¶ Zach Wahls joins the Chuck ToddCast
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get covered today with life insurance through Ethos. Get your free quote at ethos dot com slash chuck That is e t hos dot com slash chuck. Application times may vary and rates may vary. Well. Joining me now, I think the statewide candidate from Iowa that I've interviewed in the last year, it is Zach Walls. He is a Are you still a state Senator, Zach? Or you form state Sure?
¶ Democrats have a real chance at flipping statewide Iowa races
We actually used star serving from the state House. Yeah, this is my eighth and final year in the Iowa Senate.
So this is, So would this be the year you'd be running for reelection.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
So yeah, the state Senate seat and the US Senate seed same cycle here in twenty twenty six.
So we're going to hold on to it.
We had a good Democratic candidate and actually don't believe Republican has filed. But you're exciting things happening and say legislature.
Too happy to chat about that.
Well, look, let me just quickly give the one episode Zach Wall's running for the US Senate. This is the open Senate seat that Jany Erntz decided not to seek reelection in. It is a competitive primary. You've had Josh Trurick on the podcast a few months ago. I've also had the guy that's going to be leading the top of the Democratic ticket, Rob sand on here as well. Because a as people know who listened to me, you know that i was one of my home states. I
was joke. I was not born and raised there, but I was raised Iowa. My first savings account was with the Waterloo Savings and Loan, yes when those existed. And I also believe that Iowa is the is the test is the Petrie dish for Wave or not Democrats win multiple races in Iowa, we're in the middle of a wave. If not, I think it's a different situation. So that's another reason why I've spent some time with Iowa candidates. Zach Walls, Welcome to the podcast. One sweek.
Good to be her.
Kind of already chimed in because I asked you to, so anyway, it's all right, we don't form all around here.
All good.
Well, look, I'm excited to be here. You're absolutely right. We've got a lot cooking in Iowa. As you mentioned, my friend Rob sand running for governor. I think we've got a real chance at flipping that race, which is super exciting.
We've got two and I think maybe a third and.
Well I think it's three of the four waves territory.
If we start seeing some good numbers out of Iowa
¶ Did you always know you were going to be in politics?
four on election night, people forget this. You know, obviously, Steve King.
I'm not buying that opium that you're selling there.
I'm saying it is about step and it was a unique case, but we came within a couple of points back in twenty eighteen, and I think you know what we always like to remind folks eighteen first Trump midterm. I will won three of the four US House districts, we won three of the five state wide offices, and we came within spitting distance of flipping the governor's mansion that year. And we just did not have a Senate race on cycle in twenty eighteen, and so we got
a really unique opportunity here. You did, of course mention Joan E. Earnstrapping out. You know, she had, of course revealed her healthcare plan of waiting for people to die in June, which it turns out was not a very popular position with most Iowa voters. And then when she dropped out in August, that was about a week after a poll came out showing me actually leading her in a general election matchup.
And so we think there's a real opportunity here.
And I'm happy to chat about my likely report looking opponent, Ashley Hens into I had a couple.
Sure, I get that. Look, you won't say this. It is not surprising to me that two people who were not supportive of Donald Trump in twenty twenty four at the start of the presidential cycle, Kim Reynoldson John Earns, both somehow find their way not running again in twenty twenty six. I maybe time will tell how connected those two things were. But let me start with you. Look, you you have you're you're pretty young, and yet you
have been in the public eye for some time. And you went viral when you testified about your family when it looked like there was a movement in the state of Iowa to somehow make your family illegal for and
¶ Realized at 13 years old the GOP was targeting his own family
that did not happen. But you've been in the public eye for some time. Did you always know you were going to be in politics? Was there ever another lane you thought about going into when you're at the University of Iowa.
So I was actually studying civil and environmental engineering. When I was at the University of i was going to go build bridges. Today we're at the Ironworkers Local sixty seven hole here in Des Moines. I was really proud to win not just their endorsement, but they actually made me a member earlier this year, dues paying member. And so even though the work that I've done as an adult has definitely taken me in some different directions. Yeah, you know, when I was a sophomore in the video
that speech went viral. You know, Look, no one ever wants to find themselves in the position of having to defend your family from you know, powerful people in the government. But when that was what I had to do, that was what I had to do. And I think part of that for me. Check you asked about politics, You know, I learned at pretty early age that politics was interested
¶ Going viral in 2011 for speech defending his two moms
in me. I will never forget the experience I was in the eighth grade and I am going to date myself a little bit here, but it was the two thousand and four election cycle. In my first homework assignment for my social studies class is to watch the speeches at the on TV of the two thousand and four Republican National Convention and then to go back to class
the next day and to talk about it. And I will never forget what it was like watching some of the most powerful people in our country address the nation and talk about these raging wars in the Middle East, in Iraq and Afghanistan, the global war on terror, and then in the very next breath talk about the threat to our way of life from this radical state Supreme Court decision in Massachusetts and the so called gay marriage and realizing as a thirteen year old that they are
talking about my family and going into class the next day, wanting to speak up and set the record straight, but being scared, being scared of being judged by my peers, a target of our government.
Right.
And when my courage you know, failed me that day,
¶ Gay marriage rights are still under threat today
you know that shame has has stuck with me. And that was exactly why in twenty eleven, when I had the chance to do the thing that I did not have the courage to do seven years earlier, to go fight for my family, I knew I had to be there, and so I had no idea that someone was going to record it with the flipcam, or that the video was going to go viral, or that it would.
We didn't. We didn't really planned when they go viral. Back then, there wasn't There wasn't.
No, I mean, politically doesn't really go viral. At twenty eleven, that not nearly the same same way. I mean, it became remembering, right, it was the most watched political video that year, and like the second place ad was like a like a Rick Perry thing, like I don't remember what exactly it was, but.
That was the.
Fence and like he's his jacket or I don't know, it's a long time ago.
So I don't really remember, but yeah, you know, and I learned a lot from that experience and I and most importantly that when you are able to find that courage to speak up and speak truth to it helps a lot of other people find courage too. I heard from so many people after that it made a difference in their family and their lives, and just learning that at an early age it was a big lesson.
How concerned are you that your parents' rights are at stake again?
