#72 - Drag-On

He was the proof to DMX is Eminem, you know what I mean? Shout out to drag Man, all right, listen, had a dope conversation with him. Unfortunately, the audio got a little fucked up. So if you noticed the audio sounds a little weird, shit happens on our end. It's all right. It's still still a good listen, so check it out. Dragon talking about all kinds of shit, DMX passing away obviously dope Rough Rider stories. Shout out to our sponsors, though odd socks Man, those guys whoo much

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are yo. So you just put your first album out in how many years? My last album was Held Him Back? So I think that drive in three or Old four, So that was my last album. So that's almost twenty years. Yeah, twenty years, because I mean it's close to twenty Why why, like what happened? What has been going on with you? Like, why has it taken that long to put a project out? Man? Well? And oh six, no, oh seven? Eight, I had to

get my releasement for more for roth Riders. So I finally got my releasement, but it took me years to fight them to really get out of my contract with that. And then and then by the time I got out of my contract and eight, I had my daughter, me going back and forth with lawyers and stuff like that. Trying to get out of my contract. Made me go broke. Yeah,

I went, I went broke. I was twisted. My baby mom was taking care of me for the first two three years and I mean get oh, I mean and uh then that for that uh I mean, uh, it took me a while just to really start generating some money again, world what I'm saying. So that was like a real setback. Cause now I don't use all my money to get out of my contract. But it wasn't like I had other deals on the table right my

daughter now, which is on the table now. So I me do with me just dealing with that and you know, but by the same time in O six, I started my company hood environment that I'm putting out on my music on now. It just took ten years for everybody to catch on, cause people didn't catch on to it til like two thousand fifteen, two thousand six m and then people started catching on to what I'm doing and stuff like that. But you know, it's just been the grind world in cause I was doing the real and

then everything out of the pocket. Yeah, I think it's dope, like for you to be so transparent with that because I feel like a lot of people they might see rappers and think, well, you know, this guy was on Rough Riders, he had a deal, he had two major o uh major uh label releases and and uh you know sometimes like a lot of times, rather like you're like like it's it's it's hard to get really really rich off a rap, you know what I'm saying, Like

you might get in advance, but you're obviously gonna spend that, and then once that's spend, it's like, you know, So, So I think that's dope because a lot of people got to understand both sides of the coin. You know what I'm saying, Like the end of the day, everyone's bills need to get paid. That's right. Everyone bills got to get paid. Everybody is parents now say so, you know, and everybody got responsibilities at the end of the day,

you know what I'm saying. So you know, it was a real grind for me world because I already had too much bread and then I was trying my best not to go back to the street and stuff like that, and then eventually I eventually had to go back to hustling on the street, you know what I'm saying. So you know, I was using that money to bring myself back into the forefront. It took a couple of years. It's because my career was pretty much over and five I would say, oh five or six, she was done.

So you had to go back to get to putting your feet in the streets and you getting money that way. Damn, Yo, It's crazy because I always think of your story as like kind of like a what if. Like damn, like Rough Riders the hottest shit moving in music period, right, Like I went to the Hard Knock Life tour and I left before jay Z got on, Like I literally was there to see DMX. That was it. I was there. I think Jay did one song and me and my cousins left. I was thirteen maybe, but we're there for DMX.

That was it, you know what I mean? But like you were like the perceived air apparent to the throne of rough riders. It was like you were on starking, Hell is hot, You're on flesh, my flesh. You were on the you know the rough riders call those rough Rider compilations were crazy like and it really felt like they were positioning you to be like, Okay, we got exes the flagship, but we but obviously we got to

have some some young young guns as well. What what do you think went wrong in regards to your career and maybe just the whole entire rough rider situation because it definitely there could have been worse situations for you to be a part of it at that time, because at that time that was the that brand was scorching. Yeah, I mean you know, like what like what means that I had like a manager that was like fully behind me, you said, like I always shared with d MX. DMX

was like a real protector for me. So I mean, you know, I mean, like his management. I had that management, his movie agents. I had those movie agents, like I never really had your own people. I'm going drag, right, just drag, you know what I'm saying. I never had a movie agent that was like, okay, I'm going hard for just drag our auditions for those parts because X put a good word in from me, like yo, I'm not gonna shoot this X one unless you use drag

on as my brother. He looked like me, that's my homie. It makes sense. The BIBB is there, let's go. And that's how I got that right the next one. But yeah, you know what I'm saying. But you know that's how I got that movie. Yeah, and then it led to another movie and stuff like that, you know what I mean. But the reason why that stops because I want something happened with him as far as Hollywood it's out. Yeah they yes, right, It wasn't like somebody else that could

be like okay, dragons. Also, those agents, those managers, obviously DMX is gonna be their priority because at the time he's probably bringing in so much money, you know what I mean? What he what he sold thirty over probably over thirty million vers just in by himself. I don't know, it's crazy. I mean then, look, you did have a lot of people who we see come out of cruise that are you know, are big like that don't get the chance to put out two albums. We see a

