Colin Cowherd Podcast - Ravens & Lions Meltdown, Mahomes Greatest QB Ever,  Super Bowl Preview,  NFL’s Dominance - podcast episode cover

Colin Cowherd Podcast - Ravens & Lions Meltdown, Mahomes Greatest QB Ever, Super Bowl Preview, NFL’s Dominance

Jan 29, 20241 hr 12 min
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Episode description

Colin reacts to the Chiefs dominant performance over the Ravens! He’s completely baffled by the Ravens decision to abandon their running game (3:30) and analyzes Lamar Jackson’s late game meltdown (7:00). He also points to Andy Reid’s coaching for the late season improvement in the Chiefs offense (10:30).

Then John Middlekauff, host of “3 and Out” joins Colin to discuss both games.

They debate how much blame should be assigned to Dan Campbell for his aggressive play calling that backfired (17:30) and give their takeaways from Brock Purdy’s performance (21:30).

They break down the missteps in the Ravens game plan and why they forced Lamar to try to play hero ball and bailing on the running game (33:00). Colin declares Patrick Mahomes the greatest quarterback he’s ever seen (38:30) and gives credence to the narrative that Lamar Jackson shrinks in the playoffs (46:00).

They look ahead to the Super Bowl between the 49ers and Chiefs (55:00) and discuss the reasons why the NFL has completely pulled away from other sports as the most dominant cultural force in America. (01:00:00)

(Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.)

Follow Colin and The Volume on Twitter for the latest content and updates! #Volume #Herd #3andOut

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Transcript

Speaker 1

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rarely shocked. The Kansas City Chiefs dominating from the opening play of the game the Ravens. This Ravens team qualifies as a bit of a jaw dropper. I mean, let me start with this. At the moment I'm reading this, we're left with three offensive coaches, no pure defensive coaches again at the end of the season. And Harball is kind of a special teams guy. That offensive output that he okayed John Harbaugh, Gus Edward touches the ball. Things happen,

not used. They bailed on the run. Isaiah Lively terrific last seven games. Did they have a singular play design for him? It's amazing to watch what happened. Baltimore just bailed on the run game. I mean, that would be like watching the Niners and saying, yeah, they didn't use McCaffrey much and played a real finesse game. Their makeup is physicality and heavy. McCaffrey use. You know Detroit, they they love the drop back, Jared Goff protect him, big playoffense.

Kansas City. I'll get to them in a second. We know what they are in big games. But the story of this game, and I know Chiefs fans want credit, what was that game plan? It didn't make sense for three and a half hours. They didn't run the ball. And it's not like Gus Edwards as a backup running back isn't capable. He makes stuff happen. He's terrific. I sat there and I just now. Also, you also saw what champions do. They create pressure, They score first, they

take the crowd out of it. They put second half pressure on Baltimore. Zay Flowers melts down, Roe Kwan Smith, personal foul, melts down, Lamar Jackson end zone interception, bad one, melts down. They lost their composure. So Baltimore is a really, really, really good regular season team. But I thought they looked immature.

I didn't think they played smart football. I thought they were completely outclassed between Andy Reid, Patrick Mahomes, Travis Kelcey and Spags a masterclass, a complete and utter mismatch and You know, I'm a Harbaugh fan, Jim and John, but to sign off on that, I don't even know what to make of it. Like younger teams do lose their composure that happens, Lamar should not be making that throw

at this point in his career. But I mean, once again, Kansas City, what did the Kansas City staff sign off on? A lot of Travis Kelcey, run the ball, Pachecko, Rashi Rice. You know, they put the ball in the hands of their stars. Also, what did they do? They got a good, pretty good pass rush, pressure, pressure, pressure, pressure, so their

game plan was get it to our stars pressure. The Ravens, a power running football team average about one hundred and fifty a game, deviated completely from their DNA, and John Harbaugh apparently signed off on it and didn't really adjust. I mean, I have notes here that it just there were and there were moments. I mean, Lamar catching his

own deflection was a top five play. But I really felt when the Chiefs took a fourteen to seven lead and they had that nine minute drive in the second quarter, it was like, Okay, had you not watched the game and you said, well, Kansas City leads fourteen to seven. That'd be one thing, but to completely by that time, they had established their offensive line was pushing the Ravens around. I thought that drive was like first time, I thought, well,

that's a problem, Like this is a problem. One team, the one with Mahomes and Kelsey, decided we're going to run the ball. We're going to be really physical. The physical team decided we're going to pass the ball. We're going to deviate from who we are. In fact, my notes here third quarter Ravens bailing on the run. Why aren't they running? Ravens first drive met largest Baltimore deficit in thirty one games, seventeen to seven, which is again

that's why it's shocking. Again, if you would have told me this game was a go either way game, Mahomes wins it late. That's one thing. This wasn't as close, Thank god for some good field position edges by Baltimore. They had opportunities, and so a lot of times Kansas City was pinned a few times deep in the second half when they're not going to take big, big chances. Right, they were controlling it. By halftime, it had been established

that Kansas City was dominating the line of scrimmage. They were doing what they wanted running the football and Baltimore could not protect Lamar Jackson. And I also wrote this down coaching mismatch. Three offensive coaches left. Again. I know I say this and I beat on it all the time, but go look at the top quarterbacks in this league. We love Josh Allen defensive coach. Once again, look at that game planned by the Bills, everything behind the line

of scrimmage. Non offensive coach John Harbaugh signing off on that game plan brutal. I'm just really bad, and I think we have to be honest about this. Listen, when you go against Mahomes, he can shrink everybody like Garoppolo got so much heat for miss that deep ball against Kansas City, and part of the reasons because Mahomes wouldn't have missed it. Mahomes puts enormous pressure on you. Plays with a lot of leads. Can also come from behind

and play. But I thought you juxtapose Lamar, who I defend at every corner, and Mahomes, and I know Mahomes is better. Lamarro win the MVP based on regular season output, where he was better than Mahomes in many statistical categories, but he's got more weapons, more consistent weapons. There was a huge gap between those two quarterbacks. And I think it's fair, and I hate to say this, but I think it's fair to say that Lamar melted down late and now this is becoming his reputation. But he's an

enormously dynamic regular season quarterback. You know what he is. He's the opposite of Eli Manning. Eli Manning had two of the great playoff runs of all time, beat Brady and Belichick super Bowls, great last drives to win. But in the regular season, you're like, Eh, Lamar's unbelievable regular season now, but we are now left with he's not the same quarterback in the postseason. And I hate to

say it. It drives me nuts. I've never paralyzed by being wrong, but I really thought, Okay, this team's different.

Speaker 2

Wow.

Speaker 1

But the coaching staff for Baltimore has to look in the mirror. I mean, I've been banging on Buffalo's coaching staff where it's all Josh Allen, and I felt a lot of this game. The Baltimore coaching staff just said, Lamar, make a play. I mean, Gus Edwards, you're just going to pretend he didn't have an enormously successful second half of the season. You're tied in that replaced Mark Edwards. You're gonna look as if he didn't have a tremendously

successful second year in the NFL. Meanwhile, the offensive ingenuity, game planning, play designing of Andy Reid Rashi Rice every few weeks just got better, better, better better. Then you look up and you're like, yeah, that's a number one receiver in the NFL. Didn't start the year that way, thought he was a two. But again, an offensive coach, the soft, velvety touch, improving Travis Kelsey, Patrick Mahomes, I

thought trusted his offensive tackles more. Today, Notice how Kansas City just keeps getting better offensively, more refined sandpaper, the edges off, and in the biggest spot, Baltimore goes backwards. And I think that's the difference between the great offensive coaches, the Shanahan's, the mcveigh's, the Andy Reids. I think Sean Payton what he did with Russell Wilson this year, say what you want, but it was a massive leap in quality very quickly. They just have a feel for it.

