The Burden | 8. Judgment

Hi, Steve Fishman here, creator of The Burden as well as the number one true crime podcast, My Friend The Serial Killer. For those of you who liked The Burden, I have good news. Season two starts August seventh. It's a series called The Burden Empire on Blood and it's the director's cut of the true crime classic Empire on Blood, which reached number one on the charts when it debuted half a dozen years ago. Then the fat cat funders

Previously on The Burden.

So the judge said it right there, somebody's planning on corner Scarsella.

And he made that decision that I did, which is preposterous.

Holy shit.

We won.

I'm sure in Derek fifty five report in the bottom of this that has Detective Scarseller Lewis Scarseller.

I can't run off in the sunset. I get the souls left behind, right, I know nothing? Who was innocent?

You can't tell me, isn't you gotta be serious there, there's no games here. This is freedom here.

I look forward, whooping yell ass in court.

The floodgates had opened. Many of those convicted, with the help of Detective Scarcella, were back in court. They wanted their convictions overturned. In each hearing, Scarcella testified, and in each hearing Derek Hamilton sat quietly in the back of the courtroom until one day in twenty sixteen.

I was very upset when I came to the courtroom that day and he was sitting in there like he was a star. He was proud of who he was as a detective.

He way, hey, Bob and Joe and now like all his friends were here and this was a joke. I went up to a massine, why the fuck did he framed me for this murder? And he said, this is not the place, not now.

What is the fucking done? If I ever could have killed the man? That was the day.

Scarcella's attorneys hustled Louis out of harm's way, But a blow of a different sort did land on Scarsella. This one came from the judge in the case.

That judge's decision contained a scathing attack on Scarcella, his police work, his attitude, his morals. Judge Sean Dia Simpson trashed him personally. He showed no ris expect for the rules. She wrote.

Scarcela has been regarded as a legend in the NYPD for his number of homicide arrests, and there is a saying, when it's too good to be true, it usually is.

Then came the hearing to free one of Derek's closest friends and one of those supposed victims of Scarcella, an AI team law partner named Nelson Cruz.

Derrick. He always told me before he went home, He's telling me, listen, don't worry about it. I'm gonna comfort you. Trust me. He kept telling me that I'm gonna comf for you. When I make it home, I'm gonna come for you.

He kept his.

Words, and he's here if I need anything, he's there. And she got me while I'm at today. I'm in court today with my case. Hopefully I'm hoping to go home in a week.

Nelson may have good reason to be optimistic. Guess who the judge is in his case.

That's right, Judge seande As Simpson.

I'm a sinner, baby, I'm all the power you need now I'm out of the bottom.

I'm gonna set you free.

Welcome to the burden. I'm Steve Fishman.

And I'm DA's Devin Ross. In this episode, judgment.

Nobody's got any fucking balls.

Nobody we knew something was wrong in that damn courtroom.

Murder literally pays.

I've been fighting for my freedom for the longer. Dinner with a lot of people.

She destroyed me on three cases.

Never never, never, never count your chickens before they atch.

You gotta hold all time.

Judge on Dia Simpson's decision had changed everything. She'd concluded that Scarcella's investigative practices were corrupt. This was a huge deal. Now all a convicted person had to do is proof Scarcela had played a meaningful role in the investigation, and then their conviction could be thrown out.

The appeals court upheld her decision, and that meant the bar had officially been lowered. The burden to reverse a conviction had now become much easier to clear.

I needed to talk to Judge Simpson about her momentous ruling. But judges don't usually talk to reporters. It's not considered proper conduct for an impartial arbiter. I emailed, phoned her office, didn't respond. So I did what any journalists would do. I sent her flowers. The day before the hearing was to start, I showed up at her chambers unannounced, and she appeared in her black robe. She met me in the lobby and she seemed delighted the flower guys. She

You think Scot's Owa did it on purpose? Well, yeah, but you know what he had to do, what he had to do.