lot of like people who are get signed. Like think about all the artists on Rough Riders have never even dropped an album. There was a lot like when I came to Roughriders, it was Casino big stand. Yeah, I gotta go back. I'll go back to like the Rough Riders like compilations and I see some of the artists. Was somebody named Parlay? Was this Parlay? Uh? There was a was there someone named I know remember young Bird

when he was a kid? Was was uh? I remember when we first met Young Bird and extrap Young Bird on that was we met him on what these bitches want from that video set? Came through like a little kid, But I ain't go from he always like Young Bird was always like a boss, very talented kid man a little kid when he came through right, but his entourage he had like six different big who is this year? Like he always moved like a boss even before he was that. But that's one thing that I can vouch

for that dude. He always was a boss as a little kid. Still is man doing his thing. Hit shout out to hit maker man. He always like when I met him, he was like, I don't know eleven, but Boston it. He walked up on DMX with six big security guard like, what's up? That's crazy? Got cool. At the peak of the rough Rider ship, right you're on

tour your I mean, ship has gotta be great. But like what like, like what point in time did you, like do you remember vividly being like, oh, ship, we're like the hottest motherfuckers in the world because legit like rough Riders for like that run man, there was nothing. It was like all this puff daddy shit was happening and then boom, DMX came in, ripped all that ship away and was like, nah, man, no more of that

shiny suit ship. This's a whole new energy. Like what we did, we just made it fear for regular dudes on the street, like just regular dudes that just happened to be nice. We made it a big platform for them to be successful too. You don't necessarily gotta be fining around in the video and stuff like that. No,

disrespect to the boy. I'm a big fan of that, of course, but no, but it was like you had that big budgets to those kind of videos to where we made it to where you can actually wear regular jeans, and they told the homies to come out. Yeah, obviously with X passing, man, I mean, share your thoughts, like, I like, where were you at? Like, you know, obviously you and X had a very close brother brotherhood, and you know, I mean that poster has been there since

before he passed. X. More of my all time favorites, you know. And I was ship that shit had me fucked up man driving through New York City having Hot ninety seven on and they're playing his ship and I'm like, damn man, Like, but but where were you when you found out about it? Man? I was in His family actually called me, you don't like it's actually blood family really called me, and it was like drag, you know what I mean. You know, we're about to take him

off of the life support and stuff like that. So I kind of knew he passed away before a lot of people knew, you know, you know, like before the media knew, you know what I mean. So I was already hurt him down. You know what I'm saying, Yeah, it's rough man, cause it it felt like we saw that verses with Snoop, It felt like he was in such a good place. I love to see him. I love to see him with a belly because I was like, oh,

he's eating good, you know what I mean? Like good and like the greatest part about that too, was that dmx is was always a Snoop Doggie Dog fan. Like when I was watching him versus and stuff like that, that's all I was thinking about him because I know the type of fan he is for Snoop. You know what I'm saying, Like he really respected like like Snoop Dog. He respect that dog. Right there, I ain't gonna fun. That's one person that he always was a fan of.

So that's why we watched some of the verses, like some of the records that he put on. Did you see x get up like, oh hold on, this was my really was fun? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, that was real And that was actually like, oh snap, this is my joint right, I remember? That was your relationship with x uh Did you have one prior to the Rough Righters thing or did you like how how did you come into the fold. Were you like, like with him before the rough Riders or like explain your guys' history. Uh, well,

D you know what I mean? You know, D the general is the one that put me on the map, the one that believed in me first before everybody. And he brung me up to the studio and and it was like to battle DM Max. But I didn't even know it was a battle because I never was battling at that time, you know what I'm saying. I found out very fast though, you know what I mean. As soon as I got in there, boom, he was right there. They didn't quite waste any time too. I was like,

I got there, what's up? What are you doing? Yo? Drag yo yo? Turn that beat on my quick boom and it was straight like that. And then he just started rapping, which was and then I'm listening to his floor and the style of delivering. I'm listening to all that. I'm like, Okay, this dude was incredible right here. But at that time I was so hungry, you find trying to say, so I still kept going back at him, back at him, back at the back, And next thing

you know, a whole hour went bound. We were just back and forth, trading bars, and even though I lost that battle like the whole time. Yeah, I said, we probably battle four hour. I lost four hour, you know what I mean, But he respected it, like you know what I mean, you know, like to the max. Like he he just just like, you know what, I think, we're gonna keep this dude right here. I like this

dude you gonna trying to say. And it was just something that he always said that was just in my eyes that reminded, uh uh that I always just minded me right right right right, Yeah, yeah, I think like you guys were it was It's almost like you guys were so synonymous with each other, you know what I mean. It was like, yo, you see DMX, you see Drag

Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. I say, like like the whole Batman and Robin thing that was set up us our joint was actually genuine What year was that because obviously this was prior to his first album, So when like when was this? That was nineteen ninety seven, ninety seven, album came out in ninety eight, album came out in ninety eight. After that, you know what I mean, you know, like right after we battled, It's like me and him got super cool. So Or had bought a house in

