You're at the Coaching Inn, 3D Coaching's virtual pub where we enjoy conversations with people who engage in the world of coaching. Welcome to this week's episode of The Coaching Inn. Today, I'm delighted to be joined by some lovely coaches who are going to talk about their accreditation journey and what they wish they'd known. I'm really aware that what is about to unfold is about the ICF.
And I'm also aware that some of you lovely listeners belong to other tribes like APEX, the Association for Coaching and the EMCC. So if you are listening to this and go, I wish they do one on that. Send us an email to info at 3dcoaching .com and let's do one. Meanwhile, let's find out who's in the room. So here we are in the great company of Michael, Andrew and Zoe. Tell us a bit about yourselves, Michael. So I'm Michael Hubbard.
I'm giving myself the of director of questions at Make Your Habits. And I am as good as a year into my journey to become accredited. So I've just about tipped over my 100 hours and I'm just looking at completing my accreditation, the test, whatever it is called. The test. Great. Well, welcome, Michael, director of questions. I do like that name, I have to say. Andrew. Yes. Hello. Lovely to be here, Claire. So I am a husband, a father of two grown -up boys.
Coaching is a career change for me after 30 plus years working in not -for -profits. I became interested in coaching, having had coaching during my career. I trained in lockdown and left full -time work about a year ago. So I have just become accredited in the last month with the ICF. Congratulations. Thank you. And what you didn't say about yourself is that you are a pilgrim who has done the Camino. Yes, like you. Like me, yes.
I remember we had that lovely conversation when I was walking and you were, think you were also walking at the same time and we were talking about rucksacks and all sorts of other interesting things. Yeah, well it made all the difference. I think we should do a coach's Camino. Yeah. One day. We could do the Inglis, couldn't we? We could take a bunch of us, because that's only a week. Yeah, sounds good. Zoe, hello. Hi, yeah, I'm Zoe, living in Kent with my husband and son.
And I've been coaching for 11 years now. Began my coaching journey with 3D coaching, that was 11 years ago. So I'm self -employed, doing full -time coaching. And as part of that, I'm also part of the 3D team doing coaching. And also in my accreditation, so I'm in the process of the last bit of doing my PCC accreditation. I have my exam tomorrow. So on the very last bit of the journey, hopefully. Yeah. Great. So we've got over the line, nearly at the line, almost nearly at the line. Why credit?
I'm really curious to know what made it a useful thing for you to I for me it was about having that sort of stamp of approval for a number of reasons. So in my, my career was in operations and I was always quite keen in having some sort of accreditation of what we were doing so we could. So could reach a certain standard, but then also improve on that. So I introduced ISO into our organization. I introduced best companies.
So as a nice stamp to have, but also as a mechanism to benchmark and to grow. So that was the main reason for me. Right. Stamp of approval. Michael. Well, that could say that's a bit of a funny journey because I've also introduced ISO to a business. I have been part of an organization that has done that best, that good employer journey as well and topped it. actually seeing what a rigorous process can do to your outcome.
And actually that's the reason why I to be accredited because I've been a very good ops leader as well. This is completely coincidence. My background is running ops, but as an ops leader, you solve things and which is not coaching. So, and that was a bit that really dawned on me during the training was that actually everyone says I'm an actual coach, but I solve stuff.
So I had to do a lot of unlearning, which is, which is, which is actually really interesting and something I wasn't expecting to happen. The degree it did. interesting. I have not introduced iOS into an organised course. I was not even sure. You're lucky. Yeah, I'm not a boxer. So it's different for me. I think for me, there's something about the just the ongoing learning and development and the stretch and the growth for me and a bit of feedback in that.
So part of I'm sure we'll come on to the accreditation journey for me has been that, you know, I want to hear, you know, I used to be in team with a line manager and get regular feedback. And sometimes you don't get that as much. So I think just connecting with peers more of part of that journey. But I think just that sense of, I where I'm pitching. I know what the stretch is. And I've just found that a really life -giving process, I would say.
Yeah. For me, I think there's something about early levels of accreditation where you're actually putting a line in the sand and going, I'm serious about this. Because of course, yeah, it's unregulated. You can do what you like. But the issue about it's unregulated and you can do what you like is that it's unregulated and you can do what you like. Yeah. So so some standards actually can demonstrate to potential customers. I'm serious. I think the ethics are important. And all those other things.
Actually, maybe this is the time to say to you lovely listeners, if you're looking for a coach, one of the advantages of going for a credential coach who belongs to a professional association is that you have a place to complain if you have an issue. So number one, they have standards and ethics. And number two is if you feel as though that's been broken, you have somewhere to go. And if you work with a coach who doesn't have a credential, the only place you have to go is them.