Yeah, look, I mean there's been a push by some of these far right groups trying to reverse essentially the Obergefell decision from twenty fifteen. And you know that's not just about same sex marriage. I mean they're clearly coming
¶ Does Iowa's famous libertarian streak still exist today?
for reproductive rights. They see that as a piece of further eroding protections around IVF and fertility treatments, and so yeah, I look, I think it's absolutely a concern, and I think it's a part of why so many Americans have felt like, you know, they need someone who's willing to
fight for them and their families. And in this campaign, you know, the issues that come up the most we're on the campaign trail, definitely the economy, but also the corruption that we see in Washington, the self dealing in this administration, and I think frustration frankly with the establishment of both parties that people have experienced for a long time, and it was part of why Donald Trump won in
Iowa and consecutive elections. But I think the other thing that's a real concern is definitely, you know, fear for the future of our country and or democracy. We hear that all the time, and it's something that we need to take really seriously.
I want to go back to.
You.
I remember a friend of mine would describe Iowa as the Oregon of the Midwest, and I said, what do you mean by that? And I and this person said, well, it's it's very Midwestern. You know, it's meaning that it is, you know, as the President might say, it's central casting, right,
¶ Vast majority of Iowans are pro-choice and support marriage equality
like you know, the bridges are correct, the landscape is correct. It feels you know that Romney once said the trees are all the right height when he went to Michigan, you know, sort of like a but but I understood what he meant. Right. You go to Iowa and you're like, yes, this is what what Bridges of Madison County was based on. I get it. I see it, but there was It's not just Iowa nice that's there, but there really is a you keep to your business, We'll keep to our
business type of mindset. Do you still think that exists? It feels like in parts of rural Iowa, And maybe this is an east west divide and that Eastern i was in one place, Western I was in another, or or maybe it's just the rhetoric that said, do you still feel that? Or do you think this threat to the rights of of your parents, for instance, really is just more a bunch of activists, it's not actually what the average Iowa things.
Yeah, it's a great question, Todd. I think there's two sides of that coin. There's a there's one side of the coin that is you take, you know, mind your own business. The other side of the coin is that you look out for each other. And I will tell
¶ There are a lot of Obama/Trump voters in Iowa
you you still see examples. I think of both of those things quite a bit. You know, in twenty eleven, far before marriage equality was a sentineled issue, that resolution, that amendment to war State Constitution that I was speaking against it did not right. And this was you know, four years still before the Oberga Felt decision at the US Supreme Court, and today you look at the numbers are super clear. Vast majority of islands are.
Still pro choice.
Are people who again marriage equality no longer a controversial issue at all in the state of Iowa. In those things on the other side of the coin, you know, I had certainly seen our share of natural disasters. I remember in two thousand and eight going down to sandbag along the Iowa River as those floodwaters were rising. In twenty twenty, grabbing my chainsaw after a straight line windstorm decimated the community of Cedar Rapids and getting debris off
the ground there. Flooding that continue used to be a persistent challenge in other parts of the state. It is my first year in the legislature twenty nineteen. There were some really bad floods in western i over that year, and I will never forget going to the state House when I drive in one morning and there was a convoy And now these are from Ohio, but it's that
same Midwestern ethic you're talking about. Convoy of pickup trucks basically bringing hey to farmers who needed to feed their live stock and who had basically been wiped out, and just taking care of each other. And looking out for each other. And so when people sometimes ask, you know, like, well,
¶ Union leadership in Iowa leans Dem, rank & file lean GOP
why has Donald Trump had success? And I for me, this is not theoretical. So when I won in twenty eighteen for my state Senate district, I had three counties, Johnson County, which is where I live, all of Cedar County, and then a slice of Musketine County. What Cedar and Musketine County have in common is they voted for Barack Obama in twenty twelve and Donald Trump in twenty sixteen. And I won all of Cedar County in twenty eighteen.
So there are a lot of Obama Trump walls voters. Well, I knock on doors and talk to these folks, you know, to learn about, you know, issues that they were worried about, concerns that they had. And then also if this came up, you know, you votter for Donald Trump two years ago, you're voting for me, Like what's going on? What people would usually say to me is basically, I don't agree with Donald Trump on every issue, but I believe that
he cares about me in my community. I don't agree with you, Zach on every issue, but I believe that you care about me in my community, and I think that that is a thing that I would still really value. And I think that is something where you look at what is happening in the state right now, that is a very clear contrast with Ashley Hinson, who has been a rubber stamp for an agenda out of this White
House that is almost uniquely bad for a state like Iowa. Well, so I think that's that's something that's worth worth itting.
I want to dig in there a little bit because I spent a lot of time in eastern Iowa in twenty one, in twenty twenty two, twenty twenty three, I think it was twenty twenty three into this because I mean, look, there is no state home to more Obama to Trump counties than Iowa. You know, it's something I think half of all the counties in the.
Country, it's only about a third. It's only a third.
Only a third, still a lot for one state, you know, one state with four congressional districts, right, A big chunk is in Eastern Iowa. Now, Eastern Iowa has always been
¶ Rural Iowa communities feel forgotten by the establishment
the more labor union heavy part of the state. So this really is labor union members. You're you're with the Iron workers, and the leadership of many of these labor unions are Democrats, and you know this full well, but the rank and file much more independent, right, some some some Republicans, some Democrat. But they're frankly, I think, very skeptically the same reason why they're in a union, because they're skeptical of corporations. I think they're a bit skeptical
of politicians for the same way. And Trump, in some way, I think was more seemed to be more on the skeptic, you know, viewed, viewed some of these people the same way they did, right, versus a Hillary Clinton who felt like part of the establishment. Mhm. But it's you know,
¶ Iowa was in a regional recession in 2016, Trump spoke to that
this is persistent. How do you get that voter back?
Well, so you get the nail on the head. So, I mean, I think there's a few things about Iowa that we always are trying to remind people of. Number One, when you look at those swing counties, those pivot counties, if I'm remembering correctly, there's thirty one of them, and twenty three are in eastern Iowa and a slice of the other ones that are not Eastern Iowa, kind like
North Iowa and North Central Iowa area. And so if you think about where are the place is where we have lost ground, where we need to win people back. It is counties like Cedar County, which I represented for my first four years in the legislature. Went to a lot of town hall meetings. I was often the only Democrat on the panel right, you know, for legislative forums or updates. You know, knocked a ton of doors, been to cattleman's meetings and farm bureau meetings and.
Board of supervisors and school boards. And again, what I hear.
In these communities is a sense of they feel like they've been forgotten, that the establishment has not been there to fight for them, even though they work hard, they played by the rules, and they just want a better future for their kids and their grandkids and not have to lose those kids, not usually to Miami in your case, but to places like Colorado or Minnesota or Illinois sometimes. And so that is something that I hear, and that
really goes across the political spectrum. What Donald Trump did really effectively in twenty sixteen was talk about the failures of the establishment to build an economy that worked, especially
¶ Why run as a Democrat vs. as an independent?
in the Midwest. A lot of folks on the coasts did not realize that in twenty sixteen, we were in the middle of a regional recession and the most of twenty sixteen, right, And so I think the message that then Secretary Clinton had just did not feel like it really resonated with a lot of people here.