North Carolina and sent us out there. So he worked on his first album and I worked on my first album. You know what I'm saying the opposite eight two oh yeah, at the same time with him in the house in North Carolina. While he was working on this shit in their room, I probably was in another room in my room was is working on my ship? Do you you know? There's so many profound songs on his first album. I think that Uh Damien is one that always sticks out

to me as one of my favorites. That's one of the songs that he wrote in North Carolina with us in the house, and that's one of that's great. You said that in the world. I was like, he was actually just discussing that that's one of the fastest songs he wrote. He actually timed himself. He said, you know what, I'm gonna see how fast I could write. You know, I just wrote a song before that fast kind of fast, but didn't have the hook. He said, you know what,

I think I could write even faster than that. And I mean because I think he had just knocked out a song with like two and a half hour's whole song boom, right, so he try to top that, and he topped it with Damien. He wrote Damien in an hour and a half Wow, hook and everything that that whole him playing two different people. Yeah, nah, that's X doing that. And he wrote both of those parts and everything.

So you're you were in there while he's writing this, and uh no, But I'm curious because, like obviously him rapping from the perspective of the you know, the devil or whatever you wanna called Damien. You know, yod what's up? You are smooth? So like was like did he have the like like talk about the concept, Like how did he come up with that concept? Because if you guys were there, I mean, that's crazy. That's that's one of the crazier records on his first album. That like always

just sticks out to me. Yeah, yeah, like that right there. That was something he was actually dealing with in life and reality, you know what I mean? That right there? So that was real FN, Like that was I'm telling you, that's the fastest record if because it always fell to

me as a kid, not knowing any better. I always thought to myself, Damn DMX sold the soul to the Devil and then Belly came out, and then the opening scene there's the Little Boy and he's quote shit from Damien and I was like, oh my god, he did sell this. This shit is crazy. Now. Mind you, I'm a grown adult now and I'm no better her. But like I really thought, I was like this motherfucker DMXI.

He's really like you know what I'm saying. Like, so that was something he was like really battling with, just kind of like the battle with just just just what life generally like. He had a hard life. Yeah, so you know what I mean, you know, just falls him growing up as a kid and stuff like that. You know what I'm saying. He's really from the streets, so you know it's times he had to hold in the

street and being a homeless and I've been homeless. There's a lot of artists that actually came into this game being homeless of course and having nothing to go to, you know what I'm saying. So that was some of the demons, you know what I'm saying that that you

might be fighting. It might be something like like I'm hungry right now, and it's a lady and and that person looked real nice and I'm hungry right now, and I'm contemplating even though you're a good person, you might you might but you like I'm starving, Yeah, but you might have to make a hard decision. These are decisions that he had to deal with. So he was just he was just able to capture it, you know what I mean, you know and put it in his music. You know, I saw I watched the U the Rough

Riders uh bt thing. Uh I figured what what what they call? I watched not not not the memorial the documentary the docu series they did. Was it last year? Yeah? Yeah, And I didn't realize that. Uh. It's crazy because Swiss coming up as a young guy in the camp, you know,

with some favoritism because of the family situation. But there was like a some of the other producers kind of felt some type of way about Swiss's like a sentence in in you know, obviously Swiss is an all time great producer, Like how was how how was it being around Swiss early on before he was like a thing, because he became a thing real quick. His sound became

very distinct, very fast and automatically. I think everyone just had was beats beats, But early on like you know, he was a kid, he was started off as a DJ obviously, but like, did you kind of always see that in Swiss? Like I was like at the time, I was just so busy working on my album. I was. I was just working on Opposite at age two. Well, I was trying my best to get beats from anybody, you know what I'm saying, trying to get some ship.

The DMX didn't take. You probably got all the hot ship. Yeah, I was, I was. I was. I was actually trying to get beats from uh Swiss, p K Grease right an, you know what I'm saying. You know, like a lot of my stuff, I always work with a lot of up and coming producers. But that's what I just always was just focused on. I was just focused on that fire. The rough Rider compilations were very, very historic, and you had some of your I think some of your dopest

moments on those. Uh what was it like like when you guys are making those compilations where they're record Like, would you guys like purposely go in and be like, Yo, we're working on Ride or Die Volume one, that's what we're working on. Or was it like, hey, look who's got extra records and everything I put together? Like how how did those songs come to be? You know what

I mean? Like we are lay like we alay some records and stuff like that, and some records to make it there and some records to make it there, you'll say. So that's what it really was, Like a lot of people do it. The song with Me and juven Now was gonna be on my album it made it to and it might it might have should have been on that on your album because that would have been a single. Yeah, a lot of people say that, you know what I'm saying,