He did a lot of frickod things, a lot that was just plain.

Eva, just plain evil. I don't know. I hear that, and I think, how can a judge, a sitting judge, say this about a detective, a cop, someone who's also on the side of the system. I mean, I have to be honest. I don't think I've ever heard something like this before.

And Scarcela is about to appear before her in court at Nelson's hearing. For Nelson, this is great news. I mean she thinks that star detective in his case has done evil for Derek too. Let's face it, this looks like fantastic.

Luck Nelson's case. It's personal.

He's a young man at the system fucked around, and you remember it happened to you.

I heard for that kid every day, every fucking day. Here's a kid who lost it's mother, like I lost one. You gonna give that becks.

Can't get it back.

Derek's known Nelson crew since their days on the actual innocence team. Remember Nelson was like an intern. He's the one who'd make Derek's coffee through a sock. As Nelson's hearing approaches, I check in with the key players by phone, Like Louis.

I think that you're probably don't have the luckiest judge.

I would bet, I would bet get the judge overtur into this. She destroyed me on three cases. I am the oppressor of the minority community.

This is nothing new.

No one has the balls because she's a woman and she's black. No one has the bulls to put this woman in her place.

I also talked to Nelson's lawyer, Justin Bonus, on the eve of the hearing. He's psyching himself up, so you're there.

Yeah, I'm here.

I'm actually strapping right now for them all with bed. Keep the pressure on and stay focused.

Honorable Jeg Sipson is residing.

It's March twenty six, twenty nineteen. Nelson Cruz is best shot at freedom begins today far.

Diping number three six six, nineteen ninety eight. The matter of Nelson scruise.

So, Steve, you were there.

Yeah, And I'm sitting about a dozen feet from the judge so I can see them lead Nelson Cruz in. The officer unlocks his shackles, which gives me the chills. Nelson is tall and thin. He wears a knit cap a white shirt. He's been in prison for over two decades, since he was seventeen years old.

Justin Bonus on behalf and Nelson threw his good morning office.

Justin Bonus is a newbie. Law school had not been easy for him. He'd flunked out after his first year, lived in his car for a while. He hadn't been practicing for very long when he stepped into judge Simpson's courtroom, but Derek believes in him.

Justin will stand up in front of a judge and state judge, you're run and be upset and angry and argue.

And he's young enough to be bothered.

And maybe it's okay that Justin is a novice. Derek is sitting in the back of the courtroom, handing out black caps that say victims of Detective Scarcella and texting Justin instructions.

Derek is literally Google Legal.

That's what my nickname is. So let me talk to Google Legal real fast.

You know, the hearing is packed with reporters. We've taken over the jury box. Judge Sandia Simpson shows up late, oddly late. During breaks, she jots with me, calls me the flower guy, even gives me her cell number.

Wait a minute, she actually gave you her phone number.

Wrote it down on a scrap of paper and pushed it across the desk to the flower guy.

Bonus went first.

Oh, Louis Barcella's involved in this investigation, because this is like Louis Barsola.

Isn't just He's not just here and and mom and this this is his case.

Over the phone, I described the scene to Louis.

First thing he does is he gets up and it's like he delivers an opening state. Basically, he says his argument is it's a scar seller case. Oh god, this will not make you happy. But Judge Simpson journs the hearing for the morning, and before everybody leaves the courtroom, she picks out Derek Hamilton, walks up and gives him a big hug.

I don't believe it. I don't believe it, Derek. Oh my god.

I caught Simpson talking to Derek on my handy recorder.

He said, I believe in you. Then I believe in you.

Know I asked Derek about this moment.

She believed in the changes that operate.

I mean she believes him in this fight.

Back to Louis, do you have any other good news?

I mean, it's it's over. It's over. Before it started.

I also called bonus.

If I'm justin bonus, something wants a good thing.

Yeah, never never, never, never count your chicken.