And there's been headlines. over the years, I'm sure in different continents, certainly here in the UK, about situations where people have had issues working with people who don't have a credential because there's been nowhere to So we're going to start with you, Andrew, because you're over the What do know now that you wish you'd known earlier? many things. Maybe we'll start with process. So first of all, how complicated it seems when you start to look into it.
And we're all ICF here, but I I looked at EMCC, I looked at AOC and different colleagues who are doing different things. and then trying to weigh up which path you were following based on what you were training. And I thought I was on a totally different path. I thought the mental coaching had been included in my program, not that I could remember doing it. And then realized I hadn't, I've got to do mental coaching now. And I thought, okay, that's another hurdle.
I mean, that was the best thing about it in the end. But I thought, goodness, I've got to do this stuff. which turned out to be really, really valuable. And then looking at the time that it takes as well. So, okay, you've got to do mental coaching, takes three months, you've got to have your 100 clients. And then you look on the ICF website and they say from application, it takes 20 weeks to process. I checked today, I think they've reduced that to 14 weeks.
And actually, I got notified within six or seven weeks of having submitted. So but that was a bit sort of scary thinking, this is potentially a sort of six month piece of piece of work. And actually, once you got your head around it was it was fine. But that sort of slightly daunting thing of starting the process was, yeah, took a bit of time. And then who are you going to go with your mentor coaching and course 3D was the best choice. Thank you for the feedback.
I did notice when you said earlier that was the best bit. But no, it really was the best bit because you got to, I think as a sort of first -time coach, you quite quickly get into certain habits and they're not always the best habits and having the ability listen to some of your recordings with another person and to learn with a group of like -minded people. yeah, think just listening to people coach and be coached was really, really helpful.
So what I thought was going to be a sort of box ticking exercise to get a badge and then I would sort of improve from there. mean, yeah, I think my coaching has changed dramatically as a result of accreditation. Fantastic. I woke up at five o 'clock this morning thinking about this and do let me have a Camino related story. So I walked the Camino with Nordic walking poles and so did my friend Margaret.
I had had small group tuition from a Nordic walking teacher and she had been in a class, a bigger class. And both of us recognize the value of the poles. So there was when we use them properly, and then there was when we use them to come down very steep slopes and not fall in rivers. But if you talk about the using them properly bit, I was much better at using them properly when it was difficult than she was.
So when we got on a really steep hill going upwards, I knew exactly what to do and exactly how to position my body so that I could, with the least effort, go the greatest distance. So I would be at the top of the hill most times first because I'd had somebody looking at my walking and go, move your shoulders, pull your arm out a bit further, put the back arm in your back pocket, all of that stuff that made all the difference. And she goes, how did you get up that hill so quick?
And you're not as out of breath as I am. At the end of the day, when I was tired, that wasn't always so true, Often that would be happening and it was happening because I'd had mentor coaching on my Nordic walking and she'd just been on the training program. And I think for me, that's quite a useful insight into the benefits of that extra bit because it's that little tweaking and refining that makes us into the coaches that we can be. Thank you, Andrew.
And thank you for indulging me in another Camino story. Michael. What do you know now that you wish you knew before? I think it's about, it's just the timeframe in my head. It's going to be a lot quicker, but I, it should be, shouldn't be, but now that to really get into it and practice it and have time to go and coach different people. You need, it needs to be a year, some year in. And it's just, yeah, think the training, do it really quick.
Really might make you want to get it actually, but just sitting and trusting the process. I work with someone else, so I went with maximum performance, I think it is maximum performance coaching. And it was the same like 60 hours of tutored study. And actually, that was the bit where I really learned it. And you get people hold that mirror up and say, you know you're doing that? Or you missed out? And they're sitting and doing a course online for five quid.
Or there's actually spending investing the money in the time. and seeing a whole different sort of different style of coaching. Cause you've got the eight people on the course and then you've got the six or seven other people that are used within it as well to do some of the demonstrations. So you've seen a lot of different coaches that was by the end of it. I don't think we can get that another way. Yeah. Yeah. You've said a year for ACC, Andrew, you said six months for MCC.
think it's five years. So I get people coming to me saying, I've got my two and a half thousand hours. I'm ready to do my credential now. And my PCC is expiring in three months. And I go, well, actually, it might take a bit longer than that because there's something isn't there about formation and not just the box ticking. And each level requires us to deepen the work that we do. And therefore, the process of the deepening will take time as well as the actual thingy itself.
So I'm hearing something about starting early. I'm hearing something about research process. Actually, that was a big one because I was looking because I've got an ILM level seven in management. I can't remember quite the title anymore. But I was looking at ILM coaching versus the HST coaching and the ILM coaching it's loads of good work.
