Instant Reaction: Supreme Court STRIKES DOWN Trump’s Tariffs - podcast episode cover

Instant Reaction: Supreme Court STRIKES DOWN Trump’s Tariffs

Feb 20, 202617 min
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Episode description

In this breaking-news episode recorded immediately after the Supreme Court's landmark 6-3 ruling striking down Trump's sweeping tariffs under IEEPA, Chuck Todd breaks down what he calls one of the most consequential decisions of the Trump era — and argues the Court did elected Republicans an enormous favor. Chief Justice Roberts, joined by Gorsuch, Barrett, and the three liberal justices, ruled that the 1977 emergency powers law "does not authorize the President to impose tariffs," leaving only Thomas, Alito, and Kavanaugh in dissent — a split Chuck argues should have been 9-0 given that the Constitution plainly gives Congress the power of the purse. He contends that the 6-3 margin is critical because it prevents Trump from framing the decision as a partisan attack, and gives congressional Republicans cover to move on from a policy that has devastated America's farm economy, spooked markets with uncertainty, and could now require the Treasury to refund an estimated $175 billion to importers. With Trump calling the ruling "a disgrace" and his State of the Union address just days away, Chuck notes the president has a lot of explaining to do — particularly since he could have sought tariff authority from Congress in the spring of 2025 when he had the political capital, but instead chose to go it alone through executive action. Trump, Chuck concludes, is a huge loser here, and the uncertainty is far from over.

Timeline:

00:00 Chuck Todd’s intro - Supreme Court strikes down Trump’s tariffs

00:45 SCOTUS did elected Republicans a favor

02:00 Trump doesn’t have the votes in congress to enact tariffs

03:00 There’s a ton of uncertainty coming from this ruling

04:45 Trump has a lot of explain to do at State of the Union

06:00 Alito & Thomas always side with Trump, Kavanaugh mostly

06:45 Congress has power of purse, ruling should have been 9-0

09:00 Supreme Court has given Republicans cover

10:15 Tariffs have been devastating to America’s farm economy

11:45 Markets face a ton of uncertainty

12:30 6-3 ruling means it won’t be viewed as a partisan decision

13:00 Trump is a huge loser here

14:30 Trump could have gotten tariff authority from congress in Spring ‘25 

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Transcript

Chuck Todd's intro - Supreme Court strikes down Trump's tariffs

Speaker 1

Well, huge news for consumers, and I think that's the important win. This is a huge win for consumers and a huge win for constitutionalists. A Supreme Court in a six' to three decision ruled the president's emergency authority that he has claimed to have to impose tariffs across the. Board if you go back To Liberation day and how he's used tariffs as a coercion tool on trade, deals all of that is unconstitutional and so now we go into

a world of. Uncertainty, politically this should be great news For Congressional, republicans so hear me. Out many of These republicans don't like these, tariffs but they have not wanted

SCOTUS did elected Republicans a favor

to cross the. PRESIDENT i would say that if you had a secret vote Of Congressional republicans On Capitol, hill you probably would have a sort of a fifty to fifty split Among House republicans and probably two thirds Of Senate republicans not in favor of the president's use of tariffs and his policies toward. Here but, obviously if it's not a secret, ballot many of people want to get

caught siding with the. President but we've seen these little we've seen the tariffs have created a small, wedge and when there's been an, opportunity Some republicans have publicly shown their cards and have pushed back on the. President we saw that symbolic vote On canadian tariffs in The house a couple of weeks, ago which saw Six House republicans go on the. Record so why is that sick number Of republicans who symbolically voted to get rid Of canadian tariffs?

Important because in, theory the simplest way for the president to essentially to get this authority back and restore his ability to impose these tariffs is to go get permission From, congress go get specific authority to do what he wants to. Do the problem, was even though there Are republican majorities

Trump doesn't have the votes in congress to enact tariffs

in The house in The, senate there are not majorities in The house in The senate that are in favor of this unilateral. Authority there are plenty Of republicans who view tariffs as straight up consumption taxes and that they're essentially taxes on working. People and there's been plenty of studies that have shown the tariffs that have been imposed have been primarily paid by, consumers not by the other.

Countries Like President, trump claims or by the businesses which The president tried to browbeat into eating some of his. Tariffs and they. Did some companies ate tariffs Early hyundai And kia for a short period of time ate some of the early, tariffs but none of these companies were

going To we're going to eat them for. Long here's the real, problem, though you, know while this is politically good news in theory could be good news For republicans that are on the ballot in twenty twenty, six there's a ton of uncertainty now that comes with this. Ruling, right The president's team in a way that AND i think this was a little bit of sort of, bloviating

There's a ton of uncertainty coming from this ruling

if you, will trying to jawbone The Supreme court saying, well it doesn't matter how you, rule because if you go and rule against, This we've got plenty of ways to impose. This we've got other ways to do. This there are small ways they can do, this but it's very sector specific and it's they're certainly going to have to do it. Differently but here's the. Thing there's a whole bunch of businesses that are going to want this tariff money. Back they're going to be looking for, Refunds

so you're going to have that situation potentially. Introduced and you, know The president has been spending this tariff. Revenue he's spent more than he has collected, rhetorically if you, will, right he's always talking, about, oh we can give money back to the people, here or we can use it to pay for, this or we can use it to pay for. That, well now he's going to have to refund some of, this so you're going to see a lot of. Lawsuits he's not going to want to admit.