Before that, Nelson's wife was feeling so optimistic she brought him a change of clothes like she was expecting him to be freed straight from the court room.

Okay, so what is the evidence in this case, just lay it all out for us.

The crux is probably this. There was actually a cop at the scene of the crime and he arrested the man holding the murder weapon.

Do you swear or from the testimony you are about to give this court will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

I do, thank you very much, you seated. This is the cop at the scene. He doesn't remember anything from the night of the murder, after all, it was about twenty years ago. So the prosecutor hands him the report he wrote that night. He reads from it.

I was inside the car when I heard the gunshots coming from the left of our patrol car. I exited the car and I saw a number of muzzle blasts coming in front of me.

People started running in every direction.

My attention was drawn to a male Hispanic pointing a black gun towards Bradford Avenue. I yelled at him a number of times to put the gun down.

The officer arrested a male Hispanic, but that male Hispanic was not Nelson Cruz. It was a man named Eduardo Rodriguez.

So just this time the people call Eduardo Rodriguez.

Eduardo Rodriguez comes in wearing what looks like a maitred D's outfit. The prosecutor asks him his first question, a really simple one.

Back in March of nineteen ninety eight.

How tall was Nelson Cruz? He was? He was really ta kid, he mumbles. Even the court reporter can't understand him.

He was, I was.

And how tall are you?

Six six five?

I'm sorry, you're you are six ' five. I'm sitting really close to Eduardo Rodriguez.

Is he hallucinating? He's not nearly six foot five. Even the prosecutor is surprised.

You're six feet five inches tall, he said.

From the bench. Judge Simpson instructs Eduardo to stand back to back with the prosecutor.

Fair to say that.

The witness is about Friday Fidy.

Okay, I drink from.

Repeat that, Eduardo says, I kind of shrunk as I got older, apparently afoot.

So you're in this jury box with all these other reporters. What is going on in your head?

I'm thinking, I'm not gonna believe anything this guy says. And this guy is a crucial witness for the prosecution. The night of the murder, he was initially arrested and taken to the precinct. After all, he was found with the murder weapon in his hand, but somehow he walked out a witness. Then Scarcella and another detective drive Rodriguez to the apartment where Nelson lived with his mother. Scarcella obtained a photo back in the car, he showed the

Bonus would seem to have a lot to work with. I mean, he's got a witness who doesn't know his height, and the same witness who had the murder weapon in his hand the night of the murder.

But in his cross examination, Bonus struggles.

Why do you think, and this is just if you know, why do you think an officer would believe that you had a weapon in your hands?

I mean, this is basic, basic criminal law. You can only ask a witness about things they know.

Well, Judge, Judge, he's asking to speculate as to someone else's state of mind.

You can't do.

I take it, Bonus couldn't reach Google legal.

Let's rephrase it.

I know where you're getting at.

Just take it. Tom tick about.

Judge Simpson would like to help Bonus rephrase, but she's forgotten the question.

We had just the court report to read that because I lost some words.

You did that last part sing it.

This is not normal. What are you thinking? Just talk to me about what's going through your mind.

Hey, I can sum it up. I'm thinking, what the hell is going on in the halls of justice? This whole thing is painful to listen to. Had to check in with Bonus.

I'm a young guy, you know what I mean. I gotta work out some of my kinks.

I asked him about Eduardo Rodriguez.

I'm not gonna think about it anymore. I mean, this guy is just you know, she's a lion, suck as shit.

But in any case, Rodriguez's testimony shouldn't matter all that much to the fate of Nelson Cruz.

Right, because the burden of proof is simple. Simpson laid it out in her prior decision show that Scarcilla had a consequential role in Nelson's case, and all should be good. Nelson's conviction should be overturned, and.

So defense call detective Scarcelo.

That's in a minute.

Scarcella arrives in the corporate in the jury box, photographers, leaning cameras go wild.

Scarcella is sixty nine now, his hair is thinning. He's wearing a suit. To my eye, he looks a big rum book, but he's smiling. He's confident.