And again, it's one thing to lose that you got to answer some questions. I mean, if you're John Harbaugh, you got to answer some questions. There's losing and then there's that right. And I don't want people to think you're not giving Kansas City credit. No, they are a champion, absolutely, masterclass bags read Kelsey Mahomes. Nothing taken away, but you have to acknowledge the story was the collapse of Baltimore. I mean, what was my homes at one point thirteen

or fourteen it was backyard catch. They weren't getting a pass rush. He was sort of manipulating and toying with him. It's, by the way, I'll never bet against Kansas City again. It's like the third time in a big game I've said, Okay, this year's Buffalo. What am I doing? Andy Reid is in a short list? Bill Walsh, Belichick, Andy Reid. I mean that list is getting shorter and shorter. Go back to September and October to this Kansas City offense. Weren't

they averaging like seventeen a game. I mean it was bad and at the end of the year they still let the league in drops, but they got Tony out and Rashi Rice just kept developing and developing. And Travis Kelsey was a monster tonight. He was you know what I really felt like I was watching. I felt like

I was watching Michael Jordan's Skye Pippen. Phil Jackson backs up against the wall, nobody believes in them in a big game, and they come out and play their best game of the year easily, which they played pretty close to it, and it wasn't perfect. They had those holding calls at the end of the first half so they couldn't get into the end zone. But I mean, this is what the great ones do. We're all ready to bury them. I thought this was going to be a

tweener year. It was stage one of the dynasty, gradually moving into stage two. And you just we saw it. You just you know, the spark plugs aren't all firing. It doesn't work. But never doubt any reading Mahomes, what spags read, what a staff, what a staff? I am excited for Kansas City. This isn't all dumping on Baltimore. It's not just the heart of a champion. That's a cliche. It's the execution of a champion thirteen or fourteen for Mahomes.

I wrote it down at one point, Like, yeah, mahomes first incompletion, second quarter, next time, third down, Kelsey catch, Wow, nine minute drive. That's what champions do. Congrats Casey on though, another super Bowl. All right, here we go. Former NFL scout got a podcast at the volume three and out knows the Niners back and forth. You've already heard my preamble on that mess. That was the Baltimore Ravens. All right, thirty four to thirty one Niners, second super Bowl in

five seasons. Overcame a seventeen point lead. So Dan Campbell's gonna get you know, barbecued because of his play calling. He's not my favorite coach. He never has been. He's much more of a player sensibility than like a coach than like a McVeigh who's young but is a coacha. Campbell, to me, this is who he is. He's built the culture on it. I get it. You know, here's my take. Josh Reynolds drops fumbles, blown coverages. How much heat as Dan Campbell deserves, Colin.

Speaker 2

I listen, going forward to me is situational, and I understand a lot of times throughout the year, tie game up one score, week six, week ten. It's twenty four to ten, and you have the The Niners weren't on the ropes. They were falling out of the ring. I mean they were getting their ass kicked. You kick a field goal, you make it a three score game. So yeah, you could say it hit him in the hands. But this is you know, we see guys drop balls all the time. You have a chance to kick a field goal,

they have to score three times. I would understand if it's like, hey, it only makes sixteen points, it's still a two score game. It would have made it a three score game, which at that point the Niners defense wasn't playing well their offense. It would have it gave the Niners. And let's face it, the Niners had no life because party was up and down in the first half,

mainly down defense was atrocious. He didn't have to go with four and fourth down the first half because he was getting first downs in like second down every single series, right, they were like five to seven on third down. He was killing them.

Speaker 1

Well, I'd said this to you and on FS one ten times this year. The star of the Lions is Brad Holmes, the GM. It's not the quarterback. It's not Dan Campbell. He's not McVey or Shanahan, and Goff isn't Patrick Mahomes or even Herbert. He's one of the last true pocket guys in the league. I mean, Perty looked like Lamar Jackson in the second half compared to Golf. So my takeaway is I still think the strength of this team is not the coach of the quarterback, though

I really do like Golf. It's the players. They remind me of a younger version of the Niners. But you know, I think if you'd have said all year long, what worried you about Detroit, it never would have been the talent. Everybody's secondary gets gashed. I mean, the Chiefs are one of the few teams you would have said, oh, Dan Campbell's coaching or golf doesn't come through. Wasn't that sort of what happened.

Speaker 2

I will say this though, Colin, it does come down to your coordinators. You know in the playoffs, we saw it in Baltimore and Kansas City. Yeah. Right, this game, Ben Johnson, the offensive coordinator, was by far the star of the game. Through two and a half quarters. He was unstoppable and you have a chance to me the two making it seventeen points now listen. Kyle said at the beginning of the week, this is part of playing

Dan Campbell. He gets it on you. It can be crushing, but if your defense gets it and you're in a position where you're down, it swings it and it swung it, and I'm with you, like listen, Dan Campbell's not calling the place right. Dan Campbell is there to give the thumbs up or thumbs down on that. And I'm a huge believer in like us, he did the right thing.

It's not about the end results bullshit. This is an end result sport, and when you don't get it in a win or go home situation, I have no problem touring the season. I do think situationally, second half NFC Championship, when you're beating the crap out of a team and you're at the underdog seven point lead, I would kind of understand it, like, really, try you're up fourteen points, Colin, I mean the seventeen points. It would have deflated the

forty nine ers, but that swing gave him life. But like you said, Dan Campbell lives by the sword, and sometimes the sword gets stuck right into his belly.

Speaker 1

So I thought it was interesting because you know, brock Purdy I think is he's a fairly limited thrower. He's okay, the pocket collapsed, he threw a really ugly pick at one point in the game. I have it written down some here. Yeah, it was brock Purtty in the second quarter. Pocket collapse. And he's just not the kind of guy that could sit in there stand over it. He's small

without a huge arm. But I did think in the second half and it felt like he was told by Shanahan they do some mann a man here run because it looked very in intentional to me by brought pretty in the second half, like it wasn't just hey, I'm gonna I'm gonna go. He played with a script in the first half, wasn't working second half of it Almost looks like Shanahan said, listen, don't don't be afraid to move. Okay, don't be afraid to move. It'll soften up the defense.

That's what it looked like to me. Do you think it was just him going or had there was some intention to it.

Speaker 2

I think he's a pretty instinctive player, right because he has to overcome heigh limitations and arm limitations. So one thing he's done all season long and listen through two quarters in this game, and through the majority of the Packer game, I think everyone was thinking, is this guy their long term quarterback? You can't play with this guy in big games, right, But this is why they believe in him. I mean, part of the evaluating quarterbacks. I'm sure we'll talk about it coming up to the draft,

is the intangible stuff. The kids got some mox see, and he's got some toughness and mental toughness. He doesn't wilt because it would have been easy to go into the tank. I thought the first half he was playing like shit. I mean, he looked overwhelmed in the pocket. He looked bad some of the passes. I mean he was letting rip or flying over guy's heads. This is not raining today with seventy five degrees in the Levi Stadium.

So I thought more that he's just an instinctive player and he just had to find a way, almost like I have to will myself to make some plays. And he's a pretty good athlete. I know a lot of people don't think. You know, part of the reason they moved off Trey Lance so quickly is because Purty was the better athlete, right, you know, he moves a lot better. Honestly, his movement is really an NFL. It's an underrated skill in the league because how many plays do the Niners

make outside the script of the given play? Avoid some sacks. He's small, so he can kind of dip and run around. Obviously, he can run relatively quick in a straight angle, but he can move quick laterally keep some play that one play that he had the little lob to Jennings, but that can also get him in trouble, right, I mean you kind of live with the aggressive. He could kind of turn into a gun slinger. Well, one reason everyone had in Red Flag coming out of Iowa State. Now

looking back, they were an under man team. He threw a lot of interceptions, yes, because he is willing to take some chances for a guy that doesn't exactly have far for Josh Allen's.