And if you look at the people who.
Have one in Iowa, including her husband, Bill Clinton, who ran on an anti establishment message in the nineteen nineties, you look at Barack Obama's success in two thousand and eight and twenty twelve, and of course Donald Trump in some respects epitomizes this anti establishment message because he was running not just against the Democratic establishment, he was also
running against the Republican establishment. I mean, you remember him being on that debate stage attacking the other Republicans who were there, attacking George W.
Bush and others.
And I think in John McCain famously, I think that that you approach that mentality from Trump spoke to a lot of those same kind of swing anti establishment minded voters.
And as we have been.
Traveling across the state, I will tell you there are
¶ Since the New Deal, Democrats have fought for workers rights
still a lot of real frustration with the establishment. You see what's currently happening in our economy. You see the lack of progress and things like campaign finance reform, and those are things that voters. You may not be able to explain all the ins and outs of exactly the problems with a super pac or a C four or whatever, but they know that the system has been rigged against them.
And that's actually why today we did our first major policy roll out, and it was all about ending that rig system, taking on the corruption, and speaking directly to the concerns the voter have because they understand there's a
¶ Wouldn't support Chuck Schumer for senate leadership
connection to what has happened in our politics and what is happening in our economy right now.
And ask you this, So, why are you doing this as a Democrat? Why not do what Dan Osborne's doing in your neighbors in neighboring state and Nebraska run as an independent? I mean I asked this question of Rob Sam early on and he basically said the only reason he wasn't running is an independent is ballot access and that maybe he would be more comfortable a being able as an independent, not because you get put in a partisan box and no matter what you say here, it's
vote counting once you get into a legislature. You know this, you were in leadership, you know what you'd like to do and what you can do are two different things. And you know it is that the old saying you campaign in poetry and govern in pros, right, it is
¶ Schumer-linked Super PAC spending millions against him
it ain't it ain't easy translating a change message to a change agenda.
Well, Chuck, here's what I would tell you. I've been a Democrat my whole life. You know, in two thousand and four, I remember being that scared kid did not see somebody, you know, fighting back against the threats that I could see to my family. And look, I didn't totally understand like that this wasn't a debate, right, these were conventions and not debates, and like so I didn't really understand, like why there wasn't a response or whatever.
And like I understand that whole thing now better. But what I will tell you is that since the New Deal, this has been the party that has fought for workers rights, has fought for civil rights, has fought for women's rights. That is who we are as a party. And I think the more focused we are at getting back to those core values of what makes the Democratic Party the Democratic Party, the faster we are going to be able to rebuild trust with voters who we have lost, and
that was part of why Chuck. When we launched this campaign and I was asked point blank, would you support Chuck Schumer for leader, I said no, because Senator Schumer is someone who has said on television that it is fine if our party rights off rural voters and blue collar voters, because for each one of those votes we lose, we'll pick up two more in the suburbs. And like that math might work in New York, even though I'm
¶ How do you avoid being painted as focused on identity & not economics?
not really sure it does, it definitely does not work in Iowa. And frankly, that is not the Democratic Party that I want to belong to party all America.
No, absolutely not.
And and and again then you know some people wonderable like wire Democrats losing ground in rural places like Iowa. You know, I mean like to me, right, I mean, it's it's it's it's pretty straightforward. And so you know, I did not hesitate to call for new leadership in the party. Now that's not always easy. I think it is, uh, you know, directly tied to the fact that there's now millions of dollars from a Chuck schumerlink super pac spending
against me in this race. But that doesn't change the core conviction that I have, which is that there are so many Iowa families who feel failed by an establishment. Who uh if you have an economy that again, it's working great for the billionaires, for the big corporations, but so many working class, middle class retired on islands cannot make ends meet.
Uh.
And there is a deep understanding that what is happening in our economy is directly tied to the brokenness of our politics, and so we need new leaders, we need new vision.
And that is what this campaign is all about.
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tell you one thing you hear pop up. And sometimes it's an excuse from somebody who wants to claim their middle of the road, and they really aren't. But that doesn't mean what they say isn't a valid point. And the point would be the problem is Democrats worry too much about the identity of others and not my pocketbook that when they get to Washington, they're worried about trans issues. They're not worried about how we're going to make ends
meet and how we're going to bring back manufacturing. And I know that it's easy to say and on all
¶ Bipartisan bill to get money out of politics in Iowa spiked by lobbyists & GOP
these things, but you know how it gets. I mean, look, Kamala Harri's got put in a box on this and they couldn't get out of it. On these cultural issues, how do you avoid it?
So I think it's really important to understand that the progress of what happens are in our economy and our progress on questions around civil rights or social issues, those often go hand in hand. Right, People, I think, generally speaking, in my experience, are much more open to thinking about new ideas on civil rights or social progress or whatever the question is if they feel economically secure themselves.
Their kids, their grandkids.
I don't think it's a coincidence that you saw, you know, obviously a massive expansion of the middle class in the post war period, and simultaneously you saw significant progress on civil rights. And I think that when Democrats lead with a focus on ensuring that we have an economy that works for everybody and not just people at the very top, and people feel economically secure, they tend to be more
open to that social change. When they see Democrats trying to advocate only for social change without addressing enough what is happening in the economy, it's like, well, hold on, I don't necessarily have a problem over here, but I'm
¶ The money in politics has gotten obscene quickly in recent years
struggling right now, and you've got to fix this first before we start worrying about these other things over there. Now, what I will say is I don't believe that we should be throwing people under the bus or anything like that. What I do think we need to do as a party is be much more concrete, and that we talk about building an economy that works for working class, middle class, for tired people, having clear ideas about how we challenge.
Corporate power and corporate greed.
We see the massive wealth and income and equality in this country. That is a threat, frankly, I think to our democracy and certainly to the future of future generations, and I think that has to be the number one priority that we are focused on. And the reason why we rolled out the anti corruption agenda today is because to build that economy that works for us, you have to start by going at the heart of the corruption of big money, special interest money, dark money in our politics.
And I'll tell you, Chuck, I have seen the impact of that influence firsthand in the Iowa Stay Legislature. My very first year is twenty nineteen. There were these large data state companies that came into Iowa started purchasing mobile home communities, trailer parks, and then jacking up the monthly lot rent in those communities, so you own the trailer, but you have to pay a monthly rent to say
¶ What would a campaign finance constitutional amendment look like?
in that community.