But they wanted that look for that. So it was just like certain songs just where you know, I mean, you know, like wherever they wanted it to go, you know what I man me, My job is just writing and just trying to lay as more songs as possible. What was it like having the Locks be brought into the fold? Because at the time I was se the Locks were some of the hottest artists in New York. There was the huge Bad Boys split and you know, we are the Streets is a bible for a lot

of people out here, you know what I'm saying. But what was that like, because like, Yo, think about the competition within just the crew. It's you, it's X, it's Eve, it's the Locks. I mean ship young one was fire. You know what I'm saying, Like, like, what what was that like? Having the Locks come into the fold. I've always seen them in the fold, Like I've never really seen them out the fold. No matter where they was at, it was always you know, they always was like Locks

are there before me? Oh they were there already. Yeah, I mean I felt like, yeah, it was like some younger ship. Really it was like some wild ship. Never was really not there, you know what I mean. You know, I mean like me, since the first day I got over there, they always was there. X was there, you know what I mean. You know, give me some some

some some of your fondest memories of being on tour. Well, first of all, we could talk about the h There was a rough Rider's Cash Money tour, which was pretty dope. But the the tour that I remember that we talked about was that Hard that Hard Knock Life Tour, which is like a moment in hip hop method Man and Red Man flying through the air. I knock like to it. With the tour that prepared me for the Dcast Money Tour.

You know, I mean that actually prepared me, you know what I mean, because I actually had to come out twice and perform, you know what I mean. You know, on the Hard Knock Life tour, you know what I mean. So it gave me a taste of being an artists. You know what I'm saying. You don't performing in front of hundreds and hundreds of thousands of people, you know what I mean. So, you know, it kind of it kind of molded me, you know what I mean. Of course, yeah, yeah,

what because I did that tour. The dynamic of Hove in d m X at the time was so interesting to me because obviously they were both at the top of their game. There was all these rumblings about there being that murdering group with him and jaw Rule and and Hove and and uh. I think anybody who you would have probably asked at the time probably would have said the DMX should probably close that tore out, you

know what I'm saying. At the time, obviously jay Z's the greatest of all time, but at that time DMX was scorching, like scorching was there, like like how was their relationship because we watched the Hard Knock Life documentary like I mean, you know, like for a DMX and and whole, Like I wasn't there for that, so I

don't really know what that was. I know it was always mutual respect No, for sure, it was always respectful, but like there had to be some sort of friendly competition you would think between like I mean, you know, but but that's just New York, Like, yeah, always who's the King of New York? Talk? Yeah, that's that's that's that's what that's about. That's that that's the New York thing that you know what I mean, you know, we'll always in competition with each other. You know, that's just

New York. So yeah, I feel like New York is probably the most competitive city and hip hop everybody, especially back then, because everybody was who's the King of New York? I think he's gone, So who's the king of New York? It was like is it Dove? Is it ghost Face Killer? Is a DMX? Is it is it Fat Joe? Is? That's crazy? So obviously you know what X passing the

way he did. Man, you know, he's had a troubled, uh history when it comes to I mean also a very open history when it comes to his his you know, use of certain substances and stuff like that. Was that something that was like was that something that everyone around him kind of knew was going on? Or was it something that became worse over time? Like yeah, with the drugs, any drugs around me. Ever, not one time I put that on my daughter. He knew nothing to do that

around me. So I don't really know too much about the drugs, like like like far as the drug and I put this on my daughter, my grandmam, Mom's everything, like he never ever did. But did you guys know that that was a thing or was it like if you didn't see it, so you didn't really know? Or I never really I mean, you know, he was such a dope artist and I was just so focused on that part of his life, you know what I mean, you know, especially with him not trying around me, having

that respect for me. I just always looked at him as the great artist that he is. That's it. I never looked at him and no other way but that, you know what I'm saying. At what what what year did you end up kind of starting to split away from rough Riders and being around X so much, because yeah, I think you said Helen Back came out in two oh three, so at that point in time, I'm trying to think, O three oh four, that's probably around the

time the Grand Champ is that Grand Champ type era? Yeah, like three when we were shooting Crazy in the grade, he was working on his third album, so he was working on uh and then there was X. Yeah because that's that was his third album. Yeah, hey, because you said you were after with these Bitches one video, so that was on that album. Did did your relationship with rough Rider souring effect your like your relationship with X? H Nah, me and X was always brothers, always going

to remain brothers, you know what I'm saying. So you know, we always was genuine us, Like when we came across each other, they were straight brothership. It wasn't none of that. Let me like, like the relationship that me and X had, it wasn't just it wasn't just based on music, you know what I mean? You know, it was it was like some real genuine shit. That's yeah, when's the last time you spoke with him? That's my script that X probably mean, I don't know, maybe like seven eight months

ago time. I mean like like it was months before he passed. I mean because he was working on his album, right, and I was working on Yeah, And I just did a big transition movie from the East to the West. So it was kind of hard for me when I first got to the West because I didn't really know how the West really moved like that. It's my first yeah, so you so focused on his joint, I was just focused on my Yo. Have to stop the Bootleg cav podcast real quick and shout out our sponsor, odd Socks.