We have the tape, and finally we get to hear Louis Scarcella under oath on the stand.

I do yeah, and listen. I'm hoping for fireworks. This is a showdown.

Good morning, Detective Scarcella. Is it all right if I call you Detective Scarcella?

Sure, it's comfortable. I've seen that term enough.

Justin's referring to his notes. There are long pauses between questions. Scarcella on the stand appears calm. He's really relaxed. He's also flanked by his two lawyers. Bonus eases into the examination. This might be a showdown, but Justin Bonus is playing nice. He knows Louis served in the Navy.

Yeah, my father was in the Marines, Douglas, God bless you too for your.

Safe So they've God blessed each other. Okay, great, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, on with it already.

So Bonus does shift gears. He asks Scarcela about his hundreds of arrests.

How many of those arrests resulted in convictions? You know, I have no idea, no idea.

I think all of them.

All of the night, I didn't possibly well, I don't remember.

I don't remember.

Do you stand by all the investigations you've conducted.

Louis had gone into the hearing thinking it was over before it began. Now he's feeling like Bonus gave him the chance to say just what he wanted. I did nothing wrong.

I was disappointed. I wanted to say for another two hours, I think I would have given him enough more wealth to hang himself. And I gave him the thumbs up time.

When I walked out and Dax, there was something else surprising. This judge, the same judge who told me that Scarcella was basically an evildoer, seemed kind of nice to him. She waved past objections. He won't ask, She was solicitous, she was patient.

I guess he's thinking.

Bonus asked about doctor Phil. The judge was like a fangirl? Did you sorry? Did they shared a lad.

You do?

What did you like of the judge?

She was so nice to you. I think she has a crush on me.

I think even she's saying this, there's a lot of bullshit.

It was a zero for the defense.

I should have fucking.

Hugged us, son of a bitch, A son of a pitch.

I should have fucking.

Hugged us like Derek hugged her. But guess what, Derek doesn't think any of that matters. He likes what he heard in the courtroom. From my point of view, we've met that burden of proof.

Were right.

I kind of agree. I think Louis is misunderstanding the legal dynamics. Yeah, Bonus's command of procedure is inexpert, but justin elicited certain important admissions.

So you were the detective organized the surrender of mister Kruz if you want, if you want to say that should why would you? Why did you take the photo? Did you show what Edward Rodriguez I did?

I certainly did so.

Is it fair to say you did something right?

Yes?

Derek believes that something is enough. Scarcella had a lot of chances to do is evil, and in Derek's mind, that should meet the burden to overturn the conviction. It's Derek who drafts the briefs or Bonus and He's already thinking about what he wants to write.

I'll planned to the judge and plain English, what the issues is that? What the bird approval? Oh, I'm sure that that would be, you know, case closed, The closes.

That both sides rest. Everyone waits for the decision. Five months past, and then finally the day comes.

We had a mic near the judge and overheard bits of her conversation. A clerk tells her the press is coming with cameras. She applies. Judge Simpson's court attorney reviews the decision with her, the one she's about to deliver.

A tough one.

This is tough one, she says, The case is a tough one. Then, weirdly, right before the court is called to order, she asks her court attorney a question.

Would you grant the motion? So Judge Simpson, with cameras worrying and people's lives hanging in the balance, wants to note if her court attorney would grant the motion to free Nelson. What something is terribly off right now?

The court attorney demurves.

I thought, what, I don't know on what basis? And this seems like this is news to the judge and she's about to read this decision out loud.

Anything you want to say beforehand, excuse me, Rol, anything you want to say beforehand.

No, I think we're all right.

The defendant was granted the hearing giving the relations of compromise police practices. It was a difficult case. Substantial testimony was taken in this hearing. Eighteen witnesses were called. Significant issues were raised in the course of the testimony taken. Although the involvement of detectives Garstella was a great concern as to the reliability of the investigation. In this case, the defense failed to effectively undermine the evidence upon which

A family left heartbroken. Justin jumps up from his seat. He's outraged. He's about the same age as Nelson Cruz. He thinks of Nelson, who turned seventeen on the day of the murder.