And as a raving dyslexic, and this is like, do I read when I saw the amount of hours you have to put into the coaching was like, do I actually have time to do all the study and it's the what's the difference and what's the trade off and that was the one of the trade offs I made and that was the choice I made and which way I was in my certification. So what you chose was a practitioner led, yes, bucket rather than a knowledge led bucket. Absolutely.
Yeah. Yeah. We did for me and my learning style. Yeah. We do quite a lot of work with Ireland coaches who trying to simplify because, because there's a lot of knowledge in that bucket. And over here, it's actually more about what you actually do in the room. Zoe, what do you know now that you wish you'd known I think I'd I wish I'd known something about the pace.
we, a few of us have talked about timing, know, things that I thought wouldn't take long, you know, took longer and things that I thought would take ages. So I thought it would take a long time. think Angie, said, I thought it would take a long time to hear back on my recordings. It was weeks. I can't remember the number. And then I think I heard back quite quickly. you know, I want to say four to five weeks, you know. So I was, that was lovely. but in terms of getting my recording.
So I was like, yeah, get two coaching recordings. But actually that took longer, partly life circumstances that happened that I wasn't expecting and partly just wanting to know they were the right standard or getting the feedback on those, performance pressure. So I didn't expect that to be hardest. That took longer than I expected to get my recordings, for example. or to get my last 50 hours of coaching.
So I think I thought, once I've got everything and I submit it online, I'll kind of chill out, relax and I'll wait to hear. And I think at each stage, you know, it's like there's a bit more here. So, you know, I submitted all my coaching log and then I, you know, then the recordings, I think there was some stuff that was complicated for me about transcripts. So there was a bit of to and fro about tidying up transcripts, which I hadn't allowed for. So again, I thought that would be really quick.
You know, I just download it. And so just that thing of pace. I think rather than here's my deadline in the sand or submit it all and then nothing more, it wasn't like that. Each part takes another kind of burst of energy, as how I put it. But within that timing and throughout that journey, there was a lot of rich learning. So I think I'd agree with Andrew. I feel a much better coach than I did five months ago. Interesting, so what else are we learning on the way?
The word that comes to me is sharpening. There was a sharpening and a refining of what I did. A lot of that was, you know, when I was looking for my recordings, I was doing more listening to my coaching. So actually, I'll probably say hand on heart, pre accreditation, I had probably never listened back to my self coach. And I have done that a lot, partly for finding the recordings, partly as part of mental coaching group, getting the feedback.
And actually for me, listening to myself, hearing others give me feedback was really, really helpful. Not as easiest, but helpful. We'll talk about the recordings in a minute. I'm just wondering, Andrew and Michael, what are you learning from doing the process? it's similar like you Zoe, didn't particularly like listening to recording. I had to listen to the recording I submitted when I did my original coaching, accreditation, diploma rather.
But yeah, forcing myself to do that more was really helpful. And actually then getting transcripts, looking at transcripts was sort of interesting because you'd notice certain words that you kept using. yeah, so I thought that the sort sharpening incremental improvements and some of that was really about not trying so hard as well, I think. trusting. Well, I think it's one of your settings, just trusting the process. Yeah, interesting. What are you learning, Michael?
Well, I've got lot that's been said already. I think one of the funny things is you learn a lot about yourself during the process, because where you're in a cohort of people that need to practice coaching, you get coached loads. You actually come out of every, you come out a different person from being, having regular coaching lots of different coaches, it actually changes you. But it's a funny one.
There's something you don't expect is to have that level of personal change as well as that change. Yeah. The recordings one I think is really interesting because I've learned so much about recordings over the last five years. I have to share my little victory. The page proofs for the new book have come back today. It looks beautiful. We've still got to wait till November for it to come out.
And I've still got to spend, Lucia, we've got to spend the next three days reading every single jolly word. But there's a whole chapter on listening to recordings. And what I really want to encourage people to think about is that the way you listen to a recording at the very end of submitting for your credential, when you're checking it against the different competencies, is not the way you should be ever listening to your recording at any other time.
Because at other times you can be listening and looking for the air and the flow and the tone and the movement and all of those things. And when you get hyper -focused on recordings, it actually badly impacts your coaching because you start coaching to tick the boxes rather than coaching to keep in flow.
So I think it's a good thing, but just don't feel that you need to be attached to it all the And just following on from that, Claire, if I could say one of my main learnings, just going on from what think, and you said about trust the process is, to relax and trust my training and experience. So, know, I'm nearly overlaid hopefully.