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this podcast. Let's get back to it. Yeah, I think that there's obviously an unfair expectation when we see someone like X pass away and how he passed away, where you know, there's so many would have could have should have that people try to bring up like, hey, well you know, you know, maybe people closer to him could have spoke up or or intervened or you know, had

an intervention or whatever the case is. But you know, I think that I think that there was probably a lot of that that we didn't see because I know, I don't you know, obviously Swiss is you know, somebody who was very close to X. But did you feel like maybe looking back, that there were people around him that could have maybe done more way back then. At the time, X is the hottest rapper in the world.

There's boatloads of money coming in, so I'm sure that like, yeah, some stuff was ignored because it's like whatever makes them happy, We're just gonna do because the money's coming. Was there something that you think, like like you like like thinking back, was there more that you think other people could have did not not necessarily saying yourself, of course, I just always looked at X as an artist. I never looked at him how everyone else views or or or how

someone else viewed that situation. I just looked at him as one of the greatest rappers I've ever heard in my life. I mean, he's obviously your brother, your friend, right, Yeah, I mean I think it's a It's just it's just tragic, man. Anytime someone passes from that, like it's like fuck man like that, everyone starts to think, like, well, what could have Like my mom's Like my mom's was a crackhead, My pops was a crackhead. My uncle did drugs and

stuff like that. I had, I had so many you know what I mean, don't like and I mean you know, when you from the hood and stuff like that, and you grew up around that, Like that's just all you know, you pretty much numb to it, you know what I'm saying. So you know, when it came down to the relationship with me and DMMX, I just looked at him as one of the greatest artists I ever seen in my life. That's it, I I j I. I didn't really nomally fond chance to life. I mean you know, I didn't.

I didn't really get into uh not me don't like me and him always had a respect for each other where I mean we didn't. I mean, don't we have respect. We didn't dig deep and you know, I mean no, like X was a older brother to me, you know what I mean. You know, he wasn't like like somebody I could be like ek So what they say, like you find like I was his little brother, right right, right, right right. I just looked up to him, like how

you would look up to your big brother. You might not be knowing that he's out there robbing liquor stores or whatever you find out own, you know, is your right? Yeah, that's firsh shit, Mmmm, that's fair man. You talk about the Cash Money Tour, which was a adupt moment in hip hop to have both of those crews on the road at the same time, obviously, Uh, I missed those

kind of toys. I feel like we don't get those kind of toys and hip hop anymore, Like that kind of energy where there was that bigger artist all together at the same time on the same bill. I feel like there's too much ego and hip hop now or that kind of shit don't even fly no more. It's just way too much egoye. You know, the word platforms used way too much. Oh you know, I don't know if I already want that on my platform. Yeah, there's

some bullshit. Everyone's so worried that. Yeah, Like think about it, rough Riders in cash Money, two different genres, like not, two different pieces of the country, two different, totally different sonically movements coming together on the road is fucking crazy. That wouldn't even happen these days, Like it fucking you know, imagine if like Kendrick Lamar went on tour with fucking NB a young boy. Yeah, people be like what that don't even make sense? Give me some like what what what?

What's like your some of your favorite stories about that tour, Like, give me a story from that tour that you kind of look back on. That was pretty crazy. Just me being able to actually come out every night and rob the crowd. That's the biggest story for me, just me actually going out there and representing trag. You know what I mean. You know, that's the biggest story for me. That's that's what I'm going always your mumbo, you know

what I man? You know, did you and Juvenile perform together the record off the the last show in New York? That's it? The ho tel We didn't perform in that one time, but you guys did it do it once? We did it once? And I think for New York? Did you do that song together in the studio, because nowadays we think so it wasn't together. I met him for the first time. I guess has been out number one. Wow, Hey, we got that song together. We got them that's it.

That shit is crazy on tour. Wow, that ship, that's that's wold. You just put a new album out, which is by the way you're spinning. Man, it feels like you said, it feels like you had like you you almost like you had a broke fucking point to prove. It's been almost twenty years since the last one. It's like you can't come with no bullshit. I mean this, I mean, like this album right here. It started from bof Part one and I had dropped that a couple of years ago, and it did real good on the streets.

You know what I'm saying. You know, the videos, like some of the videos on there. I got two three million views on my fan page, so it did real good. Shout out to DJ get it right. Let me, he's the one that actually started that because I didn't even want to drop no mixed right my brother, but he

was like, nah, is doing good? Drag Ufonchin said like you might could do it, And I mean I had just dropped the Chok Them freestyle that did like three four million on the streets, so h I mean you know, so after that, it made me link up with them and do part two. So we did Part two and

then we did Part three together. So Part four was kind of catering to those fan base that loved that uh saga, but I really wanted them to know that I know how to do music too, so I put a lot of different music and I mean, you know, after the fourth or fifth song, if you notice the album goal like another direction, which is me into a biby type zone. You know what I'm saying, because you know part one, two and three, I really was just like, I'm back, I'm spitting part to talk about anybody. But

part four I didn't really care about that. I really just wanted people to enjoy the project. Who's because there's so many incredible MC's that are thriving right now in hip hop. Who are some of the artists that you're fans of that are currently kind of like on the newer side of things. I like, I like Rowdy Rich Roddy of course, of course, man, mm hmmm. I like money Bag Yell, money Bag Yell's fire. Uh. You know, I'm a big fan of Kendrick, big fan of j Cole.