These little kids, we're gonna believe that on the day of his birthday. He chise, somebody, let's think about that for a Second's.

Sixteen Judge Simpson listens and then and this is bizarre, gets up, turns and walks.

Out through.

Normally a judge calls a recessor will adjourn the hearing before leaving. But that's not what happens right in this instant Steve. She gets up from the bench, turns on her heels, and exits exactly.

And the reporters we have no idea what's going on.

In all of my years as a reporter, I've never seen anything quite like this. The judge stood up in silence and walked out of the court room.

Finally, a clerk announces that court is adjourned until the afternoon. When court resumes, there's another strange turn. Judge Simpson calls Justin Bonus to the bench. She wants to have a word, she whispers. And Mike was there so they.

Might the little turn of things. And I know you put your heart on something of your case. I know I know your passion, I know you're dry. It's a tough one. There may be some more work to be done. They were doing some research ourselves.

I'm going to clean some stuff up and.

Reread off the records. I'm gonna vacation your so I got it refreshed, recollectious.

Okay, hold up, Hold up. She confesses that she is not sure she got it right, that she hasn't read the record. Could be a little turn. She's saying that she might change her ruling.

I broke news of the decision to Luis Scarcela by phone.

But did she She did not vacate.

Correct, she did not vake cake.

He is in shackle all right, Steeve. I don't you know, Steve, I gotta tell you something. This is very fucking hard for me. I'm over here in Maryland on the beach with my whole family, and to day she just likes to do this, and you know, it's just fucking look, you know what fucking shecause. I mean, I'm happy. I'm happy, Steve. I'm very happy. And uh, I'm very happy for the first time, and I a Steve listened to me, Steeve, Steve, I didn't do any of these things that they said

We caught up with Derek.

So you must have been shattered when Judge Simpson.

Devastated. I remember being him, Steve. I remember sitting to.

See Yeah, I'd sat through that hearing for days and I still didn't understand. I had so many questions. Judge Simpson had given me her cell phone number. I called it and guess what she invited me for that interview, the one she promised me when I sent the flowers.

I respect you wholeheartedly, always had and the first time I met you.

That's in a minute.

I am nervous.

I get into my car with our producer Saxon. It's several months after the decision, so let's review the chronology.

So yesterday we go out from Brooklyn to where she lives in South Orange. We run in a little late, so I text her and say we're running about fifteen minutes late.

We have a noon meeting with her, and she texts backs.

Saying, Oh, I just have to run into the city running to DMV.

I'll be back soon.

You and I both know that no one runs into the DMV, especially from South Oreg, New Jersey, and is back soon. That's at least a two hour round trip.

You are right, I mean it's baffling. So wait, do we dig around?

Do we cancel?

I really wanted to push your head. So Saxon and I set up at a local cafe.

So two o'clock comes around, we're drinking coffee.

You get a text message, I am on my way back. Now we're driving back to her house and we're like five minutes away and the phone rings. It's a woman named Anna who says she is Sean DIA's assistant. One of Seanda's kids has gotten very sick and Shendya has to reschedule.

So now it's back to New York.

Okay.

So an hour later, we're just crossed through the Holland Tunnel and there's a Raleigh, North Carolina number on the phone.

Okay, I'm at a red light.

Hello, Okay, this is Steve Fischman.

Correct, Yes it is.

Yes, I'm reaching out on behalf of my client, Shandy a symptom. I'm just going to as you know that you need to cease communication with her directly. Any further communication needs to come through week.

Oh okay, could you tell me why.

I mean we were just invited to her place today.

I will be contacting you via text matches or we conduction any further communications.

Thank you so much.

Do you have a great day.

A half hour later, we're in Brooklyn. Are you about to drop me off?

