes, right? Like you even said to say yes.
So, you know, and our God is a creator. And so the more we can mirror Jesus, the more we can mirror our God, I think the more likely we are to find that inner. That inner peace and get our priorities lined up. Where sometimes it all just seems like, how do I do it? Right? And that's with people and with Jesus. Right. Jenny, I know that there's women listening who feel like their dreams have died and they can't begin to consider what it would look like to redream again.
There's women listening who feel like they're definitely surviving and they're stuck in the daily grind. What do you want to say to them? Today. You have permission to dream again. And it's scary. And it may not be dreaming for something so big and scary, but what does that look like? Even in the small.
What could be that small liminal space today, going back to, you know, that loop that you're in and how can we find, within that loop that you're in, how can you connect in a way where you are being rebellious? And that's, again, that's scary, right? Being willing to step out of the loop. Being willing. And if you can't do it alone, who are you linking arms with? Who are you going to reach out to? And again, the vulnerability there is extremely hard for some, myself included.
Again, the inner introvert in me would rather just be stuck in my loop because it seems safer. But the moment you step out and take that risk of vulnerability and connection, the more you are able to have the ability to set a goal or to think bigger or to actually hear what is beckoning in the nooks and crannies of your living right now. Jenny, I know that there's people who are going to want to follow you, hear more about the sacred Commute acronym and so many things that you're up to.
How can they do that? Absolutely. So you can find me on Instagram, Sacred Commuters, and. And also on my website, jennylabrie.com and on that website, I've just got a bunch of freebies there that can help lead you through the entire commute or there's even swipe files to help you take that leap of faith.
To take that next step and seeing yourself maybe embracing some of the pieces of your story outside of the mundane commute and stepping into something a little bit more sacred for yourself and for your story. Jenny, thank you for being on the podcast today. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for having me. It's been so much fun. Hey friend, I don't know where you're at with the whole dreaming thing today, but after talking with Jenny, I just wanted to remind you of a few things.
One, make sure that you subscribe to our podcast so you can get this weekly so it can continue to encourage, inspire you in your faith, in your life. But I want to tell you about a few resources we have around here at Collidethat could potentially help you with your dreams. I thought of four as she was talking. I want to tell you about all four of them. One is a free exercise called five exercises to help you do amazing things that is on our website.
Make sure to check it out because we curated this thing for you to help you in your calling. The others are check out the yes you or the Go ahead Bible study books that I wrote. I purposely wrote them to help women. Yes you is tackling all those ways that you say, not me, God, I'm not enough. I'm. I'm too old. I'm not that interesting. I'm not that cool, I'm not that hip. All the ways that you disqualify yourself from God, using you and purposing your life.
And so that is a great study to grab if you want to tackle that voice that's just bugging you. The other one is called Go ahead and it's a Bible study that wrote and actually at the end why I thought of it is because at the very end there's an entire dream journal that helps you re dream for your life. And part of dreaming is taking leaps of faith. So that Bible study really helps you to recognize that the extraordinary is sitting right outside of the ordinary that you now sit in.
And how do you leap out and walk on water and take that step of faith and experience extraordinary things? So check that out. And then the last one is women of impact. We had like 70 some women hop on a course and teach and they're women who truly are living their dreams and making impact in this world. So check that out. Out. We have tons of resources on our website at wecolide. Net. In the meantime, friend, keep colliding with Jesus and we'll catch you next week.