You funk with any of the Griselda guys at all? Yeah, Yeah, that Griselda ship is like that's the energy, like I feel like he's been missing, man, that's the energy that New York was once. Of course, I have much respect for for Grazil Direcords, like all the artists is over there, Bennie and like, yeah, and I'm a huge fan of them. I mean, because they are just just keeping the hip hop they their leaders and they know that they're not following. They actually said, Uh, so you were in Exit Wound's

Cradle to the Grave. What are the movies? Were those the two? Uh, I'm a Grave. I shot another movie with me and Love and Doctor Dre shout out to those guys are legends Cradle two. I mean Exit Woons had Steven Segall Cradle to the Grave at jet Lye at the time. I mean, obviously those are two of the greatest like, uh, martial artists of all time when

it comes to just on movies, especially jetly Man. And that was like early on in jet ly Is, like you know, there was I feel like Jackie Channel was like the first guy in the nineties that like like was a superstar in China and crossed over and it worked in America. And then there was jet Lye. What was it like being on set with jet Lee? Like, you know what I'm saying, Like, cool, dude, you know

what I'm saying. You know, he's real short, you know what I mean, And he barely spoke English, but he tried his best to speak to me in English, you know what I'm saying. So I kind of respected that, you know what I mean because he know, his English was real bad. I know, it might have looked like he can talk you yeah, like a translator speech. Yeah. It's the whole time on every single part to get it right. Did you like, you know, acting wise, I

feel like Ex's potential as an actor wasn't even sniffed. Like. I feel like it could have been so much bigger, Like for some reason, I mean, I don't know, we just stopped getting DMX movies. You know, we had a there was so many fire ass DMX movies. I don't know if it was whatever was going on in his personal life and he ended up stopped acting as much.

But what did you like? Did he did he try to like kind of give you a lot of pointers on the acting ship early on, because he was a solid actor, unlike Nasa Nas was a terrible actor in that movie. I'm just going to shout out to Nas. But Ex ex X is the reason why I'm in movies, you know what I'm saying. Of course, Ex is the reason for Dragon. So anything you've seen that I did, it's probably because he did it first and allowed me

to do it after. You know, what was it like t describe Stephen Sigall as a very uh interesting fellow. What was what was being on a movie set with Stephen Sigga? Like it was real interesting cause he took a liking to me, you know what I'm saying. For real, you know what I mean. You know, out of everybody on this set, he didn't really rock with too many people like Steven sicgall An. They type of person that if he rock with you, he rock with you. If he don't, he don't it like like you know what

I mean. So you know he with him actually taking a liking to me, like weird cause I grew up on him, you know what I'm saying. You know, I was a huge fan and all that. I was actually able to tell him some of my favorite movies that he did. Wow, Like you know what I'm saying, And he was telling me what was going on at that time.

So I'm just sitting there listening. So you know it was dope, you know, I mean doing like Steven Seaga was actually a cool dude, super cool dude, super cool dude with me dance serious, you know what I'm saying. So yeah, you know what I mean. He used to be in the studio with Casey and Jojo. So, I mean he's into the music. That's so rare. I can you imagine walking into a session and it's and it's Casey and Jojo and Steven Sogal like all the time.

Were you ever in the studio with them? At the same time, I was about to say, that'd have been that's gotta be crazy. Yeah, he'snna tell me stories and all that stuff. He just said this listen, like, you know what I mean. But he's into the music the whole. You know what I mean, You know he's aware. Yeah, damn,

that's that's wild man. The other thing I think that is dope is like, you know, for people who are watching this who might have the same situation, like you have a speech impediment and you have never let that be an excuse for you to do what you want to do right, and you're also you know, some people are shamed by that or they do their best to

hide it. But I think that it's important for there's somebody who could be watching this right now who's going through the same situation and might want to be a rapper or might wanna think you might wanna do TV or whatever. It might not think that they can you know what I'm saying? And that's why, you know, I mean, you don't like when I first let it out, you know what I mean? You don't on a swed show. You know what I mean? You know that I have

a stuttering problem. I actually went up there, not trying to hide it and stuff like that. Right now, I've been studying a little bit on this. Yeah, they pretty much gonna see it. But I've been working on it, you know what I mean. So I'm not as bad. But if my studing is real bad, you know what I'm saying, So I just stop hiding it because I wanted people to know, all right, And I mean, you know, this is my imperfection, perfection, you know I'm not perfect.