And who calls Judge Sean Dia Simpson.

Sorry, I'm just driving. I just pulled over.

Oh that's okay. No, I had to. I had to get my driver's license renews. So I had to go downtown and get that done, which was great because it's like I got to check that off the list.

Yeah, yeah, that's really good. I actually I felt bad because we could have just met here in uh New York. Oh, that's true.

I know.

I thought about it AFTERCA. I was really eager to talk because I feel like you're really pivotal in that, you know, whole narrative of the change of the justice system.

Oh that makes me feel so well. One, I respect you wholeheartedly, always had from the first time I met you. The best thing I remember about you is bringing me flowers.

Well, I'll bring you to remind you.

Yeah, let's get together. We got to make this happen because you know I'm here for you.

We set a date.

Okay, so we'll see you tomorrow.

It's one.

Thanks.

That sounds gay.

Okay.

Bye.

So where we are now on the New Jersey Turnpike repeating le groundhog Day what we did yesterday.

And still wondering if at the end of our drive she's gonna be there.

Yeah, Oh my god, I'm nervous now.

Thankfully, Judge Simpson is at her house. She's been on Leaf for a few months. Actually, the Leaf started right after Nelson's decision. She told me it was the first break in her professional life. She's wearing jeans, a gray sweater, uggs. A couple of dogs are running around. She's a gracious host.

So we have like different rooms, like like this is a great room here, this is like my piece and tranquility room.

We got the Gold room and the Green room.

And then then we sit down. We're bunched together at one end of a large dining room table.

That one, it was back to back to back to back people.

Yeah, Nelson cruise.

That case Nelson cruise.

That was another hard one.

Yeah, what was your what was your thought on that? I had the feeling that you made up your mind, but you weren't sure.

And it's a case that bothered me. It was a case that bothered me because you remember too, because there was okay, there was Nelson cruise.

I remember it was what was that, Jude Simpson gathered your thoughts the phone rings.

It was you know, it was tough. It was tough.

We hold on, well, we hold on for less than a minute fifty seconds to be exact. She sits down with us again.

You had just come back from vacation on that one, and that funds like what a way to come back from vacation, because.

You know, yeah had in one place.

Yeah, you were you were reading the decision and obviously a very tough case.

Yeah, which one?

Which one was Thelon Cruise case?

Yeah?

And I just that case that will always kind of bother me. It was just a lot happening in that case. And it's something like I kept reading stuff over and over. I probably have stuff more in my office. I should probably read all this stuff. That Nelson Cruiz case kind of did bother me.

How about Scarcella's involved, Yeah, I just made a place like what.

I think that put it this way. I don't think he's a bad man, and I think he tried to do the right thing, and I'm gonna give him credit for that. I mean, you know, you got to accept people for who they are, and I think that sometimes you see people in their mask and it's just like, oh he's a bad guy. He's a bad guy. But Scarcela, you know what, he had a nice history there and he tried to do the best that he could.

Put it.

That way, Steve, this is the same woman who told you just a few months earlier that Detective Scarcella had done evil things.

It's confusing. Did she really change her mind? Chanced to like read and through that decision?

The Nelson Cruise decision before you? You had to read it before everybody.

No, I read it a couple of I read it. In fact, I still have it.

Someone there's not here with me. It's probably no office.

Then Nelson Cruz, that was a hard one.

Well thought he was guilty.

You thought he was innocent? Nelson?

Yeah, I thought he.

Was probably more innocent than guilty.

I thought so.

And around this point I turned to Saxon and scribble a question, is she high?

You know?

Nelson Cruise was seventeen?

That bothered me.

Too, Saxon wrote back, early dementia. How about a DMV yesterday?

Uh, what happened to DMV yesterday?

They're doing their dB yesterday.

I was supposed to do something in dB something happened.

What happened at DMV?

I was supposed to do something at DMV.

We'll come back. We're gonna let you go.