Exactly.
Yeah, these companies were increasing the costs in these community They were buying it by fifty percent, sixty percent, seventy percent in some cases from one month to the next. In this one company from Utah, by three parks in my district, proposing these massive increases. I was absolutely outraged by what I heard from my constituents, and so, you know, in might sound old fashioned. I went to my Republican colleagues in the State Senate and I said, look, I
know that I just got here. I know that we don't agree on every single issue, but you cannot tell me that this is a question of left versus right, or this is right versus wrong right. And so we actually got a by Parson group together. We hammered out a compromise that we could all agree on that gave my constituents and islands all over our state real protections under Iowa law. We passed that bill through the IO was Senate forty eight to zero. We sent it over
to the House of Representatives. I was told this is a done deal. Who would possibly.
Vote against this unanimous Senate? Yeah.
Two days later, get called over for a closed door meeting, and I will never forget this.
Go into that meeting.
There's a conference table with on one side of the table a Republican representative who was sympathetic to what we were trying to do. On the other side of the table was the lobbyist representing those big companies. And he's kind of smirking at me because sitting next to him holding my bill, shaking her head. Was then state representative, now congresswoman, now my Republican opponent for this US Senate race, Ashley Hinson, and Chuck I was in the room and
¶ Republican aligned PACs set to spend huge money in Iowa in the fall
I watched as she killed my bipartisan bill as a favor to that lobbyist who I found out later had bundled some money for her re election campaign, and who I found out after that was representing some of those donors who would go on to become big supporters of her campaign for the US House. So when we talk about this connection between what is happening in our economy and what has happened to our politics, I have seen it with my own eyes.
It's one of the better story that's one of the better narratives I ever because I think this is the hard thing about I mean, the amount of people in my world that I have suddenly brought up campaign finance reformed to me, and I'm talking people on the right like that. I'm hearing from that. I never would have thought.
¶ Received small dollar donations from all 99 counties, no corporate PAC $
I'm very friendly with the former governor of Ohio, John Kasick lately, and he goes man, we got to have campaign finance reform. I said, Oh, Glad, to know that you're here here now, you know, it's given him a little grief about it, But I think it's we somehow we got too obscene really quickly. Right. There was always this, Yeah, there's always money in politics. Yeah it's the mother's milk. But we are at we are at this sort of
astronomical level. And you know, I've always said the least corrupt institution legislature in the country's Congress, because there's a lot of liballs on it. And the further down you go on the legislative food chain, the more likely you're going to see whether it's a city council and zoning laws getting bought or it's a legislation. Sure, the scene you just described because we don't have a lot of watch talks right at the state legislative and at the
local level the way we used to. But here's your problem. The courts have said money a speech. What do you
¶ Anti-corruption message is resonating with voters
do we amend the constantation? Look like yep, yeah, and so yo. Look, you know the Supreme Court has said what it has said. I think that was a bad decision, but if that's what it takes, then by god, that is exactly what I skinned. What does this look like, what does a constitutional amendment on campaign money? Is it about disclosure? Is it about limits?
So I think it's about both.
So you have the superpacks that can take unlimited amounts of money, and then you have the dark money groups that five on one C fours that can take anonymous money, and then the C fours can spend money on the super packs.
I don't know if you remember, actually just.
Watched this again recently because we were working on this anti corruption plan that we released today and if anyone wants to check that out, it's on our sub stack. And I think you can go to my website at zach Walls dot com slash plan and we're going to be rolling out all of the various pieces there. But you So I went back and I watched them with Stephen Colbert from the Colbert Report when they started Stephen's super Pac and then Stephen's Shell Corporation with the C
four stuff. I mean, it is it is outrageous what is possible and what is currently happening. And I think it is really important to understand that the corruption that we are seeing, the influence that we are seeing now, look, it's not always as transparent as you know, a bribe that is taking place right that you see in some places,
¶ Can you unilaterally disarm in the face of huge Republican spending?
but you you definitely do see effects of you know, that money shaping the outcome of elections. You see it shaping the outcome of primaries. Is I just mentioned there's millions of dollars being spent in our primary and actually just yesterday a Republican super pac announcement they are going to be spending twenty nine million dollars on television in the state of Iowa in November, which I actually think is a very good sign in terms of the fact that this race.
Is very much implied.
It's on the radar, yeah, one percent. But are you going to accept money from a Democratic super pac if you're the nominee? I mean, I mean, look, here's what I would say to tell them to stay out.
I from my perspective, I think that you were going to see massive spending on this offside. This is the super packs, right, You're spending on the hard side. When you look at our campaign talking about like right now, we have raised more money than anybody else. We have done it without taking a dime of corporate pack money. We have done it by talking to individuals and people
¶ Will co-sponsor amendment to overturn Citizen's United
are really resonating with this message, not just on the campaign contribution side, but on the political piece as well. So this is a fun little story. My campaign was the first one to receive a grassroots contribution from Iowans in all ninety nine counties. Our ninety ninth county was Wright County, wrighd Up in North Iowa. Not a Democratic county. I mean, this is a county that Trump carried by almost forty points in twenty twenty four. Twenty five bucks
from a guy named Gary. Gary's a retired small town lawyer and president of his local school board, Vietnam veteran, and Gary's a registered Republican. And when Gary got us to magic number ninety nine, I called him up. I got to know him a little bit. We did not have a relationship, you know, before he chipped into the race and he got us to this milestone. But what Gary told me was that he, you know, first of all, he really appreciated my stance of public education. President of
his local school board. That matters a lot to him, and I'm a strong support of public schools. And what Gary also said was that he loves seeing a young person step up. You mentioned my age at the beginning. I'm thirty four years old to be thirty five on the election day, which is old enough to run for the US And we did double check the constitution, but Gary also loved way clear well separate story feel on that one. But Gary loved our anti corruption message. And
¶ What did you learn from your stint in leadership in the legislature?
so when we turned in our nominating petitions to get on the ballot here in Iowa a few weeks ago, state lasses you need to have thirty five hundred signatures, we had ten thousand, and you'd have nineteen counties with one hundred signatures or more. We had thirty one, and because of Gary and his wife, Susan Wright County, we had one hundred and seventy four signatures.
We literally have not.
Been able to figure out the last time that a Democratic candidate for the US Senate had more than one hundred signatures from Wright County. By the way, you did mention Rob, so I will say we had more signatures from Right County than Rob Sanded.