I want them you know. I mean, you know, because I know it's a lot of people that's that's probably capable of doing so many things that they be nervous on how somebody's gonna look at it. Yeah, that'd be the whole thing of when you stutter and you catch a real bad studying and then you're wondering if they're looking at you like you're crazy? Right right, right? Right? Yeah. So with me being in a position that I am. This is this is what let them know that Nope,

you have a studying problem. But you're not retarded. You say, you're not slow. I'm very intelligent. You know. Oh you've also got had an extremely successful you know, career using your voice and and and I think that that's got to be inspirational because that would be the single most insecure thing that anybody could probably do. And that's decided to be an artist, a musician, you know, saying a

rapper stuff like that. I really stopped doing interviews because of my student And then I said, nah, you know what, that's not a way where I can really show them that it can actually be done with a studying problem. I mean, you know I was born with this. I got on both sides of my family. You know, my father's stutter on my father's that's my father, Yeah, my mom. So my grandfather stuff badly he said, which he just

me which he just passed away. But uh, he had a real bastarding problem to the front where you came to quotem on the phone purpose you know what I'm saying. So you know I actually got it on both sides of my family, you know what I mean? So I just be wanting people to understand and know that it could still be done. Even even with it. I could bear them speeding, but I flat listen. I'm gonna tell you this, man. I pressed play on your new project,

and I'm like, I haven't heard a Dragon project. And since I was I was in high school, maybe even junior high, and was riding around to yesterday and I was like, yo, it might like I know, not even gassing you man, like this might be the lyrically the most tip top I've heard you. You was really getting getting off, bro, because you know, sometimes you press play, like all right, let me hear this ship. You know, I'm afraid. I'm almost like, I'm afraid this just gonna

sound dated or something. It's gonna be. I had play on that, bitch. I said this intro is grazy. The next and I'm like, damn, and you had some lines in now. I was like, yo, god man, Yeah, man, I think, dude. I think, like I just had this conversation with Jay Mills not too long ago, and I think that there is a rare opportunity for artists such as yourself who are lyrically inclined to really just you know, thrive because I think the pandemic has made people listen

to music differently. When I like, most of the country isn't standing on couches this the last year in the nightclub popping bottles. They're in their cars or they're at home listening in their headphones. So the substance and the lyrics. That's why if you see the Grammy nominations from twenty twenty, it was all real rap shit. It was Royster five nine, it was Freddy Gibbs. It was all all lyrical, ill

rap shit. And I think that, you know, another thing too, is like don't hold on to music anymore, you know. I think if anything, if anything that Griselda and Westside Gun and Conway and Benny the Butcher have taught us over the last you know, four years, is run that indie catalog up man, run it up for sure. The music me I got dropped. I mean, you know, like I started my own record label, Code Environment, and we put out music every week, go every two weeks. And

that's not just songs, you know what I'm saying. But we don't really rely on DJs, so we put the song out with the video every day. So smart. So when you first hear the record, you're looking at it. That's fire. Yeah, that's smart. Man. Were you able to make it to Ex's memorial service? How was it? Because I mean I thought it looked so amazing on TV. Uh. I mean, I know Kanye helped design like the stages.

It just looked great. Man, it really you know, it was obviously a very sad day, but like, how how was it for you to go to that? It was a lot for me to go to that, you know what I mean. You know, I was in denial for a long time, so I like, like me, I had a hard time accepting it, Like you know what I'm saying, you know, I'm going to make my homie the rest. Like I had a hard time accepting it. So I actually booked my flight the day of, like I was

really contemplating it, you know what I'm saying. But I mean, you know, overall, I'm just glad I went for DMX. Yeah, I mean it also, you know, just has to bring up so much old feelings and then obviously every i mean everyone through probably through your hip hop career, was there, you know, I mean, were you able to reconcile or see anybody there? That you hadn't talked to for a while, or I was just there for DMX. That was it,

in and out. I was there for DMX. DMX passed away, So I was acting in such of that manner, you know, I swet I saw, you know, obviously Swiss's speech I thought was really I thought, I mean what he said could be applied to anybody in your life, right, like as far as just like being there for people, well not just when they're gone, like being there when they're here. What did you think of just the services? Like like Swiss's speech, I thought was anybody should watch that if

they haven't seen it. You know, he kept it a thousand. But what were your thoughts on what he had to say? And my thoughts was on my speech. But you you're to worry about your own ship speech. My speech was really focused on what he had done for me. You know what I'm saying and what he is to me, and I'm hurting that he passed away. How hard of that is is that to write, like to put that together into words. See, my speech just came from the heart. I didn't write it. So you just went up there

and just just told your truth. Man, just spoke exactly what it was. You know what I mean. So I mean, I mean, like like what it like with my speech being straight from the heart world genuine It made me, uh shed a tear, you know what I'm saying because I know where. Let mean, you know where it came from, right, a real place. I just I just wash, you know, happy that everybody showed DMX love, you know, the love that he deserved. You know what I'm saying. You know

that was my thing. My thing was just shown up for the homie. That's Have you been privy to hear his new album at all? Anything from his new album? I heard two records from it, dope? You know what I mean. You know what I mean. You know like DMX never really put out too much songs that wasn't great. He was just great period. This is true. I wish we would have got more. Man. Yeah, I always think back, like what if DMX just never let up on this

rap shit? A lot of people's careers would have been because man, I feel like he let up and that's when you had the job rule slide in and have his like you know, the R and B wave. And it was really only because that X kind of just let up on this ship, you know what I'm saying, and with it the acting and you know what I mean, it was like it kind of left the hold. Yeah, it's crazy. Would there ever be a or would you ever consider being a part of a Rough Rider reunion?