Thank you so much.

It's so great to see you.

Appreciate you, mak your time for all.

I appreciate it.

Thank you, thank you.

We will take care of that, all right, Thank you.

I'm rolling still.

That was rough.

There's no way she could have really conducted that trial, like giving her currency capacity. She just disappeared from the.

Bench turn half hour break, two and a half hour break.

But she didn't say it was a break. She just disappeared. That kind of makes a little more sense.

Now, Yeah, it all makes sense.

Now.

That's about the time I called you, Dex. I needed your take on this. Journals aren't supposed to take sides. We're not supposed to or.

A field or one side or the other.

What's going on? We're a neutral ring.

Yeah, I'm thinking, frankly, I'm.

Thinking about my duty to Nelson Cruz.

I'm thinking about my duty beyond my journalistic duty.

This has consequences. This is untenable.

How did people let this go on?

Am I going to be one of those people who let this go on?

We can't just not.

Do anything, Dax. I think we've got to reach out to Derek.

I mean, he has to know.

We knew something was wrong in that damn courtroom.

We just couldn't get our hands on it.

Derek wanted to get Justin Bonus on the line, Justin, can you hear me?

Yeah?

I wish I could say I was surprised.

But at the same time, I'm blown away.

I mean, how bad was it, Steve? I mean Derek said it.

Was bad, but how bad? Oh?

It was?

It was?

It was so striking that I felt.

Guilty being there. I didn't really know who.

I was talking to at that point. I don't even really know what to say.

Totally.

It's outrageous, Okay, it is. It's really disturbing.

Everyone around her had to have known, I mean, had minimum, her assistant, the court attorney, all those clerks, I mean they're around her every single day.

And her bosses. The knowledge had to be widespread. She'd previously been quote unquote disciplined for tardiness and lack of productivity in fractions, for which she was shipped to the Bronx, where they assigned her less consequential matters. Shout out to the Bronx, where Brooklyn's problems apparently go to hide.

Soon after your meeting, Judge Simpson resigned. The official reason in the press release. Early onset Alzheimer's Bonus submitted an argument that Judge Simpson wasn't competent to preside over the hearing and that Nelson Cruz should get a new one. Another judge was assigned to review the record, and this

I'm thinking of those officials who called Scarcella a rogue and blamed this rogue for so many misdeats. Really, the whole system ran over Nelson. No one spoke up, and it was clear to me at least she was not capable of making a decision on Nelson's future. Another judge had the chance to overturn Judge Simpson's ruling, but he upheld.

It beside man because they know who committed that crime, they didn't care, and that kid is still in prison. I try to stay so busy that I don't think about.

It next time. On The Burden, Derek Hamilton's case solved.

I mean, the story just doesn't work.

Could not have happened.

The way she says it does.

So if you couldn't be doing all the things that she said happened.

It boggles the mind. It boggles the mind. It boggles the mind.

All now, I'm mama.

Bon I'm going to steffree.

The Burden is created by Steve Fishman. That's me.

It's hosted and reported by Steve Fishman and Dax Devlin Ross.

Story editor is Dan Bobkoff. Our senior producer is Simon Rentner. Our producer is Sanam Skelly. Associate producer Austin Smith. Fact checking by Sona Avakian. Our production coordinator is Davon Paradise. Mixing and sound designed by Mumbo Media. Our executive producers are Fisher, Stevens, Evan Williams and me Steve Fishman. Additional production help from Josie Holtzman, Isaac Kestenbaum, Naomi Roner, Lucy Souchek, Drew Nellis, Micah Hazel, Priscilla Alabi, Saxon Baird, Katie Simon,

Number one.

Season two of The Burden Empire on Blood will be available everywhere you get your podcasts on August seventh. All episodes will be available early and ad free, along with the exclusive bonus content on Orbit's newly launched True Crime Clubhouse as subscription channel on Apple Podcasts. It's only two ninety nine a month.