Not that it's a contest, but that was something to me.
When we talk about this message resonating with the voters like Gary, who we need to win in November in order to defeat Ashley Hinson, I'm telling you that is something that is resonating.
But here's the trap that campaign funding rhetoric gets set sometimes, and it may be an unfair trap, which is you don't like it, but you know that this is the way. You know, the old saying you can't go to you can't come armed with a knife to a gunfight. And you just mentioned all the money that's going to be I mean, are you if you get this nomination, do you think Chuck Schumer super pack is suddenly not going
to be interested and helping you? Maybe he will? Do you tell the look I mean, not to be an already? Do you accept the premise that this is the way the system works now and you're going to get their super pac money all over the place, left, right and center? You know, I mean, look at the state of Illinois. The progressives had super PACs on their back. The you know, crypto people, the AI people, they come in all shapes and sizes. They support progressives, they support centrists. Right.
Yeah, So, Chuck, how do you do got the question? Yeah, here's what I would tell you. I'm sure that there may be outside interests in you know, our race. We're coming into the general election in November, I think, because this is going to be one of the most competitive US and races in America, and there's a very good chance. So this is fifty one in a potential majority. And what I would tell you is if outside groups get involved,
you know, that's their decision. It will have zero impact on my belief that we have to change the system. And it will not change the fact that on my first day is United Senator, I will co sponsor an
¶ There was no clear strategic plan for Democrats to take back majority
amendment to our Constitution to overturn Citizens United, get dark money out of our politics, get corporate money out of our politics, and get super.
PACs out of our politics. That has to change.
And you're totally right that there are both sides that are using these different vehicles, and that fact being what it is, it will not change in any way, shape or form. The fact that this is a core belief that I have. It is a belief that I'm running on, and I believe it is the first step to actually reversing what is happening in our economy so we can actually build an economy that works for everyday people, because those are the people that I'm here to represent, not
super PACs, not billionaire donors. I'm here to fight from my constituents the same way that I did. Is that freshman state senator fighting for my folks who lived in those communities. And by the way, I can not give a rass ass if they were regial Republicans, independents, Democrats. They were my people and they needed a champion. And I remember being that scared eighth grader wishing that there's been somebody fighting for me. That's exactly what we're going.
To do with the US Senate.
Hey, tell me about your stint as a legislative leader.
¶ There were basic organizational issues for Iowa Dems that needed to be fixed
It seems as if that wasn't the best ending. And what did you learn? I mean I look at it. I look at at it as a it's tough to be the change agent and then like all of a sudden, you're you're hurting the cats. It's tough to do both. What did you learn from it? And how will it change? Let's assume you're elected US senator. How will it change?
How is it going to change? How you behave as a US senator, how you interact with you know what, what did you take away from that experience that will color how you go go forward.
Yeah, So for folks who were listening or tuning in what have you like? It was not something so.
I was the Senate Minority leader for two and a
¶ Needed to rebuild relationships with organized labor
half years, three legislative sessions.
It was not something that I ever thought I would do.
Uh. The woman who had been the leader when I was elected decided halfway through my first term two years in that she did not want to be in that position anymore.
Uh, for reasons that I became let me, let me, let me. It sucks to be in the leadership in the minority. I don't care what legislature later in. So Uh, the empathy, I totally get. Nobody's had one hand. Being in the minority. You get to just throw spitballs, that's true, But when you're the leader in the minority, there's this weird expectation that you can somehow get stuff done, and then you have to remind everybody we're in the minorities.
But anyway, so so so so, I mean a few thoughts on that.
So so, it was not something I ever thought I would do, not something that I coveted. Right, people in the caucus came to me and asked me to do this when the former leader decided she did not want the position anymore. You know I have you know, I saw firsthand, you know, the experience or you know that she had had. But I knew this was not going to be easy. But it was like, look, you know, I'm young, I want to work hard. Had success as
a fundraiser. I represented a district that had pivot counties in it, So I think I knew had a good ability to commune gate with voters who we needed to win back, and so signed up to do it. And I will tell you, Chuck, I was a little surprised at what I discovered when I became the leader. It just sold Will Rogers line that I'm not a member of an organized political party. I'm a Democrat, And I became.
Underly stood what that meant, right, Yeah, I mean and like and like, look, you know you're the line a lot, but you're like, what does that really mean?
I was a part time legislature so you know, people fucking has set their expectations appropriately, but being a caucus leader is not a part time job. But just the level of this organization that I saw, you know, we did not have like a clear strategic plan to get back to the majority.
A lot of the staff who I.
Was now overseeing, you know, and again I was like twenty seven, twenty eight years old, like didn't have job descriptions, didn't have clear goals, didn't see kind of how we all fit into this bigger picture, and so like a lot of what we were trying to do in the very beginning was just like getting this might sound basic, but like clarity of like what are we're trying to
¶ Stint in leadership doesn't make him have more sympathy for Schumer
do here, what's the vision, what are the goals, what's the message it's going to get us there? And then literally building, rebuilding the infrastructure, rebuilding relationships with labor. I mean, you mentioned that earlier as a place of where we've
had some weakness. And one of the things that I learned very quickly my time in that leadership role was that the experience for a lot of the labor leaders who to your point, most of them are still Democratic, but they really felt like the Democratic Party, you know, in our state had not done a good job of fighting for them, of showing up for them, being there supporting them, you know, and like I didn't have good access to lists of people who I should be reaching
out to, events that I should be going to. I mean this and again this is all really basic stuff, But at a certain level, that's kind of what politics is, right.
It is all really about organizing.
And showing up and connecting with people and meeting people
¶ Democrats didn't know what they were asking for during shutdown
where they are, And so that was something that I made a real point of emphasis. And you know, as a result of that, I think there have been some national observers who have been like, oh, I thought Walls was the gay rights guy, like, why does he have a lot of labor support, And it's it's just because I grew up in a labor household. My mom, Jackie,
was a union nurse. That union contract was incredibly important for us when my mother, mom Terry, was diagnosed with MS and going through a really really hard time with our disease. So I learned it at an early age the difference that labor made for us and the ability to have a collectively bargained contract. And as leader, I really made it a point of emphasis to rebuild those relationships, to show up, to understand the issues, and to go
to bad for people. And the one last thing I just want to stay because I think it is an important point. Even when you're in the minority, even though
¶ If Democrats get the majority...do you work with Trump?
it is more difficult to pass legislation, you can still get wins more often than you might think, and constituent service is really important even if you're in the minority. If you have a constituent who's dealing with an issue and they reach out to you, and even if you're in the minority, you send an email or make a phone call to an agency head and ask them like, hey, why is this not happening, people will still get it right.