I mean obviously without X that's gonna be hard to accomplish. But focused on my record label called Hood Environment, which we just dropped the album March fifth, and we're doing successful with that company. That's a company I started since six. It's two thousands, it's twenty twenty one. So this has been a long grind. I got my release Smith from Rough Riders in seven I was not men, you know, and I started my record label from then. So it's

been so focused on that. I mean, you said that that lawsuit kind of broke you, right, so I can only imagine that getting on the other side of that, like the animosity you might have towards Rough Riders in general, like who told you that? No, I'm saying that you said that after you got released that going through and high and lawyers and stuff, you ended up like kind of broke, end up. I ended up being broke. I ended up being uh he had to go back to the streets. But I had to go back to the

streets and restarted my career. So you ended up homeless after Rough Riders, Yeah, I was. I was actually homeless while I was still on rough Riers. You were homeless, So so explain to me being homeless, Like, wouldn't you say homeless? What does that mean? So you actually were definitively homeless while still being on rough Riders? Right, So I started my company and just kept building for the past ten years. So did d n Y know you were homeless or was that something where it was like

it was just that the relationship was so sour. I don't know, Like, you know, like once I left Rough Riders, I focused on hood environment. Right. Damn for people watching this man, that that's that's a low that it's hard to come out of being homeless, right, especially being Dragon from rough Riders, hitting homelessness, having to get back to the streets to get your money up. The perseverance that that takes, the dedication, the like mental fortitude that that takes.

Then I let that shit break. You gotta be crazy, man, Yeah, yeah, you know what I mean. You know, at the end of the day, I don't really like rely too much on the people that's down here on this earth with me say, I rely on God. God got me, you know what I mean. So you know I'm here on the strength of God. I am living proof that God will help you if you ask them, you know what

I'm saying. If you pray, if you prayed up, if you keep yourself within the bubble of prayer, then God will be there for you, and and and even for the people that don't pray, but just believe in God. God got them too, you know what I'm saying. So my thing was just mean, Like once I did that, I just focus on my company, and then the streets started catching on to it. So I just focused on that. How long was that period of time that you were

actually homeless, like before you got to play? Like how long? Like how long was that? A year and a half? Two years? Like wow, damn man, we look you came a long way, bro, And uh as listen, you're a part of history. You are a part of history, man. And how did you think that the documentary came out on BT the was it was? It? Was it? The five? Was it five episodes? Something like that? Oh, you didn't watch it. I didn't watch it. I thought I thought

it was dope. I mean again, I'm I'm a fucking When I was a kid, I used to tag up DMX and rough Rider logo on all my folders and that was all the posters I had in my room. And so it was just like, yeah, this ship is great, but yeah, it's it's also kind of got to be crazy too, because like you're kind of like a part of a fraternity that will forever exist on this planet

that has nothing to do with hip hop. Like the Motorcycle Club ship is so big, big just the culture of that are that has nothing to do with the music or the record label. It's just so big. It's like, you know what I'm saying, Look, your album is out, are you? I hope you keep putting out. You're gonna keep putting out more albums. Yes, we're working on I'm already working on another project that's so dope right now, it's out of here, you know what I mean. So,

you know, we don't have a name. Somebody just used the damn name, but they didn't know which name was. It was the name that just been used, right, So I mean, you know, but they didn't know that that was the name of right right, right right, So you gotta switch the name of them, switch the name of now, switching the name. But it's so good though, you know, the music is great. It sounds super big, you know

what I mean. You know, it's it's it and it's and it's actually better than bof four, you know what I mean, because it got just a little bit more of a music type of vibe on this joint that I just know everybody gonna love. Hey, what I didn't ask you about? I always was curious about Eve Man and Eve was I think when we when we always talk about the greatest female hip hop rappers of all time. For some reason, I feel like people kind of just don't bring her up. And I think that's just because

she hasn't been acted for a while. But like, uh, what was your relationship like with Eve? So just like any brother or sister relationship, highs and lows, and it was always love that said sisters, you know what I mean. You know you can actually go to my Instagram piece. Actually, I think like my last post or the post before that, you see when we sell each other, it's genuine, you know what I mean? You know it's Brother's Sistance. That's it.

That's a beautiful thing. Man, we'll look drag on the legend. Go get the album, go stream it, and man, welcome to Cali too. Yes, yes, it's glad to have you on the West Coast. I love the weed. Man boomed up. See ready,