Speaker 1

Harm, you know, one of the things though they were a favorite. I thought, clearly Baltimore melted down late in the game, and I thought Detroit starting with Josh Reynolds drops melted down. And this is something that it really matters. San Francisco's got a veteran team Kansas City Andy Travis

spags Mahomes. Mahlmes is now a veteran player. Right, Yeah, there is something to be said, John been there, done that, because I thought, I mean you could see, I mean when Lamar with that terrible throwing the end zone, Za Flowers, what in the hell is that? Rokwan Smith with a personal foul? And then I watched this game and I'm like, oh, this is this is nerves. I felt San Francisco melted a bit. Listen, there is this historic pressure. They've never

met a Super Bowl. There's Jags, Houston, Brown's Lions, and not many of them left. I kind of felt like they melted.

Speaker 2

Well, I think you saw in the second half the forty nine Ers defense that they started playing with a different pace. They started flying to the ball. They definitely were more fundamentally sound. They weren't out of place constantly.

That was happening in the first half. And obviously the Chiefs who have won Super Bowls, the Siner team hasn't won one, but this was They've been in this game four or five years, right, it was a huge deal for the lines to be here for the first time in thirty years, and you just see a championship level character and part of that, like you said, is just keeping your head, not attacking back, not swinging back when you get swung on, not you know, hanging your head

when you miss a tackle. Because the Niners easily could have gone to the tank. I would say about fifty percent through this game. And I think they proved a lot like the Chiefs showed up to win, that they had that championship character, that championship blood. They showed up ready to kick ass, and they did throughout the whole game. The Niners got hit in the teeth immediately, and they were hanging on for dear life, and they just won't fold.

And it gets back to a lot of the character of the guys from Deebo Samuel how many plays did he make in the second half, George Kittle, Fred Warner, and Drake Greenlaw making open field tackles, all their dbs who had given up huge plays and big runs early in the game, flying to the ball. So to me, there's a level of like coaches say this, no, NonStop,

don't quit, don't you know, play the next play. These games come down a small even the Chiefs Ravens game, the score was it wasn't big, right seventeen to seven. You're you're a fumble and a touchdown away from being right in it. So you can't get down on yourself. You can't mail in plays and listen. I mailed in the Niners. I thought, listen this game. They're in major trouble, and they flipped the switch, starting with a Dan Campbell miss field or missed fourth down.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I mean it was listening. The first part of this game looked like a brilliant young OC working a defensive coordinator who replaced a great defensive coordinator in Demiko Ryans. I had a couple of GMS, a couple execs in the league. One of them a GM text me and they're like, boy, they missed Tomko Ryans, who was just you know, and he's a brilliant young head coach. And I thought when I watched them, I mean, Detroit and green Bay offensive coaches sort of offensive leaning cultures right now,

are both very good first quarter teams. The quarterbacks, Golf and Jordan Love stay on script. Where Jordan Love can get in a little trouble is off script, little radic. Where Golf can get in trouble is sometimes playing from behind or if you can get pressure on him. I did think the Niners got better pressure on him, But if you go back to the first half of that game, that was a lot of Ben Johnson. First of all, Golf had all day. They were running, so the Niners

couldn't pin their ears back. It is interesting. I mean, I think my takeaway in both games today, the one thing I'll say is for a seventh round, last pick and for an undersized guy, Purdy has been in so many games, high school, college and now pro. He's just had so many snaps that he's just kind of situationally, I see no higher low of him. I mean, if he goes to the podium, Johnny's unemotional. I've never seen him smile. He smiles less than Kawhi Leonard. Like he's

just like he's just kind of static. That's not a terrible quality. He's not very emotional.

Speaker 2

Very mature guy. I mean, he's engaged at twenty three, twenty four years old. I mean, I would say that's not typical for NFL quarterbacks in twenty twenty four in the modern day culture. One thing, you know, speaking of the two quarterbacks in the second game, if you just put him in a pocket, untouched GoF throws a better ball. He can see much easier Quar five. But the game as games get uglier and as you can generate some pressure and things just it's football. Things don't go as planned.

You need to be able to make some plays with your legs. Jared Goff just cannot. Kirk Cousins cannot. And that is one element that Kyle, who likes Kyle, would like Jared Goff. But there is an element of having just an athletic quarterback. You don't need to be Lamar Jackson. You just need to be able to move.

Speaker 1

That's why they drafted Trey Lambs. They so Brock gives them that. And it's funny when they got Trey Lance, what I had heard in the building was he's not as athletic as we thought.

Speaker 2

No, he's slow. And that's you know, there are always a thing in scouting about time, speed or athletic ability. If you went to watch a guy play basketball or a guy at the combine, you know, the combines in a month or whatever, all these guys run fast forty times. And then there are guys like Saint Brown, who I don't know what his forty time is, but he plays really fast Deebo runs a four or five five, we'll put the ball in his hands. No one catches him. Right.

So I don't know what brock Purty runs, but I know when he scrambles or when he moves behind the pocket, he moves fast enough to get away from some guys. Now he can't run away from everybody, but his play speed is really good. And this gets back to instincts and to me, instinctive football players. The Lions have a lot of them, you know, I mean they really do. They have a fast team, so do the forty nine ers. Fred Warner plays really fast and Drake Greenlaw played really

fast because they're instinctive players. I mean, they're good athletes. But when you can read and you know what's coming, I mean, these players in the NFL have been talking about this the history since I've been alive, about knowing

what's coming, preparing it helps you play faster. And then there's the upper level of like the truly great instinctive players, and obviously the forty nine ers are full of them, right, I mean they just are from Kittle to Deebo to I think their coach, you know, when he gets in a rhythm, Kyle's weird, right. Ben Johnson has just been red hot all season long. Kyle can have game for

you feel like got it? What's he doing? And then today it just kind of flipped and then he got his mojo and the rest was history.

Speaker 1

Yeah, he tends to get a little tied to his script, and I think what happened today John is he did against Green Bay. He kind of gets stuck to his script because you know, he's a smart guy and thinks my script's better than your script. We're staying with it today. He didn't have a choice, No, he had. They had a couple of tachos. Yeah, yeah, I mean when you're they So they got lucky with with Dan Campbell's recklessness. So my guess is Kansas City would be favored by about two.

Speaker 2

I think Niners line's already out the other way. Niners are favored by two, which is insane.

Speaker 1

Yeah, boy, I would I would take Kansas City, wouldn't you. I mean, you can't bet two weeks for Andy Reid to prepare. Look at the numbers.

Speaker 2

I don't know about you. I was kicking myself. I put money on the Ravens and obviously, I mean shit, Andy Reid had me to his house for Thanksgiving. I've seen the guy up close, and I can't believe I did it. And you knew right away here, like, how did anyone even think that the Chiefs didn't have a chance.

I didn't think they didn't have a chance. But the way that game went was just classic, Like this is Belichick and Brady, but the twenty twenties version, and it was just I would never bet against this team now. I do think the forty nine ers you know in theory should be much more mentally capable. The Ravens melted down neutral Site. They're better in a dome. But Mahomes, I don't know if you saw the stat he has as many playoff wins now as Elway and Peyton Manning.

He has as many playoff wins at twenty eight years old as Peyton Manning and John Elway's career. He's too away from Joe Montana.

Speaker 1

Here's what's remarkable. So let's go and talk Kansas City Baltimore. So what you saw with an offensive coach, and you saw this with McVeigh this year and Matt Lafleur, that you had a flawed team and there was a unit or a part of the team. With McVay it was the offensive line. With Lafleur, it was the quarterback, and with Andy it was the wide receivers. You watched real coaching over three months that mvs. Rashi Rice is a one all three. At the Rams o line was a

train wreck. Early McVay offensive coach salved the riddle. Lafleur over eight weeks. Jordan Love was a bust to a star, and I thought, this receiving, this is what they can do. This is what McDermott drives us crazy, is that basically what you saw with the Rams, Packers and Chiefs was a their very best football by the end of the year offensively. Yet John Harbaughs signed off on that game plan. All Gus Edwards does is make plays. They ignored him.