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¶ Have a responsibility to work across the aisle if it helps people
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¶ Open to banning private equity from owning homes, anti monopoly in meat
learned that one thing Grassally and hark Andhead in common is that they were they both they were always both very well known for being really good on that stuff. Like you cannot mess that stuff up because that's a political right, and.
That's what people expect from their elected officials.
And like the only the last point I want to make on this, because you alluded how it didn't end well. As you can tell, I had a lot of ideas for like what we needed to do, and like the fact that it was not actually okay to just be comfort being in the minority, because the stakes are incredibly high, the laws that were being passed and our and my views certainly were terrible for our state. And winning back the majority was not optional. It was not something that
we would get to next cycle. We needed to really embrace the urgency that we were doing. And I always believed in leading my example, I would never expect somebody to work harder than me if they worked, you know, as a part of my team. So I took that work really, really seriously. But it meant that we had to step up our game. Whether you were on the leadership team, whether you are a rank and file member of the caucus, whether you were staff, did not matter
to me. We had to elevate our expectations. You asked what I learned. I knew that making change was hard. I learned just how hard it was as a result of that experience, I probably should have been more intentional about communicating my vision in a way that spoke to
¶ Price of fire trucks has tripled due to private equity buying up the manufacturing
members of my caucus. But the reality is that part of it was just I was willing to push people.
I was willing to.
Say that our party had to do a better job of showing up in the communities that we had not been present in. And like, frankly, it's a lot of work.
But I mean, for you, that's epathy for in this.
I mean, look, no, because he and I'll tell you this as one of I think it would be, I'd be like maybe the fourth or fifth senator in the caucus who has served in a leadership role, right, he has been around long enough that he should have had a much better understanding of the leverage that he did and did not have. And I just go back to the shutdown fight as an example of not meeting the moment the first Well, so both of them, because they're
deeply connected. Because in March, when they gave them the votes to keep the government open, they knew the clock was set to September thirtieth, right, they knew that was the next that they had coming. At what point did Senate Democrats put forward their counter offer to keep the government open. It was like the second week of September. They missed the entire summer recess. They could have been
barnstorming all over the country. They could have been in states like Aye right now, not Chuck Schumer, but other folks right could have been campaigning in Iowa right But because they couldn't figure out what they were actually asking for until less than three weeks before the shutdown deadline, you get into this this you prolonged shutdown, having missed your best opportunity to communicate with the American voters ahead of time.
And then it was you know, the ACA subsidies, which by.
The way, are totally worth fighting for, which is why throwing the towel in on them, And they still haven't taken a vote on that, and said, if I'm not mistaken.
To me, just like illustrates that he's clearly not up to the job.
Let's talk about being a US senator and you guys get the majority. Yeah, because I think this is a real open question, which is what do you do with
¶ Is the description of being the "Sanders/Warren" candidate a fair description?
the president? Where do I I don't want to put words in your mouth. Do you work with him or not? Yeah?
Of course I mean, so look, here's the thing with Donald Trump. I mean, and we're recording this on April seventh. There are some events that are happening today.
I know exactly what you're referring to. By the time miss airs, hopefully it's just yet another crazy thing he tweeted. And we're literally moving on to the next I mean, there's every chance that there are six tweets between now and when this airs that are almost as crazy as the two that you were referring to at the moment. Totally right.
And I have not been fully briefed, and I haven't been some development today.
Who knows what's happened since we started talking.
Yeah, look at your phone.
Oh my god, you're like Jesus, here's what I would tell you, Chuck, as a member of the State Senate, as a freshman legislator who's from and Johnson County is the most progressive county in the state of Iowa.
That is one percent true.
I approached the job really simply showing up finding places where I could find common ground with my Republican colleagues, because that's what they are. My first floor speech was not a barn burner about you know how evil the Iowa Republican Party is It was about a man I had met the night before during one of the polar Vartexas that had hit our state, who was homeless, was
trying to get to where he needed to go. As able to help him out just a little bit, And it was to me, again, as a freshman legislator, when we can make a difference, we have a response. Its ability to make a difference, and if that means working across the aisle, then that's absolutely what we'll do.
So if Donald Trump.
Has ideas that are good for the state of Iowa, of course I'll be willing to work with him the same way that I've worked with my Republican colleagues and the Senate to pass that bill that killed What's something There's two that I would say that I've talked about publicly. You know, he had I forget if it was a social media thing or if you got asked a question about it, but it was about private equity purchasing homes and the effect that's having on young people being able
to buy homes. If I said, if he wants to work on that, I'll be happy to work with them on it. And then the more recent thing was about anti monopoly work within the beef livestock packing space. Like that is another place where again, if he is actually serious about, you know, any of that work, I would be happy to work with them. The problem is the vast, vast, vast majority of things that this administration is put forward, like I said earlier.
Are almost uniquely bad for Iowa.
I mean, Ashley Hinson rubber Stand voted for the tariffs
¶ Part-time legislatures don't have the institutional knowledge of the lobbyists
four different times, having devastating impacts not just on our ag economy, on manufacturing, on everyday consumer products, I mean, you name it. Voted for the Medicaid cuts that in Medicaid is a lifeline for rural hospitals in this state. And voted for ending investments in clean energy, the result of which is that energy costs are already going up and are going to continue to go through the.
Roof the ACA subsidies.
I mean, all of these things right, and the fundamental problem is that the challenge in beef, livestock processing, meat packing of four companies calling the shots. That same trend is playing out in industry after industry after industry after industry.
I'll give you just one example. We were in Southwest Iowa, Caste County in Atlantic, which is the county seat roundtable discussion with community leaders there from a wide variety of different backgrounds, and one of the things that emerged in that conversation is the fact the price for a new fire engine that community turns it out in this state and in fact in this entire country has tripled over the last decade. And the reason that has happened is
because a single private equity company has consolidated forty percent. Well, was previously a very competitive manufacturing sector. So not only have they consolidated almost half of that industry, which is jacked up the price three times and ten years, the wait list has more than doubled. And fire trucks are not an optional expense for a community, right And I'm
¶ Must lead by example on anti-corruption, will only serve two terms if elected
not just saying this, by the way, because my two year old is obsessed with fire trucks, which he is. But you think people are They feel like, well, why are my property taxes going up? Well, one of the reasons why your property taxes are going up is because your property taxes are padding the profit margins for this private equity company that is getting rich off your money, holding up essentially and taking hostage.