Defeat so the wild card here and the fact that we're living in this era of. INSTABILITY i, mean just look at the car. Weekend i'm coming to you here on A friday morning after this in court. Ruling and you, know we're also still in a partial shutdown OF dhs And american flying, public and you HAVE tsa agents working without. Pay we have the largest number of military assets in The middle gathering in The Middle east since the start of The Iraq, war where it's not clear what we're

going to do With. Iran we're going to attack them to do? What just to take out their nuclear program or are we looking for regime chains or something? Else what is this. About he's got A state of The union On, tuesday and let's just say that while he may want to talk about what he wants to do or hopes to do over the next two, years instead he's got a lot of explaining to. Do you, know how is? He you, know never mind that we just got a NEW gdb report earlier this morning that indicated

Trump has a lot of explain to do at State of the Union

the economy grew at an snail's pace in the fourth quarter of last, year part of the reason being the forty plus day government. Shutdown, now even the current shutdown now does not have that kind Of it's not is big and is not going to have that kind of impact on this quarter's. Growth but this uncertainty for business now with these, tariffs and it's been nothing but. Uncertainty

this only adds more of. It because you, know If Donald trump were a conventional, president you'd sort of take your, Defeat you'd accept the premise that you don't have the votes On Capitol, hill and you might rhetorically continue to campaign and say this is the best way to do, it and let me persuade. You that would be how a normal politician would. Behave we, know this is not how he behaves he's going to take this as a personal. Rebuke he is going to probably attack those that rule against.

Him what's interesting here is two of his appointees were on The this is a six to three, decision and it didn't quite break the way that we had seen many of these decisions when they go Against trump break. Right we've seen there's a fairly consistent three justices that are almost always there to side With trump's, arguments which

Alito & Thomas always side with Trump, Kavanaugh mostly

is Always alito And, thomas and Usually. Gorsig in this, case it Wasn't. Gorsag it Was kavanaugh that that sided

With trump on this, one which is a mild. Surprise he's usually a bit more of an, institutionalist And i'm mildly, surprised Or gorsage is every once in a while is a wild card because he does call himself a, textualist and in that, sense if you are originalist or, textualist whatever you want to call yourself in these sort of, manufactured made up legal legal views that the Federal society has created over the, years however you want to view.

Yourself you, Know congress has the power of the. PURSE i mean this to be should have been nine to oh, right and only AND i think we're seeing we're seeing

Congress has power of purse, ruling should have been 9-0

a bit of the partisanship of The Supreme court be exposed by the three people that chose not to do. This i'm looking forward to reading those discent full. DISCLOSURE i haven't ready, yet they're all still being. POSTED i think it's the descents are always. Interesting it's more important to note what the ruling itself. Is it's notable That

roberts himself wrote the. Ruling so the six' three was the, Three liberals Roberts, and barrett two of, the three sort of the, center wing as we've seen With This, supreme court but It was gorsets who joined the majority in

this case And. Not kavanaugh AND like, i said we've been seeing sort Of A supreme court that's more divided in three in that you Have The, trump conservatives which Are Normally, alito thomas and in course it's not in this case the Institutionalists that roberts has worked really hard to try to, Have kavanon barrett on, his side and these, institutionalist things so he's not the only one siding with the.

Three liberals and then you have the, three liberals and so in, that sense we still have that basic, split there but in, This case Coursu's in kavanaugh swap swap there a little, bit so but it is two Of the president's and pointees went. Against him and we all know he personalizes. These things he thinks because he appointed somebody than their job is to always abide by what.

He wants that's not how our system was supposed to Work in this is why lifetime appointments, matter, here right is if, they Didn't the president would fire members Of The supreme court that voted. Against him so just a reminder that some of these things that are uncomfortable that some people, don't like like the, lifetime appointments it is

for reasons like this that you're glad that they. Do exist but let's talk about the political fallout here a. Little bit this, in theory could be huge news for Any congressional republican who was uncomfortable defending raising taxes On the american consumer because that's what these tariffs, were doing and wanting to push back without alienating the. President's Base

supreme court has given. Them cover and so One thing i'm looking to over the next seventy two to ninety six hours is how many Of those republicans publicly express this,

Supreme Court has given Republicans cover

relief publicly now say you know What The supreme court, is right this is a Decision, of congress and, you know and maybe, THEY say i would love to support the president having. This authority let's bring a Bill. To congress now that's that's something that would. Bog down and That's what. I'm curious how is the president going to? React here he's going to see if he can do this without Going, to CONGRESS because i don't think he has,

the votes or he can try to Strong. Arm congress and one thing we have learned is when he, does engage he can get there might be Enough nervous republicans about losing his support with the base or primary challenges that they could. Go along but they would have to do this under some form of a reconciliation because he can't get sixty votes In. The senate it's going to have a hard enough time getting fifty if he really

was trying to strong. Arm THIS and i, You Know john thune doesn't want to vote for, Any tariffs none Of the Midwestern. Republic bilicans this has been, a devastating Devastating to america's. Farm economy and so That's what i'm going to be looking for is How many republicans publicly celebrate this ruling By The, supreme court, you know because

Tariffs have been devastating to America's farm economy

they will sort of expose themselves as sort of The quiet trump opposition that didn't want to speak out until they had some cover From The. Supreme court others may not, say, anything right, That is normally those that are Happy that trump's been rebuked usually don't want to get caught celebrating a Rebuke, of trump fearing alienating. His base so you may see a large Number of republicans try not to react at all while they wait to see how dear leader.