Isaiah Lively, they ignored him, and it was like, to me, it's the opposite that what Baltimore their basic DNA all season. And then you got into the game and Hardball signed off in this game plan and by the way halftime, no changes. They abandon the run totally. So they went This is what drives me nuts is that offensive coaches old Lions, young quarterbacks backup quarterbacks receiving course, they can fix shit over the course of a season. I watched

I watched that Todd Monkin hardball performance today. That right, and again I'm not saying Kansas City Spags doesn't deserve credit, but the game plan and the play calling. They basically said, like Buffalo does, Hey, Lamar, go make great plays.

Speaker 2

In throwing the ball in the pocket. Right to me, last week, Josh Allen ran all over the place, especially outside the numbers, you know, or outside the tackle box. So I thought, well, if he's going to do that, could Lamar run for one hundred and twenty yards? Willy gaze out today that they did the opposite. They just tried to force feed the pass against a team that actually can ant like they have a lot of very talented defensive backs. Their linebackers were struggling to catch Josh

Allen last week. Lamar's faster, So why wouldn't you have design power runs outside both They just never did it. I thought the first half part of that game plan, and let's face it, the game felt over at halftime, was one of the most embarrassing in recent memory. They just had somewhat of you know, the blueprint last week with Buffalo how to use a running quarterback against these guys and be very successful, and they did the opposite.

The other thing that really hit me, do you know who might be the best coordinator in all of football? If you factor in, you're never going to lose him. No one is ever going to hire Steve Spagnola to be their head coach. It's never going to happen. So Andy Reid has a defensive coordinator who's clearly one of the best in the league that he ever ever has to worry about being hired to be a head coach. This isn't college. It's not like someone else can coach him.

He basically just gets that as defensive coordinator. If he wants to coach another five years, this guy gets to just stay with him. Think of what a luxury that is what SPACs is doing these last five years, especially the last couple since their defense has gotten good. If he was a forty one year old named John Smith, he would have interviewed for four jobs or even as

a defensive coach all around the league. No one touch, no one even pick up the phone, no one will, so Andy doesn't even have to worry about that, and like you said, the offense is always gonna be taken care of. And I'll promise you this. I still think the Niers might win the Super Bowl. But this Chiefs team will never be as bad as they are. Offensively again, yeah, because they're gonna get better. But defensively, you know you're

in good hands because your defensive coordinator is elite. He's taken out Belichick.

Speaker 1

At multiple Super Bowls.

Speaker 2

I mean he's won super Bowls now with Andy. He changed their culture defensively, and he's not gonna leave.

Speaker 1

This is New England Scarnakia after Josh McDaniel's bombed as a head coach. Part of what made them great was this institutional this institutional cohesion and knowledge. Brady Dante, Scarnectia, Bill Belichick, Josh McDaniels, Matthew Slater on special teams. Jesus, it was these like six seminal guys that were the

best in the world at what they did. And I think to your point, I think, you know, monk and may lose his job after that, But I think what we forget about this because I don't think Green Bay wanted to get rid of Joe Berry. I think they had to there's such an outcry, but Green Bay's been one of those places historically that you know, players don't get in a ton of trouble. You know you're not going to overspend on free agents, no crazy owner. You got to draft and develop. Green Bays had a thirty

year continuity of offensive coaches, drafting and develop. No chaos at quarterback. I mean, now it looks like they're going to get another twelve, but Jordan Love, they're going to go almost fifty herds with no quarterback. Cast Marino left Miami, they've still never replaced him.

Speaker 2

The cohesion in the NFL is not normal. Look at Kyle Shanahan. He's on his third defensive coordinator and what three years right, Sala got a job. Demko's there too, and now he's on Wilks, who at halftime looked like he might have been on his fourth. But I think Andy look at their cores right. Obviously, Spags now has been there over this four or five year run since they've been really good under Mahomes, and they You ultimately have to choose a couple players around your quarterback, and

you got to get it right. And for twenty plus years, Belichick always got it right. Well, they made a decision, right, They got rid of Tyreek, but they just stuck with Travis who was easy to because he doesn't make that much money. He's a great player. And Chris Jones. So their corps was basically one of the great quarterbacks of all time, one of the greatest tight ends of all time, and one of the greatest interior pass rushers we've ever seen.

And then they've just built it around there with great cohesion. At coaching. Matt Naggie leaves, he gets fired, immediately comes back right, So a lot like the Josh McDaniels thing. You know, this guy who the quarterback knows cohesions and underrated part. And now Andy Reid historically has been used to losing a lot of coaches, right, and he's comfortable

doing it. But right now I think they got something special with the players and the coaches of everyone's on the stae the Niners have a lot of that going for him. With the players, right, Kyle and this group of players have all been together now for four or five plus years.

Speaker 1

That matters. Oh you saw it in the second half a corse, it matter you saw it. So it's interesting.

Speaker 2

Against rookie who's fantastic fumbled the ball. Christian McCaffrey ain't fumbling the ball today.

Speaker 1

Zay Flowers late rookie bonehead, plays like it matters all this stuff. I mean, in fact, you could argue Gibbs and Zay Flowers made the big mistakes of the game. Great young players. So it's in Detroit. It's interesting because they could take a step back when Ben Johnson leaves. He's that good where everything can come back down to earth if you hire the wrong coordinator. Nick Sirianni and

Philly is a great example. You miss replacing a brilliant oc it's a different everybody comes back down to earth. I was thinking about my homes today. Though when he started the game he didn't have an incompletion to the second quarter. Is that I don't think we've ever seen anything like this. Peyton Manning, as good as he was, was a teeth clencher. Elway had some really bad big games. Brady was mostly an early game manager. I can say it now. Mahomes is the greatest quarterback I've ever seen.

I can say it, and I've watched Marino and Elway. You know I love Brady now. Brady's more productive. But what we're watching here, as a player that against the best defenses, in the highest leverage moments, the biggest audience, the most pressure best defenses, is significantly better, not better, significantly better than he is in the regular season. His playoff numbers, they don't make sense. It would be like Derek Jeter was a three hundred hitter hitting three seventy

in the postseason. It's like, wait time out, what are we doing here? When I watched Mahomes, I'm like, hey, this he made a throw today and it was Travis Kelsey made a great catch, but he was running. It was a muddy pocket. He moved forward and he just sent a little floater up and it was like Thanksgiving backyard football and it was completed. And I thought, nobody

cares about that play. I honestly today in that environment juxtapos watching Lamar and him, and I'm like, if Lamar's number two in the league, the gap between those two is the Grand Canyon.

Speaker 2

Lamar's not number two in the league. Josh Allen is and you listen. They're never gonna go on record and say this, but I'll promise you Josh and Spags have more fear face in Josh Allen than they do Lamar Jackson. Like that. It's not crushing the guy. He had a great season, but he's not as good as those two guys. And it was on full display today. It was on display the first half a week ago against the Houston Texas, like he can be rattled really easy. And to me, Mahomes,

to me, I'm with you. The Brady thing, it's gonna be hard even if he wins a couple more to ever gets to the six.

Speaker 1

It's like Lebron and MJ because it's just there's so much production and titles and trophies from MJ. But Lebron does significantly more things better than MJ.