And, and what I know now is, you know, trust that it was in you, you know, yes, you sharpen and you learn, but I think the downside at some point, especially watching, maybe trying to find my recording was overthinking or being perfectionist. And I think for me, that's where they're meant coaching was really helpful. You know, being honest, the two recordings that I sent, they weren't my best ever coaching sessions that I've done, but they were good enough.
And I think that's been quite a journey for me of going, none of this is going to be perfect, but I've done my training and I've, you know, to have the hours that I have, I've obviously learned something along the way. So just, I think the hindsight, I just say relax and enjoy it a little bit more. It is, it can be intense and there's a lot, but you know, it's in you kind of thing.
I was talking to someone the other day and they'd listened to a MCC recording that passed where the coach had gone and opened the door in the middle because the doorbell had gone. But because they kept in flow, the recording passed. Now, I'm not recommending that that's the thing to do because that's a high risk thing to do. And it also depends on the mood of the examiner and what their standards are and all those other things. But it isn't about perfection.
It so is not about perfection because we're humans talking to humans. So there's always going to something going on. What was I going to say about recordings? I can't remember, I'll come back to it. What are other people thinking about the learning here? think the other thing for me was the diploma I did was, I deliberately chose it because it looked at quite a types of modalities, bit of gestalt and a bit of narrative coaching.
And at the end of it, you sort of came out with a whole load of box of tricks, supposedly. But because you'd only sort of touched on them, I felt there was quite a lot of pressure to use them, but I didn't feel confident enough in using them. And actually, the mental coaching. really helped with that to say, okay, you don't need to use these, or there might be one or two that you might use from time to time. yeah, develop your own style of coaching. Absolutely.
There was an amazing dialogue the other day on a Facebook group for coaches where somebody who's a PCC coach with the ICF was talking to somebody else who wanted to go for MCC. So they were both standing where they are now and not where they want to be. And one of them said to the other one, all the things, all the tips and tricks that you use to get you to this point are the ones that you need to go.
They need to disappear now because what you need in your future development is about doing less. And I'm looking at it going, did I write that? That's very good. I agree with it. I like it. It's lovely. I've just remembered what I had forgotten earlier. And that One of the tips that I would give to people going for accreditation is, is recognize who you coach when you're at your very best.
And if you're able to go back to them and ask them if you can do another session with them and record it, that is the way to go. Because people who are willing to engage in the moment with you in the conversation enable you to show up at your very best. somebody who's kind of just about agreed to do four sessions with you for nothing so you can record them but isn't really wanting to think isn't going to show the best of you. That's so true.
In when we're doing some more mental sessions, because people coach themselves as well. This is when you're working in these coals, people start coaching themselves. you end up in this horrible trap where people are talking and they're answering their questions and they go through half of the things you need to say. So picking the right person for your assessment.
I've got a very articulate, someone who works with me and he is my assessment man because he talks beautifully, clearly and he very short sentences. And I know that actually I can have a good coaching conversation and it not feel too forced. Yeah. it's the other thing of it. Are you doing it by numbers? So it is that find the person if you are looking for those recordings that you know is going to do your job on the other side.
And if you assemble your coaching hours through reciprocal coaching, you're not going to become the coach that you need to be in order to be able to get paid work because because the reciprocal coaching hours, it's okay for a bit of practice, but the more coaches coach coaches, the more they get into this bubble, which is all a bit weird and isn't at all what you're going to experience when somebody pays you money over here.
So really making sure that even if it slows you down, that you're doing paid work as well with people who aren't coaches I think is really important. So we're going to do another roundtable on the exam. And Michael and Zoe, if you want to come back to that, well, Andrew as well, if you want to come back and talk about that, that would be great because it's all a bit of a mystery, I think.
And we know that you have to sign that, you know, on plane of death, I will not share any of this, but actually you can still share some of the process and some of the learning from your journey. So Michael and Zoe, we wish you well. with your forthcoming assessments. And hopefully by the end of, by the time we broadcast this, we'll be able to say that you got your credential. That would be nice. would be great. Yeah, it'd be lovely.
So final, a final tip or a final comment to our listeners as we wrap this up, what would that be from each of you? Mine would be don't lose your authentic self in the process. Great. Mine would be similar, was going to say, following what I said earlier, trust yourself and what's in you. Andrew. Don't treat it as a box -ticking exercise. Treat it as a real learning and development opportunity.
Brilliant. So thank you, Michael Hubbard, Andrew Cook and Zoe Dickinson for coming to The Coaching Inn and listeners, thank you all for listening. We'll be back next week. And if you want to share this podcast with others, please do, because that would be great. That's how we get more listeners. Thank you all for coming. Thank you for listening. Bye bye. If you've enjoyed what you've heard today, we'd love you to share the podcast with a friend or leave a comment on social media.
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