They manufacturing not just a.
Fire trucks, but street sweepers, sewer vacs, you name it, right, and that is corporate greed and the failure of this president and frankly of leaders in both parties to really challenge that corporate power, that consolidation. That is part of what voters are so angry at and why there is so much You know, I think grassroots support for our campaigns as we are talking about it, and it is resonating with people.
Look the frankly, very simple way that this primary is being described as you're the Sanders Warren candidate and your
¶ Thoughts on "vice taxes" & gambling to help state generate revenue?
primary opponent is the is the sort of Schumer mainstream candidate. Fair description or unfair description?
Yeah?
Look, I mean I don't really think of myself as being, you know, a far left or far right person. I think most Iowas really see themselves as being people who look at the issues and trying to figure out their position. I was really honored to have Senator Warren's endorsement for this campaign, and in fact, Jockey goes back to what we were talking about a few minutes ago. You know, she and I first met back in twenty nineteen when she was running for president, and it was at the
same time that we were having back then. I did YEP in September of that year, and you know, she you know, we I'm doing battle with these big companies that are coming in screwing over my constituents, and of all the folks who were running for president, she was the one who took the most interest in figuring out what was happening on the ground and how do we fight back. And so she came and she toured communities right and talked to my constituents and heard from them,
and it was actually really really special for me. She she let me know this a few weeks ago that in this goes exactly to your question. And the bipartisan housing bill that has moved through the Senate is now, i believe, heading to conference at the House. There are two provisions in that bill that were a direct result of the work that we did together back in twenty nineteen.
And that bill, as you know, passed it things like eighty five to ten or something, and it was it was a very bipartisan bill.
And so this fundamental question is about who are you fighting for and who do you wow? Right as I was us, Senator Chuck Schumer is not going to have leverage over.
Me, right, And so when my constituents are saying, hey, this is what we need you to fight for, and I've got leadership saying hey, we need to do this, I know who I'm siding with every single day. And I'll tell you one of the most popular things that I'm running on is term limits. That is not something that is a kind of stereotypically democratic or progressive idea, but to me, it's something that I just I experience. Seeing my time in the legislature, I've seen what happens
when good people stay for too long. I think it is much worse when bad people stay for too long. And so from my perspective, having that rotating the crops right in Iowa, we know that's good for our soil. I think it's probably pretty good for Congress too.
I like that.
I just hate I'll tell you where I come. My issue with term limits is due to what's happened in most state capitals, right where there are most and this is something that I think is a I think what the rotating crops line is fantastic. By the way, I love that line.
You know who's I did borrow? I did borrow from my friend Tom Bill Sack.
Anyway, Oh look at that and old Bill Sacks, you know who's not term limited lobbyists. And one of the one of the things, yeah, I hear you on that. One of the things that happens, especially with part time legislatures, is that you just described the problem for a part time legislature. You you have the demands of a full time constituent service. You know, you've got to figure out
¶ High interest in gambling speaks to fear for economic future in voters
these bills. Some of them are quite complicated, and you're literally on your own and you have to have a job on the outside in order to support you know, everyday life and all this, and the lobbyists have all sorts of resources and the last and losing that institutional knowledge. I mean, I think that's the it's the lobbyists that sometimes dictate the legislation because they've been around longer than that. That's my only concern with with.
With term limits.
And I get it because trust me, it's too popular, not wrong, Like everybody wants that they're tired of these people. You look at Jesus, Chuck Grassley's been there how long? Right, that sort of thing.
I've bat My mom turned seventy last year. She was not even three years old when Chuck Rasse.
Was now eligible to run for president.
Does she know this, Yeah, Chuck, I've totally heard that this argument too. We don't have term limits in Iowa. The lobbyists have plenty of power. The packs have plenty of power, right, and so from my perspective, that is
part of a broader agenda. And I'd say the kind of quark and pieces of that are, you know, overturning citizens United cracking down in the dark money, the unlimited money, term limits, and then also banning members of Congress from being able to own trade sal stocks while they're in office. And the key thing on all three of those, Chuck,
is I'm leading by example. I have made a promise I will only serve two terms if elected, following the soon to be bipartisan tradition set by my predecessor Joany Ernst. I have, as you we talked about earlier, we are not accepting corporate pack money in this campaign. And that is something that again I think resonates with people because they can see what happens.
Right.
Ashley Hinson, by the way, has accepted more corporate pack money than almost any member of the United States House of representatives and that is saying something. And then the final pieces that have also made a personal promise not to own, trade, sell stock, cryptocurrency. More recently now these prediction markets that are obviously getting a lot of attention.
We address all of that in my proposal that we released today, and I will hold not just myself but my wife and my staff to that same standard because leadership starts by example, and I think that's part of what is also resonating with people online gambling.
Look, states are looking for new ways to get money without raising taxes, which is why the vices right, whether it's legalization of cannabis, legalization of sports gambling, legalization potentially
¶ How has having a two year old affected your life & job?
these betting markets, there's a societal concern, right, and that toll where's the balance? Where are you on these things? I believe has mobile gambling is it? Is it great revenue for the state? Has it been worth it? And where do you come back? By the way I say this, I enjoy gambling. I'm not going to said I'm not a I'm not, but there's a you know, we all know there's there's moderation. There's nothing wrong with moderation sometimes on some vices nobody's saying to drink a botle of
wine a night. Nobody is saying, you know, make fifteen bets a night. Yeah.
So, I mean, look, here's what I would tell you when I was legalized online sports betting. This is back
¶ Childcare costs as much as his mortgage with one child
in twenty nineteen, my first year in the legislature.
I voted no.
There was a biparson group of Democrats Republicans support it, and a bipartison group of Democrats Republicans who.
But this isn't a clean left right issue, is it? It really is not? It felt was it a more small town big town splitous?
I mean, I mean so for me, so I represent at that time Coralville, which is where I live in some Iwa City neighborhoods, and then I had rural Johnson County, all of Cedar County y Musketine County. So I had actually a very wide I mean I had communities that were two hundred people and that represented parts of Iowa City, which is about eighty thousand people, but especially representing part
of the University of Iowa. I was really concerned about the fact that people were going to be able to bet on amateur athletes in the university College setting, and I was really worried about the impact.
And this is also separate. But now the amateur athletes from we can.
From an I and all all that, all that stuff as well, and like that's a separate hour long conversation.
We're not going are promise.