Speaker 2

I mean last night he was have like twenty rebounds against the Warors. It was incredible. He's got gray hair over his face, He's got twenty rebounds beating the worst. The thing that Mahomes does that parallels Brady to a t is in these big moments. Now he can do a sexier play because he can move around in the pocket. Tom could not. They never fuck up, they just refuse. And in the second half, and Romo kind of mentioned

this is it's unsexy to say this word. But when you get a lead in a big spot, the game manager aspect, or maybe Bill Coward did, He's like he game managed like a Hall of Fame player. I'm not No one on the other team is touching the ball, anyone around me. I'm either getting rid of the ball, throwing out of bounds. You're gonna have to beat us, but you're not gonna beat us because I give you something. And Tom and the Patriots were elite at that. Peyton

would screw up. He would throw the ball to the other team. Sometimes had some awful interceptions in some big games. Right, the teeth get tight, he gets loose, but he's very under control. A lot like Tom. It's like they're super focused, but they're very calm and loose. It's I mean, how many guys in the history of sports have had that, like Tiger, Michael Tom. It's a tiny, tiny list. Derek Jeter in the playoffs, maybe big poppy. Most guys just

naturally get a little tight. You saw Jared Goff like it. He just kind of got felt a little tighter. Lamar, the pressure you can feel it. You don't even need to be at the game. You can feel it on the TV. You're like, God, this drives huge. And then if you don't get a second and eight, all of a sudden, like third and eight, you're like, h The coaches clench up, everyone clenches up. And this is where

the championship blood and the championship medal. I saw it when I lived in the barrier with the San Fransco Giants. It all starts at the top. And I'm telling you, Andy Reid, if you talk to anyone that plays for him, they're like his team meetings after loss, his wins. They all feel the same. He's not a yeller and a screamer. He does not invoke tightness anytime you're around him. He's naturally kind of loose. He's not a big screamer, but you know, enjoy but he's not a big downer in

the negative times. So I think it all starts with him, and he has the perfect quarterback for him. But to me, Patrick, the maturity today to be in full control on the road against a great defense, Like you said early in that game, that dot he threw to Kelsey down the scene was like, oh my god. It was like it would have been like watching Michael Jordan ninety seven or ninety eight, Like, good luck, guys, you're in for one.

Speaker 1

How about the throw to Kelsey when Kyle Hamilton he was on a single side by himself and it was a first Kelsey made a hell of a play first time all year a tight end beat Kyle Hamilton for a touchdown. And after that throw, I'm like, he's on one.

Speaker 2

Isn't Kelsey? Also, we talk a lot about Mahomes and Andy, but think about Kelsey all year long. You're like, huh, is this gonna be his last year on the Chiefs? Are they gonna ask him toke a pay cut? Like he's kind of getting old. What happens when the playoffs start looks like the Hall of Fame a minus guy. Now he's not may not be as dominant as he

once was in at thirty two thirty. He was great today, but he's still It's like a throwback like Scotti pit, like Michael Michael looking at him like I need you and Travis like I'm ready, And he said it all week He's like, I've never wanted a game more than this game. Like these guys, their level of focus and obviously their talent is second to none. But today there it was watching greatness like that. That game was Were you shocked? You didn't think they would dominate like that?

Did you like the chief?

Speaker 1

So basically the Niners Lions looked exactly like I thought. I said on Friday, I said, Detroit will probably take the lead. They're a great first half team. Ben Johnson, I said, perty you'll play from behind, It'll be good. It'll be close. If thebo plays, I said, he'll make two or three big plays and they'll I think I predicted the score would be thirty four to twenty eight

or thirty four to twenty seven. So that game, now, I didn't expect the meltdown in the huge lead, but the final result was San Francisco just made more big plays. Their physicality took over. Detroit was not quite ready in the moment. That's what I thought I would see it. Just how we got there was different.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

I do not remember ever a playoff game with what I perceived to be a great team being more wrong that game. First of all, my entire belief on the game was, Oh, they're going to pound the rock, make mahomes sit on the sideline. And it was Kansas City that had a nine minute drive. I know the game looked the opposite of what I look like at.

Speaker 2

The time of possession. I remember they put it on the screen one time. You're like, this is insane.

Speaker 1

It's insane. And they abandoned the run. Like I thought it was going to be. Baltimore lead, Kansas City can't quite keep it. In the end, Baltimore couldn't score. They abandoned they They didn't abandon the run. They never ran, they never attempted to run. So that game, that game, Okay, So let's talk about this.

Speaker 2

How do you match the experience with the coaches on Kansas City When you think about Andy's now been in the league for thirty plus years and all the stagnola can it can lean back on the games against Belichick and his experience. I mean it's so.

Speaker 1

I have been a been a big defender of Lamar. I love how much he cares. Every year he gets bigger, he gets better, and we cannot deny he's a better pocket quarterback to day than he used to be, no question jastic player. But I did think today it is now fair to say not quite the same. In the playoffs, I defended him forever. I used to say Peyton Manning wasn't the same in the playoffs. It's hard to win in the playoffs today, And again I'm not blaming him.

He had no run support. I hated the game plan, but he melted a little late, and I think it's fair to say he had a couple of bad throws. I do think it's fair to say that he is. He tends to be run centric. He can melt a little. He's not as good from behind, most aren't. But when you watched him in Mahomes, I'm like, some of the criticism is just now. I defended it, but it's just.

Speaker 2

Well, from a specific football standpoint, he got fidgety today, he got rushed. He looked like the younger Lamar where in the playoffs when it wasn't going Baltimore's way, he would one read and then kind of scramble around and kind of scramble within the pocket and it just throws everything off instead of all season long. Now, granted they were beating the crap out of most teams, right, he

was very under control. It's like, well, if this is the version of the player, I'm all in because he's calm, you know, kind of moving around today, he got very fidgety. He got very felt very uneasy about two seconds into the place. And part of that I think gets back to the immense amount of pressure in a spot like that against that opponent, and you start going we're down,

you just naturally kind of freak out. Now, maybe we look back in a couple of years and he wins a game like this and he says going through that experience helped me out. But today he resorted back to the guy. Like I said this last week, everyone shitting on Josh Allen. Was he perfect? No? But I never watched for a moment thought I wouldn't want that guy on my team. If you put that guy on a team that stacked, you're winning with that guy. It was

not his fault. He did not look overwhelmed. I'm not saying Lamar looked overwhelmed, but I need you to be in complete control the moment you get fidgety. It's the Peyton Manning thing. In the playoffs, you're playing the best of the best. He used to lose the Patriots. You're playing the Andy and Mahomes here. They're not gonna screw up, and this defense is solid. Like, just live to fight some other you know, get a seven yard game right complete some balls. The balls were flying on him, the

rain started coming. But to me, he was very very uneasy in the pocket. And that, to me, you kind of knew it right away, like you could feel it. And it happened against the Houston Texans, and then he came out a different guy. Why they started running the ball calmed everything down. He never calmed down. Their offense never calmed down.

Speaker 1

Well, they didn't do Monkin, didn't do him any favors. The way to settle a quarterback down is get him a run game for sure. By the way, second half Niners Christian McCaffrey peeled off a couple of big runs. Everybody comes down, the temperature in the room comes down. The lit'll swing past the debot, debo breaks, tackles, the sideline played a kittle. It just brings the temperature down. It gets the crowd into it. So Sam Francisco, after a rocky first half, by party, what are we gonna do.

Let's get him some yards. Let's not put the pressure on him. They never did that with Baltimore. They just kept dropping him back. By the way, and Spags is bringing extra people Baltimore can't block him. So at no point did Baltimore say, listen, because they saw what you saw. God Lamar's frenetic here, let's get him help. Nope, they just dropped him again with six rushing and five blocking.

Speaker 2

If I told you this morning that before the game kicked off, the Chiefs are only gonna have seventeen points, you would probably assume they're gonna lose, right Like, I didn't envision a spot where they could win seventeen to sixteen, or seventeen to thirteen or seventeen to ten. But what happened today. Awful pick in the end zone in a triple coverage, Karlovskis gets a big strip sack against him. Obviously, the Chiefs came through with turnovers. You can't afford to

have the forty nine ers overcame the pick party. It was early. Would they would not have been able to overcome a pick in the second half, and let alone countless turnof over stay Flowers, Lamar Jackson, the fumble trip sack. I mean, that's you're not overcoming that against you know, the New Dynasty. It's not possible, But it starts with him. I mean, the whole building. I would imagine every guy and and female that bought a ticket felt it early

like we're in trouble. This quarterback looks a little off kilter, and let's face it, he was.

Speaker 1

Yeah. I think the Super Bowl is going to be interesting for a lot of reasons. San Francisco, as you noted, comes out of favorite. I would bet Kansas City.

Speaker 2

I think that line will come storming down, are you yeah?

Speaker 1

I mean, listen, this institutional.

Speaker 2

The Chiefs just won the Super Bowl. Last season, they won the Super Bowl. They're back in it, or they not the favorites.