Spends this but make, no mistake this is a. Huge RULING it's, I LOOK i'm i always hesitate them to, speak, about well how the stock market's going, to react and we're one hour into Trading as i'm taping. This VIDEO but i would assume the markets are going to be happy and relieve on that, Front, that okay this means that it's going to be harder for him to. Impose tariffs so, in, theory uh, it should it should clean. Things up but there's a lot of handshake. Trade deals

do they get? Up ended does these investments that the president claims countries have promised to make do they get? Pulled back so it doesn't. Like, everything look we're living in. This incredibly just just this weekend shows you this uncertainty With the we're still in the midst of a. Partial shutdown we have more military assets In The middle east than we've had since the start Of The. Iraq war he really has Some informed congress exactly of what his plans.

Are here is he just trying to take out? Nuclear

Markets face a ton of uncertainty

sites is he trying to use this as a negotiating ploy or is this the beginning of? Regime Change, and okay what do we do after the after the first few days Of? Bombing iran than? What so and here's another THING that i think is an Intangible that i'll be looking for. The more, you know this being a six' To three, supreme, court ruling right it's not going to be viewed as. A partisan, decision you know it's going

to be as a decision. About our constitution those That Are non maga republicans who have been less and less, Comfortable with him does this open? Up the door do

6-3 ruling means it won't be viewed as a partisan decision

you start to see does to quote use my Favorite Quote of harley barbara, good gets better. Bad gets worse does losing sort of make him look more, Like a loser and we know the president hates looking, like a loser but he's. A loser here he is a. Huge loser here this is a reminder that our constitution. Is still working there are, Checks and balances and we know he doesn't react to losing, very well well and so.

Trump is a huge loser here

He may overreact he, may get angry he may and it's that uncertainty that's always. Unsettling on this, but big picture this could be a sigh of relief for a bunch Of. Vulnerable congressional republicans i'll be curious to see, how they react how they try to show that they're. Happy with this there is there a middle ground they can do that doesn't. Alienate the president how? Does he react do they really have this backup plan? Ready to go do they essentially bull those forward and hope there are,

more you know and essentially dare more. Lawsuits to happen does he try to do what a normal, president would do which is go see if you can get Your. Authority From congress but i'll tell you this goes BACK to and i said this very EARLY on when i started my independent PODCAST here that i thought the entire rollout of the first three months was just incompetent In

How this. White house ran the fact that they didn't anticipate that them taking shortcuts was only going to make the courts a huge impediment to them was something many. Of us foresaw but the president had a sort of a sixty to ninety day honeymoon period with. His own party he had congressional Majorities, in the House. In the senate he could have gotten A very compliant congress back in the spring of twenty five to give. Him this

Trump could have gotten tariff authority from congress in Spring '25

authority but he didn't. Do IT right and i think it was because he knew there was. Some hesitance there he knew that maybe he didn't want to risk losing a vote where you might Have Guys like Chuck Grassley and john thune, and you Know all these midwestern senators going against. Him on this but he was at the peak of his influential powers in the spring and when he first in that first ninety days. Of his presidency

but he. Didn't do that and this is it's always a reminder WHY it's why i sort of Reassure people why i'm not as concerned about the long Term impact of trump that Other people are trump is too lazy to impose things for. The long term he's always in a hurry to. Get a headline he's always in a hurry to look like. He's doing something but he does it with an executive order which can, easily be overturned or he does it with an odd interpretation of congressional

authority which. Now got overturned and so the fact that

he didn't want to do this. The legitimate way he was trying to find a shortcut to look like he got early victories and that he could sort of bull those, his way through he actually has made it a Lot easier to this is a reminder that overturning some of his sort of executive orders and his bad interpretations of congressional authority are, not very difficult and so the change he's trying to impose is going, to be actually in some cases a lot easier to uproot because he's done

this with shortcuts in. The lazy way, but bottom line good news for consumers and that ultimately right this is there is a chance we could, see a flattening at least a little bit more, of a flattening and maybe the threat of continued inflation. Starts to abate but of

course the wild card. Is the president how, does he react how does He try, to you know he never accepts, losing very well and that uncertainty might table whatever potential good news we may feel as Consumers or congressional republicans may feel in that a bad idea might finally, be shown, OFTEN all right i will Likely, see you monday unless we start A war with iran a lot sooner than many of. The experts believed

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