Yeah, but what I would tell you is that, you know, after it passed, even though I voted no, like I downloaded DraftKings a couple of years later, and you would put a little bit of money on you know, I'm a big Packers fan, so you know, I bet on the Packers more than the Hawkeye, like a good like a good island.
My father grew up in that part of Iowa. He came away a Packers fan. That's what you do.
My mom still has these stories of watching Bart Starr and the black and white TV and the Ice Bowl and all its its.
So I don't get all these way too many Vikings and Chiefs fans have encroached in Iowa. I don't. I don't know.
Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope, nope nope. But what I would tell you is that, you know, you definitely do see the dark side. And I think you know the discussion of like, well, if Democrats, you know, oppose betting, is that going to You're going to lose young men. And I think it completely miss it, completely misunderstands. And now, look, gambling, to your point, can absolutely be enjoyable when responsible, and like I've certainly you know, enjoyed a hand of blackjack
or two, and it certainly can be fun. And putting a little action on the game certainly does increase the stakes for sure. The challenge and the reason why, whether it's crypto or online betting or now some of these prediction markets. So many young people men and women, but men because of dystosterone and higher you know, appetite for risk, what have you. You know, a lot of young men do not feel like they have economic opportunity in their future.
They worry about this world that they are growing up in where there's this massive and growing disparity between people who have what seems like an infinite amount of money
and an uncertain future for themselves or their families. And so you know, their interest in crypto or gambling or prediction mark it's fundamentally it is all speaking to the exact same thing, which is fear for their economic futures and that is the thing that Democrats need to be focused on, because what is happening in these things is a symptom of a much deeper and frankly in some respects,
more disturbing disease. The one thing I would say, though I didn't have the chance to read it quite as close as I would have liked, there was a big cover story in The Atlantic by Mickay coppin. Yeah, and I know that his writings is really high quality. But I would just tell you, you know, I have not close personal friends of mine, but you know, close people who I'm close with who have themselves lost friends due to gambling addictions and suicide and some of these things.
And it is a really unique addiction because of the fact that it does not always manifest physically. It often involves a lot of secrecy, and so there are some really unique things that I do think we need to take a much closer look at. And again going back to its connection into the NIL and the amateur athletics, to me, like that makes me very uncomfortable.
Uh, And the addiction on that's got to be settled on a federal level.
You guys, got I think, I mean, I think so probably yeah, I know that there's some separation of power stuff with federal and state government there too, but fundamentally right, I think the broader issue and this is what Democrats need to be addressing more effectively, which is what we're trying to do and lead by example again in this campaign, is have those concrete ideas about what's happening in our economy so that people don't feel like they have to
bet their life savings or what little money they do have trying to get enough money to escape the you know, quote unquote permanent underclass. Uh.
And I think that's something that speaks to a lot of people. You see, you have a two year old.
Yeah, how is uh? Everybody probably told you when you had your when you had your kid that you know your life was going to change forever, and you're like, yeah, yeah, yeah whatever. Now, how how do you take those comments?
It is the best part of my day.
You know, my wife is travel for work this week, so man solo dad duty, which, while running for the US Senate is not.
You know, the easiest for sure.
I've also been you know, look, having two grandmas, who are you know, fifteen minute drive away and Eli is their first their first grandchild certainly a huge help to this campaign. I'm very glad that there's an FEC exemption for inkind contributions because my parents are definitely way past
the federal limits. You know, we haven't even I mean, Chuck, I don't think I've mentioned this yet, but the fact that my childcare costs as much as my mortgage and we have one kid, and that is something that we hear doesn't matter for an A bite.
Should be bipartisan. I mean, jd Vance is for the childcare tax credit. It seems like this is something that has bipartisan support. I don't know why this got dropped as a Democratic priority, being.
Well, you know, Chuck, I would tell you I've seen in my own life. So this is right back in the beginning of the campaign, I had a friend from high school called them Jeff, who had moved away for a while. I'd come back and I learned that he was in Des Moines, and so I just shot him in text. Today it's been a while, I would love
to see you. Can we sneak in a fifteen minute coffee to sketch up a little bit and so, you know, first ten minutes just talking about life, in the last five minutes, says, you know, Zach, I get all your texts in your emails, and Jeff's a conservative Republican.
You know, It's like, I don't agree with.
You on a lot of what you have to say, but I will tell you this, you are one hundred percent right about the cost of childcare. And then he talked to me about how he and his wife want to start a family and they either of them want to quit working, but they literally cannot afford the combination of rent and childcare.
And then Jeff said, and again this goes back to.
My Gaary story earlier, Zach, I love your anti corruption message, the term limits, banning stock trading, you know, getting the big money, the corporate money out.
That really speaks to me. And so look, Jeff's not going.
To be voting in our Democratic primary, but he's gonna be voting in the general election. And I think the fact that you've got a message that is resident, you know, with more than just my high school buddies, but with people I think across the state.
That's part of why we're so excited about this race.
And I would have fortud not be doing my job if I didn't make sure your listeners know that if they want to join a grassroots campaign, they can go to Zach Walls dot com to learn more and make a grassroots contribution today, Zach, it's.
Been good to get to know you here. What's it going to take for Iowa football to go to that next level? The they're like in the really really really really good what's the take to get to Ohio State?
Yeah? Look, man, I'd say two things. And it's funny.
It's you just a little parallel with the caucus leadership thing. You can't be comfortable being a ten and one team. You're ten and two, like you You you got to move past this idea that.
You know, getting satisfied with nine and three and ten.
That's that's that's That's what I'm saying is like, at a certain level, you have to change your expectations that you set for yourself. And I have nothing bad to say about Kirk Farrance's time in Iowa. He's been a legendary coach for US at most wing ast he.
Did covered the past last year.
Well, you know, look, I do think and to some extent, right, I mean again, our athletic director being willing to make the tough call to let his son go.
Not easy, coach, you got to you gotta let go of your son.
Yeah, Beth has done great things for Hawkeye athletics and one of the you know, and look, the McCaffrey family are our friends of mine. Friend and Margaret have done a lot of incredible work in our community and their they're work supporting efforts against cancer. So I don't have a bad word to say about Fran or his time at Iowa either. But what I will tell you is everybody saw what Beth saw and Ben McCollum this year, and so I think the future is very bright for
Hawkeye basketball, both men's and women's. And uh, I think that we've got, you know, some good things on the horizon, but fundamentally just sets. It begins with a leader who is willing to say the way things are is not the way that they have to be, and sometimes it means making Jack.
I'm impressed you took a question about Iowa football brought it back on message. We're trying there.
You go.
Be safe on the trail. Good to get to appreciate it.
M HM.