Speaker 1

Well, I'd say when they played them before, Mahomes wasn't making the money, The roster was a little deeper on the defensive side, more experienced. Perty's a better runner than Garoppolo. I think he's I think he I always thought, gimme through a great ball between the hash marks, could didn't move much. Pretty gives you a new element. McCaffrey wasn't on that team, so that this team has.

Speaker 2

Got their defense is not as good as that team. That defensive line house at Buckner, That defensive line was good.

Speaker 1

I I would take Kansas City and the points, you know, because I've watched San Francisco play crappy football for three quarters against the Packers and two and a half quarters against the Lions. So my takeaway is where I haven't seen Kansas City have a bad quarter. They've had twelve excellent quarters. With San Francisco, they've overcome I mean, let's let's.

Speaker 2

Not kid, go back to the Baltimore game that they've had some bad games over the past month. It's not even just the playoffs, they've been off. Yeah.

Speaker 1

So I just I got to tell you, I find uh, I don't know why I bet against Kansas City. There's just so much institutional intelligence, you know, And it was so clear to day early on, I mean, Kelsey had one of his best haves ever and not even just touchdowns, just making diving catch after diving catch. And there's been this sort of narrative he's not focused. There's Taylor Swift and I'm like, well, he's showing off for today, because

that's shit what I'm watching. Yeah, that maybe he has a ring in his pocket he's delivering tonight, because that was like one of the he was engaged. I thought Travis Kelcey really set the tone. And you know what else I liked in big games. Baltimore didn't give it to Gus Edwards. It's like, what are you doing? Didn't they didn't go with their strength? What did Kansas City do? Travis Kelsey, Travis Kelsey, Travis Kelsey, But Checko Rice? Who's because I love their game plan, which is what spags

rep pressure? What did they do? Play right into his strains? Go look at everything Kansas City did today. It was all the best version of what they did. And I think San Francisco's second half, by the way, looked exactly Okay, here, guys at half, this is who we are. Let's go do what we do now. Detroit did the same thing, which is reckless. But Baltimore is the only team this weekend.

I thought, what was that? I don't get that. I thought Kansas City and San Francisco niners second half, Really that's who they are.

Speaker 2

You know. One thing that Andy has changed definitely the last couple of years. Now, part of his tyres gone is the knock on him was always pass pass pass. He has no problem given to Isaiah who against the forty nine ers, I mean, look at them. They can't stop the run right now, So I would expect for the Super Bowl a lot of pachaco because stopping the run is not and let's face it, there outside passing game with the Kansay Chiefs is not as good as Detroit's.

So the forty nine ers are gonna have to find a way to slow down this game because that if you're just giving up five six yards of carry, you're just gonna be up against the ropes. It's impossible not to be because it keeps your offense off the field. You know. Obviously this guy on if it's third and three, they're talented enough to get those, and they have the

greatest quarterback of all time. But you have to start if you cannot stop the run, like they would have lost this game the version of the way their defense was playing to the Kanatite Chiefs and now it's inside fast. Now that benefits the forty nine ers too. But the other kind of swing is think about Mahomes. These last two weeks just perfect. He's just been a plus A plus party's, you know, but a little bit of a

roller coaster. I don't think you can afford roller coaster party throwing a pick six or something against Kansas City and being down ten nothing to the level of coaching staff you're gonna go to. Now, maybe the Niners can figure out some defensive stuff. Here's one problem, Colin when you invest a lot into a certain position, like ultimately, like, why are the chief struggling with the wide receivers. Well, they don't have a great player. It's not like they've

bought one guy who's not living up. They drafted a guy in the second round. Sky More didn't work out, whatever, Rice is, whatever, a third round pick like that, they'll be fine. They will invest more in that. The forty nine ers have invested a ton into the defensive line right now. Bosa made some plays today, but Chase Young, they trade a third round pick for it, He's nowhere. Armstead and Hardgrave today were many places to be found. By the second half, at least Fred Warner and Dre

Greenlaws started making some places. But when you invest in an area, this was the downfall of the Philadelphia Eagles. When you put all that money in the defensive line, well, if the defensive line doesn't play it like an A minus level, and if you put them at like a C plus B minus, you're gonna be screwed because you're gonna have major liabilities to other spot. This is a business that you build the Pike chart over and the Niners are very dependent on this defensive line, and right

now it is not good. Beside Bosa, none of them are making place, and they definitely against the run. They're all getting turned around in these gaping holes. So Andy Reid might have been a passing coach, but I would imagine that you're gonna get a big dose of running game come the Super Bowl.

Speaker 1

Yeah. I don't have a strong feel because I will say this. I think Kansas City has the best quarterback. I've the best player I've ever seen. So that is my age, and I think Andy Reid. You know, I think I've told you this before that if the NFL would have written that CTE check to the players union ten years earlier and the league would have pivoted to offense, Andy'd be the best coach ever. Belichick probably wouldn't have two or three of the Super Bowls. But it was late,

so Andy was working against the league. These offensive coaches, defensive coaches reigned supreme for years and decades in this league. Well, I mean, now you watch John Harbaugh's game plan today, you look at McDermott, Mike Tomlin, how these teams struggle in the O line run games. It's I mean, is it a surprise that Kyle Shanahan and Andy Reid are in the championship game? Only McVeigh to me, maybe Peyton. But that's kind of the highest cut of the cloth in this league offensively, is it not?

Speaker 2

Is it not?

Speaker 1

Shanahan's the best scheme guy in the league. Andy's the best play designer and play caller. Mcvay's the best offensive culture builder. And then I think, I think Peyton and Lafleur deserve a lot of props. Ben Johnson's probably the best year coordinator. Shane Steike and I think is getting really close to putting that, But I mean, it's not a surprise. This is the coaching sport. NBA is a players league, Baseball is a pitchers sport. Football order back. In the

coaches league. We have the two best offensive coaches.

Speaker 2

Yeah, for sure, I mean, and I think both of them. And this is what my issue we talked during about college football during the season with Lincoln Riley and some college coaches is they don't even look to the defensive side of the ball that they don't. They don't attack it till it's too late. Is Andy Reid and Kyle

Shanahan are huge believers. Now it doesn't always work, but doubling down on defensive lines, getting aggressive players, paying for corners, drafting guys high on defense because part of my ability, right is going to be I can help the guys out on this side. Now, it helps when you hit star players like Kelsey or Tyreek Hill, or trade for Christian McCaffrey. But Juwan Jennings, no one heard of the guy three years ago, and now he's making big plays

every single game. Right that they can. They can create that with no names. And defensively they've always, you know, allocated a lot of resources over there, and sometimes offensive coaches, you know, are either two hands off. I give Sean McVeagh a lot of credit. Look how the defensive coordinators he's always invested in, how much emphasis they put when they do have draft picks on that side of the ball, right,

because you cannot win in these big spots. Obviously the Niners were getting treaded, but their defense came through in big spots that are highly paid.

Speaker 1

Right.

Speaker 2

Obviously, Kansas City has a fantastic defense the Baltimore was there because they had the number one defense. So offense is huge and the offensive, you know, head coaches are the ultimately like the swing part of it. But you've got to emphasize defense as an offensive coach because you're

gonna need that side of the ball. And the Chiefs have really benefited from that this year because their offensive personnel is not as great, but they keep getting better, right and obviously Kyle since he's been since they've been good, they've always had very physical defense. I also think practicing physically is a really, really big thing, and Andy Reid is still known for running the hardest training camp. Kyle Sham talk to their players Monday through Friday is not

that fun. It's a very very intense environment. It's not negative like Belichick, but in terms of football wise, you better know your shit or people are on you. And practice is not just lollygagging around in sandals. What was the knock on the Eagles this year, It's like, oh, they weren't really practicing, they were an older team. Well I get it, but if you do not practice in football, you practice four or five times more than you play

every week. So yeah, the practice these coaches are addicted to practice, and Andy Reid and Kyle Shit, they like practice as much they like the games. Their excitement getting ready because it's the preparation for but it's also getting setting the team's tone. It's why Harbaugh's such a great coach. His practices are physical, like his team doesn't just show up and shove people around. It starts in the offseason, starts in training camp, and then it's through the weeks

during the season. It was always something famous Belichick did when they were always the number one or two seed and they got the Bie week. I heard Jillan Edelman is like, we used to scrimmage in full pads, like it was just step the tone for physicality. We didn't want to lose that because that is the separating factor offensively and defensively. And when you practice hard, everyone gets better. What do you watch when you watch the Chiefs and

the Niners. I mean, people are getting hit hard offensively, defensively, and it starts with the head coach. You can't fake that. Listen, most people in life aren't tough like Dan Campbell's a tough guy. You know, Jim Harb is a tough guy. You go is Kyle a tough guy. Well, the way he viewed football philosophically, one Andy reeves always smile and

nugging people, I promise you. And he loves throwing bombs, loves toughness in football, and it shows in the biggest moments because that's where you needed to come through.

Speaker 1

John Middlekoff, former NFL Scout three and Out podcast for the volume. This is always great. So I think we'll meet again next week. Listen, we have the best coach and quarterback against maybe the second best coach and best roster. And so the conspiracy theorist can say the league wanted Taylor Swift in, but it looked like Todd Monkin. What the Chiefs in now? Roger Goodell, that goofy game plan. It's been a hell of a year, you know.

Speaker 2

I look at this year, these ticket these ticket prices to get in, I might need to get into that building, cal and I might need to use to call some people, to call some people because this ticket price to get in price could be I bet it's going to shatter records. I mean in Vegas, right, and Taylor Swift.

Speaker 1

I mean, what do you think that Lions Niners rating? Is that Fox has been in a role Jesus Fox eight million people. You think, but listen. I like the NBA. I watched both the Celtics Clippers game Saturday night, first half, second half of the Lakers Warriors. I love the NBA. NBA is dying to get like one point nine million or a game. The NFL, and I think legalized gambling as jet fuel is completely pulling away. I three or

four things are happening to the NBA. One, the NFL took Christmas back, which was a huge marketing day for the league. NBA NFL said, yeah, we're done with that. We're going to own it.

Speaker 2

Hurts.

Speaker 1

That was a real launching point. Secondly, the league's getting highly European. Most of the best players Luca Jannis Jokic doesn't bother me. I love it, but it is getting Our domestic players have very little imprint. These guys come. You know, Wenby's the next great player. SGA's from Canada. It's it's and I'm I'm not opposed to it. I like stylistically, I love watching Jokic play, but you know,

fans often they kind of root for their own. They want to see their Kansas guy and their Ohio State Guide. And so that's second thing. The third thing with the NBA is that Stephan Lebron carried the league for fifteen years and that was so much fun. As I watched it this weekend, and as I watched that, I thought, is this the last meaningful game between those two? I literally was getting romantic. I'm like, we're not getting any Steph.

I mean, Steph Lebron. This could be one of the last times they really light the world up.

Speaker 2

Where's like five games out of five hundred theyre not gonna be in the playoffs? I thought, can the NBA you know how golf gives sponsors exemptions, Like, could you give a sponsor exemption to get Steph Curry into the playoffs? Because that's got to be the highest rated NBA game of the year. Do you know one thing I think

in the NFL? And I'm sure you've talked about this, but I really noticed it in my life, whether it's my girlfriend, her friends, whether it's just other ladies in my life, my mother and her friends, a lot of women watch the NFL. Yes, my mom watched every snap to day and she she's because I worked for coach Read and he was so good to meet. She doesn't miss a Chiefs game. She's a diehard Chiefs fan, you know. And I know so many moms that you know, I'm

from northern California. They don't miss a snap of the Niners. And I think that's probably the same moms in Philly, women in Philly, Dallas. I think you go around the country. No way basketball has that. I mean, I think the under and this is not has anything to do this well before Taylor Swift ever showed up Dayton Travis. Yeah, I'm telling you, I think that the audience uptick in women watching football, specifically the NFL has got to be.

Speaker 1

All Okay, my wife doesn't like sports. Glued to the game today with her sister. My sister doesn't like sports, became a Seahawks fan with Russell Wilson. My sister and my wife do not watch sports anything ever. I mean, they the idea of taking my wife to a baseball game, it would be like taking her to a bingo game at an old folks home. She just wouldn't do it. No,

I think you're right. In fact, I saw a number six or I just got to Fox about seven years ago and they were showing I got some research from the people upstairs, Mike mulva Hill, and I stopped by. I used to see him like once every few months, and I see him a couple times a year.

Speaker 2

Very bright guy.

Speaker 1

All the numbers I fall docked like it was like fifty percent of the fans were women or close to it. I was like, no, I can't be true.

Speaker 2

It was well like people up in Seattle and your sister's friends and just random females over the last ten years. When Russell Wilson came onto the scene, how many of them do you think followed the Seahawks really closely? I bet it was pretty high. Yep.

Speaker 1

And I also think there's something about football. It's once a week, so you don't feel I mean, women have big, broad lives, careers, kids, One game a week. By the way, it's Sunday, and so husbands are around, families around. It's kind of like lunch, dinner, beer. It's a real it's real family feeling football it's once a week. It's also to be honest with you, I mean, I do think there's something to be said. You have to be a

real baseball fan to get baseball. There's literally one hundred and sixty two games spring training, postseason, there's over two hundred. It's a maze of games. I'm a sportscaster. I get lost with it. NBA so many meaningless games, load management. NFL players once a week they play hurt and you know, for most of your stars, the careers are ten years, so you just get used to seeing people. And by the way, many of those players that are great in

the NFL, they were great in college. So I just followed. You can go follow Caleb Williams at US to the Bears, so you have some connection to it.

Speaker 2

I also think one thing, you know, most of my friends, either from college or high school, if I went on Instagram the day I swear to got eighty percent of them were at the Niners game. And I think if you grew up in an NFL city like Philly or Dallas or wherever, or the big college cities, it's such an event, right. It's fun to go tailgate, it's getting out of the house, going to hang out. It's really just all day. It's a positive thing. Now the game

might not turn it. It was going to be a negative thing if they lost, but it is something fun to do, and like you said, it's not one of those. It's once during the season, rights every other week. If you're a season ticket holder, I mean, I know countless season ticket hold it's very easy thing to fall. It's always easy to get rid of your tickets. And I don't know many people that are associated with a team as a season ticket holder or go to games that

complain about it. And I think it's the opposite in the other sports where I know so many people over the last five years that have taken their kids to see Steph Curry and just for whatever, he didn't play right,

and and that's dramatically hurt the game. You know, when you're going to a Kansasity Chiefs game or a forty nine er game, that if I'm wearing a Deebo jersey or I'm wearing a Kelsea Mahomes jersey, that guy's gonna have to have a broken leg or broken shoulder else he I mean Johnny and if you like, he's gonna give me everything he has.

Speaker 1

It's totally relatable. I mean, MB doesn't play against Jokish and we're both we're both NBA fans. I watch all, I watched, I watched again, I.

Speaker 2

Watched I'm dipping, so I've gone the It's just I found it with the with the the load management and the effort last night was pretty remarkable. But that felt like a game from fifteen twenty years ago, right the Lakers and Warriors. That that's not what the NBA is anymore. They've lost the guys making so much money, the urgency

of the sport has been lost. That's what's amazing about football is the money has Like Patrick Mahomes had a four hundred and fifty million dollar contract, and if I told you that guy was playing for his career, you would have thought today, like you know, his contract was on the line. So the money hasn't phased any of these guys. You might not play well, but you never

feel like anyone's mailing it in. Everyone's always trying. And I do think it's a culture of football from from pee wee's to high school to college to the pros. Guys are coaches yell at you, right, you're just getting yelled, you're getting humble.

Speaker 1

Also, if you go look at the NBA media coverage, it's like it's like a fan It's just it's just basically they're all pr people because nobody, even the ones I respect. They don't want to lose access to the top four agents, in the top twelve players. In the NFL, there's there's just I mean Kansas City. I mean take Kansas City. Travis Kelsey gets pissed off at you. I'll go talk about homes. I'll talk to read shit. They're

two corners. There's just guys to talk to. In the NBA, there's like a player or a team that you have to have the access to. I used to have a buddy that covered the San Francisco Giants, and he's like, man, those guys will.

Speaker 2

Turn on you.

Speaker 1

Boy.

Speaker 2

Those guys will try to bury or else you'd throw a bat at your face. Yeah.

Speaker 1

So it's like in the NFL, it's just the media is hard but supportive. I mean we're not here to I mean I used to be Broodloan Baker. I think he's great. I love his redemption story.

Speaker 2

Do you think most of guys, most players are are unfazed by it. Like in the NBA, they go into the tank and they get mad and they start lasting out. In the NFL, it's like whatever, I'll see you next week.

Speaker 1

Well, I think also NFL players because they have shorter careers and they stay in college longer. A lot of them married their sweethearts in college. Yeah, and because of young place, I think they have families and kids sooner, and so they're not on their phone all day. I mean, if you're some of these NBA guys, you're twenty seven, never married, no kids, you're doing your thing, You're on your phone all day at your hotel. I tell people this all the time, that people I've had not in

a long time. But I pretty much have my staff except for games like today when they're big games. But I have my staff pretty much run my social and I tell people all the time there's no value in reading it. But NBA got again. But I'm married, kids, business podcasts. If I was a twenty eight year old sportscaster and I didn't have any of that, I'd probably be on the phone all day. So I think I think NFL players tend to come into the league more mature.

They see the they also know one injury and they're done, so they put their money away. You don't hear a lot of NFL stories of guys going bro. Most of the guys put their money away because they know they're just a one hit from being done.

Speaker 2

Yeah, you know, so what's your what's your guests on the numbers today? We're talking over fifty million. Game got pretty good in the second half.

Speaker 1

I'll say forty six and a half million. Super Bowl get over fifty. I mean, you know what's so funny when the season started, I think we were a little concerned at Fox. I'm not going to speak for our per management. Rogers gone, the AFC had the star quarterbacks, and Aaron had left the AFC, and Russell Wilson the year before had left the AFC, And we're like, Jared Goff, how long Stafford playing?

Speaker 2

It was?

Speaker 1

I mean, it was like new kid. But what's been great is the NFC has these great rights Dallas against green Bay, Green Bay, San Francisco and then Detroit. Such a heartwarming story as the NFC's got these the.

Speaker 3

AFC, Philly's just interesting and even. But in the end, if you go to look at the AFC, it's Tennessee's and Jacksonville's and the Houston Texans. Kansas City's obviously a profoundly popular franchise. But in the NFC, you've just got these built in sixties set even the bad teams. The Bears were kind of fascinating.

Speaker 1

This year is Justin Field's gonna work and now Washington's gonna get Ben Johnson richest owner, most cab space. I'd be kind of interesting. The NFC has these big foundational people don't understand John out East. They have no idea how popular the Niners are out West.

Speaker 2

They have when you say that the NFC East, if we were going to compare it to college football, would be like the power of the SEC. And then if you took like the Packers and the forty nine Ers, that's like Michigan Ohio State. I'm not obviously the AFC is really good. I'm just talking the power of the brands. I mean, I don't think people understand like when the forty nine ers in Green Bay played each other, how many people were watching that game. I mean, you're talking

about my entire life. That's a rivalry going on thirty plus years. These two teams have been in the biggest games in the biggest sport now for decades.

Speaker 1

John Madden, the Great Late John Madden, used to have a line and he used it at Fox and Management often kind of hearkens back to it. Does the game sound big?

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

San Francisco Niners sounds gigantic, Dallas Packers sounds Cleveland Browns, Houston Texans. It just doesn't sound that bag. A couple of years ago, Jacksonville Chargers, it just doesn't sound that big.

Speaker 2

Well, you could argue this is the best Super Bowl. I mean, obviously the Cowboys being in it, given the quantity of people, But the second best matchup would be the forty nine Ers against Mahomes.

Speaker 1

Right, Yeah, no, no, I think it's listen, it's again people.

Speaker 2

I would say the nine get to the NFC Championship for that ever to happen. But you just know what I mean.

Speaker 1

The brand, The Niners are the Yankees of the West. The Lakers are popular, but it's the NBA. I think the Niners are even bigger than the Dodgers.

Speaker 2

How many Niner fans live in Los Angeles?

Speaker 1

Did you see this year? Was it? This year? The Niners played?

Speaker 2

The last three years? Colin They sell that place out. They call it Niner South.

Speaker 1

It's crazy. Yeah, I mean, I went to Starbucks this morning, so I got a great workout in I went to Starbucks. There are three guys and Niners full Niners gear. It was like eight point fifty and I'm like, and then where else did I go? Oh? I had to go to a pharmacy and there were two more Niner hats in there, and I'm like, people, just when you're in Los Angeles, it is Dodger hats, Lakers shirts, and Niner hats.

Speaker 2

You know. Kyle always had said before he took the Niners job that he was only going to go to a job that he felt had a good quarterback situation because he had seen so many people fail. And then the nine offer in the job, well, he had been there with his dad when Steve Young and they were winning Super Bowl, so it's hard to say no. And he went because of the power of his experience there and when you win with the forty nine ers, like, to me, they were one of the biggest brands of

my lifetime any sport. I mean, they they've just been to think of the good and now I mean they are just rattling like they're a bigger brand than Kansas City. Obviously Kansas City could win back to back Super Bowls, but it's not even close in terms of fans.

Speaker 1

And it's fascinating how many interesting quarterbacks, John Brody, uh into Montana, into Steve Young, even like into Kaepernick. Alex Smith was caping.

Speaker 2

Parstin, was going to Pro Bowls, going to Totoe with Far.

Speaker 1

And then now then they had Garoppolo, got him do a Super Now it's brought pretty. They haven't all been great, Montana Young were, but they've always had interesting core, even Kaepernick, they've had interesting quarterback stories and good enough to win a bunch of games. I mean, god it they got to a Super Bowl with Kaepernick, Garoppolo and now pretty. How many organizations could do that?

Speaker 2

Do you think the reason brock is such a polarizing story just simply his draft spot or simply because of his draft spot and he's the forty nine ers quarterback.

Speaker 1

You know, I don't. Here's what I think. I don't think he's polarizing. I think it's we live in a debate culture and I fall into the I think he's good. I don't know think he's great. I think he's good. I don't think he's big enough of his arm, but he's good. And I thought his second half the day running around, he was really good. And then there's those that say, you know, my buddy Jason McIntyre, he's great. And I'm like, now that scouts know what they're doing.

I mean, there are these occasional Kurt Warner stories are Antonio Gates or GMS and both of those, by the way, there were circumstances why they didn't get drafted. But I think there is this he's great, he's this. I think Brock Purtty is a good quarterback. If I argued he's Kirk Cousins with mobility, that's a pretty good quarterback. C J. Stroud is Jared Goff with mobility, that's a pretty good quarterback. So if I said to you, he wames Jared, Listen,

you win a lot of games with Kirk Cousins. Imagine if he could move, Oh you can, It's called Brock. Pretty that's what he is. Exactly When when when when c J. Stroud came out, all the scouts were like, he's Jared Goff, Well he is, really, except he moves better. Shit, Jared's good without moving, So what's he like when he moves? So I think I think the comp is like c J. Stroud to me, is I mean Jared throws a beautiful

Stroud throws a beautiful ball. He just moves better, So I think I think brought pretty feels like to me, kind of a pedestrian arm pedestrian average, yeah, pedestrian body, but he moves.

Speaker 2

And that's a good player and he makes place yea in big spots. All right, buddy, see you go.

Speaker 1

John Middlecoff, former NFL scout We love him. Three and Out podcast Always Miney the volume

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